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Welcome to Success Secrets Exposed with Sally A. Curtis, where we share stories of challenge, success, and inspiration, along with practical tips and strategies to move you forward to your success. And now, here is your host, Sally A. Curtis.

Good evening, good morning, and g'day to you all, and welcome to another episode of Success Secrets Exposed. Super excited to be sharing with you yet again today. I've got a great guest in Cheryl Palouf who's going to be sharing with us about profitable podcasting, um, and an abundance of information, and super, super great at taking the complex and making it really simple for those that overcomplicate things like many of us do. So for those that are new to the show, I'm content repurposing whiz. I work with brilliant individuals to help them leverage their content to engage their audience through the power of visually emotive content. We're actually best known for turning books into 2 years' worth of social media posts. And what we do is we help you connect, stand out so your message is heard and that you get to reach more people easily. But as I said, our guest today is Sheryl Palouf. We're going to be talking about profitable podcasting. And the concept we're going to be sharing is how to interview thought leaders, turn them into clients, referrals, and also speaking engagements. Sheryl has turned her professional media experience into an absolutely thriving virtual video production agency and consultancy. She's an entrepreneur and an international speaker and has broadcast over 20,000 hours of live television in her 25-year career. career. So you are definitely in the right place at the right time today. So without any further ado, please help me welcome to the show Cheryl Palouf.

Hi, Sally. So great to be with you.

Thank you so much for joining us. I feel very, very privileged. As I shared with you as you were coming on, I've been deep diving into your YouTube content, which I know is, you know, going to be expanding and future-proofing even further. But I really love the way in which you take what Everyone and me, this is the label for me. Everyone seems to make overcomplicated and you turn it and you make it super simple. So I'm really thrilled to be sharing with you today. Thank you.

Oh, wonderful. I'm so glad that you've been binge-watching there. And I'm proud to say that that YouTube channel has over 2.5 million video views so far. And I hope to continue to add to that with this, really this, this thought leadership around podcasting. I know that's what we're going to talk about a lot today, but I think that podcasting is one system among a few others that really help us to scale businesses, right? That's how I see podcasting. So I have a bit of a different take on it, and I'm happy to share that with you today.

Yeah, and I love that. And I've just, um, if you've seen me scribble because I'm a prolific note-taker, I've just written down that you're the first person and only person that's ever called it a system versus a product. Um, so that, um, that already makes me incredibly excited. So thank you. And can I ask you to share and elaborate a little bit more on your backstory of sort of where you came from, from that media perspective, to why you're sort of doing what you're doing now?

Sure. I started broadcasting when I was 18 years old, and I worked my way up to national broadcasting before I was 30. I spent 25 years in the industry, 17 of them on the national stage. And as you indicated in the introduction, we actually did the math one day and figured out that it was over 20,000 hours of broadcasting. I was even surprised.

Hmm.

But having said that, I think that what I really did was I took that experience And I let it permeate my thoughts and ideas and my point of view about digital, about social, about business, about entrepreneurship in many ways. And I think it not only did it help permeate what I think about it, but really the learning and the teaching that came from that, from being in the media, really helped me to see things in a slightly different way. Let me paint a picture for you. In the broadcasting world, You are in a position where it's usually a small crew of people. I wouldn't say necessarily skeletal, but often a small group of people who are responsible for producing a large volume of content and doing it to deadline and doing it consistently. I know in my case, we had 11 different feeds at one point across the country where We were feeding different feeds with different levels of content on a 24/7 basis. So you get very good at systems as a result of that, because you have to do that in order to survive, you know, to be able to do the thing that you've been employed to do. So I think that it's really this idea of systems that has bubbled up for me in the last years and thinking about podcasting in that way.

Yeah. And I think that's even just the reference of the 11 feeds. I mean, when we think as entrepreneurs of our social media feeds, let alone the feeds and the production that we can overcomplicate in everything then that we do, it's no wonder that it becomes this almost full-time Franken-business thing if we haven't systemized it. And I think I've definitely experienced that. But when you get that level of systems in, and I'd still I'm always wanting to improve systems. When you get that level of systems in, you actually gain back the lifestyle, which is often the reason you actually started your own business. But Franken-business crops up in the middle there somewhere.

Yes, that's so true. I think it's a common experience, especially for, let's say, coaches, consultants, people who are packaging their intellectual property into programs, courses, memberships, masterminds. They're in the knowledge space. And it can easily happen because when you first start out, you really are doing all of the jobs. You know, there's a certain level of bootstrapping that happens at that point. And I think that it can easily be derailed, or you can be easily derailed into going to a place where you're busy for the sake of being busy.

Yes.

And it's It's really important to be able to steer you back and say, let's get focused on simplifying this and going back to basics to some degree and really thinking about the business side of this. How are you leveraging what you're doing for business building activities? One of the things that I like to remind people, and this has been my experience and this has been helpful for people that I've worked with as well, is speaking. And this is evidence of it right here. Right. We are speaking. I'm speaking on your show. You speak on other people's shows, it is really about you need to talk to more people. You need to be talking to more people publicly, privately, in just getting-to-know-you type calls, connection calls, discovery calls, sales calls, whatever, but always be talking to people.

And do you find— and I'm sort of having a slight giggle here because this is one of my soapbox moments and I get really ranty, so I'm going to cut it back real quick— but do you find people get so stuck in the marketing that they forget about the business development elements?

Yes.

Yeah,

that is the problem.

Yeah, absolutely.

Although I don't think that it's— it's not anyone's fault, really. I mean, I think that we live in a space, especially with social media and the decade that we have come out of, is that people are bombarded with ads, right? They've been bombarded with, you need this shiny object, you need this too, you need this SaaS tool, you need this. And they're all amazing and they all do wonderful things. And then people, you know, they get drawn in and then they go down a rabbit hole and they spend the next 8 months trying to do— I don't know, it could be I'm trying to build this quiz funnel. When that might be a great thing, but maybe it's not for now. Maybe it's for later. Right now you have to focus on the season that you're in. What season are you in right now? If you're in a growth season. Like, if you haven't reached 6 figures, you're in the growth phase. You're in the initial early stage growth phase. And it's, in many ways, hand-to-hand combat. You need to talk to more people. You have to have intelligence about who your client is. You probably don't have that dialed in yet. Talk to more people. Don't worry about the quiz funnel yet. You don't need that yet. You need to talk to more people.

Yeah, brilliantly said. Love it. Thank you. Um, and one of the things that we, um, have planned to talk about is the, um, how traditional podcasting is actually a broken strategy for online entrepreneurs. So I've sort of got a sneaking suspicion this sort of ties into the system side of things. So what are we generally doing wrong and what are some of the tips that we can sort of talk about in correcting that so we can focus more on these conversations with people and building the business versus just having another marketing thing that, you know, runs along the side or runs us?

Well, the truth is that Anyone can create a podcast. You can create a podcast on your phone. There are amazing tools. They're free. I mean, creating the podcast is not the problem. The problem is that if you want to create a podcast and leverage it for business, if you want to use it to generate your leads, you want to use it to build your network, you want to use it to— elegantly sell your own products and services. If you want to use the podcast to do that, that's what requires more thought and strategy around how are you going to do that. So what happens typically, and why I think the model is broken in the traditional sense, is that anyone can create a podcast. But if you create a podcast and you— even if you, you know, do have a strategy of getting a sponsor, right? Or, um, inviting advertisers to be part of your show, and they're going to give you advertising dollars to be part of your show, etc. That is a process whereby the sponsor or the advertiser is going to want to know that you have an X number of downloads and what, what is the size of the audience, and because they want predictability about their investment in your show. So the trouble with that is that when you first start any show, you don't have the audience yet. You— that is something that builds over time, and you have to be committed to the process and be very consistent and stick with it and keep doing it and rinsing and repeating for a period of time. Now, some people, that time frame could be shorter, and for others it's longer. I think the majority of people, it's a longer process, a longer-term strategy of building the audience. What happens is that people get, uh, they get— how shall I say this— but they, they fade, you know. Yeah. The allure of it starts to wear. Yeah, it starts to wear off because it's work. And if you're not seeing any short-term or at least medium-term ROI, you start to question, why am I even doing this? And then people fade away and they pod fade, right? They, they, they just stop doing their show because they're not seeing anything for it. That's the problem. So what we're saying is use podcasting and in a different way, you can still build your audience. That is going to be a long-term strategy. And over time you will build, you will have great guests and it will build and you could have sponsors and advertisers. But in the short to medium term, we want you to leverage it to build your network, meet amazing people, build collaborations, joint ventures. You could certainly get clients. You can certainly get clients directly from your podcast. Speaking engagements where you get invited to speak on other people's stages. Focus on that part of it, the business development side of your podcast. Or sorry, use your podcast for business development activities and then let the audience build naturally over time.

Yeah, brilliant. And I think that's something from a general networking perspective. If we go back to traditional networking, you've got those that go to a networking event and I call them the, you know, your business card ninjas that are, you know, quickly, you know, ninjaing all their business cards out. And then you've got people that are sort of tucked away in the corner which are having a deep conversation with somebody and they're creating something. So they're creating that deeper relationship, they're building those relationships and potentially those joint ventures and collaborations. That's certainly the way in which I've always networked. But again, you find people that go, but I've been doing networking, it doesn't work, no one buys anything. Again, we've got that upside-down strategy as to why you're doing the thing that you're doing. And I think from a my, in my experience from, uh, podcasting, that ability to expand your network, to showcase clients, to showcase, um, colleagues, etc., has been such a great way, as you said, to expand that network, which then brings in more opportunities. And from a business growth, a human growth, and an evolution of your business, that's such a, a streamlined way, um, to do it if you have that goal in mind from the very beginning and understanding

It's also, I think, built on some level of reciprocity too. It's this idea that you're not going into this new relationship trying to sell anybody anything. You're building that relationship off on a positive note of, of giving, of, of, of giving, of gratitude, of reciprocity. Like, these are all positive ways to start that relationship off. Not to mention the fact that if you have especially if you have high-ticket products and services, which is what I recommend that every person who is a coach or consultant, they should be starting with high-ticket and then moving down, as opposed to moving down and up, which is what we see. But

yes,

when you have high-ticket products or services, reaching the people who are your ideal clients for those products and services could be more difficult because those may be perhaps more affluent people or more educated people or whatever type of people it is you're looking to attract. You have to really look at it and say, say, are those people really scrolling on Facebook looking for an inspirational quote? No. Maybe, maybe. And if they are, that's great. But know your audience. Know who it is that you're talking to. So especially with high-ticket products and services, you really have to be clear about who are those people and what are their daily activities. Where are they hanging out? They could be on social media, but you might not be on the right social platform. Right. Maybe you should be focusing more on LinkedIn than on TikTok.

Yeah,

if you have a better definition of who that person is. So it's important when you have high-ticket products and services to really give that some thought.

Yeah, couldn't agree more. And I love that you've actually differentiated the difference between high-ticket, starting at high-ticket and coming down, because we do see so often from low up to high. But I'm going to ask you a question as, as it relates to Do you have any sort of tips or 3 areas that people can look at? Again, this is something I always get on the soapbox about, so I'm going to get you to reference it. Me and my audience will roll their eyes as it relates to helping them to define if they're going to sort of focus on that high-ticket scenario. What are the 3 things that they really need to know intimately about their audience to be able to then utilize that? Do you have any tips around that?

Oh, I think you have to understand their behaviors. I think you have to understand what their natural daily in and out daily behaviors are. So if I think of, let's say, someone who I'm trying to— let's say it's a— my audience is a 7-figure business owner who has, you know, a team of 10 people. And if that were the person that I was trying to attract, Then I would think, gee, where would they hang out? Well, they're probably, they're probably on LinkedIn. They probably have strong morning routines. These are people that read, and they read a lot, and they also listen to podcasts. They're always looking for personal development. They're always working on themselves. They're probably working with a coach or some type of executive leader. You know, you have to kind of understand like what would be the daily activity or behaviors of that person and put yourself in their shoes. That will help to determine a lot.

Yeah.

Another thing that I think, uh, we have to know, and this is regardless of whether it's a, you know, high ticket, it doesn't matter what, you have to understand what their needs are. Like, what are— where's the need and the opportunity for them? Like, what's the opportunity to help them and what is the need that they have That you can help them with, you know. Um, and then I think the third thing is, how are you going to reach them? You know, where can— how, by which means are you going to actually be able to start a relationship with that person? You know, and that comes back to point one. If you know where they hang out, if you know what networking groups they participate in, then maybe you can show up at those places and make yourself known. So those are 3 that come to my mind.

Yeah, perfect. And something else that you touched on that I think is incredibly, incredibly relevant as it relates to podcasting was my experience when I built my business originally through using the Meetup platform, which I saw a lot of people try to duplicate and emulate, but they never stuck around long enough for it to actually work. And I didn't think of that as it related to a podcast, but that consistency element is so strong and it It always tickles me that, you know, I thought of that long, the long term, you know, first 12 months I'll do it this way, next 12 months I'll do it like that, then, you know, after that we'll do it like this. So I thought like that, but didn't realize it. And then when I was talking, I remember talking to a couple of different people that were wanting to sort of get out and do their, we call it shoutouts and those sorts of workshoppy type things, that they would just do it for 3 months, but it didn't work. So is there a Is there a really good— I know you talked about this, some people do it quicker and some people do it over a longer period of time. Is there a sweet spot as it relates to consistency with podcasting if you've dialed in some of those elements that you've talked about?

From a consistency of production and publishing?

Yeah.

I like to recommend to do at least an episode per week.

Yep.

For a variety of reasons. One is, yes, the consistency from a public perception and, you know, being able to show and demonstrate that I'm here and I'm doing this consistently for their benefit.

Yeah.

But I think we also have to realize that there's a huge benefit to you as the host to do it at least once per week. It's like going to the gym. How many of us have purchased gym memberships and we're really gung-ho about the gym and then All of a sudden we let through, you know, a week go by where we don't go to the gym, and then it's really easy to fall off the wagon. Next thing you know, you haven't been to the gym in 6 months. It's happened to everyone. So I think podcasting is a similar thing. You want to stay in it to win it, right? You want to be able to be consistent for your own benefit. It improves your, your ability to interview and to, um, and we, we teach people how to execute on this themselves, like for people that are going to be producing their own podcast. And we have a method where it's done in an hour per week. But if that person is consistently doing it, they're improving their interviewing skills. We have a thing we call the 5-star interview. So they're improving that. They're able to more readily produce the show and know where to click. Things are more familiar. It's really easy to let, you know, 3 weeks go by. And then when you come back in, you can't remember What was that thing? I know it's easy, but where is that thing again? I can't really recall. So yeah,

yeah,

I think once per week is a good standard to stick by for your audience's benefit and also for your own.

Yeah,

but if you really want to progress more quickly, if you have goals of, again, you know, growing your business from 6 to 7 figures and you're installing podcasting as a system by which to do that, a marketing system to do that, you can push and pull those levers however you see fit. You could decide to do more episodes in one season and fewer in the next. It's totally up to you how you want to do it.

And that comes back to you have the opportunity to pull those levers based on what you know your strategy is. So without a strategy, it's sort of very difficult to pull those levers because it's hope or, or almost that lottery, you know, as to what they're doing. Whereas when you're doing it consistency and you've got a clear strategy, it makes it— you can— there's a— there's an understanding and a reason for it.

I'll say, Sally, though, I do have a client— actually, I have 2 clients who I'm producing for, and they have decided, again, because we've worked that strategy out, they actually do it once every 2 weeks. I think that's acceptable so long as we make sure that we're staying consistent to that once every 2-week schedule. Because especially when you expand it out like that and you decide you're going to do it once every 2 weeks, now if you only miss one— even if you miss one week because you, you know, the schedule didn't align or whatever, it could be a month gap where there's no content. Yeah. So you just have to be careful with that. So in some cases it could work to do once per— once every 2 weeks, but for the most part I would recommend that people do once Once a week at least.

Once a week at least. And you've also talked about when we've spoken around the post-production, and this is obviously where the system side of things coming in. So we've got the— you've got the system at the front end, so to speak, which is the, you know, what's your strategy as it relates to growing the business, which in itself would be a system because there's strategy and structure to that. And then there's obviously production, I'm imagining, that needs to be systemized to help refine the ROI on these types of business development activities?

I think the production is more about efficiency of time and energy, actually, rather than a direct tie to the ROI. Because the return on investment is through the relationships that you're building, the calls that you're having, and the discussions that you're having to help move the business along through Collaborative efforts, strategic partnerships, um, directly selling your product and service to people. But the production side is more about efficiency of time and energy, and, and that's obviously a huge benefit too.

Yeah.

To reduce that post-production time. We are obviously live right now, so I'm a big fan of doing things live because it cuts down on post-production.

You

know, that this is a great way to do that. And I subscribe to that. I think it's great. I've spent many, many years doing live television. And there are ways and tools that you can use that would allow you through just clicking of your mouse to be able to add elements within a broadcast in real time as you either go live, or as you record it in what, what I would call a look-live scenario. So when you're producing it, you're producing it as if it were going live so that the finished product is completed in its entirety the way that you intend for it to be and in the order of the elements that you intend for them to be. So now you don't have as much post-production or production after the, you know, the recording or the live stream to do. So that's where it can get very efficient. I talk to people all the time, and I'll ask, especially people who are already doing a podcast, and I'll say, how long is it taking you to produce? And I've had many, many different answers. But I would say generally, people say anywhere from 5 to 8 hours.

Oh, wow.

You know, so that's a lot. That's a lot in a 40-hour week. So although maybe, maybe most entrepreneurs are not working just 40 hours a week. But nonetheless, it's just this idea of efficiency. So if we can reduce that amount of post-production, now we can use that time to do other things like other business building activities.

Yeah, brilliant. And you talk also from an efficiency perspective. So we've talked about that production system, which is obviously starting with the end in mind. Now, I just was hesitating because I can't remember whether I saw this on your website or whether it was part of our notes. You also talked about the repurposing element and you talked about video to audio, which is something that I've never done as a repurposing agency. It's not something that we do. So I love the idea of that. What's the, I suppose, the benefits and the strategy around doing that?

Well, I think the strategy is that people consume content in different modalities. Some people like to watch the video. Some people watch a video, but they're not really watching the video as much as they're listening to the audio from the video. Yes. So depending on, again, behaviors and how they like to consume content, some people might have your show on in the background and they're doing other things, but they're having an ear on it. Sometimes they do actually want to sit there with rapt attention and watch the nonverbal cues of both people. Sometimes it could be that there is something demonstrative happening on the screen where I'm showing something, whether it be sharing screen or showing something physical on the screen. There's that piece of it, that video part of it. There's a lot of nonverbal communication that's going on. And I think it's more dynamic. People like to see 2 people talking. I'm talking with my hands right now, which is always what I do. Now, the audio side of it is, again, just thinking from a behavioral perspective. There are people who would prefer to listen to long-form interviews in a podcast format because they are in the car. They have their Apple CarPlay or whatever they're listening to there on their, on their stereo. They are at the gym. They're running errands. They are gardening. They, you know, whatever the thing is that they're doing. And they prefer to listen to it that way. So I think it's really understanding their behaviors. And I feel from just from a distribution perspective, why not, right? Why not leverage these channels, be it Spotify, Apple Podcasts, Google Podcasts, um, iHeartRadio, um, YouTube, LinkedIn, like name any of them. These are all distribution channels that are free to that you can put your content on. So I say the more the merrier.

Yeah, beautiful. So definitely from a podcasting perspective, do you do much or advocate much for turning those into what I'm going to call audio snippets? Do you do much of— do you find much value in doing the audio snippets?

I think there's value in turning any long-form content, or what I would call macro content, into short-form or micro content. Anytime you can, whether it be audio, video, and, you know, obviously Shorts, Shorts and vertical short-form video is hot. So taking any type of your content, and, you know, obviously as a repurposing whiz that you know this, but it's taking any of those, those are just opportunities to be able to create snippets and cut down and find sound bites and be able to, you know,

easy to consume,

leverage and repurpose your content in any way, shape, That you can. So, but the only thing I would say about the audio snippets is that, again, uh, typically I think video snippets might work a little bit better.

Yeah.

Than audio snippets, because the audio snippet will just be an audiogram.

Yes, yes.

But so I think if I had a choice between choosing a snippet that had an audiogram and only having that as an option versus Choosing the snippet that had 2 people talking, I would go for the more dynamic version.

Yeah, and that's exactly my, I suppose, my feelings that come up with it when I've seen the audio snippets. It's like, but there's nothing there because I'm visual. So I want to, you know, I watch, I want to engage in something. So I know whether I want to look at the longer, watch or listen to the longer version, but I like to be able to experience more. And I think that becomes Because of that visual element that we're so strong on.

Having said that though, Sally, I mean, if you have a— and I personally recommend and train my students to do both, right? I train them to do a video and then repurpose to audio. But like I said earlier, I mean, if you have an audio podcast and it is only in audio format, then use what you have. Leverage what the modality is that you've created it in. It's better than nothing.

Yeah, absolutely. Totally agree with that. As far as leverage, leveraging, leverage everything and be consistent. with that too. Very true. Um, so I'd love for you to sort of deep dive a little bit more into how you really help, um, the clients, especially as it relates to this system, and sort of give people a bit of a helicopter view of the opportunity of working with you and what that would look like, if you're happy to do that too.

Thank you for the opportunity. The podcasting is really one of the 3 systems that I teach. Teach. So what I'm really teaching is how to grow a 6-figure business and install scalable systems to put you on the track towards 7. Podcasting is one of the systems under the umbrella of marketing, the marketing system we happen to subscribe to using a podcast to do that, because most of the people that we're teaching, we're teaching them to create a scalable high-ticket offer so that they can grow. And, and as such, we find that the podcast is the best method by which to attract the people for that, that offer. So there are 3 buckets that we work in. One is fulfillment. That's how are you fulfilling on— how are you actually delivering the goods to your clients and to people who buy your offer. And that includes the building of the offer unto itself. So there's the fulfillment offer side, there's the marketing side, which is where the podcast falls into. And then the last part of it, which is the part that often people miss, is that you're not in business unless you're making sales. So the sales is a component of that as well.

Yeah.

And those are the 3. We call it scalable business, that if you can really get dialed in and install these systems in your business, you will be able to scale your 6-figure business to, you know, $50,000 a month, $85,000 a month, in a way that is stress-free and simpler. Frankly, it's just a simpler way to get to where you ultimately want to go.

And I think, as you've said there, have understanding those 3 buckets, because it's not 1 bucket or 2 buckets. There is traditionally the 3 buckets. It's as if you've got the fulfillment, the and the sales, uh, with, with fulfillment and marketing with a, you know, a wonky, a wonky sales, uh, bucket, then, you know, the, the rest of it's not coming in. So by having the, the 3 buckets there, it is creating firstly the sustainable business that then gives you the opportunity, uh, to scale. Um, having worked with a number of different people that are going through the scaling process, you can only scale if you systemize and your systems are are the right systems that are functioning. Because otherwise you end up scaling, and I'll go back to the Franken-business, you end up scaling this business that's become a Frankenstein and it just grows and becomes more, more consuming and you, you miss out on yet more lifestyle. And as we talked about, many entrepreneurs work lots, become an entrepreneur to have lifestyle, then something gets out of whack, which is that Frankenstein business, and it ends up becoming you know, um, all, all-consuming, then it's coming back into wrangling that back down and then trying to scale again. But it really comes down to what I'm going to call those, the fundamentals of making sure you've got the, the strategy as it relates to the fundamentals so you can literally, um, skyrocket.

I would argue that if you don't have systems in your business and you are increasing your revenue and you're, you know, say you are capable of, of reaching those levels, then you don't have a scalable business. You have a business on the path to burnout. Yes. Because the problem that you're having is you're going to reach capacity. There are only 24 hours in the day.

Yeah.

So what happens a lot in the lead-up to reaching 6 figures, most coaches and consultants are starting with done-for-you services, one-to-one coaching, personal, you know, one-to-one type of services that they're providing. And that's great. I think that's actually where you should start as you build up to the 6 figures. But what happens at that point when you want to grow and you have your eyes set on— because to be honest with you, 6 figures is not the goal. That's— it's a rite of passage to get to where you really should be going. You need to be dreaming bigger because 6 figures is not enough. You know, 6 figures, it's not going to be long from now where 6 figures is going to be table stakes. I mean, that's just, you know, so I think there's a lot of emphasis on, you know, get to 6 figures, and it's made to feel like the 6 figures is the ultimate

goal. Yeah.

Not— you have to get there, but But you got to keep growing if you want to have the lifestyle, because that, to your point earlier, that's the reason why most people got into these types of businesses, because they have a vision of a lifestyle. It's not going to happen on 6 figures. So the scaling part has to happen and you have to have systems in order to really make that so you do not burn out and that you do have the time back. And it's exciting because that's what you want. That's what you got into this business for. You made it through the tough part. Now you've got to invest in your business and you've got to get these systems installed and now you get to breathe a little bit.

Yeah, yeah. I love that. And that, that I really love the burnout because that is, I suppose, the habitual pattern that we can see and we do see. And I've certainly experienced in sort of the 15 years at different, at different times where I've just sort of gone, oh, it's enough. because of not having systems in place and those sorts of things. And I think that's probably why I get so excited about systems and like talking to systems, because I'm almost that reformed smoker that did, you know, used to smoke and now I don't smoke. I didn't have systems and now I do. So I'm so passionate about the confidence and the ease. And yes, they, in lots of cases, need to be improved until you find the right solid, sustainable system, which is obviously what you're creating, helping your clients create. But, you know, that's, that's where the, where the, you know, almost the joy comes back and you fall back in love with your business because you've, you're finally at the point and you've got the right people to support you to get that, that lifestyle business back on track and those sorts of things. So that's really exciting.

Yes, I agree. And that's the reason that You probably got into business in the first place was because you wanted to have more freedom and to be able to spend more time with your family. And I know for, for, for me and for my husband, our son plays baseball and at a high level, and he's also a hockey goalie. And to be able to go to his games and to be able to spend— baseball especially takes a lot of time as a parent to go into the ball diamond and watch them. You know, there's, there's the warm-up, there's the game itself. It takes It takes a lot of time, but to be able to have the freedom of a business that allows me to go to those games. And, and even sometimes I, I have been guilty of, you know, doing a little bit of work while I'm there. But because it's a lifestyle and it's a business that I've built in this way, I can have a call while I'm watching him practice. I've done that. You know, he's been in a tournament and I've been on a call watching him, and I think, this is brilliant. I love this. You know, I love what I've built. Yeah. And I wish that for more people. I want to be able to use my work to help people have better family lives, to be able to have more freedom and be able to spend more time with their, with their family, you know. And that's my driving force behind all of this.

Yeah, beautiful. Can we expand on that a little bit more? And then I'd love to invite you to sort of talk a little bit more about how people can get in contact with you. And you've also, in relation to the the link that you provided today. But I'd love to, if you can, just share an example because you've talked about the picture and painted your picture of why you do it. What have been some of the transformations or case studies of some of the clients that you've worked with that have gone, you know, started with you and then they've, they've got there, got to the point of the lifestyle business side of things?

Well, I mean, I think of people that in many cases I talk to people who have aspirations or have had aspirations to do this for many years. It's not uncommon for me to talk to someone who has been wanting to launch a podcast for 2 years. I have 2 people that come to my mind who had thought of it for 3 years and never actioned it. So I love being able to help someone like that who— and there's various reasons why, you know. Yeah. It's fear. Sometimes it's just like actual fear of being on camera or being seen. Other times it's just, well, I'm preoccupied with other things, and they're in the busy work of doing things that are actually not going to generate revenue. There are various reasons why this happens, but to be able to work with someone and build their confidence up and give them the ability and the tools and train and teach them how to utilize easy-to-use tools that allow them to launch a podcast in 30 days, right? Like, that, that to me is something that, oh man, that lights me up. So, um, in fact, just before we got on this live, I'm talking to one of my clients who just launched her podcast yesterday, I think it was. Yeah, launched it yesterday. And I asked her about it. I mean, she's almost in tears, right? Because she's been thinking and wanting to do this for So long. Um, I think of another one who launched her podcast, and within— I think it was the second episode— she's in the health and wellness space, but within the second episode, she had Mindvalley reach out to her. Yeah, Mindvalley reached out to her and said, hey, we love what you're doing. She's only done 2 episodes. We love what you're doing. Would you interview— I think it was their CEO or some higher-up person within Mindvalley. Could you interview this person? Now they have this arrangement. She's going to interview them in June.

Yeah,

I mean,

magic of the network.

Really about like relationships. It's access.

What

do you have to be able to— now for her to be able to say, I'm connected to Mindvalley, it's like a legitimate connection. I know somebody there

Yeah,

you know it's it's things like that that really light me up on on the on the side of helping people with their offers too. I mean, helping someone find the clarity around their offer because they were you know selling or or providing you know ten thousand dollars worth of value for twenty seven dollars. And so helping them to see their value of what. the, what the value is of the thing that they're doing, they see things in a very different way.

Yeah.

And it's things like that that really light me up personally, you know, to be able to help someone have that aha moment. And, um, it's just what, what excites me. And I just love this type of work. Or for on the sales side of things, to be able to give someone a script and say, you know, here's a better way of approaching this. And here's a script that you can use. Just fill in the blanks, make it your own. But here's the script. Go and try that. You know, these are people that maybe have never had that type of training on sales. They're just kind of winging it.

Yes.

And winging it is a hope strategy.

Yes.

You're just hoping. No, you want to know definitively. Like, you're not going to Predictable. You're not going to be able to— you're not going to sell every 100%. You shouldn't have 100% conversion rate because then that would be indicative of the fact that you're, you're not priced right, right? You're, you're priced too low. Um, but you want to be able to have like a really good solid conversion rate and, you know, 20% to 40%, that, that's, that's awesome if you can, if you can get in that range. you're doing really well, but you need to be talking to more people. But in the sales side, I think it's the scripting is transformative. On the marketing side, to be able to get people launched in 30 days and have a strategy that they know definitively who they're inviting. And then also on the offer side, those realizations around how start with high ticket, start with high ticket and have a $5,000 to $10,000 offer that's leveraged and that scalable, that will help you grow to your 7-figure range.

Yeah, brilliant. And I'm just gonna make a note there in as part of this. When I said at the very beginning, Cheryl is absolutely awesome at taking the complex to the simple, just listen to the last couple of minutes of how that's just been mapped out because it's a perfect demonstration of how it takes the— you take the complex to the very simple. simple, uh, with the, uh, you talked about the 30 podcasting 30 days. That in itself is, you know, sounds like a much simpler process, creating some scripts from a sales perspective and then understanding that the predictability of a business when you know the numbers of people that you're able to speak to, to then turn into conversions, etc., there as well. So we have a few minutes left. I'd love you to now invite and share with the audience, um, how they can actually connect with you and what would happen next in that process?

We do a scalable systems call, and it's with my team. It's 15 minutes long, so it's a short call, but it's a powerful call because we're able to walk you through, um, and identify whether you're ready for these scalable systems. Are you in that place, and what might those scalable systems be for you? What we like to do on those calls is to provide resources no matter what. So, that's what I would recommend as a first step is to just spend 15 minutes, talk to my team, and they will ask you some questions to be able to determine what are the resources you need for the moment that you're in right now. It's really about the season that you're in and determining what is that next step. It might be talking to me, right? Yeah. It might be another thing. They are trained to be able to determine what is the resource that you need in this moment. It could be that you need an introduction to a person, you need this book, you need to talk to Cheryl, you need whatever it is. They're trained to be able to identify the stage that you're at and are you— does a scalable system make sense for you at this point? So that's really what that, that

Brilliant. Thank you very much for sharing that. We've got the link up on the screen, and we'll have this obviously posted when we— through the social media channels and up on YouTube, etc., as well. So the best places to reach out with you and connect with you from a social media perspective sounds as though, and certainly was, LinkedIn for us. Where else?

I love LinkedIn. It's really grown on me. I wasn't always a LinkedIn user. I was a Twitter user. a LinkedIn person, but I'm loving LinkedIn. I really love it. So LinkedIn is great. The, the advantage of having a name like Cheryl Plouffe, a French-Canadian name like Cheryl Plouffe, meant that 10 years ago Cheryl Plouffe was available on all the platforms. So it was easy. So you can find me @CherylPlouffe pretty much everywhere. Uh, but I, I love Instagram. I love LinkedIn, is probably my Number one, Facebook as well, and email. You know, you can just send me an email, cheryl@cherylplouffe.com, and I'd be happy to send you in the direction of what you need.

Yeah, and if you want some fabulous resources, and as you gathered at the very beginning of the show, I've been going down a fabulous rabbit warren, the best sort ever, of binging on some great snippets that Cheryl does on her YouTube channel, and I really, really loved the behind-the-scenes walkthrough of where you actually started when you were doing the TV episodes and then your studio, etc., at home. And again, having worked with so many speakers and know the complexity of their production setup and then seeing your beautiful simple one, again, just a testament to how you make everything super simple. Simple for everybody to be super successful. So thank you very, very much. Any closing words from you before we wind the show up?

No, I I love conversations like this. This is something that I could speak about for hours. I mean, I absolutely love it, and I think that this is these are the parting words: Is if you're passionate about what you do and you know that you can really make an impact. impact in someone's life doing what you love, just be thinking about, thinking about how you can grow that, because it's a disservice to the people who you can serve if you don't sort out systems in order for you to scale and grow and be able to impact more people. So think about that.

Just giving me goosebumps.

It is a disservice to other people if you hold that back. If you're the person who's holding all of the, you know, the cards close the vest and you're not able to be just because you are maybe afraid of technology or you don't want to be seen on camera, or, you know, really take a step back and say to yourself, but wouldn't it be worth it to find solutions around those things so that I can impact more people with the good work that I do that I know is in my heart, that I know that I'm being called to do? And I think that's why a lot of people people go into these spaces because there's an inner knowing, there is a calling, there's an energy source that's calling you to do this work. So you owe it to yourself to find solutions to be able to scale your business.

Yeah, couldn't agree more. For those that are on their quest, that have found their quest and know what it is, well, the world needs you right now. Yeah, I agree. Brilliant. Thank you very, very much for sharing so much of your wisdom with us today. It's been an absolute pleasure. So please do connect with Cheryl. Check out the YouTube channel and make a 15-minute call with her team. Find out more because the success is in your hands and here's a great person to help you simplify that success and elevate so we can get you out to the world more often. Thank you very, very much. Take care, everyone. See you again next week on another episode of Success Secrets Exposed. Take care. Bye.

That's it for this week's episode. Thank you so much for joining us, and I trust that you got some inspirational tips to move you forward. You can find this episode along with many more on your favorite streaming platform such as iHeartRadio, Spotify, iTunes, and more. See you next Thursday at 7 PM Eastern time for more Success Secrets Exposed with Sally A. Curtis.