How Ariel Helwani Is Building an Independent Media Empire

Yeah, I feel like I could rule the world. I know I could be what I want to. I put my all in it like no days off on the road. Let's travel, never looking back.

The current setup right now with your business, what do you think is going to be the biggest revenue driver? Is Substack, do you think, going to drive, you know, this paid newsletter business? Is that going to drive a significant amount? Do you think it's most going to come from BT Sport, from YouTube ads? What— how's your business set up and where's your head at in terms of where the opportunity is?

Right now, my biggest revenue driver, if you want to put it in those terms, is Vox Media. They're paying me the most. And that was important to me because The MMA Hour was a show that I created and put a lot of time and effort and, you know, just, I mean, everything. I poured everything into that show from 2009 all the way to 2018, and it was heartbreaking to see it end, even though I was going To My Dream Job. That show just meant so much to me, and I think it meant a lot to a lot of people, and so that's the biggest one.

And that's a, do you regard that as a YouTube channel, or is it?

YouTube and the podcast does very well. It's on Apple, it's on Spotify, it's on Google, it's on Stitcher, all those places as well.

And you own it?

I do not own it, nope, I don't own it. They pay me to do that show. So that's what's interesting about my situation, is like some of the stuff I own, some of the stuff I don't own, but everyone's playing nicely together in this sandbox, and I'm very appreciative. It took some time to kind of figure out all the pieces. That was the most interesting part of this. Like, back in February or so, when I came to the conclusion that I was gonna go and leave ESPN and try to do things here and there, obviously you have, oh, I'd like to do this and that. Like, some people call it a Chinese menu. You know, you kind of build out your own thing, but then the actual dance of getting everyone to play nice and be on board with all these little different things that I'm doing was the most interesting part of the whole process. And I really lucked out and I found all these people, like, people who are okay with me having my own YouTube channel that's completely mine and the Substack, but also doing something for The Ringer, Spotify, and also doing something for Vox. And so, um, it's just, it's just been a really interesting, um, exercise in Look, I, like my friend Pat McAfee, here I am dropping names, he's like, "Oh, well you're not totally independent, you don't own everything." I'm like, "Okay, fine, if you wanna get into that whole semantics game, fine, I don't own everything, but there's an independent spirit to all of this where at the end of the day I feel like I'm partnering with other people as opposed to being a full-time employee with anyone, I'm not, I have an LLC now, and I'm able to pick and choose what I wanna do." Um, and so that's, that's really important. But to answer your question, the biggest deal that I have at the moment is my deal with Vox Media.

And you, do you think long-term that stays true? Or do you think, cuz some things are, are, some things pay off better immediately and then some things you say, okay, if I build, I don't know, the newsletter, if I build the, the podcast or the Ringer stuff, if I build that up 3 years from now, this picture might look a little different. Or do you, you said you don't really think too much about business. Do you not even care about that? You just, do your thing and see what happens.

Are you trying to get me to reveal my 5-year plan, my business plan right here?

Are you— That's exactly what I'm trying to do. I'm looking for 2030 Ariel. Where's 2030 Ariel doing?

Like, who's the guy who started The Ringer? What's his name again?

Bill Simmons.

Yeah, like, you know, he was in a similar position as you. Sold The Ringer, probably netted $150, $200 million when he did that. I mean, is that going to happen to you?

Haha, that would be nice. I don't know, you know, right now, obviously I'm very happy with the situation. I'm really excited, and it's kind of the thing that's flying under the radar at the moment, which I'm totally okay with that. What I'm doing on my own YouTube channel is giving me, as I like to say, a lot of nachas. Nachas is a Yiddish word which means kind of like fulfillment and joy in my heart, because every week for now, every Thursday, I am posting an interview with someone outside of the MMA world because I have been itching for a very long time, and that was part of the reason why I went to ESPN, um, to show people that I'm more than just an MMA guy, that I can interview other athletes, authors, musicians, comedians, anyone. It doesn't matter if you're in the sports world, if you're an actor, if you're a Holocaust survivor. If you're interesting, I want to talk to you because the thing that I derive the most enjoyment from are the interviews. I love talking to people. I could do a hun— I mean, I do a 4-hour show twice a week now, and I feel like I could do it every day. It's just a lot of fun for me. And so I started that around a month and a half or so ago, and it's just my own little thing. It's me and 2 producers, an audio guy, a video guy, and we're posting these interviews. And I don't honestly care at this moment if a million people watch these interviews. Or 3 people watch the interviews. For me, now I'm doing them to fulfill this little passion of mine to talk to other people, to scratch that itch, but also to eventually show people, the right kind of people, that I could do this, that I could be much more than just an MMA guy. And it's actually the exact same thought process that I had when I got into all of this back in 2009. 2007. In fact, uh, this past Tuesday, October 19th, marked the 14-year anniversary of me launching my own site, jerrypark.com. It's still up. I was at Spike TV in September of 2007. I got a job working at Spike TV, and Spike TV was the home of the UFC, and I was working in TV production. I thought, okay, this is the best place for me— TV production, UFC. They're the home of the UFC, it's perfect. After a week there, I walked into my boss's office and I quit. And I said, I don't really think this is the right fit for me. I'm not— I really like— they didn't do anything creative. I'm a creative guy. I like to think of ideas, come up with things, and they were just kind of the middleman. The UFC was producing all the content. So I walked into his office, I said, I'm really sorry, thank you for the opportunity, but I don't think this is the right fit. And I'm the kind of guy who, when he's 85 years old, I don't want to wake up and say I I could have done this, I should have done this, I should have zigged when I zagged, all that stuff. He was very upset. He said, you're gonna regret this for the rest of your life. This is unprofessional. No one's ever done this, blah blah blah blah. And they made me stick around for a month and a half in my cubicle until they found someone to replace me. And that was the crossroads of my life. In fact, our mutual friend John was a part of this process where, you know, I would— we would go for lunch during this process. I'm not doing anything, and I'm telling him I'm gonna start my own website. And I'm gonna start interviewing fighters 'cause I really wanna go into MMA journalism. I really wanna show people that I could be the Howard Cosell, the Max Kellerman, the whatever of MMA. And so I started to reach out to fighters via MySpace, and every morning I would post an interview with a fighter, and I didn't care if 5 people looked at the interviews or 500 people looked at the interviews or 500,000. I just wanted to use that to show people that I could do that. 14 years later, I'm doing the same thing on my YouTube page, and now I want to build this and grow it and use it as an opportunity to show people, but for now it's just like giving me so much joy to go back to those early days and just talk to people about things. And then now I'm like, last week I interviewed Marty Fish, the former tennis player who's been very open with his battles with anxiety, and friends of mine who have never listened to my work, watched my work ever, who don't care about MMA are like, "Wow, dude, you're a really good interviewer." I'm like, "Yeah, I've been doing this for 14 years at this point." But it's opening me up to a whole new audience, and I'm very excited about that.