Scott Duffy interviews Jeff Gogue: The Art of Conquering Fear, Business & Burgers: Season 2 Ep. 4

I'm Alan Taylor. My buddy Scott Duffy and I are in search of the best burger in America. Each month we visit a new city to try some of the top restaurants, pubs and brewhouses while sitting down for a candid conversation with some of the top entrepreneurs, athletes, entertainers and celebrities. I don't know about you, but I love talking business over a burger. Welcome to business and burgers.

Today we're in my hometown, Grants Pass, Oregon to meet up with one of the most sought after tattoo artists in the world world. His name, Jeff Gogue. We're meeting Jeff at the Hall, a restaurant, social hub and exclusive taproom for Conner Fields Brewing. At the hall, they're all about community. They work with area farmers to provide only the highest quality local foods to help bolster the local economy. Jeff is something of a local celebrity here. He threw himself into the tattoo world at the age of 26. And through his artistic ability and innate business sense, he quickly rose to the top. His shop is the place to go if you're looking to get a tattoo. With such a high worldwide demand for his work, Jeff now rotates between his shops in Orange, Massachusetts and even Italy.

So, Scott, I'm really excited to introduce you to Jeff Gogue from Gogue Art. He's a tattoo artist and we used to work out together. Scott Duffy.

So did you actually see him work out?

I did see him work out, yes.

Once or twice, but I didn't know that he was like a world renowned tattoo artist. I'm like, no, we gotta talk to him, right? Cause this is not an easy thing to make a living at, let alone become world renowned at what he does. How did you do this?

I was obsessed. That's how I did it, you know, from the moment I started. And it hasn't stopped. I mean, it's all I ever think about. It just is part of my being.

You know, I have two daughters. I have a seven year old Lex and an eight year old Lily. And from the time Lily was born, she was naturally drawn to art. She just started to draw and she hasn't stopped. And, and I'm curious, is being an artist something that you think you're born with, or is it a skill and passion that you kind of acquired as you got older?

The skill is acquired. You know, skill in anything is acquired because we're all born not knowing anything. I do a lot of teaching and I've done a lot of mentoring over the years, and anyone that tells me they can't draw or they're not built for it, I just don't agree because, you know, the skill of expression is definitely acquired.

It's interesting. People get locked up and they can't. They just can't let that artistic expression flow.

I think it's fear. You know, I think that the difference that I've seen between artists and non artists, if you want to use that title, is fear and Courage. I think that courageous people express themselves and fearful people hold it in. Someone that's fearful hides. Someone that's courageous steps out into the clear.

So the truth.

Look at this.

Nice.

Before you leave, I have to ask you about your tattoo.

My grandparents died like within three months of each other and so it's in honor of them.

This guy do it.

Jeff didn't do it, but it was done at his shop.

Nice ride on.

Thank you so much.

Thank you.

The hall rocks.

Today we're trying the hall's signature burger, the by animal burger that buy animal patty is a mixture of beef from the Salant family farm and ground pork. Add minced house cured bacon, lettuce, tomato, onion and mayo and put it between a brioche bun and you've got one delicious burger. We'll be right back for these tasty burgers after a word from our sponsors.

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Let's eat. All right, guys. All right.

Awesome. Even before I take my bite into my burger. So when Gabriella walked over and she talked to us about her tattoo, she told us it was it was for her grandparents and you could see that it really meant something to her. And most of the people that I know that have tattoos, they can Tell me a story behind every single one. Is that something that you find in your business?

Yeah. People that want to justify marking themselves, they need purpose, you know, so people do want to build in a lot of purpose and justify why they're getting it, when I think ultimately they're getting it because they want to. But I would say the majority of people are doing it because they want to memorialize something that's important to them.

Well, I want to memorialize this burger right now.

Bam.

Let's do it. Let's do it.

Bon appetit, boys.

So earlier we were talking about courage, and it's really, you know, it's just like opening a business and building a company. And I really think that courage is a lot like a muscle that you can build it.

Courage is one of the most important elements of being an entrepreneur, because if you don't take that first step into the unknown and even if you do your homework, there's still so many elements of unknown in being an entrepreneur and being in business. What was your first step into becoming a professional tattoo artist?

I was raised by a single mom. We were on government subsidies. We had welfare and food stamps, which I was embarrassed of as a kid. And I ended up getting a work permit when I was 13, and I started working as a dishwasher at a hotel, and I was making $3.25 an hour. And I remember feeling like things were being dictated to me and that I was limited because of my circumstances. To answer your question, you know, it's like that's where the courage started, was I wanted to steer my own ship.

Buy your freedom.

Yeah.

What was the biggest challenge that you had when you were trying to get yourself started and break out on your own?

Probably the biggest challenge is just insecurities, you know, being insecure and not having the courage like I was talking about to actually do something. And then a lot of ignorance. You know, ignorance has probably been the biggest hang up in my life, is kind of jumping before I knew what I was jumping into. You know, I've tried a lot of different things, and I tried having T shirt companies in high school and tried being a fine artist and tried doing limited edition prints, and I tried a snowboard clothing company. I borrowed money for that. I remember showing up to the trade show and not being able to get in the door. I just thought anyone could come in. I didn't know you had to be a legitimate business. I just thought I had, like, a T shirt and a logo, and that wasn't enough. You know, I needed A business license.

But you went for it anyway.

You showed up. Yeah, I showed up and knocked on the door and got turned away. And I've had way more failures in that realm than successes.

But you built on them.

Yeah, I tried to learn from each.

And what was it that finally led you to being a tattoo artist?

That's a funny story. I mean, most tattooers, you know, when you. When you talk to them, they were interested in tattooing since they were kids. It literally never registered in my world at all. I didn't think about tattoos. It wasn't something I aspired to. I didn't want one. I didn't care about them. I was almost 30. I was 27 years old, and I had hurt my back working construction, trying to provide for my family. Someone that I knew knew that I had done art in high school, and they asked me to tattoo him, which I thought was stupid.

I was just gonna ask, who's the first person that you tattoo is a new tattoo artist?

It's someone that just got out of jail.

What was the aha moment for you that said, I can do this?

In the beginning, I knew I could do it because it looked so easy, because all I saw was people going like this. It's kind of like watching a master guitar player. All he's doing is going like this, you know? But there's so much that goes into that before he gets to do that. There's so much effort going into it before it becomes effortless.

10,000 hours.

Yeah.

How has technology impacted your business?

Everything's a tool, right? So I can make a tattoo. I could take this, and I could cut your skin open and then take some, you know, charcoal and rub it in. And that's technically a tattoo. So that would be, like, the most primitive form. And I could also use computers and Photoshop and do all kinds of stenciling. And it could look like a photograph. It could literally look like there's a photo imprinted in your skin. I could create depth and light sources and all that stuff, like a painting or a photo. As far as technology in a business, it's, you know, it's transformed in the last 15 years from hand to hand, like handing you my card or showing you something I've done versus posting something on Instagram or Facebook. I operate in every single time zone, so my clients are from all around the world, and I post stuff, and I strategize it just in my mind based on what time zone is available online. And it's just become such a habit to me. Now.

So are you using collaboration tools to help refine the designs?

Yeah, I Skype with clients. I mean, I have business partners.

We have three locations. I have a partner. So we have a shop here in Oregon. I own a shop in Massachusetts. And then we also have another shop in Cervignano, Italy. So, yeah, we Skype. I do a weekly executive meeting with my business partners where we, you know, I'm sitting there on a conference call, and I got my computer, and we're all looking at the same screens. And it seems surreal at that point, you know, and it's amazing. It is amazing. I can't imagine how it was before.

When did you go from that point where you're a tattoo artist and you're a good one, and now you have to try and duplicate yourself and your effort? Now you're an entrepreneur. You're not just an artist. You're going to be an artist that is an entrepreneur that is going to try and clone himself or duplicate the art, the efforts, the experience, the journey.

What was that like?

Well, I had to realize where I fell short, you know, and I realized that as an artist, I might be good at drawing a picture or doing a tattoo, but trying to be good at that and be good at paying all my bills and be good at marketing and all that stuff, it's like I spread myself too thin. So I had to recognize and admit where I had weak spots, and instead of focusing on those, I focus on my strengths. I got a business partner that was good at business. I learned, and I'm learning how to delegate and let go of stuff. I can give this thing over to someone else and let that be their mode of expression, and then they can be successful at that, which helps my success. I realize that I'm just one little component of the whole. My advice is just that, you know, it is that no one person can do it all. You're just one part, but you are also an integral part of the whole. To me, that's just a very profound realization to realize that, yeah, I'm not everything, but I am part of everything. And so that does allow you to live up to every one of those cliches of, you know, like, be true to yourself, be honest. You know, give everything that you have to everything that you do. That's something that's just been kind of ingrained in me, that if I'm gonna do it, then I gotta give everything that I have. And I won't be satisfied if I know that I held back. And usually you hold back Based out of fear. You know, I mean, it always comes down to that. You know, it's like, why didn't I give everything that I have? Why didn't I let go? It's because I was afraid. If you can let go of that fear and have courage and actually just give your all to it, even if you fail, you're completely fulfilled knowing that you now know where you stand. Yeah, it's hard for me to talk about it because I sound trite, you know, I sound cliche and I sound like I'm just using all those little sayings. But for me personally, that has been the truth. You know, the truth is that my biggest advice is you got to stay true and you got to give it everything you have and be willing to face what the outcome is. And if the outcome is disappointing, then.

As cliche as it sounds, get up, dust yourself off, try again. You know, maybe set new goals, maybe apply the lessons that were just learned. Thanks.

Alright.

I have no tattoos, but it's been fascinating to learn more about that world. I guess you could say Jeff's story left a mark on us. Here's some food for thought. Skills are acquired. Mastering a skill takes a lot of time. It takes courage to express yourself, overcome your fear, and take that first step into the unknown. One person can't do everything. Identify your weak spots and hire good people to fill those gaps.

Check out more episodes of Business and Burgers and our B and B blog at our website, businessandburgers.com and don't forget, visit business and Burgers on Facebook and give us a big thumbs up. See you next time right here on Business and Burgers.