EP 641 - How To Avoid Distressing Your Credit During The Pandemic And Holiday Season With Merrill Chandler

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This is the no Closers show where you get the latest developments in distressed note investing and learn the secrets of how you can control millions of dollars worth of property for pennies on the dollar. Get educated and entertained by someone who has closed thousands of deals and lives to support you in achieving the same. Now, here's your host CEO of We close notes SC.

Good morning, good afternoon, good evening, everybody. Welcome to this episode of the Note Closer show. As always, Scott Carson. Excited to be here today. We are honored to have back in our credit messiah, the man, the myth, the legend From Get Fundable, Mr. Merrill Chandler, who's been bit of a galvan guy across the country recently in Covid. Hey, what's up, man?

How you doing? Truly, I'm doing spectacular. Thank you for having me on again. Yeah, I've been in in the last three weekends, I've been in La Sarasota, Florida, and then back to Newport Beach, California. So a couple masterminds, a couple research conferences. I mean, I'm. And then everybody's shutting their. Which is what we're talking about today. Everybody's now reshutting down their state. I'm surprised it's not like no interstate travel on the airlines. Right. Like, I'm sorry, you cannot go from Indianapolis to Oklahoma. No longer possible. Right. A lot of travel, a lot of great research. Because Covid is regardless of how we feel about the disease, the pandemic, what the results of it, the results are undeniable and we have to deal with those results. Right. Ultimately, it's less relevant why we have these results. But I'm telling you, there is so many things to have hope about in this pandemic. And it's kind of like bounce, right. We've just bounced off of. They call a W recovery instead of a V recovery. So, yeah, we're heading down into another one. And again, I saw another three governors are be like, we need to do the following. Right. They want to keep up mandatory mass, mandatory sequestering. Except for. And how many people are being told not to go see their families on Thanksgiving?

Yeah. Right.

Well, I thought. Hold it. But you're saying that we cannot have groups of more than 10 people and not see our families on Thanksgiving. So only small families can actually get together. Right. So anyway, what are your thoughts? What's been your experience out there, Scott, with regards to how the financial markets and the banks are responding with their REOs and the pending foreclosure mess? I keep telling people we have like five months, six months before the moratorium stop. Talk to me. How's that going?

So everybody I talk to is waiting for December 15th to see what happens with the executive order. Is it going to be extended? Is Trump going to give Biden a middle finger and extend it for six months? Is it going to stay? Is he going to let it expire and deal with something else? So that's really where everybody's at right now, you know, that's exactly. There was an article today in CNN Talking about like 6 million renters are facing trouble across the country because they don't know if there's going to be. It'll be evicted come January.

Right.

And what's it go on? It's an interesting time right now. Now, obviously every place I go, stuff will crack, probably cracks because I'm not leaving the house. Very often we leave and like I live like within like a stone, like a Tiger woods drive away from my house to the movie theaters, the grocery store and like Lowe's and Home Depot.

Okay, right. Everything you need is within walking distance.

Pretty much, if I wanted to. But the thing is, we actually got up and took a 10 minute drive this weekend and went north up to Cedar park, which is just a little bit.

You just wanted to see if there was more country left than the island you're living in. Right.

Amazing. Exactly.

Is there a zombie Apocalyp apocalypse outside of my neighborhood?

But the funny thing is, Steph was always like cracking. Was like, I'm like, oh, that place is vacant now. Oh, there's a for lease sign there. Oh, that business is not there anymore. And that's what the thing I keep seeing is. More and more businesses closing more and more for lease signs for rents. You know what I mean? And that's the thing. I'm like, okay, so they closed the Starbucks that was near us. They closed the Taco Shack. Cause here in Texas, tacos are important. Right?

Yeah.

All right. They closed the Taco Shack and another Taco Shack moved into the Taco Shack. Basically.

Yes. But has Torchies closed anywhere?

Torchy's is still doing fine. They still rock and roll.

It's only because they have such a high rep that they could lose 90% of their business and now just be busy instead of crowded.

Exactly, exactly. But they started serving alcohol so people come get their margaritas.

That's how we survive. Self medicate. Well, that's what I kind of wanted to address today is, you know, the cities that are being just pummeled. But the article we're referring to that Covid the cities with the most Financial distress.

Mm.

And then kind of what to do about her. What are the cause? I've got some tips and techniques that I want to share with your listeners to make sure that we can protect everything we can, as much as we can. Right, Right. So here's the interesting thing. You're going past your neighborhood and seeing more, you know, more vacancies or people who are pulling, you know, pulling up stakes. Right. In Utah, we're in a bubble, but it's not a real estate bubble. There are so many companies that are leaving California and coming to Silicon Slopes instead of Silicon Valley. Very intellig. I mean, the present company was standing. A very intelligent workforce, highly educated workforce, low cost, relatively speaking workforce, low cost housing, low cost business expenses. They're coming over in droves. And our real estate prices continue to. There's like 10 to 15 offers on every single thing that comes up. My daughter, who is also Liv and Flipper, and they actually had to go out to an area that is that they're putting in tons of infrastructure, but it's more of a ten year growth model than the two to three year growth model closer to where she is right now just so she could afford the payment. So she's going to be out in Magna, but in 10 years, if things continue to go the way they are, she's going to have two or three homes and an 800 plus fundable profile. So I'm not seeing the same things that the rest of the country is. In fact, in this list, cities with the most people in financial distress, there were several criteria like total credit score, the delta in credit score.

Right.

The change of credit score. There is the actual people in distress, the quantified number of people in distress. The average number of accounts on a credit report. Right. The people not paid, 30 day late, 60, 90 day late bankruptcy filings and interest in debt. You know, like debt, interest being paid and each one of these and interest on revolving accounts and interest on installment loans. And Salt Lake City is not even on this list of 50. It's, there's, it's not even here because we're living in a bubble. So, so. But I did want to reach out to all my compadres all over the country so that we know what's happening and what to do about it.

So it's coming from your impact and you look at those nine or six characteristics in the article. We're talking about the article that WalletHub put up a few weeks ago. We talked about it briefly on a previous episode. They just called it the United Cities of Distress.

United Cities of Distress.

We talked about the top 10. But the thing that I wanted to have you is when you see that, what's the thing in your background and your experience? Mayor what's the one category there that really kind of not the cities. Maybe it is the cities or what's the one thing that disturbs you the most about that? You see a big increase. Is it increase drop in credit scores.

Increasing Bankruptcy bonds, credit scores sensitive. But every one of these affect my clients, my students. Right? Because there's distress and then there's late pays and then there's the resulting credit scores. So for me, this is like a cascade falling down. So everyone. The preceding ones affect the later scores. The things that are kind of disturbed me the most. Or it's the rural America is being hit. The smaller cities, right. In rural America, if we look delta in credit scores, we got Indianapolis, Oklahoma, Corpus Christi, Memphis, Tennessee. I mean, these are cities. They're in a more of a rural. You know, there's the city and then there's gobs and gobs of countryside. Right. And it appears again, I haven't done any FICO statistical analysis, but anecdotally there appears to be a significant. It's weighted towards the cities that are influenced or are in. Are in parts of the country that don't have a lot of borrower training, borrower education. There's not a lot of sophistication in high finance. Right. San Francisco is like the last in line when it comes to the worst cities. New York City, way down on. Because there's a certain degree of sophistication because you may live in Corpus Christi, but if you're a financier, you're going to move to San Francisco, you're going to move to New York, you're going to move.

See, I grew up in Corpus Christi, so I can speak directly to the Bay Area. I grew up there. Mom and dad lay there. We moved across. We lived in a small town of 3,500 people across the bay from Corpus Christi, called Ingleside Corpus Christi for that thing aspect of it is you have a high. I mean, majority is Hispanics and Hispanics. And it's also the oil industry and the natural gas industry in there. Diamond Shamrock or huge refineries down there in Corpus Christi. Them expanding the port. They're expecting Corpus become like the number.

Five largest port in.

In the world. But in the country anyway, Houston up the road, but Corpus is a big one. But the thing that falls in place there is you have all these layoffs. You don't have a very financially knowledge community.

Yeah, it's the financial sophistication. Right. Which is my mission in the first place is the Million Borrower March. Right. Kind of what I'm just playing around in my head educating a million borrowers who have not had previous education. Now we're not talking financial literacy. Right. What's a checking account? The rule of 72 where your interest doubles in. Yeah, I'm talking about how do you borrow money and how do you get a lender to want to lend to you. Right. True borrower education. Which is what? Boot camp or podcasts, all of it's all about. But I just cannot see or I can't help but seeing where there is less sophistication by the borrowers. Right. I know what my dad taught me, you know, and that's the only level of education that. Those are the cities that are being crushed, number of accounts in distress. Now here's another one. There's North Las Vegas and there is Madison, Wisconsin, Fresno, California. Omaha, Nebraska. Right there again, cities. But they're outside the finance circles. They're outside of that realm.

Well, I would also be willing to bet there are also sites of major universities that have not brought back as you think of Fresno, Fresno State. Omaha is. Well, Lincoln, Nebraska is there. But you also have. Omaha is. Oh, what's the university? I'll think of it. But you have a lot of these college towns and I was looking at major universities that have stopped. They don't have the infrastructure, they don't have the. When the major employers of university and kids aren't coming back to campus the school, they're furloughing.

That's the term. So you don't have to pay. And I'm an employer. You're an employer. But there is something to be said about taking care of your people and doing your best. When you furlough somebody so they can't get benefit. Well, unemployment benefits, even temporarily. But at the same time you don't lay them off. Then all of a sudden they're stuck in this middle ground of not being able to have resources to help them get through, even if it's a temporary layoff. So yeah, I think there's just. I don't know, this just totally gets me amped up again about. I'm already at 120%. But we got to get this message out there. Right? There is a way to navigate all this. If you know what you're doing, you don't have to spend more money. Can I give a few tips to your listeners?

Yes, let's do that. Yeah.

And I don't believe I've covered these. If you've seen any of my web classes or something, indulge me because you might have forgotten these. First thing, if you have to do a moratorium on any of your payments, right. Credit payments, mortgages, auto leases, whatever your bank is offering, make sure there's kind of a. Not shady, but they are still. But the lenders are still trying to protect their interest. There's a. What's called a. There's called a current. Even if you're late, they'll say it's current. But they will say due to national disaster. That comment is a negative indicator even though you have a positive account. And God bless the lenders. I was just reading that they're the most capitalized they've been in a hundred years right now.

That's a direct correlation to we having the most amount of savings being deposited banks right now. Most amount of people saving. Wait for the day. So yes. What's the bank doing? They're giving that 0.01% because now they're more capitalized because it's crazy.

And so what we need to remember, guys, team, tribe, is that every one of whenever we're going to navigate or negotiate a moratorium, a deferral of a payment, you want to ask them in language that they can understand. You want to ask them and say, will it say current? Will it say paid as agreed? Can you not report subject to a natural disaster, the result of natural disaster? If you can get them, they have to manually take that comment off of your account. If you can get them to take that comment off your account, then it looks like business as usual. Paid as agreed moving forward. Now remember, we're just playing funding game. They set the rules. We just have learned the rules and know how to navigate this place. So our ultimate idea is to still stay current. If they're going to allow us, by the grace of the funding gods, they're allowing us to defer these payments. But make sure the notation is removed. We don't want anything associated with resulting from natural disaster or any language similar. If you can keep that off your report, your fundability, your score may not change, but the notation in the background. Remember pulling back the curtain and the little guy's playing with the bells and wizards in the wizard of Oz, the bells and whistles. You want to make sure that the fundability of that of your credit account stays high. So do remember that if you can avoid not taking advantage of a deferment or a moratorium on a payment, then that's your best play because they are keeping track. I have dozens. Last week was a FICO symposium and I attended the FICO symposium and once again to see how the sausage is made right. I literally am seeing everything that lenders are looking for to grade you as a borrower. So you want to make sure that don't have any late pays where possible and make sure that that notation is removed. The next thing is if you're stuck, if you only have limited income, if you're borrowing from family or friends or your unemployment, if you're limited on resources, you gotta promise me to do this, guys. Never make a minimum payment. Now this is only on your revolving accounts, your credit cards, this isn't your mortgage, this isn't your auto loan, your student loans, but on your credit cards and your, what are called revolving accounts. Never make the minimum payment. You've got to, you want to make a dollar, $2, $3, $5, $7 more than the minimum of payment. Because what the software is measuring is it's, it's looking for what is owed as a minimum payment and what you pay. And if those are the same, if they are the exact same number and you do it for more than three or more months in a row, you're sending the message and the algorithm is calculating that you don't have any more money and that you're going to be high risk and so don't make the minimum payment. Make a dollar or two or three or five more than that and switch it up every month. 72386 $5 more than the minimum payment. These are ways in which you can protect, so you don't end up, whatever city you live in, you don't end up in having a seven year record of your financial distress. There's the debt, there's what you owe and then there's the evidence of the debt. There's a way to have the stress and remove the evidence for anybody to know about it. Okay? So vital, vital, vital. Also the credit bureaus, Experian, TransUnion, Equifax, go to annualcreditreport.com I believe they're going to extend it, but until April of next year they're allowing you to pull what's called the consumer disclosure files, your raw data files. They're letting you pull them for free every week, every week. AnnualCreditReport.com if you can get just. That's where you check it doesn't cost you any money, it doesn't cost you any credit score points annualcreditreport.com and that will. And you'll be able to see what the lenders are seeing. The raw data the lenders are looking at. Those notations will be there, you know, due to financial disaster or otherwise or a national disaster. So those are a couple of things that I just want to make sure your people know. Oh, if you've got an extra dollar or two or 29.95, if you want to know the truth of your entire situation, go to myfico.com that's myfico.com and you can get a subscription that updates quarterly, but it will 28 FICO scores your more all three of your mortgage scores, all three of your auto loan scores, all three of your credit card scores. There are 28 FICO scores, the actual scores the lenders use to approve you monitor. No other credit karma is. That's a FICO score. That's a complete FACO score. So anything that you guys are, if you've got a few dollars extra and you want to know the truth of your situation, go to myfico dot.

I love it. Now here's the thing. Let's flip it up because we are coming to the end of the year. I mean we've got, as we're filming this, roughly six weeks left in Armageddon.

Yeah. 20, 20. WTF.

I know, right? What the fundable.

What the fundable.

So we talked about, we talked about this last year at the same time and it was a really exceptional episode. People talking about biggest mistakes people make around the holidays. And we mentioned a couple of things. One going in, oh, you want to put on your credit card? I've been seeing that. Oh, get saved 10% today by signing up for a new credit card to pay for your kids gifts to pay for Christmas. That's a big no no, right?

Yes.

But also let's talk about this. If somebody has been responsible for their credit, has done a really good job, maybe they want to buy a new vehicle, maybe they're looking to buy a new house or an investment property or looking at some lines of credit, what are some things? If they've taken responsibility for their numbers, what are some things that they should probably dive into to take advantage of right now? Any ideas?

Yeah, first things first, I do want to reinforce the fact that every store who offers the offer that Scott's referring to, it's get 10% off, 20% off. If you fill out this application three very powerful negative things occur. Number one, you get an inquiry from what's called a tier four lender. The tier four lenders are think of as hard money lender types. All of your mall store card, your online cards, anything that it has the word finance in it, all of those are what are called Tier 4 and FICO and lender software actually downgrade your fundability because what you're applying for is a consumer finance account. Those are negative bad juju. Don't do it, okay? I'd rather you ask for a limit increase than get a new card. A limit increase. Now that first thing is the card is bad juju. And the inquiry for that card counts more against you than if you go to bank of America or BBT or P and C. The actual inquiry costs you more. It says that you're a consumer, it says that you're not a professional or sophisticated borrower. And so it sends a whole slew of messages, bad messages. The second thing is you want to, if you get approved for it, it gives you a big fat zero on its age. So let's say you have a hundred months in current credit cards and you're looking good and you get a new credit card that's zero months. Let's say you have one credit card that's a hundred months old and new zero. You just dropped from a hundred months average age to 50 months average age. That will show up in a 20 plus point reduction in your profile. So the new card is low value, but it's also harmful to your credibility as a long term borrower. You're just going out. And if it's happening in November and December before Black Friday, which now they're calling just Black November now. Holy hell. If it's happening before Black Friday, if it's happening for Christmas, they know that those are spikes in credit requests and 85% of those spikes are all for mall store cards and what are called low value cards, Tier four cards. You don't want these on your profile. So I just want to cover that again because we talked about it last year. But it so vital, guys, you can literally hammer the soul of your credit profile just by doing that one thing. Don't do it. Raise. Ask for a raise in a limit of one of your current cards. If you need to borrow money for.

Christmas, it's literally like being, it's literally like giving yourself a lump of coal in January in your stock.

Yeah, you don't need Santa to give you a lump of coal. You're going to give it to yourself. It's going to be coal pit in the center of your fundability. Stomach cold, black heart. Yeah, guys, you can avoid it at all costs. Please do so.

So I wasn't asking as they do. What are some things that if somebody does have responsibility in a. Is it a good time in the end of the year to be buying a car or is it a good time to go online and take advantage of these zero low interest rates?

Excellent. Second part of the question. So some of the big things that you can do, remember you're going to talk to your tax people and, or your accountants. But. But one of the things that you want to do is decide with them which kind of purchases that you can put on credit. Like let's say you're in good shape and you're moving forward. There are certain expenses that if you buy it outright, you get to expense the entire amount before December 31st instead of amortizing it over the full period. So because the way credit works is that with the merchant, let's say you're buying a, a car on credit with your credit profile, you're buying a new house, you're buying essential materials for a flip that you're going to be doing in January or February. The more you buy now, the transaction with the vendor of those materials or the house or the car that is a completed sale. When you use credit, that sale is complete. That you have payment plans with a third party does not necessarily get in the way of having to amortize it over time. You get to expand, expense it. I'm all about expensing every possible thing I can. Now again, talk to your accountants or tax your tax people for the details. But the transaction is complete when you purchase it on credit, whether it's a revolving account or you're using or you're buying a car or a new house. Now, whatever you can do, get it done by 1231. Because I don't know if 21 we're going to have the same tax structures that we have today. I blow neither way in the political wind. All I know is that we get to deal with whatever's in front of us. And so I'm pragmatist that way. So if I have no power or control over the political machine, then I'm not going to worry about the political machine and I'm going to worry about what's in my front yard, in my backyard. So this is a very favorable tax year. So maximize whatever you can through the acquisition sweep account. Whatever you're doing, do it before December 31, because there's not a lot of if anything in taxes change, I don't think they're going to put it out to 2023. You will enact this in 2023. We'll enact this in 2022. It might be June of 21. Right. And for those of you who have real estate or note empires, remember again, I don't want to be in anybody else's lane when it comes to fundability, when it comes to using your credit, then make sure that you stay under the 40%. If you're going to carry a balance, maintain and stay under 40%. If you want to keep asking for limit increases, stay under 30%. By and large, those are rules. Banks vary. But I've come to find out with all of our the evidence and data from our clients and our students that you don't want to carry large balances. If you can deploy the capital, don't get it a another business credit card. Get a business loan then and use that capital to do the work that you need to. So look at all long term planning for 2021 and do what you can. If you would like any advice whatsoever, come to my bootcamp. It's an open forum. It's not like you're just listening the whole time. There are 32 strategies that we review. There's huge Q and A after every strategy. So come and find out what those strategies are and how to do that. I believe the last boot camp of the year is in October. And this might have already expired. Will be in January.

January, yeah.

Okay, so it'll be January 8th and 9th. But make sure that you talk to your accounts about what you can do before the end of this tax year. Before we go into what might be a different kind of tax environment.

Yeah, just a little bit. I was going to ask you if you've read any of the things that so and so has up his sleeve to try to implement. I know that he's talking about removing the 1031 exchange policy for a lot of people. Nothing's in set in stone yet, but still, that's kind of scary in a lot of ways.

Yeah. All I know is no matter who's in office, we're gonna pay us plebs. Gotta be flexible because there's radical on either side and we just gotta know which way the wind is blowing. In fact, I was at a mastermind. Oh, you know, Eddie Wilson. So I was listening to Eddie Wilson in a presentation that he did when I was in Sarasota and somebody asked him about political climate. And he goes, here's the thing. I'm not in charge of who wins this thing. What I know is I have investment strategies for whoever happens to. So he used the example. If one party wins, then I'm going into solar, wind and green initiatives and investing there. If another party wins, I'm going into oil, coal, and other initiatives. Right. He's going to invest based on who's enacting or enforcing law. And I thought that was genius. I believe fundamentally we need to stay to what we have power over. Right. I don't have power over all that mess. I got power over my decisions. Whatever happens, I'm going to invest accordingly, plan accordingly, and make sure that I have my strategies, that I have the greatest likelihood of success, regardless. It's just choosing strategy A over strategy B, or vice versa.

Well, that's the thing. You've got to be flexible. That's the most powerful thing that we like to say. And you're big preacher. Hey, be flexible. Work it where you can, because there is a different slide and scale. And you don't have to always worry about one negative thing. A lot of times the other things can go around and make up on the negative thing because everybody thinks about their own late pays. Well, you've beat that into our heads. Like, wait, it's not about your past. It's more about what you do going forward.

Yeah, the next 24 months. Right. Not the last 24 months, because there's nothing that you can change. So hold on tight, guys. If you like roller coasters, this is going to be a big one. Whatever happens, just keep the faith. Take care of your loved ones, your families, and do just implement. Come to my bootcamp. Learn how to protect your profile regardless of what's going on out there. And I would like to say this, this is kind of like, like the message that I have, guys, we can either be right or we can be happy. Just because someone believes differently than you do, man, you never know who's going to be having the next best deal to offer you. And don't burn bridges, don't sit where you eat.

Biggest thing I see. Yeah, I'm agreeing with you because I see this over and over and over on social media. The country is pretty much, what, 74 million roughly to 71 million voters, and it's just split. And if it's split, if you start damning the other party that voted differently, you're half the country. You're burning a bridge with half the country.

Yeah, I don't get that I'm a zealot for a lot of things, but lambasting and shaming and criticizing another person's beliefs, there's no room in profit, guys. There's no room in profit. If you want to be profitable, there's no room for shaming your neighbor or business people or whatever. You never know. I have learned, and it doesn't happen often, but I've learned when somebody comes to me and they're not happy or they need to back out of an agreement that we've made or otherwise, I have found that by having rather than being right, I want to be happy. I want us to part as friends. So whatever the negotiation is, I have found that people have come back sometimes years later. Said Meryl. You treated me right. And guess what? I want to introduce you to so and so. It doesn't matter if someone's across the aisle or in a different church or different color skin. It does not matter if you are open. If you are kind and respectful, then the goods will come your way. What you are waiting for is also waiting for you. So, guys, I'm not going to shut any doors and I'm certainly not going to make a stand on something that I got no power over. So I'll get off my soapbox now.

Love it. Now, with you going to the FICO event recently, you know what was, was there a big aha moment from there?

Anything that the symposium was online, that technically, if it's available, it's supposed to be in Orlando. The FICO world is supposed to be in Orlando in April. We'll see what happens. But in this event, the biggest message was how do lenders take care of their people? And what are the fraudsters? What are strategies that fraudsters will do in this environment? And so the SBA has already run fraudulent PPP loans, Eidl loans, and they're collecting that data to throw it in their mix. So it was how do we protect ourselves was the big message for them. And how do we take care of our borrowers? Because the borrowers are going to, they're going to leave your bank and go find somebody who treats them well. Borrowers are not. In fact, there was one presentation that says we all think of the borrowers as the bad guy or, you know, what are they going to do to try and steal from me. The vast majority of their customers are good depositors who are looking for a leg up and looking to borrow money to do that. If you don't treat them right now, they're not going to be around to treat in any fashion later. And so online banking, Google banking is coming down the pipe. There's going to be a lot more competition than there is right now. Google is coming. It looks like Google because of some purchases of some banking assets, they may come in at a tier 3 or a tier 2, not normally like Sofi Prosper. Marcus, all those fintechs came in at a Tier 4 because they were, they were financial companies, right? Google, I don't know, maybe they listen to my podcast, I don't know. But they are coming, they're coming in at a tier 3 or tier 2 right out of the fricking gate. So a lot of great things are happening guys, but we got to be flexible, we got to be kind, we got to be respectful and be like yoga flexible.

How does that compare to where Apple, the Apple card is at? What's Apple?

Apple is a tier two 80% because it came in with. Who's underwriting it? I want to say Solomon Brothers, they're out of business.

Goldman Sachs.

Yeah, thank you. Goldman Sachs is a tier 2 and so since it's CO branded it's a tier 2 80% because we dock 20% off of that. So they came in at tier 2 and of course Apple massive. But I still don't recommend people get it because I want everybody to have tier ones. But my entire business runs on Apple, right. We have Apple corporate accounts. In fact one of my business leases is an Apple lease. So they came in high at tier 2. Whereas Google though is got of. Goldman Sachs was already a bank and so they're underwriting Apple's card. Google actually wants to get into the personal banking business and so that's why they may have to work their way up.

Interesting. Very interesting. What would Google do? Is a whole new idea out there.

Wwgd. Wwgd. What would Google do?

They've got a book I read years ago that actually helped inspire a lot of things in what we do because Google, when they built their platforms like oh, we're going to share our platform so people can go create all these great apps and things off it versus trying to hide everything. And that's more the open mentality versus everything being closed and hidden aspect of.

The older which is what Apple has been forever. Right. So you had Google and Apple, you have an Apple, they change their, they have security updates. Well actually those are additionally patented codes that you can't touch their operating system. And yet Google is kind of, it's far more open and flexible.

Yeah, right.

Hey, well thanks, thanks for Having me on the. On the show, there's just so much going on and dissing on somebody is not gonna serve us. It's never gonna serve us personally. You could be right or you can be happy. Rarely are we both ask your spouse who likes to be right.

And sometimes being wrong is being happy. Yeah.

So just know, are they really happy all the time? Cause they're right all the time. Yeah. Doesn't look like that to me.

I love it. I find that fascinating, Mr. Merrill. Good stuff for the. Hey, you guys be safe there, and we look forward to seeing you in person at some point. All right, brother. All right, guys, that's going to wrap it up for this episode of the Nutclosure show.

Check it out.

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Love it. See you later, Mayor. I'll be safe, buddy.

Thanks. Beyond Sat.