EP 649 - Challenges And Opportunities: What To Watch Out For In The New York Real Estate Market With James Prendamano

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To support you in achieving the same. Now, here's your host, CEO of We close nodes, Scott Carson. Hey everyone. James Premano, CEO of Cassandra Properties. This week with Scott Carson on the Note Closer show, we take a hard look at some of the opportunities that are going to present themselves next year in the market and how to stay flexible enough to make sure you can take advantage of those opportunities. Looking forward to seeing everyone.

Good morning, good afternoon, good evening, everybody. Welcome to this episode of the no Closure show. As always, Scott Carson. Excited to be here with you today and really excited for this episode. We've got listeners all across the country. We have people listening over 130 countries across this crazy world. The Rock, third rock from the sun, they like to say. But one of our biggest audiences is up in the New York area. And I've been looking for somebody who knows that market, who understands what's going on. That market has been doing it for a while. Not a flashing band, but somebody who's really done quite an amazing job at the neck of the Woods. And so I'm really honored to have our special guest today. He's the CEO for Cassandra Properties at Staten Island's premier real estate firm. And for nearly 30 decades. We won't age him, but you have a bit of idea. He started like when he was one. With his trademark enthusiasm, his creativity and leadership, he shepherd the completion and transformation of projects including major initiatives reshaping Staten Island's commercial real estate landscape. Also big on the residential side, I was honored to be a guest on his podcast a few weeks ago and as soon as I we connected online, I was like, I gotta have on the note closure show. So I'm so honored to have Mr. James Prendomano on the no Closer show today. What's going on, James? How you doing, buddy?

That is some intro, Scott. I don't know some billing to live up to, but let's give it a shot.

But you know, crazy times, it is a crazy time. We were chatting a little bit earlier about things and how chaotic it can be and you know, we haven't had anybody in to talk about your market up the Neck of the woods, kind of what's going on there. So first before we dive into that, let's share a little bit about kind of what you focus on and guess you could say your bread and butter and kind of how you got to where you're at today, huh, James?

Sure. So the answer to that question has changed over the years, right? I think part of what has been a big portion of our success is that we've adapted as the markets have changed. We found the company was founded in 1989 by my mom. She specialized in high end residential homes. Not the best of times to go start a brokerage, but you know, she's a trailblazer mom. She went out there, she kind of owned that luxury market and then she started to see an opportunity for land leasing of all things back then on Staten island was almost non existent and she started to get into the land leasing marketplace. And being a woman in that space at that time on Staten island was a challenge, but she really carved out a niche and in many cases she educated the base out here as to how the land leases worked and what the opportunities were there. So over the years we've really gotten involved in all of it. You know, we've got a really healthy residential component. We've got a very, very strong commercial component. We do a lot of consulting work, so we've adapted back and forth. But our focus for sure has been the large projects and the consulting work, the brokerage, the leasing of the large scale, the more complicated, difficult projects that you've seen out here on the borough. We've been proud to handle and we do do stuff off Staten Island. Usually it's court appointed work. We did a lot of the Walgreens portfolio work and that type of stuff. But that's really our sweet spot is the larger complex transactional stuff. Big packages, defaulted note sales, ground up development. That's really where we kind of hit every note.

Well, that's why I was so glad to have you on here. We talked about some of the bigger stuff out there and you and I talked previously about this before. We expect to see some big things happening in that commercial space and that other larger property space or unique space because of everything that's going on. You want to talk about kind of what you're seeing as opportunities maybe in your neck of the woods right now.

Sure. So, you know, it's interesting there are still opportunities out there, but it's become very difficult to quantify the opportunity in the context of where we are, the traditional cap rates, very difficult to assess who's paying, who's not paying, even if it's a completely performing center, which is almost non existent at this point. You know, there's. Everyone seems to have different issues throughout the tenancy mix. But even if, if it's completely performing, what is that going to mean in a year? What is that going to mean in 18 months as we start to see the second half of the fallout? And that's where I believe, and I believe you also agree that's where the real fallout is going to occur over the next 12 to 18. Some are even saying up to 24 months once the market gets to that point where the courts open and the stimulus has run out and folks have decentralized.

Right.

And they've kind of up and moved out completely. Now what is a 10 cap? Is it 12 cap? And we were excited to get involved in six cap deals, five and a half caps if it was a single tenant asset. Now 10, 12, I don't know, does it make sense anymore? What is it going to look like in the next year, year and a half? I think that there are some opportunities, Scott, but I think the majority of the opportunities are still out there. We're recommending to our clients pull trigger. You have to. If you have tax free exchanges that you're trying to keep in line or for whatever other reasons you need to move assets, go ahead and do that, but keep some powder dry.

Yeah, it's definitely. We've seen that with a lot of the funds there on Wall street, they've been pulling back for the last 24 months expecting something to change as the market kind of turns. And you guys are in such a unique kind of market, especially legally wise, with the foreclosure process really being on a slow boat to China for the most part. If you think about that compared to like here in Texas where everything's so fast. And that's the way when you start seeing these national numbers, you gotta break it down on a micro bas. Are there any things that you're looking at? Obviously vacancy factors, cap rates, stuff like that, but anything that you're kind of watching as kind of your bell cow or your mark that you're kind of paying close attention to, that really shows you when things are changing or things are getting tough.

Yeah, well, we have the traditional metrics, right, that we all kind of take a look at. But what's so different about this turn? We've been through multiple cycles, right? The market goes up, the market goes down. These things happen. But what's so different this time is technology has disrupted everything we do to such an extent that it's not easy, but it certainly is much easier to look at other marketplaces outside of New York City, where the legislative process isn't as difficult and not as threatening, where the legal process certainly is not as difficult. So with that, folks have begun to decentralize. As real estate is decentralized, investors are decentralizing, and we don't know when the courts reopen, what's going to happen. Everyone's in limbo right now. So many of the rights have been shifted. That's been consistent. There's been a consistent shift of rights away from the property owner to the tenant on both the residential and commercial side, believe it or not, Even confessions of judgments now they're throwing out. They're saying that they're not gonna stand anymore. There's a. Yeah. And it's become very challenging. So, you know, I don't wanna give your listeners bad advice because there are the traditional metrics that we would look at. But I really do believe that you have to wait and see. Once everything opens back up, how are these things going to play out? How many people are not coming back to the city proper and who's going to backfill that space? I do believe that we're going to have an opportunity to backfill. I do believe that there'll be new markets that are going to open up. I do believe that micro logistics centers and stuff in the M zone is going to absolutely continue to explode.

But what do you mean by the end zone, James?

So the end zone is 1978. I think it was the last time the zoning code was updated in New York. So each piece of property has a zoning classification and you can only build within those classifications. So M property, which for a long time languished because nobody was manufacturing up here in New York. And it was. You could have picked up end zones for a couple of bucks a foot. Now, as we're seeing Amazon and the, you know, the focus on Last Mile on a host of different supply chains. Right. Micro logistics centers are starting to pop up. Storage facilities, cold storage facilities. These distribution centers now are coming into, I don't want to say center city, but into the cities in a meaningful way where that market segment's continuing to explode. Whereas the residential stuff has certainly pulled back. The retail stuff has really pulled back. But if you have M property, we're bullish as we've ever been. We think that that's poised for continued growth for the foreseeable future.

Yeah, we've seen. Starting to see some things pivot on manufacture, but also like Amazon looking at coming and taking over old malls, retail, large retail centers are Basically vacant now that nobody's going to. They expect 50% of malls across the country not to recover. And that's a great opportunity. I even saw a company buy a mall and turn it into a SWAT center for police training because it's a great kind of. With the different shops and everything to do live target practice with live rounds in a mall. You got to get a little creative, stuff like that. But that's. I think you hit the nail right in the head that manufacturing and those companies are looking to downsize or have a little bit more availability and smaller units. Kind of like what Blockbuster did initially or Best Buy did initially with the machines in the malls. Blockbuster Minis. You know what I mean? Or have it be a small store versus a big, big box store. Right?

Yeah. So it's interesting because we're having a lot of discussions now with the administration and the powers that be centered around precisely that. It's time for us to reimagine our real estate in every way from top down. And I have to say, to that end, the city's been very responsive and has pulled together officials from each different arm up here. And we're brainstorming on what do these assets look like after Corona. How can we reposition? And I think the most important thing that we could be doing up here is pulling back some of those old zoning codes that were put in place in a different time, in a different era. If you think about how technology has disrupted every single industry over the last 15 to 20 years, and then you apply it to the zoning, which is what allows us to envision and create real estate in the greatest city in the world that hasn't changed much. Right. It's time that we pull those layers back. And I think we have to really start to reimagine what M zone means, what C zones mean, what the R zones mean. And the world's changing, brother. We've got to change with it.

Yeah, exactly. And that's one thing that I've seen. Have you seen a lot of the residential stuff, especially in Staten island, really start to skyrocket as people moved out of the city, jumped on the ferry and come across. You seen those? Probably prices really jump up or days on market probably drop dramatically. Huh.

We have Staten island is the forgotten borough. Right. It's always kind of been known as the forgotten borough, where a part of New York City, but we've always kind of lagged behind. And it's really great silver linings. I guess the one takeaway in that perspective is Staten Island. Has now become the chosen borough. People are, you know, we're the borough of parks. We've got some wonderful places out here that are. Now folks are waking up and saying, wow, you know, I can sell in Brooklyn my 13 foot wide townhouse for a million seven, a million eight, and I can come out to Staten island and buy a Beautiful on a 50 by 100 detached center hall colonial and have my own little nice slice of heaven here, put 800 grand in the bank or reinvest it into other assets. We have seen everything you just said, days on market come down, listing prices are going up and deals are moving with a really healthy velocity. The absorption's down. Everything in Staten island has been trending in the right way. The rest of the city, it's been tough.

It's been tough. Now, knowing your kind of background, let's talk a little about some of your background in the note business. Talk about some of the things that you've done in the past. And I'm setting that up because I want to ask a follow up question. So share a little bit with our listenership. Some of the things that you've done in the past when it comes to the distressed debt side.

Sure. So in the past, again, as we've kind of been a chameleon and we've adapted into whatever trend we thought was on the horizon. And back in, I think it was 2006, actually, we had come back to the office. I was with a business partner, I'll never forget it. And we looked at each other and we said, it's over, it's over. We felt it in 2006. This is done. And real estate, of course, reports two, three, four quarters down the road, especially in New York. But a couple of years before the bubble officially burst, we had said, let's start to hone our skills. Let's whiteboard what we think this is going to look like on the other side. And of course, the faulted notes was where we knew that was headed. There was a lot of banks that were credit card lenders one day and then they were full blown lending institutions the next, you know, and you could kind of jot down the names on a short list that you thought were going to be headed for trouble. And that's what we did. And we started to cultivate relationships with those banks. And when it came time to move those notes, we became experts in it. Not on your scale, not anywhere near your scale, but, you know, for us, especially out here in Staten island, defaulted note for 20, $30 million that wrap a host of different assets out here in the borough was a big deal. So we focused on that for a couple of years and then as we saw things starting to change again, it became all right. So now what are we going to do with the product? How are we going to reposition it? Is it going to be long term cap rate plays? Are we going to do condo or co op plays and have, you know, a disposition plan? Is it going to be a hybrid thereof? So we started to move through that as well. And one thing leads to another. You know what happens, you know, when you're in the business, you have a way through vertical integration to kind of get involved in different synerg businesses. Capex Funding is our commercial lending arm. We have a very healthy consulting company, the residential and commercial, of course, and the real estate side. And now we're doing work in the cost confinement space for companies that are skinnying up and property owners that are skinnying up. So Cassandra is the mothership, but as the markets evolve, you kind of evolve with it and vertically integrate where you can.

Yeah. So that leads to the follow up question because you're very familiar in a lot of these areas and it's been flexible. I guess. The one biggest thing, those that stick around long term versus just an upward trend of those are the most they can pivot or find the opportunities really kind of ahead of time. You've talked about a couple of things there. What are you kind of putting in place here for once? Things shake loose. I don't want you give away any secret sauce, but if you've got some things that you're keeping your eye on that you think are going to be really advantageous there in your neck of the woods, would you mind sharing?

Sure. So what we're doing at this point is on our own portfolio and for our clients, as I had said, we're divesting from certain asset classes that have experienced contraction for a number of reasons not limited to the traditional metrics. Right. Their legislative threats, Scott, have become a massive, massive part of our decision tree on everything we do now. The legislation is coming out fast and furious. While it's all well intended, sometimes the consequences are so profound that they're setting entire asset classes back significantly. So we're looking to move out of some of the multifamily space, we're looking to move out of some of the retail space. Not all of it, but some of it. And we're keeping some of the powder dry. We're moving into opportunity zones and we're doing Incubators in those buildings where if you could get wrap your head around getting out of trading bricks for bricks, we want to start trading bricks for human capital and talent. So we're excited about a program where through a QOF qualified opportunity fund, we're taking some of that gain from those capital events. And again we're rebuilding new bricks, better, smarter bricks. But we're also holding a piece back to invest in our incubators to grab some of these younger kids that have unbelievable ideas and spirit and energy. And we want to invest in them and in their companies and help provide, you know, a roof over their head infrastructure, high speed Internet mentorship of course, and capital to give them a chance to grow. And then we're also holding back, you know, we're keeping some of the powder dry. As the courts open again, we think that there's going to be look as deposits are shifting within the banks. Right. I was on a call the other day and I heard, I think it was Wells Fargo was offering a half a million dollars, I believe it was for a discount of like a quarter of a point. If you moved a half a million bucks into their bank, right. They would discount your mortgage that amount further. Don't quote me on the number. But it was something along those lines. So what's happening is the big boys are going bring the deposits in, we're going to stay whole, right. We'll remain solvent and compliant. But that money's coming from somewhere and it tends to come from those smaller to mid cap banks. And as those deposits get pulled out, as you are well aware, they fall out of compliance and they have more debt on their books than they can. So what happens at that point? Right. They have to get rid of it. And that's where we think there's going to be a massive amount of opportunity. Not the huge defaulted note markets like it was last time around. I think in that 2, 3, 5, 8 $9 million range, there's going to be a massive, massive amount of opportunity.

Yeah, that's the biggest stuff, you know, that's the biggest price point that's really opportunity wise out there. Is that sub 10 million really anything 5 million and below, we see a lot of that what's been financed by your traditional banks and the bigger stuff is all been gobbled by Wall street and it's just a change of zeros and ones. I love that transfer stuff but I love what you said about being, changing your traditional brick and mortar aspect. Taking a business and converting it to a, like an executive office or providing a place for people to come individually to have that professional setting where they don't have to have the whole building or whole leased up, they can do something and you give them the resources to be. And then also investing in what they're doing. That's a phenomenal. I love that aspect of things because there is so much talent coming out right now. And so with technology really changing the way you have to do business these days, I love that stuff, man. It's kudos to you, James, for thinking ahead like that.

Yeah. And if you set it up properly in the Opportunity Zones, not the income, the income is taxed, of course, as any income would be. But if you keep it there. And of course, I would recommend speak to your Opportunity Zone experts. There's some wonderful experts out there. But if you keep the business in that location or in an opportunity zone for 10 years and you hit on the next Google or the next Twitter or the next Snapchat and you sell it for hundreds of millions of dollars, it's tax free.

Mm.

It's tax free. Those are investments that I think are worthwhile. We're not saying 50% of the portfolio, but if you're selling, you're trading out of bricks. Take 10%, take 20% and invest it there. We think it's absolutely well worth it.

That's smart thinking. Now, I wanna throw something out there. You talked about legislation, and with everything going on at the presidential level, we know things don't change overnight there. If Biden's got a tax plan that he's talking about doing away with 1031 exchanges, I don't think it'll go through. But you brought something up. We were talking with a 1031 expert just the other day, and I think this is very relevant because the price points in where you're at fall into not only on the residential side, but also obviously on the commercial side, that if you are trying to move something, doing away with a 1031 exchange is going to cause a stagnation on a lot of sales, don't you think?

It is. And it's going to require all of us to start to reinvent how we shelter those gains. Ergo, the opportunity Zone. Right. That was one of our avenues. I think basis swaps become really, really popular. If, in fact they do get rid of the 1031, I hope they don't. I think that of all the times in the country's history that we cannot afford that type of a blow to the industry, I think that would be really ill time to take that tool away at this point.

Yeah, I'd agree to there. That's where we think a lot of the deferred sales trust or owner finances are coming to play for a lot of the commercial properties to kind of delay those tax, you know, those long term capital gains taxes that people are going to see such an interesting dumpster fire every year. I mean, but with every type of thing, even with fires, there's a fertile ground for a lot of opportunities out there with things going on. You know, you just gotta be flexible, looking at different opportunities there for you. Are you guys looking at anything outside of your area, any other states or anything like that? Or just trying to stay home right now in the empire?

So we're definitely gearing up to operate out of state. Again, the legislative challenges and the courts have become particularly difficult to continue to operate. And the taxes were still getting hit. Right. It's very tough to. And look, I understand certainly the reasons behind the shutdowns and at least the thought process behind it, but when you require someone to shut down their business and then you hit them with a tax bill and there's no abatement on the tax bill and you don't require banks to give forbearance, that becomes really difficult to manage. Right. So I think that New York's always going to be New York. I really do believe that. I think that when it does rebound, it's going to rebound with an unbelievable ferocity the likes of which we've never seen. But it is becoming easier to operate out of state. And I recently met this really dynamic guy out of Texas who specializes in defaulted notes. So I'm hoping to be doing business with him in a meaningful way in the nearest future.

Exactly.

You're my plan, baby.

Gotcha. No problem at all. We got plenty of people like, hey, show me the money, show me the deals. Definitely. Exactly. Now, you mentioned doing some things and was it you have a fund you've started called Capex, is that correct?

That's our commercial lending arm. So that's the non QM field mortgages where we're doing the financing.

Can you talk a little bit? What you guys are proving, what you're kind of seeing right now as far as what you're financing.

Yeah. So right now the big thing is sba, where you have tenants in buildings where perhaps they hadn't previously contemplated making the purchase because the rates are so low and because the programs have gotten so flexible on sba. I have to say SBA has done an unbelievable job adapting. Here we are finding that we're able to convert renters into owners, which is great. But outside of that, we are still financing deals. We just closed the retail deal last week. But it's challenging the discount rates that they're applying to the appraisals and to the rents, even for the tenants that are performing. And I get it, the traditional metrics are out the window at this point. It becomes difficult. The LTVs become so egregious that you have to pull back a bit. The private money as hot as it's ever been. As the banking restrictions increase and they become less flexible, that need for that private money becomes more and more and more relevant. So we're seeing a lot of things happen transactionally there. A lot of SBA stuff, some refinances. But short of that, the traditional lending metrics have been very difficult.

Where have you seen the LTVs dropping down? Obviously, we know cap rates have changed and nois and also affects the true value of a commercial property different than a residential property or rental property. We all know that's differently. But we all knew the banks were getting kind of greedy up in the mid-60s, even 70% range. Are you seeing it down in the 50s now, the low 60s or even below that?

Yeah. So if you're not in the space where your tenants are hospitals or medical, or you're not in the M space where you've got trucking companies, storage companies, logistic companies, short of those two markets, all of them are down, quite honestly, the LTVs. And they're right where you're saying 50, 60%, nobody is excited about 70, 80% anymore. It's just the thing of the past. It'll be interesting to see how some of these things shake out and how some of these lenders, the CMBS lenders in particular, because some of those programs were so aggressive and those funds all have these springing power of attorneys where if there's a default, they now are in control of it. And I think they're kind of sitting around going, we don't want to be in control of all these properties.

That's not where we make money. It was a great idea on the Friday, not such a good idea now. It's the whole same thing happened with banks and defaulted on the real estate. They didn't want to manage property and vacant homes. You know, they wanted the performing stuff, which is what all the banks want anyway, you know.

Yeah. Not as easy as everyone thinks, right? No.

Well, but that's also leads to an opportunity with, if you can be creative and structured, deal with owner Financing, like you said, bringing in a private lender, maybe in a mezzanine, you know, short term and short term is a whole different ballgame. Now, short term is two to five years, really, versus 12 months to carry that paper till the market rebounds if you find an opportunity. That's why you said having that drive, that extra money sitting on the sidelines, ready to spring on a deal that makes sense and the ability to get creative if something's going to make sense or transition. I think that's the one biggest thing, and I think you agree with this, is if you're transitioning, how are they evaluating that property transitioning? You know, we saw a office space convert to self storage in downtown Denver was an interesting play. 110 units and it got bought up for $560,000. And the cap rate, when I looked at the numbers, I was like, oh my God. And then talking to the seller, I'm like, really? Office, I would think is a little tough downtown. He goes, it is for office. But what we did is we turned it to self storage and we reached out to all the offices closing and they're the all who rented with us. We filled up in like a week with office furniture, basically.

I'm glad you brought that deal up because that's a perfect example of what we're dealing with up here now. So there has been multiple deals that we were involved in, some that closed and some that died. And I'll explain why. Where they were taking these buildings where the tenancy wasn't there anymore and they were converting them into self storage. Big returns. They take that, they sell it on the secondary market. You get wonderful money. At the end of the day this year in the budget, the governor cut the ICAP for self storage buildings so there's no longer a tax abatement available. So where there was this suffering product right in the office spaces, the vacancies were up again. I've been talking about the decentralization of real estate for years. In comes the self storage. People reinvent themselves. Great. This is a nice, easy transition. Deals start to happen. Governor pulls it out of the budget. Deals start dying all over the place because the taxes here are so egregious, you can't make them work anymore. So again, if there's ever been an opportunity or a time when I would call upon the legislature that continue to focus on pulling some of those things back and allowing the market to kind of find its own level when you tweak those little things and you turn those dials because it Looks good on the balance sheet and you can recapture that tax base. The impact is so profound and so 10x20x more devastating when the deal never happens. Right. And the buildings lay fallow and there's no one paying taxes, there's nobody paying their employees. Those employees are not now going out and eating. Right. All of those things that a waterfall is immense on a transaction like that. It's tough.

It is tough. Speaking of tough, I think I've got a buddy who's taking hotels, smaller 200 unit or less hotels, and converting them to multifamily in areas that need affordable housing. That's my next question for you. The hotel industry obviously has been dramatically affected in New York City and all over the place. Are you seeing maybe some of those opportunities, some of the things pop up where distressed hotels or stuff being closed a little bit more?

So, yeah, well, without a doubt, some of the hotels made deals with the city and they're handling the homeless population now. So they've been able to stay solvent during the shutdown in that manner. But those who either elected not to participate or were not able to participate for a number of different reasons, they're in trouble. Again, a great example of repurposing the real estate. But again, because of the complexities of the zoning here, it's not as simple as, you know, I'm sure down in San Antonio or in some other districts. It is a very, very long, difficult process to try and operate outside of the prescribed zoning. And I think that that is an immediate need that has to get addressed where there's an emergency panel, I sit on the mayor's advisory group to address these kinds of things. And I'm hopeful that we can get to some sort of resolution there because the flexible zoning and emergency zoning, I think an absolute must to help the city rebound.

Now, one of the things that you've done this year too is launch your podcast. And I absolutely love what you're doing with the pod. You're listening to this. You could not see the megawatt bulb that just went off with James smiling right now talking about the podcast. Let's talk a little about that. Because you do such a great job. You're really doing a great job, not only marketing, but your social media stuff is second to none there. Let's talk about the podcast and what made you kind of decide to launch one and kind of your focus with that.

Sure. So thank you for that. This is very, very, very far out of my comfort zone. I've always been a head down guy. Just Go to work and put your 14, 15, 16 hours in a day. Grind it out. And I never worked on this side of the business. We began with business coaching and we began forcing ourselves to get out of our comfort zones, quite honestly. And Peter, my CMO for the company, who had previously worked for Apple, said, hey, there's a whole other side of this thing here. Real estate is as much about marketing today as it is about being a deal maker. Maybe more about market marketing than it is about being a deal maker. So we had made the commitment and when Covid hit, everything was delivered. We said, let's go in and finish the studio up. Let's get it ready to go. And it became for us, honestly, a really personal thing. We needed to give the folks a platform to communicate a lot of frustration, a lot of stories in the local business community that we needed to get out. It took off much faster than I honestly took off more than I ever thought it would, never mind much faster than I thought it would. And I give full credit to Peter for that. Peter Gambino, our cmo, brilliant guy, has really changed how we do things here. And it became, like I said, personal. It was a way for us to help connect the dots and to give an audience to folks who otherwise didn't have it and to get that message out there and to communicate. Scott, there's nothing more important today than communication.

Yeah, that's one of the biggest things that we found this year being so unique is just one thing, is the need for us to touch base. Sometimes we get so bogged down in our day to day, like working at our desk.

Desk.

It's nice to have. You can't meet in person and share a beer or a cup of coffee. You can share an hour or a half hour online and have that personal interaction. But the venting side, I agree to that. Sometimes people just need a place to vent their frustration, how they're feeling to express and realize that they're not alone these days. More so than anything else, right?

Yeah, without a doubt. We're all in this boat together. It doesn't matter if you're a new business or, you know, we've been here, like I said, 1989, we've been through the 9 11s and the 08 crash, Superstorm Sandy, which was devastating for Staten Island. We've been through the stress tests but in the moment you feel like you need to connect and that's been something that we take a lot of pride in. We've been connecting and connecting our peers with an audience they otherwise wouldn't have had access to. And it's really been a great experience for us.

What's been the biggest surprise for you?

How much I enjoy it, quite honestly. I promise. It was so far out of my comfort zone, I felt, how am I going to get on and talk for an hour and how am I going to carry a broadcast in that way? And I've fallen into it, and I've really fallen in love with it. I enjoy the podcast so much. I look forward to them every week. And anytime I have an opportunity to come on a show like this, we're so appreciative to be able to connect and get that message out. That is without a doubt, my biggest surprise is how we, all of us, we've all just kind of fallen in love with it. It's a wonderful tool for us.

Yeah, your whole team does a great job. Kudos to Rebecca on there as well. Out there doing a great job with anything going on. James. And this is kind of taken away from business. A little personal. What do you do at night besides hiding elves on the shelves for your kids at night? What are you doing to relax a little bit with everything going so crazy?

I enjoy the country. I enjoy to get out and to fly fish, and that's kind of my passion. I enjoy to get out in touch with nature. We've got a place up in Honesdale, Pennsylvania. Don't get there often, but when I do, reconnecting with the earth, we've got cows and chickens and goats and that goat farmer.

I didn't know you were a goat farmer. There we go.

Absolutely. For me, that's it. A lot of families, we joke around, like to go during their downtime and put their feet in the sand and to relax. Not us. We like to get in the mud and play with the animals. And I don't know, there's something that's so therapeutic about it for us. The whole family really enjoys it.

Yeah, there's definitely something to be said around different animals. You're getting a little dirt under your fingernails and getting dirty. Those that haven't experienced it. It's something to be said about that. There's an energy that flows in the ground. I mean, you know, I live in North Austin, Texas. Here we've got to have a very big backyard, but we've turned it into our own tropical forest. And it's the nice thing. Every morning, first thing, getting up, go outside, just walking, enjoying it, trying to step away from all the negativity in the news. That's taking place out there. And that kind of brings me with everything that's going on in the media, what would you say? I just want to know your opinion. I know you probably have a strong opinion with what we see. And I won't say on all the networks how much do you think was what the reporting is going on up in your guys neck of the woods is actually accurate.

Can we be more specific? There's so many topics.

So I get that. So let's do, let's do one thing. Let's talk about COVID because I know New York City was hit hard initially, but I've got friends that are head nurses in ER room saying they've got a lot of empty beds. They're only seeing a few cases here, there. Do you think the media is really over exaggerating the situation up in New York? I mean, you had the boat that came in, the big ship that left that really didn't get used and stuff like that. You think it's overblown over the neck of the woods.

Yeah. So look, look, somehow somewhere along the way we thankfully, I think we dodged a big bullet here. I think that if this was as fatal as we had originally thought it was, good lord, were we not prepared. So I understand the hesitation and the desire for the powers that to make sure we don't get to a critical mass issue in our hospitals. Right. And for as many cases as I can tell you about folks who I knew who got sick and who really got sick, I can tell you about cases where people had no clue they had it. And only through all of these testing efforts did we find out that they did have it. Literally zero symptoms. So I think it's a wicked bug. I think we all have to do our part. But I do think that there comes a point where the cure surpasses the ailment. And that's not meant to be disrespectful to anyone who's lost anyone through Covid. But there is an other side to this. And for those of us who have dedicated our lives to our businesses and folks don't realize, they think, oh well, James, he may be a greedy business owner. Talking that way. We have so many people that depend on us, so many families that depend on us, that it's not us, it's our extended family. And it's been difficult to keep the wheels turning in New York to begin with. It's a very expensive place to operate. And when you layer something like this on top of it and forced closures, it's tough I think that toning down the level of reporting probably would serve us all well. I don't think that we're all so connected now, Scott. Any critical information we can access right. Immediately through a host of different medias. So toning it down. I think honestly stepping that rhetoric down would serve us all well at this point. I think not only because it's been over reported, I think that it's created Covid fatigue. I think that there's a lot of folks that have let their guard down even with the basic safety things that we all should follow because they're just exhausted on it, man. It's on every channel, it's on every app. It's so in your face that people are kind of tired of it at this point and that's dangerous. We have to stay vigilant. So, yeah, I think we would all be served well if you things got toned down a bit.

Good stuff. Favorite New York sports team. I always love asking this question and you can pick a couple if you need to. One across the sports.

That is very tough for me. So I'm a die hard Giants fan and I'm a die hard Yankees fan.

So there you go.

Those are my two top teams, without a doubt.

You know, it might be interesting to see how who wins the NFC east this year with four or five wins, you know what I mean? And the Giants are in first place right now. Surprise, surprise.

This coach Joe Judge guy comes in, first year head coach, a veteran giving him a hard time. You know, Golden Tate, he goes and he sends him down to the practice squad. To me, that's leadership, brother.

Yep.

That is in this market with the media frenzy when something like that happens. I love everything that he's doing. I'll take another losing season if that's the way the team is headed. I absolutely love it.

Yeah, exactly. So it'll be interesting to see. We might need to place a little bit because I'm such a big Cowboys fan. So don't hold it against me now, brother. But that's all right. Thanks.

Jason Garrett, brother. We're loving him over here. He's got Wayne Gallman looking like Gail Sayers. I don't know what the heck's happened, but it's amazing.

Yeah. You know, Gary was actually. Well, he played Cowboy. He played quarterback for the Giants for a couple of years there too, if I remember correctly. Yeah, Ivy League education. It's amazing what happens when you can actually do something with it, which is being controlled by the GM or the owner for a little bit. That's a whole nother, whole nother thing out there. Good stuff there. Well, James, what's the best way for our listeners and people watching this or listening to the replay of this? The best way to reach out to you, find out more what you're doing, listen to what you know, the podcast stuff like, what's the best way for people to get a hold of you.

You could find basically everything through our website, right? Www.cassandraproperties.com also my email, you know I am not accessible. It's jamesassandraproperties.com certainly always available. Happy to get on and chat and I absolutely love chatting with you. I have to say you've got a way about you that brings out the best in the Cassandra Properties family. This has really been great.

Hey, you know what, I appreciate that. Same here, man. It's always nice to get on the phone and zoom here with somebody. And you said something that was really impactful a couple minutes ago. People don't realize how many people that entrepreneurs and business owners affect. Not only our employees, but our vendors and their family and our clients and our tents. I mean we are our own GDP of some sort affecting so many more things out there. And people don't realize that a lot of the difficult decisions that we have to make that keep us up at night. And it's one of the best things I have found about the podcast is being able to connect with like minded individuals who are also facing those things. And you are putting in those 14 and 16 hour days when nobody else thinks, oh, you're probably just working six or seven and chilling, have a bottle of scotch and a good cigar. No, not the case.

A lot of times you would have a hard time quantifying how many times I've disappointed my wife. I've missed an event. I wasn't there for something that I should have and promised I would be. Those are the things you don't hear about on our side of the table that are really difficult to quantify and why we get so passionate when there's a situation like this where there's forced shutdown and these types of things. You know, we've put so much of our life into our business that it's an emotional process. It really is.

Yeah. That's the beautiful thing behind us. There are very powerful women and strong women who allow us to do what we do and keep us on track. And that's why the holidays is such a great time to spend time with the family and show the loved ones that we love them and respect them and go from there. I'm sure you got big plans for the holidays, huh?

Yeah, with the restrictions again, it's tough. But my wife has been unbelievable partner for me over the years and allowed me and really beyond allowed me, she's encouraged me to go out and get it and do what I do. So we're looking forward to some quiet time around the holidays with the kids and the family and get ready to jump on into 2021, baby. It's going to be a ride.

Yes, sir, it is. Definitely. Well, James, thanks so much for coming on the no Closure show. Thank you so much for just delivering and being honest and delivering to our audience out there. And once again, guys, I highly encourage you to check out the Cassandra Properties website, his podcast, listen to his guests go on, go over, give him a five star review as well and hit the subscribe button. There's one of the ones that I subscribed to recently and love listening to and always educational, always a nugget. Take away from that as well. So, James, once again, thanks so much for coming on the show.

Thank you so much. I appreciate it. Stay safe.

You too. All right, guys, that's gonna wrap it up for this episode of the Note Clothes Show. One thing I think you'll take away from James is the reason and the necessity doesn't be flexible in your investments, in what you're looking at. Looking to the future, not just staying stagnant and where you're at and being aw, shucks, but looking at opportunities in the market, in the future, in people and figuring out a way to pivot that, keep some powder dry, as you like to say. So you've got the opportunity to pull the trigger, to take advantage of an amazing deal or jump into a deal that maybe you don't see very often. So go out, take some action, buddy, and we'll see you all at the top, everybody. Bye.