How Young People Can Get Out Of Financial Dependence With Bobbi Rebell

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This is the no Closer show where you get the latest developments in distressed note investing and learn the secrets of how you can control millions of dollars worth of property for panties on the dollar. Get educated and entertained by someone who has closed thousands of deals and lives to support you in achieving the same. Now here's your host CEO of We Close Nodes, Scott Carson.

Hey everyone, I'm Bobbi Rebel. I am the host of the Money Tips for Financial Grownups podcast. And on this episode of the Note Closer Show, Scott and I talk about my new book Launching Financial Grownups and so much more. Join us.

Good morning, good afternoon, good evening everybody. Welcome to this episode of the no Closure Show. As always, Scott Clarkson, jacked up and excited to be here with the day. We have a very special guest today, somebody I met at fincon but somebody been following for a while actually out there. And when I saw that she was a keynote speaker at one of the big ideas of fincon, I was really excited. And this lady knows her stuff. You've probably seen her on so many things, whether it's Reuters or CNBC or all over the place, she's held so many positions. She's a best selling author of the book how to be a Financial Grownup. She is the host of the badass podcast Money Tips for Financial Grownups. And then of course she is a new book out that we're excited to have and be a part of. Therefore to help get the word out what she's doing. This is something that we all need, especially if you got kids or you just find yourself as an adult child. The book is launching financial grownups. Live your richest life by helping your almost adult kids or yourself become everyday money smart. So we are honored to have the amazing Bobby Rebel joining us here on the Note Closer Show. What is going on? Bobby, how are you doing today?

I am in awe of your intro. Wow. My background is as a TV anchor and I think you could definitely have that job. You nailed it. Not a single flub. It's. I don't think you have a teleprompter which is really good, really impressive. That speech at fincon was hard for me because I am used to having the crutch of a teleprompter. So I thank you and the audience there was so supportive and lovely. It was really a little bit scary for me because I am used to having that support of having a teleprompter. So I got through the whole thing. So now I get to coast and go on shows like yours. But you're a pro.

Well, I actually studied mass communication. I actually wanted to be a news anchor going through college and then ended up going the route of business and finance and got into the note business these days around. But I love what your message was. We'll get to the book in a second here. But you shared some very honest words at fincon about the need for us as tribal leaders, is what I like to say. Seth Godin, you know the book, the tribe, how we lead everybody. We really need to kind of be a little bit more transparent and share our journey a little bit more, right?

Absolutely. Things always look so neat and clean on the surface, but the truth is life is messy and you can have all of these wonderful ideas on paper. But and this is what really inspired my book is I was a certified financial planner. I had been a business news anchor and writing money related columns for my whole career. And yet my almost adult children were not listening to a word I had to say when it came to investing in a Roth ira. And it was a big fight. And I was like, what is wrong here? Like, I know everything. I'm telling them to do the things and then the things are just not being done. And the truth is humans are complicated. And the book is filled with expert advice because I am ultimately a journalist, so I'm the conduit to bring everyone the advice and I'm learning along with everyone and I share my experiences. We've even got financial therapists in there. So it's not easy. So hopefully my book will help lots of people. It helped me. I will tell you that I did a lot of homework to get the book together and so far the kids are doing a lot better. Having written the book and learned from all the experts. It was really that I needed the help. And then the book was the COVID for that.

You write the book that helps you and it ends up helping your audience in a lot of ways. Right?

Let's hope. We're hoping for that. But it certainly helped my almost adult children. One of them, spoiler alert. Did successfully buy the apartment that she was saving for while the book was being written. She had lived at home and was really banking everything we did supervise. We were. I had access to her bank account and saw the money going in and there were moments, of course, but she did save. She spent two years spending very, very, very little money. And. And she talks about this. She did an episode of my podcast where she does talk about the details of it, but she did miss some things with her friends. And I have mixed feelings When I heard that, I sort of had this pang like, oh, that stinks that she did miss that night out or she did join them late and whatever. But you know what, she's really happy and really proud to be a homeowner. And now she's 25. She bought it when she was 24 and she loves it.

Yeah, that's such a smart activity to be looking at your numbers. And I think we as adults or grown up children, a lot of cases for a lot of us are that in child there we always like wish we'd gone back and done things different. Like I had a guy I was talking with yesterday who's 21, brand new investor. Man, I wish I got started when I was 21 versus doing when I was being a bartender and living the life. And I'm like, I wish we could go back and as an educator, when we teach classes, it's always kind of, and I'm going to ask your opinion on this, what you feel about this. But we like to ask questions of our audience. And when we have people, I'm like, hey, are you, you know, what are you doing? Are you, do you have a Roth ira? Are you saving? And most of the time it's over 50, 60% are like, no, I don't have one. Well, do you have a 401? No, don't have, I'm not really saving anything for retirement. That's downright depressing in a lot of cases, isn't it?

I don't want to characterize it anyone. I would say today is the day you're going to start opening those accounts, whatever's available to you. And depending on what you're doing, different things are available. Look, if you're not in a corporate job with a 401k, you're not going to have a 401k if you don't have the qualifications, meaning income and the right level of income tax bracket for the Roth ira. You can't do that. But everyone can just invest. And that's the other thing I tell people because you know these kids and it's slipping my mind. I don't want to say the number wrong. I forget what the max is to put into an IRA or Roth IRA right now, but I think it's six.

Right now, 6,000 right now, and then a thousand ketchup if you're a thousand.

Okay, so it's six. So let's say, you know, my 22 year old puts in a six, he doesn't have to be done. This is the most Important thing with young people, he you don't have to be done. You have no dependence. So you actually in theory will never have more money to put away for yourself to gift to yourself. That's what you're really doing. So treat yourself to the gift of investing in just a plain old brokerage fund. You know, you don't have to put everything into retirement. And that's not a bad idea because then you know what, you do have access to that money. And maybe it is for a dream vacation when you're 25 that you started saving for when you were 22. Or maybe it's a down payment on a home, or maybe it's having a car without a big note on it. Right?

Yeah. What do they say the average car payment's over $700 a month now? Something like that. Which is just. That's a mortgage payment, you know, that's what the mortgage was. My first house, in a lot of cases I'm like, oh. And it's a depreciating asset as well too, so.

Yeah, well, although not always it's been quirky, that part's gotten really weird. But the other thing that worries me with respect to cars is that also the length the timeline of a car loan has extended. I had a five year car loan when we first got our Now I think 11 year old Ford Explorer, but I hear the time is really extending to sometimes seven years for that loan, which is really long.

Now, with your background and your history as a CFP as well, and then writing this book, what was probably the number one surprise thing you got writing it? Was there a nugget aha moment, a light bulb that went off and communicating with your kids, what was the biggest learning experience for you?

Well, I'll tell you the biggest aha moment in writing it was I put the age parameters at 16 to 26. Those are parents of almost adults that are 16 to 26. Okay, so 16, because that's usually when you might have your first sort of on the books job and you might be getting a car. That kind of age range where you have to worry about insurance and those expenses and 26, you come off your parents insurance maybe. But a lot of my friends came to me and said my kid is 28, 29, 30, 35 and still financially tied. To me that was shocked that 26 wasn't necessarily the maximum because a generation ago very often the max was 18, you know, or 22, you know, it was a life milestone. Going to college, graduating high school, graduating college, first job, getting Married, whatever it may be. Now that's all out the window. And there seems to be no boundaries to when children, adults get off the parents payroll. And that was really shocking is the number of people that came to me and said, I don't know what to do. No one knows this, but my kid is living at home. And they're sort of embarrassed. And so no one's talking about it, but it's happening. It's like subsidizing their kid. They're not living at home, but they're being subsidized.

We saw a little bit of that back in the last recession where people, you know, when they were losing their houses, they moved back in with mom and dad for a little bit different situation.

Those are external factors. That's not what I'm talking about. Families should be there for family, right? That's not what I'm talking about. I'm talking about unnecessary financial dependence.

What do you think's caused that? We're talking about games, people not going out and getting those jobs as early. What do you think? What's the vaccination to solve that?

Well, I don't know about that, but there are big societal things that are happening that have changed the way that parents and children relate and have really changed the expectations not only of parents and children and families, but of society. So for example, let's talk about the Affordable Care Act, Obamacare. Well, if children usually makes the most financial sense, frankly for children to stay on their parents health plans until they're 26. So what does this do? It creates a financial tie. While I'm already paying for the health insurance, maybe I'll also keep their phone bill going. Now we have things which we didn't have a generation ago, like cell phone bills, where they're on a family plan so you'd have to proactively pull them off. You're all sharing a Netflix account. Why would you do that? I'm very much against having double bills if it's completely legal to have everybody on the same Netflix account do it. But you also have given permission effectively to many corporations to not give young adults benefits or to keep them in a gig economy state. Or you've given the young adults permission to sort of dawdle and kind of dip their toe into different careers and different, you know, putting together this hodgepodge of side hustles. And there's some benefits to that because there's a lot of people that were miserable being shoved into the career because they had to get the benefits. They had to be able to support themselves. So it's not a cut and dry situation. But the reality is, because so many young people are in the gig economy and stay financially dependent on their parents, there isn't that sort of marker that there used to be. And there's also, and again, this is something that has some good to it. There's a lot less shame in it. Right. We also have parents that want their children to stay at the same lifestyle that the parents are at. So in other words, if you're living in a certain level home, you want your children to not be in a dump. So they're subsidizing them when really in many cases the children would be okay living at the age appropriate and income appropriate level. The parents are propping them up and then they're surprised when the kids can't keep up. So we have this expectation that the kids live the life of a 50 year old parent when they're 25. And that's not fair to the kids. So a lot of my book, I hate to say it, is really talking to the parents about being more confident in your children that they can make it because very often parents are offering support that wasn't asked for.

It's almost like throwing your kid in the deep end and say, hey, you'll swim, let's throw you the deep in there a little bit. And if you do drown, we'll throw life raft. Let's get you in there and get you swimming on your own. You know what I'm talking about, Matt?

Yeah. I think it's amazing to me and seeing this in my own life that when you. For example, my stepson, senior in college, he's studying film and tv, he came to my husband and I and said, I need X dollars to complete my film for school. And it was a range of, you know, let's call it $5 to $10, whatever. And we said, okay. And we looked at each other because my husband's good and we knew, we just said, what's your plan? How can we help you with your plan? In other words, we could have written a check and we really didn't want to, but we could have stretched and done it. But what good does that do, right? And he's not going to respect the budget. So he went on go fund me and he set up a page and he did a video with his other two producers and we did contribute to his GoFundMe page. We guided him and said, you should hit up these relatives. Maybe you want to hit up these friends who have you worked for in the last few years. That might be a mentor that might want to contribute. You can also just put it out there to random people. What can you do? And you know what? He only raised half the money and that was great. You know why? Because he had to work and make that film within that budget and he did an amazing job. Right. But he raised the money himself. We're so proud of him. And he learned if you don't have the budget, you adjust to the budget. And I think it was a great lesson. He's doing great. And he, I think really had a feeling of accomplishment that he had raised that money, not just took a check from his parents.

Yeah, I think it's so important. I think we're so capable of so much more than what we think we are. If we get out there and stretch and stretch a little higher, do a little bit things, we don't need everything to be so big. We can do a whole lot with a lot less a lot of times than what we think.

Yeah. And our kids are good. If you raise them well, let them accomplish things. Let them know that you have confidence in them, but you're there for them. You're there, you're the backstop. If something really bad happens, you'll be there for them. Let them know that. But also give them the confidence to know they're going to be okay and they can accomplish things on their own. And you're very confident in them. And that's really important because something could happen and you won't be there for them.

What about tough. Okay, exactly. What about tough love? How does that come into the picture?

Sometimes depends on the kid. I am generally not a big believer in tough love. I am definitely a believer in letting your kid know that you believe in them. And that's very different from tough love. I don't believe in cutting a kid off at an arbitrary age. I know that some people do. If that works for you and your kid and that's right for you, go for it for me. And when you read the book, it's very much the world. It's a tough place out there, Scott. If you know someone and you have a connection, you can help your kid get a job. Call that connection, help them. It's hard, right? But make sure that they do the follow up that they do the emails. Look, if you want look at their emails, help them write the emails. Don't write it for them, but say I'm happy to take a look at it. I'm happy to give you some Feedback. You can nudge them and say, did you follow up with them? Don't do the follow up yourself. Right. There's nothing wrong with being helpful in the background and letting them know that they can come to you. My Little boy's in 9th grade. He texted me the other day that he was confused. He was getting a refund on something he bought. He has money that I give him through an app and he had bought, I think, some video game. No. Maybe it was a poster that was being sent to our house. And he didn't understand why it was being refunded and he didn't understand how it was going to come back to this app, what was going to happen. And he had not informed me that he was buying this and he didn't have to. That was in the zone, that he didn't do anything wrong. But I love that he came to me and I was able to look at it and say, you didn't put our full address. You didn't write our address correctly. So there was a communication there. And I said, from now on, why don't you have me check things? I said, you can buy what you want with your allowance that you've earned, but let mom check it for you. And now he understands. So because we let him fail a little, he will now come to us. We'll let him do his thing, but it's okay to have a second pair of eyes on it. You're there to teach your kids not to kind of throw them to the wolves, right?

Exactly. Well, it's also probably a little different mindset versus Let me check. Well, no, I got it. You let him kind of fail and realize the value.

Let him fail.

Exactly.

I let him put the address in incorrectly and it's fine. So he didn't get his poster, whatever it was that he ordered. Maybe it was a T shirt, I don't know. But it didn't come. He got a refund because they couldn't mail it because there was an incomplete address.

Exactly. Now he knows exactly and it's corrected and won't make the same mistake again.

And I did not judge him. Right. I said, let me take a look at it. Oh, it looks like you didn't put the complete address. How about next time you want to buy something, just show me so I can double check it for you.

As our kids are getting older and graduating high school, pre graduation is getting ready to go out in the world. In a lot of cases, go to college. What are some of your favorite tips or recommendations for parents to Help them start off on that financial pathway on a good foot, on a good trajectory.

I would let them do as much paperwork as possible with your supervision. And it does matter. They have to press the keys on their own keyboard. So even my son that just graduated college, he paid his rent, I reimbursed him. So we covered his rent. I don't know what went on with the landlord that's with him. He's got to pay his rent on time and he's got to submit receipts to me and I'll reimburse him. But he is the one that has to make sure he pays on time. He's the one that has to make sure he gets his security deposit back. He has to make sure that he paid his renters insurance. I'll be checking on him, but it's on him. And the actual payments have to happen through the kid. And I think that's really important. Even with tuition, he had the account and I think keeping them close to the numbers and making them aware of the actual tuition is really important. You know, when you sort of just have a debit card and you're just going against your parents money, maybe you don't feel it as much, but when it's your money and then you have to make the spreadsheet and submit it for reimbursement, which is also what you're going to do as an employee potentially.

Right.

I think you see the numbers and feel it, it's a little more tangible to you.

Yeah, that totally makes sense to get into that process, doing it, acting like you would as an adult out there to get things reimbursed and expense reports and stuff like that. It's very, very important.

Yeah, and the same thing with their taxes. He had income, he had a job. Keep them close to the taxes, let them see the form.

Are there any mistakes that you see parents making? You know, say hey, let's not go that route. You know, like maybe you have them as a cosigner credit card or give them a credit card to handle on stuff. There's faux pas that you don't think work out really well.

I think assuming when a child says they get it, that they do, sometimes they don't. And an example I talk about in the book is my stepdaughter who's amazing, the one who bought an apartment at age 24. When it came time to set up the 401k for her first job, she set it up, but she hadn't actually put money into investments. So I said to her, oh, are you all set with your 401k? Yep. I'm going out with my friends. Hold on, let me look. Okay. And she had not actually chosen the investments. So we did that. We're good. But don't assume just because they say they understand something that they do. Ask them to explain it back and ask to see the page. Ask to see that they really did set it up correctly and they didn't. Maybe, for example, pick a mutual fund to invest in in their 401k that was not the right one for them. Really check up on them and create that open dialogue. But be careful not to be judgmental. Just don't always believe them when they say they got it. They'll sometimes say that because they're rushing out to go with their friends or they don't want to hear it or they just whatever. But, you know. Did you sign up for your commuter benefits? Oh, let me see.

Let's double check.

Let me see. Let's double check that everything is done correctly, especially when it comes to things that are only once a year. So, for example, if they're in the business of having a flexible spending account, although most kids now have HSAs, but let's say they have an FSA and it's use it or lose it and you got to do it right for the year and you're done for the year. Check it, please. Check it. Make sure they did it. They might have misunderstood what you said or be confused or thought it was something else. Almost every time a kid doesn't understand something or says they understand and don't, it is well intentioned, but it happens a lot. So check, check, check.

That doesn't always happen with just kids though, too. It happens with a lot of adults. Yes.

Scott, check on anyone that you care about. Because we all have our moments. I mean, we all have our moments where we are forgetful or we don't check the right box or something happens and it doesn't process. And you know, even with the general benefits, once a year with my family, you have to make sure you get the receipt and keep that receipt because things go wrong and you want to make sure that you have it, that you signed up for the health insurance correctly or whatever it may be because there are very serious consequences if you don't fill out those annual enrollment benefits properly. And let's not even talk about Medicare. Right. That's not your audience yet. But we want, you know, Medicare is really funky. So.

Yeah. Trying to sit down my mom to get there a while back. Yeah. So I Was like, let's get a professional here to help us out with that versus trying to wing it here. Now I have to ask this because I know with your expertise, experience, is there something that people do? It's kind of like the whole aspect of in your real estate and a friend goes and buys a house and you're a realtor and they're being asked your opinion about something. Is there something in the finances that friends and people do that you're like, why didn't you just pick up the phone and call me on that? Anything that stands out, you're like, besides, you know, checking, you know, 401ks and stuff like that, what's the thing that stands out to you?

That's like a pet peeve, mistakes that friends make. I think that peer pressure is something that is very complicated and still lives with us as adults. And I think that sometimes people will buy things to impress other people that they don't even like. There's that thing, right? So I do get frustrated when people I see that I think don't have the money. And maybe, I don't know, maybe they do have the money. But I do think people live beyond their means sometimes. And I feel bad because I think it comes from being well intentioned and our very human insecurities and our very human desire to be liked and to be accepted into the group. But I really. One thing that I've urged my stepdaughter to do, that I try to practice as well, is if you're going out with a group, try to be in charge of the restaurant and pick the restaurant. That's the price point for the person with the least amount of money to make everyone comfortable. And I really hate it when people will go with a restaurant example, choose a restaurant that may be their favorite, or maybe it's a restaurant they've always aspired to go to. Maybe it's a restaurant they think will impress their friends. If they say, oh, hey, let's go to this cool trendy restaurant that's ridiculously expensive because I hang out there, well, that's not doing anyone a favor. And I will tell you, I've met through my career some extremely wealthy people. And part of the way to stay there for many of them is to not spend extravagantly. I have friends that are, oh, I don't want to say very wealthy. Let's just say very wealthy. And you would not know it because while they will dress very neatly and very nicely and they'll drive up perfectly nice car, they are not flashy. And they don't need to go to the most expensive restaurant in town and order extremely expensive drinks and all the things to prove their worth. It's usually people that are insecure or just, you know, maybe want to impress you that do that. It's not a sign of being wealthy to overspend on things like meals, etc. So I just feel bad. I feel bad for those people making poor financial choices, and I feel bad for the people that don't have the money and want to be included and then maybe get pressured into going to that restaurant with the people that maybe can afford it, and then they're sort of stuck paying their share of the bill. And it's just uncomfortable, and I really hate to see that. Yeah.

Trying to be impressive doesn't pay the bills in the long run.

No, no, it doesn't. But it's human nature. It's human nature. The other day, my husband and I were watching a movie. I believe it's called the Joneses. It has Demi Moore in it.

Yes.

And the guy from the X Files, David Duchovny. Yes. And it really says it all. I mean, it's such a statement movie that this couple comes in. I mean, maybe you can share the premise, but basically, it's a marketing firm, and they create a fake family and they move into a neighborhood. And they basically. They were the original influencers. I mean, they come in and they're, you know, playing golf, playing tennis, and going to the country club and showing these sort of almost wealthy people things that are aspirational, trying to get them to buy things. And it's really very sad. It's very sad. It ruins a lot of lives because it creates this feeling of trying to literally keep up with the Joneses. And they're overspending.

Yeah, it was definitely interesting in there where they're getting people to buy cars. They were getting bonuses on getting their neighbors and pseudo friends to buy new stuff. Buy new stuff. Buying more product and tracking. So, yeah, it's an interesting movie. I was thinking that exactly as you were talking about that a second ago. So it's funny that you brought that up there. Where do you see doing so much and getting the kids off on the right foot or helping them break away from their. I don't want to say helicopter parents in some cases, but you can say that. Well, let's say it then. Yeah, definitely. Because I think we all know folks are like that. What do you hope for with the book? What's your biggest, biggest striving goal with it? Is just get the word out more and helping people with the tips and tools that you developed over time or what. There's got to be a why there A little bit more. So can you dive into that?

My hope was for people to come out of the shadows and start talking about it because people did start coming out to me and telling me, like I said earlier, that, oh, my goodness, my child who is this age is still financially tied to me. I'm still paying, you know, part of their rent and their, you know, they now have children. It came out some politician who was being investigated. They were having trouble investigating him because they wanted the phone records, but he was on his parents phone plan and he was 36. It was crazy. So I want people to take the shame out of it and be honest that we as parents are so well intentioned. This is the extension of helicopter parenting is we're becoming concierge parents where because of technology. I did not have texting growing up. Okay? We did not have cell phones. We had car phones for the new thing when I was a child. And so now we're available and reachable at all times. As I said, my ninth grader is texting me about this purchase and error that he made. So we're available at all times to solve their problems, often with money, because money is an easy way to solve your child's problem in many cases. And so we're doing it because it makes sense in the short term, but the long term consequences are real. So my hope is that we create a dialogue so that we as parents can help each other to sort of take a step back and say, you know what, we're good parents. Our kids know what they're doing. We need to give them the space to be financial grownups, let them know we're there for them, keep the doors of communication open, be there to help, but in the right ways, not in a way that undermines their ability to be adults.

That's awesome. I love it. I love it. The book is launching financial Grownups, guys. You grab you a copy of it, give it to your friends, with Christmas just around the band here in a few months, grab a copy of it and put it in stock and suffer. But let's talk about your podcast. I want to do a little pivot here. Let's talk about your podcast. You've had that going for a while. What's your biggest win or biggest takeaway from having your podcast?

Robbie, My favorite episode, beyond the episode that you are on, of course, my second favorite episode is the One with Ashley, with my stepdaughter. Because people are so fascinated with her story of how did a 24 year old save up. And it was a six figure sum to buy an apartment at age 24. And she talks about it and she talks very honestly. She knows she's privileged that she didn't have student debt. So that's a big one. No student debt. She was also able to live at home rent free. Another big one. And Covid happened. And she had a boyfriend. So she wasn't out dating. She had the boyfriend. Covid happened. So she didn't have a lot of pressure to go out with her friends and spend money. Those are real things that might have taken longer were it not for Covid. Rates were very low. Still also helped because she had planned this so far in advance. She had worked very deliberately on her credit score. She understood how much that would matter to being qualified. Because New York City real estate is complicated. She's in a condop, which is a co op with condo rules. We did that very specifically with her because she may want to go to graduate school for a couple years. And when you're in a condop in New York City, you can rent the apartment out. So we wanted that flexibility for her. Some co ops, you cannot rent them out. New York City real estate, whole different world. Total, very complicated.

Yeah.

I love that episode. We are focusing more as we get to the second half of 2022 because the stock market has become such a source of concern for so many people. We are focusing a lot on investing and different ways to invest. That's part of the reason that I recruited you to come on the show. And so we're going to be focusing in the fall of 2022 and probably into 2023, much more on investing for financial grownups.

I love it. Yeah. Because financial grown ups are important for us to grow up at some point. I have a question for you. If you've got kids and you haven't saved free retirement, what's your opinion on do I need to put money for retirement or do I need to be paid for my kids education? Retirement first.

We can just stop there. Retirement.

Okay, that's fine. That's right.

We're done.

Exactly. Now, what's your thought about the college debt forgiveness act or the tuition forgiveness stuff that's going on out there?

I think it's complicated. I think it's really complicated. And I don't want to get political.

Sure.

I think that I wish everyone well. That's what I want to say as A parent. I think tuition is too high.

Yes.

So I will say that I think it's just very complicated. And I think that I really feel for people that are mired in debt. I think many times they are sold a bill of goods that is not fair to them, and so I feel for them. But at the same time, there are people that have paid off their debt. So I just think it's complicated. And I just send everyone love and wish everyone well.

Well, there's a whole lot of gray area there. There's rights and wrongs on different sides of the ball out there. Definitely.

I'd like to focus on the bloated administrations of our universities and I'd like to focus on the waste going on there and more accountability for our universities having paid two full college tuitions with no financial aid. I think that the tuition number is too high and it is un American to expect anyone to pay those numbers. I don't think it's right. And I would rather the discussion veer towards accountability for these educational institutions at all levels. It is not right to be charging students or parents this amount of money. It's not right. So I hope the discussion goes away from debt and avoiding the debt. It's insanity. I don't know how anyone should be expected to pay this tuition. It's not right.

Yeah, I put myself through school in a business degree and, you know, I did have some scholarships early on and some grants, stuff like that, but the last couple of years paid my way through and then even went to graduate school, stuff like that, too. There's both sides. I can see the good for some folks. And I can see, come on, I just paid it off. Why am I not getting a handout? Can I get a refund?

Right? I mean, look, you know, someone said to us, why didn't you throw debt onto your kids? Because you would have got it paid off. I really want the discussion to go towards these institutions so no one has this debt in the first place.

Amen to that.

Don't think it's right to put this tremendous burden on young Americans and on their parents.

No true words are spoken out there, Bobby. Definitely. So, guys and gals, like I said, the book is launching financial grownups. Get you a copy today. Check it out. Give it to your kids, Give it to your grandkids. It is a great book out there. And check out the Bobby's podcast as well. It is money tips for financial grownups right now. Then also, don't forget to check out her first book, how to be a Financial grownup. So check it out guys. Listen to podcast anywhere you listen to podcasts. We'll have the link to her show in the descriptions as well there for you. But Bobby, thank you so much for coming on the Nutclose show. It's been just an absolute joy to have you today.

Thank you so much for having me and thank you for being on my Money Tips for Financial Ground Ups podcast as well. Everyone should please check out that episode. You are wonderful and you gave so many incredible investing tips. So that was definitely a new favorite episode for me.

Well, I appreciate best way for folks to reach out to you the podcast, the book or website. What's the best way for people to.

Reach out to my website is just my name bobby rebel.com and also if you are looking for gifts in addition to the book, a nice stocking suffer is to go to grownupgear.com where I have lots of fun merch. Show off your grown up side.

I love it. Yes.

I got adorable baby gifts there.

I cracked up with the baby. It's hard to believe that you're the grown up of this relationship.

I can't believe I'm the grown up. Yes. Yeah, we have a bib that says I can't believe you're the grown up. I think it's in a onesie also.

Yeah, I think it says cute.

It's cute stuff.

It is great stuff.

So it's a fun stocking stuffer for the holidays for sure.

We'll put the link to that all in the description for everybody out there but Bobbi. Once again, thanks again. Have a great day. All right.

Thanks for having me.

You're welcome. All right, guys, you heard it here. Make sure you take advantage of the tools and the tips that Bobbi discussed and what she covers in her book there. If you've got kids or grandkids or, you know, somebody that's struggling and wanting to help their kids take that next step or grow up and they don't. We all want to be. Check out the book. We'll see you all the time everybody. Bye Sa.