Your Kids, Their Money: Teaching Financial Literacy To Your Children With Clifton Corbin

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This is the no Closer show where you get the latest developments in distressed note investing and learn the secrets of how you can control millions of dollars worth of property. For panties on the dollar. Get educated and entertained by someone who has closed thousands of deals and lives to support you in achieving the same. Now here's your host CEO of We Close Nodes, Scott Carson.

Hey, everybody, My name is Clifton Corbin, the author of youf Kids Their Money. I'm happy to have been on the no Closer show with Scott. I got a chance to talk about how you can help raise financially literate children. I'm super excited for this episode. I hope you enjoyed it as much as I did. Take good care and we'll talk soon.

Good morning, good afternoon and good evening, everybody. Welcome to this episode of the no Closer Show. As always, Scott Carson, jacked up and excited to be here with you today. Thank you as always for listening and how you ever, whether you're listening or watching this or read this. Honored to have you as part of the Note family out there across the world. But we've got a very special guest and this guy, man, I'll tell you what, he is motivated and dedicated for his. Why somebody who has just a huge passion for helping people and our kids out there really take their finance, their numbers to a whole different level. He is a business consultant with over two decades of experience and then he left his office to become a full time stay at home dad. That's so awesome. He's also offered his first book, you Kids Their Money, which focuses on providing parents with the skills and tools to teach financial literacy to the children. We all know that we live in such a financially uneducated society. So we're so excited to have the man, the Myth, the legend, Mr. Clifton Corbin, MBA, join us here on the no Closure show. What is going on? Clifton, how are you doing today?

I'm doing well, Scott. Thanks for that introduction. I'm energized by your energy, so thank you for that.

Well, you know, we met at fincon. It's hard to believe about a month ago, it was energy. I mean, such a good energy, you know, conference. I know I got a lot of. I know you got a lot of it. We just, we crossed paths a couple times. I was like, okay, tell me what you do. You know, we got to talk. It was like, oh, this I gotta have you on the show. Because we got even a little bit of, you know, our audience and our listeners out there are all entrepreneurs of some sort, either working in their jobs and then doing A side hustle real estate or note investing or we have a lot of, you know, their half is also investors that are investing in real estate and other things full time out there. But you know, I think about, I think last time I checked, at least 50% of our audience has kids.

You know what I mean?

And so when we talked about your book there and I was like, oh, we gotta have you on to talk about it. So let's talk a little bit about your background before we dive into kind of the nuts and bolts of your kids, their money, huh?

Sure, sure. So you kind of outlined, outlined it a little bit there. So I was work a day kind of guy. I had my job. I was a financial consultant. I was managing a couple million dollars of budgets. But before all of that, before I got to, you know, my adult working life, I was a student, I went to school, I went to university. And the weird thing about it for me is I was, when I was younger, going back even a step further, when I was younger, I was so curious about money. Like I couldn't learn enough about money. I was that kid who had, you know, the lemonade stand, who had the side hustle washing cars. My dad was a mechanic, so I was the one who, I bought the oil wholesale for him and I sold it retail to his customers. So I was all about earning money when I was younger. And then I went off to, I went off to university and like too many stories you've heard, I know this is not a new story for you or most of your, your listeners or your watchers. Like, I went off to university. I got those early credit cards and just made a mess, just made a mess of my finances. My credit score, shot my debt through the roof. And for someone who was so curious about money, it just didn't seem right.

But you probably got some cool T shirts though, right?

Was that there wasn't the T shirts for me. It was music. I used to, back in the day, I used to be a dj, so I was buying like the latest. I still like, I'm going to date myself a bit. But I remember when Tribe Called Quest had their last album out, I went out, had to get it right away. So I was buying stuff that as we know now, anyone who's got a bit of sense in their head knows, you know, buying consumables on debt just, there's no value there. It's just a waste. But I didn't have that knowledge going into my young adulthood after I was able to kind of dig myself out of that debt. And trust me, it took a while. That was most of my, my early, my mid-20s into my 30s and. But once I kind of got out of it, I looked back and I was like, man, I had so much interest in this subject. I was so hungry to know about how money works and how to make money and all of these things. Yet I still got into school and I still made a mess of my money. And I was lucky. I had parents who were willing to talk to me about money. Like a lot of, a lot of young folks don't necessarily have that. I remember there was times I'd say, mom, dad, how much money do you make? And they wouldn't even just tell me. They'd go grab a pay stub, they would show me. So I had the, that is an advantage. And yet I still kind of made a mess. So I went back and I was like, how do I fix this? How do I stop this next generation from falling into the same money habits, the same money traps that I did? That's my why. That's my why. That's why I wrote the book. That's why I'm here talking to you. That's why I'm working on all the projects I'm working on. It's in an effort to help that next generation avoid some of those mistakes and really, you know, launch into adulthood with their feet underneath them, unlike what I did to myself. So it's, that's like you said, I. That is my why. That's what I do. What I do.

You know, it's such a great thing because I'm friends with Sharon Lecter, who's the co author of Rich Dad, Poor dad. And she's got this big initiative and starting to get finance education taught in high school. I mean, I can remember going in my junior year, senior, and then we had a 30 minute segment in one class about balancing a checkbook. Right. That was about it. Now they don't even do that anymore. There was no talk about credit cards, no talk about investing, nothing out there. And then when you get to college, oh, that first class you take, you know, that easy a that we all have, you know, that the university charges us to attend, you know, to learn how to study or learn how to time block. There's nothing in there about, you know, the minefields or pitfalls that you're going to see as a constant. And when I was on campus, they always had to get, sign up for a credit card, get a T shirt, you know what I mean?

Yeah.

Get a mug or Something like that. Or, you know, I think about buying. How many Columbia House records did you buy on your credit cards?

Exactly. Like, you've got so many. Like, when you get off on your own, like, all of these, like, and it, like, don't even put into the, into the pile, like, how many times you're being offered to buy something. Like, we're not even including all the ads, all the consumer, all the pain, like, buy now, pay later opportunities. I'm just talking. You get off on your own. And especially in that college setting on that campus, those credit cards are coming at you right away. And I said to someone recently, like, I got into university, I got my student loans, I got my credit cards, I got all of these things. I also had, you know, my, my rent check, my, my cell phone, my Internet bill had all of these utilities and all of these bills. I got into university. I had never owed anyone anything. Now, that's not a bad thing when you think about it, right? Like, I didn't have any debt, but I also hadn't paid anything. I'd never paid a bill. I never actually experienced what it was like to pay something on a regular basis. And that's the kind of money habits I'm trying to encourage parents to give their kids at an early age. I'm not trying to tell parents, put your kids in debt, but I am saying, hey, there's chances for you as an adult, as a, you know, as someone in your child's life to give them. Them an opportunity to start practicing these things that we will do as an adult. And if we can learn them when we're young, if we could figure these things out when we're young, then again, we're just setting our young people up for more success. So that's, that's the thing.

Well, I think one of the things that also falls in line, you have a lot of people that just don't know their options. I mean, as an ex banker, I can't tell you how many times people came to the bank and I would say something, they would just look at me like I was, you know, deer in headlights, and I'm like, okay, let me explain this. Let's take this back to doing this or doing. Setting this up or setting that up. Now, let me ask you that before you dive into more nuts and bolts. You have adults that really are elementary kids when it comes to finance, and that's why they're not teaching their kids, because they don't know any better. And that comes from a lot of things. A Lot of hurdles. And I think, I hate to say it, but I think the banks, banks who are behind a lot of stuff because we buy the paper, we buy debt, and what we do here, the banks have a lot of minefields that are out there that look like they're tasty little items that we gobble up that turn out to be very, very bad for us in the long run. What are some of the biggest fallacies or the biggest hurdles that you see people making that just. You just bang your head again? Clifton.

Oh, man. If we're talking about adults, it's back to what I was talking about. It's not using debt in a wise way. That's kind of the one that I find will get. It sets you back the farthest. And then if you want to, like, combine that with the other side of it, which is not focus on wealth and wealth creation early enough. Right. Because you need to take advantage of time to actually start getting some of those compounding effects. You need to focus on time so you can minimize any risk that you're going to have. So you combine those two together, you're setting yourself back and you're not building that wealth to go forward. So those are the two big ones. But if we're just talking about on the parenting side, you're right. Like, a lot of parents avoid these conversations because maybe they themselves don't feel like they're equipped to have it. But what I often say is, well, there's two things. One, One, you know more than your child knows. No matter where you are on that journey. No matter where you are.

Let's hope so.

You know, you do. You definitely do. Even if it's just I've gone out and I've got a bank account and I'm putting my money in the bank and I'm not doing any of the other things that I might need to be doing. You're doing more, you know more than your child. Now, that gives you an opportunity. You can grow and learn with your child. Which is one of the things I encourage in my book is, you know, if you're not where you want to be, you could bring your child along on that journey with you so they can see what you've done and how you're growing, how you're building your wealth, how you're paying off your debt and a child appropriate way. Like, you're not trying to put any undue stress or anxiety on your child, but you can grow with them. And as they see you building up your wealth, they can see what it takes, they can see some of maybe the pitfalls that you have. So that's one is just if you're not ready, if you are, if you feel like you're not there, you know more than they do. The other thing is you just need to include your child in these conversations. Like if you're not talking about it, if you're not talking about money, it's like all the other things, right? Like if you're not talking about it, then they're not learning about it. Or if they're learning about it, they're learning about bits and pieces and misinformation and disinformation. They're not getting the whole picture. So I often say, you know, you the parents in our kids lives, they're the children's best teacher. But it's not just parents, it's all the adults in our lives, right? Like if you've got a niece or a nephew and you feel like, hey, this child isn't getting the information, like I've seen it so many times, like let's say yourself, let's say you've got a niece or nephew out there, you're investing in debt, you're taking on notes. That is something you can teach, not just your children. You can teach that to any child and just say, hey, this is how I make my money. This is what I'm doing. This is another option for you. I've seen it now a lot with the early Financial five the Fire movement. So a lot of people don't even realize that's an option. And you can talk to children about that. I met Dan Sheets at fincon. I've known him previous to fincon, but I actually got to meet him in person and his book is spectacular. Like it is just a phenomenal book to introduct introduce that concept of early financial independence to teens. Like, teens can pick up this concept, they can understand this. But if we're not introducing it, we're doing these kids a disservice. Right? Like we need, like, you're right. The banks might not be giving them all the information they need, but let's be honest, the banks aren't supposed to be our children's educators. They're not. Like, that's not, that's not their role. Their role is, you know, it's a profit motive. I get that. And I, you know, I can't fault a bank for that. I, when I was little, I remember the two businesses I wanted to start the most was a bank and an insurance company. I was like, if I can make those things happen. For me, I'll be so I get it. Like I, like I told you from an early age, like I was in my early teens, I was like those two businesses, I can make that happen. I'm good. So those companies aren't meant to educate us. They, that's a side part of what they do. And some more banks are taking it on. And I appreciate that there's banks that have started making financial literacy part of what they do. But let's be honest, it's not ever going to be the core of what they do. It's going to be something maybe they add on to as a service to their customers, but it's not their core. Hopefully we're getting that at schools and like you said, we're not yet schools are taking it on. Some schools are bringing it in. But it has to be the adults in our children's lives that bring it to them because we have their best interest in mind. I believe we do. So we have to bring it to them and we have to start giving them all the pieces. Like when I grew up, I learned about earning. I told you, like I could, I could make a dollar. That was never, that was never a problem for me. And I knew putting that in the bank again, I'm going to date myself. Interest rates were high. That money was making money. In my mind, that was investing. It kind of is, it kind of isn't. But for me at that age, it kind of was. But I didn't have the rest of the pieces of the puzzle. And that's what I want to encourage other adults to do. Give those other pieces, learn it yourself, grow with your kids, do what you have to. The one thing I say, especially for parents who are a little reluctant to talk about this, like, there's so many benefits. I can go on for hours on the benefits of talking about money with your kids. But one of the things I try to like tug on those heartstrings a bit and say, listen, what, what's the legacy you want to leave behind, right? Like what do you want your child to inherit from you? And it's not a lack of understanding, it's an eagerness to understand and to know and to grow. And it's not just about having more money in the bank because that's, that could be a self serving and selfish kind of way. But when we start talking more about wealth and we start talking about being appreciative for what we have, that's when you could start building and start saying, listen it's not just that I want to have more money, it's that I want to have more freedom. I want to have more flexibility. I want to be able to do what I want to do. And wealth is how you do what you want to do. If you have money in the bank, then you could start saying, hey, you know what, this job, I don't like trash it. I'm going to go do this other thing that actually brings me joy. And that's what we want to do for our kids. We want to give them those opportunities. But if we're not talking about it, then we're kneecapping them and bad term. But we're not giving them all the work. We're not giving them everything we want to give them. So that's why we need to talk about it. It needs to be part of our conversations with our kids.

Totally love that. Now let's talk about that a little bit because not everybody quits their job to be a stay at home dad. So let's talk a little about that because I know that's one thing was a da ding when we were talking and doing some research, stuff like that. Let's talk about the steps that you took to get to that point. Because I think a lot of folks would love to stay at home with their kids and teach them and not be forced to because of COVID you know what I mean? But let's talk about that process because you're as a business consultant, that's kind of a bit of a dramatic 180 degree turn on that stuff, right?

Yeah. No, it wasn't an easy. It wasn't an easy move for me, to be very honest. It was a few things. One, my wife and I kind of always wanted to have a parent at home. Like we were both working, we're both fairly successful in our careers, but we knew when we had kids that was something we wanted. So we started talking about that from pretty much the time, might even be before we started having kids. But we'd always talked about having a parent at home and me being a bit more entrepreneurial than my wife kind of always knew it would be me. But I had a couple advantages. One, I'm a planner. I'm also a project planner and planning is what I do and financial planning is kind of what I do. So we talked about it beforehand to kind of figure out, okay, what do we need to have in place? Where do we need to be financially, can we make this work? I was also able to kind of do it stepwise. And that I took a leave of absence before I had to actually say goodbye to my job. That's just the benefit that I had. I know a lot of. Not a lot of people have that, but I know I'm very privileged and very lucky to have had that. So I could kind of do a trial run before I said no. This is the thing for sure. But even with all that said, there's sacrifices. Like, I do not. We're not living a lavish lifestyle over here. But that's also part of, you know, growing that wealth, right? Like, if you're spending every dollar you make, no matter how much money you're making, Whether you're at 1000-002000-00500,000, it doesn't matter how much money you're making, if you're spending all the money you make, you're not going to build that wealth. You're not going to build those opportunities. You're not setting yourself for, you know, that financial independence that I think almost everyone wants. And when I say financial independence, it really. However you define it, right? Like, that could mean retirement. That can be retirement early. That could mean working, you know, less. That can mean working the same amount, just feeling comfortable. Like, financial independence is a term that you get to define in your terms, in your way. But when we decided that it was what we wanted as a family, we started putting those steps in place. We made sure we were spending less than we were making, made sure that emergency fund was built up. We started looking for sources of income that were not trading time for money. So that was. That's another key. Is like a lot of folks, your audience probably less so, but a lot of folks don't always recognize that you don't necessarily need to trade your time for money. Like, there's other ways to earn money. Investing real estate, debt, like, there's so many different things, but you got to educate yourself on it before you can jump into it. So one of the things is we got. We made it so that we'd have some rental income coming in. So we've got some income that it doesn't replace what I was making, but it subsidizes us. It definitely subsidizes us. We cut back on a lot of what we're doing. So that brought the expenses down. But it's tricky. It gets a challenge. Like, we have two kids who are, you know, they're getting into more extracurricular things. They want to do more things. They only. They could wear their clothes for about a week before they grow out of it. So there's challenges, there's challenges. It's, it's a lot easier to say, you know, I'm going to Try to hit 5 early when you don't have all of these other needs now, mind you, you could still do it with kids. It's just you're going to have to find where do you want to make the sacrifices. And it's an early sacrifice for long term benefits. So I think it's worth it. But it requires some planning, it requires some diligence. And I say this with the caveat that I am not perfect. I am not exactly where I want to be. I still make my financial missteps. And I think it's important that I acknowledge that and that I express and share that. Because the last thing I want anyone to feel is like, this is an easy thing and this person's doing it and they've got it all figured out. And why don't I have it all figured? Like, it's not that, that's not my messaging at all, especially when I'm talking about parents and kids, all about the journey. Getting there is what you're trying to do, but you're always working on it, you're always refining, you're iterating. So there's times where I'm like, wow, we're going to need to dip into that emergency fund and we're going to have to dip into it heavily just because we didn't see something coming or, you know, it happens, it happens. But then I go back, I refund it, we get back on solid ground, we keep investing, we keep trying to build to that future, but it's a journey. It's, it requires you to keep going back and it happens. There's going to be times we fall off track. That's just life. But I think it's important, especially from folks like yourself and myself, to make that clear that we're still working it out ourselves. Like we might have a path. It's great. The ideal is you build some systems, you put them in place so that you have less opportunities to fall off path. Like the old adage of pay yourself first, it still works. You make it automatic that money's coming out, you don't have to worry about it, you don't have to think about it, then you're not spending it. So putting systems in place helps. But again, we're not. No one here is perfect and no one, no one expects anyone to be perfect. It's really about acknowledging that you need to focus in on your money. Like, that's how I got myself into problems back in my 20s. I ignored what I was doing. Like, it almost seems ridiculous in hindsight. Like, how could you have fallen so far into debt without saying enough is enough? But it's because I chose not to. I chose to close my eyes, put the blinders on, and not make my finances a priority in my life, which is a mistake that I learned from and I don't do now. That's in my mind. That's how you go.

You.

You learn, you grow, you build. But you need to be focusing on wealth creation because that builds that flexibility in your life, and you need to manage your money in a. In a responsible way for you and whatever that means. So knowing what your priorities are, right? Like, if you know your goal is this, then that's what you're working towards. And if you're spending your money, that takes you away from that. Well, is it really your priority? So that's. So it's a long answer to your short question, but that's kind of how we made it work. We had to. We had to prioritize, we had to plan, we had to. We had to set targets, we had to set goals. Even with all that said, there are times where I'm like, we're not. We're not doing what we're supposed to be doing. We need to reject. I think I just talked to my wife last night. I was like, you know what? We haven't looked at our budget in a little while. There's always lifestyle that pops in. I'm like, how many. How many streaming services do we have right now? Do we need all those streaming services? Probably not. So there's like, life happens, lifestyle creep happens, where you just start, you know, you get a little bit more access to money, and you spend that money without thinking about it. But ideally, you're going back, you're reassessing, you're reevaluating, and you're making the changes to get yourself to where you want to be.

No, it totally makes sense. But, you know, first, talking about it, secondly, cutting back on expenses. Third, coming up with a budget, and then four, that. Pay yourself first is such an important aspect of things, no matter what amount you can put away. But doing it first before the. That way you've paid yourself first. You being the investment first and foremost, versus waiting to the end of the month to see what's left over. We know we'll all eat. There's always more month left over after over the budget. In a lot of cases, for Most folks, but that's why it's pay yourself first and we'll always, always seem to figure out a way to take care of other things or spread things out. I think a lot of people struggle with now. So let's talk about the conversations you have with kids. Or what would you recommend besides just having that, talking with kids about what are some steps you can help with your kids to start taking these lessons you're teaching them and helping them apply it in real life?

Sure. So the one thing I say is the last thing you want to do is make this an extra thing. Like, parents are busy. They've got so many competing priorities. There's no extra time. Just like there's no extra money at the end of the month. There's no extra time in a parent's day. But what I am trying to say is make those conversations that we're talking about just part of your day, just part of your everyday life. Like if you're, you know, you're grocery shopping or you're buying something online or what have you bring your child into it. The one thing I'm really trying to encourage parents to do, and I think I've kind of mentioned it, is giving your child opportunities to practice using money and building good money habits while they're at home with you. So giving them those opportunities to pay themselves first to do some transactions, to build some savings and invest, if possible, borrow money and pay bills back if at all possible, but doing those things while they're home with you. So, for example, I'm very bullish on allowances, if you can afford it, if it works in your family. And allowance is a great tool to give your child the opportunity to do some of these practices. Right. Like, they need access to money to practice a transaction. They need access to money to practice saving. They need access to money to be able to, let's say, borrow money from you and then pay you back. So they need access to it. But an allowance alone isn't the only way you can do it. There's other ways of doing it. In fact, I encourage people with older children. Allowance is great, but a budget is better. Right? So if your older child is already, let's say you have someone in high school or about like middle school, what have you, and you've already allotted X amount of money for lunch for them. Well, let them manage it. Say, hey, this is how much money we're going to spend for you on lunch this week, this month, what have you. You take it, you figure this out. See how this goes. Now they're managing a budget. Now that's an experience that a lot of kids don't have until they're off on their own. Now, if they want to go and spend all of that on peanut butter and jelly sandwiches and use the rest to buy some designer jeans, have at it, right? Like, there's so much that you can learn from that experience. Like, but you have to give them that experience and give them that autonomy and that, that agency to actually experience what it's like to manage some money. Now, you might have to bail them out or maybe not, depending on how you want to run things, but giving them an access to a budget to say, hey, here's your clothing budget. This is what we're going to spend for you going back to school. You know what you need? You need these items. Again, it has to be in concert with conversations and discussions because you're still there to coach and help them. But by doing that, you're giving them again, opportunities to practice. You're giving them chances to use their money, to use the money that they will have at one point. Like, at some point they're going to be off on their own. They're going to have to figure this out anyways. So do it when they're home, when, let's say a misstep won't mean that they're going to be, you know, homeless or credit score has gone to, gone to the, the dogs. Like, do it while they're younger. So they have you there as their financial coach and advisor and they could figure this out. So that's what I'm encouraging parents to do. That's the, as far as nuts and bolts, that's one of the biggest pieces. And I get into, like, a lot of the different ways that you can do this in my book, but specifically, like, if you can give your child an opportunity to practice using money, whether it's an allowance, a budget, or their first jobs, what have you, those are the chances you get to give your chance. So those are the chances you give to give your child practical experience and habit forms that will help them when they get older. So that's, that's one of the things. Practice, practice, practice, practice.

Now, didn't you also, I think from our previous conversation, did you create a game of some sort with your kids? You're working on it. Yeah, that's what it was.

Working on it. I am working on it. So when the kids were younger, like, there's, there's some games out there right now. Like, there's monopolies and the game of life and all those. I'm still good with those. Like, I think they're still great. And I think playing games, playing games, telling stories are great ways. Role playing, you know, like building a little kitchen, a little restaurant or grocery store in your, in your bedroom. Like these are great ways to teach money. The reason I'm working on my own game is if you, I'm sure almost everyone who's listening or watching yourself, you've played Monopoly. Especially someone who's into, you know, buying and dealing with debt, buying notes.

We're doing real world Monopoly over.

Yeah, exactly, exactly the difference between what you're doing and the game Monopoly. To win Monopoly, it's a zero sum game. For me to win, you need to lose. And that's not how I, that's not how I approach life. Right. For me to win, you need to win. That's how I feel. Right. So I'm trying to make a game that while it might not necessarily be a cooperative game, it doesn't have to have you lose. For me to win, it's still involving money. Building good money habits. I'm in the play testing phase right now, so I'm still working out some of the kinks. But you'll be one of the first to know when it's all done. But yeah, no building. I'm trying to build a game that will give again those money habits with some real world experience where you're trying to, you know, grow your wealth and be creating, forming those habits and being aware of what happens. Because that's the other thing is as a child you're not always aware of all the different perspectives. Like we mentioned before, if you're, if you know, if your parents are the show you how they've earned income, it doesn't really give you the perspective of how everyone or how many different ways there are to earn an income. So I'm trying to give you some, give you, give your children some ways of seeing that, but in a fun game like way. So I'm working on that right now. It's a, it's a project I'm super excited about but still in the, still in the development phase.

Let's talk about the book. Your kids, their money now obviously got some lessons, real world lessons. Talking about your past and all the mistakes that we've made growing into the dulce that we are today. Right. And not being so hard on yourself for making mistakes because everybody makes mistakes. I think that's one of the most difficult things. I think so many folks they make a money mistake and they hold it over them, their cells for so long versus okay, let's just. How do we fix it? How do we move on? A lot of people listen to Clark Howard, which is great, but then Dave Ramsey, which Dave's got some good ideas and some philosophies that don't necessarily always agree on everything. But talk about the book, kind of what led into it and what did you hope to accomplish with the book? Your kids, their money.

Sure. So I like how you mentioned the shame and anxiety that some folks can feel. And I think I tried to address that. I think it's in the intro of my book. My goal with the book, I have multiple goals. But one of the goals, and I set it out pretty early, is I want people to let go of any shame, let go of any anxiety, let. Just let that go. Like that holding on to that gets you nowhere. Right. Like, it doesn't help move you ahead. It helps to hold you in place. It helps to keep you down. So I know when I was going through my money troubles, like, those were some of the darkest days of my life. Like, I just felt like there was no sunshine. Like, it felt terrible. But luckily for me, I'm kind of a forever optimist and I knew that that was a point in my life and I was working hard to get out of it. Like, I worked and paid and worked and paid and worked and paid, knowing that at some point the paying off the debt would end and I would be able to grow. But it's critical, I think it's so, so critical that we let go of those things and we use knowledge and wisdom. Your show my book Other, like, there's so much like we like mentioned, we met at fincon. There's so many amazing creators out there now focused on helping people get their finances in order, whether it's a financial coach, financial advisor, podcasters, Instagram. Like, there's so many people out there, so I don't really care if you get it from me, from you, from my book. Just go out and find the person that resonates with you and use them and use their, what they're teaching and what they're. What they're telling you to let go of any of that shame and anxiety and then start to grow. Now, my book, to answer your question, more specifically, my book, it's written as a, as a resource book, but it's also, if you read it from end to end and you don't have to, it's kind of written so you could Jump in on any section if your child's asking you about debt, if your child's asking you about insurance, if your child's asking about taxes. You could jump into any one of those points. But I also tried to one, include a lot of my stories and I tried to kind of almost mirror the story arc of what I already talked about. So I started off being very, very money hungry, going into debt. And I kind of, I'm at a point now where I'm very, very grateful for where I am and what I have and who's in my life. And I talk very deeply about how that's one of the habits, one of the financial habits that I want you to instill in your children's acknowledging and being appreciative of what they have. Because there's always opportunities to want and get more. But it's only in having that practice of appreciation and being very grateful for what you already have that you can kind of put a hedge on some of that consum that consumer demand that the need to buy and have more. But the book, like I said, it's. It's written as a resource guide. It's written as a means of giving a parent the skills, the tools, the language, and hopefully it will also give them the empathy so that they can let go of some of those things that they're holding on to. Like I said, I could talk for hours just about all the benefits that you will get from focusing on this with your child. You get benefits of building a stronger relationship with your child. You will gain the benefit of being more comfortable with your finances. So the book is really meant to be a resource for parents, but also for any adult who just wants to have a better understanding of money or they want to be able to talk about money with children and they want to know different ways of going about it. So I have the do's and don'ts of allowances in there. I even tell you, like, how you might want to start an allowance practice. I talk about, like I said, some of the other pieces that a lot of folks don't talk about when they're talking about financial literacy, especially with children. I talk about taxes, I talk about insurance, I talk about acquiring, protecting, wealth. I talk about it all because as I mentioned, I had a piece of the puzzle growing up and had I had a little bit more of that puzzle, I might have been able to better hedge against some of the mistakes I made. So the book is really an attempt to give you a chance to get that full puzzle, get that full Piece of what it is that you should be thinking about with regards to your money, whether it be budgeting, whether it be or saving or investing or when is a good time to borrow versus when might not be a good time to use some of that debt and giving you again, some of the nuances there. And I try to make it very practical. So at the end of most of every chapter, like I talk like, here are some extra things you could do. Here are some things you can actually do with your child that could be fun, that could really cement home some of this learning. So it's meant to be, like I said, a resource guide. It's written with a nice, I think personally, a nice little story arc in there. There's a nice little narrative. Again, I'm a bit biased, but I love it. But I really, like I said, you nailed it at the beginning. Like my why is very much to help folks, you know, let go of some of that shame, let go of some of that anxiety and just use knowledge to guide you. Not the shame, not the anxiety.

Now, what are the some of your best suggestions or tips for parents and helping their kids start investing? They're kind of building that seeds. Are there things that they can do, you know, besides just mile allowance or other things that they can do to kind of skip that. That ball rolling, start planting those seeds to change the mindset? Because I think so many kids come from a point. It's. We're guilty of it with all the mass media, buy the newest game, the newest gaming system, you know, newest cell phone, you know, or new, new, new, new, new. New. You know what I mean? What are some things we can kind of change that parents can help with them, change that perspective and get them on the right path to invest in for the future.

So there's two things. One, you need to talk to your kids about wealth, what it is, what it means. Like it's, it's a concept that I'm not sure if you've read the the Psychology of Money, but that book is a spectacular, another spectacular book. But I think he puts it best when he talks about how wealth is hidden. It's not something you see, it's not something on the outside. But especially if you're not having these conversations with the children in your life, you may perceive, you know, fancy clothing, jewelry, new car, new, new, new as well. But that's not wealth. That's money spent. Money spent is not wealth. Money not spent is the creation of wealth. And I think it's critical that parents talk about that and show that. So what could happen too, because wealth is hidden. You might be doing a spectacular job building up your nest egg, but your child won't see that. Your child can't see that unless you bring them into the inner circle of your, of your finances. They won't know that. And then they may start to perceive that that wealth is on the outside. I was talking to a financial planner just a couple of days ago and she was saying how she had a client who, you know, left a huge nest egg to their child. And again, they blew through it so quickly because they just didn't understand, like this is something that you could live off of if you understand wealth, how it works, how the interest can compound, etc. Etc. So talking about wealth is so, so important. So you need to be doing that the second piece. And it goes back to the paying yourself first comments that we had earlier. That's a challenge for a child. Let's be honest. Telling a kid to save up money, saving up for something makes sense. Saving up for saving sake makes less sense. So I think it's critical that we give kids a reason to save beyond just for saving sake. Again, it's going to build that habit. I spoke with another financial planner. Her words and her concept was spectacular. I loved it. She said she builds, she encourages them to build an opportunity fund. So an opportunity fund is when you know you've saved up your money for your big ticket item, but you don't spend all of it. You keep saving a little bit more so that there's money there, there's an opportunity fund. So let's say your friends come and say, hey, I want to go to the amusement park. Do you want to come with us? Well, if you spent all your money on that big ticket item, there's no money to go to the amusement park, there's no money to go to the movies, there's no money to do all these fun opportunities that are going to come your way. So I talk to kids about the opportunity fund. So instead of saving all your money and then blowing all your money on that big ticket item, which is easy for kids to do, it's easy for me to do, the critical piece is to make sure that you're keeping some of it behind in case of an emergency, for us it might be in case of an emergency, but for a child it's in case of an opportunity. And if they're able to keep some behind, I feel like that will hopefully at some point you can kind of make the switch from an opportunity to Maybe an emergency fund to maybe a retirement fund. But if you're talking about wealth and you're talking about saving, and you can combine the two, now we're talking about investing, right? Because now we know that earning a loan may not be enough for some families, some people, to reach those financial independence goals. So it's only with the combination of investing. But it's critical that you're having these conversations with your kids. And if you can, if your kids have the wherewithal to have enough money, like see if you can buy an investment with them. And that could be anything, right? Like you can open up a brokerage account on your phone, buy the investment for them, and then that's theirs when they turn. When they turn 19, 21, however old you want to do it. Or you can open up a 529 and show them what you're doing there. One of the things we did for my nieces and nephews, it was a while back, but I got kind of tired of giving them all of the Christmas gifts and birthday gifts that they forgot about after a week that broke that were plastic and ended up in landfills. So my wife and I, we stopped giving them birthday and Christmas gifts, which was a bit of a push, I have to admit. She wasn't keen on that from the get go. But eventually I was able to convince my wife, let's stop buying these gifts. And anytime we would have bought them a gift, we're putting money into their 529. And then instead of giving them a gift for their birthday or for Christmas, we'll give them a statement. We'll give them the investment statement so they could see what's coming their way. And it's been. We've had two. I had a niece and a nephew who've gone off to college. Now we're able to pay for a whole semester of college for my one nephew, plus a little bit, plus some of his books. I think he was able to buy a computer with some of that money. And that felt so much better than those moments of fleeting joy that happen on Christmas Day. But that was another opportunity to show them, hey, look, this is a way again, over the course of time, we contributed regularly. It wasn't large sums of money, but it built itself into a larger sum of money that can now be used for this big goal of yours, which is going off to college. So there's different ways to do it on the individual level. Like I say, talking about it, showing them that they need to keep some of their money back, showing them what you're doing. Showing them that you've got, you know, an investment account. Showing them that you've got, you know, an emergency account. But it's critical that we bring them, like I said, bring them into that inner circle. A lot of parents, I think, are afraid to bring their kids into that because they're worried that, you know, their business is going to be out on the street. But it's by bringing them into those conversations and showing them that you trust them to share this information with them that you're building trust with them, that you're showing them that, you know what? I'm willing to show you this. And you can give them the caveats and say, listen, this is a conversation within our four walls here. This isn't something I want you talking about on the playground, but I want to show you this because this is something you need to know. You need to know what's happening in my bank account, because that affects you. That affects me. And this is something you'll need to do one day, too. So when it comes to investing, do it with them. Show them what you're doing. And if you can't, have them do it, too.

Yeah. One of the best things I think you can do is, you know, start an educational savings account, either whether It's a Coverdell 529 or in an IRA. Educational IRA that you can put up to two grand a year and they can be used for any of your kids. You know what I mean? That's $88 a month on average. I totally agree. Instead of the toys and stuff like that, hey, I've got a nephew who loves to get cash because he wants to go buy stuff. So his mom says, okay, great, you got all this cash. Here's half it to go do. The other half we're putting into an account for it.

Yeah, yeah.

You know what I mean? And he's gotten to the point where he understands that because he sees the stuff, but it's a great way for everybody to do it. And, you know, if the kid doesn't end up doing stuff, you can use it for so computers and other things that are associated with that as well. And that's a great way. But it's a little bit each each week, a little bit each day. I mean, figure, 20 a week, that's $80 a month. That's almost maximum.

It adds up. That's free.

I love it. Now you are also. I wanted. Well, I'll get to that in a second here. But what has been the biggest, you know you had the trial period where you took a leave from your job is a trial run for it. What's the biggest thing you miss from being a stay at home dad? I know it's a little different. You know, I'm going to ask the opposite side in a second here.

What do I miss? I don't know what I missed. That's a great question. Sorry, give me the question again. I missed.

What do you miss from being a stay at home dad? Did you have a little bit more time to yourself at the job or things like that? You missed the camaraderie or like. Hell no, I don't miss anything. I love where I'm at. I'm just asking.

Exactly. Exactly. You got it.

Okay, all right, cool. But how old are your kids again?

My oldest is 10. My youngest is 8.

When you were that age, you said you already had. You had an interest in insurance and other things and investing and stuff like that. Who was your idol or who was your financial hero as a young kid was like Michael J. Fox is back in the day when he played. Was it Alex Keaton or was it. If you think about that. I know, maybe not. But is there somebody that's been a financial hero for you besides your parents that helped kind of maybe plant those seeds that you liked and.

Yeah, my parents for sure. My dad was one. But then it's some of these authors. So what was his name? I'm trying to remember the name of this author. He wrote a financial literacy book that was spectacular. Which.

What's the name? You remember the name of the book?

Oh, gosh. I'm trying to remember the name of the author and I can't remember. Or the name of the book. Oh, it's the Wealthy Barber. That's it. Sorry.

Oh, yeah, that's right.

So I'm a Canadian guy, so the Wealthy Barber is one of my favorite favorite authors. I actually met the author, Dave Chilton. He's great guy. Great guy. I called him up and he gave me a good, like a little congratulations on publishing my book. So, yeah, he's great stuff.

And when did you read that? When you were young, at 10 or 11?

Wealthy barber. Yeah, I read that when I was younger. I read the Wealthy Barber and then also the one we were mentioning earlier, the Richest man in Babylon. So I picked up both of those books pretty early, but I don't think I actually, I can't say other than that maybe pay yourself first. I don't think I was heeding their. Their wisdom as much as I should Have. It was good. Their books are great. They're still great books. But I know at the time it was more. I would listen to them, I liked them, but I don't think I actually took advantage of their. Like I said, I don't think I took advantage of the wisdom that they were providing me.

Very good. Very good. Now, let's talk about the Richest man in Babylon. Great book. It's a great book to read. You are doing something with it and we're, you know, share a little about what you got in the plans with that book.

Sure. So I'm, I, like I mentioned a moment ago, the Richest man in Babylon, one of my favorite books of all time. It's a classic. It came out in 1926, I think, which means it's a great book that came out, but it's a little bit dated. Like I was, I was trying to read the book to my son a couple. A couple years ago, or not a couple years ago. Last year, I was trying to read it to my son. He's about 10 years old. The book doesn't make sense to him anymore. Like the language of author who wrote something in 1926. It just doesn't work anymore. But the story itself is still spectacular. Yeah. With my son, I decided I was going to try to rewrite it. So I'm working on a revision of that book that has a lot more plain language. So that's part of it. So it has a nice little. Yeah. A much better story that's easier for the someone to read and also has a little bit more inclusivity. So one of the things that the original version, it was all. Oh, man, there was no so. Yeah. So one of the things I wanted to do, I wanted to make this book a lot more inclusive and I wanted the book just to read a lot easier. But it's another book that's just. That's another spectacular book. The story is great. So I'm super excited about that one.

Yeah. When that comes out, we're going to have you back on and talk a little bit.

I'd be excited to. I'd be excited to, for sure.

Definitely. What's the best way for our listeners out there to connect with you to follow up what you're doing? Clifton, how can our audience be of service to you out there?

Oh, man, I'd love to connect with anyone out there. So you can reach me@cliftoncorbin.com. yeah, that's probably the easiest way to find me. You can also find me on Instagram as well. So I'm there at your kids their money on Instagram. You can find me on LinkedIn. I'm kind of everywhere. So if you're looking for me, my website is usually the easiest one. But I'm happy to email you or connect with you if you're curious.

Yeah, definitely. Guys, go check it out. Cliftoncorbyn.com, the website, but go grab a copy of the book. You kids their money. You know, as we're rolling into the fourth quarter here of 2022 could be a great stocking stuffer. It could be a great gift to somebody who's got kids birthday present and that's, I think it's one of the most important things to think about. If you're financially educated, you're understanding, you've got family members who aren't. I really believe it's up to you to help maybe start those conversations because finance money talks can be intimidating. But if you approach it from asking, hey, I'm here to help. Let's start off on some right, the right path and some good habits with you. This is a great book to make it an easy transition and easy conversation for the family people that you love in your life that you want to see come up more financially fit. Right. Clifton, thank you so much for coming on the up Close show. It's been insightful. We look forward to having on a future date as well. Buddy.

Scott, thanks so much for having me and I just wanted to take a quick moment to just thank you for what you're doing. Like I, I, I told you my why I wanted to say I'm, thank you. I could tell your why is very similar to mine. You're educating, you're putting yourself out there, you're spending the time to make sure that people are, are getting themselves, getting themselves to where they want to be. And I just want to thank you. Like that's, that's, no, that's no small deed that you're doing and I wanted to make sure I, I thank you for that. So thank you for that. Thank you for having me on. I really appreciate it. It's been great.

Well, thanks, man. Thanks for coming. We'll be, we'll be in contact some more. I think we've got some, definitely some synergy going together and looking forward to what the future holds for you.

So I appreciate it.

Thank you. All right, guys, that's going to wrap up for this episode. Once again, the book is your kids, their money. You can get it at Amazon or check out Connect with Clifton directly at Clifton Corbin. Those are C's on both the words Clifton Corbin.com and like I said, guys, go out, take some action and we'll see at the top.

Sam.