#234 - The Secrets To Lease Here Pay Here

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You are listening to the Independent Dealer Podcast with hosts Luke Godwin and Jeff Watson. Hello and welcome to the Independent Dealer Podcast brought to you by Buckeye Dealership Consulting. Luke, this week we have a very familiar face. Mr. Tim Lawrence is back with us. We are going to do a deeper dive into leasing. It's kind of a hot topic right now. It's like, it's like saying CPI or you know, Trump Gate or any of these other like real cool trendy words these days. Lease here, pay here, is. It's like heyday.

I'll tell you. I've never heard it more than I have at the last four conferences I've been to. It's all people. Not all people are talking about, but a lot of people are talking about it. And Tim's here to expand on it and talk about Tim.

Why is it so important or so cool? Like, why is it so hot right now?

What's happening? Yeah, I, I think it has to do with the market pressures because with the prices of cars increasing so much, there's not a lot more you can put on the customer to increase their payment. And so I think as independent dealers are super creative. They're trying to think, well, how can I deliver a good quality car to my customer without just jacking the payment of something they can't afford anyway? And so leasing is a really good alternative to be able to do that and still maintain profitability.

Okay, okay, I can. I can get on board that. We need that before you guys get into this. So go Back to episode 193. So episode 193, we talked to Tim and we did a really good kind of surface level covering of what is leasing, why we do it, some of the structures, we cover a lot of that stuff. So I'm going to try not to rehash all those same points, even though we might have to for some of this conversation. So go back to that one. But first off, Tim, what I want to do is I want to kind of bust your nuts on this leasing thing for just a second, and I want to talk about the dirty underbelly who does this not work for, who should not get into leasing, who can just turn this podcast off right now, not waste their time and ignore this whole situation.

Yeah, well, being a little bit of a cheerleader for leasing, that's a harder question for me to just answer. So I'll try to be objective as.

Okay, I'll fill in the blanks.

Yeah, that's.

All right.

Add the expletives. The. I think it comes into more of. There are certain states that are more friendly to leasing and certain states that are less friendly.

Who is more friendly, like not friendly to leasing? New York, Massachusetts.

What? Yeah, there's. There's about 15 states that are not friendly. And what that friendliness really means is from a sales tax perspective, can you pay the sales tax over the life of the lease on the money that's collected to you, or do you have to pay it at registration? So if you have to pay it at registration, that would qualify as less friendly or unfriendly. And yes, New York, Ohio, New Jersey, Connecticut, there's about 15 states where it is. It's less friendly just on that aspect. All the other benefits still work.

Is that. Is that the only way you classify whether a state is friendly or not is by the sales tax, Tim.

Yeah, and. And it really is because all the other aspects still hold true, like federal income tax benefits. You still have the collateral control to repo the vehicle with greater ease.

So there are no states that say, hey, I don't care if this is a lease, you still can't come take this person's car. Or there are not states where they say, I don't care that you're not the driver of the car. You were 100% liable for any damages they do as the owner of the car. There's no, no states have gone that crazy just yet. Like, like GM Financial doesn't lease in a certain state or something. Like there's not one place where it's like, hey, no go, no fly.

Well, there's, there's. I think there's probably a couple different answers to that not to make it murky. So I'll try to simplify this. On a state like Ohio where the sales tax is calculated in a crazy way. It's on the sum of payments plus the residual and then you apply the sales tax and it's due up front. So it's like that probably doesn't make sense. If you're a super prime customer and we actually have customers that are in Ohio and we use a Hudson Cook provided lease. It's a periodic lease that makes it a little bit more like a subscription. So there is a max term for the lease, but the, the lessee driver can turn the vehicle in at any time voluntarily, as long as they're current with their payments and all those things. And then it is a pay as you go type of transaction to where the, the sales tax is only on the payments collected.

And liability wise, liability is fine. No matter what state you're in, it is fine.

So vicarious liability, I think is what you're referring to, and that's the Graves amendment in 2006 is what solidified that to where there is a break in the liability between the driver, the lessee and you as the owner, the lessor, so that you aren't liable. And that's why there's so much consumer leasing in general. I mean 20, 30% on any given year is leasing. And all of those companies and rental companies would just fall apart if they were liable for that.

Yeah, yeah. I couldn't even imagine which. Some states look like they're going that direction. But whatever. The other thing I would say is it is not a good idea for you to get into this if you are absolutely married to your DMS and that DMS is not DealPac or Auto Masters or a couple other little guys.

Right.

Because I know like Luke and I dealing with dealer socket, they do not have a leasing module. From what I understand, it would not work. If I wanted to do leasing, I would have to switch my DMS either, you know, concurrently or completely switch over to make this work.

Yeah, I think, I think that's true. There's a pain level range on if you convert and if you, if your dealership. There's probably two ways to look at it. If your dealership has, has a organizational culture of continual improvement and we're going to do whatever it takes to take on these new, whatever it is, the objectives that you set and it's a top down as a leadership model. Hey, we're going to look at this and get everybody on board because we see the benefits for everybody involved in the organization that this is the way that we want to go. Then there's a different way of looking at it. Okay. Changing dmss is going to be painful. It's not going to be fun. But we have a plan in place and here's how we're going to do it. And once we do it, we're going to be pumped. If you. But like you said, if you don't want to change and that's the farthest thing from you, then don't change.

I believe that's with any, any type of change. It's got to come from the top down. And switching DMS can be a problem. But I think you could run it concurrently, get out of all your buy here, pay here and start your lease here, pay here and probably it wouldn't be all that painful. And you know, years ago, Tim, a lot of people didn't get into the lease here, pay here because no really access to capital. And I think that's where you all came in and Tim's with lease here, pay your capital. What. How has that market changed with, with y' all entering that, that ball game?

I think it's changed quite a bit because one of the things that we really wanted to take on was normalizing leasing and providing a lot of education around it. And because of that, we offer accounting information for accountants and we actually see on our website people come on all the time. We don't see who, but we see that they're downloading all sorts of information. And I think because of that we've seen more competitors come in the market. And it's not like we're the leader in the space by, by number of dealers and by the transaction size. But that, that doesn't mean that there aren't a lot of players. We see a lot of regional players, small banks, friends and family. We see some big banks in there too. And so I think. And we see people coming in trying to scoop up our customers which we welcome. Because you know, that helps with the competition. We get more, more lenders in the space and overall it's going to benefit everybody.

Yeah.

And Luke, we interviewed Joe Powell quite a long time ago and he does his own leasing with a local lender that he gets his money from. I don't know if that's still the case, but I would say that's probably the other disqualifier for any buy here pay here that's looking to convert over is if their covenants, if they're heavily leveraged, you know, to go in and either buy that portfolio out or convert those people over, you may have an issue paying it down. Or I guess that could probably get a little bit sticky if you're switching from buy here pay here to lease here pay here when you've got a, you've got some sort of a capital provider that's got their tentacles into your business.

Yeah, actually, I think that's one of the biggest things, maybe obstacles that we run across is somebody wants to either do both or they want to wind down their current portfolio. And we, we have like a purchase and wind down program to where we'll refinance your buy here pay here portfolio and wind it down as you're ramping up your lease here pay your portfolio. But some, it just depends on how much hair is on the deal because if you're over advanced on your buy here pay here portfolio, it's, you're just sort of stuck anyway. Whether you're, however you're going to change lenders, you're, you're on a, you're on.

A hamster wheel and didn't know it either way.

Right?

Yeah, but it's, and the biggest reason we got Tim here today is to talk about 2022 lease here pay here Summit. It's in San Diego, which is pretty nice place. September 16th through the 17th. Jeff and I will be there, be doing some interviews and all that. Tim, I've never been to at least Here Pay here Summit. I've been to all kind of, you know, conventions. Can you kind of talk us through what this is and, and how much fun it's going to be? How much education is there?

Yeah, absolutely. Okay, so first I'm, I get super pumped about it. We've been doing it for six years so far, so this will be our seventh. And the first four or the first two years it was dealer run and led and we just sort of hosted the facility. And then we, as it started to grow, we took it on and we now host and Facilitate it. It's on the smaller side because lease here, pay here is on the smaller side, and we kind of like that. So, like, last year, we had about somewhere like 65, 70 attendees, which is great, because then you get a little bit more interaction and one on one with the speaker and panelists and that sort of a thing. We. So, like, this year, we have 10 sessions over a day and a half, and six of those sessions are directly dealers being interviewed or dealers on panels. I think we have 15 dealers who are interacting somehow across those six sessions, and then we have four a little bit more informative. We have like an accounting session and an economic one and a couple others. But the funniest thing is, as we've added or tried to add a lot more dealers into each panel, we have so many good operators that are attending that just don't want to speak, but they enjoy being a part of the discussion. So the more interaction we can get from everybody, the more it just is valuable to everybody who attends. And of course, as you guys know, some of the best stuff happens in between sessions when you're meeting, grabbing cocktails, and out to the couple dinners that we do.

Yeah, that's a lot of fun. That's, of course, Jeff and I enjoy that probably more than. Than any of it. And it's gonna be interesting for me to never really, you know, talk that much about lease here, pay here to go and just listen. I. I can't wait to learn. Jeff, you. You're in love with lease here, pay here, so it's gonna be fun for you. I know.

Yeah. Yeah, I definitely look forward to it. And like Luke said September 16th 17th in San Diego. I mean, what a better time to be in San Diego. Yeah, it's great.

Do you, Tim, you know, lease here pay here is like, we've already discussed is different. You talk to lease here, pay here dealers every day. Do you see them having the same inventory issues that that regular car salespeople are having right now? Or does being the least here pay here side insulates you from that a little bit?

It depends on the ACV that you acquire in your inventory. So if we have a lot of dealers that go after higher ACVs, like 10 to 12,000, and so those are a little bit easier to come by. But in general, we've seen the same struggles as everybody else because there's just less inventory available. And every call, we do pretty frequent calls with our customers, and we get the same story. There's supply chain issues and service center issues and getting inventory Customers are there, but those are probably the biggest issues.

Yeah, I would assume that so much of the lease here pay here inventory were off rental cars downstream and those dried up as we all know the last two years. So I could see that being the same problem. Do most lease here pay here stores have like a full service center where they change all of the customers and things like that?

I would say the most successful ones that have the most accounts do. And I think that's probably similar with buy here pay here. There is an advantage to getting lease inventory back. So you are getting, you don't have to acquire as much inventory if you have leases that started out as a higher ACV and they're coming back full term and then you're going to put them out again for let's say 24 months on the second, the second turn. So there is that advantage. But yeah, I think, I mean I think in this day and age in general, working towards having a successful service center for your operation is extremely beneficial, especially for leasing. I would say probably half of our dealers have their own service center. We see a lot of outsourcing.

Does. I've never thought about this. So you said that one thing about having to acquire less inventory is lease here pay here less cash intensive than buy here pay here.

I think super good question, Luke. I think there's. I'm going to answer this in two different ways because aside from let's just say sales tax, federal income tax stuff aside, let's put that on the shelf. If you go through the transaction, it, it really is just another financing tool for the customer. So if all things are created equal, you're using the same ACV and the same price point. In the end it's probably about the same. And we've had CPAs argue one way and CPAs argue the other way and of course we, we want to say, oh, leasing on a just that transaction basis is 100% better. It's probably about the same. The same. Now you add in the sales tax benefits if you're in a pay as you go state. And just like Luke, you said in the buy here pay here United conference on down payments, if you get more down payment money every month, that operating cash flow in your business is so impactful and so if same side on the sales tax, if you have that awesome, that helps a ton of. If the federal income tax depreciation or if you're going to access bonus depreciation like the tax cuts and jobs act allows you to do, it is a game changer because you're setting up one offsetting any federal tax income liability. And then you are potentially setting up nol carryforwards for the future to where you don't have to pay income tax going forward. And that can keep going and keep going for a long period of time. The probably the last two that come to mind as not really being tangible cash items, but making an impact on your business is if it takes you longer to repo a car on a buy here, pay your transaction and you can do a quicker on lease your pay here. I mean think about the value of that vehicle just losing. Even if it's 30 days worth or 15 days worth, that's longer than lease or pay here. That's, that's value that's losing in your business. And then the last one is you don't have to have an rfc so that whole just extra admin set up and probably just the, the brain power you have to use. Yeah. Just to try to understand the health of your business isn't there.

Not to mention my opinion, two tax returns every year. Ridiculous right away robbery.

Exactly.

So it makes a lot. What I'm saying, Luke, is I argue that you could do this. You could have the same leasing philosophy with a buy here, pay here car. Right. It's like, sure, it's just an early turn in. You had a 36 month term, you can turn it in at 24. Right. And whether I call it a residual or whether I call it forgiving your negative equity and flipping you into another car, I can call it whatever I want at that point and I can recontract you and get you going again. But what I, what I feel like I see in leasing is a, you can charge a lease initiation fee, which is like just pulling some random number out of the sky because I want to charge you money to start a lease. You know what I'm saying? I can't charge you a buy here, pay here initiation fee. That's illegal. Right. That's payment packing. That's hidden finance charges. I can charge a doc fee, but guess what? So can leasing. They can charge a separate doc fee. So the lease initiation fee is pretty darn cool. Obviously the tax savings from a sales tax standpoint, if you're in the right state. But then like you talked about the depreciation and the bonus depreciation on your asset, on your, on your, you know, portfolio is, that's, that's huge. I mean I can take repo losses, but that's not anywhere near that. And repo losses are you Know, sometimes those are real cash losses. If I, if my, if my cash on the street is still too heavy. So that is, that's pretty ridiculous because we all know what we pay in income tax each year. I mean, it's astronomical. And if I could have a, you know, an extra 20% or whatever, 100% bonus, depreciation, it's crazy.

And Tim, you know, we Buckeye are great sponsors of podcast. They actually introduced us a long time ago. And do reinsurance work the same in a lease here, pay your program.

Yeah, actually, it's. It's kind of cool. So first, shout out to Sean Peterson, who made the intro to us last year. He was a speaker at our conference. So thanks again, Sean. The. In your rent charge, your money factor, you can include any reinsurance products as long as it's itemized on your lease as part of the rent charge. And so you can either itemize it as, in two different ways. On your lease, you can itemize it as, okay, this is what it costs and it's being added to the contract, or you can itemize it as 0 under your rent charge, and you're just disclosing that this is part of, of what is being charged to you as rent. And so if you do it that way, you can add any of your reinsurance products to 100 of your customers because it's, it's part of your program. Like, we do a service contract for everybody, and we do CPI and we do GAP or whatever it is that you're electing to add to your program. And then it's. It's there, it's disclosed, and there's. If they, they don't want to access your program, then they don't.

And if you did the same thing on Buy Here, Pay Here, you'd get in big trouble because your penetration would be too high on those products and they'd call it illegal.

Right. Because those are considered aftermarket or ancillary products. And in this circumstance, they're not. They're part of your lease program.

Very neat. You're starting to sway me. Starting to come over.

I don't even want.

I don't want to start over there. Gosh, I might. I don't want to start over.

Talk to him about that then, Tim, because I know there's going to be a session at the convention at the summit about that buying a Buy here, pay here and converting to a lease here, pay here. Do you have any, any more practical tips for someone like Luke that might be dancing on the fence and saying, okay, Do I switch over? Do I not? And, and that's why I led this whole discussion with who is this not good for? You know, right? There might be some deal breakers where you're like, okay, cool, I don't even want to go down this road because I'm not switching dmss. And that's probably where I'm at. Honestly, if my DMS was friendly to leases, I, it would be so much easier to be like, okay, we're just structuring these differently. Like, and I'm going to hold the paper in your ship's name and not sell it to my rfc. And maybe I do. You know, my high end stuff gets leased and my low end stuff gets buy here, pay here. And I have a dollar that cuts off. And it would make sure complete sense to do both or whatever, slowly transition over if my DMS was friendly and I could look at them both in the same place and be like, all right, transition. It just really doesn't matter since it is not. That to me is like, I just can't handle the brain damage of converting to DMS again. It's just not where I'm at.

Right.

Lazy, old whatever it is. What would you say?

Well, I, I would say that first come to the summit so you can get firsthand experience with some of the dealers who have done it. Because me saying it just because of the company I work for is probably going to be swayed. But you can hear directly from somebody else and then you can ask them on the side, hey, I know you said this while we were, while you were being interviewed, but what's the real deal? You know, where did it hurt you the most? But I think if so, but to answer the question, I think you look at what are the similarities in my business that I, that are don't have to have any impact of change, which is a lot. I mean, it's the same customer you're collecting, the same financing aspects of it you're repoing. There's really just the, Can I handle the DMS change? Can. What do I need to do to prep my organization? I need to do a little bit of sales training so that my salespeople understand, hey, this is a lease, Mr. Customer. And this is an alternate path to ownership. You're test driving this for 36 months or 42 months, and then you can decide if you want to buy it or not. So you're disclosing all those things up front and then make sure that your advertising is spot on, which is not really not a big Scare. It's really easy to make sure your advertising is compliant. And then the last thing is, hey, does my accountant get it? Do they understand leasing or do they want to learn leasing so that I can get those good tax benefits? If you, if like those three categories seem like they're worth tackling, then, then you just, you make the plan and you come up with the objectives and the tasks and who owns them and the, the timing and the, the budget for them. And then you do the plan.

That's that actual session is Saturday from 9am to 9:45, right after you speak, Tim. And it's buying a buy here, pay here dealership to convert to lease here pay here. I'm going to be there in that one because I want to check it out. Yes, I need to learn.

So Tim, from a practical. And this might be hard without really getting into the numbers, but say Luke has a $5 million portfolio, right. If he could instantly convert those all over to leases, let's say this year, whatever. Not possible. But if it happens this year, they all get converted to leases. You're telling me that he could then in his taxes at the end of the year, he can take a bonus depreciation for all $5 million in his lease portfolio, depreciate those to zero in year one, and then carry that $5 million loss forward against all of his income for the next. I don't know. How much do you make, Luke? Probably, probably carry around till you're 100. It might last in two years.

It sounds like maybe a year. Maybe, maybe a year.

Yeah, you're right.

Exactly.

Exactly. That's cover you six months.

But on top of that, he's also super funding his reinsurance company, which is an expense item. Right. So he's super funding his reinsurance company that's on steroids. And then he's taking this $5 million net loss or depreciation that's carrying over, Correct?

Yes. Although the, the depreciation is on the cost of the vehicle. So let's say you buy 10.

He's actually into it. Three.

Yeah. Okay.

So he's only depreciating.

He depreciates the 3 million.

So that only get him like six months, I guess.

Right? Exactly. And that, that 3 million goes against any income tax that he would potentially have to pay because it's an expense. It'll probably create a loss that then is carried forward. So any, any future year is still going to go against that expense after that tax year. So let's say he had. He was going to have 500,000 in net income from this year, then he would have two and a half million to apply for the future years, however much he's going to use that up. But, but next year he's going to add more also because he's also buying inventory and he's going to apply it. And actually the cool thing about having a reinsurance company is that you then have tax, you have income that's going to come in later and you can decide when that's going to come in. So if you want to bring that in at a time where you know you're not going to pay taxes anyway, then great, you can bring that in because you're already offsetting it. Or if you want to wait till a time later on down the road, then that makes sense too. So it's a really a good fit for, for accessing with bonus depreciation.

So, so, so back to that example. If Luke was going to have a say he had a half million dollar net operating income for the year, he can apply his $3 million depreciation towards it. So he's wiping out the half million dollars which he would have. He's probably in the 40 or 50% tax bracket. I don't know what they do there in. He probably would have had a 2 or $300,000, say a $200,000 tax bill that is now gone. Right. Like it's not cut down the road. Is he deferring it? Does he eventually have to recapture that?

Yeah, so it's just the, it's the way that depreciation works in general. So if you, you just depreciated 100% of the cost of the vehicle. Well, at some point you're going to either sell it or wholesale it. Right. And so let's say the, of that $10,000 vehicle that you bought and fully depreciated for that year, in five years from now, it's worth 1500 bucks and you're going to wholesale it. So at that point that fifteen hundred dollars is now income to you that you would have to pay the income tax on. And so that's, you're basically deferring it out. But it's great because as you defer it out, the vehicles are losing value and that depreciation is going away. Just like the, the property that you own, that depreciation is, is helping you out over time. But if you sold the, the, the property because you depreciated too much, you would have to pay a little bit.

Yeah, but, but, and the problem with Properties is they go up. So you're depreciating your basis is still where it was and your depreciation so then you're recapturing everything above that when.

You sell it for a profit.

But when you sell a car and it's a $500 pile of scrap metal that you kick out the back, it's not going the other, you know what I'm saying? It's not going the other way.

It's being, I mean, it sounds like it sounds too good to be true, honestly.

Yeah, well, that's why it makes sense because you want, you want the bonus depreciation on a vehicle that's not going to grow in value or on an asset so that later on it's going to be this. The amount, if you can't see me listeners, I'm just holding up like an inch high is about what you'll have to pay later on.

So if Luke could save himself $200,000 this year, next year and the year after by switching over to leasing, that seems like enough money to go through the painful process. Oh yeah, swapping.

So our, our owner, the what he used to capitalize this company was he sold his previous company, Credit Union Leasing of America to Westlake Financial Services and it was a leasing company where he always had depreciation. And to him it is just crazy that that dealers aren't jumping on this constantly with the bonus depreciation. Like he walks around our office and is in shock for years. Guys like us, specifically you, Jeff, not so much you, Luke.

So personal note, have you contacted Dealer Socket and ask them to add a leasing module?

We have not contacted Dealer Socket. We have tried to work with other dealer DMS systems to say hey, can we work with you to build a module or can we, you know, somehow incorporate in an independent lease module to yours? And so far we've had no's and no's and interest and no's and interest. It sort of varies.

You said ams, AMS has it or.

Yeah, Auto Master Systems. And I think this is kind of a cool thing. So I was at the DPG with that you guys were at early in January and AMS is a really good partner of theirs and they're helping with dpg. Well, what a great way. If you're already, you want to access the benefits of getting the live offering that that DPG does for their performance groups, then that's a cool way because you're already looking towards AMS and might as well add in lease or pay here if you're looking at converting as one of the motivators for sure.

And and I and I are they Does DPG have a lease here pay here group yet?

I don't think they do. And so in terms of 20 groups I think yeah, it's cool if you can get in with all lease here pay here 20 group. I know Bill Elizondo has one through NIADA and but in general it's not. I don't think it's necessary for you because there's so many similarities that you don't necessarily need to have. Okay, I need to be in a 20 group. It's more important that you're with like minded, you know, good operators who are challenging you and your operation versus the financing product. Yeah.

So be it. Being in a group with other buy here pay your dealers works anyway.

So totally one thing we didn't cover in the last episode and again episode 193. If you guys want any more detail on the leasing thing is we talked about GPSs and so we can plug our sponsor pastime at the same point of using a GPS in my lease here car. So if I've got my pastime GPS and I'm under the impression like right now I use wireless because it's just so much easier to get it in, get it out. Like I don't know how long they're.

Going to have it if it's a.

Cash deal, blah blah blah. But if I know this car is going to be in my portfolio for five years and it's going to be out on two or three leases cycles. I mean I could put in a hardwired ignition interrupt pastime gps. Is it illegal for me to shut off someone's ignition in a lease situation? Is it the same rules apply where I got to give them notice?

Yeah, same, same rules in terms of the state, whatever the state laws are for that and we have dealers who use a lot of those pastime remote battery operated ones and they just put it in another spot when it comes back for the second turn and it's just a note in their DMS for that, that turn. Just keep. I mean it's just like if you're a buy here, pay your dealer and you get the vehicle back on a repo and you're going to put it out again, what do you do? You probably just slip one in close to the same spot or a new spot.

Yeah, I could see the benefit of just being like all right, I'm going back to hardwired because I know these cars are going to Be with me for a very long time, or at least that's my goal. I don't really want someone paying out the lease or buying the residual. I want to get them into another car if they're a good customer. So anyways, I, I could see that being a benefit. And to close out, Tim, I want to ask you this. Who, dollar wise, who's the largest lease here, pay here dealer you've seen? Just out of curiosity.

Well, not. Yeah.

Are we talking like 10 million? 50 million, 100 million? Like, are these guys running massive, massive lease here pay here operations?

Yeah, I, I know of two that are 100 million operations and receivables. And I, I don't want to say their names because I know I have the information because I have it.

Yeah.

So we don't need a who.

I'm just curious. It's not like a boutique mom and pop. Like I run leasing out of a cornfield and like my friends and family, like, this is like, no, the smartest, largest operators are like all in on leasing.

A hundred percent all in. I mean, we see 20 million dollar portfolios, 50 million dollar portfolios. It's a. For these guys, they all do the same thing as our owner. They walk around and they're like, I am totally thrilled that a bunch of buy here pay here dealers don't see this.

Well, if you, if you've ever, if you've ever met Nick Marcosian.

That is right.

How many. What's the large measure? What's the largest? Like, you know, defactor. Like, who have you seen, like move over to that side as far as like trans.

Whatever. Yeah. Over the last. Yeah, over the last three years we saw somebody convert over and this took time to do it, but we saw. Let's see you do the Math, right. Probably 50 million in lease receivables convert, you know, buy here, pay your receivables, convert over.

Yeah.

For one dealership.

Geez, that is no small cookie. And I guess Tracy Myers is doing the same thing right now. We talked to him a couple episodes ago and he's.

He's.

Yeah, he's making.

He's wanting to.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Very neat.

Well, anything else for the listeners?

Thank you.

They know how to get a hold of you. They know the website.

Yeah. At the website. Simple. Lhphph.com so you can look at the summit information and then we have a bunch of information. You can just get lost for a long time.

Cool.

Thank you, Tim. And we look forward to seeing you in San Diego and everybody out there this isn't a conference. Just. Just. If you're a lease here, pay here. This is for anybody who's even interested in it, and you'll probably learn something either way. So their rooms open, I'm sure. And there's registration still available, so come check us out, see us and see Tim.

Yeah. Thanks, everybody.

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