We're All In This Together - Interview With Allison Hammons

Foreign welcome to the Agent Leader podcast. My name is Brent Kelly, your host. Thanks so much for joining me on this episode. I have a fantastic guest for you, the agency leader today that I will introduce here just in a minute or two. But before I get to my awesome podcast guest today that you're going to learn a ton from and you're really going to like, I always want to share the mission of the podcast. The mission of this podcast is to help you, the agency leader, gain clarity, build consistency and make a commitment to become your best version possible as we get into this new year, 2023. Hard to believe, right? Like 2023, I just feel like we are all getting older. But why does it feel more real when you really do feel like you are getting older? For whatever that is worth, as we get into this year, we are continually to seek out and to find qualified growth agency partners. And you know, we've mentioned this on some previous podcasts, but if you're an agency that's really looking to take the next step, schedule a strategy call with one of our coaches. We get to know you better, you get to know us better and see if there's a potential fit for us to work closely with your agency to help you in all kinds of different areas and alignment and getting your producers producing to understand the power of retaining the, replicating the high level and to give your agency a high level playbook that can be customized for your agency. So if you want to learn more about that, go to sitkins.com experience sitkins.com experience all right. I am, I am privileged to have a guest, someone who I got a chance to meet this year. Didn't know each other before this year? I don't think so. Right, Allison, that I'm aware of. So. Oh my gosh, she forgot. No, we didn't meet until this year and I had, I had the privilege, I mentioned this on a previous podcast of being part of the Agency Leadership Institute, which is hosted by Cincinnati Insurance Reagan consultant. Reagan Consulting leads that. And I, as part of Sitkin's group, was truly honored to be able to present and share and have conversations with a great group of agency leaders across the country. And we had two in person sessions, one in June, one in September. And not only was this person part of the group who had great value to share, and I know she'll have great value to share today with you, but she had the privilege. Wait a second. No, no. I had the privilege of sitting at her table. She probably didn't have the privilege of sitting with me, but we were table mates as well. We had groups of five or six, so I got to know her very well and we had some great conversations. So without further ado, Allison Hammonds is my guest here with Knight Insurance Group. She's a risk consultant. But I know you've got your fingers around different parts of the agency as well. So, Allison, welcome to the Agent Leader podcast.

Well, thank you, Brent. I appreciate it. I'm excited to be here.

Well, I want to. I wanted to bring Allison on for a number of reasons. A, she's just really likable, which you'll get to know that right away. Just has a great personality. But I, I was. I didn't share with you before we started recording here, Allison, but I just, you know, got a chance to meet so many different people as part of that Agency Leadership Institute. And I just loved your openness and transparency and just facing things like head On. This is something we're dealing with and this is how we're doing it. And I learned a ton from you. I know the audience will as well. But before I get into some of those questions about you and what you're doing and some things that I know will be helpful to agency leaders, I'd love to, for you to share. How did you get to where you are today? Like, you're sitting there and what you do. Like, if you could share a little bit of a backstory and what you do today at night Insurance.

Yeah, sure. So thank you. I. I have actually been a part of the agency for almost 23 years. I was 8 when I started, So I actually started working at the agency. My first job was a receptionist and I was 18 years old. So I was just graduated high school. And I am also a second generation, so my dad actually is in the business and I work with my dad. His name is Sam. He's the president of the agency. So I, throughout college actually worked through the. At the agency. And so that's really kind of where I got, I would say, the bug for the business. I was their first sales intern. So that is also where I got kind of the sales bug and thought, I think I want to do this. I was going to school for business, so I knew I wanted to do something business. I wasn't really sure. And so I went and actually worked for Auto owners Insurance company as a commercial underwriter first outside of college, and then I was ready to move on from that. And so I moved back to Toledo and I actually called my dad and said, listen, I need to do something different. If I don't, I'm going to get out of the business. And he's like, well, I really think you should be there for five years. You know, it's good to have that company experience. And I said, well, you're either going to hire me or I'm out.

So the ultimatum, right?

Yeah, right, I know. So In January of 2006, I actually came back full time to the agency and then at that time I became full time sales, commercial sales. And so I have been doing that role for over almost Gosh, it's almost 17 years now. Have really enjoyed it, really work with a lot of really great clients. But probably about 2019, our CEO started coming to me and said, I want you to get more into a leadership role at the agency. And so we put me in charge of the business development unit, which was really the new people that were coming into the agency, new producers specifically. And you know, what can we do to get them trained? How can we help them? Coaching and mentoring. And I also myself and another individual in the office came up with our playbook. So we have what's called the Night Playbook and it's what we put, it's what our, what we put our producers through, especially in that first year. So that was created. So I was helping coach and mentor people as well as kind of put the behind the scenes stuff in place to some of the detail stuff. And then I also became a partner in the agency just soon after that after really kind of after Covid started and then there were are now six of us that we came partners, myself and Greg, who's actually another younger individual here at the agency. And so we were only partners for a few short like two years. And then this year we actually became 100% employee owned. So so we now are an ESOP. And that happened on August 1st of this year. So I'm still on the executive team and we meet, you know, still to discuss about, you know, what are we doing as an agency, what do we need, how are we moving forward? So, but I am still very heavily in my sales role and helping my clients grow and getting more clients and then as well as, you know, what are we going to do to help grow our sales team. So that's kind of where I'm at now.

I love. Well, thanks for sharing that. And I, you know, I said you had your, your finger, so to speak, or pulse on lots of stuff, right. And you do. And you know, so many of our agency leaders that listen and those that we work with at Sitkins group. They're, you know, very similar to you in the sense they're kind of that player, coach. Right. And that's a. It's a really challenging role. So I love to get your perspective on how, you know, maybe you balance some of those things. And, you know, also, obviously, you know, so many of our agency partners are second, third, fourth generation, and I always find it interesting to hear the story. Every story is unique, but there are similarities. And I gotta ask you, and I don't know if this is true or not, so I just want to get your take. Did you ever have a point and you said you started at 18 as a receptionist and kind of growing up around the business where you were, like, made a comment, I will never be in this business. I'll never do this, or did that never, ever happen? Do you always kind of like, no, I like it.

I never. I never said I would not be in the business or never do it. I don't think I ever really. I mean, my dad's been in it forever, and it's. He's had a really great career, and so. No, I never really thought that. I think he did. He's like, wait, maybe you should do something different.

I have to. I'll have to get him on the podcast.

Yeah, yeah, exactly. But, yeah, no, I never really felt that way. And then once I got into it, I was like, oh, oh, this could be. This could be really great.

So, yeah, yeah. And obviously, everyone's got their own journey, but it is. It's interesting. You're talking about, like, you did the company side, which was good, but you were. You were very quickly ready to, like, do. Do the other thing. But it is interesting. There's so many generational agencies that I know and work with of, you know, having that bit of just the company side, I think, in one way, and again, a lot of ways you could phrase this, but I think it really does give you appreciation for what happens from the agency side of things. Right. I think it also gives you appreciation for all the stuff that carriers do, but, you know, sometimes it can be taken for granted of. Of how great this business is.

Yeah, absolutely.

So I appreciate you sharing that. So.

Yeah.

All right, I've got a few questions for you. I told you as we got into this, this is like having a cup of coffee. And, you know, obviously, we're virtual, and I'd love to be in person with you, but I got my cup of coffee here just to get. Get some ideas. And I asked these questions for the audience, but certainly I Learn a ton as well. And I'm just curious, Alison, from your perspective, you know, if I ask an agency leader, what's frustrating you? I typically could, you know, could sit back and for an hour, you're like this and this and this. But I'm curious, from your perspective, whether it's individually or as your team, or again, even as an industry, what do you see as your biggest frustration right now or biggest challenge, maybe, and what are you doing or your team doing to address that?

Yeah, I think one of the challenges is finding people, which I know that is a huge issue for many agencies, but finding experience people, because you know that in that realm there's. It takes so much time and effort to train somebody. And I know, I mean, we've done it. We've brought in new salespeople without any experience or even customers. On the customer service side, we've brought in new people, but it just takes so much time and effort to really get somebody going. And so it's so nice to be able to bring in somebody, but there's just not a lot of movement in that. And I think of myself too, when you've already got to book a business, it's hard to leave. It's hard to leave that comfort of like, oh my gosh, I'm going to have to start over. So we are trying to figure that out. One of the things we thought is like, okay, well, let's hire producers with books. Let's buy their books so that maybe we don't have as much concern about that. Looking to still try and find experienced account managers, like senior level account managers. One of the big things that we did this year, and actually it came from some of the training, the ali. We actually revamped our referral program, our employee referral program. And so we now are doing $1,000 for an employee referral after they stay for 90 days. And then we added, if they stay for a year, then they're getting another thousand dollars. So we did do that with one employee. So far, we kind of kicked it off with her. And, you know, so that's one of the ways that we're trying to hopefully maybe see if people know other people within the industry. I mean, people. Some of these people came from other agencies. So that's one of the ways we're trying to combat that. I would say also for me, on my own, like, business side of things with my sales is getting people to respond back. And it's not cold calls. This is. These are people that like, have sent an email or Made a phone call on my behalf as a referral or I know the person, like I know them, they know me. It's not, you know, there's a relationship there. And so that's really been strong. I've really struggled with that this year with the, probably within the last like even six months it's been why don't people respond back? Why? What is it? And so one of the ways that I've been is just reaching out to other individuals that are not even in our same business but maybe they're in like some kind of a business development role and say, hey, what are you, what are you experiencing? What are you doing? You know, it's emails, it's calls, it's text messages. I've done all of that. What are, what's something else? And so some of it's persistence because like I, it's just persistence and being able to do that and then sometimes it's walking away too, you know, like say, all right, I've done everything I can do. If I can't, it's not going to move forward, it's not going to move forward, it's okay, move on and get to something else. So those I would say were, are some of the things that I'm trying to change and experience different things maybe to try and help me get things turned around. So it's going to happen. You know, you just have to be. But sometimes it's just frustrating. And then I guess lastly I'm a full time working mom. So you know, the balance of being there, I mean that's the beauty of this job is I can, you know, be there, my kid is sick or if I have, they have an appointment or I'm not at work at 8am but it's also, you know, tough because you're like trying to get so much stuff done and you know, when I'm home I'm with my kids and so, and my kids are young, I have a 3 year old and an 11 month old so they need me. You know, they're not as self, self, self guided as maybe I would think so. But it's great. Like it's wonderful. It's just the whole time management and being able to figure all that out and get everything done that I want to get done. So I would say those are probably my top three right now that we've kind of been experiencing.

Well, first of all, thanks for sharing. I mean I'm sitting here going, I bet you there's some other people listening to go, I can relate to that. Right. Maybe in some different ways, but similar ways as well. And I mean, the last part, I know you just had the, you know, because when we were there in June, right. I mean, new, new baby, the whole deal you're dealing with and which is so awesome and it's exciting. It's wonderful. You know, I've shared with you. I got, I got five kids. They range all over, by the way. Them needing you even when they get to college doesn't, you know, it changes different, but it's different. They just need you in different ways.

Right.

I don't, I don't need your time. I just need your money, Mom.

That's right.

Right. But, but there is that, that challenge. There. There's no doubt. And you know, I think what hit me as you said that is that, you know, the great thing about the independent agency world is that it is flexible, right. Which is great. But it also creates challenges because you can work when you want, which can be good or bad, right? Like, yes, right. You can work when you want, which means, oh, I can go to that thing at three or the doctor's appointment at one, which is fantastic. But guess what? I also can work what I want, which could be 9pm or 11pm or 4:30 in the morning. Right. You know, so this, you know, part of that is again, I'm not going to give any band aid solutions to this other than we talk a lot about energy management. But it's just the biggest thing is, you know, prioritize and be focused where you are, which is so hard because, you know, it's like right now. And I get it, you know, we're having this conversation. I have no doubt as a human being you have a pretty good idea of what you have to do after we hang up this call. Right? Like, right. So we all that way. But it's like, you know, when you're here, you're here and that's a huge challenge for salespeople and entrepreneurs and leaders. And I want to share a couple of things too, and I don't mean to hog or take steal from what you just said, but it's interesting because you mentioned the challenge of finding people, which is obvious. We had some discussions at the Ally group, certainly about that, and I've had others. On a recent podcast, I had Art Bettencourt, who's part of a Betancourt great guy, and had some interesting solutions on that. But one thing that I'll never forget, it came up at our table. I think I asked this question to someone because I was just kind of sitting there listening, is they're talking about all the different things they're doing for recruiting. And again, there's, as you remember, there's a multiple different ways you could do this. And. But I asked the question about what are you paying a recruiting service? You know, like, well, you're not paying this and this and whatever. I said, oh, well, what do you pay if someone internally that really loves your company, that's been there a long time and is a great internal recruiter because. Not because they know all the details, just because they believe in the culture? And it was like, oh, we only pay this. And I'm like, that was about it. And it was like, oh, my gosh, you're right. Like, you know, in essence, we're paying strangers way more than we pay the people that have been here that love our company. Now, you got to be careful with that. Right. And how that's facilitated. And you mentioned you after a certain period of time, and every agency's got to find their own thing. But it just, you know, I think what I've seen, Alison, I've seen some of the stuff that you guys have done. I know I'm talking to you at night. Is it really. Yes, there's someone in charge of recruiting. But it truly is a team culture approach that everybody in the team understands, obviously who we are and the people that we want and why we want them. And all of a sudden, you've got people that are at a restaurant or at an event or at a bank. I don't know. Right. And they go, oh, gosh, you're frustrated with your job because we have an amazing career opportunity. You should talk to such and such. Right? Yeah, it's. It's, you know, that takes time.