Why Visibility Is Your Biggest Business Advantage

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You just dropped a secret nugget in there, Lindsay. I don't think you cut that or it was, uh, you You know, one tip could be just engaging in other people's stuff more. That helps with your reach. I didn't know that, so that's good to know. I need to get out there and interact more.

Absolutely. And it applies to Instagram as well. I can't say for sure about TikTok and some of the other platforms, but for sure for Instagram and for LinkedIn especially, the more you comment and engage with other people, the more your stuff's gonna be seen.

AI is everywhere, as we all know, and now more than ever, it's important To actually get visible and show your face and be out there so people know it's not an AI avatar they're talking to. So I am so excited to bring on today's guest from our Calgary chapter in Speakeasy. We have Lindsay Sullivan, also known as the Queen of Visibility. She is the guru, the go-to when it comes to saying, how can I get more? How should I get visible? Why should I get visible? And how do I get confident on camera? What's the strategy for growing my social media? And she has got so many amazing answers and tips she's going to share. Welcome, Lindsey.

Thanks so much, Eric. I'm really excited to be here.

Awesome. Well, I am so excited today because I'm like, literally, as we were talking in the quote green room, I'm thinking, gee, I'm going to be like your test subject today as we talk about this. And I'm feeling it more than ever too. I'm seeing just AI slop out there on what's going on and what's real. And this is exciting times probably for the business you've been in for a while now, right? I imagine.

Yeah. It's definitely interesting with AI and photography. In social media, for sure.

I love it.

Okay.

So you do a lot with your clients. You teach a lot with respect to, um, how to get confident on camera, how and why you should be visible, strategies. Uh, we're gonna dig in a lot of stuff and we got some nuggets to share with everybody before we go there. I always like to do just a little bit of a background because you're playing a big game in the social media space. How did you get here?

Yeah, I started as a photographer. I got into brand photography specifically, 'cause I love working with business owners. And the reason I got into that actually is 'cause I had a photography business in general to start. So I was doing everything, families, you know, all sorts of different types And I needed to get my own photos taken, but I really didn't want to because I never like getting my photos taken. I always cringe when I get asked for a photo, you know, podcast host asks for a headshot. And so I felt like, oh, I'm a photographer, I need to have some good photos. So I forced myself to book a session with another photographer. And for me, I didn't realize that I actually was photogenic. So when I had this session with her, she was able to relax me and get me some really good photos, some authentic smiles. And then once I had these photos that I loved, it was so much easier to be visible, to actually be able to show up. On social media and put my photo everywhere. And I thought, you know what, I want to be able to do this for other business owners. So I ended up really niching down into the brand photography space and really helping people realize they're photogenic and give them that boost in confidence to show up and be visible. But then I also found that, you know, they'd have these great photos, but there was still something kind of holding them back at times from posting, or they just really struggling to be consistent. So I ended up creating, you know, some workshops and courses to help teach that side of things so they could actually be consistent with their social media.

I love it. Okay. So I'm gonna rewind a little bit there. I totally get it. Like you're saying, it's like, until I have that perfect picture, I'm stalled. I don't wanna like go out there. I don't want people to see me yet. It's just not the best me. And it's funny, I've seen that actually with my wife. You know, she started her own little online business and actually she's like, I needed the right picture to get on my website. So there are a lot of people, it sounds like, that are just frozen, not willing to even go because they don't have that picture. Now, when you were doing brand photography, tell me a little bit more about that. Like what kind of brands? Like, Where did that start?

I specialize in people. So for me, it's like the coaches, life coaches, business coaches, chiropractors, hairstylists, a lot of different genres really. But the key thing with all of them is they wanted to be able to be visible on social media. They're the ones people were coming to work with. And so having that personal brand was really important and also to be able to show people what it's like to work with them. Like even my chiropractor client, people would say, wow, we felt like we already knew you before we even walked in the door, you know, and they'd never even met them yet in person. So being able to create that know, like trust factor before you even meet people. That's what the brand photography is all about.

You just went ahead and my big question is, is the why, like, okay, so let's dig into that more. So the why behind people should even do this, because I imagine you're running into a lot of people now. And I love this because I talk about this a lot when I see clients, it's like a lot of people are their brand name forward with face hidden, like doctor or lawyer. Like it's just a company name with a bunch of stuff on it. You got to go search in the about us section and maybe you'll see like a group picture of somebody or they'll just hear about the name. And there's nothing there. It's flat. So is that kind of what you started seeing? And is that really the why? Is that what you've noticed? And have you been able to see the differences as you've been working through that?

Yeah, I've noticed actually one of my clients, for example, she ended up posting just some general, we call it B-roll where it's, there's no sound. It's just a, you know, a video of someone typing on a laptop or walking or things like that, or meeting with clients. Nothing like, you know, crazy or exciting necessarily, but she got 10 times the engagement and comments because it was her in there. People could see her and they liked seeing her way more than they liked seeing the generic stock images she was using. And so, being able to see us, it really creates trust and it also creates recognition. So, when you're on social media, people will actually see your face and be like, oh yeah, I remember Eric from, you know, when we met. And maybe if you get on camera and you start doing a talking head where you're speaking to camera, they can feel what your personality is like and get a feel for you. If you've got brand photos that show your personality and your smile, they can get a feel for you that way too. And they can also imagine themselves working with you if you've got, you know, images behind the scenes or you meeting with clients or those kinds of things. So, it's putting a picture into their head and helping them imagine what it's like to work with you and the different services you offer, the experience, the vibe, you know, that kind of stuff.

So a lot of takeaways people could be listening and saying, well, sure, I got an about us page and I have my picture on there, my arms folded and, you know, hey, Eric Berman, blah, blah, blah. But you just kind of added to that. So what are you finding? It sounds like that's not enough. It sounds like what you're saying is, okay, great. I have clients that have nothing. Now at least get a picture of you out there with the right smile and doing the things, but you just added a whole other layer that I didn't think about too much because I think a lot of us probably say, well, wait a second, do people really care about, like, I don't want this to be an Eric Berman thing or a me thing. I don't want a bunch of pictures of me. Nobody cares about that. But you're saying no, people actually do want the B-roll. Can you dig a little bit deeper? Like, have you noticed the difference in results when people are doing that and what types of B-roll have you found is working really well? Yeah.

So I'm gonna dive a little bit into the psychology of things, but there's something called the mirror exposure effect. And what it means is that when we see something often, it becomes familiar with us. And that familiarity actually leads to trust. And the trust leads to a subconscious preference of us over another brand. So, if you've got one brand that's just got a website and that's it, they've got no visual presence. They're not reminding people that they exist and they're not getting to know people. People aren't seeing their face, seeing what they look like. They're not getting used to seeing them. They're not getting that reminder either that that brand exists. Whereas when you have, you show up on social media, maybe you also have a newsletter and you're networking and you have all those different touchpoints. You're reminding people that you exist. And then when you're on social media, it's just another opportunity to get in front of them and be seen a lot more. So, it's, that's one thing that you're getting seen more. So, you're establishing that trust from the familiarity. But the second thing is people get to know you because they can see your personality. They can get a really, a really good feeling of what you're all about. So, you're also showing, you know, the way you like to work with. And then 3, you can also show yourself as an expert. So, you can talk about different topics and they can go, oh yeah, she really gets me, or he really gets me. He understands what my problem is and he has a solution or she has a solution. So it's more than just having those images on social media. It's also showing yourself as that expert as well.

I love it. I couldn't agree with you more. If you're choosing between A or B, who are you going to go with? A flat brand or somebody who's got that personality that you vibe with? And, or honestly, it could repel people too. Like I've seen people, that's okay. That's just not your customer type. If it's like, oh my God, the way this guy or gal looks or the way they say things, I just, not for me, but that's okay. Like you're going to attract the right people. You talk a lot about confidence on camera. I mean, you teach that. It's just a nice bold statement. I know you do a really good job with that, helping people get confident on camera. What do you find?

Yeah, it's kind of, there's a bunch of different things that go into it when I'm taking photos. Part of it is relaxing people and connecting with them and getting that authentic smile, the laughter coming through. But if you're taking your own photos, it's harder if you're taking your own photos. So then you have to make yourself laugh and it's harder to get that authentic look. But if you have a friend or family member, you can, you know, maybe take photos of each other, then you can create that fun and that laughter and get some really good smiles that way. So part of it is maybe having a wingman or wingwoman to help you. Maybe you trade, you get together and take photos of each other, but you're getting that relaxed kind of vibe. Another thing to think about too that I find really helps my people is they think about who they're helping. Because if you're thinking about yourself, it's all about you. You're thinking, oh, I don't like how my weight is. I don't like my hair, my teeth, whatever it is. I've had a number of people recently tell me that they're not ready for brand photos because they need to lose weight. And so, you know, they're really focused on themselves, which I understand, but the people that want to hire them that need their help, they don't care about the weight. What they care about is that authentic smile. They care about whether that person is an expert, whether they can actually solve their problem. And they're not going to know that if you're not visible, if you're not putting yourself out there and being visible and telling people what you do and helping them and those kinds of things. If you are avoiding the camera and posting, You just don't exist and then they're not gonna get the help they need. So I find that helps a lot of people, myself and my students, just be like, okay, I'm gonna put this out here. And even if I'm not looking perfect on camera, that's okay. Because as long as somebody liked that video and found it useful, then that's the key, right?

Yep. Okay. I like that. What types of poses and styles should we be in for the most part? And then you also mentioned like B-roll and other things. Is there a certain kind of default that you have for everybody?

Yeah.

Let's start with your first question, which was like basically the smile. Whether they should be smiling and laughing. I would say it really depends on the brand. So that's one of the things I love about brand photography is there's a lot of creative direction. There's a lot of strategy that goes into the photos. It's not just show up and take them. We want to look at the brand itself. So for example, one of my clients, she's a mortgage broker. She previously had photos that were very stuffy and boring, and those were her words. So she came to me, her brand's very vibrant, her personality is fun. So for her, laughter and smiles and brilliant colors. We have backgrounds, like we use some cool graffiti backgrounds in Calgary in one of the spaces she loves. You know, those kinds of things. So for her, that brand was perfect. Those images were great. I have another client though, who's more of a holistic healer. She's very peaceful and quiet and wise. And so those kinds of poses would be different than Jen's photos, which were the mortgage broker, right? So it kind of depends on the client, on what kind of expressions, even the poses that you have that really will influence how people are feeling. So if you do a power pose, that might work for an executive coach, but it might not work for a therapist who wants people to feel really invited in and like really comfortable with them. You might have a more relaxed pose and you might go for more candid looks or, or lifestyle, we call it, where the photos are taken in a home with a beautiful window and, you know, that kind of thing versus, you know, a classic studio shoot. So it really is client dependent on the brand. You wanna think about your clients and what kind of vibe you wanna give off when you're, you're meeting with them and, and with the branding and that sort of thing. So yeah, it really depends on the client. And then for the B-roll, again, it depends on the client, but a lot of people, something simple like typing on the laptop or walking is a good one, or, you know, those kinds of things, just movement, because things like Instagram, they prioritize video. And so if you can have some movement and then you put some words on it, you know, maybe using a program like Canva, like for me, for example, I might be walking, holding my camera. It'd be 3 tips for taking better photos, you know, or getting better photos in your brand shoot. So you can add on a few things in there like that. Or you could have some fun stuff. Like some people have like really fun things where they're dancing or they're doing all sorts of different things. So again, it's very brand dependent cuz I don't like to do the dancing ones.

Yeah.

You know, it depends on the brand and it won't fit all brands. So, and again, for me as a photographer behind the scenes of doing, working with clients helps people understand what it's like to work with me. They'll see the laughter, they'll see the fun, you know, a chiropractor might have You know, video of them working on a client. Doesn't necessarily have to be an actual client. It could be someone who looks like their client, bring in a friend or family member, and then show what it's like to have that service. Or maybe for you, maybe it's someone meeting with you at your events, Speakeasy events, for example. You may be talking in front of the group or something like that, and people laughing in the group and are having some serious conversations. You know, they're deep into conversation and masterminding, those kinds of things. So you could do B-roll of that sort of thing and talk about what it's like in the Speakeasy group.

I love it.

Those kinds of things.

I'm hearing movement, almost performing the act you're performing, whatever it is you're doing. Show that movement in there. Like even for me, the 2-part question, you know, I'm not going to have me all serious because that's not my look. You know, it's more of, you know, I'm sort of there to like facilitate or be more spirited and energy and that kind of pose. And in my case, it's interesting because I think Speakeasy, not to make it about, about me, but I'm just sort of thinking through as you're going through it. I like this idea. We're actually going to try to fix some stuff on the website now, but you gave me this idea of we're thinking of putting a lot of static images and I have some testimonials. Of course I have B-roll of the entire annual event, which we try to get out there.

Oh, nice.

I like this concept of even like little mini images of like movement at a localized chapter where you see people kind of interacting and questions and almost this concept of not, you know, I don't want necessarily to me be on stage all the time because that would almost lean towards, hey, this is a facilitator-led group, which it's not, you know, it's very much peer-led.

Mm-hmm.

But I have to create this video and imagery that shows that.

Yeah.

And I don't know if I'd want me to be in that many pictures. I guess that'd be my question for you. I was like, somebody like me, like I'm a facilitator of all these groups. Like, I don't know how much face I'd wanna put in my own site.

That's a great point. I think it's still important to show you because people wanna know the founder. They wanna know the person behind the brand. Why did you start this? Why is it different from other groups? You know, more about you. And then we connect with you and go, okay, well, I feel like I really like Eric, so I probably am gonna like his group. And then you look more into what the group's all about. So I'd say like even on social media, there could be some posts with you in it and you talking about why you started it, the origin story, those kinds of things, as well as like these kinds of interviews where you're in it, but it's not necessarily about you. It's about the topic. You know, that sort of thing. But then you could also have images and video of the experience because the experience is really key. And if you can capture, you know, our group has a lot of laughter in our chapter. I like capture, I take some pictures when I'm there. And so we can capture like the fun of the event, but then also some of the serious looks too, as we're having serious discussions about things. So you can capture those experiences and the emotions people are feeling and those kinds of things. And that can really attract people and be like, oh wow, that group looks like a lot of fun. So, you know, it might be a fun one to try.

Love it. All right. I got to get some of those pictures from you too. We can post them and get them out there. We'll talk about that on the side. You've given me all sorts of ideas. So I got the content now. What do I do with it? But just to kind of recap, I think anybody listening here, the moral of the story is stop hiding, you know, get out there. We need to see real more than now than ever. We need to see a real person. We need to see authenticity. We need to get familiar. I like that. The more I see your face, I'm going to start to build a relationship with this person before I even know them. So when I do see them, it feels sort of special and I already have a sense of their energy and their personality. I feel sort of like them before I've even been there, which will probably get me to— if a prospect is between you and somebody else, you're probably gonna get that prospect.

Exactly.

And you've seen that.

Okay.

So let's talk about, I got my site up. I have an Instagram account. I got my B-roll down. Now I'm like, okay, Lindsay, it's time for me to grow my social following. What do I do? I'm stuck. Like, how do I get visible?

Everything you hear on this show comes back to one idea, proximity. I wrote the book on it, literally, Proximity Pays, my bestselling book available now at proximitypays.com.

Yeah, I usually say start with creating some social media themes. So generally what this is, is kind of like 5 to 7 themes that people can pick and they talk about that consistently throughout the year. So it might be one theme might be education. So for me, for the brand photography brand, the small business photographer, I might talk about why you need brand photography. I might talk about what to wear. I might talk about how to choose locations and what kind of poses you might want to do. So that's the education piece. And then I talk about that throughout the year. Then I might also have testimonials in there. That'd be another theme. So I want to make sure I'm posting those. The personal brand, I think, is really important as we talked about that familiarity, but also because of AI. One way to actually stand out is to show your face because there's so much AI stuff out there that if you can stand out, you know, by showing your face and helping people get to know you, that can really help you with the marketing. So personal brand, I highly recommend having that as one of the themes. Um, and you can have another one like behind the scenes stuff of what it's like to work with you and then your offers. That's another good theme to have. So what kind of things are you offering? I just ran a one-day mini session day where people could come for these short little sessions. And so I had a whole bunch of content around that for about 6 weeks. So you can have different themes around that as well, the offers that you have. And that way you're, you're directing people towards something like working with you, an event, or even just downloading your free resource, getting them onto your email list. But you have a strategy behind the post. You're not just posting randomly. I think that's one of the biggest mistakes people make is they just post randomly and kind of hope it's going to work.

I think I'm reading, I'm not, this is actually even helpful. It sounds so simple, but I'm sitting here saying, I just wrote these down. And to me, there's a 6th one, which I'm going to ask you about. I was wondering because I hear a lot about it. It's really just behind the scenes business, but there's the behind the scenes personal, the personal side of the individual. Family and lifestyle. Is that important as a theme? Do you recommend?

I think it really depends on the person. I think people do like to get to know you, but it's up to you as to what you want to share. So for me, I share things like my love of flowers. Like I'll post on my stories, for example, when I'm out in the gardens, just taking pictures and going for walks and, you know, the nature stuff, or when I'm at a festival or so just like things to help people know what I like. And people will comment, they'll like reach out and be like, oh, I've been to that festival too. I loved it. And then, oh, I love those candlelit concerts. So I post that kind of stuff on my social media, more on stories on Instagram. Those are the ones that are only lasting for 24 hours. You don't have to think of a caption or anything. You just like pop it on there. But other people will actually put, you know, images of their family and things like that. So it really depends on the person how much you wanna show from your personal life. I think stories are good too though. I did one that actually is kind of a metaphor for, or an analogy for social media, and that was how I fell off my horse Ernie when I was a kid. And then the whole falling off the horse, the fear of getting back on. I need to get back up on right away. I have a whole story around it. And it basically is like falling off social media and then people are afraid to get back up on the social media horse. And so it's a weird little story, but people remember it.

Yeah.

They'll be like, oh yeah, I remember that Ernie story. And I'll be like, oh yeah. So it can connect. The stories can really connect people too. So if you have some story posts and those things like that, you can bring that in, things from your childhood and you can bring it in and don't just randomly talk about it necessarily, but tie it to what you're doing. Like, is there a reason that you brought that up and does it tie to what you're doing?

Yeah, this is really helpful for me. I'll tell you what's resonating with me. I mean, I think, and again, it sounds so simple and maybe I'm just the idiot out there, which is very possible. Most likely it's just the, uh, strategy and the themes. Like, I mean, I'm the exact example of what you just said. I'm literally like, I went to Claude and it knows Speakeasy, knows me. I'm like, hey, can you just gimme, um, 90 topics, bullets only of things that I could talk about? First I had somebody doing scripts for me and I'm just reading 'em and I'm like, anybody that's been following my reels, like for a while, like you could see me kind of reading and I'm doing scripts and I'm like, not even thinking. I'm just doing what they tell me to do.

do.

And it's okay. And I'm like, okay, this is all right, but now I gotta really get into this and do it right. So now I'm much better. Just like, gimme a topic. How to grow your social media following. What are you doing? Okay, so here's something. And then I could just, a lot easier. It just feels more natural to go that route.

Sure.

But what I'm not doing, which is what you just said, which I love, is like, literally, I think this week I told Claude to gimme 90 bullets of topics I could just riff on and I could just pick one today. And I was just going to literally post a reel every day because I've been posting every day, which is another question I'm going to ask you in And I've been posting, but it's just a lot of it's around networking and the power of community and masterminding. And I've started to talk about some, some of my experiences in life and business, but there's no structure. I'm not sitting here saying, okay, Monday's education, Tuesday's a testimonial, you know, Wednesday is a personal, you know, branding, you know, personal branding thing or behind the scenes. I'm just going riffraff. So thank you for that. I think this makes more sense to go that route, to have more, more structure on that. And I bet a lot of us are in a similar situation where I have Speakeasy And then I have Eric Berman, right? Speakeasy's posting often, like 3, 4 times. It's like this podcast we're doing now. It's going to be posted on Speakeasy as a reel. And then it asked Eric to collaborate. So I guess now that's going on my reel too. And then I'm competing with that versus the other stuff I'm posting. And so Eric's posting, Speakeasy posting. I don't know what's supposed to follow the script, what's not. It's a little bit confusing to me. And then there's the frequency question. I'm literally hitting LinkedIn, I think 5 days a week and Instagram reels Almost 5 days a week.

Awesome.

That was a mouthful. So what am I doing right, wrong? I'd love to get some guidance there. And I don't mean this to be an Eric session, but I think there's probably a lot in a similar situation.

Yeah. Both myself and other students have a lot of brands too. They have more than one brand. So it's always a question of what do I do if I have more than one service?

Yeah.

And I have more than one brand. So generally I recommend if this, if you have multiple services, for example, let's just take, you know, me, for example, with the brand photography and the social media, I found when it was all under one, it was a bit challenging because I'd be posting about social media media, but then I'm also trying to get brand photography clients. And then I wasn't putting enough time on either of those things. And so the workshops and the mini sessions, so I ended up splitting the brands. So I have 2 different accounts and there is some cross-collaboration. So if I do a talking head one about confidence in front of the camera, that applies to both brands. So I will put it on both brands. But if I'm talking about social media strategies, I'm no longer putting that on the Small Business Photographer. And if I'm doing a whole bunch of photography, I won't put as much of that on on Visible by Design. Now, both of my accounts are still similar. Like Visible by Design is all about visibility and photography is a component of that, but I don't want the entire account to be all about photography. You know, I wanna still talk about systems and strategies and things like that too. So I would suggest kind of looking at both of them and having a strategy for both of them. Like what is the purpose of your account? Like, is it more the personal brand to help people get to know you or is it something else you're selling?

Yeah, I was gonna go back to ask you first, you have your Lindsay Sullivan personal Instagram, So that's more personal, like the flowers, your love for photography, that would go more on your personal.

Actually, no, I've got 2, both are business. Okay. One is the Small Business Photographer. It's all for the brand photography side of things.

Okay.

And then Visible by Design is the social media courses and the education. And I have other courses on how to take your own photos. So it's the education side of my business essentially. And the flower photos, that's just personal brand. And I'm putting that on both cuz people get to see who I am, the person behind the camera. And so, you know, the person behind the brand. So they'll know that Lindsay's obsessed with macro photography, you know, and then other people who love photography. I just was on a podcast with someone, we were chatting, she's like, I love macro photography. So we went and did macro photography together, you know? So it was like a connecting point, right? Because people are like, oh, I love that. Or I love gardening. Or I also went to that concert. So that personal brand stuff, that can be on the business brands too, because it helps people get to know the person behind the brand. Mm-hmm.

This is helpful. So those are, those are both your different companies you have, but what about your personal IG?

I don't have one.

Oh, you don't even have one? Okay. So that's helpful.

I don't have one. And I mean, maybe you could build one if you wanted to, but I just have, I mean, LinkedIn is the exception. I have LinkedIn as my, I don't have the business profiles for that one. I stick currently to like my main LinkedIn, but I don't have a personal one for Instagram. I just have the 2 business ones.

Got it. Got it. Okay. So back to your question. And again, I'm saying this with the understanding, I know there's a lot of people in the same boat as me because, you know, a lot of our members and a lot of our listeners are probably out there as potential experts, coaches, thought leaders, and they also have brands behind them and they're struggling to figure out what do they post where.

Yeah.

You know, my hallucination is that, you know, Eric Berman posting his, you know, meant to be more of a thought leader expert in the world of building masterminds and community and trying to understand the the pros and cons. And I have a book, like all related to the concepts that I'm teaching. And then, oh, by the way, there happens to be a great mastermind that I believe in. If you're looking for a good mastermind called Speakeasy, and I talk about others as well throughout my different posts. So that's the purpose behind that. And then I have some fun lifestyle things I'll show in there and I'll, I'll bring that in. And then Speakeasy, of course, is being very much more specific about, hey, check out this great meeting that just happened. And thanks to Lindsay Sullivan's amazing picture she took, or here's a podcast we did, or here's a recap of last month's virtual event we just did. Does that make any sense? Is that the right direction?

So I don't think there's any wrong or right answer there. I think you can have your, your Eric account that has all of that stuff and the thought leadership, but I think it, for people who don't know that you have that account and they just following Speakeasy, I think it'd be nice to know a bit about Eric. Why are masterminds important? Why is community important? You know, because it's not, when you start to talk about that kind of stuff, people are like, oh, that's why I should join Speakeasy. Not just because it looks fun, but like, Like there's reason behind the masterminding. Here's what masterminding is. I've had people ask me what masterminds even are when I tell 'em I'm going to this mastermind group. So I think part of it is that education around that. So that stuff could also go on your Speakeasy account to help educate around that. But if you still want your separate account with more personal stuff that you're sharing, you can definitely do that. But it's totally, totally up to you. I don't think there's one right or wrong answer there. Like you could have one account or you could have two.

If I'm doing a reel to Eric Berman and I add Speakeasy Collaborator, which accepts Is that achieving the same objective? What you just said?

It is. Yeah.

Okay. So that is one way of sort of hitting that. Yeah.

For anybody who doesn't know, um, who's listening, Instagram does have a really cool feature now where you can actually collaborate. And if I do a post for the Small Business Photographer and I put Visible by Design as the collaborator, it then gets sent to Visible by Design and I have the option to accept it. If I accept it, it goes onto my feed. And so you can actually get double the reach because if you have followers on Visible by Design, they're seeing it. Followers on the Small Business Photographer are seeing it too. So yes, that's the easiest thing to do is to just do the collaborator feature for Instagram so that you've got it going to both accounts.

Okay. So I'm doing some things then probably accidentally somewhat right. Or I do have a team that's guiding me.

You're great.

But I think you've given me some really good guidance on really the structure I think needs to be a lot better. And I think that's really helpful. Back to frequency, you know, for those listening, You got a new client. You got them to believe in the importance of visibility, even though they feel like maybe they're not ready yet. Maybe they don't like the way they look yet. And you're saying, nope, I don't care. You gotta get started.

Okay.

I'm convinced now. I got my website up. How often should I be posting? Is there a formula that you recommend?

So I'm a little bit different from some of the social media gurus out there. I tend to say it depends on you because there's a couple different things that come into it. The platform, if you're on X, X lately, they say it's about 3 to 4 times a day you need to be posting on X, whereas Instagram's around 2 to 5 days a week. So part of it is what is your bandwidth? Do you have the bandwidth to do 3 or 4 posts a day? Then okay, X might work for you, but if you don't, don't pick X. It also depends on your goals. You know, if you wanna be a massive influencer, then you're probably gonna have to post twice a day on Instagram. But if you wanna just be top of mind, like I, I like to be top of mind with my business. And so what I've found I meet people at networking events, follow each other on social media, and then 3 years later they'll reach out and be like, I'm ready for a photo shoot, but I don't remember them because they haven't liked my post. They haven't engaged, but they've been following. So I think that's part of it is just knowing that me even just posting twice a week for the business photographer side is enough to achieve the goal of staying top of mind as well as to educate on what I do and show myself as an expert and show my portfolio. So my goals for that one potentially are not as big as maybe, you know, a different brand that really wants to be that influencer and make money from being a brand that has affiliates and all of those kinds of things, you know, on social media. It's gonna be a different marketing strategy depending on what you're doing. So I would say it depends on you and also what you can do that's consistent. Because if you are like, yeah, I need to post daily and you post daily for 2 weeks and then you drop off for another 3 weeks.

Yeah. Yeah.

That's not gonna be great. Whereas if you were posting twice a week consistently, that would be better. And then I often tell my students too, to have 2 posting frequencies. So there's the minimum that you're agreeing to do regardless, even if you're on vacation, maybe that's twice a week, but then maybe ideally you post 5 days a week and that's what you're aiming for and that's what you're building your systems for. But when things get busy, you're still meeting your minimum and you're not feeling guilty about not having done every day. Okay.

I got 2 follow-ups to that. Well, first of all, you mentioned a couple of platforms and IG obviously covers Facebook because they could just go on both LinkedIn, TikTok, YouTube. I mean, what's your sense over there?

Yeah. So the most recent from what I've been reading is posting about 2 to 5 times a week on LinkedIn is really good. More, if you can post a little bit more than that's great, but 2 to 5 times is good. The benefit to LinkedIn is you don't always have to do the posting. So with LinkedIn, you can find someone's post that would resonate with your audience. So maybe for me, it might be a stylist that I work with who's talking about confidence in the clothing and how wearing something can make you feel more confident. That's going to be something my audience finds useful. So I'm going to share that post with a little comment at the top. I'll put my thoughts on it, but it's really her post. And so she's getting more exposure, but then I'm also not having to create a post about that. I'm just sharing it. So you can also Do that as well. And that counts with LinkedIn. So that's one of the reasons I like LinkedIn. TikTok, I don't know as much about TikTok, so I can't really speak to that one. I just post on that one automatically because I'm doing Instagram. It just automatically goes there.

Nice. Okay. And then the magic question of patience. I know you get your clients all the time. Okay, Coach Lindsay, I've done the things already. I look good. I've done what you said. I'm posting 5 days a week, Lindsay. Aren't you proud of me? I'm doing things you say. Hey, my followers, oh, I'm getting like 50 views. Is that good? Like, what are the metrics? Like, what is the timeframe? And I know it's a different answer from everybody, but, uh, how do you keep your clients and students patient and not giving up? What's the expectations you give them?

Yeah, I tell them it can take some time to grow, but also a lot of the effect they're not seeing. It's kind of like the iceberg where you see a little bit on top, but then you don't see the big part of the iceberg underneath. Um, it's that consistency showing up and building, reminding people that you exist, that familiarity so that when they are ready 3 years later, You're the one they think of and they don't even bother price shopping because they're like, no, I know Lindsay's the photographer. I've been wanting to work with her for a couple years. I'm finally ready. I'm gonna reach out because I just saw that post. So part of it is like knowing it's not necessarily gonna lead to an immediate sale. It can. I've had posts that people sign up for my masterclass and then they sign up for the workshop from based on one post. But a lot of times it's putting in the work and having that consistency and knowing that people are still seeing things. And even if they don't comment on it, Doesn't mean they're not seeing it. People will still come up to me all the time at events and be like, oh, I saw this post about this. Like, you didn't like it though. They're like, oh no, I loved it. You're like, okay.

Is there a metric to see like, hey, is it looking at, let's say on Instagram, is it just the views? Like, hey, you should check back and maybe every 3 months you'll notice that the views are going up. That's progress and be patient. It's a 3, 4, 5 year plan if you wanna keep doing it. Is that realistic?

I do like to tend to look at the patterns. So yeah, look at the reach and because you also wanna look at a couple different things. So you're not just looking at Is your reach and your comments and those kinds of things, is that growing? Because that's good to see a pattern of that growing, but then you can also experiment a bit. One of my friends is a marketing person and she did an experiment where she posted one month doing more posts on LinkedIn. And the second month she posted less, but she engaged more in other people's posts. Can you guess which month did better with engagement on her posts and reach?

When she engaged in everybody else's stuff.

Exactly. So, you can do some experiments and see, and you're only going to know the results if you're tracking. So, usually tracking things like like, you know, the reach for sure and engagement. So are people commenting? Are they reaching out in DMs? And sometimes you don't see them actually purchasing. So like the person who signed up for my masterclass, she commented that she signed up and then, so I knew she was coming to it, or you might recognize them in the workshops. You can look to see if you're getting clients from it, but I often find it's a combination of things. So it's not just social media, it's the fact you met them at an event and then you're staying top of mind now with the social media so that when they're ready, they reach out. So, so you can look at a combination of things. Sorry, it's not like an exact black and white answer. It's like—

By the way, you just dropped There's a secret nugget in there, Lindsay. I don't think you caught that at all. It was, uh, you know, one tip could be, uh, just engaging in other people's stuff more. Uh, that helps with your reach. I didn't know that. So that's good to know. I need to get out there and interact more.

Absolutely. And it applies to Instagram as well. I can't say for sure about TikTok and some of the other platforms, but for sure for Instagram and for LinkedIn, especially the more you comment and engage with other people, the more your stuff's going to be seen and your stuff's going to be seen by the people you engage on too. So if there's people you want to see your stuff in particular that you want to stay top of mind with, then make sure you're engaging with their content too, not just to support them, 'cause that's really important, but also you're gonna stay top of mind as well. Love it.

Okay. You talked a little bit about your masterclass and a couple other things. So, you know, if I'm a listener here, I'd be pretty interested in maybe wanting to work with you. Tell me a little bit about your program. What do you offer? How do you help people?

Yeah, I have a 3-day workshop and it's an implementation workshop. So it's one of those ones where you don't just learn the info, but you're actually going to implement. So you're gonna create your 30-day content calendar, your social media pillars, and you're gonna actually start learning the AI tools and other tools you can use to speed things up, because that's also part of what keeps people from being consistent is they don't have time. It takes up too much time. So how do we streamline it? How do we put a system in place so you can keep going? So they actually implement that. And then I also cover some stuff about confidence in front of the camera and stuff like that so that they can feel more confident with that. Because sometimes I'll notice that they're getting a little bit nervous, you know, as I'm like, yeah, you gotta be visible, blah, blah, blah. And then they're like, okay, now that you need to be visible, let's talk about what holds holds you back from being visible, the things that keep you from hitting post and things like that. Even if it's not you in the picture, even if it's just the post itself, you know, what's stopping you from hitting post or what's causing some of the procrastination? It might not actually be that you don't have time. It might be something else holding you back. So that's what we cover in the 3-day workshop.

3-day workshops. Love it.

Cool.

What are your, some of your favorite go-to AI tools these days as they continue to evolve?

Yeah, I mean, I have other courses I was teaching before this on AI image generation, so I soft spot for Midjourney AI because I created some really cool images with that. And you can also refresh some of your existing brand photos too. So I like that one. ChatGPT, I really like that one too. I know a lot of people use that one or they prefer Claude, but ChatGPT I find is really good for the social media ideas and the captions and the hooks and all of those kinds of things. And it's actually getting better with image generation as well.

Yeah, it is.

So those are 2 that I really like as well.

Wonderful. Wonderful. Was there any questions that I didn't ask that you wish I had or what topic we should have covered that we missed?

That's a good question. Maybe just like around some of the mindset stuff, people will sometimes hold back because they think they have to be perfect. And so I just want to, you know, let everybody know you don't have to be perfect. Just think of whether your content's going to improve someone's life or help them in some way or lead to them working with you so you can help them and then realize it doesn't have to be perfect. You know, they can still get a lot of value out of it. I know when I first started doing videos, I was terrible with Instagram. Like, I, you could just see me shaking, you know, it was so bad, but people still reached out and said they were inspired. So just remember that, you know, your content, even if it's not perfect, it's better to be out there and, you know, be inspiring people and getting them to work with you than it is for it to be perfect and sitting in your drafts.

Be real. No, I love it. It's funny, you just again said something that resonated with me and my wife and her her not necessarily being a typical entrepreneur mindset. And it's just like the delay. And I keep saying, look, do you realize the longer you wait, the longer you're taking to make people's lives better in what you do? Because every person you interact with, you're improving their life. You're giving them more confidence. She's a skin concierge. So it's kind of like every time you talk to somebody, I'm like, you're not serving all these people with the gifts that you have to help others because—

Yeah.

Like, it always gets her going when I say, shoot, you're right. All right, let's go. Thank you so much for coming in today and really sharing amazing nuggets and words of wisdom and all the gems you have and continued success in everything you're doing. Sounds fantastic.

Awesome. Thank you so much for having me.

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