Cutting Through the Fluff | LeadingLane Podcast | Ep 85

Absolutely. I think all great things. All things to be able to really, you know, just have in your back pocket and making sure that you're playing the cards correctly and making sure that you are stacking to be working in your client's favor, whichever side, if that's the buyer or seller side. But. And it's also, I think, protecting your sanity. Right, like the more that you do up front. Yeah, it's a little bit extra leg work, but you're protecting your sanity and being able to keep deals together, knowing what you're walking into, being, being prepared. And it's factual information versus these BS fluffy stories that we're telling in our brain.

Welcome to the Leading Lane podcast for Real Estate Pros by Real Estate Pros with your hosts, Ashley Frederick and Stephen Burch. If you're looking for an honest, authentic and raw perspective, you found it.

Welcome back to the Leading Lane podcast. We are excited to have you here today. And today we're going to explore kind of cutting through the fluff, if you will. And I think it can be when you're, you know, in a buyer presentation and a listing presentation, I think for sure, when you're in the middle of negotiations. What kind of that fluff or.

I.

Don'T know if there's another word that you have for it besides fluff, but. Okay, there's that. Yep. Thank you. If we can cut through all of that, you know, one maybe like what the fluff does that we're not expecting it to do, that can lead to problems down the road. But secondly, maybe how you cut through that fluff to make sure it is received. Well, you know, I had a we can talk about two out of phone call this morning, an upset seller. And I just got straight to the point. There was no going around it and short phone call and everything was fine. And he ended up, you know, leaving the phone laughing, which is what we're looking for. So tell me on the. On the list side, Stephen, like, what is something that you noticed that maybe other agents do as far as fluff and what you try to do as far as cutting through the.

Yeah, so I think it's like the, you know, this conversation, this topic stemmed from, because I went to my first listing appointment in four or five years, I won it. So just make sure that that is noted there. But, you know, preparing for. Yeah, no doubt. But, you know, preparing for the listing. I think when agents prepare for that and being in those shoes, again, really what was happening is like I was almost over preparing. It was almost over complicating the entire situation of I need to know this. I need to know that you're not going in there to know everything about the property or to know every single thing about all aspects of the market, the comparables and everything else. In my opinion, that listing appointment, you know, cutting through the fluff is to be able to meet the person to see if you're a good fit for one another, if the property is something that you're going to take onto your portfolio, and then be able to see what kind of questions the person has to answer. This is like your discovery. This is your research time, in my opinion. So I think people put so much, almost too much thought into what goes into the listing appointment in that aspect. So, you know, for me, for this appointment, the seller showed up and really, like, I had my presentation, I had the cma, I had all the documents ready for her to sign. I didn't know which direction that she was going to want to go or what direction I wanted to go, but I wanted to be prepared for those, you know, any pivot that might happen. But also don't want to go in there and do step one. Let me read page one. Step two. You know, like, that's just not my style. So really, as you know, we looked through the property, she was giving me the highlights, and I. In that time, I think that's where you start to learn about the seller, this person on the other side, what is their personality like, you know, this profile or these different things. And really, when we got to the actual my time to talk about the process, I just opened up with, you know, what are your main concerns first? And then let's go from there, because I don't want to sit here. I could tell by her personality she didn't want to be sold to. She wasn't here, you know, to know it all in real estate. She really is asking for my professional opinion. And so when we got through that, I basically asked her, I said, okay, now we can go two. Two different directions. I can go line by line with you, or I can give you the highlights. And no BS approach. Which way would you prefer? And I gave her the option. She was like, I'm a no BS person. Great. We're gonna get along just fine. So I think it's just over complicating it, Telling us ourselves these BS stories, and we work ourselves up over something that probably we don't even need to work up whatsoever.

Yeah, I think you make a good point, too. As far as bringing everything with you. I learned that lesson very early on, like, thought that I was just going to give, like, the listing presentation is what I call it, where I go over the pricing with them and then just thought, like, they were going to think about it, and then they get back to me. And then. So one time I did that and I didn't bring anything else with me, and they're like, okay, so where do we sign? I was like, So a lot of times I just. I bring the whole entire packet with me, regardless if that's what we're doing or not. But I would say, like, nine times out of ten, I'll be like, did you want to sign today? You want me to come back? Oh, let's sign today. You're here. Let's get it over with.

Yeah. You know, back in the day, I used to take the lockbox with me. I would take the sign with me. I would have every thing with me, and I would make it to where, like, it was my challenge to myself. Like, I don't want to take that sign back out of my truck. I'm going to put that sign in the yard and make sure that, you know, I'm going to get the listing. So my motivating. Motivating factor to be able to. To get everything in there or if I didn't win the listing, I mean, there's a handful of them, but brought it back and everybody knew I didn't win it. And it was kind of that, like, what could I have done better mentality. So. But yeah, so, I mean, how do you. How do you go through those tough conversations? Cutting through, you know, the fluff, no bs, straight to the point. Like, how do you do it? I know that's such a random, wide open question, but I get asked that all the time. Like, how are you so direct?

Yeah, I think it's really paying attention to people. Right? So, like, you're right, too. A lot of people, when I go to their house, they'll ask if I want to sit down first. And I. I normally say no because, like, what, we're going to sit down and then we're talking about something that I have no idea of what we're doing. So I. To do the tour of the house first because you really get to get their personality. And I think that, like, they almost lead themselves into certain things, like, well, we're not going to need this because we're going to downsize and we're not going to do this, and I don't want to make this repair because we're right. So you get to learn about them. So I think like the way you cut through it is just, it doesn't have to be short with them. Right. Like you can still be direct and I can, it can be lengthy if you will. But I think it's just a matter of they called you for a specific reason. Let's keep that in mind and let's get to that specific reason. Now that's not to say a lot of times we get through all the paperwork and then I think we were talking about this, we were talking about a topic and now I remembered one of them was listing appointments as far as the, the fluff. So a lot of times I save that for the end. So I have done my job, I've gotten through all of the, the documents, questions, etc, and I think by doing that right, it's just we're trying to get to these bullet points. So I'm making sure that, you know, maybe time, a lot of times I'll prep the seller. So we're gonna take a tour of the house and then I'm gonna sit down with you, I'm gonna ask you a variance of questions. And I also think that when you prepare them ahead of time with how long you're going to be there. So I normally tell people like for a pre listing appointment, it's probably going to be like a half hour. Depends on if we've ever met before, if I've been in your house before. So I think that that also keeps them on track. Like if I've been there for 15 minutes already, they maybe realize like we're taking this a little bit longer than we need to or if it's an actual like listing appointment, we're going to do all of the listing. We've come back with the cma like an hour is what I tell people, right? So same thing, I'm trying to prep them with how long they think it should take, but also telling them what we're going to do. So we're going to go over this, we're going to sign this, you're going to fill this out. So I don't think that any of that has to be like direct. It's just, or harsh. It's just being clear, right? So these are the expectations of the next hour that we're going to spend together. But you know, I think it's also being confident in yourself and in the market because they do ask the questions about the market. And I would hate to tell someone, I think you'll get an offer in a week and it's five weeks from now, right. So although I think a lot of agents just tell sellers what they want to hear, I always think that that backfires when it doesn't come to fruition. So I always tell people, right, like it could sell tomorrow, it could sell three months from now, but there are things that we can do as far as pricing, right? And that's a no, no BS conversation to have either, right? Like you want to price $20,000 more of what I told you to. Like we, there is a very distinct concern of mine that we may sit on the market for longer because I don't think we're in the right ballpark. And I think a lot of people are afraid to have that discussion with sellers. I think they think that they're going to lose the listing if they don't just agree to whatever the seller's prices. And I kindly remind them that this is what I do all day, every day. Been in and out of thousands of homes. And this is what I think your best bet is. You know, at the end of the day, it's your decision to make. But you hired me to come here to make those decisions for you. And so I think you kind of have to give this back and forth balance so that they do see you as the professional and the expert so that then there isn't all the fluff. It's just these are what my suggestions are to you. These are the expectations, this is how we handle moving forward.

And I think that, you know, bringing analogies, real life scenarios to that seller, that other person, you know, like, would you tell your, your doctor, right, like what you, like what's wrong with you or how things should be going. No, right. Like you're going to give, you know, what you're wanting or your symptoms or whatever else. And you know, your, the goal here is the doctor to tell you what's up and how to be able to treat whatever is going on. And it's the same concept. And when you put it in that realization for them to be able to say, look, like I, I'm giving my suggestions, it's your choice. Just as the doctor's going to give their suggestions, it's your choice to fulfill those or not. But when you say it like that, they're like, oh, okay, like, and same thing with like the compensation discussion. When you go hire an attorney, you pay for your attorney, correct? Yeah. Okay. And then the other person that you're suing or whatever's happening, they're going to pay for their attorney, correct? Yeah. Same concept here. Okay, that makes sense. So I think it's putting it in real life scenarios. And again, it's not overselling it. It's not. I think that, you know, trying to come up with a perfect elevator pitch on everything. We're people, we're humans. There's no perfect elevator pitch. There's conversations and connections and figuring out their. The motivating factors. That is it.

And, you know, I think it's funny too. Go ahead.

No, you're good.

I was gonna say, like, you know, like, obviously, do you spend a lot of time on it ahead of time? I have found that, like, because sometimes pricing is so strange. Right. There are some houses that just. They're on their own little island. Right. And so, like, you just. You. I will run like three different CMAs, and I'll question myself, and I'll question myself and I'll be like, ugh, like, what about this? What about that? And you go back and you go back and you back. And then you're like, I'm just gonna go with my gut. And then you go there and you're there for like, you know, 10 minutes. And then you're like, oh, I wonder how this is gonna go. You search for the numbers and they're like, oh, it's perfect. It's literally in line with what we were thinking. And you're like, should have just listened to my got from the beginning. Right? So I think it's funny, like, I try to just like, I think that's the other piece of this is if you really get to know your market, if you're really in and out of these homes on a regular basis, like, that's so. So key in listing presentations. Like, I've been in this house. It was in pristine condition. You know, that had another. It had a full finished basement. Yours doesn't have a full finished basement. Or like, hey, these pictures look great, but I was in it and it smells like cat pee and whatever else. Right? Like, that's gonna. So when you can have those and tie those back to your cma, like, I think that it proves to a seller, like, they. They have done their homework. Right? So. Right. I think being confident and having those conversations and being confident and knowing the market and like, for a brand agent, that's one of the easiest ways to get to know your market is showing these properties. If your area offers tour, like, go on tour, go and look at these homes. If. If they don't, if they have open houses, stop at open houses. So you can really get an idea of what these homes look like and what they're selling. Watch them. I just watched, you know, a neighborhood that's been really busy and two of the houses just sold for $25,000 less than asking. Well, guess what? I took that into account. I had been there at another listing, you know, 30 days ago and I told him, well, my numbers changed and that's not common to have to change in a 30 day time frame. But I was like, these two properties sold for less than what we had intended and there's more house than yours. Like we're gonna have to adjust. Right. And he didn't question it. He's like, well and the numbers speak for themselves. I trust your judgment. So you have to be keen on what's selling, what's what came on in the last three weeks. You just have to be very, very in tune and that's how people really start to trust you.

Yeah. And you know, I think it's, and I think because the market is shifting and is so different and you know, the, the property that I went and just listed, it sits on a few acres and which is very well sought after. Right, right now. And so we have a, a, like an approach on this of, you know, we're not in a huge rush and I'm fine with putting a little bit higher than what I'm suggesting. But what we're going to do is I'm going to put a plan in play in the listing contract that every week that we're going to do small price reductions to until we start seeing an increase in traffic. And so like when I laid that plan out, they were like, this is an estate deal. So everybody was like, oh my God, this is, this is so smart so that we don't have to come together. And what does this look like? What does that look like? We already know. And I told them, I mean very bluntly, look like I'm trying to get the maximum dollar for you. Like of course it's the bottom line for you on the profits. But I also want to make sure that you understand and realize that my compensation is based off of a percentage which is based off of the price. So as much as I am protecting your bottom dollar, I'm protecting my bottom dollar as well. But my goal is not to just establish sign and let it sit there. I'm making sure that we're actually selling a property and getting it gone. And so I think that when I put that approach out there, like you could just see like this weight of relief off their shoulders, like oh, okay. Thank you. Because they don't. They, they. They don't know what the market's going to do. We don't know how this is all going to go. And it's a unique situation, so I'm not afraid to try. But also I'm not just going to let it sit there and be stagnant and stale.

Yeah. And I think you make a good point as far as, like the current market, like, we have to have those discussions with our sellers. Right. So I think that a lot of people are afraid to have those discussions just because no one knows what the future holds. Right. But I think it's only fair for you to have this seller. Discussions about things are a little strange. Depends on price point, it depends on market conditions, but also like, interest rates haven't moved like we thought they were going to move. So some buyers are, you know, on the fence right now, or some people have lost jobs. Right. So I think that you just have to be really in tune. And I always tell people, like, something could happen tomorrow. I mean, there could be a natural disaster tomorrow that could affect everything. You know, there could be a Covid. Right. Like, we don't know those things. So all we can do is work the knowledge we have. But I think prepping them with the fact of we might have to make a very strategic change in the next two weeks if something comes up that we weren't expecting or another property comes on, that price is better than we were.

Yeah. And you know, something funny, like, just in listening, you say that, like, strategic, that's a great word. And I don't think a lot of agents look at what they're doing is truly coming with a strategic plan. And how you choose to, or what vocabulary, what type of vocabulary you are using shows that confidence. And I think if you're going into listing appointment, talking about strategy and talking about pivoting with the market and these different types of things, of putting yourself different than your competitor. And it's just simple verbiage that you can start, you know, changing out. That makes you sound like you are on top of your shit and it plays volumes. And it's just your approach on how you are delivering these things now. And I think it's way more. It's received way better than it is for somebody that's in there and stumbling around and doesn't have their, their shit together and doesn't have the, you know, the structure of the conversation of how this outline is going to go for the day and et cetera, et cetera. So it's just working on yourself and not over complicating it. Just improving how you're speaking and delivering your message and communication.

Yeah. So let's shift gears a little bit and talk about that on maybe the buy side. So I think that that's a really good example of where fluff gets put in, because it's the new shiny. Like, this is super exciting. I'm gonna buy my first house, which is great. I love all of that. But I think that sometimes that fluff can get in the way. So even, like what I found with people is like, if a house is extremely, like, staged well, or the decoration, like, looks like a magazine, that people get lost on the decorations and, like, they want to move into the house because the decorations. Right. So how do you try to, like, reel buyers back as far as the fluff of, like, homes and what they're offering or what they should be asking for and the inspections, those types of things?

Well, I think it starts from that initial buyer consult. Right. Like, it's making sure that you understand truly what their needs and what their wants are. And when they start veering away from those types of things, then it's saying, hey, like, you know, when we first, you know, bring them back to that conversation. When we first met, you said this, and this house is not checking those boxes. What changed? I'm trying to understand. Make me understand. And I think it's the more that you can get them to talk it, they typically start speaking it to truth. And they're like, oh, okay. Like, I see where you're going with this. So I think it's more so just structuring how you are asking the questions for them. And then I think the other thing here too is like, I always tell people, like, when you're in the house and you know, you can to me, when they start placing furniture or their own furniture in there, and like, this is where the couch is going to go, this is where the TV is going to go. It's pretty well known that they're going to be moving forward with it. But when, you know there's a house that was staged that I was like, I mean, it was great stage, but what's the reason why, like, that's like behind the. The lipstick on the pig and. And see what's going on. And so when I was like, okay, I want you to visualize all of this stuff off the walls. The furniture is not here. Like, what do you see? And then, you know, it takes them a little bit because I think that's kind of just a, a wild question. But when I ask them, what do you see? They start then seeing some of these other things. Like, oh my God, you're right. Look at the, like the defects on the walls and look at this. Like, yeah, there's a reason why sometimes there's in my opinion, why we have, you know, they staged the homes because they're trying to maybe showcase something different and get you to, you know, to the smoke and mirror game. And I think once you start putting in that position and make them see and visualize it, they already know it's the pretty is no longer there. So I don't know if I answered the question properly for you, but.

So, I mean, like, I do think that the, I mean we can talk about the buyer consult like a thousand times. And I still, still know that there are a very large population of agents that don't do that. They're still just meeting them at properties which again, like, I think it works for like once or twice. But I feel like you're not doing the buyer justice by not having some type of sit down with them. You know, I'm still pretty much like, don't get me wrong, I do a lot of docusign, a lot of, you know, electronic signatures. But even like last week it was his first time. Home buyers, like, I, like, they deserve a sit down. They deserve a sit down. They deserve and I, you know, explanations of what happens if you default. Right. Like, I'd hate to have something happen and then we didn't have that discussion. So I think that, you know, I was talking to someone yesterday about if AI will replace real estate agents. And I firmly believe that they will not. And I do, I think that they will help us in things that we're doing, like paperwork wise day to day activity, social media. Sure. But that human connection of like giving the examples or like this is why you have an inspection because the seller probably hasn't been in the attic in seven years and there might be mold. Right. Like having the real life or being able to watch a buyer's face, you know, you'll see that maybe you said something and they kind of look at each other. So then I'll kind of go back and be like, all right, what, what did you not catch there? What did you, what, what are you scared about? What, what were we not? Right? So I think that's where that like fluff part comes in is there is all this excitement of buying a house, but there are so many details that someone needs to have ironed out for them. And that's really your role as our agent is to cut through all of the houses stage. Great. You know, looks fantastic. I love the colors. Okay, great. But like can you afford the monthly payment? Do you have enough money for earnest money? Like do you have enough funds to pay for an inspection? And what happens in your first year if the furnace goes out? Like who. That's where I feel like we're having those discussions with people as we're trying to prevent them from having those hiccups on the road.

Right. It's starting the negotiation with your client first. I think that's huge. To be able to make sure that you reduce any of those hurdles that you possibly can. Because we already know in the real estate transaction there's going to be other hurdles that we don't foresee whatsoever. The knowns get them up front and you know the. I had somebody who went a newer agent. Like when I was telling them, you know, all these different things what they should be doing at the consult, they were like, well what happens if they decide not to buy? Well then I did my job, right? Like I did my job if they decide not to buy because they didn't have enough funds or they didn't have earnest money or you know, the fear of having to be a homeowner of, you know, what happens if the water heater goes out? You know, there's so many different things that are into play with this that a lot of people don't realize. And I don't think that I would be doing anybody justice if I'm just sitting here trying to close deals and not educating them because then I'm going to put them in a position. And I know that I can't have that on my conscious whatsoever knowing that I put somebody in there and they are not able to afford or prepared for what true homeownership entails.

Well, and I really think that those are where you're like tried and true customers come from is when you've had to have those frank conversations. I'll never forget a, a good client of mine and he was. We had an offer on a house and it had like the. One of the worst home inspections I've ever seen. Like you name it, it was wrong. And I remember thinking like, I wouldn't touch that house with a ten foot pole. And so he came in and like there was just like a sheer panic looked on his face. And I just remember being like, you don't look well. And he's like, I like the thought of like, buying this, like, makes me sick. And I'm, I have to buy it and I'm tied to it. And I was like, what do you mean you have to buy it? And he's like, well, I mean, that's, that's what happens. You just have to buy it. And I was like, no, no, no, no. We have options, right? And so you could see, like, some of that worry, like, washed away and in fact, did not buy that house and bought a very nice house, you know, a couple months later. And I remember he just always says to me, like, oh, my God, I'm so glad that you gave me the options and that I, I wasn't forced to buy that, you know. So I think that, you know, they, they don't know better unless we explain to them what their options are. And that's how you become their realtor for life, is because you were up front and honest with them.

Honesty is the best policy.

Yeah.

Pretty simple, right?

The last piece of that, what I would say is negotiations. So when you're in the thick of negotiations for an offer or in the thick of negotiations for repairs, I think that we've maybe talked about it a couple times too, but, like, the emotions of the other agents can really get into it. And I'll be honest, like, I'm guilty of it sometimes. I'll. I literally said to an agent last week, this is insane. And it was because, you know, it was like a, like asking for a stopper that they didn't think worked. But, like, the inspector just didn't know how to use the drain stopper. And so they wanted a thousand, they wanted a thousand dollar credit for a stopper on a drain not working. So that with time I might have gotten a little bit, but I was like, I literally was like, this is insanity. Absolute insanity. I'm sure he didn't love that, but. Right. There are some things where, like, you have to, you know, and I again, like, also just being like, brutally honest, it's not going to cost a thousand dollars to fix the stopper. The best part is I have a, like, I have a video of this seller, like, turning on the water, pulling up the plug the way it's supposed to be plugged, and it's working just fine. So I think that's probably where frustration comes in for sure. But I think, you know, being able to keep your calm when things are ridiculous, you know, or seem ridiculous, and trying to keep your sellers or your buyers from not jumping off a cliff, you know, I think, I don't know If I brought this up last week, but it started with an inspection last week where they were going to ask for like a $32,000 roof. And again, like, I was like, nope, we're peeling back all the layers on that. And sure enough, like, other roofers came or like, doesn't need a new roof, you know? Right. So we could have gone off the deep end of just a flat out. No. Versus we did all this homework and now we're still on track to close. So I think that's where you just have to try to remain calm, try to see it from the other person's standpoint. But otherwise, my thought is always just like documentation and backups, like, what can I have? So whether that's other contractors, I don't. I need to have five there to support whatever's going on. Like, that's on me and the agent. So I'll schedule them. I'll be like, nope, let me take care of that for you. I'm going to call these three people. They're going to come out and get a second opinion. So I think that's really important to, like, use your resources so that you have data and information to, you know, same thing with working for the buyer. If there's something they're really concerned about, get a couple of estimates, you know, and maybe then when a seller sees it from two or three different people's standpoint, they might be more apt to agree to those repairs.

Yeah. I mean, it's supporting documents. It's not my opinion. It's not my. I'm not the plumber or the roofer here. Right. But I have the, the resources that I can tap into to bring other people into and get those supporting documents to be able to. And sometimes, you know, my opinion or the seller's opinion or whoever I'm representing may actually be wrong once we get these other opinions, and that's okay. At least we now have the true reassurance that this is the right choice to move forward. Or now we have this knowledge and we're gonna have to disclose this later on. Let's go ahead and correct it now. So I think it's. It's almost like building a court case, in my opinion. It's like grabbing. Grabbing the evidence, supporting documents, and then being able to pull that together. And it's no longer my opin. It's another professional's opinion that is actual, you know, a, you know, great in that. That industry. Like, it's not a me thing anymore. So I think it's just being able to constantly grab to that and then it's bringing everybody back to the facts versus bringing people or bringing in your emotions.

So I think the other thing is, you know, with the, with the market shifting, I don't know about in your guys's area, but like inspections are back on the table for the most part and repair requests are back for the most part as well. And so I think same thing, like you have to prep your seller for that. Because a lot of these sellers will say, I've heard that, you know, people don't do inspections, they'll just accept it as is. And I'm like, right or not. I mean, if we're in a multiple, there might be a situation. But I mean, not, not really like people are going to have inspections. So again, prepping that for them, that. And that's potentially like off topic. But maybe that's where they have a pre home inspection. Right. If they're concerned about something, they have those. It's a benefit to themselves.

I love doing like having a pre listing inspection. Right. Getting it done.

No problems during the transaction.

It helps tremendously. Like, yes, there's a little bit extra money up front, but hey, I would much rather make that investment up front versus trying to go through and piece everything together later on and not know what we're trying to negotiate. We have now literally all the cards on the table and that aspect of the property. And then the only other car that we're bringing in is the buyer. So I love it.

Yeah, I mean, like, I had one that was a pre inspection. You know, they lived there for 30 years. So I was like, probably not a bad idea. And right. There is like, there's $7,000 worth of mold in the attic while we got it taken care of ahead of time. And all the reports were available for a buyer and there, there was no issues. Right. Where I have another one right now. No pre inspection inspection had mold in the crawl space. And I mean, it's been like months trying to get someone to fix it. And you know, it will probably sell for a little bit less. And so again, it's just that, like thinking outside the box when the market starts to change.

Absolutely. I think all great things, all things to be able to really, you know, just have in your back pocket and making sure that you're playing the, the cards correctly and making sure that you are stacking to be working in your client's favor, whichever side, if that's the buyer or seller side. But. And it's also, I think, protecting your sanity. Right. Like the more that you do up front. Yeah, it's a little bit extra leg work, but you're protecting your sanity and being able to keep deals together, knowing what you're walking into, being prepared. And it's factual information versus these BS fluffy stories that we're telling in our brain for sure. Good. Good topic. Love it. As always. If you guys have any other topics that you want to discuss or want to be a guest on our podcast, please reach out to us. Make sure you tune in next time. We appreciate you.

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