The Anti-Salesy Newsletter That Builds Loyalty | LeadingLane Podcast | Ep 80

You're putting different things out there that other people may not know. And we initially started and you were asking about or you know if I read your newsletter and about the Caitlin Clark effect and no, I know who Caitlin Clark is, but I don't know the whole gamut of everything that's going on right now. Right. So being able to even start and spark those conversations. And it's funny cause I was like, oh, I don't want to talk about that because I don't know about it. But that's literally why you do newsletters and these different types of outreaches, because it is thought provoking and starts conversations. So tell us about the Caitlin Clark effect and what you wrote in your, your newsletter.

Welcome to the Leading Lane Podcast for Real Estate Pros by Real Estate Pros with your hosts, Ashley Frederick and Stephen Burch. If you're looking for an honest, authentic and, and raw perspective, you found it.

Welcome to the Leading Lane podcast. Ashley, you've been doing newsletters and constantly reaching out to your, your sphere and your past clients and people maybe ever even purchased anything from you. So I get asked all the time. I don't even know what to do with my CRM. I don't know what to do with my sphere. I don't know what to do. And you know, every time that I say newsletter I kind of get an ick because I feel like it is kind of a sales side of things. But you draft and publish your newsletters completely differently. How do you do yours differently than maybe the industry standard or what a salesy typical newsletter looks like?

Sure. I actually have two different newsletters. So I have one that is a little bit more focused to my hometown and then I have one that is just meant for anyone really. Probably a little bit more female centric, if you will, but I have a lot of male readers as well that commented. Even Ryan told me how much he likes it. So the point for the local one, which we probably started with Caitlin's help probably about three years ago, for me, that came out of the frustration of people saying that there's nothing to do in Marshfield. And I feel like that couldn't be further from the truth. And I was like, how can I just get that out to people? And also really it is ideal for people that are moving to town to now have a list of things to do or people that are in town. Like I just sent a thank you card to someone that is from our shield, has lived here for like, I don't know, 30 years. And I sent her like a little coupon to a coffee store that's been open for like seven years. She's like, oh, my gosh, I've never been to that coffee shop. And I was, you know, so again, like, we live here, but we just get stuck in our. In our own little ways. So I think a lot of people will choose to take a news, like a real estate newsletter, and it. And it can just be like, salesy, like, if you need me to help, you know, buy or sell your home, call me. And here's all my listings. So I try to make my intro just more like an update because, let's be honest, everyone always asks, how's the market?

Right?

What's new in the market? They might not be in the market for buying or selling, but they're still curious or maybe that might change for them. So I normally like to do something that's just, you know, a little bit about the market. Like, we're busy, we're short on inventory, whatever that might be. And then they can use that information however they want. And then it's really the next 30 days of local activities. So it's the pizza on the farm, it's the circus, it's the, you know, yoga in the plaza, all those types of things. And then at the bottom, I think we normally do like a home maintenance tip or something that's a little outside of the realm. And then I do normally, like one featured listings, maybe if I have a listing that's been sitting there. And it's funny, like, you know, you put people on it that are past clients, and sometimes you never hear from people, so you're not sure if they're, you know, reading it or not. And I think one of them. I had an office space that I put for Lisa on there, and he messaged me back right away and was like, could you tell me more about this? And I was like, whoa, like, you want to not work from home anymore? Like, you know, right. So things change that we just don't know. But you know that the newsletter will also post like, those events in other places. And now I have people that are reaching out to me to specifically ask me to put their events in my newsletter. So that's just another touch for me, I think, as far as, like, real estate, again, like, when you're. When you're touching base with your. Your database, I don't feel like it should be solely real estate driven. It should just be. I always try to look at it as like you're their expert for whatever that might be. So you're. Here's a good painter recommendation. Here's our local coffee shop that we really enjoy so that they open those and it's, they know it's not going to be salesy, right?

Well like, and if you, if you compound this together and if, if you're doing, you said yoga on the plaza, right? If you go to yoga on the Plaza, you as Ashley and you're inviting other people from your newsletter to attend yoga, the going to see you and then they're going to, you know, spark a conversation because hey, maybe they didn't know about it and they went because of you. And so now you are, you know, creating that, that connection in relationship even further. You're creating the rapport, right? It's. I think people put too much overthinking into what do I say, how do I say these different things in, in a newsletter. But in reality it's your think of it as you're the mayor of the community and you want to be able to invite everybody to all these different events that you're going to be going to and or you're trying to help promote. It's that simple.

Well, I look at it for let's say people that are brand new to the city, right. Like how do we get it so that they stay right. So it's same for your town, right. Like it's hard with people, you know, military in and out. So here we have a medical facility. It can help, you know, people can be in and out especially I feel like if they don't make connections. So if they never really meet anybody or become part of like a group or whatnot, it's hard. It's easier for them to leave, right? Where if you tell them there's all these things to do, then they started, you know, going to meet people. To me that lends them staying here longer because they've made these relationships and they've made these reports with people, right?

And you're constantly staying top of mind with them. Yeah, it's. I'm not going to go to yoga, right. Like Johnny the other day, I'm going to make. But we had yoga with cows here and Shani made a post about it and everybody's like, oh my God, I didn't know about it. I think that would have been a great, you know, topic to not only promote to get people to go see you there. And then now you have all of this content of being able to share that you are doing yoga with cows and you know, like it's just you never, you never know what anybody's going to spark an interest or spark a conversation. It just shows the different dynamic of who you are as well. And it doesn't have to be this big, elaborate plan. Go ahead.

I think the other part of that, too is people are always just looking for ways to stay in touch with their database. It can be a newsletter. I believe in social media as well. And same thing. Sure, our posts are probably more geared towards real estate because that's what we do every single day. But I also tell my clients they have to know you outside of real estate, so they need things that they can relate to with you when they see you in person. So, same thing, like, you should be in tune with what's going on with people. So if you see that they were in Italy last month, the next time you see them in person, you have the ability to talk about that. Well, same thing is true for me, right? When I post like that. We were on vacation. I had people that I saw in town that were asked how Carousel was. Right. You're giving these, these opportunities for these conversations where you, you know, build rapport with people. So, same thing. I had a client that posted about her, her workout class. Well, same thing. I told her, you know, take it a step further and wear your franchise hat or your franchise shirt or whatnot when you're at this workout class. And over time, people probably start to remember that or ask you something and it's just because they saw you there.

Right. You know, I, I remember I went to the grocery store and I had my name tag on. So, you know, this is a while ago in our company, mascot is a little orange French bulldog. And somebody, you know, the cashier, she was like, oh, my God, I love Frenchies. And, you know, what does that mean? And then so we started having a conversation. You don't know where the conversation is going to spark. People want to talk. People are curious. They want to, you know, ask you questions. And, you know, I think in any sales industry, it's really not sales like. And I know that's maybe an oxymoron, I don't know. But it truly is about the relationship and it's about the connection. And I think that if you lead into something, and we were talking about it over this last weekend, Ryan said that, you know, one of the things that, you know, in, in car sales for him when he first started was never to say, you know, is there something I can help you look for? Because then they can instantly say no then. So he talked, talked about how then he would go into the weather, you know, oh, it's hot out today. I was like, that is the most one sales 101 not to do. Right? And everybody kind of looked at me and I was like, no, like, what? Like, what are your goals today? Like, how are you? What's your name? And it's so funny that we forget to jump, you know, to have the, you know, shake their hand and have a conversation and see if you're actual genuine people and they can build a trust with you. But people want to be able to see that you are actively working. They want to see those newsletters. They want to see you actively on social media out in the community. And all of those are building trust. And even when you think that nobody's reading or nobody's listening or nobody's watching, you always have eyes on you always have people, you know, seeing what's going on. So it's just being consistent with it.

I mean, this punchline over here is like, you know what? It's funny. So I have the. The real estate newsletter. And then I think it was maybe four months ago, I started a more personal. Real estate, not real estate, a more personal newsletter. And I think the goal for me is that one, I think that we live in a strange time, which you and I were just talking about. There's a lot of negativity. I think people are just drawn to negativity. People like to post about negative things. Like, you can scroll through my social media, and I would find it very hard for someone to find something negative in my social media. And that's just because that's not who I am, and that's not who I want to try to present to people either. And let's be honest, people could use a little positivity in their lives. So my goal of that one was to just try to be, I think, one more open to like me. Because a lot of people think they might know me just from that outside, but they really don't. Right? But also just like random things like a book recommendation, because I know you and I talk about it too, but I do believe there's a science behind. For me, it's audible. But books, like, they can be a game changer. They can make you think differently. They can make you see things not how you would have thought you would. I like to offer those to people. And then, like, lately it's been, I'm all about protein, so, you know, some different recipes or things like that. And, you know, it's funny, you send it out there and you don't know who is going to read it, if anyone's going to read it, you don't know. But very thankful. And the people that have reached back out every time they get a newsletter and be like, oh my God, I needed this today. How did you know this is what I needed? Thanks for your message. And so that's the other thing I encourage people to do too, is it you do get something that resonates if you like just pop a simple message back to someone and be like, needed that today. Because a lot of times I'm like, I don't maybe no one read it. And then I'll get like three messages. And I was like, okay, people got it and it resonated with them.

And you know, it goes until you're putting different things out there that other people may not know. And we initially started and you were asking about or you know, if I read your newsletter and about the Caitlin Clark effect and no, I know who Caitlin Clark is, but I don't know the whole gamut of everything that's going on right now. Right. So being able to even start and spark those conversations. And it's funny cause I was like, oh, I don't want to talk about that because I don't know about it. But that's literally why you do newsletters and these different types of outreaches because it is thought provoking and starts conversations. So tell us about the Caitlin Clark effect and what you wrote in your newsletter.

Yeah, you know, so interesting because I played basketball in high school, so I mean obviously there's a, you know, basketball piece that I enjoy. If you don't know who Caitlin Clark is, she played for Iowa Hawkeyes, which that's another connection because I was born in Iowa, so my dad's a die hard Hawkeye fan. And you know, she rose to fame quickly because she was just so, so good at basketball. And now she plays for the Indiana Fever, you know, but if you've watched it at all, I mean there's a strong following for her but like within the WNBA there's a strong dislike for her. And it really comes back to like people don't like people for being good at something. Which I just have a really hard time understanding why like one people get so caught up into not liking someone that they don't know that. And we talked about it's no different than, you know, Travis Kelce or Taylor Swift. I mean it's just crazy the mean things that people will say and like they've never met them. It's just something they read on online. So, you know, she continues to do extremely well. I mean, I'll be honest, I never watched the WNBA until she was there. You know, that industry has grown, but she gets bullied a lot. There's a lot of plays where you see that people will purposely knock her over hard. Fowler and just, you know, I'm sure it's these older girls in the WNBA trying to pull their weight. Which reminds me of when I started in real estate. And there are these older real estate agents that would be mean and say things, you know, trying to get you to probably drop out of real estate, which I never understood. But as you know, there's a game, I think maybe three weeks ago where like, Hardfelder and then the other girl, like, chest bumped her and she fell over. So her teammate, who is new, I think, to her team this year, Sophie Cunningham, maybe a couple other plays later. And I said in my newsletter, I don't condone violence, but this situation, you know, someone on the other team was going for a layup and she, like, hardcore fouled them, like, wrapped her hand around their neck and like, pull them down. Right? So I, I get that it's the same thing that people are doing to Caitlin, but this was out of the blue, not mean that, you know, Sophie does. And I think it was more or less this. Her standing up for Caitlyn, for seeing, like, what people continuously do and just being like, if you're going to do it, I'm going to do it. We're not allowing this type of situation. So the, the interesting thing was what happened after that. So Sophie has, like, a decent following or whatnot. Like, overnight she got like a million followers on Instagram. Her jersey's now sold out. I think she has, like, something more than what Caitlin has. And so it was just really interesting to me. Like, there are the people that out there that see, like, she was trying to stand up for her. So my newsletter just focused on, like, can we maybe try to be that person that can see that someone's struggling and can be that light to help them or a simple, like, thinking of you, great job. And I think when you're someone like, you know, Caitlin Clark or you think, you know, rely, like to Kobe because she knew Kobe well. Right. Like, when you're at those levels, like, there aren't a lot of people that will tell you, like, you're along your competitors, right, that you're doing great or good job. And it's kind of people at the lower levels that Always get those compliments. So it's just, I think it's interesting. I think what I was just trying to do is get people to think that it's okay to tell people they're doing a good job. It's okay if someone's doing better than you. You don't know if that what that means at home life. You don't know what that means at any point in time. So it's only a facade that you're seeing and you really shouldn't be judging off of it.

Absolutely. And I think it's. I mean, we talk about all the time about how, especially in small town America, you know, always having a target on your back and being high performers and everything else, but when you're at that level as well, like at that professional level, there's not a lot of other people that are above you. You're really a small fraction of the 1%. Right. And so who else is there to cheer you on? And I couldn't even imagine, you know, being at that level and the constant shade and daggers thrown and the target on your back and the, the little things that you can do for people go a long way. I think that people, you know, see a whole bunch, you know, a stadium full that may be cheering her on, but you don't know what's really going on. And I actually think it takes a lot of courage for one person to stand up for another person and especially on a stage, on the spotlight, like at like that scale. Right. So it's small things. And yeah, I mean, it's a contact sport too, but let's.

I think the other thing that probably makes people mad, which I can relate to, is that she doesn't really give in to the like, negativity, if you will, as far as, like, she doesn't post about other players or negative comments. So, you know, they also try to always compare her and Angel Reese. Right. Like there's this ongoing battle, but she always says like horrible things about Caitlin Clark. But you don't necessarily see her saying those things. I think that there's that part of it too, of just rising above all of that. Like, I know that people talk about me, talk about us, whatever, and it doesn't really bother me anymore. It's. That's their choice and I don't have time for it. So I try to find the people that are excited for me or for us or for our company, and those are the people that I try to focus on. You know, what do they think? Are they concerned about something? But it takes time, man. Like, it. It takes a lot of time. It takes a lot of daggers. It takes a lot of bruises to be able to get to that point where you can just wash it off and realize that at the end of the day, that's the problem that they have. And not on you.

Absolutely. You know, I. There's this saying, like, I don't care if you're talking good about me or bad about me, as long as you're talking about me. Because as long as you're talking about me, I'm doing something and you are helping promote me one way or another. So I'm here for it. Talk about me.

And I thought, like, gosh, do I bring this up in my newsletter? Is it going to be controversial? You know, but then I just thought, like, I mean, again, like, I'm opening up a book to me that people don't necessarily see, and I think that's the messages that I received after it. I was like, yep, I did the, the right thing by just bringing it up and bringing light to. We could all do a little bit better.

Well, I mean, what you're doing is you're showing that you're. You're human. You're showing. Showing the. Not the. The facade, right? Like, there's the sales facade, if you will. But, like, this is me. This is who I am. This is who I'm showing up to be. Like me or don't like me. But I think standing tall, standing strong on who you are, who you're like being your true self, that attracts others, and it also is going to potentially detract others, but those are not your people anyway, and that's okay. And I think the more that you can surround yourself, I mean, we had that with, with Ben, right? Like the, the last podcast that we were on, the more people that you can surround yourself, the. The better that you're. You're going to be. You're going to continuously to improve and push and. And if you don't detract people from coming over to you and being in your circle, you're not really going to move. You're going to have to make that move your. You know, move them away from you. So that's an easy way to be able to do it, is express your opinions and thoughts and. And also with that being said, it's okay to be friends with people that don't have the same opinion of you. Does not need to. That you need to bring them down. This world has enough of the negativity. We don't need any more of that?

No, you know, but I think it's just, you know, I think that brings it back to just that, the newsletter, whether you know, it's, you can make your real estate one, you could make it a little bit more personal so that it's, it's not salesy. But I think that you're right and people focus on real estate being such a sales part of it. But it, it is honestly not, it's, it's really the relationships. And you know, I talk about that like 95% of my business is repeat or referral business, which is what I prefer because, and you know, they're true legit people. But it's because there was a relationship established. Right. So had there not been a relationship established, then there wouldn't be their repeat or the referrals. And it is at the end of the day like you know, I'm selling a town, if you will, and I have to be there. A resource as to what's good, bad, ugly. There are things to do here. But I'm also a human too, you know, So I think that just being relatable and making sure people know that you're a light for them. You know, I, and I, we've talked about this before but man, some days I should have gone to school for psychology because the conversations that come up in real estate transactions are mind boggling sometimes. And you know what, the tragedies that people have dealt with and then like you're their resource to get them through that tragedy. I mean there's a lot to be taken there that I think people don't think about. They just think about, you know, a line, your signature on the bottom line where it's you know, peers and it's phone calls and not sure if they're making the right decision and, but also their family's growing. Right. Like we've had children, we are empty nesters. Like those are all big life things that are emotional for people and it's nice when they can rely on someone that they know like and trust.

Absolutely. And that's what you have to continue to, to do and build and get your name out there and make sure that also like you're not just forgetting about your people after the transaction either. I think that's a big part of the, the newsletter and being in, in continuous contact with your, your people. Yes. You know, like I think people are thinking, yes, the newsletter is salesy, but what, what about just the continuation of the conversation after the transaction? You were telling me that you have A coaching client that you're working with that is doing pop buys right now for the fourth of July. And she had a client, like one of her clients that she dropped a gift off. What did they say?

Yeah, I think they posted on Facebook and they had said, like, oh, my gosh, she was my realtor, like six years ago. I can't believe, you know, she still does these. And then someone else commented underneath it, like, I've never heard from my realtor after the.

Right.

And Right. I will. I will preface that with there are some people that will probably never hear from me after a real estate transaction because we worked together and that was probably good. Right. So there are people that. It is like, you don't gel with people. You help them the best you can, but sometimes there's just not a good gel and that's completely fine. But, you know, I try to send, you know, quarterly postcards, like, just write us away. For people that they remember me would. That's also the part of showing up to places, right? Like when you go places, when you go to the farmer's market, when you go to yoga or whatever, you run into your clients so that you keep on in touch with what is going on in their lives. I mean, they have a new baby or, you know, whatever that might be. So I just thought that it was funny that somebody even commented on there that they've never heard from their realtor after the transaction. Again, like, that's not how I feel like a normal transaction should be. It should be like, where you're. A couple years later, they called and he was like, you're my realtor for life. So I mean, you know, I'll call you in like another 10 years and then maybe another 10 years after that. And that's the way it's supposed to be, is that you're their link for all of. All of their needs.

And, you know, like, it goes. I know when I was truly selling, I did not do the pot buys. I did not do the newsletters. I didn't have a CRM. Right. I did. I was literally the person that had the post it and. And wrote their name and number down and lost it afterwards. And so when I asked, you know, when. When agents asked me, like, well, what would you do differently? Okay, let me tell you. I'll give you a whole list of everything that I would do differently. And like, newsletter CRM, the pop buys, the constant, you know, continuation. And so I was probably the realtor that that person was posting about. Never heard from my realtor. After the transaction. So I apologize. But also like you live and learn, I didn't know those things when I first got started in real estate. And looking at it, it's very simple to write a newsletter or do a newsletter. You know, our company provides those types of softwares and everything to to people, but it just is taking the time to do it and it's getting out of your own way. And it can be as simple as just providing thoughts, recommendations. I mean you had a, you did a salad recipe one time and then the Amazon link to the container, the glass container that you used or something to that effect. Right. It doesn't have to be anything over the top crazy.

Just do the many people not use plastic containers. It's not good for you.

So not at all you and Ben on the microplastics right now.

Yeah.

So cool. Well, I greatly appreciate you sharing what you do and I think that we all can learn just to the simple first thing to do is be kind, say something and then you can write a newsletter after that. Yeah, cool. Well, as always, if you have a topic or you would like to be a guest on our podcast, please reach out to us. We would love to hear from you and tune in next time if you've.

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