Lessons from One of the Industry’s Leading Experts (Jasper Ribbers)

Welcome to short term Rental Riches. We'll discuss investing in real estate, but with a specific focus on short term rentals. Quick actionable items to acquire, manage and scale your portfolio. I'm your host, Tim Hubbard.

Welcome back to the short term rental Riches podcast. Excited you're here again? As most of you know, I do most of these episodes by myself, but there are a lot of experts out there and Jasper is one of them. He's our guest. And before we get into it, I gotta just let everyone know that I read Jasper's book get paid for your pad a long time ago before I started with my short term rentals. So he is a veteran. He's got so much experience and I'm really excited to have him on today. Welcome, Jasper.

Sup, Tim? Nice to, nice to see you and always cool to talk to a fellow podcast host.

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. You've got a great one get paid for your pad. And I've listened to it a ton actually. You've got amazing connections, Jasper, and before we get into some of the questions and just kind of how you manage all of the information access you have and access to the information you have, can you give us just a little brief background?

Yeah, for sure. Yeah. I mean, I, I started, you know, get paid for your pad a long time ago. When I started Hosting back in 12, 2012, it was just such a huge opportunity and it's, I felt like no one knew about this, right. I was, I was traveling around the world. I mean, I know you, you're living in Brazil. I actually used to live very close to where you are right now. And I was just traveling around the world and you know, renting out my one apartment in Amsterdam. And yeah, I had like worry free life for a while and everyone asked me like, what happened? Are you retired or something? Or like, how do you, you know, how do you travel around and, and not work? And I was like, oh, I have my apartment in the Airbnb. And they're like, airb, Airbn what? You know, what's this air, what's this air thing? And then I started telling my friends and they started doing it and, and I was like, wow, this sounds like this, there's people just don't know about this. So I was like, let me, let me share this with the world. So I wrote the book, started podcast and yeah, it's just been, it's been so much fun recently since I, you know, Eric Miller, of course, my, my business partner. We started mastermind in 2019 and, and after that we Kind of expanded. Started.

Essentially a short term rental education company with multiple programs going on. So, you know, now it's. And we're building a new hospitality brand on the side too, which is called Free Wild, which is what I'm really excited about. So there's. Yeah, there'. Much, there's a lot going on now. My life has definitely changed from like, you know, stress free sipping cocktails in Brazil to now like just working my butt off like 12 hours a day, you know.

So yeah, you know that there's so much opportunity in this space still that it's, it's hard to kind of sit still for a long time and even just relax sometimes I'm finding myself in the same position. It's like, you know, when I discovered your book, I didn't have any short term rentals. You know, put, put one up and you know, here we are years later. And one of the things that I think makes it hard to relax is just there's just so many sources of information right there. Like, I know you are an expert and I've been in the industry for a long time, but it's like every day there's more resources, there's more people out there. There's like, what would you say and I know you have tons of great guests on your podcast all the time. What would you say is any tips or anything for managing all that data and who do you choose to listen to or learn from?

I guess. Yeah, that's a very good question. Right? Because there's so much information out there. Like one of the reasons I started get paid Freepad was because I just couldn't find information. So I was like, oh, let me put something out myself then. But yeah, now there's so many groups, right. There's podcasts, obviously you have your own podcast. Podcast, right. There's a lot of other people that do podcasting now as well. So I would definitely say like podcasts are definitely one of, in my opinion, one of the best ways to get valid information. You know, obviously there's, you know, there's, there's YouTube channels and there's Facebook groups and everything.

But I find that the, the highest quality content is usually is usually either on, on blogs or podcasts. Right. So, you know, books Bl. Podcast is, is kind of like where I get my information. I'm not a, I don't like to consume too much information from social media in, you know, like there's, there might, there's, there's some good info on YouTube to be found, but there's also a lot of, a lot of kind of, you know, content that's produced with the mindset, I think with the goal of just attracting as much traffic as possible versus delivering like, you know, valuable content. So that's, that's my preference. I would say check out podcasts. You know, books is good, of course. And what's the other thing? Yeah, blog, good old, good old blog posts can be really good too.

Yeah, no, that's true. I, Podcasts are some of my favorite. Obviously I'm slightly biased having, having my own, but, you know, I didn't start this until I learned so much from other, other podcasts. And yeah, this was the, the idea behind this podcast is just short, quick, actional ideas and, and that was kind of hard for other places. But podcasts are just a fantastic, fantastic tool. I'd have to agree. It does seem like a lot of the information now is just to get you to watch it and keep watching it. You know, a lot of times it takes a while to get to like the actual nuggets that you're looking for. And so podcasts, you know, another source though.

Of information and I think personally, really good information. I want to get your take on this, but our conferences and there was a, while there were none of us were going to physical conferences and now a lot of them are virtual, which I think can be an excellent source of information too. But what, what are your thoughts on short term rental conferences and, and going in person?

Oh, yeah, 100%. I, I love conferences. I think they're a good source of information. But I think most, most importantly, they're, they're a very effective way to expand your personal network. Right? Because you can meet somebody, you can meet somebody on Zoom. I mean, we've known each other for, what is it like?

We've met on Zoom many, many times a while.

You know, I actually just real sorry to interject her, but I, I was on your podcast a while ago and so I went to search for it to, to find it and I was thinking, man, I don't know, maybe a year ago. That was like three years ago. I was in December 2020 of 2020. I can't believe it. The time. All right, sorry. Sorry to cut you off there. I just thought that was crazy.

No worries. But here's the thing. You can spend a lot of time with each other on Zoom and things like that, but at the end of the day when you're having a drink and you get to feel sort of energy and just really connect, that's where you build a much stronger relationship, in my opinion. So I love conferences.

The reason I haven't shown up on a lot of conferences recently is just that I'm going through a visa process for the United States, right. So I've applied for a work visa, which actually got approved, and I'm actually about to go for my interview at the embassy just a week and a half from now. But during that process, like, you can't travel to the US So they already locked out, like, a lot of conferences for me. And then. And then also, like, living. Living in Panama. Like, I live in Panama, right? You know, like, going to. I just got. After. I traveled to 100 countries during my digital Nomad times, and I almost felt like I was. I was just kind of like enjoying.

Not traveling for a while, you know, I feel. Yeah, I've. It's nice to have a base sometimes.

Yeah, yeah. 100. But just going back to your point, like, yes, conferences. I actually, believe it or not, I actually, I had a time where I was like, putting out, like, little courses on Udemy, just. Just kind of for fun, putting out some little, small, little courses for people to buy. And. And I actually created a course on like, how to. How to maximize a conference visit. Because I was going back in the day, I was going to so many conferences that I, I kind of figured out a way to, you know, to really maximize your time at those conferences. So, you know, I would say if I can share just a coup tips, you know. Yeah, it's like, it's like. Because here's the thing, you're at a conference and you could go to conference and just kind of like, you know, sit in with some. Some presentations and like, you know, have a couple drinks, go to a party, this and that. And then looking back, you. You might. You might think like, h. Did I really get a lot of value out of this? Right? And I, I've been there before where I was like, one conference, I just had so much value. And any other conference I didn't feel like I was getting any value. So I just kind of made a list of things like, okay, how do you maximize your conference? And the number one best way to get value out of conference is to be one of the speakers.

Because then you. You can. You get to connect with all the other speakers. That is also, like, everybody wants to connect with you because you're a speaker. So now suddenly you don't have to go around and try to get, you know, try to get introductions or like, meet people. Like, everybody will talk to You. Right. So that's, that's my secret tip. Number one is, you know, just apply to be a speaker or do a workshop or whatever that is. You get a lot of value from that. And then number two is oftentimes on, on the conference they have a. You can figure out who's coming, right. They usually have a back end where you can see like, you know, the guest list or whatnot. So I would say like make a list of the people that you really want to meet before you arrive. Right. Because then you already know like, okay, I want to meet this person, I want to meet that person versus just kind of showing up and then just kind of going with the flow.

So great tips. Great tips. Yeah, I love conferences and I was going to a lot for a long time and not just in the short term rental space, but I go to other real estate investment conferences and Precious Metal. And I actually went to a podcast conference last year that was the first time going to one of those. And a lot of times it's like you get out of it what you put into it.

Right.

And if you show up super tired or you go out late, real really late night and you're. You're trying to soak up the information the next day, that makes it difficult. I do like now that at least a lot of these are being recorded virtually too. And so especially some of the bigger conferences where you might not be able to get. Be able like catch everything at the same time. You can go back and revisit things, but just having a good note system as well, I think and actually reviewing the notes and stuff and taking action, you can get so much, so much benefit from.

Yeah, great tips are.

Do you have any that you're. I was just looking at VRMA for those of you that don't know that are. That are listening in. Vacation Rental Managers association puts on, I think a really good conference. They put on several, but they have an international one too that they do once a year. And if you go to their website, they've got to schedule all the short term rental conferences for the year. And so I kind of went through there and I was selecting a few you. So I'm gonna go to that one later this year. And there's another one in Barcelona that I was. That I'm gonna go to as well. At least I'm planning to. Any. Any on your list?

Well, you know, honestly, like my, my life right now is so dependent on whether I'm gonna get my work visa or not. Right.

Yeah.

So that. That's like just dictating my every move almost. Which, which is kind of crazy if you think about it, right? But yeah, I just can't plan anything right now. But yeah, I would love to go to, you know, I love VMRA. I was there in, in 2020 I think it was, or 2019. New Orleans I think it was.

Yeah, it's awesome. I would love to go to a whole bunch of them. I've been to the one in Barcelona. I've been to the one in London. It's called Host, I think. I don't know if that's around post Covid. But yeah, the one in Barcelona is great. I used to live in Barcelona so it was easy for me there.

That's awesome. Yeah, I used to. I actually, I don't think I lived there quite as long as you, but I was there for, for a while too and I, you know, I did the like your book really sunk in for me, Jasper, because I, you know, I love traveling. That's why I got into real estate. But it is, it is nice having the home base sometimes. Would you say it doesn't sound like you are now, but would you say in the past then that you were a digital Nomad 100?

Yeah, I had that lifestyle for I'd say the better. Almost a decade. Yeah. You know, as you know, I was in finance. After I quit my job, I was only one thing in my mind. It was like I want to travel the world and I figured I'd do it for a year but I ended up doing it for eight years. So.

Yeah.

Yeah. That's awesome. Well, it was very inspiring story. It helped me with my journey and kind of to piggyback on this digital Nomad topic, you could say now or I heard this somewhere that you know, there's a different type of digital Nomad now and that's just a remote worker. Right. I mean these are you can professionals of all different levels that are now living that lifestyle a little more because they can. And of course a lot of them are staying in short term rentals which is fabulous for us that are investing working in that space. What's your, what's your outlook on virtual work going forward and how it relates to short term rentals?

Yeah, I mean I, I definitely think. Well, first of all the digital Nomad trend was, was already there before COVID but Covid really accelerated it, right? People, people learned how to use zoom and how to work remotely and everything. So I think it accelerated a trend. But I think you're right. I think the, the. But there's various ways of being a digital nomad. Like, when I started, it was very much like there was a couple places in the world and that's where everybody would go. Right. The low cost environments. Like, like Medellin is a big hub. Right. In Colombia. There's this place in Thailand. I'm blanking on the name now, but it's in the north of Thailand and it just. Chiang Mai. Yeah. Got flooded with digital nomads. Right. I was there in 2003 or something and it was just a tiny little sleepy village then. And then 10 years later, it's like, it's massive digital nomad hub with super fast Internet. And you know, you rent an apartment for, you know, for 500 bucks a month. So you had these hubs. But now what you see is that, is that people don't. People might just go like two hours away and then stay in a different city for like a month.

Right, right.

So that's, that's definitely changed a lot.

So. Yeah. And I think that trend's going to continue. Right. I mean, it's not gonna, it's not gonna. Probably not gonna grow as fast as it's done over the last couple years, but I think, you know, in the future, I think people will get more, more and more used to the idea of sharing resources. So the whole sharing economy, I think, is going to, is going to keep growing. And I think younger people also, I feel like they, they're more focused on experiences. They want to have certain. They want to experience things. Right. So. And I think, you know. Yeah. Moving like a young person can probably not really imagine living in one place for like 10 years or something. Right? Yeah, it probably sound. Seems boring to them. I think so. Yeah. Yeah, I think it's. It's going to continue this, this. And what's the most interesting part of that, I think is because, like, you know, midterm rentals is a very interesting topic right now. Right. Because more and more people are looking for like a one month or two month or three month stay. And you know, Airbnb is not really the ideal platform for that, I think.

But there's no other, there's no other platform that really dominates the midterm rentals. Right. So that's going to be interesting, I think. Like, is there going to be a player in the future that's going to dominate that market for midterm rentals?

Yeah, it's a good point. You know, and this is kind of like I've living this life, I would say now, you know, I happen to be able to stay in my own residences fortunately, which is nice because they have some of the things I want, but not all the time. I actually sold my place in Colombia and when I go back there, I'm working on another project to cater to this specific type of guest, you know, one that wants to stay a little longer. And so I'm going to be renting an Airbnb there for probably six months while we build out this project. And that's just becoming more and more common. I mean technology's made it easier like, like you said. But there is furnish finder.

Right.

That has really kind of put themselves in like the traveling nurse sector of midterm stays. But yeah, I wouldn't say that they're a platform. That's a lot of people outside of nurses are going, going to, to find a place. So I think there is a lot of opportunity there for platforms and, and also the direct booking websites too, right? Having our own booking website.

Yeah, yeah, for sure.

Good stuff.

For sure. I don't, I don't know how it is now like, because I haven't done this lifestyle for a while, but I remember that was my always, my biggest challenge was like, how do I find a place where I can stay for two months? Like I would find Airbnb is just a little, little pricey. You know, maybe this changed now, but like, but it's either Airbnb or where else are you going to go? Like you're going to go on local, you know, local Grec list type of sites and see if you can find like a sublet or something like that. Right?

Yeah.

Yeah. So it's, that was always my biggest challenge. So yeah, it's really interesting to see how that, how that's going to play out in the future.

Yeah, I'm just kind of thinking out loud here, but Airbnb didn't really start with a really long term rental in mind mind either.

Right.

They've, they focus on that a lot more recently where they're really trying to push a lot of people in the long term rentals. They still make a lot of money off the long term rental reservations. And so as we see other OTAs online travel agencies enter into the short term rental space that weren't traditionally there, like booking.com for example. I would, I would think that these other sites like booking.com and vrbo are probably going to try to cater to a midterm stay sometime in the future as well. Because if they get the booking from it and More people are searching for it that it would just make sense for them to offer those as well. So.

Yeah, yeah, it's possible. It's possible, but it's, it's like, you know, like we, I remember booking an Airbnb for two months in Hong Kong and, and the places in Hong Kong are expensive. And so yeah, I think the total was like, I don't know, like, like 8000 or something. 9000$. And I was, unfortunately I was sharing it with somebody else. But yeah, just the Airbnb fee on that reservation was like two grand or something, you know. Yeah, or 1500 bucks, I can't remember. But it was just mass. I was just thinking like, man, I'm paying like 1500 bucks for, you know, just to, just to rent this place for two months. It's kind of.

Yeah, it's a huge chance. I know. Well, we'll see what happens. Maybe they'll realize that they're losing market share for some of these medium term reservations and come out with a different pricing strategy specifically for medium term stays and hopefully lower the cost kind of for everyone. Well, gosh, so many good things to talk about, Jaz, for one of them I want to bring up is that I know you work a lot with Eric now. Eric is your, your partner in multiple, multiple ventures. And I have the pleasure of knowing Eric as well as I was part of your guys's group for, for a while there. Also a fantastic guy. I was wondering if you could share with our audience just a couple of the lessons learned working with a partner or having just any tips. I mean that's one of the cool things about real estate too is we don't have to do it alone. We can, we can partner with other people.

Yeah. Yeah. 100%. Yeah. I mean I will say that I've had different partnerships in the, in my past life because I've, I've done different, different things in different industries. And I, I would say like finding, finding a, a partner who's a really good fit is, is, it's very difficult. You know, it's, it's very tempting to just kind of do things with somebody because it just feels lonely doing it by yourself. And like it's hard to make decisions sometimes, right? It's like you, you kind get, bounce some ideas off each other and, and, and make a, make the best decision. So it's tempting to, it's tempting to partner with somebody who's not really the right fit as a partner. I think, and I think that's why a lot of Partnerships actually don't work out. Right. I think there was actually some of our. Some of our members in our Mastermind were talking about this, like, last week or so. It's like, hey, what's. How do you find a great partner? And. And one of them said, like, well, there's only one thing that's true about a partnership. It's going something like that. Right. And which is also fine. I mean, you could have a partnership for a certain amount of time, and then, you know, it doesn't work out anymore. That's fine. But I think. I think a lot of people jump into a partnership without really understanding, you know, what. What type of partner would be the best fit for. For me, what are. You got to start with your. Your weaknesses and your strengths. Right? You got to really identify, like, okay, what am I good at? And what am I. What am I not good at? And what. What. What does the business require to be successful? Right? And I think, yeah, I think it's. That. That's not. These are not easy questions to answer. Right. It's. Before Eric and I partnered, like, we had a long process of, you know, I can't remember how long we were talking for years, and. And then we tested the waters by throwing this Mastermind event back in Puerto Rico in 2019 just to see, like, okay, how do we work together? And really trying to understand, like, okay, what are your strengths? What are my stre and are they complementary? Right. Because I've partnered with somebody in the past who was exactly like me, and, you know, it didn't work out. Right. Because you need to have opposite perspectives that kind of clash to push.

To the equilibrium, if you will. Right. So, yeah, I'd say that's the most important thing, I think, is really consider.

The weaknesses and strength of both partners. But also, are you aligned on your values? Are you aligned on the type of culture that you want to build? Are you aligned on the vision for the company, too? Right. I mean, I. Look, we've talked about this. Like, I've. I've had years where I was just like, car carefree, rent out a couple units on Airbnb, and just kind of travel the world. And now Eric and I are building something that we believe can be a generational hospitality company, you know, that people will know 100 years from now, people will live beyond us. Right. That's a complete different vision. Right? So, you know, you gotta be aligned on that as well. So, yeah, it's. It's not easy to find. Find a great partner.

Yeah, yeah, I'd Agree. It's.

It'S, it's challenging, right. And especially if it's something that you, that has a never ending timeline, for example, a generational company, you know, you're in it till the end, right. And so definitely a lot of thought needs to go through it. Excellent tips there. And so let's see, Jasper, a lot of the economy's constantly changing, right? And you can say right now that a lot of people would say we're in recession and it's maybe not looking bright at the end of the tunnel, at least for the foreseeable future. What would you say to someone that was interested getting into the short term rental space in today's economic environment?

Yeah, I mean, look, I think the biggest thing is there's the economy, right? Like nobody can really predict. It's hard to predict what exactly is going to happen. Like, it seems like there's definitely some slowdown on the horizon. But I think when it comes to short term rentals, I still believe that short term rental industry is going to grow and there's a lot of opportunity long term. Right. Just because I see that people, I see the trends that there's, there's trends that I think support certain rentals. And you know, the biggest thing right now I think is if you want to get into the space now, you gotta really, you gotta look at it as a, any other business. You gotta figure out what, what is, who's my, who's my ideal client, you know, who, what solution am I bringing to the market? How do I stand out from the competition? What's unique about me? You know, the days that we can just literally just grab a random apartment and throw it on air Airbnb and, and just, you know, be booked 80%. That was the case when I started, but that's not the case anymore. Yeah, me too. Right? That's not the case anymore. Maybe, maybe in some markets maybe there's exceptions, right? But you know, but overall I think, I think that's not the case anymore. So, you know, before you get into it, I think you really gotta, you gotta create like a, you know, what we call like a vision or like almost like a business plan of like, hey, how are we going to do this? Like, what's our goal here, right? What's of properties? Do we want to rent out? Do we want to do ownership like, like yourself, or do we do want to do management or you know, rental arbitrage, which is kind of gone out of fashion now. The, the rental arbitrage is, you know, proven to Be a very risky model through Covid.

But yeah, those are. There's so many questions to be answered and I think, you know, before you get into it now and, and you know, the other thing I'll say is like, you got to educate yourself because it's no longer an industry where there's so much opportunity that anybody can just kind of come in and do really well. Like, you really have to educate yourself. Like, like any other sector really. You know, like you wouldn't start your own bakery if you don't know how to bake bread. Right, right, right.

Yeah. No, great, great points there. I think the one thing that always.

Excited me about real estate and I guess makes me more comfortable is that people just. We always have to live somewhere.

Right?

And the, one of the exciting things about short term rentals now is that people aren't just traveling in them, they're actually living in them. And so it's become a more permanent piece of the real estate industry. And I think a lot of people in big companies and venture capitalists have recognized that. And so with that has become, has come more competition. And so the management piece and really planning out and educating ourselves, like you said, said, is more important than, than it's ever been. But I still think a lot, a lot of opportunity going forward.

Oh, for sure. And, and it also really depends on your goals. Right. Like, like you. And you know, you and I both own, you know, real estate that we rent out short term. Right. I, I have my place in Cali in Colombia, for example. And you know, I just, I just have a management company takes care of it. For me, it's just a passive investment. Right. I just bought it and, and it pays out every month. So, you know, if, if, if that's something that you want to do, that's that, that, that doesn't require as much, you know, education. But if you want to build like a bigger, if you have a bigger vision for, you know, for a company that you want to build, then that's definitely, that's definitely required, right?

Yeah, yeah, definitely. Yeah. I think think a lot of our listeners are, you know, the, the title of the podcast, Short Term Rental Riches sort of implies that like, we're, we're going to become rich from this, which we absolutely can. Of course, rich. The word rich has a different meaning for everyone and I want to get to that in a little bit here. But.

A lot of people listening to the podcast are people trying to scale their portfolios and add more units. And I know there's a ton of tools out there. But the idea was to have quick apps, actionable ideas to help people do that. Do you have any tools or software tools or even maybe just an idea that you've encountered recently or come across that's just a quick actional idea that might help someone getting started or that's trying to scale their portfolio?

Yeah, I mean I would say, like, I would say technology is a big, is a big thing, you know, because as the, as the, as the market matures and as competition increases, like operational efficiency is going to be key. Right. Especially if you want to scale. Right. You know, when you talk to, when you talk to operators who are like big operators, I'm talking like 5,000 units. You know, they're all, they're just, they're all very, very focused on operational efficiencies. So let me share one, I'll share one actionable tip that I got actually from, from Ste. Schwab was at our mastermind and he's the founder of Kasico. I think they have 6,000 units or so. So one thing I learned from him was that.

And when you scale, like the operational efficiencies are so important. And one of the things that he did to make his operation more efficient was he planted like what he called an ammo box in all of his units. So it's literally a box with some tools that will allow guests to sel. Resolve issues. Right. So for example, like the, the toilet's like clogged or the, there's a light bulb, you know that, that, that's dead. Right. Or the electricity go out or whatever. It is basically to give you guests the option of like, okay, we can send somebody, right, to help you with this or here's instructions if you, if you wanted to self resolve this issue. And, and he was sharing that like in 80% of the cases, guests actually choose to self resolve because they don't want to deal with somebody coming to the unit and the friction that comes with that. And then, you know, that's something that we're looking to implement in our, in our business in the near future is, is minimizing the amount of time that when we have to maintenance people and you know, or cleaners or whatever to, to help guests with their issues because that's, you know, that's, that's a lot, that's costs a lot of resources to do that.

Definitely. Definitely. I like that. An ammo box for fixing quick issues. Yeah, you got to think, you know, if someone, someone clogs the toilet and there's no plunger around.

That's, that's something that could solve that issue real quickly. Although some people don't, definitely don't want to do it themselves. But given the option, I think it's good to have an option. So just don't make sure you leave a dirty plunger right next to the toilet because that's not a good site for, for our gu.

Oh, good, good tip there. So much to learn. Well, let me ask you this, Jasper. This is again the podcast, the short term rental riches. And a lot of people associate the word rich with finances. Normally, you know, being wealthy, but that is not the case for all of us. I know living a rich life for myself is just having the freedom. That's why I got into real estate in the first place, to be able to travel. Not necessarily really bouncing around all the time, but just having the freedom. And so, so what does the word rich mean to you? And is there some way that you've enriched your lifestyle in the, in the recent past that's not financial?

Yeah, yeah. 100 I would say, you know, like for me, for me being rich meant freedom. Like you, like you, like you said pretty much the same thing. You know, I, I didn't need to make a million dollars. I was just like, hey, if I, I, you know, if I have enough money to comfortably travel the world and, and experience this was essentially what, what I wanted. You know, I want to experience different cultures and I lived in so many countries, you know, and that, that to me was, was, was being rich. Now I think it's changed a little bit. You know, my life has changed. I'm, I'm married. You know, I'm looking, I'm trying to, I'm building this, this generational company or that's our, that's our vision at least with Eric know, my life has changed a lot. I'd say what, what rich means for me now is, yeah, it's, it's a different, it's more about like learning. Learning is a big thing for me now. I'm doing, you know, I'm doing a lot of things that I'm not necessarily or that I'm not, that are new to me. Right. And, and that's really exciting. Right. So I think learning, I think personal growth and then I think I would say emotional, emotionally, you know, just.

Doing a lot of emotional work, like meditating and breath work and you know, getting, getting 20 minutes of sunshine every day.

That, that's a big focus for me now it's more like health and like physical health. But also, but also emotional health. Right. Just really taking care of our, taking care of the, the mind. Because as you probably have noticed as well, like we, you when you're building businesses, there's a lot of challenges and that can cause anxiety and there's uncertainty and like, you know, like I gotta look after my mind because otherwise I'm driving myself crazy. So.

Yeah, yeah, no, great, great points there. Yeah. If we don't have our health, we, we don't really have anything.

Right. And.

Let me give you one, you know, let me give one example piece of advice I have. I have this thing called It's a whoop. Have you heard of a whoop?

Oh, it's the same.

It's similar to the, to the ring, the aura ring.

For monitoring sleep or.

Yes, yes. There's one thing that I learned that helps me, makes me feel more rich is quality sleep. Sleep. Quality sleep is so important and no one's tracking it. So I started tracking it. I have this device called a whoop. And I can see exactly in the morning I can see like my average heart rate, my heart rate variability, my average respiration rate and all these other metrics that tell me like the how, how good my sleep was. And it's crazy. It's crazy because, you know, I might sleep seven hours one night and seven hours another night, but my, my quality would actually be one night could be 90, one night, could be 30%. And how, how productive I am and how, how good I feel during the day is massively dependent on the quality of the sleep.

I totally, totally. I, I don't know what happened yesterday, but I woke up at like 2 in the morning and my neck, like I was sleeping on the pillow wrong or something.

It just really set my day back. I mean, it still kind of hurts actually, but I know I didn't sleep that much that, that night. And I've got one of these Fitbits which helps me monitor the time that I'm sleeping. I don't know how accurate it is, but, but looking back at it seems to be pretty kind of on par. And yeah, if I'm, you know, feeling a bit down or if I'm not in a great mood a lot of times I can go back and look at the sleep patterns and you can see that it's, it's not always like you said, like the, the, the same time when you think it might be, but it might be like, you know, you miss sleep a day before or a little bit in the past. And it really does affect us a lot.

Oh, 100%. And you know what you find out when you start using this, these things is, is like when I eat in the evening, right, A couple hours before I go to sleep or drink alcohol a few hours before I go to sleep, completely messed up my sleep. Like the quality just drops. Right. So what I do now is like, you know, I don't really do big dinners or big meals after like 5pm or so and I try not to drink any alcohol in the last two or three hours before I go to sleep in the. During the weekends that sometimes a little, little difficult but. But yeah, it's massive. Massive.

I've noticed that too. I've noticed that too. Well, gosh, awesome stuff, Jasper. I know we can talk for forever. I. Before we get to how people can find you anything else you want to add?

I mean, you know, just appreciate, appreciate the invite here. You know, I think, I think we covered some really important, important topics of like, you know, in today's short term rental industry, I think we have to really set higher standards. Like our guests are expecting higher standards from us and we really have to, we have to like be professionals in what we do, you know. So I think that's the most important message. But at the same time, like for, I think for the people that are embracing that and are setting the standards higher, I think there is going to be a lot of opportunity regardless of what the economy is going to do in the next few years. I think in the long term, the short term rental industry is a great place to be.

I agree. And you guys have a lot of fantastic information and you guys teach all kinds of people. I've learned a ton from you since the very beginning when I read your book. So how can our audience reach out and learn from you and Eric and everything you guys put together?

Yeah, 100%. Well, obviously there's the get paid for your pet podcast that you've been on that people can listen to. We do two episodes a week, one on Monday where I kind of interview somebody and then on Friday Eric and I just kind of talk about what we're learning, what we're experiencing. And then, you know, obviously getpaidforyourpad.com is where you can find lots of free information. And then if you're interested in our course or one of the courses, you can go to overnight success IO our main course is a 90 day accelerated program called Legends X. Where you can find more information on that is overnight success IO X. And then we do free trainings every Wednesday. And that's overnight success IO training Every Wednesday we do a free training everybody can jump on and we just cover a topic for like an hour Eric and myself or one of us that's open free for the public for everybody.

To join so awesome awesome so much good stuff there. Well you are truly an expert Jasper appreciate appreciate you coming on the show we'll make sure and get this out to all of our audience and hopefully we can do this again in the near future and see where things are at then.

Absolutely thanks Tim thanks Jasper.

Want to.

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