How Collegiate Runners and Adult Triathletes Are Similar with Coach Peter, PhD Ep 61

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Mm-hmm.

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All right.

Welcome back to the Find Your Edge podcast. I am your host, Coach Christina Fiumara Newport, and today I'm with Coach Peter, Dr. Peter Ormsby, actually. So welcome to the show, sir.

Thank you very much for having me today.

This is all about getting to know the coach. Because I feel like our coaching staff is amazing and has such a diverse background. So for you, Peter, how did you get into triathlon?

30 years ago. Ooh, '94. So graduate of '94.

And by the way, if you're, if you can watch this on YouTube, you definitely need to, cuz we were just talking about who has the better gray, my hair or Peter's beard.

I went to Elon College, now Elon University, and we only had cross-country in the fall. We didn't have, didn't have track or anything like that. So to do something in the spring to keep kind of active, I started doing triathlon. Didn't have a swimming background, barely had a road bike, but was a decent runner, obviously running in college, and just started in the spring of '95. My first race was Azalea down at UNCW back in, back in the day. So that's kind of how it started, and it was just a, a spring-summer type thing. My college roommate and I traveled all up and down North Carolina to, to Loggerhead Island and Topsail and, and did all the, the local, you know, North Carolina ones back in the day. And then kind of graduated to, I've done St. Anthony's, I think when I was still in college. I did Eagleman like 2000, 2001, and then did Ironman Wisconsin in '02 as my first Ironman, still in school. Albeit as a Florida State graduate student for, for my PhD, and then took a portion of time off to finish the degree, raise two kids, was married and everything else, and then got back into it full swing, I think in '12 or '13 when I was at Weber International, and we had the first ever scholarship triathlon program in the country. And I was there '07 to '14, so we had a triathlon program for 3 years, I think, when I was there.

So you, you've got this like little blended kind of thing going on, which is super cool that you were racing for cross country, doing triathlon as a side gig kind of thing. And then lo and behold, you got into coaching. So when, but not for triathlon, right?

No, not, not originally. No.

Yeah.

No. Um, the coaching thing started in '99 when I got to Florida State and it wasn't even on the radar, not even close. Going to Florida State to, to go to school, sports psychology, do whatever I was doing. And my wife was interviewing for a job. At a high school, and I'm sitting in the car like a hot dog waiting for her to come out. And the next thing I know, I've got the AD and the current cross-country coach knocking on my window going, hey, your wife's interviewing in there, but she said you ran in college in cross-country. I was like, yes. Like, do you want to coach? I was like, sure. So that's, that's how—

That is the wildest interview story I think I've ever heard.

It was never like, I'm never, not even close. So I coached high school for 3 years and was still going to school, still racing myself. And then in 2000, 2001, I think I needed an internship for my PhD, got on board with Florida State Track and Field and started volunteer coaching for them, was their lead performance enhancement consultant for a season, and then kind of got on as, as a paid volunteer. And stuff like that. And that led, one thing led to the next to where I went from Florida State to UCF to Weber to now up here at, uh, UNC Pembroke and with Endurance Edge like many years later. So yes.

Yeah. Which is very exciting. Cause you're not, so we're, so the Endurance Edge is based in Cary, North Carolina. You're about 90 minutes south of us.

Give or take. Yep.

Ish.

We'll say ish. Yes. South side of Fayetteville. Yep.

Hope Mills.

We'll say Hope Mills. We don't want to be associated with Fayetteville, even though it's a pretty cool town. We are on the south side, Hope Mills, and it's closer to Pembroke, which is another 40 minutes down the road.

So all of those years of training and all of those years of coaching, what would you say is your philosophy or style of coaching?

I am— I don't want to say I'm laissez-faire, even though it may come across if you talk to my athletes. I'm not an in-your-face, yell, scream type person at practice or anything like that. That's more— I save that for race day, more encouragement as opposed to yelling during practice because it's a waste of that.

Well, especially with your background in sports psychology, right? Like, is that an effective method of coaching?

Not for me, at least. Not for me. I share a hallway with baseball, and the baseball coach is 4-letter words all day. And that's his motivation. And I appreciate that. I just can't do that when I'm coaching guys and girls at the same time. It, it doesn't work. But I think philosophy for triathlon and, and endurance-based athletes, it's the program's there. I'm willing to answer any questions, help you do whatever, but it's, I'm not gonna be in your face telling you you suck if you don't finish workout. Cause I know, I know, you know, we all know that life gets in the way of executing a plan to 100%. And I, I feel I'm very flexible having been married for 25 years, two grown, two grown butt kids, and, and trying to balance a semi-competitive racing schedule within that. So like, I, I get it and I'm willing to work around that. So I guess I'm not laissez-faire, but I'm flexible with the needs and desires of the athletes I work with.

Yeah. Would you like to share what race you did last year in the fall time period?

Oh, this time, this time last year?

Uh-huh. This time last year. Uh-huh.

This time last year, I might have been in a country called France getting ready for the Ironman World Championships.

I mean, kind of a big deal.

I would've trained a little bit differently had I known or realized how much 8,000 feet of climbing actually felt like and how many times I wanted to get off that bike within the first hour and a half, 2 hours. But great.

But that's the fun part about racing, right?

Yeah. It, well, the, the sucky part about world championships and, and that kind of racing is, uh, the age group I'm in, I, I was the last male age group to go in the water.

Oh.

So. As bad of a day I had on both the bike and the run, just from a time span perspective, I've never been in a race where they've started to shut down aid stations. Oh, so like the, the out, the back half of the run where they were shutting down and cleaning out the aid station, I was like, hello, what, what? Hello? I've still got 10K to go.

Uh, what an interesting experience for someone who's, you're probably towards and have been used to being the front of the pack and now it's like, oh my gosh. Now I'm towards the back and what happens back here? Even though you're not slow, but just a different race. Yeah.

Worlds in '23 was slow. The wife did not like 14 hours of waiting. But made up for that this year at Roth with right at about 11 hours. So she was very pleased with that. But it is kind of cool depending on how slow or where you are in transition because you can hear the male winner. Or you can see Jan Frodeno coming down the finishing chute while you're going out on the run. So there's, there's perks of when and where you start and your time on the course.

I dig it. All right. So I've been asking all our coaches this, what is a memorable success story or achievement you've had with one or some of your athletes? Because you've got quite the coaching career. You just had one athlete had a baby. Not that you, I mean, you coached her through that. That's kind of a big deal.

She, she would be my second athlete to have a baby cuz I had one when I was coaching in college too. Which was weird, but she came back stronger and faster. So maybe that's what said athlete will do.

There you go.

I don't know. Like, I've had athletes win conference titles, be All-American and stuff like that. And I don't know if that's— while that is a success as defined by a lot of people, I get excited when the athlete comes back from a race or an event and they say, hey, I just— that was a PR. That was a season best, lifetime best, whatever. And I just, I'm excited about the, just their facial expressions and their excitement gets me excited. And so that's, I could have 10 achievements in a meet or stuff like that. I think when they win team stuff, that's kind of like the big success. But I think within that you've got little successes.

Yeah.

Um, and it could be 1 second, could be 10 seconds, could be a minute, could be 10 minutes. Over the course of 25 plus years, it's, I've had an All-American in the marathon when I was in AI, which he finished 4th, which was really cool. And I've had a guy finish 8th in the country for D2 cross country twice. But while those are very good and those are my recruiting points, I think it's the average kid getting better is, is where I like to hang my hat on the achievements and the success.

So it sounds like not just the big quote unquote titles, but the, like, the small steps and just continuing to move forward.

Yeah, because the fasties are always going to be fast and you can only have so many fasties on a team. It's really those average to semi-above-average athletes that you're actually developing. So like my 4-time All-American in cross, he was fast already. I just was crossing my fingers that I didn't get him any slower. So that, that's that. But like, it's those kids that come in as 17-minute 10K guys out of, or 5K guys out of high school, and they're running 15-minute 5Ks a year and a half later. Or it's the girls that are running 22-minute 5Ks in high school and they're running 19:30 or faster. You know, a year and a half. Well, last year I had a girl that was 21, 22 minutes. She ran 19:30 indoors and, and was about 19 low outdoors. That's a pretty big improvement for a 6 to 8 month span. And we were running through, running, I don't say running through, we were running with injury, but we managed them successfully to where she could do that. Mm-hmm.

So, yeah. Yeah. So you've talked a good amount about some of your younger athletes. How, with the Endurance Edge, generally speaking, our average age, I would I'd say is somewhere between late 20s and like mid-60s, probably averaging out somewhere in the 40s-ish. I'd say how different, how would you compare those two groups of like, hey, I'm coming to you and I wanna do my first Ironman, or I wanna get faster. Do you feel like it's a different approach than cross-country kids in college?

Yeah, not necessarily.

I think they all— tell me about that.

I think they're all coming to you with a goal. So one person's goal at 18 to 22 is to get as fast as they can in the shortest amount of time to do whatever it is. And they may never have the ability to have the resources they have for those 4 years, the coaching they have. And it's all— they get free resources, free coaching, free shoes, free gear. Now, 20 years later, which is where we are or I am, it's the same thing. Like they're trying to maximize their fitness but still achieve goals. Now, the goal may not be to win a race, win a conference title, win whatever. It may be, let me place top 10 my age group, or top— let me get on the podium on my age group, or let me— this is what I have to do to get to Worlds or to an age group championship, and let me do— let me rank myself amongst people in my age group. And that— so like, it's the same goal, we're just working at a different time frame. and we may not have quite as much time to work with because in college they're there for 4 years, whereas we may only have an athlete for 6 months to a year to 2 years to 3 years, depending on how long their interest in the sport and life takes them.

Yeah.

And I also like it because it's like I'm right there with them. So like if I've got somebody who's doing an Ironman for the first time, while I, I don't feel I'm bragging, I'm, but I'm giving them Well, my veteran, and this didn't work for me, so don't do this because you don't want to end up like Coach Hornsby on the side of the road. But no, I enjoy like doing that because I really can't do that with my kids because I was slower in college than they are. And I'm not any faster now, but I'm more resilient now than I was back then. And I think that's, that's, I, they keep me going. And I think it just kind of carries into the more adult athletes that I work with.

Do you think that that's a difference in training volume or intensity or just training differently or maybe getting better rest? Like what would you attribute your success as a triathlete to?

It's a little bit of like, I'm gonna say like nutrition is probably my like weekend. Like it is the, I'm just always working on that. I'm a, I'm a train to eat type person or eat to train.

No, or both. Which is both.

I like my pizza, I like my burgers, I like my, I like my monsters, whatever. But I also like my 6-hour bike rides. I like my 2-hour long runs. I think for me, it's just consistency. And I could go back in my training log through 3, 4, 5 years to where my training hours have increased, not exponentially, but it's, it's been like 60 to 90 hours each year since like COVID. I think COVID was still a great year for everybody from a training perspective if they took advantage of it. But I can, I can definitely look back in my training logs and say, okay, 2020 was great. 2024 is gonna be probably 5, 10% higher than that. So I think it's the consistency of what you're doing along with rest, recovery, and everything else that kind of goes into how long you can do this without getting hurt.

I think there is an assumption that, oh, I'm gonna train for, let's call it Ironman. All of a sudden you're up to the volume that you're at and then somebody gets hurt. I mean, so what I hear you saying is.

This takes a long time to develop.

Like endurance takes a while.

We can, we can all coach somebody to an Ironman in, in 6 months. Now that may just be to finish an Ironman, uh, which is great. I think everybody that wants to do that is that it's, it's how competitive do you want to be or can you be? And I think you gotta get that first one out of the, you gotta do it. But then I also think you have to be consistent over the next couple years racing 70.3s. And, and picking the right Ironman depending on what the goal is for them, whether it's 12 hours, 14 hours, 10 hours, whatever the case may be. It's, it's picking one that fits your, your lifestyle, your training needs, and the time of year.

That's a good point. Cool.

All right.

So are you ready for a little rapid fire, not rapid fire questions?

Sure.

Okay. We'll see how quickly you answer these cuz the other coaches I've asked, we just go off on tangents and doesn't end up really being rapid fire, but that's okay. We're, we're gonna all ask the same questions. So what are your— and we can see them— what are your bike brands?

Uh, Quintana Roo is the racing bike.

Cool.

And, and—

oh, that one's behind the—

that one's behind Bucky the Beaver. So that's a Specialized.

Okay.

So those, those are my two, two brands, Quintana Roo and Specialized, as it stands right now.

Okay, cool. What is your favorite distance to race?

70.3. Okay.

And what's your favorite distance to coach?

I would say probably 70.3 or Ironman.

All right.

I can go, I can go down to the Olympic side if, if needed or wanted.

Okay.

All right.

What is your current favorite discipline? Is it swim, bike, run, strength train, eating pizza?

If pizza, if eating pizza was a discipline, I'd be right there. I, I don't know. It's between the bike and the run. If you asked me 10 years ago, I'd probably say for sure the, the run. Still learning how to race efficiently on the bike and learning how to push because I, having a run background, I want to save some for the run and don't want to cook myself too much on the bike. So I'm still learning power and stuff like that on the bike to make sure it's good.

So you're saying you can't get this sport figured out in one race?

I'm still figuring it out 30 years later.

Right. What is your favorite race?

Oh, I would say after doing Roth in July, I'd say that's, that's a top 3 race. But I'd also say 70.3 in Hawaii, I think, is, is a favorite too. I've done that twice, and I think we're going back there next year.

Is that Maui?

It's, it's on Kona, or it's in—

oh, on the Big Island?

It's on the Big Island. It starts halfway up. It's at the Fairmont Orchid, so it starts 20 miles north, I think it is. Yeah, uh, Waikoloa. Yeah, that's— but no, I— we've enjoyed that. We've gone there twice, and then we'll go back next year.

So Very cool. Love that. Pet peeve as a coach and pet peeve as an athlete. See, I told you this wasn't going to be rapid fire, but that's okay.

Yeah. Pet peeve as a coach is, is really athletes that say they're going to listen, but then do exactly the opposite of what you want. So like, hey, don't do 3 workouts in 1 day just because you missed 1 the other day. And lo and behold, TrainingPeaks shows 3 workouts within whatever, 30 minutes of each other. And I was like, you just kill yourself for the next day and a half.

Yeah. I always love how they're like, but it says it on my calendar. I'm like, yeah, and guess who has the power to make it go away? Delete.

Pet peeve as an athlete. I don't know if I have a pet peeve as an athlete. I just, I wish, well, I guess it is a pet peeve. I wish athletes would just abide by the rules and not wear headphones and all this other stuff when they're not supposed to. So maybe that's the race director in me or, or whatever, but I just hate seeing that because you obviously didn't, didn't read them or don't know USAT rules.

Yes. Well, and if you're potentially compromising your own safety and the safety of others, it's kind of like, mm, yeah. All right. Your favorite workout to program and your favorite workout to do?

I enjoy bricks.

Okay.

We talked about that on the coaches call last week and Marty's not a huge fan.

Yeah.

I, and my wife was listening to that whole conversation. I like them. Now I may not do them exactly the way they're supposed to be where it's like, come back, drop the bike, get on the run. I'll take like 5, 10 minutes because that's what transition on a 70.3 or an Ironman is going to be. Mm-hmm. But I enjoy, I enjoy feeling what the legs are going to feel on that and it's I've been surprised at how fast, like if it's a heart rate based run, I'm like, it's heart rate, but then I'm going like 7 flat. I was like, who would've thought I was gonna go 7 flat off the bike?

Mm-hmm. Yeah.

I, I enjoy that. And that's a, that's a weekly thing for me. So there's not a, well, this week I'm racing this weekend, so I probably won't do anything until—

Oh yeah. Where are you racing?

Age group nationals up in Atlantic City.

Oh, that's right. Yes. Ooh, good luck ahead of time. Okay. So favorite workouts, Brix, what do you like to program? Do you also like to program Brix? And just so, just so it, if does somebody doesn't know what a brick is, generally speaking, it is like a bike run combination workout, but it could kind of be any combination of workouts really. Yep.

I haven't tried the swim bike thing cuz I think they, they say that's important too. I just haven't.

Is it logistically, personally, I, that's kind of a pain to me. I'm like, I don't wanna get my bike wet if I don't have to, but that's kind of lame of me, you know, but Yeah, hardest part's getting the wetsuit off.

Maybe that's what they're transitioning is.

Yeah, could be. Mm-hmm.

Programming-wise, I don't know. Like, I think program— I think I'm equally— everything has its place. So I don't think there's a favorite thing. I think every workout has its own place within the week, but a lot of it depends on the athlete. The athlete may go, I want to run one extra day. Fine, we can run 5 days a week.

Yeah.

Or we can do 3 swims instead of 4. So like I'm, I'm open to, to the athletes of, of how, like I know the structure of what I want, but obviously it's their plan. So just being flexible with, with what they want and where they want it.

Yeah. I think that just goes to show that there's not one way to accomplish your goal. You know, I think, I think there's a sort of perhaps a misperception or a misconception that you have to run 3 times and bike 3 times and swim 3 times a week and that's otherwise you're not a good triathlete. And it sounds like you're saying that's not really the case.

I like the structure that I use, but I know it's not for everybody.

Mm-hmm.

Um, but also like if they're, if they can't run too much anyway, then we maybe we have to do a little bit of extra swimming and biking, or we have to supplement with, with cross-training and stuff like that. So like it, I'm flexible with, with nearly anything and everything, just knowing that there are minimums that I think we need to do. Per week. So I think there's a minimum that we, we should be programming, but obviously it's all up to the athlete and what they can handle in recovery. If we're working with middle-aged or 30 to whatever athletes, it's like recovery is a huge thing. And I know you guys don't like it that I'm able to do an Ironman and come back the next week and do a half Ironman and do even better at the half.

So, you guys, we, so we have weekly coaches meetings, which are great because we all get to learn from each other and share, share share war stories or ask questions or learn how to just generally program differently, better coach differently, better. We, and when I say we, it's typically Carly and myself who are giving Peter the hardest time because the amount of beating that this dude can take that I know I couldn't take. We razz you because we're jealous. So there's that.

So it was the whole thing. Was it last? No, '22. It was '22 that I did Ironman Maryland, went 11:22, which is a PR at the time for me. And then I came back the following week and did Augusta, went 4:44, which was a PR for like, as like a 20-year PR. And I was done after that. That was, that was the end of the season. There was, there was no, but I surprised myself.

You peaked at just the right time.

I peaked at just the right time. And you guys were not the only ones. Cause I had other people on Facebook going, what the hell were you thinking? I was like, I couldn't get out of it. I'd already signed up for it.

Couldn't do it. And it, well, I will say that's a little bit of my pet peeve is like, oh, you shouldn't be doing that. Or like somebody else, certainly on social media being like thinking that they know your context, you know, like, no, that's their opinion and maybe it wouldn't work for them, but if it works for you, great. And clearly it did. So, and you're still here.

I'm trying to think. I think I did the same thing last year. I think I did Worlds and 2 weeks later it was Augusta.

It was something like that. You had a, you had a, if I remember right, it was like a 3-week turnaround maybe, or something else that you did. Yeah, maybe like, maybe I had, I had an actual, you did 2 Ironmans, wasn't it?

I did, I did Placid in July and I came back and did Worlds in September, which was this year.

Yeah. Okay.

And then 2 weeks later it was Augusta. So yeah. Yeah. Yep.

Don't be jealous. Just know that Peter, uh, knows himself very well and that's okay. We will leave the razzing to us. You're welcome. Yes.

So do you have a least favorite workout?

Anything that involves sprints in the pool.

Really?

Yeah. I will do 2,000, 3,000, 4,000 straight in the pool. But if you want me to do 25 sprints as fast as I can, No bueno.

So you're made for Ironman is what I just heard you say.

I am made for like 5-second recoveries and I can go all day with that or, or continuous stuff. But if you want me to do threshold and LT and sprints in the pool, not, not gonna happen. Not, it, it will happen. It just won't be, you won't see a, a pace differential personally or a smile on your face until I'm done. Yes.

Until you're done. Yeah, that's fair. All right, cool. Well, Peter, thank you for sharing your story and your history and hopefully your personality too, right? Because everyone deserves to have the right fit and have a good relationship with their coach because it is— I'm like, coaching is very personal and I think so many people are like, oh yeah, I just got a plan off the internet, which is fine. I feel like everybody needs a place to start or at least have some level of structure. But if you're really going to do better, I feel like you have to have a good— you have to have that good third party to be guiding you in the right way. So if you guys want to work with Coach Peter, head on over to our website, theinneredge.com. And Peter, thank you so much for sharing, and we appreciate having you on.

You're welcome. Thank you for having me.

Thanks for listening to the Find Your Edge podcast. If you like what you heard, don't forget to subscribe on your favorite podcast platform so you never miss an episode. And if you're interested in learning more about our endurance coaching, sports and wellness nutrition, metabolic and sweat testing, triathlon training team, or our triathlon training library, be sure to check us out at theenduranceedge.com. And don't forget to follow us on social media at The Endurance Edge. Thanks again, and we'll catch you next time.