He Thought He Had Time… Until She Stopped Reaching for Him

It's a hard time for you. You know what I'm hearing from you right now?

What's that?

I'm hearing your strength, man. And you know what I'm hearing from you is that for the first time, it's like you're doing something, you're growing, you're thriving, you're feeling confident. And there's just that little bit of kind of second-guessing coming in. Like, am I doing the right thing? Am I okay?

And I know I can do it. You know, you get nervous, you know, because I haven't had these— I have never had these hard conversations with my wife. I really can't. I couldn't do without this program because this has given me all the right tools and it's put me in the right headspace.

You know, Todd, what's up, brother? Come to the show.

How you doing? Great.

How you doing?

Wonderful.

Awesome, bro. Talk to me.

Um, I'm just having some, uh, some issues with resentment on my wife. As you know, she left a few months ago, and, uh, I helped her move out and everything, and I was okay with it. But it's the, uh, coming back home. I'm having a hard time, uh, getting past the fact that she was okay with, uh, with with leaving, you know, and like she was going to sneak out on me when I was gone. And so I just happened to find out and, you know, and I helped her move out. It kind of shocked her, I guess. And but I guess I'm having a hard time with how do I get past the resentment or, you know, the, I don't know, the fear that she's like, if I go on vacation or should I go to my cabin for a weekend and, you know, is, am I going to come back home and she's going to be gone again, you know, if stuff gets rough, you know, I kind of having a hard time with that. But I'm like I said, I'm going through the vertical ladder and I'm doing some, uh, some of the box technique to try to get through that. I don't, I don't know how that looks, you know, I don't know what that looks like for us, but I know I, I need to work on that because, uh, that's going to be a big, uh, big challenge for me.

Yeah, that's— thanks for bringing that up. So yeah, first of all, it's a couple things. What you shared was two, two parts. The first part is that you don't trust her.

Yeah, pretty much.

Yeah, yeah, that's the first part. Second part is And, and the lack of trust, right, is, was born out of feeling betrayed.

Correct.

So you felt betrayed, so obviously you lack the trust there, which is understandable. Okay. The second part is the resentment, right? Which tells you that you're, you know, you're angry, you're struggling with forgiveness, but you're not really angry, right?

No, I'm, I'm not angry. No, I'm not angry. I'm just, I guess I would say I'm more disappointed, shocked. You know, because I never thought that would happen.

You know, now it's not disappointment or shock. That's a part of it. What else do you think it is?

I guess trust and, you know, now the feelings, the emotions, hurt, shame, abandonment, you know, my childhood.

There it is. There you go. So you're hurt.

I'm struggling because, you know, my mom abandoned me when I was a kid. And so, you know, now I'm— those feelings are coming up, that abandonment, you know, that fear that, you know, Is this what's going to happen to me again? And I know it stems from my childhood issues.

But that doesn't negate the fact that they're two separate things.

Right? No, it's two separate things. But that's, you know, that's, that's where I get those feelings from, you know, that's what's coming up for me. Because, right, I think back on that. And I'm like, man, am I getting, you know, I never thought my wife would ever stay with me here. Right?

So you feel hurt, the hurt reminds you, which we'll get to in a second, of something else.

Correct.

And then your brain goes into a protective mode of don't trust, As a way to do what? Stay safe.

Correct.

Okay. Let me ask you this.

Yes, sir.

Do you believe that being with your wife, the prerequisite, we all know that you, you obviously need to have a healthy marriage. You have to trust somebody, right? But let me ask you this. Do you believe that you're just supposed to magically today trust your wife after something like that happening?

No.

No. So the real reality is, is a couple things. Number one, you gotta give yourself time cuz respect is something that's earned. Especially with somebody like you or I, right? You gotta earn trust with us, number one. Number two, the reason that it's difficult for you to live in, in the patience that's required and the perseverance that's required for you to build back this marriage without trust just being rock solid right out the gate is because it is triggering for you. So let's, let's go into this. So what does it remind you of?

Being abandoned as a child and having to, you know, pretty much fend for myself and shutting everybody out. Just to protect myself.

Okay, so let's look at the difference, right? So you said being abandoned as a child and having to shut everybody out just to protect myself. What happened when your wife did what she did? Did you do that? Did you shut everybody out, else out, just to protect yourself?

Um, I shut her out and people. Well, yeah, I guess, I guess I did. I, I kind of just withdrew from everybody, that friends and everybody, just to get, get by myself and to make myself safe, you You know, yeah, but let's look at the difference.

Let's look at a couple differences, okay? The first difference is this: when you got abandoned as a child, it threatened your survival, it threatened your safety. What happened when you got abandoned as a child? Where, where did you end up? How did it jeopardize your safety?

My mother would just, uh, was verbally abusive, physically abusive. I ran away from home and hid in the closet in a building just to be safe. Run away from home, you know, at 8 years old, 7, 8 years old, and hiding out in the mechanical closet to stay safe, you know, and just because I was scared that I was going to be you know, hurt. It was horrible. But, you know, that was my way of, of protecting myself.

Yeah.

From anything, any harm coming to me. Yeah.

If somebody abandons you today, are you threatened in the same way, your survival? Can you make a choice to get away from it now?

Absolutely.

Okay. But, but let's look at a couple things. So do you blame yourself for not being able to trust your wife?

Do I blame myself for it? No, no, I don't. I don't blame myself for that. No.

Okay, then why do you think it's a problem?

Just because of the trust. It's hard for me to, you know, it's not— I don't think it's my fault that I can't trust her. It's her fault because she's the one that left, you know what I mean? And she was okay with that. That's the trust problem I'm having. That if you're okay with that, then how can I trust that you're not going to do that if times get tough again? You know, right? I guess that's where I'm stuck.

But that's what I'm saying is, have you ever worked for somebody that you didn't trust?

No.

Have you ever had to work alongside somebody you didn't trust?

Yes.

Okay. Did that stop you from getting the job done?

No.

So what makes you think that to have the healthy marriage, you need to automatically trust your wife right out the gate and feel safe? You don't. But the problem is, is that your nervous system is extremely hypervigilant and on high alert, assuming that in the end you're going to get hurt again.

Correct.

But this time the difference is that you can protect yourself, you can fend for yourself, and you can move forward because you can take care of yourself. You're not dependent upon your wife.

No, no, not at all.

So your brain though doesn't know the difference because it's cataloged that trauma. So it's trying to protect you from the potential pain of isolation, being alone, and that turning into more and more and more pain. Let me ask you this, since joining the program, going through everything you've gone through, overcoming all this adversity, facing all these childhood wounds, do you have the skills and the community and the support that if your wife left and did this again or chose to do this, you'd be able to make it through it?

Yeah, absolutely.

Would your response be different than it was when you were 8 years old hiding in that mechanical closet?

Absolutely.

Then what does that tell you?

That I can get through it. I'm okay. I'm just— yeah, I'm okay. Yeah, I guess I'm okay. I just, like I said, I guess I'm just— I'm in my mind, I'm in my head. It's in know. And yeah, that's why I'm— that's why I'm working through some of these tools to, uh, you know, to get through that, because I know it's in my head. It's just, uh—

no, no, no, it's not in your head though, brother. Like, listen, there's no reason why you should trust your wife right now. You have every right to not trust your wife right now, and you should not be in a rush to trying to trust your wife right now, because trust has to be built, and you have to be okay with the patience and the long road for you to do that. And what you're thinking in your mind is that you can't be in this place and tolerate it, and that you're in an unsafe place, which to some degree is true, but not in the same way that your brain remembers it.

Yeah. And I'm, I'm not ready for her to come back anyways. And I guess I'm, I'm probably just kind of jumping the gun, but you know, she's talking about, you know, she wants to come back and I'm just like, well, okay. But I'm still, like I said, I'm trying to explain to her. I'm like, listen, I'm, I gotta work through this because there's And there's a little resentment there, you know.

Yeah, you see that pressure, you see that. So yeah, the difference is now, brother, is you have the choice about who to trust, and you have a choice about when you want to trust them. And what I'm picking up from you is that you want to work through this. This is not a situation where you're talking to me saying, yeah man, I'm resentful and that's my problem. No, that's not your problem. The problem is that you're having a hard time living in the unknown and building back trust with someone that's betrayed you, because it's something in your life that you've actually never done. You've never once in your life had to build back trust with someone that's betrayed you and hurt you in this way. What you've done before is cut them off.

Absolutely.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So if you think about that, what is that opportunity for you to learn how to build back trust with this woman? What does that do for you, even if it works out or not?

Well, it makes me a stronger person. I mean, there you go.

Yeah, there you go.

Yeah.

So how, how, how does it, how is it happening for you? How does it make you a stronger person?

Because I don't need her to be happy. I, you know, it doesn't, I don't need to have her in my life to be happy. And if I feel I can't trust her at some point, if we don't get back together or I, I'm okay with that. I can still be happy. I don't have to have her in my life to be happy.

And, and you know what's happening? You're not telling, you're not reminding yourself of that. You're not telling yourself that. Because when you were at your strongest, that's where you were mentally.

Right. Yeah.

And, and let me ask you this. Have you told her that you don't trust her?

I haven't told her I had that. I don't trust her. I told her that I have resentment and that, you know, and that, oh yeah, that's, uh, we're going on vacation. We're going on vacation for 4 days and we're going to have some, we're going to have a couple of good talks while we're there. So, yeah.

Um, and she needs to know, right? Based on your childhood and your experiences, how very real that is for you. And if she can't see that, right, if she can't empathize with that, and if she can't understand that, then that to me is a clear indication of how supportive and how much she actually cares about you to begin with, right?

Yeah, if she can't support me in that, then I, you know, then I'm not going to be able to, uh, because again, like, I, I, I got to sit down and be vulnerable and share all this stuff with her, you know. And I told her I need to feel comfortable and knowing that I can share this with you, you know, that I can be vulnerable with you, you know, because I don't. And so she's, she's, she said she's okay with it, you know. And so like I said, we're going to Florida for 4 days, and I'm gonna— she doesn't know what I'm— what my plans are. But those are my plans so that we get some time alone together, we'll spend some time and then, you know, I just want to take— cut out maybe just an hour or so just to sit down and have a couple conversations, you know, while we're there. And, you know, if I have to at some point pull the plug, then I'll pull the plug. But we're going to have some conversations and, you know, okay, I love that.

And, and let me ask you this. If your wife had a father wound and her father abandoned her and you had, let's say, tried to sneak out of the marriage and commit infidelity to in some way, shape or form, and your wife was feeling like she didn't trust you and wanted to come to you and talk about how her lack of trust and the feeling of betrayal was connected to her father wound, and she talked to you about that, what do you think would be the right way to respond to that?

Well, that I understand. I could understand. I can sympathize with how she feels and that she has valid concerns and everything. But—

And that would only be if you what? How would you have to feel about her to say that?

I have to love her, care about her.

Yeah, exactly. Show empathy. Exactly. And if you didn't give her that, and if you didn't listen and you shut it down, what would that demonstrate?

Because I'm an asshole. I don't care about her.

Yeah.

Yeah.

In other words, yeah, that you don't really care. You don't want to hear it and that you don't have time for it and that it's not really a concern of yours.

Right.

Which to me, that tells you everything you need to know about that marriage.

Right.

Or at least how she feels about you inside that marriage.

And I know she's got some trauma with her, with her childhood too, you know, and, uh, sure. And I, and I, and I know, and, and I, in the past I've dismissed, I've dismissed it, you know. She's all, I'm depressed, I'm depressed. And you know, I've dismissed her depression, not asking her why she was depressed. And so, you know, and I've shared that with her. I'm like, listen, I want you to feel comfortable to be vulnerable with me too, because I know you went through some trauma as well. So we both kind of, kind of build that, that trust as far as being vulnerable with each other, you know, but, uh, like I said, the thing with the trust with me is, is that, is that she left and that was, you know, and I helped her move, you know, but it's still, it bothered me. That she was okay with that, you know? And so that's the trust issue there. I still love her and I care about her.

Yeah. So what's your plan of action? What's your course of action? Have this conversation with her, bring it up to her, see how she responds, and then be able to differentiate the past from the present moment. And then no matter what happens, that your life is not dependent on another person, that God has your back, he's gonna take care of you. Doesn't mean it doesn't hurt. Absolutely. Doesn't mean I'm, I'm not gonna possibly get hurt again. It doesn't mean any of that, but this time it means that the response is different and then I can show up for me. In the way that I— that, that somebody, another man, didn't show up for me in my childhood. And I can show up for me now, for my inner child, myself, in the way that I couldn't prior. And I can be that man that I always needed in my life regardless. And that God has me, that I have a community, I have tools, and that I can overcome this. And that it gives me a great opportunity to rebuild trust with somebody else once trust has been fractured, to teach me how to be stronger, to not have my guard up so much, to know that I'm okay no matter that even if I do let it down, to not be naive, not rush the process, and to take it one day at a time.

Absolutely. Yeah. And that's why I plan on, like, you know, I've been, I've been practicing, practicing my sandbox technique. So I'm gonna have these conversations, you know, because I have boundaries, and, you know, and, and so I have to set those boundaries up with her too. And this is, and I've expressed that to her, you know, I'm like, listen, you know, if we, if we decide to get back together and everything, you know, to to go forward here. I go, I'm gonna— I have boundaries, and I'm— I have boundaries, I have needs, and I'm going to write all these down. And I want her to do the same, you know, but I'm going to write all these boundaries and needs down, all the needs down, and I'm going to discuss the boundaries with her. But I'm gonna write all my needs down. I said, just pick 5 of them, um, like you just suggested before. Just pick 5 needs, write them down. And I said, I'm gonna pick 5 and I'm gonna write them down, and I'm gonna give you mine, you give me yours, and then we'll, we'll work on those, you know. But, uh And then with the sandbox technique, I'm just, I have to set boundaries. And so that's, that's, that's what I'm working on because sometimes I feel uncomfortable and I don't want, and you know, I don't want to hurt her feelings. I don't want her, make her feel uncomfortable, but, uh, I have to, I have to set boundaries. And so, you know, it's a hard time.

You know what I'm hearing from you right now?

What's that?

I'm hearing your strength, man. And you know what I'm hearing from you is that for the first time, it's like you're doing something, you're growing, you're thriving, you're feeling confident. And there's just that little bit of kind of second-guessing coming in, like, am I doing the right thing? Am I okay? And Todd, you're—

and that's why I'm doing the box technique, you know. I'm just trying to get through that because I know, I know I can do it, you know. I get— you get nervous, you know, because I haven't had these— I've never had these hard conversations with my wife, you know. And now that I'm able to, um, yeah, I just, I just need to do it. So like I said, it's uncomfortable for me and I'm a little anxious, but, um, they need to be done. So for both of us, you know, to have a healthy relationship going forward, if I don't, if I don't set these boundaries now, then what am I going back into? Am I going back into the same chaos that I was in before? The same, you know, dismissive, not having conversations with each other. And that's not, that's not what I want. I, that's not what I want moving forward. Yeah. No, no.

Todd.

Yeah.

Epic. Epic.

I really can't do, I couldn't do without this program because this has given me all the right tools and it's put me in the right headspace, you know?

Yeah. I got a good exercise for you too.

Uh, yeah.

I just dropped it. It's inside the tools. Okay. It's called, it's a trauma healing exercise.

Okay.

And it's in there. It's called trauma healing.

Uh-huh.

It's a writing assignment. Go and complete that one.

Okay.

Go and complete that one because that one will bring you back. It'll ground you again.

Okay.

And then let's follow up after you complete it. Send it to me.

Okay. I could do that.

Awesome, bro. Thanks for coming on, man.

Thanks for having me. I appreciate all your help. This program's awesome. I don't know what I would've done without it. Really.

Anytime, brother. It's been an honor.

Thank you.

Love and respect, bro. We'll talk soon.

All right, thank you. Have a good day.

You too.