Navigating How I Show Up in This Family

I'm Dr. Becky, and this is good inside.

My name is Ethan. I just celebrated one year with an amazing woman who has an incredible five year old and am kind of overjoyed at the bond I'm building with them both. I've come into their lives in motion, and there's a lot of unknown unknowns that I am slowly unpacking. And so I'm just trying to, like, be the best partner I can be, be the best loving adult figure I can be while also making sure that my needs are met.

You know, I just gave my honest reaction right away. I've always been someone who's drawn to, like, questions and not answers. And to me, the best it gets in life is like, feeling like you're asking yourself good questions that usually are unanswerable, but, like, they kind of, like, the question leads you down a certain path. I just want to say from the start, Ethan, like, I've never even heard someone articulate, like, the questions of life like you just did. And I really mean that. And I actually imagine, and I, like, for some reason I'm thinking about this. I just want to name it. I actually imagine there's people listening right now thinking, like, I wish my partner, who I have biological children, would be asking those questions. How can I show up in a way and be a good partner and be a really intentional, loving adult to our kid? And how can I also do that while taking care of myself and being the best version of myself? So I almost just want to, like, honor if that is feeling almost like, triggering. Just notice that. Notice that. Say hi to it and we're gonna come back to you, Ethan. And I don't know if you are someone who tends to pause and give yourself credit for, like, the way you show up and the way you ask questions, but, like, I think this calls for it because you're asking, like, all the important stuff. We'll be right back. I have, like, always two parts of me. I have this part of me that has, like, really big thoughts that, like, bring me off the ground almost to the clouds. And I have another part of me that's always stronger that, like, brings me back to the ground with very, very practical things. So I just want to. Yeah, there's the more philosophical parts. Is, like, isn't. Isn't that the beauty of a struggle in our struggles? We find questions in our struggles, like, why am I doing this? What's going on for me? What is really hard for me? You actually articulated the power of struggling so well. I'm not Going to let myself go there for too long. I have a feeling people are listening. Like, okay, can we just like get to the. Like, I need some practical advice here, so. And I do too. So we're gonna go there. So. Okay, so you are a newer adult to this five year old child. It is very clear to everyone on the earth that you want to show up in a way that's in line with these lovely intentions. Also kind of noting your own needs, also knowing your partner. All of that. Okay, bring me into a situation where some of the seams in conflict or like a specific situation where she's like, oh, how do I exactly manage this new role? Let's get specific.

Yeah, I think a really good recurring situation is. So first of all, my partner splits custody 50 50. So already her time with her daughter is profoundly precious. Like it's half of what it should or could be. And that already has an element of like weight to it. And so when I'm in the picture, when I'm around, like, especially in the beginning, I was very conscientious of and her daughter like helped me become more aware of the fact that I was changing the sort of dynamic from, you know, me and mommy time to like a three of us time.

Yeah.

And that came with some struggles and there was a lot of like hot.

And cold, like, why are you here? Get out of the house. I just want my mom like that.

You know, never like articulated that specifically, but in terms of like the performance of her emotions. Absolutely. And like completely understandably. And something that my partners helped me realize too is I have been going through a version of that as well. Because as we started dating, we weren't spending time with her daughter right away. And then as we like realize, oh, this is gonna be real, this is like, this has legs, this has a future. Let's like start spending time together altogether. And of course her daughter's a huge part of her life. But then my time with her also was getting.

Yes.

You know, and that was really hard for me to admit.

Yeah, it's such a parallel process where like, if I'm in your shoes, Ethan, like I come to the house in a little bit. Forget what my, what the five year old says, I'm gonna say, like, hey, get out of the house. Like, what are you doing here? A little bit. Right. Like we were about to have a fun night of adult time things, you know, and like now we're gonna play. Play doh. Like it's a little different.

Yeah, it's dramatically different. And so like I would say, like, especially as time has gone on, like, we have so much fun together. There's definitely a squeaky wheel needing oil thing that can happen here because we have so much fun. When it's easy, it feels natural. And, like, I don't need advice when it's easy, you know, it's like, hey, Dr. Becky, sometimes it's hard, and this. Some of the squeakiness needs some oil. So it's. Yeah, it's in these moments, definitely, where her daughter feels like she's not getting full attention and that just. I often notice it around transitions. Like, picking her up from school together on a day where there's a custody change. I've noticed that's a big one where, like, emotions run really big. And so just trying to figure out, like, where. You know, where I. How can I show up in a way where I'm also not being like, oh, God, I'm not wanted here.

Yes.

You know, and, like, of course, making sure that she's okay. They're both okay. Yeah.

So the first thing that comes to mind, actually, I want to articulate something that you just did with your body that no one else can see because they're listening. But to me, I just saw, like, kind of wiggling a little bit. Like, do I pick her up? Do I not pick her up? I think the best it gets is, like, the motion of a dance, and I think that's really important as a starting framework. Like, it is going to be a dance of closeness, of distance, of that felt good, that no longer feels good. Ooh, this closeness feels. Oh, that's too much. Okay, back, back, back. Oh, okay. That doesn't feel good to me. I feel like I'm a little, like, not part of anything when I'm here. Okay. I'm gonna move forward because I also can do that sometimes based on my own needs. Okay. That's not exactly it. The daughter loves so much of, you know, the time with you. And then another point's like, wow, that no longer feels good. And I think when we have that dance, like, we can see it from the outside in two very different ways. And one way is like, nothing. Nothing lasts. Nothing works. This is impossible. Another way to look at that would, I think, be to look at it from a bird's eye view of someone on a dance floor where, like, that person's just in motion, and, like, right now, they're on that part of the dance floor, and then they move to another part of the dance floor. And it's not really that nothing works. It's more that nothing is static and final. Does that, like, does that resonate?

Oh, a hundred percent. 100%. Like, moving away from essence and into process is very much how I think. Yeah.

Yeah. And so I think as a starting point, just to say, like, there's no. There's not. There's no right answer. Because actually being in a relationship with anyone is like a constant evolution. And so I am gonna give myself permission to dance around. So let's. Let's get concrete about this. I'm making this up. But if it feels close enough to reality, go with it. If you're like, this is so not reality, please stop me, because I can just go off things I make up in my head. So she's like, I don't want ithan to pick me up on Wednesdays. Or maybe she doesn't say that, but it's just like a massive meltdown. Let's say something like that's happening. I can see for you, there's a lot of. There's a lot of feelings that come up, like. And I think sometimes something big can come up. Like, do I have a place in this family? I think it's like, is it always going to be like this? Like, Wednesdays are just a day that I'm going to be kind of left out. Because on Wednesdays you go to soccer and then you go out to dinner, so I don't come to pick you up. I'm kind of out of the picture on a Wednesday. Right. And I think we can have so many things happening. I think, like, where I would start is actually just with the mindset of, okay, whatever we do on Wednesdays this week or this month not only isn't predictive of Wednesdays in three years, it's not even really predictive of Wednesdays in, like, six to eight weeks. I think that perspective matters so much because very often we do what I call the ffe, the fast forward error. And you can tell me if you're prone to. This is where we use a moment in front of us that's hard. And our brain fast forwards like, I don't know, you know, we're like, wow, she's graduating high school on a Wednesday, and I'm just not gonna be there. Cause I. I can't hang out on Wednesdays. And it sounds ridiculous when we say it, but we really do kind of fill in our life in that way. And then what happens is we feel such panic in changing the intervention today because we don't want it to be that way 18 years from now. And. And when we can just recognize, oh, I'm doing the fast forwarder, like, I'm. Then we actually are grounded back in, like, oh, wait, it's 2023. Like, that's where we are. And then we can lead with a little bit more trust, like in the dance, rather than in kind of the finality of a moment. Tell me what you think about that.

I mean, it's 100% what I needed to hear. Cause the moments feel like, so weighted. And I definitely struggle with precisely that. With one sort of. I think my capacity to dance is hindered by kind of holding a sort of emotional tension precisely because I don't want to drop my dance partners.

Yeah.

And that very literally inhibits my ability to move, to go with the flow. And to also, as you just pointed out, to recognize that today is not forever, and that is hard. That definitely resonates with me.

Yeah. I always make sure today is not predictive. You know, in a way, today is not predictive of all the future moments. Right. And. And the nuance I want to add to that, Ethan, is today is. And it isn't predictive. But I think the way we think it's predictive is the opposite of how it is not going to pick her up at school. That's what we lock into. And then we fast forward how that's predictive. Well, I'm never going to pick her up from school. And no matter what happens on Wednesday, I'm never going to go to soccer, and I'm always going to be left out. We kind of predict similarity on the surface. But if I say what is predictive. Okay. And what I find very, very comforting is. Wait. Okay, so what's really happening here right now? She's voicing something that feels really important to her right now. She's trying to figure out how much time she has with me and how much time she has with her mom and how the transitions go and how much time we have together. And she's just trying to figure that out. And so are we. And the truth is, that part is predictive. Okay. So 10 years from now, we will probably still to some degree be navigating exactly what role everyone takes. And if you trust, which I can tell you do just from how you talk about both of these people in your life, like, if you trust them and you trust in some ways, like their inherent goodness and like, there seems like there's a lot of love, then I. I think trusting that that process will stay the same, like you'll always be Kind of negotiating this. And my bet is what it actually ends up looking like on the surface changes dramatically. Does that difference make sense? Yeah, because it makes me think, like, in another way, people are like, my kid is the only kid who's not joining soccer class. They're never gonna be someone who joins the group. That's predicting kind of, on the surface, things staying the same. But underneath, we're saying, my kid is checking in about whether she's ready. My kid does things when she's comfortable. Like, that might look different 10 years from now, but I would hope that stays consistent for my kid 10 years from now.

Yeah, this is really helpful. It's sort of like, maybe the way I'm kind of seeing it. I like the idea of the surface. Like, the way I'm seeing it is like, ah, okay. What underlying kind of. What is the ocean doing? Not just the waves on the surface.

Yes, exactly. And the ocean's doing what it's supposed to be doing. Like, honestly, even when kids have married parents or partners who live together, that is a negotiation. Sometimes I want dad to just come to my basketball. Sometimes I want both of you to go to my basketball. I want a dinner with, you know, both of you and neither of my siblings. I want a dinner just with Mom. Like, kids have so many needs, and so they're always trying to figure that out. And right now, especially in this family dynamic, yes, it's complicated to say, yes, I'm leaving my dad's house. I'm being transitioned to my mom's house. I kind of need to fill up with mom to feel safe again. I always think that's the essence of healthy attachment. We have a secure base from which we can explore. And in the best of all worlds, our secure base is our adult. And the reason it feels so good to be close to that adult is actually because it gives us the bravery to say, oh, wait, I can try new things. I can attach to new people, in part because I feel very Sakira looking behind me and saying, you are there. And one of the things she really needs to figure out is in this transition, like, are you part of that base right away? Does it feel a little bit like you're a threat to that base? Right. And right now, over time, right. I think it'll change. But right now, I think what she's saying is, I need to kind of feel secure with the base of my mom so I can have fun with you, so I can attach to you. In some ways, I feel like she's saying, I don't want you there on Wednesday when I am picked up. I want that just to be my mom, because that actually is going to be better for our relationship.

Yeah. Yeah. That is so resonant.

Yeah. And, Ethan, I just want to say, nobody likes when kids basically are like, I don't want you there. I don't want to be with you. There's nothing more painful. It's like, I want dad to read me a book that just happened to me last night. And I was like, wait, wait. I came home from work early so I could be present and read this book with you that we've been reading together. And you're. You're. You're kicking me out of room. Like, who are you? Like, you know, it's so, so normal to feel this. There's rejection. There's, like, a little bit of, like, anger. There's a little bit like, hey, is anybody seeing this? You know, like, how is this happening? And that is going back to what you said in the beginning, which I think is so poignant. There's their needs, and there's your needs. That I think it's important to give yourself space to say, yes, I'm doing this dance, and it's a dance I believe in. And, yeah, there are moments of the dance where the dance itself benefits. But me, for me, in that moment, it's hard. It's really hard. And probably unenjoyable. Is that okay to say?

Yeah, I appreciate that. It feels hard to say because I think one of the things that I'm finding challenging in that arena is how to articulate to my partner that there are struggles and things that are hard and even, like, you know, questions that come up, but that those struggles, challenges, and questions aren't destabilizing my intent to be involved, my commitment, you know, and that is. That's hard. And I completely empathize with my partner, you know, hearing that from. From me and being like, this is hard to hear.

Yes.

Because it's, you know, they are question marks.

Yeah. Well, one. One tool I want to give you there. I'm going to sound like a broken record, but two things are true is really one of my favorite phrases. And. And I have had periods where I say it out loud and I'll explain what I mean all the time. And it's, like, gotten to the point where people in my family are like, if you say that one more time, like, I'm so. Seriously, I'm gonna freak out. Stop saying those words. So instead of saying it out loud, I just kind of Say it to myself. But really, the idea behind this is when we really get into conflict with someone where things explode, it's almost always because we're not holding two truths at once. We're stuck in one. And there's something about when you talk to your partner maybe about, hey, yeah, it kind of stinks for me that she doesn't want me there on Wednesdays, like your partner. And it's easy for most people. We hear that. And what we actually translate it to is, Ethan doesn't really know if he wants to be in this partnership. Like, Ethan doesn't really know if he can handle this. Like, Ethan needs me to make that better so that things feel more pleasant. I actually knowing you for, like, 20 minutes, like, I actually really don't think that's what you're saying. And then also, what's missed when we interpret someone that way is now all of a sudden almost like, you have to, like, no, I didn't mean that. And all of a sudden, you're like, wait, I. I think I was upset, and now I'm suddenly kidding. Caregiving for her feelings. Like, I don't. I don't know how that happened. Like, exactly. And the idea of two things are true is really a good starting point. And the way I would start that is even say to someone, like, hey, you know what's interesting? Maybe it sounds obvious to you, but we can really have two very different things that are equally true at the same time. One is not more true. One is not more important. They're equally true. And. And two things that are true for me right now. And I'm gonna speak as you, Ethan, even though obviously amended to be true for you. Two things that are true for me right now is, you know, whether you say, I love you, or I care so deeply about you, or I feel, like, so good about where we're at and our relationship and even our future. And I would actually keep my hand out to show that person, like, this is true. And then I'd put my other hand, like, very apart and almost, like, visually show someone not negating. Right. And what's also true is sometimes it's just tricky for me to manage all the different things that come up with, you know, whatever her name is. And just before we go any further, let me just say that again, because it really matters. Like, I feel so good about our partnership. I feel so good even about your daughter and my growing relationship with her, and I see a future for us, and that all feels so good. And. And did you hear me I didn't say but. There's no but. And it's tricky to kind of do this dance. And then where I think you can go from there, and I'm going to give you a way to react, is saying, and when I share that with you, I don't see the trickiness of managing these relationships as threatening. The way I feel about our partnership, if anything, all I need from you is actually just to kind of hear me or try to understand or things like, yeah, that makes sense. Or, yeah, that would be hard for me too. Like, there's no fix. And I don't need you to fix anything because the first thing still is true, that, like, we have a great relationship. And just like in any relationship, there's moments that are hard. That's all. Tell me what you think about that.

I. Yeah. That.

Our work is done here. I don't know. Our work is done. I'll see you later.

Yeah, I mean, that's. I wish I had heard you say that long ago because I think that I have so often sort of accidentally stumbled into elbowing the foundation a little bit for my partner without even realizing it, because I did not kind of prime things appropriately.

Well, well. And look, there's a two way street here. And this is why I love couples work so much too. Because in our interactions with our partners, what ends up happening is our kind of subjective words really do get interpreted through their histories and their traumas and their fears. So my guess is she's very fearful. Is this gonna be too much for Ethan? Is he gonna feel too rejected? Like, is you. Right. And so if that's someone's fear, actually, even if you say something in the best way, hey, that was hard when she said, don't pick me up. Those words come in through someone's fear as confirmation, and it enters their body as, see, I was right. Ethan wants out of this relationship. Meanwhile, like, you literally didn't say that. This happens in couples therapy all the time. Someone be like, they didn't say that. Right. But they heard that. Right. And this interplay of, how can we. How can we know each other's fears and triggers and histories? Because then you actually can a little bit get to know the way someone is likely to interpret what you're saying, and it's not your responsibility to change them. No, no, no, no. That's not what we do. But we do understand with a lot more nuance how to slow things down and interpret someone's reactivity, which just helps us communicate more effectively.

Yeah.

And that's Something, Ethan, I wonder, like, could she hear that? Like, I wonder if you said to her, hey, you know, sometimes I wonder if one of the things that's hard about hearing me complain or voice kind of some struggles in this dynamic. I wonder if, like, you ever worry that it's just going to be too much for me and this is going to make me be the thing that pulls the cord, like, and I'm only asking you that because I feel like knowing that would be so helpful to me to try to, you know, communicate in ways to really assure you that I'm here so we can make space for how I'm reacting. Like, do you think she could hear that from you?

Absolutely. I actually, you know, I think she's even articulated that to me. And what's really fascinating about that is that then made me reflect back on myself and ask myself, well, why am I communicating in a way that is sort of like trying to create space for myself in a way that then doesn't feel safe for my partner? And then that sort of brought me down, like, oh, okay, well, what's my history around feeling like my needs are being met from my Love Lab original Love Lab?

Well, look, putting yourself in the equation matters. Like, you and you started with that. And I actually love that about you, that you were saying, you know, her daughter and her and you, like, we all have feelings, right? And it's messy, and sometimes that feels like, you know, there's not enough space for all of our feelings to be heard and met. But certainly it seems so important in this dynamic for you to feel like it's okay to voice some messy feelings. And I actually think you and your partner, this will be a, like, an amazing project. Say, like, okay, so part of our project. And to me, knowing the projects we have with our partners is, like, the best it gets. Like I always say, when my kids want to get married, I'm going to say something like, very unromantic to them. I'm going to say, okay, think about your partner. Is this the particular set of problems you want to deal with the rest of your life? And I'm not saying that because your partner's bad, because everyone has a set of problems. It's just about saying, is this the set I want to deal with? Right? And knowing the set of problems makes you way ahead of the game, and you kind of know it. Okay, so sometimes when I voice things are upsetting to me within this family structure, it probably triggers you maybe to feel like, oh, he's going somewhere, or try to talk me out of those feelings and then I don't know her as well. To figure out coming back and to be able to say, hey, the fact that we can articulate this early, it's like we know the landmines in our field, if there's everyone has landmines. But knowing them puts you way ahead of the game. That's amazing.

Yeah, I really like that. That's such a helpful framework.

I want to thank you for sharing so much and for being really so open and reflective and receptive. I can tell in this short conversation like oh my goodness, how lucky any family would be to have you join them.

I really appreciate it. It's really been great to speak with you. It's been interesting being someone who doesn't have biological kids, like getting to know your work. And as my question when I reached out stated, like us future step parents need more resources 100%. So this has been great.

Oh, thank you.

Thank you.

Thanks for listening. To share a story or ask me a question, go to goodinside.com podcast. You could also write me@podcastoodinside.com parenting is the hardest and most important job in the world and parents deserve resources and support so they feel empowered, confident and connected. I'm so excited to share Good Inside Membership, the first platform that brings together content and experts you trust with a global community of like valued parents. It's totally game changing. Good inside with Dr. Becky is produced by Jesse Baker and Eric Newsome at Magnificent Noise. Our production staff includes Sabrina Farhey, Julia Natt, and Kristen Muller. I would also like to thank Erica Belsky, Mary Panico, and the rest of the Good Inside team. And one last thing before I let you go, let's end by placing our hands on our hearts and reminding ourselves, even as I struggle and even as I have a hard time on the outside, I remain Good Inside.