The Most Powerful Intervention for Siblings

I'm Dr. Becky and this is good inside.

I kind of got sidetracked by my oldest a couple weeks ago when he said, no, why didn't you have my brother sooner so that I would have someone my age to play with? You know, I know they love each other, but I really want to help them have a good relationship.

Having a sibling is hard and when one of your kids complains about the other kid or wishes that their sibling was different, it's tricky. Do we hold space for those feelings? What about defending our other kid? How do we manage the feelings our kid has about their sibling?

This is exactly what we're going to get into.

More after this. Hi, Anna, nice to meet you.

Nice to meet you.

So tell me a little bit about you and what's on your mind.

Yeah, of course. So I have two boys at home. I have an eight year old and a two year old. Two boys, very hectic. Pretty good age gap in between them. So different stages of both growth and just maturity all the way around. I had my oldest very, very young. Definitely not planned. Kind of came as a surprise. So we did decide to wait before bringing him another sibling and, you know, becoming a bigger family. And right now what I'm currently struggling with is helping them develop a healthy relationship given their age gap. My 8 year old is very independent, he is a very social person, he's great with other kids his age. But when it comes to his little brother and sharing and having an 8 year old try to understand that what a 2 year old does is never personal, has really been a rough spot for us. I know he loves his little brother, but helping nurture that relationship is what I'm really struggling with. Having to explain to him, hey, he doesn't mean to break your lego that you spent an hour building isn't personal. He very much just wants to play with what you're playing and, you know, just trying to give them both equal space and attention without comparison. The biggest question I have for you is I kind of got sidetracked by my oldest a couple weeks ago when he said, no, why didn't you have my brother sue sooner so that I would have someone my age to play with. And that one hurt a little bit just because, you know, I'm not going to explain to my 8 year old financials and all that whole process, but I kind of just was left speechless as kind of his awareness of the age gap and how he's struggling to play with him. But I have other siblings as well that have a big age graph And I do. You know, we did miss out on a lot of time, but we did catch up. And as I navigate this world of being a parent of two, it's definitely been a learning experience, especially as I have to second grader versus still in daycare. And when we're all home having not these outbursts of, this is mine, no babies in my room. I don't want you touching my stuff. And, you know, I know they love each other, but I really want to help them have a good relationship. I know that that comes with time, but I'm open to all the possible advice.

Well, thank you for bringing this to me, really. And I know you're not alone in this struggle, and it could relate to the similar age gap that someone else listening has as well. Yeah, my kids aren't exactly close in age. That's tricky when they're young. I know someone else is probably thinking, yeah, I have, I don't know, two boys and a girl. And my daughter's always saying, why don't I have a sister? Or, you know, in some ways it's not that dissimilar when a kid says, well, why aren't you living in the same house as mommy anymore? And I want that. We all have times where our kids say something to us, where it feels like they're. They're questioning decisions we made or they're speaking up for a wish that we can't gratify. So, you know, the first thing that comes to mind is I think about when our kids say things to us that, like, we feel like. It sounds like you feel this, like in your. I don't know if it's your heart or your chest or your stomach. It's like, oh, I don't know. Is that. Is that what it feels like?

Yeah, it's. It's everywhere. I. I definitely felt almost like it was a personal. Not. I don't want to say attack, but I did felt like it was something that instant regret just steeped into me and said, maybe I messed up. Maybe I should have. We should have done this sooner. Did I ruin his childhood? Am I not doing a good job by giving him a sibling sooner? So it was a lot of regret and guilt after he made that comment.

And that's so poignant, Anna, just to realize because what you're saying, and this is going to be a key understanding that's going to help us with an intervention is, you know, I hear something my son says to me. It's helpful when we hear something from someone else to almost visualize it. It's like a thing outside of us. No one besides you who's listening can see this right now. But you can see I actually have my hands in front of me. Like, here are these words like, why didn't you have my brother sooner? Why didn't you have another kid so I could actually have a playmate, you know, who's around my age. So, okay, I'm visualizing this thing as like an object outside of me. And what you're saying is like, it comes into my body, then it no longer feels just like something my kid is saying or experiencing. It actually comes into me. And when it does come into us, it often shifts a little bit what we hear. It feels like our kid is like saying something a little different to us. So when your son says, why don't you, you know, why didn't you have a kid who's more around my age? What does it feel like he's saying to you?

To me, it feels that, that he's lonely. That he really just wants someone to be with him and play with him consistently. And that to me hurts because I'm like, you know, you're not alone, like. And it's also hard cause I'm trying to help him understand, like, we don't, you know, it's okay to have individual play.

But I'm gonna jump in there for a sec because what you said so many powerful things already. It seems like he's almost saying I'm lonely, but you're saying it also is associated with your regret or your own guilt. And so I wonder if it also feels like he's saying. And you tell me just cause I say something definitely doesn't mean it's right. I say wrong things. Most of the things that come out of my mouth are wrong. Ask my husband.

Okay?

But it can feel like our kid is saying, you made me lonely, it's your fault. On lonely, does that resonate at all?

Oh, yeah, yeah. That's again, all guilt. I'm like, maybe we should have done it sooner. And I just, I start to question, am I taking, like, should we have done this? Should I start doing this? I try to find solutions when there's nothing. I can't go back and change, you know, I can't go back and change.

Yeah, it's like, I need to go adopt a second seven and a half year old child right now. Like, almost like we start to think about these things. We're like, wow, like, I didn't. That was not my life plan. But like, suddenly I'M looking up adoption agencies.

I don't know what happened. Right.

Exactly. Okay, so. But I want to separate a couple things. We all do this with our kids, honestly. We do this with our partners. We do this with our mother in laws. We do this with people at work all the time. We take something someone said outside of us, and the thing that we actually react to is a version of it that we've translated to ourselves that often comes kind of connects to our own insecurity or our own worry. And then when we respond, we're not usually responding to the thing the person said or what it might mean to them. We're responding to the translation we're most worried about inside ourselves. And this is the essence of why communication goes wrong between any two people. Because we think we're talking to each other. We're just responding to a version of what someone said that most reflects our own insecurities and worries.

Right.

So it feels like he's saying, you're making me lonely. You made a mistake. Your decision to have a kid six years after me is making my childhood a lot worse than it could have been. And you did this to me. I'm being extreme, but is that.

Yeah, that's exactly what it feels like.

Right. And so no wonder in your body your overwhelmed with pain. And it's like, ugh. Any amount of my own conflict that I felt about that decision or my own looking back and wondering about different choices I could have made, that's all surfaced, all of the pain. And I feel immense urge to fix the situation. But here's the kicker, okay. What we really feel the urge to fix is. Is nothing about what our kids said, we actually feel the urge to fix this way. We've translated it inside our own body to kind of soothe our own pain. And then in that way. And by the way, let me tell you, every parent does this. I do this with my kids too. Our kid and whatever they're going through, it almost becomes like a pawn in our own game. Like, now I just need to soothe myself and all my own guilt. So maybe I am gonna go adopt that seven and a half year old child just to make me feel better. But like, what was it my. So I don't exactly remember. He was just. I feel like my son's over here. Be like, whoa, mom. Like, I was just feeling a little lonely today. Like, I don't want a third kid in this family. Right.

Exactly. Yeah.

So what I want to do here together in this short time, but I know we'll be able to do it is I want to just practice with you. Really separating what your kid's saying, what your kid might actually be feeling, what gets evoked in you, and then a dual set of coping skills for you to manage your own feelings and worries, and really separating that from the coping skills you can help your son build for whatever's he is actually feeling. And really separating those two things so they don't get collapsed into one. Does that make sense?

Yeah. And I think that that'd be super helpful. Cause he's just. He's a very sensitive child. And I think we've. I think now that he has a sibling, it's been amplified even more. Yeah.

So let's start with you, right? I know we're here to talk about what your son's bringing, but to me, sturdy leaders always actually start by gazing in to access more of their sturdiness, and then they can give more of that to anyone else. So let's start with you. It sounds like you have mixed feelings about this age gap between your kids. In a different world, if things had, I don't know, gone a different way, would you have said, yeah, ideally, if situation was different, I would have had my kids closer together?

Oh, absolutely. Yeah, that was definitely the ideal scenario. But again, it happened unexpectedly. We were both young. It just did not seem like the right time. As much as we did think about it. It just didn't seem right. It's what happens to our plans.

Right. Reality happens. And we're like, oh, I guess I have to adjust my plans.

Exactly. And it's almost like his comment to me was almost like an acceptance of what the current situation is. And I think I still struggle with that sometimes of this is my age gap, and if I choose to have another one, like, it's going to be even bigger. And, you know, I think I struggle with, that's not what I wanted. That's not the family I wanted to create. So that's what I am still working through, especially as I see them grow.

I'm thinking about two of the most powerful phrases I often teach parents to use with kids, and I'm thinking about them both now as versions of self. Talk for yourself. Okay, so one of them is just, you didn't want that to happen. And the other one is, you weren't expecting that. So often our kid falls or something and they get really hurt, and we're like, it's fine, it's fine. Our kid just doesn't seem fine. But the scratch wasn't that big. And what they really need to hear is, is some version of you didn't want that to happen or you weren't expecting that, it's just a violation of expectations that we need to validate. And I'm thinking about that with you, Anna. Just the power of saying to yourself, even right now, I didn't want this, this is not what I wanted or this is not what I expected. What resonates more with you? Which version of those?

This is not what I wanted.

Yeah, so. And I just want to pause on that, just validating that in its simplest form. This age gap isn't what I wanted, it's what I have. But this age gap isn't what I wanted. What comes up for you when you say that? What do you notice?

The main thing that comes up to me is just all these expectations of having small children close in age. You know, my sisters and I have a 13 and 14 year age gap and that was hard. It was great, you know, because we caught up to each other and we have great conversations now as adults. But no 20 year old wants to spend time with like their 10 year old little sister. So it definitely to me brings back flashbacks of, you know, what if we did go to high school at the same time or what if we did have the same kind of friends. So it's almost like I want to give my children like a more connected childhood than what I had.

And you were the younger one?

Yeah, I'm the youngest.

Who was there for you when you were sad about your siblings not wanting to play with you or did you. Who was there for you for that?

Honestly, it was a lot of friends. It was a lot of like my neighborhood friends. I kind of kept myself very preoccupied on like in sports and other clubs that I tried to do. So I don't, it's almost like I force myself to not focus on that as much.

Did you have anyone to talk to about that? Anyone who understood those feelings?

No, definitely, definitely not. Parents were very much like, this is what it is and this is what we're going with.

So there's a couple things there. And this is going to end up coming full circle as things, you know, often do. You have this large age gap with your two kids in the same way that you experienced the younger kid end of a large age gap with your siblings. And I think you remember, Anna, you do feeling probably sad and lonely and full of unmet wishes around that. And yes, when your son comments on that age gap, it makes sense that all of that comes up. But I want to Point out a really, really big difference. Okay. We often remember pain from our childhood, and we find it very triggering when we think about our kids experiencing a version of that same pain today. But here's the thing. It's not the pain of certain events from our childhood. It's actually the pain of being alone with those events in our childhood. Right. Events themselves aren't traumatic or aren't the things that really give us a lot of distress. It's actually feeling very alone. Not having someone to talk to, not having someone to understand, not having someone who validates. Yes, that is hard. And of course, you want your siblings to be here. And that would have been amazing if you could have gone to high school. And that's very real. And you're allowed to feel mad and you wish we had you sooner. Like, I know none of those things happen for you. And so it's so easy to say, oh, and then, look, I did the same thing to my sons. Like, why did I do that? And this is awful. But I think it's really important to slow down and say, wait, there's a huge difference. And reminding yourself that, I think, will make it less triggering. There's a huge difference. I can learn to be there for both of my sons in a way that no one was there for me. And so on the surface, the age gap looks similar, but actually, how that will play out and how they feel, I have the power to make very, very different. Does that make sense?

Oh, yeah. Yeah, it definitely does.

And before we move to how to manage this with your son, I think it's important for you to give yourself permission. Like, I'm sad. Like, I'm sad, Forget my kids, that I didn't have siblings who were closer in my age and more around. And that's real. And that feels like a loss of my early years. And I'm allowed to feel that way.

Yeah. I think having kids and seeing it in real life definitely brings that back.

Yes, I think that's right. It brings those feelings back.

Right.

When we see our kids potentially feeling similarly to a painful feeling we had, it's so hard. We're like, am I responding to my kids? Am I responding to that inner child and myself? Well, I don't even know what, you know, what year I'm living in anymore.

Yeah.

It all comes together. And I'd give yourself permission to. To say to that little girl inside you, probably words that adult wasn't equipped to say to her, like, yeah, it's okay that you feel sad. And it makes sense. You're jealous of your friends who have siblings with them in high school. And those are hard feelings, and those are feelings that make sense.

I definitely feel like you're right. It's definitely full circle. Even, like now seeing the kids do it, go through it, and then just reflecting on everything it. I think, like I said, it's a hard acceptance because it's not. This isn't what I expected. This wasn't what I envisioned. I didn't want them to go through it. And then having to relive it again after not thinking about it for such a long time has. As a mother, you just have really high expectations of across the board. So I definitely need to be kinder.

To myself and separating those things. Right. Okay. I didn't expect this. I didn't want this. That's hard. I'm allowed to feel, you know, my feelings about that. No one likes when things don't go the way they planned or wanted. Okay, so that's real. Right. It's always hard to hear that our kids feel distressed or lonely. Okay. That's hard. I'm allowed to have feelings about my own childhood and maybe the support I could have used. Okay. And just because on the surface, my kid has a similar experience to something that was painful to me. On the surface, that might be similar, but what's very, very different is I can help out both my sons in a way that no one was there for me. A big thing I think about all the time, and I think it's applicable to so many situations, is just feelings don't give us problems. Feeling alone in our feelings gives us problems. And this kind of connects to your aloneness. Right. But I think about your son and him saying, I wish I had a brother closer in my age, and you're noticing an urge to fix it. Whenever we intervene from a place of fixing for someone else, ironically, that person is often left more alone than they were before in their feeling because they're like, I feel lonely. And we're like, kind of running circles, trying to come up with solutions. And I always picture a kid just saying, like, yeah, like, I don't know what you're doing. Like, I just need you to. To be here with me. Like, you know, now. Now I feel alone because you're running circles around it. And so I want to go over some other things you could do, because you can't change his lonely feelings. You can't change his wish to have a brother his age, but you can help him feel less alone about both those things, and that makes A massive difference. I want to share with you one of my favorite lines. Whenever my kid. One of my kids says something to me that's pretty painful, I try to say this. I'm not always successful because I'm also triggered and, you know, have my moments. But it's a really simple line. It's just, I'm so glad you're sharing that with me. I'd love to hear you say that back to me.

I love that you're sharing this with me. Yeah.

And for bonus points, be like, that's so important.

Yeah, it's. It's so important.

Yeah. I'm gonna say I'm gonna be your son. Oh, so annoying. He's so young. And I wish you just, you know, had another kid who was closer to my age.

This is so important that you're sharing with me. Thank you.

Great. And now just watching yourself. I have this too. I have to fight it. Watching yourself, it feels so incomplete. It's like probably on your head. You're like, okay, Dr. Becky, is that like the best you got? Like, and then what? And then do I, you know, go, I don't know, get a toy for him or go set up a playdate or something else? And there's nothing wrong with, like, really.

Come through with those adoption papers?

Yeah, exactly. Exactly. You know, what do I do? And it's not to say we can't, like, do certain things, of course. Like, there's moments to be like, okay, what can we do about this? But if you jump to the doing before, the sitting with the feeling, you end up moving at a faster pace than your kid, and they're alone kind of behind you being like, hey, remember how I was feeling? Like, nobody's here. And so to me, just being prepared with certain lines, like, I'm so glad you're sharing this with me. This is so important. Another one that is similar to that is just look. That makes sense. It makes sense that you'd want to have a playmate or. You're right. Right now your brother really can't do any of the things with you that you would love a brother to do. You're right. I'm just kind of surrounding my kids distress, like, with my presence and my understanding and my validation. And again, this is a big difference for your son and you, Anna, because when we have a powerful feeling like loneliness or jealousy or distress, and we don't have a loving adult in our childhood who can kind of surround it and in that way almost put like a loving boundary around it, like a hug Then the feeling balloons. It's like it gets bigger and bigger because no one's there to help us contain it. By contrast, when a kid is able to share a feeling and when, as a parent, you kind of picture yourself when, whether you're literally giving them a hug or not, you're almost, like, putting this hug around the feeling. You're kind of saying to them, like, I'll make sure it doesn't get much more overwhelming than this because I'm here with you. I'm gonna kind of in part, hold that feeling for you. Does that make sense?

Yeah. Yeah. No, it definitely does. And I think I always want him to feel like we have time for him no matter what. And I feel like that's so hard when you have more than one child. He also. And I'm sure you've gotten this before, but who's your favorite? You know, what was the best day? Was it when I was born or when he was born? So.

And look, I can hear from you that you have a superpower. Like, you can really hear his distress and worry under his complaints. And that's something I'd encourage you to share back with him. That's powerful. Like, you can definitely feel free to say to him when he says, who do you love more? Which was your favorite day? I think you can say back a lot of what you said to me. Look, I think you're really telling me it's really hard still to adjust to having a sibling. You had six years of it just being you, and it probably sometimes feels like. And this is just your words echoed back. It probably sometimes feels like he gets all of our attention and you don't get it anymore. Often when our kid hears that, like, they kind of hear what's really going on for them under their. On the surface question. Right. They feel much more seen. And then the other thing I would say, and I'm guessing you do this right. Is just carving out a little bit of time in your week to have alone time with each of your kids is truly the most powerful intervention for siblings. And saying that, hey, you're right. I do spend a lot of time with your younger sibling. And I understand that's annoying for you. Six years where you had us all to yourself, and then this guy comes and is, like, needing me to do his food and needing me to do this thing. I get it.

Right?

Like, it's annoying. You know what? Me and you need to do a better job carving out time on the calendar where it's just us. Just us. Let's look at our calendar. Let's do some of those things. And it doesn't have to be anything spectacular. You don't have to take them to, like, Disney World. It can be, let's do a Lego together. Or it could be, hey, let's do anything you want. Let's go out for a quick ice cream. Right? 15 minutes. Minutes here and there. Because in that time, essentially what you're saying to him through your actions, not through your words, is like, you have my full attention. You really matter to me.

Exactly. Yeah.

I just want to tell you, one of the benefits from a big age gap is that you have so many years with a sibling to become friends and playmates. Like you said, like, eventually it all catches up. One of the big benefits is your older son will develop a different sense of kind of empathy or sense of even personal responsibility. Right. In a way that could be super beneficial to him. So I think this same set of skills will be really helpful. Is really asking yourself in these painful moments, wait, what did he say? Let me keep that outside of me. What do I worry he's saying about me? Or what are my own fears? And I want to listen to those fears. But you can even say to yourself, I'm going to journal about that tonight. I'm going to ask my son. It's like, that's not really what he said. Right. So clearly something's coming up for me. But I'm gonna put that to the side, not throw it away. I'm gonna put it on the shelf and I will return to it. And then for these things he says, just having, like, sometimes at parent check, I write them down. So those lines, thank you so much for sharing this or I'm so glad you're sharing this with me. It's so important. Tell me more about that. Tell me about a time you felt that way. I wanna figure this out. You're really sitting with him in the feeling, and that's gonna help him so much. And I just know, talking to you, that you've got this. I know it.

Thanks for listening. To share a story or ask me a question, go to goodinside.com podcast. You could also write me@podcastoodinside.com parenting is the hardest and most important job in the world, and parents deserve resources and support so they feel empowered, confident, and connected. I'm so excited to share Good Inside Membership, the first platform that brings together content and experts you trust with a global community of, like, valued parents. It's totally game Changing good inside with Dr. Becky is produced by Jessie Baker and Eric Newsom At MagnificentNoise, our production staff includes Sabrina Farhee, Julia Natt and Kristen Muller. I would also like to thank Erica Belsky, Mary Panico and the rest of the good inside team. And one last thing before I let you go, let's end by placing our hands on our hearts and reminding ourselves, even as I struggle and even as I have a hard time on the outside, I remain good inside.