Birth to Net Worth with Forrest Blackburn

Join us as we unravel our deep-rooted relationship with money, from earliest memories to eureka moments and building wealth. Birth to Net Worth with me, Trystan Trenberth. Hey everyone, welcome to another edition of Birth to Net Worth. Welcome to my wonderful friend Forrest Blackburn. He's been in the business of real estate with me for some time and we've become great friends the last few years. It's my pleasure to welcome him to Birth to Net Worth. Welcome, Forrest. Thanks for joining us.

Thank you. Thanks for having me. We've been talking about it for a while. We have.

Yeah. Suddenly it's come around all of a sudden.

No, it's great.

So, well, let's get started, Forrest. So as we talked about, this is really a conversation about money, people's relationship with money through their lives, how it changes. So tell me about your first experience, your first memory of money.

Wow. We're going way back, aren't we? You know, I was fortunate enough to grow up in a, in a, in a well-to-do family. My dad was in real estate. I'm actually fourth generation real estate. That's right. So my dad was a commercial broker and developer. His father before him was a broker and developer and his father before him.

So you're all broke?

Yeah, we're all brokers. Yeah. But, you know, growing up, you know, there was a major shift in real estate in the '80s. And, you know, my dad did very exceedingly well. And, you know, I remember he was mostly land is what he was doing. And, and he was really doing wholesale before it was even a term. I mean, I remember being 3 or 4 years old going out on appointments with him.

Yeah.

And you know, he would do things where he would go and tie up maybe an 8-hole golf course with land around it. And then he put together all the plans and, you know, map it all out with permits and everything to be an 18-hole with a, with a country club. And I remember one, it had 287 modular units around it and it was all mapped up and ready to go. And then he'd turn around and sell that to an investor. Yeah, all packaged together. So I used to go out on those appointments with him all the time. And, you know, I remember these high-dollar amounts that were being thrown around and You know, when you're that age, it really doesn't matter. Yeah. You know, you're thinking about what's the next toy you're going to get. Yeah. You have to do to get it. Yeah. Which was, I will say, you know, a very important thing that my folks ingrained into me that, you know, things just— you don't just get things, you know, you have to do something and do well or— yeah, it's a reward, you know. And that followed through with school as I got older, you know, good grades meant cool stuff, you know, and I always had cooler stuff than everybody else. And, you know, there was the labeling of being spoiled. But really, I worked for that stuff. You know, I put in the time to, to be able to earn those things. But as the real estate market kind of, you know, came to a halt after Reagan was president and everything kind of changed, I— there was a fallout, you know, and my folks went through some hard times. And I remember my dad moved out. We were— I'm born and raised in San Diego, so I grew up in San Diego and he had to move out to Salt Lake City for, for about 8 or 9 months, maybe a better part of a year. And he was brokering land for telecommunication and cell phone antennas. And, you know, that's what kept things moving. But it was at that time, seeing what that put my mother through, that from being a queen to being, you know, watching pennies and clipping coupons, that I really started to realize that, you know, wow, money really matters. Yeah. You know, it doesn't just matter on getting cool stuff. It matters on survival. Yeah. And I was about 12 or 13 when he was doing the Salt Lake City thing. Maybe I was younger than that. I was younger than that. But that's when I really started taking notice of money being an important factor in just living, you know, and being able to experience life. We would go on these lavish trips and it was great. But then that all came to a stop for a minute. Everything turned back around again. Everything goes in cycles. But that's really when I started realizing that, you know, money was important. And, you know, my dad being a third generation, you know, successful realtor was always telling me, hey, you can always do real estate. And at the time I was just getting into doing, you know, theater and TV and commercials and things. And that lit me up. That was going to be that. That's what I'm going to do, you know, and not knowing the competition that's involved in that and that very few people make it. But I was going to hell or high water.

There was no—

there was no ifs, ands, or buts. What's a plan B for when plan A is obviously going to work out? Yeah. And but he was always talking about real estate and my mother was always pushed back on that. You know, she'd say, John, don't— real estate's too up and down. I don't want that for him.

Yeah.

And I knew at that point why, because they'd gone through these hills and valleys. So, and real estate, the idea of real estate, getting into real estate was getting into residential real estate. And to me that felt very, I don't even know if people use the term anymore, I guess I'm dating myself, but very suede shoe, very, you know, very catty. It was being in a residential real estate office was, you know, kind of the glorified, you know, car sales position in my mind. In my mind. Yeah. And So I shied away from it. It wasn't anything that I wanted to get into. And I did well. I did okay in, you know, music and acting. And Capitol Records paid me very well for a while, but I didn't have an importance on money at that time. So all that money that I got, I partied away. Yeah, I have those experiences and most people don't have those experiences or the stories that I have to share, which is kind of novel. And make for some interesting conversations for sure. But it didn't invest in anything that has a return. Yeah. And when my grandmother passed away, I had saved up some good money from acting. But when my grandmother passed away, she left, you know, a fairly sizable inheritance. So I put everything together and I purchased my first house and I was 19 years old and I purchased my first house in Burbank, California for cash. And I put about $48,000 or $50,000 into that property. Yeah, new kitchen. It was built in the '20s. So new kitchen, new bathrooms, new pretty much everything. Big garage conversion into a recording studio because that's where I was at one point. And I ended up selling that a couple of years later and did a 1031 exchange into a condominium in Orange County, California. And that was really my first experience personally in real estate transaction. But again, all I was doing was just living. You know what I mean? I wasn't looking at real estate as to make money. Yeah. I was still, you know, head up my ass on all this acting and music stuff. Yeah. So it wasn't really a vocation. It was just, just something to do and it made money. And I took that money and I put it into a record label and lost it all. And again, you know, the entertainment industry bit me in the ass again. But through the entertainment industry and coming out of Capitol Records and then working for the UFC out in Las Vegas. In between there, I worked for Paramount Pictures doing marketing and we were losing a lot of our budget or our budget was being reallocated, I should say, to this new digital medium on Google. Yeah, Facebook wasn't really a thing yet. It was still the MySpace days. I'm dating myself, I know that. But we— this budget allocation was happening. I went out and worked for the UFC, and when that gig turned out, I said, I need to move back to Orange County and get into this whole Google thing and figure out what this marketing is, because I think it's got legs. Yeah, well, you know, it did.

It does.

Yeah. So that's what I did. And I got into marketing and advertising and grew a very large marketing company. And in turn, a few years down the road from that, I was approached by Tarek El Moussa. The show Flip or Flop. Yeah. And to come in and scale their business because that's what I became very good at. And it wasn't a book that I read. Yeah, it was just putting it together and this is working. Well, let's do it again in another office and another office and another office. And then I had 17 franchises nationally and, you know, 50,000 small and medium businesses we serviced between 2009 and 2019. So it was a monster. But because of that, That's why, you know, Tarek and group reached out and I went in to scale their business and I very quickly latched into it just because of what I had in my brain and in my blood, I guess, from real estate. Yeah, for me, coupled with the marketing and sales scalability that I had, it just kind of came into a perfect storm and scaled, you know, Tarek's company very quickly using real estate wholesale. Yeah. You know, the show Flip or Flop is all based on flips and that's a long cash cycle. So by really leaning into the wholesale aspect of it, that becomes that fast cash turn that I was able to roll into marketing and advertising and spending $500,000 a month in, in marketing and advertising. And that's, you know, PPC, TV, radio. Yeah, you name it, billboards, everything. And doing over $2 million a month in assignment fees consecutively. December, we only did $1 million, but we gave everybody half the month off for the holidays.

Right.

Yeah, true story. But I just found out that it worked. And it— in working with Tarek, I saw how you can make money in real estate without being in a real estate office. Yeah. Without being a realtor. Yeah. And I'm not a real estate agent. I never plan to be. I don't want my license. I am able to talk direct to sellers even if they're listed with an agent. I'm able to do things that I partner with, with people that have their licenses.

Yeah, absolutely.

That helps. But I quickly learned that you can make a lot of money. You can take your money from your sales and marketing efforts and invest that into very, you know, strong wealth generating assets. And from that relationship with Tarek, I met Cody, and now Cody and I work together. Cody Sperber, the Clever Investor. And I've been building my own personal portfolio and rolling the money that I generate into those wealth-producing assets and growing a portfolio of short-term and long-term rentals and multifamily is next on my list. Yeah, I have this thing. It's a bucket list. I want 400 doors. It's a soft goal, you know, but if I can achieve that and I'd really like a complex because then I'm just buying 400 toilets and 400 kitchen countertops and do everything in bulk. And I don't have to have a property manager that's driving all over the county. Yeah, it's all in one location. So that's really something that I want to do. But it wasn't until I really, you know, saw the ups and downs of money as a child that I really started grabbing that money was important and moving forward into real estate. It wasn't until I got into really in Tarek's orbit where I really started to understand everything that my dad was saying that I was very closed-eared about. Yeah. And, you know, I look back on that and I kick myself because had I listened to what my father was saying and maybe he wasn't saying it right. Yeah, I'm a demonstrative learner. So if you tell me something, I maybe get it. But if you show me, that's a different deal. And Tarek definitely showed me those things. So I owe a lot to Tarek for that. But that's when I really understood that making money and having money is a safety blanket. But being able to take that money and invest it into something and making your money make you money as opposed to you just working to make money. Yeah, those were probably the, that's probably the big changing point for me.

So your parents, let's go back to their kind of perspectives on money. Obviously you were raised, you know, as you mentioned, they were doing pretty well when you were young. Were they savers? Were they investors in assets at that point? Or were they just living in the spoils of, you know, active income through listings, brokerage deals, that DR thing?

No, my dad was very investment-minded. My mother, on the other hand, was very spend-minded. So, you know, my mom loved to spend money. It was kind of a drug for her, tragically enough. And, you know, she— once my father got of age where he wasn't able to really produce anymore. Yeah. And, you know, as, as you're a 1099 and everything is an independent, it's up to you on whether or not you want to have 401s and all of those things. And he did not. So when he stopped working, the money was just there to be pulled from and she pulled the hell out of it. And to the point where the last few years of their life, you know, I was— I— they had had to sell all their houses. We had houses, we had a 7,000-square-foot house in Puerto Vallarta that was just amazing with two pools and an elevator and Laguna Beach. That house was unbelievable. They had 3 in the same gated community in Laguna Beach because just because. Yeah. And 3 different places in Palm Springs at the same time. And it would be just frivolous. A lot of, a lot of frivolous. And they had to sell all those to continue to survive. And that ran out because of my mom's health, her health. I always used to say, you know, some people have it all. My mom's got it all except her health. Yep. And she had health problems most of her life and those health bills were very expensive. So all of that money ended up going out the window to the point where I was paying for a rental in Palm Springs, a little rental that they lived in. And, you know, tragically enough, I lost them both last year, about 4 months apart in that, in that house. And that was a real tough pill to swallow. It still is. But Yeah, it's— I say this to my students, I say this when I'm on stage. Money comes and money goes. Yeah. But, you know, the knowledge that we gain never goes away. But then it comes down to what you do with it. And I think that that also spills over into money. When you do have money, when you are on a run, what do you do with it? Do you just hoard it and spend it? Do you blow it on gold sinks and marble columns and flashy cars and jewelry? Yeah. Because you can't take that with you. And it's— and sure, you can pass it on generationally, but there's depreciation like crazy, whereas with real estate there's appreciation. Yeah. And it's an entirely different, you know, way to invest your money. So I learned that because I went from kind of this prince to pauper with them and had to reinvent myself and make that money to be able to then support my parents. Who had always, you know, blessed me and supported me. So it was a very major change, you know, in my ecosystem. And that was another hard pill to swallow. You know, reinventing yourself is not easy. And, you know, when you have to take care of loved ones, especially the people that you look up to and that have always taken care of you, it's a change. Yeah. You know, it's different. So, but yeah, so my mom, she spent— my dad wanted to invest in before he could invest it, she'd blow it on something. Yeah, it was, it was, it was frustrating to watch and frustrating for my dad too. Yeah.

Yeah. So getting into your acting and your music career with that background of, you know, abundance at that point, how did that work with you? You bought your first house cash, which is something a lot of people don't get the chance to do. Yeah. Built a recording studio. You know, you're building your career, but maybe it wasn't paying as much as, you you may have hoped at certain times through acting. Yeah. How did that history of relationship with money move into there? Did that help you or hinder you through those times?

You know, it's— that's a, that's a great question, dude. Um, you know, I— the band STP, Scott Weiland, right? Um, there's a lot of people that are fans of him that will tell you that his music and his performances, tragically enough, were much better when he was on drugs. Yeah, when he was down and out. And when he was sober and his life was going well, the performance wasn't really there, his writing quality wasn't really there. Um, there were times when, you know, I, I did everything I could, and my parents did too. We were aligned to where, you know, I was completely on my own and had to take care of myself entirely, um, in my late teens and early 20s. And I did that on purpose because as a rock musician, the whole ideology is that you have something to, something to cry about. So you write a song about it. Yeah. And, you know, most rock musicians, if you're a really tried and true rock musician, you're either on stage— there's a joke, right? You know, if you're a rock musician, it's, it's like how, you know, if you have a roof over your head, then you must have a girlfriend. Yeah, right. Yeah. Most rock musicians are struggling and they don't have a pot to piss in nor a window to throw it out of. So It's a struggle. And, you know, that's where you get the, the black eyeliner and the black nail polish and the grungy look. And it's really because they're, they're depressed, they're— it's dark. So I really had to play that role and put myself into, you know, that mental state and that, that vibe just to be good at what I was doing and also be credible and be believable. At what I was doing. And it was for myself too, to really own that, that, that role that I was playing in my life and turn it into, you know, something that I was going to do forever. But it's not sustainable. The drugs, the partying, the girl, it's just, it's not sustainable. And, you know, my hat's off to people like Steven Tyler and some of these people that are still alive. They're in and out of rehab and, you know, they, but it's tragic. No matter how much money they have, they still have crazy demons. Yeah, I didn't have those demons and— but I still wore the eyeliner and the nail polish and yeah, so I literally had to falsely be broke in order to get myself into that mindset. And that's a clash. And I think that that's probably one of the reasons why It's almost like method acting, but in music. Yeah, yeah. Self in the mindset, it really was. Um, and I think that that could be— I mean, maybe I'm right or wrong, I don't know— but that could be a reason why I wasn't able to fully commit. You don't see me, I'm not all sleeved out and tattooed out, and I don't have a heroin problem. And, um, um, I guess maybe if I'd have gone to that dark place, then maybe I would have had to stick with music and had to stick it out, and I would have been on a street corner asking for money while I play a song and then maybe somebody discovers me. And but luckily I had a safety net behind me, which most people don't. I think that probably changed my, my subconscious, you know, approach to everything. So I think that money was probably a hindrance, you know, in the career, in being an artist. Yeah, I was never a starving artist, even if I tried to be and really put myself in that position to be. There was always that safety net. And I think that, that, that, that was probably a hindrance. But, and looking back now, gosh, if I'd have known, you know, in my 20s, I mean, we can all say this, we could turn back the clock, but if I'd have known then what I know about real estate now, you know, I would be, I would have, I would have many more millions and be 10 times over more wealthy than, than I've been able to achieve just because I would have had an earlier start. But instead I was spending it all and partying.

You wouldn't have taken the action at that point. We got the knowledge now and we're taking the action. That's a differential.

Yeah, well, and I have different motivations now too, you know. I mean, I have two beautiful kids. I've got two boys, Nixon and Weston. Nixon's 10 and Weston's almost 8. He'll be 8 in February. So they are really my reason. They're my motivation. And it's not so that I can buy them fun stuff. Of course I do. And, you know, I'm going out this weekend We're in Arizona right now and they're in California, so I'm heading out there this weekend to take them to an amusement park and have some fun with them. But those things are perks. Yeah. The reason I'm doing what I'm doing is so that they will be able to make business choices, not have that safety net and go be a rock musician, but have that dowry to be able to draw from. Because I'm going to instill in them things that they'll be able to get started on right away and action plans, not go take a real estate test and go work in an office and they'll teach you. I'm going to give them the step-by-steps and they'll be able to own, you know, start businesses and things and they'll have the money to be able to do that and they'll be able to take chances because in entrepreneurship there's way more failure than there is success. Yeah. And you have to be able to have that money to be able to try. And if you're not trying, you don't make money, you know. So I just— that's, that's really what I'm doing. I mean, of course there's the houses and that and, and, you know, they'll have that income or they can sell them or do whatever they want with them. But You know, having that stability for them means that they'll be able to take chances and they'll be able to fail and pick themselves up and try and try again and build businesses and, you know, build wealth for them, their kids. So it's all about generational wealth. Yeah. And, you know, it's not just about freedom or, you know, having the next cool car. It's really about building it for them. That's, you know, and I have a picture of them on my desk. Their pictures are on my walls. And it's a reminder every time I look up from my monitor or if I'm on the phone, my, my, I naturally look to the corner of my desk because my monitor's over here. So I don't want to deal with that. So I'm thinking and talking and their pictures right there. And that's, that's my motivation. So I have different motivation now for sure.

So that's a great segue. So, you know, at this younger age, is there anything you're doing to sort of help them, you know, get that financial literacy at this point in life? Yeah. Allowances and different things like that where they've got some responsibility around something that they can handle in a certain way that gives them experience of making a bad decision, making some good decisions, and maybe saving or investing. How are you working with them on that?

So they're two entirely different kids. Yeah. Nixon is going to be a— well, he and Elon Musk are best friends. Yeah, Elon. It's Elon. You know what Elon said today? No. What did Elon say today? Yeah, he, he wants to be a CEO. That's what he says. And he is already doing that in school. He has, he has a bunch of the kids at school that are working for him. And to set this up, yes, I do have expectations for them and they, they have to do certain things and, and, and you know, we call them KPIs, but they have to, you know, have their bed made. They have to go to bed at a certain time. They have to— if they're doing all these things that are, you know, the kind of the rules, so to speak, then they get rewarded. And those rewards can be, you know, like Weston, he wanted a new Oculus VR headset and he was hitting me up every single day for that. And the answer was always the same, you know, have you done this? Have you accomplished that? Have you hit this, have you hit that, you know, as far as grades and attendance and helping his mom at home and things. So, and he did. And so he was rewarded with that. And Nixon, my 10-year-old, he, he wore a Gucci tracksuit to photo day a couple of weeks ago that he bought with his own money. And, you know, he is constantly coming up with ways to generate money. And he takes that money and he buys things on these websites from China, these little trinkets and things for $5 or $10 or $15. And he takes them to school and he sells them to the kids at school for $35 or $40 or $50. And I asked him, I said, where are they getting this money to pay you this? And he said, they ask their parents and they bring their mom over to me at the end of school and I show them. And then their mom says, okay. I was like, wow.

He'd been to a Stone Bowl. I know, right?

He, he told me, he said, I have minions. And I was like, okay, yeah, sure, whatever. I went to pick him up from school one day and I'm talking to him outside the school and this kid comes up and he goes, hey, Nixon, can we let Shane go now? And Nixon looks over and he goes, that's fine. And I look over and these 3 kids are holding this, this kid.

Yeah.

So he does. He has minions. He's got these kids selling stuff for him and then he pays them out. So You know, and he understands that because I've always taught him that, you know, you make money by creating money and you do good things, you get rewards, and then you take those rewards and you can turn that money into more money. Yeah. And that's what he's doing. And but I've definitely got my work cut out for me. He looks exactly like I did at his age. Yeah, but he is a little more savvy than I am, which is very dangerous. And I know I've got my work cut out for me. He's going to I mean, I can talk, but he's going to talk circles around me, I would imagine. And then Weston is this little ladies' man. He's quiet and he just likes to do everything nice for everybody and make sure that everybody's happy. And the girls love him. The girls love Nixon, too, but he just doesn't know about it. He's too busy making money.

Yeah.

So I know that, you know, at 10 and 8, it's very difficult to really sit down and talk business. Yeah, it's more theoretical and it's more the ideology of taking money and turning that money into something else.

Yeah.

Whether it be a toy or more money so you can buy a bigger toy. So I, you know, as Nixon is getting a little bit older, a little bit wiser in the next couple of years is really when I'm going to start kind of, you know, going over things with him. And I want to get an LLC set up. I actually already have an LLC set up for him. I have property in that for him. But getting, you know, bank accounts and things set up for him so he can start really learning money, which they don't really get them on credit cards so they can build the credit score.

Yeah, all my kids. Yep. Calling me the other day about having a credit card.

Yes. Yeah. As long as they don't, they don't, you know, use it to abuse it, you know, but, you know, just getting those things instilled in him and then teaching him how to go find properties. It's not difficult. We just had a 16-year-old guy. I've got a phone call with him in about 45 or an hour from now. 16 years old, came into our office about 2 weeks ago. His dad was doing a podcast with Cody. And he said, I'd love to get into real estate. So Max Jimenez from The Closers Lab, he's now on board and he's my VP of sales at Green Elephant Development. And Max and I sat him down and gave him a script and said, listen, all you have to do is just run through this script. If you got him by the second page and you're still going, then you've got a deal here. He got on the phone, he made a couple of phone calls, and in 2 hours he had a deal under contract. Wow. In 2 hours, deal under contract. We had to step in a little at the end because it turned into a creative financing, which that's a tangled web. But, and he was so excited and he was asking me all these questions. What does EMD mean? What is, you know, what is title? You know, these things that, you know, that you and I think are entirely, you know, simple. But, and he's very excited and he just called me yesterday with another property in Newport Beach. And that's what we're going to talk about tonight. Fantastic. And he's 16. So Nixon at 10 is gaining on, you know, that age range. Yeah. And, you know, he's already excited about money. So it's just honing that focus into making sure he understands, you know, how to really crack the code, you know? Yeah. So, you know, I, you know, like I said, my dad told me about these things, but he didn't show me. And, you know, I think that that's probably why I didn't pay attention. And I wish that I had, but, you know, I'm going to go about it a little bit differently with my kids. And not saying that the way that my dad did it was wrong. You know, I was probably the knucklehead in the conversation for sure. But I'm going to make sure that I do it a little bit differently so that it's enjoyable and it's understandable. Yeah. And they can implement.

Yeah, it's very often the context because when you just hear it, you don't understand the context, right? You said, why do I do this and how do I do it? Then it makes sense. I'm going to do my eldest daughter's first tax return with her soon. Oh wow. I was going to send it through my CPA, but actually they're fun. Isn't it? $140 refund, but he charged $175. He said, just take it to this free website, put it through there, and just walk her through it. And that's the gift of that, having the right accountant that tells you it's not worth paying me more money than you get back. And now I've experienced my eldest, I can go through and do a first tax return for '21 and '22.

Teaching taxes is so important too, because there's so many ways that, you know, you can, you know, depreciating assets and write-offs and things that you can do that, you know, you can really minimize that taxation to the point where I was just talking with Dominic Wood the other day and he was talking to me how shocked he was on one of his Airbnbs that because it was set up through his personal taxation, he got, I think, a $200,000 credit. 2 properties. One was $100,000 and one was $200,000. Well, I mean, he's not going to have to pay taxes for a minute. Yeah. You know, so there are ways to do this, folks, where, you know, we go to a 9-to-5 and we get taxed on that. And if you know what you're doing in real estate, you can really work it out where you're not really paying taxes. Robert Kiyosaki has a story where he purchased a building for $1,000,000, held on to it for 10 years. It was then worth $8 million and he went to the bank and said, give me $6 million. And they gave him $6 million. If you sell an asset for $6 million, you're going to have to pay taxes on that. If you work and you have a job, you're a celebrity and you get paid $6 million to do a movie, you have to pay taxes on that. If you go and pull money out of an asset, the taxation is just not there. So there's ways to, to really skirt that. So I think that, you know, you getting them started on taxes is good. Yeah, I may take take you up on that and follow your lead.

Yeah. Because the thing I want to do for the next tax year is, well, this tax year is to get her onto one of my LLCs where we own an asset and we can wipe out the taxes that she would. And I can allocate whatever depreciation that she needs every year so that she can see, okay, well, I just need to buy more assets to wipe out more taxation and see the power of the rollover. You know, $150,000 that lasts you 2 or 3 years. Maybe 10 years at that age to not have to pay taxes if you got a rollover depreciation.

Yep.

Yeah.

So, you know, that's just— those are all just valuable lessons. And, you know, they don't teach this stuff in schools. Yeah. I just mentioned Robert Kiyosaki. He talks about that all the time. And, you know, they don't mention this. That's the whole Rich Dad, Poor Dad, you know, book, you know, synopsis is they don't teach this stuff in schools. They don't teach you how to be a wealthy individual. They teach you how to go to college and have debt and work for somebody else and make them more money.

And the debt creates more money for the other people.

That's it. That's it. So, you know, it's unfortunate. It really is. And I don't see a change. It's up to, you know, dads like you and I to make that change. So that's, you know, it's important. Yeah.

Yeah. So the— I guess the next question really is your kids are young, getting them into a bit of tax, a bit of business, a bit of understanding the savvy of that. Where, where are you going to sort of plan right now to give them assets rather than allow them to work into those assets? Because when we were talking last, last episode with Devin, he said in Europe generational wealth seems to be generational, but in America it seems to be two generations and then just disappears.

Yeah, no, I think I don't agree what the difference is.

But how do you think that you can set them up? And there's obviously no way that we can, you know, force or create 100% guaranteed outcome. But our intent would be to provide something long-term for the family and future generations we'll never meet, you know?

Right. No, I hear you. I mean, it's funny you say that. I mean, I experienced that, you know what I mean? You know, my grandparents grew up okay, but then they made a lot of money and they were wealthy. And then my parents were wealthy and then they lost it. And, and then I had to rebuild, you know. So yeah, there is this kind of hills and valleys. And, you know, I'm guessing by your accent you've been to Europe before.

A couple of times.

Yeah. Yeah. It's interesting you bring that up, that there's more generational wealth, you know, across the pond than there is here. And I wonder if that has something to do with Americans just being so, you know, such consumption heavy, you know, everything is consuming, consuming, consuming that, you know, shiny object syndrome and having to have have the newest and greatest thing. Yeah, instant gratification. Or, or maybe it's, it's because we're, you know, we have, you know, maybe our egos are larger than the rest of the world and we think it'll always come back to us, or we're bulletproof, so we take, you know, we blow it.

And, or maybe the availability of debt rose so quickly over here.

Yeah, that's—

but it was the economy, it created a false sense of security because the boomers came through, there was a lot of money that they generated through their lives and still generate. Yeah, but then there have been those, you know, the Big Depression was a big drop, but it's been maybe the cycles have been bigger on this side of the Atlantic generally than the other side. But there are definitely similarities.

Yeah. No, I think, I think also too, I think we're headed in a path where, you know, and this is just, you know, with my ear to the ground that there's a lot of government that is buying properties and buying up properties. And I think that the availability say, you know, 40 or 50 years from now for anybody to become a property owner, 100% property owner may change a little bit. You may have to go into a pool with a government, you know, type of institution. But who knows? But as far as, you know, setting these things up, you know, for my kids and things, I have, you know, trusts and I'm very tax sheltered. I have trusts I have LLCs that are owned by trusts and trusts that are owned by other trusts that are offshore, Belize and Panama. And find me, you know, it's very difficult. I mean, even, even my watch is in the trust. You know, everything that I have is in the trust. And that keeps my everything that I earn and everything that I generate protected. And it can't be touched and it can't be touched. And it's for my kids. So having, you know, building a portfolio and having properties and I've got, you know, I've got properties that are in Nixon's name. Next is Weston. And those properties have renters and the mortgage is being paid by, by rent, whether it's short-term or long-term. So there's really no payment, they cash flow., but those are being paid off and over time. And by the time either I'm gone or, you know, it's time for them to step in, those'll be free and clear assets that they can either, again, like we were talking about what Robert Kiyosaki did, you pull that money out and not have it be taxed and invest it into something or sell the asset. Of course you're gonna have tax bills. You wanna do a 1031 exchange into another property. But they'll have that availability to be able to do that. And if I— and again, this is on me— if I give them the proper education and guidance to not lose too much in the experience of growth and trial and error, then they'll be set. And those wins that they do have after, you know, they've, they've learned from failure. I always call it failing forward. You know, we celebrate our wins, but we learn from our losses. Yeah. You know, I always use the analogy of if you and I were going to go somewhere and we were in the car, we went, we took a left down a new street and we were going really fast, but there were speed bumps. Next time we went down that street, we'd know to go slower. Yeah. Pardon me. And we learned from that and now we know how to handle that road properly. Yeah. So, you know, setting them up with properties and setting them up with, you know, proper accounts and taxation and And, you know, knowledge is, I think, is what's going to enable them to weather storms and grow and build wealth. And that's kind of where I'm headed.

Yeah. I think the velocity at which they get to handle those types of assets or cash is important that it builds in a steady way. You know, just looking at mine, it's going to be one asset that makes sense and they can clearly see how that equates to tax savings or other people paying debt for you. Maybe it's house hacking. I'm looking for probably a 10 to 20 to 50 unit right now in Phoenix just so I can put them in there. Yeah. Now they're 18, the younger one probably moving somewhere soon.

Yeah. That's a beautiful idea.

That way they live in the asset. They won't tell anybody that they're the owner of the asset. Sure. Just live there as—

They live there and everybody else is paying the mortgage for them.

And they can just look and thank you very much and be grateful to everyone. Yeah.

Well, that's what I did. The first house that I bought, I moved a roommate in. And then when I did a 1031 exchange into— and again, these are free and clear. So it's not like I had, you know, mortgage to worry about. But literally that was my income. That was my cash flow. Yeah. And the same thing when I had the condominium in Orange County, I had, I had, I went through a couple of different roommates, friends of mine, and obviously they knew I was the owner. I'm like, you know, the story we were just talking about, but that was my cash flow. And it was a beautiful thing. So, you know, if you can get a duplex or a triplex or something and live in it and then everybody else is paying your mortgage as tenants, you can't go wrong, you know, and then it's rinse and repeat. Once it's paid off, then, you know, you can either pull money out and go and do it again. But yeah, it's, it's, that's, that's beautiful. I think that's a great idea. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. I think it's— there's, there's so much that goes on and I think like we said, some people just get it too quickly. They don't get the hang of, you know, driving at 30 miles an hour or 15 miles an hour on the, on the, you know, with the training wheels, do you know what I mean? It's like getting you past that. Yeah, you can fall off a couple of times, but, you know, a lot of people, a lot of conversations that come up is, do we share struggles with the kids? Whether it's an emotional struggle, a financial struggle. Obviously you experienced that with your parents where there was riches to almost rags in, in some senses.

Yeah.

But you were very visible to— that was very visible to you, and you were a part of that process. Yeah. You know, I look back the last 10 years, I've had an emotional struggle and financial struggle at times. There have been better times than others, but I haven't armed my kids with seeing all of that through. There's a lot at the end of that tunnel necessarily. So, you know, a lot of people only show them the good side, but, you know, do we, do we start the kids out on very little or nothing so they understand what being grateful for the basics are, and then grow from that point. But I think, you know, they really take on who we are. And that's always why I refer to the questions of, you know, how was your dad and your mum different with money? We then understand how we got two perspectives that form a perspective on money instead of just one. And it might be one parent.

Yeah.

But, you know, very— it's very unusual that both parents from the last 20 years 30 years of being in complete alignment with money. Sure. So it's interesting to know where we lean, where we see the problems with spending too much or investing too much.

And well, I think that I think that I definitely treaded on my mom's side for, for probably too long. Yeah. And, you know, was quite frivolous. But again, that was also kind of the role I was playing in the job that I had. I was a rock musician. And if you're not partying, then, you know, you're not successful, you know. And then now I'm very much, you know, very similar to my dad in a lot of ways. And, you know, when my mom passed away in April of '22, my dad and I became closer than we ever were. And, you know, my dad was the best man at my wedding. Yeah. So we've always been very close. And, you know, when I grew up in San Diego and I was an actor in L.A., it's a 2.5-hour drive when you factor traffic each way. And he was driving me to these, you know, these auditions for, you know, these TV and movies and things. And that was sometimes 5 times a week, you know, we'd be in the car doing that. So you can't get any more supportive than that. And so I know that my dad was always in my corner and he was always, you know, he was at every show and he was always rooting me on. But, you know, when my— he got so stuck taking care of my mom And you're never really stuck when you're with the person that you love. But it was tragic to see because, you know, he still had a lot of life to do and could have enjoyed it. But he stayed by her bedside for years. And when she passed away, you know, there was just a— it's like I had my dad back, you know, and we had this very close relationship. And then 4 months later, he ended up passing away from a, from a absolutely out of nowhere heart attack, which is why now I'm so focused on my health and, you know, in the gym every morning now. And it's— well, I mean, this is new, folks. You know, it's been 3 weeks every day working with this trainer, and I've got some very hard goals and I'm very sore every day. But no pain, no gain. So I'm very focused on what I'm eating. And, and it's not because it's narcissistic. I could give a shit about that. You know, I've never had a problem walking into a room and getting attention or making friends or meeting a new girl because I didn't have six-pack abs. That's— it's never been a thing for me. So it's not narcissistic. It's, it's really to feel better, but also so that I live longer and outlive my parents so that I can be there for my kids. Longer and spend more time on this earth with my kids.

These experiences really bring it, bring it home to self-love and self-care, not looking good for others. Yeah. And you know, my health journeys have been up and down over the years, and you know, each time, you know, whether it's 75 Hard and I did it with no problem, I don't know if that was truly for me or whether that was because not as specifically looking to look good for others, but because I was out there and I was making sure that I kept putting that out every day, so I was committed to something. So there's a positive side. Yep. But then, you know, after a while I let that go. Yeah. And, um, yeah, definitely health concerns with others bring it home and ring true too. Yeah. Is this for you?

Yeah.

Is this a choice or is this just something that's passing? And, well, it's always easy to tell.

I, you know, like I was, I was saying, like, my dad and I really had this crazy, very strong— I mean, I started working out here about a year and a half ago with Cody in Phoenix. And, you know, I'm born and raised in Southern California. I lived in Vegas for a year when I was working for the UFC, but otherwise I've always lived in Southern California my whole life. So it was a big decision to move out here and to— and the reason I did that is so that I could build wealth and learn. Again, knowledge is power and that's something that never goes away and learn from and be around in proximity with some of the greatest real estate minds. In the country. And, you know, Phoenix to real estate really is kind of like Silicon Valley is to startups and software. It's a big hub. And all the really most, I'd say 90% of the greatest minds in real estate are here in Phoenix, ironically enough. So that was a big part of my decision because again, I was future-minded to be able to gain that knowledge and then be able to build out these portfolios and grow, you know, generational wealth. So I was on the phone with my dad every, every day after work for an hour, hour and a half, and telling him what I learned and going over things. And this was right up until, you know, he passed. And that's why we missed the call that night. And that was, you know, that was, that was really hard to go through. But, and, you know, he was kind of my compass, you know, on a lot of things. So that again kind of came to a reinvention where You know, it's, it's, it's crazy to think, you know, as somebody who's always been a child of somebody that I don't have parents.

I remember that very moment. I realized that with my mom in 2017, she passed away. I was with both my brothers and just, you know, each of us took some time to ourselves, went for a walk, and I just realized that last generation's gone now. Yeah. You know, my direct family. And it was a stark realization.

It is. It's You know, it's crazy to swallow. You know, it's a lot, you know, but it's given me again more motivation. I don't— I guess one of the things that really changed was I did a lot in real estate to make my dad proud because of his background in real estate. And it was so ingrained. And so, you know, I remember he called me after I was on Real Estate Disruptors with Steve Trang. And, you know, he said, boy, Steve really wanted to talk a lot about Tarek. He's like, why do you want to talk about Tarek so much? Why do you want to talk about you? And, you know, I mean, obviously that's, that's entertainment and that's, that's fun to talk about. But, you know, he was always very supportive and he was always very glued to it. But everything that I did up until his passing was really to make him proud. And I almost didn't know that I would. I almost felt like I don't know if I'm going to continue in this because at this point, where's my cheering section? Where's my, you know, where's— who do I take a bow for? And, you know, being in the theater and growing up that way, you always do a great performance so at the end you can get a standing ovation. And my dad was always that standing ovation or that constructive criticism. And so that was— it was, it was very difficult. And I had to, you know, kind of push through that. And really, again, coming back to my kids, that's, you know, now what my ultimate motivation is.

And that's really in your own corner, isn't it?

It is. And, you know, they don't understand what Daddy does. They just know that Daddy's off making money and Daddy's building this for them. And, and they see me on jets and yachts and crazy stuff that we all do is in our community because we're fortunate enough to be around those kinds of environments. But, you know, they think that that's cool. Yeah, that deserves, you know, some applause. Yeah. But, you know, the bank accounts and the houses and stuff, that's over their head. They just know that, you know, they're comfortable and they're taken care of. But that right there is really my standing ovation. The fact that they are so comfortable and that they don't, you know, stress or want or worry for things or, you know, they're never like asking, you know, hey, is it too much money if we were to do this? Or I'm afraid to ask because I know that's going to be a lot of money. Yeah. They don't look at money like it's a bad thing. They look at— they understand that Daddy's working hard so that we can have a great life. And they respect that and they appreciate that. And that admiration, you know, yeah, that's, that's my encore, you know, that's, that's really, you know, what I do it for. Yeah. So I'm very careful with money. Of course I have fun and of course I have nice things, but I'm very careful with, with money and making sure that I'm never outside of my means and I'm always reinvesting that money. You know, somebody once said if, if— and I forget who it was, it may have been Pete De Best, Tarek's partner. Who's a brilliant mind, he said, if you're— if you have money in your account and you call yourself an investor, you're not an investor. So, you know, really making sure— and Grant Cardone talks about that too. He says as soon as he's got a bunch of money in there, he immediately puts it something else and goes and looks at an almost empty account and says, gosh, I got to work harder and get more money in. And then he does it again, flushes it out into an asset and rinse and repeat. So You know, it's— there's a lot of mental conditioning there, I think. But it just— they're my motivation. So, you know, it was them and my dad. And then my dad left us and moved on to a better place. And I just want to be healthy and be able to spend— I felt like my dad got taken away too early. Even though he was 77 years old. I think that, you know, had he minded his health earlier on in his life, he never did. My parents didn't work out. That's probably why I grew up not thinking about it. They never went to a gym. They had friends named Jim. That was about as close as they got. Yeah. Yeah. And so it was never really part of a part of my life. And because it was never a part of their life, they had health issues and they, they diet what I feel was you know, 10, 10 or 12 years too soon. And I want to be able to spend that extra 10 or 12 years with my kids and be there for them. My kids and, and their kids. Yeah. I mean, my dad only got to know, uh, my kids up until they were 6 and 9. You know, there's a whole lot more life to go through there, um, that he, you know, unfortunately, you know, misses out on. So I don't want to miss out on that with my kids. So it's very important to me. So health has become, you know, a big part of the journey. And it's not just focusing on business and scaling business and growth and money. Now it's personal development, you know.

And because now the other thing that the kids will notice, that you're trimming up and you're—

that's the goal.

Those things, you know, that'll be natural for them to see, oh, that's the whole thing. They could go to the gym or swim.

Thankfully, their mom, she works out all the time and she's, you know, she's constantly— she's very healthy and in great shape. And So they see it from her, but they haven't seen that from me. So I need to, you know, really drive that point home. So again, it's, it's maybe there's a little bit of selfishness to, to what I'm doing because I want to spend more time with my kids. But the flip side of that coin is, is I want to be around longer for my kids because like I said, you know, it sucked to lose my dad and I don't want them to have to go through that any sooner than that has to happen. Yeah.

So it's just so important for us to fill our own cup so we can help and take care of others more, you know, and health is one of those things.

Yeah.

Yeah. Brilliant. Well, thanks for such a great conversation for us. It's gone some wonderful directions and we always have to spend time with you.

Always. We spend too much time on the phone talking about amazing things and you're always there for me and we've had some amazing conversations. So I knew that we would probably gabble on too long as it is. But thanks for having me. I really appreciate it. Thank you so much. And Trystan is one of the greatest humans alive. So happy to be on your show. Appreciate you.

Yeah. Well, thank everybody. See you on the next edition of Birth to Net Worth. This has been Forrest Blackburn. Look out for— I'm pointing that way. It's probably that way or that way, but somewhere there will be some titles afterwards and we'll have some contact information for how to follow YouTube, Instagram, and see how you can stay in touch with Forrest. Thanks again, Forrest.

Thanks, Trystan Trenberth.

Follow the links to Forrest. Check out his work, his music, his real estate, his scaling skills in Fortune 500 companies and beyond. It's great to have good friends on the show. See you on the next edition of Birth to Net Worth.