You miss 100% of the chances you don't take. The OME Gear Story.

Foreign.

Welcome to E Commerce Growth Stories. This is your hostess with the mostest, Juliana Jackson, aka the CLV lady. And also I am the Chief Evangelist for OmniConvert.

And this is Valentin Radu, CEO of OmniConvert. Thank you for tuning in today for a new episode of E Commerce Growth Stories.

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Today we're having super special guests in the building. We are talking to Stacy Pierce and we're talking to Julie Weldon, the co founders of OME Gear. And I'm gonna tell you guys, this episode is really, really packed with all the, you know, the hardships of entrepreneurship, the good parts, the bad part, the promises you make to customers, the struggle that you have to deal with to make sure you deliver on your promises. But you know, besides everything that's business related, what I like most about this is the beautiful story and the history behind this brand and the history behind what, what Stacy and Jules are doing right now. Just tune into this episode, I promise you is worth it. And just, yeah, just let me know what you think afterwards.

I'm here with Stacy Pierce and Julie Weldon and they are the co founders of Omegare. I hope I'm it right?

OME Gear.

Okay, so it's the actual acronym. So OME Gear. And for everyone who wants to check it out right now, it's OME Gear altogether dot com. And of course tonight a special appearance from my co host, Valentin.

Yeah, he's just messing with me because I missed, I missed the last episode. Yeah, the last episodes.

Okay, thank you, thank you. Thank you guys for taking the time to, to come here today. I'm super excited about this episode. I'm gonna, as I told you before we started the, you know, the before we went live. I'm gonna pretend I know nothing and I haven't done any research. But I want to start with the first question that I'm asking everyone. How did you did you guys got into E commerce? Because right now you are the co founders of an E comm and I want to know how did you get into this? Because it's always an accident for how people get into E commerce. So what was your case?

That's funny that you call it an accident because in a lot of ways you're right. I mean it was an accident for me. So I'm Jules and that's Stace. Just so that you know who's who. A lot of people say we look like sisters. We're not sisters.

We're actually married.

We're actually married to each other.

But yeah, just know that when people live too much together, they start to look alike. I get this a lot. But the funny part is my husband is black. So people are telling me that we all look alike. And I'm like. And I'm like, sure, why not? So I, I can see that. I can see that happening. But yeah, go on.

In your case it's happening for sure.

So yeah, so I'll. I'll make the story short because it's actually a 20 year story. So my parents invented a concept of our product 20 years ago. So it was just a two in one. They ended up getting it patented and tried to take it to market but just ran out of money. And honestly they just didn't know how to do it. And so they let it sit on the shelf for 12 years. And so fast forward to 2010. I was working for a large business management consulting firm here in the United States and was working 80 hours a week and just wanted something that I could focus on to be mine. And so I woke up. You know those moments where you just don't ever forget them? So at 1:30 in the morning, I woke up and my mind was racing and I was like, I want something that I can focus on to be mine. And I immediately thought of my dad's invention. And so the next morning at 8:30 in the morning, I remember I called him at 8:30 and I said, dad, what would you think about me trying to take your product to market? And my dad is absolutely one of my heroes. And now one of Stace's heroes. But he's just an awesome man. And he started crying and, and he said, honey, that would be a dream come true. You can have everything. I'll sign the Patent over to you. So he did, he gave me all his drawings and by that point, 12 years later, they were pretty, they were just old, they were really big and plastic. And I knew I needed to change the design. So I did. Ended up partnering with a manufacturing firm in the US and it was a partnership that I didn't want to be a part of. Our values did not align and my values and Stacy's values, they mean a lot to us. And so if we are partnered with people that don't align then typically will veer away from them. And so after a couple of years we ended up taking it to market. Sold about $250,000 worth of product, which is not a lot, but we were getting started and I ended up walking away. I walked away from everything. One of the hardest moments of my life because I was walking away from my dream and my parents dream. So I walked away. Ended up getting a job. And I don't know if you're familiar with this but we have shrimp boats here in Charleston, South Carolina for shrimp. And so I ended up getting a job making 10 doll hour on the shrimp boats. I wasn't on the shrimp.

She went from making sit in the high six figures, winning her own company, own company to walking away overnight and getting a $10 an hour job.

Yeah, but you know, money isn't everything, right? Money's not everything. I mean when you're not happy, money doesn't really matter. And so for me it wasn't about the $10 an hour, it was about being able to, being able to heal my soul from what I just walked through. So I did that. And after nine months, Stace tired of me coming home smelling like shrimp. And so then she and I started a business management consulting firm. So why don't you take it from.

There and we're going to get to your question.

I know, sorry.

I like it. I like it.

Because neither one of us come from the product space. Both of us come from service industries. My background is occupational therapy. I've started, I've been on the ground floor of nine startups that are all service based companies, not products. And so, so actually we kind of did end up in the E commerce by accident. But with the products we, yeah, now that we are, we're taking the market. But so yeah, we started our business coaching firm called A Salty Rim. And the reason is we A Salty Rim is because we love margaritas. But in all actually yeah, in all actuality salt heals and salt preserves and really the missing ingredient, every recipe even, even A sweet recipe is salt. And so that's all. You always hear it on cooking shows. Oh, you need more salt. You're missing that. So we were like, let's do, you know, most of our companies, most of the companies we work with, and we've had over a hundred clients in the past four and a half years. And the missing ingredient was them not knowing something or feeling alone. There's always a missing ingredient in their business. So we come in and our tagline is, we'll help you eat your elephant with a dash of salt, one bite at a time. So we started that in 2015, and then in about 2016, we live. We live at the beach. And we are three miles from the beach. And we're like, the product. Not our product at the time, but her product. There was. No one had taken it. No one had taken the idea, no one had taken the content. Everything out there was still junk. And we were like, okay, we have something here. And we knew the product that she had taken to market before had some problems, had some issues. It was bulky, it had a lot of plastic on it. So we were like, okay, what can we do? We can take consumer feedback and we can draw on that and we can really sharpen our pencils on a product that's going to solve problems for people getting outside. So we partnered with a design firm called RCO out of Detroit, Michigan. They do all seating and positioning for Tesla and Gulfstream jets. And so we went to the experts on seating and that's when we worked with them and we were able to design. What you see now on our website is the five in one, the Wander. And so. But without E Commerce, we wouldn't be in business. So I mean, it's kind of a, you know, we need to be, you know, we need to an E commerce site for customers because our. One of our main verticals is the direct consumer. Got it.

So just to make sure that everyone is aligned. So the product that you're talking about is the wonder. And actually I was reading it because it has two Rs. And I was like the Wanderer.

Which.

Is probably something you might get a lot. And I was so this is a chair, guys. This is a beach chair. Just like put it in plain words. But I want you guys to tell me more about the product per se and what is the job that that product does for someone that decides to hire.

Yeah, so it's actually a five in one product and it's actually named after my dad. So my dad's nickname, a really Endearing nickname is the Wanderer, because he'll leave the house and just go to all different stores to where all of his friends. He's built relationships with friends, wander around and just talk to people. He's a big relationship.

And he thinks he's Elvis. He does.

But. But, yeah. So it's a five in one product and good for any outdoor activity. So not just for the beach, but it's for camping, festivals, any kind of like fishing, camping, hunting, you know, kids, kids, sporting events. So anyway, it's good for any outdoor activity where you need to haul stuff because it's a cart. One of the modes is a cart. It hauls £150 of gear, comes with a bungee net to keep it all in. And then once you get where you're going and unload it, it actually turns into four different seating positions. So a higher off the ground like camping field chair, then a lower to the ground, which would typically be used at the beach chair, and then a fully reclining lounge chair and then a camping cot or a bench that multiple people can sit on. And for us, quality was really important because in the outdoor space of camp, of seating and hauling stuff, it's a lot of junk like Stacy mentioned. And so we said if we were going to put a product into the market, it was going to be a product that we were really proud of that was actually a quality product. And so that's what we've designed with the wandering.

Exactly. We will.

We will for sure. And so that's why if you go back to the name ome gear, it's oceans plus mountains equals earth.

Equals earth.

Yeah. And so, and, and so we, we needed it to be all encompassing. We didn't want to put a timeline or a season on our product. We wanted to make sure that it's anytime you need to carry something and have a seat when you get there, or, you know, if you don't want to sleep on the ground in your tent, you know, you have your chair and then you just roll it right in your tent and you have your camping cots. We just wanted to be people, to be creative. And you know, we, we built this five in one. But people are being created now. People are using it as a bench. Hunters are using it to carry their. Their, Their.

Their gear.

Yeah.

Their care, their kill. Yeah. We have kayak straps that are being made that we can carry up to two kayaks or paddle boards. And so people are getting really creative on other things it can do, which is fun to watch.

So let's sum it up right. So here we have Stacy and Julie. They used to be working in services, doing consulting. They've built their own consulting firm. Then I think Julie, thanks to the dream of her father, she decided to completely shift her life. So she built an actual product, which is not like a simple product. It's a product that it's a five in one chair, which can transform in five different ways, that you can carry anything down the beach or in the mountain or when you're going fishing, and you can take all your stuff and put it in there. And now what you are doing is that you're waiting into an Airbnb so that you can take your RV and do what?

Yeah, well, first of all, do you want a job as our salesperson?

No.

He would kill it, probably.

I'm actually a fractional salesperson right now for you, and they haven't pay me. You just need to ship this stuff to Europe. Because I'm a. I'm an outdoor person.

Valentin is a nomad.

So, yeah, we are. We are. We are nomadic right now. You know, we're entrepreneurs. And as entrepreneurs, you. You put it all in, and you're asking people to invest in you and your company, and so you have to invest in yourselves and your company. And so in December, this was never a plan that Jules and I would be jumping in an rv, but in December, we decided to sell our house. And we said, you know, if we're asking for investors to come in, they have to see we're all in. And so we did. The market over here is crazy busy. And so we were able to sell our house and put that money into our company and pay for our first shipment of wanderers to get here so we can start getting them out to the masses. And then we were like, oh, well, am I allowed to cuss on this? Oh, shit, we have nowhere to live. And so we were like, okay, well, then let's get an RV now. Jules just turned 50. I'm 49. And. And we're going to be getting in our RV. We already got it. We got it. Her name is Olive, and she's being. She's being wrapped right now with our logo in our. Our branding. And we're going to get around the United States. We'll start in North Carolina and go down to Florida, and then we'll be gone for about a year, year and a half, and just we're organically building our company. And I think that, you know, I'll.

Show the people watching. So this will be our RV that's our product on the side, and it says, what moves you from sea to shining sea and every mountain in between.

And for who's listening and wants to see the rv, they have to wait until I launch the blood post and use the picture that you sent me. I think it looks amazing. So in all this story, I have only one question. So when you were working on a shrimp boat, you obviously took my Eastern European behind to Forest Gump and Baba. So my question is, like, how many things you can eat with shrimp? You have shrimp burgers.

You really like shrimp? Jules. Jules.

Everything that we said. And that's your only question.

Food force, Gump.

I couldn't. I couldn't.

Well, Baba turned out to be a great entrepreneur, if I recall correctly.

Exactly, yes.

You know, it's funny. We were just in the area of South Carolina where they filmed for us this past weekend, so.

Oh, wow.

Yeah. But, yeah, there are a lot of things you can do with shrimp.

There are. I'm sorry, but this is the type of person that I am. So I want to ask you something I never seen. I mean, I've seen variations of your product. So lately. Right now, Valentin knows why I'm asking these questions. I'm trying jobs to be done here right now. This is a methodology to understand something about why people hire your product. So I can see a lot of uses for it. But, like, when you release this product, who are the first people that actually got it? And did you have the conversation with them to understand what was the outcome that they had in their mind? Was it like they had too much stuff going on and wanted to pick it up in something and just go, like, what's the main pattern for the people that use your product? Because I think it's incredible.

That's a great question, and it's making me think on my feet.

I was like, my mom was the first.

Yeah, yeah. Our family. But so Kickstarter. So we did a Kickstarter campaign and for small businesses. And I don't know if I can say this or not, but I would never recommend a Kickstarter. You know what that is, right? Kickstarter.

Yeah, of course.

Yeah.

It was honestly one of the hardest things. I mean, we spent probably nine months or a year researching how to do it really well. So we took internal bets on how much we would raise in the Kickstarter. The lowest bet was 750,000, and the highest bet was, I think, 5 million, something like that. We ended up raising. Our goal was 50,000. We raised $52,000, and the reason being is because first of all, a lot of people that are our target market aren't Kickstart. They don't understand what Kickstarter is. So we had to educate people first on even what Kickstarter was to even get the traction going. But the other thing with Kickstarter that a lot of people don't realize is if you don't dump at least 100 to $150,000 into marketing, you will not have a, you know, few hundred thousand dollars successful campaign. And so for us, we were a startup, we didn't have that kind of money. And so we put in, you know, as much as we did tens of thousands of dollars into the marketing of it. And thank God we funded at 52,000 or we would have gotten nothing because it's either all or nothing on Kickstarter. So all that to say one thing that we said is we will never be those people who fund on Kickstarter and don't deliver when promised. We were those people who did not deliver when promised. We completely. Because what happened was our product was more expensive than we thought. And so our Kickstarter backers waited two years to get their product. They were awesome. Only two people wanted a refund, which was really, really kind of our backers. But it was a, it was a hard, hard process. So a lot of the early adopters of this were people who believe in Stacy and I, to be really honest. They know that we are really hard workers and, and we'll kind of like bulldogs. Like, we'll do whatever we have to do, like sell our house and get an RV to make something successful. And so. But the people who are buying now are not, are not just our friends and family now it's actual people who are strangers who we don't know. So we're beginning to traction through e commerce and through social media and through those types of things. And those kinds of people are early adopters to products. So they want the latest and greatest, the newest, the coolest, or they live at the beach. So our wheels are literally the only wheels and we have an exclusive on these for anything in the beach in the US but they're the only wheels that aren't air filled, don't require air, and actually roll on soft sand. And so people who live at the beach and have to carry stuff to the beach and then want to seat once they get there, a lot of those people have been early adopters of this product.

That's awesome. And I'm sorry to hear about the Kickstarter Thing. Go ahead, Stacy.

No, I would say, and it's men and women. It's just not men. It's a lot of women ordering to take their kids to the beach. And so, I mean, the demographics is, you know, it's very interesting to watch who's ordering and why they're ordering.

So I have a question for you regarding the website is my eye. So mainly my background is that I was tweaking websites for paying the rent. Let's say 12, 13 years ago, I was building my own e commerce and I was tweaking the website because we couldn't afford to pour money into ad. And the question that I have for you is, where is your own, let's say, story in video? Because what I see here is the text on you're about us. And I think your story is one of the coolest stories that I've heard. And we are meeting a lot of e commerce entrepreneurs, and I think the story telling should be outstanding. And to give you some glimpses of what you could do is like, there are these companies in the health industry where we have, for instance, one of our customers called your super, and the founders, they've actually started to use the ingredients because one of them discovered that he had cancer. So he started to build up the products and to do all these mixes because he was fighting for his life with his fiance at that moment. And they've actually discovered what was working. And this story is, first of all, it's authentic. And on the other hand, the brands are now built on top of the human beings behind those brands. And I think this is an undervalued strategy for new brands because behind every brand, there's a story. And behind every story, there's, there's, let's say, a myriad of, let's say, reasons why you will become emotionally involved with the product. And I think this type of story, in your trip, I envision you making this, let's say, always changing. And like Juliana said, you need to document this activity because you, you're, you're not, you're the vivid expression that entrepreneurship lives. You know, I mean, it's, it's, it's a thing. And on the other hand, you can be all in and still have your smile on your face because the, the definition of the entrepreneur. I've been doing this for, I don't know, two decades already, since I was 21, and I, I've been in this roller coaster, and it's like, it, it's, it's never ending. It's like from Nirvana to, oh, what am I gonna do? It's not going to stop. Even though you're gonna be at the level where safety is there, your mind is going to trick you because that's the, that's how your mind works. You're always going to think that, oh, it's going to be a complete mess because you are, you are all in. I mean, that's how you, you interpret life. And my suggestion is to have this story told on your website and on your social media because you need to make your voice heard. And I think your product, it's actually doing a great job. So there are a lot of shitty, let's say, products which are not offering anything. But your product is outstanding. And I think your story should be told in front of the camera and you should follow all the people that are getting on your website with your, with your story and tell them 245 reasons why you should be free. Because you're the expression of freedom. And guess what? The products that you're selling are the expression of being free. You know, you freaking get that with everything. And you go in the mountain or you go at the beach.

Yeah.

So my tattoo, it's so funny you said that is libre. Yeah, it's Spanish for free. But, you know, Valentin, I appreciate that so much. And, you know, we're living our story, so I know it is unique and I love living this story. But I will tell you the hardships that we've encountered. I would not wish them on anyone. When we say we're all in, like, we had a rental home that we sold to invest in our company. We had a second car that we sold. We cashed in our 401ks, our retirement accounts. We sold our home. Like Stacy said, we weren't planning on selling our home, but our company needed the funding. And so. And we were having a hard time at the time finding investors. And so we had to. And so with that authenticity, and you're right, Stacy and I are very authentic and transparent. Unless you really believe in your product, but more importantly yourself, I would not recommend this to anyone because it is a very, very, very hard road that we've walked and has created an immense amount of stress to the point of putting me in the hospital to, like, all kinds of anxiety. And are we going to be able to pay our investors back? Are we going to be able to deliver to these Kickstarter backers? And fortunately, they were gracious with us, but it has been a hard road that, thankfully, Stacy and I love each other so much. That it's drawn us closer as opposed to created tension. Yeah. And I honestly could not, I would not still be doing this if it weren't for Stacy. And I think she would say that, say the same thing about me. It's been a hard road.

Yeah, I'm sure it was. But even though this is going to get completely out of the scope of this E commerce story, let's say the path that you're in is not an external path. At the end of the day, we're gonna end up not being on this planet anymore. At the end of the day, the game is going to be over. And now the question for you that you've answered yes to was, are you willing to transform yourself and your life? And you've said yes. Yes, yes. But when you've said yes, your, your, your last, let's say, Persona that you've built for, I don't know, decades, you, you used to be buying your latte, going at the, in the office, you know, chit, chatting about something in. Near the water cooler. You, You've been other persons and you thought that that's who you are. But at some moment, those, let's say the, the last Persona, which was a mental construction, is not here anymore. That those Julie and Stacy are not here anymore. They are gone.

Complete gang therapist.

It's not about therapy. It's about the journey that you're in.

True.

That's why it's painful. I've been in the same journey. I mean, it's not like it's the same path is the path of self transformation. And it's more like a spiritual path than it is an entrepreneurial path. So what a lot of entrepreneurs are not getting is that once you find the comfort zone, you need to challenge yourself again.

Yes.

And you need to get to the next level. And too many of us are, are either too afraid and are going for the comfort and safety and waste their huge potential. Because I think within anyone, within ourselves, I mean, everyone has an untapped potential. Everyone, Everyone. It's always more. It's always more. And if you don't have this, this, let's say, internal mechanism to, to challenge the status quo, you will end up being bored and ill and dying. And when we look behind, when we will be 94 years old or whatever, you will say, okay, so I've been safe. But who cares about that? I mean, you, you're not gonna want, not to get through this moments when you are freaking struggling and you don't know how you're gonna do this with the cash flow, with the sales, with the house, with the rv. But fact is that you love each other and you're together and you're free and you're making it and the fact that you're doing it, I think it's out. Let's say it's. It's paying off eventually and it's way more worry even though you are, let's say, betting everything that you had.

Yeah.

Yeah.

That's wise. Wise words.

Yeah, very wise words. And I kind of wanted to piggyback on what you were saying about our. Our website and actually putting our story out there on in video. I love that idea. We may need to get to a cool place and do it when we're on the road, but we will do that. We take that advice seriously.

I will follow you and your path. So the idea is to have a map and to have map pins where you are going.

Yeah.

You're saying this week Stacy and Julie are here and you can film each other. It's not like making the biggest production and you get your. Your wonder with you and show us places because that's what the other ones, which are not courageous in enough, which are sitting in a. In an office, which have kids that should go to school or to freaking waste their time in front of the online school on Zoom. Need. Need to see. Actually we need to see real life, real stories. And you're. You're not for real, but you need to broadcast yourselves. You need to be like a small media company.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Thank you.

We take your advice for sure.

Yeah. And what I was going to say was so there is a human factor behind our company and. But a lot of people don't. May not realize it when you go to the website, you go to our. About us and you see that. But there is a human factor. And when. So we'll get emails from Not. I mean we. We don't get any bad emails, but we've had some. Maybe someone unhappy because they hadn't gotten their order. And Jules is so like gracious and so good at this. But the way she responds is the kindest. In the kindest way. And all of a sudden they come back and where they were heightened, she brought them back down to go, oh, wait a. You are a real person. You're. I'm talking to the owner, the founder of the company. And the way she words it is just beautifully written. Where all of a sudden they lean in and say, you know what? Take your time. Or we understand. Or I don't really understand but thank you for taking the time to explain it to me. Even though we sent out emails once a every couple weeks to all of our initial backers, maybe they went to spam and they never got them. And they would go, I hope I get my wonder before I die. You know, that kind of thing. And Jules is like, so too. I mean, we all, we are impatient. We're in the world of Amazon. So, you know, everything you know is immediate. And people don't realize what it takes to take a product to market. And I mean, we have a product that has 147 components to it. It's not just a piece of paper. It's not a T shirt. It's something that does all these. It's a transformer. And so I love that.

That's great.

Yeah. And so, you know, so it does take. It does take someone behind the computer to sit back and say, you know what? We understand. I mean, we've been in this place for the last six weeks waiting for our RV that was supposed to leave the factory six weeks ago. And so we get it. We've been frustrated.

We're.

We've been on that as a customer and so we understand the frustration.

Karma, right?

He just came back and bit me right in the ass.

It always does. It always does. But I think you guys should just like take a picture of the wonder, like in different places in the US and just place it there and just take a picture of it. Just like a postcard. You can send that to your clients or to your early adopters or the people that are waiting. Just a picture with like, hi from, you know, I don't know, New York or hi from California or whatever. I think it's awesome and I think you guys will have a lot to share.

Another thing is to make this entertaining and interactive. You can build a small community of people that will decide where you should be going next on the map. You are here and they could vote because you are wandering around. That's what you do.

Maybe we'll do that next year. What we call our sea legs in the rv. We. Yeah.

That much power. I love it. They're gonna send you to Nebraska or Wisconsin where it's so cold, you don't need that. There's no need there. So I'm. I mean, just to kind of go back to what, you know, whatever we're talking, because at this point, I don't even care. This is so good. Tell me, what are, like some main things you guys are dealing with when it comes to E Commerce? And all these changes, all the software, all these agencies, all these people that are promising you they're gonna change your life forever. I'm fed up with them as well. From my content, you probably know that. I'm fed up.

I love it. If anybody does not follow you who's on this page right now, they need to follow you on LinkedIn. Because I love your content.

Yeah.

Thank you.

You are speaking my language. I get so tired of. Of people promising me, oh, they're gonna do everything, and then. Then they're crickets. We don't hear back from them. Don't follow through. They want to charge you at least $10,000 a month. That's. They're like the going number here. They're a startup. There's themselves. They have no experience, and it's just like. It's just like, for the love people, you know, you do what you say you're gonna do, and if not, communicate. Communicate. Communicate. Communicate over. Communicate with me. I mean, we have spent so much time and money built on empty promises.

Yeah.

So I think.

I think that's definitely a challenge is finding the right partners, ones that share our values, because that's really important to us, but also ones who do it, do what they say they're gonna do. And it's, you know, it's. I think this world is full of a lot of people who, you know, want to make the sale and then they don't follow up with the work that they're, you know, that they're gonna do. And I don't even. So to me, because we didn't. We didn't. We didn't deliver on our promise, right. For the Kickstarter, we said we would deliver it, and we didn't. So to me, it's not even about always delivering on your promise. It's about being in communication. And so if you're going to be late, okay, no problem. Just let me know. Just stay. Just keep me in the loop of what's going on. Yeah. Be responsive. But I think. Exactly. But, yeah, I think in the world of E commerce, to try to really answer your question, it is so hard to know what we need to do to reach the right target. It's literally hard to do that. And who do we trust? Because that's not our expertise, you know? So who do we trust to be able to come to us and say, hey, all right, here's your product. Okay. Who's your audience? Okay, that's your audience. This is what you need to do. Do we need to do email? Do we need to do sms? Do we need to do Facebook ads? Do we need to do Instagram ads? Do we need to do Pinterest? Do we need to do Clubhouse? Do we need to do. I mean, literally there are so many options and all of them could be good or it could be a huge bust.

Right?

Yeah.

And so everybody, depending on what their area of expertise is, is going to tell you, oh, you should definitely have your email list and that should be your focus. But then the SMS people are going, nope, it's moving to sms. Like you, like, don't worry about email, you need to do sms. But then I'm the kind of SMS customer where if you're blowing up my text message, I don't want to be a part of your brand. Right. So now I'm going, well, wait, my internal dialogue is telling me not to go sms, but everybody's saying, well, you should. So it's just, it's really challenging. And then people are saying, well, don't do trade shows because trade shows cost a lot of money and maybe don't get you the bang for your buck. But then other people are saying trade shows are where it's at. So it's literally trying to weed out what the best thing is for us and to try it and then be ready to quickly pivot.

Right.

We've become friggin professional dancers with how much we've had to pivot. But then quickly, quickly pivot if it's not working.

Yeah. Does that make sense?

Is that, I mean, yeah.

What I suggest you, if I can. I've been doing this e Commerce for 15 years now. I've been working with all sorts of companies from startups with had like one employee and to huge companies which are making more than 1.5 billion in sales. I've been consulting them, I've been looking at what they are doing and there was one moment that completely blew my mind. It was two years ago. I've met this guy, Bob Moista. He used to be, let's say he's the pioneer of the jobs to be done theory, together with Clay Christensen, which is an absolute master in hero, the innovator's dilemma and whatever. So for me it was like completely blew my mind. After this workshop, after these two days workshop, I was with Juliana as well. After these two days workshop I was taking notes and I was, I, I got the whole company and I said, said I was freaking wrong for the whole time. And what was, what was the, the, the realization is that we are seeing individuals as, as predictable Creatures and we wrongly think that I don't know this freaking object. This is an object that I'm buying to, to. It's like a buzzer when I'm distracted and I have to do creative work. It's like a buzz that I keep with me and it has some machine learning and he's buzzing me if I'm distracted and I'm, I'm going waste. But it's not, I'm not buying this because I'm a 40 years old entrepreneur that has two kids and lives in the outskirts of Bucharest. So if you are, if you try to, to sell this because I'm from Bucharest and I have two kids, you're gonna be completely wrong. The reason that I'm buying it, it. So the underlying reason that I'm buying it is that I want to be reaching my, let's say best flow state like this without going waste because I know that I'm too creative to be productive. You know, I can't stay freaking focused. And I'm using a lot of stuff to do this. I'm meditating for half an hour, an hour in the morning. I'm doing sports, I'm using this freaking device and whatever. So the, the, the let's say this disease that it's in the marketing and in the E commerce is that you go to Facebook ads and you select the targeting how, how many years old from which location and whatever is not that. So the cause that I'm doing this is that if the ad will say are you from Bucharest? Then you should buy this, it's going to be a complete mess. Right? But if the ad says are you freaking tired not to stay focused for the whole day and look at the watch and find out that it's 7pm and you haven't even started to do the most important thing that you decided in the morning, then you need to.

Fire Juliana because that's his biggest distraction.

So Juliana is like, like, I don't know, is like a hired hitman. You know, she's, she's finding me on all the channels that you can imagine. But I, I don't. The, the underlying, let's say fact that I wanted to, to emphasize for you is that. But unless you find where are the people and what they are doing and when is the moment that they are struggling because I don't know, they have sand on their wheels or they need to carry all these bags and all the things with them. If you don't find that moment, that struggle and if you are not there to solve Those problems, if you don't put your message in front of them and you go down the spiral route where you are just wasting money on ads for people that you think they are your target, then it's. Yeah, I think you're. You're gonna be wrong about it. And I've been wrong again for, I don't know, 20 years of. Not 20, 17 years. You know, I wrongly thought that you need to find the buyer Persona and put the right message, but the idea is that you need to find the job that the product is doing. And when that struggle occurs, when is that struggle? And how can you find the people which are struggling with that and the best moments for you. I would go, if I were you, and if I would be so free like you are, I would go on the beach, you know, and I've been. I would go exactly there, and I would ask people and I would hand out flyers because you. It's the cheapest way, and they are already there. And you should plant those seeds. If you. If you. If you talk with 200 people per day, both of you, and if you are actually showcasing your thing, that's the cheapest thing. You don't have to pay Facebook ads for, I don't know. Yeah, 30 cents a click. For someone that you don't know if it's in that moment in his life when he's struggling to carry all those freaking things.

And what you sold me on that thing, I need a shocker. Okay, you are a salesman. Yeah.

Yeah, but that's Valentine. That's exactly. You're exactly right. And that's exactly why we're getting in the RV, because this product is great for RVers as well. And so we are going to be in and out, out and among our customers. We want to get to know them. We want them to get to know us. We want them to know that ome gear. Back to that human element that we were talking about. We want to meet people. And. And then once we meet people, then show them our product.

Right?

We want to lead with the relationship. And then if they're interested, then say, yeah, we have this product. That's what's always been really successful for us to. To just genuinely be interested in people. And then if they're interested in our product, that's great. But, yeah, that's exactly why we're doing the RV trip.

I think it's fucking amazing. And also, one thing that you should find out when you talk to these people is to understand what are they using to do the job for now that the product does, so what are they replacing the job with? Because I'm assuming it's not going to be the same thing. It's gonna be a chair and a backpack or a chair in a bag or a little cooler. And the chair, like you have to understand what. Because sometimes the competition is not another chair. Sometimes the competition that you have is probably because that's the thing.

Different products.

Exactly. That have nothing to do with. With each other is the classic, I guess, example of the milkshake from McDonald's. That milk. The milkshake from McDonald's were, you know, they were thinking they're competing with the Burger King of milkshake. But actually, after doing these jobs to be done research, they found out that people were only buying the milkshake in the morning and it was competing with a donut, it was competing with the bagel, and it was competing with total different things. Exactly. Yeah. So I'm gonna send you the link for that case study. It's gonna blow your mind.

Yeah.

That's why sometimes you don't compete with other products. You compete with whatever the customer uses to solve that job that your product does. So I think that's going to be an interesting find. And I'm just going to probably, you know, spam you and ask you, what did you find out?

You can spam us anytime. We, you know, and, you know, we want to be very, very open and transparent with, with anyone who may be interested in buying our product, because our product's not for everyone. It is a heavier product. So if you have trouble lifting 25 pounds, this product might not be for you. And it's not that you have to lift it. You might have to lift it into a car or, you know, something like that. But you take the wheels off, it's third. It's 30 pounds, and you take the wheels off, and so it's 26 pounds. So it may not be for everyone. And we know that. And so we're very transparent. We're very honest with people that write us and say, how heavy is it? And we try to get a little background and they're like, well, let me know when you do a lighter version. And we want to be a customer of yours. And we're going to continue to follow us, but we're going to continue to follow you. But it's just being honest with your customers or potential customers to say, this may not be for you because it may be a little heavy.

But the good news is that the job is still the same one that Jules dad was trying to solve. Because jobs don't change, so that's a good thing. Like products come and go. Technologies come and go. They disappear. They whatever. But the job is still the same. So I think you guys are still very close to fulfilling Jules Dad's dream because it's the same job, and I'm just excited for you guys. So where are you going first in your trip?

Well, first we're going to go to Kitty Hawk. We've partnered with New Belgium Brewery here in the United States.

Okay.

And so we will be going to Kitty Hawk up in the North Carolina Outer Banks. There are some islands out there, and so they're doing a big kite festival. It's in the largest. On the largest sand dune in the southeast, or maybe even on the East Coast. And so this is really where we can showcase the tires. We've been there, we tested there, and had about 80 pounds of gear up on our Wanderer. And no problem over the soft sand. So that's our first stop, and then we head down to Miami after that.

That's awesome. My husband's family is from Miami.

Yeah, they're.

They're different there.

They build it differently.

I'm always. I'm always giving my husband hell because you know that joke with the Florida man? Right. So sometimes, you know, when he pisses me off because, you know, we in Romania have our own Florida news because we're not very different than Florida in Romania here. So when my husband is trolling me, I'm also, you know, starting with Florida man. That microwave, the cat was trying to fight the crocodile or stuff like that, I think. Yeah. Besides my craziness for this podcast, which is totally, you know, misplaced tonight, I have a question here from Elaine. And, Elaine, I'm so sorry that I kept you waiting for so long. It's just that I like to hear my still talking. Apparently, Elaine is asking, you guys, do you have a schedule to publish of your travels? Like, do you have some sort of. I think this is what she's asking, like, if you have a schedule to publish your travels.

So I want to answer this because Elaine is a dear friend of mine.

Elaine. Okay.

I'm so glad you're on this. It's been too long. We need to catch up. But, yes, we. So we have a blog on our website, and it's.

Sorry, let me share it.

Yep. So it's linked on our website, the blog. And we'll be posting our itinerary for the first three or four months there, but we'll on Our blog. We'll always be updating our itinerary of where we're going to be so that we can connect with people along the road.

So we'll be putting out the first three month itinerary probably in the next couple weeks.

Cool.

I'm going to make sure to drop the link to your blog in our episode notes so people, you know that here you guys can stalk you properly.

We love to be stalked in the right way.

Well, since this is an e commerce podcast or show, we all. We also have a children's book we wrote and we have an e commerce site for that too.

Oh, tell me, what's the name of it?

It's called Rescued by Rico. And it is about a dog that we adopted from Puerto Rico. His name was Rico. And we had him for about five months and he was super sick and we got him back to health and then he crossed the rainbow bridge. And so it's. It's our story to talk about Rico and. And how he got here and him crossing the rainbow bridge. So that was our Covid project. We drew. I mean, we produced the book and coloring book and little Rico dog. So, yeah, now we're like all in e commerce, everything.

Oh, my God. But this is so awesome.

I love the illustration. Do you do them yourself or you have an illustrator?

No, we haven't.

She's awesome. She's in Charleston and crazy talented. We wanted to do it right, and so that's why we hired her. And she's exceptional.

The little stuffed dog, too. That's so cute.

I know.

Oh, my gosh.

Yo.

Wow.

This is awesome. Thank you. I didn't make that type of research that deep over, but I would have been probably weird if I knew that too. Okay. She knows too much.

I love it.

Okay, so this. Sorry, Valentin, Juliana, ladies first, please.

Anyway, I do recall that at the beginning you've said, I promise this is the only question that I have. 16 questions after.

Okay, Valentin, go ahead.

No, no, no. Ladies first, please.

I even forgot what I wanted to ask.

Okay, so what I wanted to ask, to ask you before making Juliana forget what she wanted to ask you was if you can share with our audience, with other entrepreneurs, which are, I don't know, struggling. They are in that bottom. You know, there. There is this place called the Messy Middle. You know, it's that thing that it's. Nobody talks about it. Everyone is showcasing. Yes. I'm gonna start. I'm gonna do this and that and that. Or they say we just raised 20 million. We. We just hit Whatever arrow I on, on Facebook ads and whatever, but nobody's talking about. About the messy middle. So how you've got through the messy middle? What are some tips and tricks that you can share with e commerce entrepreneurs which are struggling?

Great question.

You know, I just had this thought about quicksand, and they say that, you know, you just, I mean, maybe that's not a great analogy because they say not to move because then you're going to sink. But I think with us, it's okay. I'll even give a better one. They talk about the frog, like, swimming around in a vat of cream. And he keeps swimming, but he doesn't realize that he's creating butter. He's churning butter. So eventually gets on top. And so to me, that thing, that's where Jules and I have been. We've been down to the messy middle, to the dirty bottom. We've been, we've been in every, every part of the barrel and, and it's just, we just keep going. We get up every day and we. You said we have a picture and it says we. We will rise singing every single day. And it's just. Is it. You know, we can't do what. We can't worry about what happened yesterday, and we can't worry about what's going to happen tomorrow. We have to focus on the now and just keep going. And, and even if you're stuck at the bottom or in the, in the messy middle, you will get to the top if you just keep going.

The only thing I would add to that is one of the things that I've learned from Stacy is step away from the computer, step away from your job, step away from your company, step away from your product, and go do something that fills you. Because if you don't invest in yourself, you will have nothing left to give your company, other people, your family, the people that you love, if you don't first invest in you. And so I think what I've. What I'm learning, I'm not sure that I've fully learned it, but put the computer lid down and go for a walk or go out to the beach when you have the most to do and you're so overwhelmed, that's the best time to walk away from your computer. Because we have to as humans. We get. Our tank gets empty, and then we think we just need to keep going, keep going. But eventually, you're literally going to run out of gas. And so if you don't invest in yourself, that is hands down the most important thing. Just like if you don't love yourself, you cannot love other people, and you cannot be loved well by other people. So it literally is. It feels really selfish, but it's actually the most selfless thing you can do, is to invest in yourself. And when you do that, then you will have the energy and the strength and the fortitude to keep going on this road that is incredibly rocky and incredibly hard. So, anyway, I think we teach each other all the time different things, and that's definitely one of the things that Stacy has taught me.

Yeah, I think it's quite fortunate for you to, let's say, go through the messy middle together, because you can. You can lean on each other for me, if I can. Add on what you've told. It was 2017. I was surrounded by a lot of colleagues. I have the greatest and most patient wife ever. I had some incredible kids, and I was so attached, so identified with my. With my expectations about where the company should be. And I was passing through this burnout, which I wasn't aware about. And I've done exactly what you're stating here, Jules, that I stopped disconnecting from the computer, from the work, and I was getting into this downward spiral where I've wrongfully thought that who am I is the. It's equal to the results of my company with the numbers. You know, if I have such and such growth, if I have such and such revenue, profit to whatever. And I think it's such a. Let's say, wrong assumption. And that's, of course, having to do with your image, with who's your character? And I think that's a lot. Michael Gerber talks about this. If you have a life plan, you should include the business plan in the life plan.

Yes.

Not vice versa.

Yes.

Many entrepreneurs are falling into this trap, and they think that they should have a business plan, and the life plan should be over there as well. I mean, they should leave some room for the. For their life as well. But it's actually vice versa. The. The character of an entrepreneur is being built by who am I? You know, And I'm way bigger than my role as an entrepreneur. Of course, I'm not identified with that. And it. I had to suffer like crazy for. For months and to be alone within this. This period, even though I was surrounded by such amazing people around me, just because I wrongfully thought that I'm not gonna be valuable, I'm. Unless I'm gonna get to these freaking numbers, which are sandcastle at the end of the day.

Yep.

Yep.

That's, again, wise words.

Yep.

I love it.

That's. That's what Valentine, you know, does. That's why, you know, every day I hear some of these things, and that's why I'm, you know, one of the reasons why, you know, I'm trying to behave so he can. So he doesn't fire me.

She's crazy.

I think everyone by now. I think everyone by now has came to the consideration that I'm not necessarily uncrazy. I don't know what I think everyone is in agreement. But I also want to say for the record and for our podcast listeners, that back when Valentino was dealing with all these things, I was not working for Omnicomp, or so.

She was not the reason why.

Wasn't the reason why. Yeah. Thank you guys so much for coming. I'm just happy you guys came and you shared with us. And it's just I'm in a very good relationship myself with my partner, and I always told him every day that I couldn't go through all this shit without him, and I wouldn't know what to do with myself without him because I wouldn't. Like, I cannot even think. I don't even have memories that don't include him anymore. So I just want to say that above everything, you know, the struggles and the beautiful story around your business, I think the most beautiful thing is what you guys have. And that's what keeps you guys, you know, strong and keeps, you know, keeps everyone, you know, I guess, gravitating around you because it's pure and it's genuine. I. I love that. So thank you so much for coming and sharing with us. I apologize for my shenanigans.

Don't.

I should probably make like a PDF one. One pager that to give to guests, like, just beware. This podcast was brought to you by Vitex. Vetex is the first and only fully.

Integrated E commerce marketplace and OMS solution that offers fastest time to revenue and no upgrades ever.

So go ahead, check them out. Vtex.com.

It.