EPISODE 170: What Do Women Really Think About ___? Part 2

We got so many dms from women in relationships with men who said, I used to hate it. I used to feel like it was really degrading. I didn't have anywhere near enough confidence to do it or a lot of, like, I had never done it before. But then I got your ultimate foreplay guides and those gave me all the confidence in the world to the point where now I actually enjoy giving them. Hello, and welcome to the Pillow Talks podcast. We're your hosts, Vanessa and Xander Marin. I'm a sex therapist with over 20 years of experience.

And I'm just a regular dude. We share the ups and downs in our relationship while giving you step by step techniques for improving yours.

Make sure you subscribe for your weekly double date full of totally doable sex tips, practical relationship advice, hilarious and honest stories of what really goes on behind closed bedroom doors, and so much more. It's the sex education you wish you'd had. All right, we are back today with part two of our what Do Women Really Think about series. We actually just recorded a separate intro where Xander tried to make it about himself and say the whole episode is what do women really think about Xander? I tried that, actually. That could be a brutal episode. We put up a question box. It was like, what? What do you really think about Xander? Be honest.

I mean, it's kind of in the same vein of like, you know, the comedy roast. So instead of a roast, it's just.

Just roast Xander for an entire episode.

Drag. Drag Zander on the podcast. Live.

Live. Okay.

I mean, I don't know. As live as it gets.

So we already did part one of this. That was episode 103. We talked about topics like masturbation, butt stuff, penis size, and that is currently our fourth most listened to episode.

Damn.

We. We also did not leave men out of this series. We have done two parts of what Do Men Really Think about? That was episode 56. We talked about vulva's emotional intimacy and more. And then episode 69, lingerie, boobs, money, queefing, and tons of other questions. We do always like to put in a little shout out for our non binary friends. We know that there is so much more to gender than just male and female. Unfortunately though, sometimes the logistics of like setting up episodes like this and makes it difficult to cover all of that diversity. So I just wanted to speak to that right up top here. But today we're back to talk about a whole new fresh batch of topics. What do women really think about their partners? Watching porn, giving and receiving oral sex, tradwives and we've got some really interesting wild cards too.

We're covering a lot of ground.

We really are.

And as much as I would like to jump in and just speak for all women, since I have so much credibility to do that, instead, I will be asking the questions today. Let Vanessa speak for all women. She gets a turn in this.

I'm not speaking for all women. We are backing this episode up with stats. So here's how we set this up.

You came better prepared than I did.

For the men episode, we first turned to our Instagram community, and if you're not following us on Instagram, we're. Vanessa and Xander definitely come check us out there, because we do all sorts of fun polls for these episodes and lots of other great content there too. But it was kind of funny, actually. I put up a story that said, okay, we're doing an episode called what do women really think about? What's something that, you know, a topic that you want us to cover.

You didn't include any examples.

People answered the question really literally and wrote, like, things that they think about, like, oh, I think about my children and the chores that I have to.

Do, why the sky is blue. And we were like, oh, we were not clear enough in that question. What we are looking for.

Yeah. And so we went back and reposted it and said, okay, sorry, we're out asking for women's opinions. What's a topic that you want women's opinions on? So we picked a bunch, and then we went back to our Instagram community and polled these. So we're gonna answer these questions with some stats.

All right, let's get started. How do women currently feel about their relationships?

All right, we gave four responses here. Happy and in love, satisfied but not amazing. Meh. Pretty neutral and. And unhappy or dissatisfied. And I will say the answers pleasantly surprised me. Here I was expecting that meh neutral was gonna be pretty high, and it actually wasn't. Our most popular response was happy and in love with 46%. I like to hope that maybe the people in our Instagram community are benefiting from our tips and guidance, and that's helping contribute to that big percentage. But that felt pretty big to me. 40. Almost half of couples or half of women in relationships, like, currently feel happy and in love. Next common answer was 33% satisfied but not amazing. 12% meh neutral and 8% were actively unhappy and dissatisfied. I thought that would be a much higher category, too, of, like, actively feeling unhappy and dissatisfied, like, in this current stage of your relationship. And I Mean, I also want to say, like, it's very natural for relationships to go through ebbs and flows, to have seasons, you know, seasons where you feel happy and content and seasons where it feels like you're really disconnected and you're not getting along. So it's. It's normal. It's okay to be in a season like that. I just. Yeah, I was expecting there'd be more people in that season.

Yeah, I mean, I think. I think it can be hard to acknowledge, even to yourself, in moments where, like, you know, if you're, like, feeling truly unhappy or truly dissatisfied, I think that often we can kind of deceive ourselves into thinking that things are a little better until they're really not better, and then we kind of jump over to the extreme. But I'm really glad. I'm glad that people are generally happy. I think even the satisfied but not amazing category, like, I think that's really, like, our sweet spot. Like, we're trying to. We are trying to reach couples that are in good, positive relationships, and we can, like, make it even better than you even thought was ever possible. So, yeah, I mean, that's great. There's a lot of people there, and, like, that's exactly what we do.

That's such an interesting category, too, because it's. I think it invites you to get a little bit curious there about, like, okay, it's not amazing, but I'm satisfied. Are you satisfied? Because it's just maybe it's a hard season of life and you're like, you know what? This is the best that we are capable of right now. Are you satisfied because you feel like you don't deserve amazing? Like, those are two really different types of responses to have. So I'd say if you answered yes to satisfied but not amazing, I would just spend a little bit of time thinking, like, what does that mean for me?

Yeah. And like, yeah, what specifically is not amazing? Because once you start thinking about that, then you can start thinking about, okay, so what are some steps that I could take in those areas to get it more towards amazing. And we got a lot of ways that we can help in most of the areas that I'm guessing that you might think of.

Also, there could be a response, satisfied but not amazing, where maybe you actually have too high of expectations for your relationship to play devil's advocate for a second. Like some, you know, we're all fed this fairy tale version of relationships, and a lot of us feel some amount of dissatisfaction if it's like, ugh, you know, I don't feel the butterflies every day. I don't feel that spark every single day. Why aren't we, like, madly, passionately in love the way we used to? I'd be willing to bet that that category is very small. But, you know, just play devil's advocate. Keep it spicy. If you've heard the podcast before, you know that we record from bed. Our bed, which is draped in our Cozy Earth sheets and duvet cover and pillowcases.

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Cozyearth.com Pillow talks now, how long do.

Women really want intercourse to last?

This is such a great question that I think the vast majority of couples have never really asked each other and are probably thinking their partner has a very different answer from what their partner actually would answer. So the most common duration that women want is six to 10 minutes. But I think a lot of men in relationships with women assume that it should be higher. Like they think women want it to last longer. Yeah, all night, extra hours.

Yeah. That as a man you are expected to deliver this long performance. So I think you have a lot of men that are trying really hard to, to last, to go as long as possible. And then on the other side, you have men that are feeling like they are struggling to last long enough and are like, so it's like you have guys who are like beating themselves up over, like, oh my God, I only lasted for a couple of minutes. Like, I know a lot of women.

Who are like, great.

Perfect. So it's like he's beating himself up over it, putting a lot of shame on himself over it. And then on the other side, you have a lot of guys who are like, thinking about baseball and grandmas trying to last longer, like intentionally having a less than stellar experience themselves because they feel like they're trying to live up to some like, masculine ideal, which is also not what their partner wants.

And meanwhile, she's over here thinking, buddy, six to ten minutes, that's all I want. Now, I have to say there could be some other factors going into this. I'll say, like, I am somebody who likes intercourse on the shorter side as well. Like, I think it's fun. Like, it can be enjoyable to have it drawn out at times. But like, if we're talking about the average Tuesday night, like, I just want to connect with you. Like, I like it on the shorter side too. But I do think that there are a lot of women who want it to be shorter because they not experiencing very much pleasure and certainly not having orgasms. For us, like, we have a, you know, we have a routine, we can get it done quickly and effectively and we both have a really great time. And so on those times where it's like, yeah, you know, it's like we don't have too much time today or it's late tonight, but we just want to have that connection. Like, we can make sure that we both have a great experience.

And that opens, I mean, that opens up the door to like, being open to have sex in A lot of situations that I imagine a lot of other couples aren't, because a lot of other couples are thinking, oh, well, like, if one of us wants to have sex, then that's like, you're looking at the calendar, looking at your watch, like, how can we. Like, how are we gonna do this? Like. Or if we have to go quick, like, only one of us is gonna be satisfied and I'm gonna feel resentful and like, it's just like. Then all of a sudden, like, sex, the idea of sex starts feeling problematic rather than exciting.

Yeah. And definitely there are just so many women who don't get a lot of enjoyment out of intercourse. I mean, we've pulled this separately, and we found that 91% of women said that intercourse is not the most pleasurable activity for them. So that's another really important piece of the puzzle to remember for, you know, men who have sex with women. We need to have more time spent with your hands, with your mouth, with a toy. That's going to be so much more likely to get us to experience pleasure and reach orgasm than intercourse itself.

Yeah. I mean, I think one of the big problem is that a much more commonly understood, or at least just sort of like, known stat is the amount of time that most women need stimulation to reach orgasm. I think men tend to be aware that, like, oh, you know, it, you know, might be closer to 20 minutes or something like that. And so then in their head, they're thinking, oh, I have to be, like, pounding away for 20 minutes. And unfortunately, what men don't understand is that intercourse, regardless of the amount of time for most women, is not going to be the most pleasurable activity. So it's like they're like, oh, well, I got to go a long time so that I can give them the good experience that I'm pretty sure I've heard a stat that said, I needed to go for a while, but it turns out it's like you're looking at it the wrong way. It's not intercourse if the intercourse isn't pleasurable. Just going longer isn't going to make it pleasurable magically. It's about finding the actual activities on. Also, those stats of, like, how long women need are, like, probably imperfect.

Anyway, I was just about to say that I have issues with the 20 minutes number.

Oh, yeah. Because it's based on women who haven't had conversations with their partner about what is the most pleasurable activity. And so it's like the sample size is skewed by a bunch of people that are not having very pleasurable sex aren't doing the right activities. And therefore, that's making those averages or medians or whatever, they're looking at, like, skew way in the positive direction. If you had a sample of people where it was like, hey, like, I know what I need, my partner knows what I need, we both have, like, we both do it that way. Like, I would imagine those numbers are a lot lower.

Yeah. I think that if you had some magical dream research scenario where you could give a man and give a woman, like, the exact kind of genital stimulation that they like best, the actual times to reach orgasm would be very, very similar. I think it's just because men and women have sex that is very male pleasure focused that women need longer. So if you want to learn how to have intercourse that is more focused on female pleasure, more balanced rather than all about the man, then we'll put a link to our guide, next level Intercourse in the show notes. It's a really fun way to explore having more pleasure for both partners during intercourse. So right after we wrap up recording this podcast, we are gonna go make ourselves some lunch with our brand new Marley Spoon Delivery. They are a new podcast sponsor for us, and we have been so excited to try out their food. We're always looking for ways to eat healthier, but I think most people know, like, eating healthy usually means bland or just really unexciting food or a lot of prep time. And that is all completely changed with Marley Spoon. They are the best tasting me kit money can buy. And with our code pillow, you can get up to 25 free meals. The amount of selection that you have is out of control. Every week, over a hundred delicious recipes. A lot of them are customizable, which I've never seen before. Like, you can pick specific ingredients. You can look for, like, vegetarian meals, family friendly dishes. Like, it's just really interesting, like, how much customization you can do.

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All right, now here's one that I think a lot of people are going to want to know. Have they ever faked an orgasm?

77% of women said yes, they have faked. Only 23% said no. Honestly, I thought this might have been higher. I thought it might be higher, too, because it's ever. But here's the thing. A lot of women don't even try to fake. They just don't have them, period.

Oh, yeah.

Yeah. So it's like I'm. Yeah, I actually. We just got a DM like the other day from a woman saying, like, I never have an orgasm and I never fake them, but my partner has never asked me about it or never seemed to notice.

Oh. I mean, I was. I was just thinking about, like, the first. The first. I mean, it was a very, very casual but, like the first kind of like, girlfriend that I had in. In college for, like, two months or something. Like, we weren't. We weren't having sex, but we were doing other things. And, like, we never had that conversation about orgasm. And I feel like I would be giving her oral sex and I was like, I don't know, like, how long I'm supposed to be doing this for. Like, she's obviously enjoying this, but I can't really tell, like, what direction things are going. And, like, I couldn't. It was like, it doesn't really seem like she's having an orgasm per se, but, like, things are getting better. But. And, and, like, I think, like, I would just like, kind of stop at some point because I was too, like, I felt too awkward or embarrassed to ask. Like, like, oh, like, did you have an orgasm? Do you? Like, it was just sort of like this. I mean, that was that the era of, like, orgasm being a mysterious thing, like, for me, like, none of, you know, amongst My friends, like, no one really, like, knew that much about female orgasm.

Well, let me. Let me give you the code now. You're not. You're not having sex with any strange women any longer. But for any single people out there, the cheat code here is you tell her, I'm gonna keep going as long as you're enjoying it. So put the onus on her to tell you when she wants you to be done. But also, don't phrase it as, like, you tell me when you've had an orgasm.

You have to go until you come.

As long as you're enjoying it, that takes the pressure off of her, and that puts the focus on the enjoyment where it should be.

Man, I wish I, you know, I wish I knew that earlier. I wish I had met you earlier. Too late. So that I wouldn't. Too late.

Sucker.

Wouldn't have, you know, Wouldn't have. Okay, how do they feel about giving oral?

All right, we gave four categories for this one. Again, love it. I get enjoyment out of it. Happy to do it for my partner, but I don't enjoy it. Neutral or unsure and dislike. Won't do it or haven't done it. Okay, so our most popular answer at 40% was, Happy to do it for my partner, but I don't enjoy it. Then very close behind at 38% was, love it. I get enjoyment out of it.

These are the people that have got our foreplay guides.

No, I was just about to say, like, we. When we posted this question, we got so many DMs from women in relationships with men who said, I used to hate it. I used to feel like it was really degrading. I didn't have anywhere near enough confidence to do it or a lot of, like, I had never done it before. But then I got your ultimate foreplay guides, and those gave me all the confidence in the world to the point where now I actually enjoy giving them. Yeah, it turns out this crazy, like, 38% saying, I love it. I get enjoyment out of it.

Yeah, it turns out the secret to enjoying things is knowing how to do them. Feeling good about, like, your ability in something. I mean, it's like, it works like that, like, with hobbies and stuff. Like, no one enjoys, like, a sport or an activity that they suck at. Right?

Yeah, yeah. No, it makes perfect sense, like, the more you know what you're doing. And that's, like, why we made these guides in the first place, because where else do you learn, like, step by step, actual techniques, not just vague, like, you know, act like you enjoy it and play around and try new things. Like this is really, really a specific guide so we'll put the link to that in the show notes as well along with our next level Intercourse guide. But if you want to enjoy giving it because it's a very enjoyable act to give, it's really exciting to see how much pleasure you can bring your partner and just be able to focus on them. And of course we also have a vulva edition of the Foreplay guides so you can get more comfortable receiving. Which actually leads us straight into the next question.

Yeah, I mean you hold a lot of power in your hands or your mouth in that situation and that can be an enjoyable experience in and of itself.

Chances are the talk your parents had with you wasn't great. Maybe you sat through a painfully uncomfortable conversation about the perils of sex before marriage, heard some questionable sex facts from your friends at school, or watched your high school science teacher do wild things to a banana.

Or maybe you never even got a talk at all.

You probably wouldn't be here if you hadn't already experienced the harmful impact that this lack of a proper sex education had on your own life.

And we know you want better for your kids.

You want them to have a healthy relationship with intimacy and sex, to feel confident and secure in their own skin, to know when to say no and when to say yes, to know how to keep their bodies and their hearts safe. So we want to help you have the talk with your kids in a way you're proud of and equip them with the shame free, confidence boosting knowledge that they deserve.

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But you have to get in before August 31st. Check out the show notes for this episode or go to vmtherapy.com/talks all right. Actually Vanessa, before we get into receiving, we got another one. We got to Put in here first.

Oh, yeah.

Which is, you know, on the. On the oral train.

What do we do?

Yeah, on. On the. On the. On the blowjob train.

We're on the blowjob train.

Next stop, blowjob train. Blowjob station.

There should be different stops. It can't just all be blow job station.

Next stop, blow station. Next. Next stop, job station.

No. To be different categories.

Okay, well, we're jumping on the blowjob express and asking women how they feel about spitting versus swallowing.

So 19% of women spit, 30% swallow, and 37% said, I don't let him come in my mouth.

Wow.

Yeah, that was really high, that 37%.

Interesting.

Very interesting. Okay, so we gotta dig it.

We gotta dig. We gotta do that in future polls.

Well, I want to say this, like, you get to choose whatever feels right for you and your body. There is no right answer here. I will say, though, if you're somebody who wants to spit, I think it's really important to be, like, kind and sensitive about it. Like, you don't want to be, like, you know, spitting it out gross somewhere. Like, that's somebody's. That's somebody's body. And semen is a natural. You know, it's a natural bodily fluid. It's not meant to taste like candy or something delicious.

Like, it also doesn't taste horrible.

It doesn't taste horrible. It just tastes like a body fluid. So I think we need to be really disrespect. Disrespectful. Wow.

Whoa. Freudian slip.

Be respectful. Put yourself in your partner's shoes. Imagine, like, if your partner went down on you and came up and was like. Like, rushing for the sink to spit it out. Like, that doesn't feel good, right? So, like, do it discreetly. Do it respectfully. I will also say with spitting, though, when you spit, you have it in your mouth for way longer than if you just swallow. So if you're, like, sensitive about the taste or the texture, just like, you know, you're making yourself go through it for so much longer. So I'd say if you're. If you don't want to swallow it, it's probably better not to let your partner come in your mouth in the first place.

Also, when they're coming in your mouth, probably it's like actually going towards the back of your throat where you don't have taste buds. By spitting it, you are actually, while you're prolonging, the amount of time is in your mouth. Two, you are. You are literally passing it through the area where you have taste buds and are more likely to perceive texture and flavor. So I think that. Yeah, I'm not. I mean, no judgment. I'm just logistically trying to call out that actually, you are probably. You are more likely to have more of the experience that you're trying to avoid by doing it that way. Easy for me to say, because I've not had that. I've not had that experience.

You haven't been on the blowjob train? Blowjob Express.

I haven't been on the blowjob train.

Okay, wait. So now let's move into the what about receiving the other end of it? So our most popular response was 52% saying, Love it. 31% said, it's fine, but I like other things better. 9% said neutral or unsure, and 8% said dislike it, have never had it or won't do it. So a lot of women, 52% love receiving it. I mean, a huge percentage of women overall, like, really like it.

Great.

Only 17% don't. I do want to say, though, whenever we talk about oral, there is this big misconception. Like, a lot of women feel like something is horrible, horribly wrong with them if they don't love it. There's, like, really a sensitivity around this in particular. So I just want to say, if you don't love oral, that's totally fine. That's normal. That's okay. You're allowed not to. It is also worth getting curious about why you don't like it, because one of the biggest resistances that comes up to it is all the crap that we're taught about our bodies, that our genitals are icky and weird and they smell bad and they taste bad. So a lot of women either refuse to receive it altogether or just feel uncomfortable with that. So if that's the reason for your discomfort, that's something that you can and should get over. Because there's nothing wrong with your body. It's wonderful and perfect just the way it is.

Yeah, I feel like it's interesting. It asks, like, how do you feel about receiving oral and receiving, like, you know, fingering or something? And if you're, like, hard. No. On both of those, maybe that's something to look at. But if you're just like, oh, yeah. No, actually, like, I really prefer, like, the external stimulation I get when my partner fingers me way more than oral, then, like, it sounds like you just know what you like.

Yeah.

All right. Now, speaking of oral versus fingering, do women get more pleasure from fingering? Or oral.

I thought this was a really interesting question. So oral was the winner here. 59% of women said they get more pleasure from oral, whereas 41% said they get more pleasure from fingering.

Yeah, but it's not like, you know, it's not this like far and away thing. I'm pretty sure I don't have the numbers in front of me, but I feel like we have asked men, you know, what do you prefer between blow job versus hand job? And I think the blow job preference is much higher in men, but it's still not 100%. There are plenty of men that prefer hand jobs over oral.

We have a special treat for you today. We're joined by our friend Liz Moody, host of the Liz Moody Podcast. Liz is a longtime journalist who shares real science, real stories, and realistic tools that actually level up every part of your life. We are at the end of this series. It has really flown by. So if you have not heard Liz's first four tips, definitely go back to our last four episodes. You will hear them there. And today we are going out with an excellent fifth final tip.

This is one of my all time favorite tips. It's changed my life the most. And this is to build self love. But before you tune up, before you're like, yeah, yeah, yeah, okay, build self love. We talk about this all the time. I have actual action steps to get there because I was sick of people saying, oh, you should love yourself, you should respect yourself, you should talk to yourself nicely, all of these things. And it's like, okay, but how, how do I build this relationship with myself that's going to feel really good. And as you guys know, until we have that foundation of self love, it's really hard to show up as our best selves in all of our other relationships and our romantic relationships and our friendships, in our relationships with our kids or our parents. So building that foundation is hugely important. But how do we do it? And the secret that nobody is talking about for building self love is that it needs to be built on a foundation of self trust. Because if you are saying these nice things to yourself, if you're looking at yourself in the mirror and you're saying, oh, you're so great, I believe in you, but you haven't built that foundation of self trust. You are not going to believe yourself. It's the same as if you have a partner and they're like, yeah, I'll take the trash out. And then the next day they don't take the trash out. And then you're like, well, you're gonna take the trash out. And they're like, yeah, yeah, I'll take the trash out. And then they don't take the trash out. And then you're like, well, why should I believe you? The next time that you say you're going to take the trash out, none of your actions have matched with what you're saying. So how do we build self trust? Building self trust is about keeping the promises that we make to ourselves. This shows up in so many little ways in our lives that we do not even realize. If you're laying in bed in the morning and you're like, I'm not going to scroll on my phone first thing. And then you reach for your phone and you scroll on it first thing. That is breaking a tiny promise to yourself. That is saying to yourself, you are not trustworthy. So the next time you're trying to tell yourself something that you want to trust, that you want to believe, you have not built that foundation. So making promises to yourself that you can keep and making promises to yourself that you can keep, the way we're going to do that is we're going to lower the bar. We're going to stack the odds in our favor. If you're one of those phone people, maybe you're plugging your phone in in a different room so that you're not tempted to reach for it first thing in the morning. So you're stacking the odds in your favor. If you're saying, I'm going to meditate day for 20 minutes, but you don't do it, and you're eroding that self trust which is going to erode your self love, you're going to lower the bar. Can you meditate for two minutes? Can you meditate for one minute? What is the lowest that you can make the bar to keep those promises to yourself, to build that foundation of self trust which is going to lead you to self love.

I remember seeing this tip from you, I think, on an Instagram reel for the first time, actually. And it hit me like a ton of bricks because you're right. Like, nobody ever talks about the trust aspect of it. And we are all so, so guilty of this. Like, we make all these tiny little promises to ourselves that we never follow through on. And I had never thought about it in that way before of like, oh, I'm eroding my trust in myself. Like, why would I believe myself? Why would I believe the things that I say if I'm giving myself all of these examples to the contrary? So I love that way of looking at this. It just feels so different and so powerful. And I also really love that you take all of these, like, kind of woo woo wellness stuff that's out there. Like all these phrases that we always hear, like, yeah, I just love yourself, just take a bath, just meditate, you know, we. But you boil them down into like, what's actually important and what do we actually do here?

I'm very interested in real results. I'm interested in real science and I'm interested in our real lives. Like, I don't have hours to devote to these things. I don't have thousands of dollars. I want to figure out what's going to make a real difference that I can see and feel so that I can live the life that I want to live. Because that's what we're all trying to do. We get caught up sometimes, I think in the weeds of like, what supplements, what habit? It's like, to what end? What do I want my life to look like? So this is one of my all time favorite habits. If you're listening, you're like, how do I try this? Figure out a really tiny promise you can make to yourself and then keep it for 30 days and I promise you will feel differently at the end of that time. This is from an episode called the five Habits that have Changed My Life the Most. So that's where I share the five things that I do every single day that have absolutely changed every single part of my life.

Such a great one. We will put the link to check that out in the show notes of our episode so you can find it really easily. Thank you so much, Liz for taking the time over these last five weeks to share these five incredible tips with us. And I really, truly cannot recommend Liz's podcast enough. I have to confess, I was a total Liz Moody fan girl and I manifested this friendship because I listened to her podcast for so long and just really wanted to, like, get to know her better. So I know you are going to love her podcast. It's been one of my favorites for years and years and years. So super grateful that we've had the chance to get some of your tips on pillow talks.

Yeah. Thanks, Liz.

Thank you.

Okay, let's move on to body image. Do women struggle with letting their partner see their body during sex?

Sadly, yes. A whopping sex. 72% of women said yes. Only 28% said no. And that makes me so sad. 72%. So maybe. Obviously not all the partners of the women who responded are male, but I think Maybe we should turn this one over to you. Just as the partner of a woman. What can you say about bodies? What bodies? What the female body looks like during sex.

I mean, it is wonderful. It's the thing that I have been thinking about fantasizing about, like, since puberty. Having sex with you is something that I have wanted to be doing.

You knew about me in puberty.

I mean, with you women. But now just you, Vanessa, you women. I've been thinking about you women. That sounds real creepy, huh? But no, I mean, the reality is, before I knew that you existed, I was thinking about having sex with women. That was the thing that I wanted to do because that's what I'm attracted to. And I've been thinking about it. And so by the time I think this is, like, maybe this is, like, an interesting thing to think about. It's like, by the time that we have gotten to the stage of, hey, like, let's take off our clothes and have sex, like, I am so, Like, I am so far past any kind of thinking about, like, what you look like. Like, are you attractive enough? Are you. Does your body look a certain way? It's like, hell, yeah, I want to have sex with you. Like, that's what we are doing. Why would I be thinking about, like, you know, body. Body imperfections? Like, all I'm thinking about is wanting to have sex. And I know, like, my experience, like, and, you know, if I. I just thinking back throughout my entire, you know, experience of being sexually active, like, I've definitely had body image or insecurity. Things come up for me throughout. Throughout my life. But whenever it came to having sex, I guess. I guess, like, the way I would think about it is, okay, yeah, maybe I don't love the way that my body looks when I'm naked. But, like, if we are at this point where she is wanting to have sex with me and we're, like, taking each other's clothes off, like, who cares? Like, she obviously wants to do this with me. She's like. Or, you know, especially. It's like, if you've had sex with someone once they've seen you naked and they want to do it again, like, she must be on board with this. And I just kind of trusted and, okay, if we both want to do this to each other, we are both excited about what we are, what we are getting. And so I've just kind of, like, been able to set those insecurities aside. And so, yeah, it's just. Yeah, it's. It's sad. It's a bummer. You know, I think that I can say with a pretty strong certainty the vast majority of men who are having sex with women, the last thing on their minds when they're having sex is, like, any. Any imperfections in your body. They're thinking about how hot you are, how much they want to be having sex with you, and how good you look while they are doing it with you. All right, switching gears now. Vanessa, how do women feel about their partners watching porn?

This is such a hot topic. So first we put this poll up, but we also asked for responses, and I'm going to read some of them because there are. Yeah, people have really strong feelings in a lot of different directions on this. So only 2% of women said, I love it. Which, to be fair, is kind of like a strong response. Like, yeah, I love my partner watching porn.

Wouldn't have it any other way.

30% said, I'm fine with it. 33% said neutral or unsure. And 35%, the most popular response was, I'm not okay with it. So porn is a really complex topic. We highly encourage couples to talk about it with each other and, like, really figure out what feels right for themselves and maybe even work with a therapist, a couples therapist, or a sex therapist about it.

Like, yeah, especially if there's any, like, misalignment of perspectives or it's feeling problematic in any way.

Yeah. So here are some of the responses that we got. I don't care, but I don't want to know about it. And if it starts becoming a problem or interfering with our sex life, then it's a no for me. I love when we watch together watching it. I'm fine with the amount he watches. I'm not okay with. I think there's a big difference in those. I'm not okay with him watching, but I watch. I watch it because it turns me on. But I feel like if he were watching, he would be comparing me to the girls, and it makes me jealous for him to look at them.

Interesting.

And finally, I had a breakthrough with my therapist about this. Sometimes men don't want to perform because, let's be honest, sex is definitely exactly that. So sometimes it's nice to relieve themselves on their own versus doing the dance with a partner. It helped me realize that it's okay because I feel this way too sometimes when asked to do certain things. And I really just want to be a pillow princess. So, lots of different opinions, but definitely we recommend using this poll, using this episode episode as a way to open up a conversation with your partner.

All right, Vanessa, it's time to get real about pubic hair. What do women think?

This was a surprisingly hot topic. It was actually, I would say, the most popular request in our question box. Porn was probably the second one, but I was shocked by how many women asked about pubic hair every week.

When we do ask us anything, we got questions and it's always like, like it's always presented. The question is always presented back to us as if, like, there is one right answer. And I'm like, there is no one right answer. I'm so sorry. But it's not like, okay, the women have spoken and they have said that, you know, one little strip of hair is the correct answer and nothing else is acceptable.

Okay, so 48% of women take it all off. That was the most common response. 46% said, I trim or remove some of it. And 6% said, Leave it all. We also asked a follow up question of if you do take it off, what is your preferred method of removal? By far and away, the most popular was shaving at 79%, then waxing at 12, laser at 6 and sugar at number 3. I gotta put a plug in here for sugaring. Like, oh, my God, compared to shaving. I know shaving's cheaper. It's just easier. Maybe there are some magical unicorns who don't get ingrown hairs or irritation, but shaving is just so. I did it one time and one time only, and I was like, never ever again. The regrow was so horrible. I absolutely hated it.

And does it grow back faster than wax or sugar?

Yeah, way faster. So you're having to do it all the time versus sugaring. You get some time. I think sugaring, it's so much easier on the skin. Obviously it's still, like, not a, you know, comfortable process, but I think it's way easier. But bottom line with pubic hair is there is no one right way to do it. Do whatever feels right for you and your body. I think it can be fun to experiment, like, try one time getting it all if you want to. Like getting it all taken off or some of it taken off, because it can change the sensation of, like, physical stimulation. So it's. It can just be interesting as an experiment. But do whatever feels right for you and your body.

All right. We had to ask the question. Vanessa, what about tradwives?

So this has been a hot topic lately. I wasn't surprised to see somebody asking about this. It's really been very big on social media because there was this Big interview a couple of weeks ago with Ballerina Farms, a huge Instagram account, and she actually. I don't know if she even loves using the word tradwife to describe herself. But. But basically, trad wives is shortening for traditional wives. There are a lot of different interpretations of what this means and different ways people are using it in their own families. But it's sort of this, like, return to the more traditional gender roles that we had, like, kind of like 1950s.

Style where we return to the 50s.

The housewife, the primary caretaker, the man's the breadwinner. In some relationships, it's, you know, he's making. He's more of the, you know, in charge, he's making more of the decisions. While she might be a little, like, more submissive, again, it's like, it's kind of hard sometimes to talk about these categories because people use it so differently in their own relationship. But that's kind of like a rough sketch of him. So 8% of people in our audience said that they happily are one. I was actually kind of surprised by that, by how high that was. Not one, but kind of interested was 7% neutral slash, everyone do what they want was our most popular response at 51%. And dislike the concept was 34%. I feel like we could probably do a whole deep dive episode on this topic. So let us know on Instagram. Vanessa and Xander, if you're interested in this. I will say my response would have been part of that. Like, everyone do what they want. Like, Xander and I both try to be really open about the fact that in life there is no one right way of doing anything. And our perspective is like, everybody should be thoughtful and intentional about the life that they want to lead, the kind of relationship that they want to have. And so if being in this more, you know, more traditional roles is something that you are consciously and thoughtfully choosing, if it makes you feel happy and fulfilled and feels, you know, intimate and satisfying in your life, then that's great and go for it. I do think that there. It always gets problematic when people try to advocate that their way of doing anything is the right way. And you're seeing this on, like, both on the side of trad wives and trad families, and also like non trad. I don't know what the word is, like, non trad families. Like, I mean, in all of life, there's always judgment of, like, if you're not doing it the way I'm doing it, doing it, that's bad. So, you know, I just don't think that's helpful or useful for anybody. Judgment is never like, actually useful or accomplishes anything. So I don't, I just don't like some of the conversations that are happening on social media about it. But honestly, I'm trying to kind of stay out of it because big debates about thorny issues on social media where you're limited to little, you know, 60 seconds clips or tiny comments generally aren't very helpful. But let us know if you're interested in more of a deep dive on this.

But yeah, I know very little about this. The very little I do know. The only, like, you know, I don't want to judge, like, you know, choices that people make and how they want to live their life and how they want to structure their relationship. The only thing that I have a couple questions about is I think a lot of the discussion is driven by, you know, sort of large influencer accounts that portray sort of like trad wife dynamics or families. And I think there's something kind of, you know, counter to the concept of that where it's like, if you are a big influencer on Instagram, you are basically the CEO of your business and like, oh yeah, like you are.

I mean, she's the primary breadwinner, like the Ballerina Farms account. She's the primary breadwinner.

Yeah. So yeah, how, how are you actually embodying that lifestyle unless your husband is like, actually running the account and calling all the shots? But I doubt that that's really what's happening. So it's like, hey, how are you? Are you actually advocating for something that you are not actually living out yourself? So I got some questions there.

Well, that article was very complicated because the reporter clearly went in like, you know, from the very beginning that the reporter, like, is against this way of living and is like, looking to poke holes in it. And at the same time, like, there are a lot of really uncomfortable things that she says in the piece where you start to won, like where the Ballerina Farms lady and I have to be. I have to be totally honest. I don't follow that account. So I don't really know anything about her. And I also know, like, media pieces, like, who knows what's actually going on in this marriage? What's actually going on in this woman's head? Like, media pieces can be very deceiving. But there are a few things that she says where it makes you wonder, like, is she really happy with this? Did she choose this for herself? Or has she been like, pressured or coerced into it in A weird way. Like, there's. There's one weird part where it talks about, like, she doesn't do any medication when she gives birth, but then she talks about one birth that she had where her husband wasn't there, and she actually, like, did get drugs and really enjoyed that. And it made the birth, like, a lot. Not enjoyed it, but, like, it just made the purse, like, a lot more, like, bearable for her because it's, you know, terrific pain with no medication. And it was just sort of weird of like, okay, well, but so you took it because he wasn't there, but then does that mean that you actually do want to be taking it? But the times that he's there, like, you felt like you weren't allowed to, like, it's just kind of weird. So ultimately, like, what I want is for every woman to feel have the agency to make decisions about her own life. So if you are saying, you know, I have agency, I am not being coerced. I'm not being pressured or guilted. Like, I'm free to make my own decision, and I choose to be in this kind of arrangement, and it makes me happy.

Great.

I want you to do whatever makes you happy. But I get nervous in any sort of situation where women are being coerced and pressured. And I think we also have to be honest about the fact that for pretty much all of history, for almost every culture, like, men have had more power and control and have been, you know, have really pressured and guilted and coerced. So it's just complicated. Let's just stop here. I don't want to go too much further, but again, let us know if you're interested in more of a deep dive. But let's lighten things up and finish this off with some kind of funny questions. I saw some of these as I was scrolling through, and I was like, I have to ask these. Like, they're maybe not like, the hardest hitting. Like, what do you think about porn? But I had to.

All right, then. How many women love their pet more than their partner? Wow. This is just. We're just going in.

Okay. 9% said they love their pet more.

Damn.

53% said they love their partner more.

53 is not good. Wow.

38%. I was a part of the 38% that said I love my partner more. But it's close.

It's close. Geez. I love my little doggies. I love my little doggies, too. However, I 100% of the time choose to go on vacation with you, leaving the dogs alone. At home. I never choose to go on vacation with my dogs and leave my wife at home.

Sorry, babe.

Okay, now we're just moving towards the absurd.

I have. Okay, I saw this in the question box and I was like, I have to ask this. What do women think?

Wait, wait, I gotta read it. Hold on. We're going to just go verbatim here. Two in the pink, one in the stink. What say women?

So 23% love it. I was shocked. 23% love it, 20% don't like it, 41% have never tried. And to the 17% of you who answered, what the fuck is this? Two in the pink, one in the stink. Xander is illustrating in her video right now. When you put two fingers into the vagina and one finger, the little pinky finger goes into the butthole.

You know what? Confession time. I AM of the 41% that have never tried this. Have you tried this?

Yes.

We haven't done this together, though.

It's not a great technique. That's why.

Well, yeah, trying. Thinking about trying to do this with one hand seems like just a recipe for disaster.

Yeah.

And. But even, like two hands, it just.

Actually, I don't remember if I have done it.

Yeah, that's what I'm. I'm curious. Like, it takes some forethought. Like, I don't know. I don't. We gotta, like, to really properly do this. I mean, like, you gotta get the pinky loot. Like, you gotta really be prepared.

Yeah. Okay.

I mean, it's an. In practice, I would say it's a pretty impractical thing. I mean, I imagine it probably feels good if you get it right.

I say if you're gonna do some anal stimulation, use the other hand. Doing it all in one hand, it's a lot for one hand. But I have to read this DM that we got from somebody he said is a guy who said. In high school we used to joke about this a lot. Here are some alternatives that I remember. I thought it might make you guys chuckle. Two in the cooter, one in the pooper, two in the fun, one in the bum, two in the bush, one in the tush, two in the taco, one in the choco, two in the go, one in the no. 2 in the Camel toe, one in the asshole.

No, no, you have to read that. Two in the camel toe, one in the asshole. That is how you read that. 1.

Two in the vagini, one in the hiney, and two in the pumper, one in the dumper.

So. Thank you to that wait in the pumper.

I don't know.

Okay. All right. I guess I kind of. I kind of see it.

All right. And finally, honorable mention. We did not poll this one because I didn't know know what it meant, but somebody literally typed into that question box, what do women think about hoochie daddy shorts?

Have you tried googling hoochie daddy shorts? Why don't you do that? Okay. You didn't think to Google it?

It's like, what are hoochie daddy shorts?

Oh, man. What is coming up?

Oh, wait, that's actually a category from a clothing brand.

To me, there's short shorts.

No, those are just regular shorts.

Yeah, those look like. Like, I feel like I own a lot of shorts. Like, like short athletic shorts.

No, but some of these are longer too, on Amazon.

What do you think about short shorts?

Hoochie daddy shorts? Men.

Yeah, I had to show off those quads.

There's nothing actually called hoochie daddy shorts, but. Okay, I guess they're just.

Vanessa, do you like seeing some. Some quad?

I'm into some quad. If you got quad. If you got.

What about me? What do you think about me in some short shorts?

Yeah, I'd have to see it.

I mean, I. I have short shorts that I wear sometimes.

No, they're not like.

No, I wear those athletic shorts. They're like. They're like five. You know, they're like five inches, I think five inch inseam. That's how they measure short length. I don't. I think it's.

It's five inch.

It's five inches from the seam in the middle. It's not five inches from the top to the bottom, but.

All right, well, come over to Instagram and let us know what you think about hoochie Daddy.

Yeah, it's really important. We're. We're. We're sitting here with bated breath because we don't know. We didn't pull it. We fucked up. We should have asked the question. It's so important. So come tell us.

All right, well, we are gonna link a couple of things that we mentioned in this episode in the show notes for you, our ultimate foreplay guides and next level intercourse. Definitely check those out. They are so much fun. I promise you. They. I did not know it could be this good at level experiences.

And if you've gotten to this point in the episode and you are sad that the episode is pretty much over because you've been loving it so much, please go over to Apple Podcasts. Leave us a five star rating and a super quick review. Or if you're on Spotify, go smash that follow button. Smash the five star review. But yeah, if you go over to Apple Podcasts, that's the ideal Leave us a review. Reviews are so helpful to us. Being featured on the podcast platforms. To other people who are coming in and wondering, who are these people? Like, it helps them understand, oh, these are normal people. They got a ton of other reviews. People say that they are normal and in fact an amazing podcast.

So here they wear hoochie daddy shorts.

Yeah, shorts. Even though it's not in our little podcast art. Maybe, maybe it should be. But yeah, no. Scroll to the bottom of the Pillow Talks podcast page in Apple Podcasts. You'll see a little box to leave the rating and the review. Just type in the review. Once you submit your review, you are enrolled for life in our Review of the Week giveaway. So if you hear your review read like right now, then you have won DM us on Instagram and we will give you a little masterclass for free. So this week's review of the week, New Obsessed Listener. See, this is why you gotta leave reviews so you can create more New Obsessed listeners. I'm a new listener and I'm already totally obsessed with the show. You guys are honest, unfiltered, and most of all, hilarious. I've been sharing the episodes and wisdom with friends and family and everyone is as hooked as myself and my partner. We now listen together and it's our favorite way to spend quality time at home. Thank you so much and hugs from London. Ooh, fun. And then the English flag.

Well, that's all for today's episode of Pillow Talks. Thank you so much for listening. Join us again next week when we share your funniest, most awkward, most embarrassing, and downright hilarious stories of getting the sex talk as kids or teens. Sam.