The Ostrich Report AKA: The Marketplace Podcast with Vinny and Hendrik week 3

Hey, hey, it's Vinny and Hendrik here over at The Ostrich Report. Uh, Hendrik, I was talking to my wife over lunch and I was trying to explain sort of things that we do, and I said, in the afternoon I'm going to record my podcast called The Ostrich Report. Guess what it's about? And you know what she said?

Uh-oh.

She said, I already know. I think we're on to a winner. I think we are on to a winner. My wife would not give us credit for something like this because I explained another one I work on and she gave me the what the eff eyes.

Oh, Vinny, you crack me up sometimes with how you, uh, can describe situations that are supposedly bland and make them basically funny to the point that you can't stop laughing.

Here's another one then in that vein, because I think you'll get a kick out of it. And not to be talking too much about my wife, this is a work podcast, but she has what I call go-to-bed eyes, not come-to-bed eyes. She loves a good nap, a nap in the afternoon. She has go-to-bed eyes. Can't beat that, I don't think. Um, how's things in Cape Town?

Um, things in Cape Town are— we are turning to the colder parts of the year. Which I unfortunately am not a fan of. Um, but I, I had a good walk with the dog this afternoon because we were 2 days, um, inside the house, so she was starting to get naughty, which is a challenge.

Okay.

Um, but yeah, I've been thinking about a few things because, um, the world's a changing place. I don't need to tell you about it, but also marketplaces will never stop to amaze me. I'll just say it out loud. They, they one of those things, like, like the best way I can explain it to the audience, it's, it's they— I view them as they the gift that, that keeps on giving, in the sense that just when you think that you understand them, a new wrinkle appears and you think like, wait, what? They're doing what? So yes.

So this is, this is not my big question for you today, and as people will know, we've got 3 big questions, but are marketplaces the best little corners of e-commerce?

I think the answer—

remember, you're going to be judged on this forever.

Uh, so I think the answer is a resounding yes. Um, I think we need to all to just be mindful that in most cases these businesses are not small. Um, I spoke this morning with, with an analyst who works at, uh, a, one of the largest marketplaces in the world. Um, does 7— I think does over a trillion dollars of GMV. And, um, we're not— they're not small. Let's just— let's just say they are good. They're good places on the internet, but they are not small. We need to just make sure that we— um, but they do their job.

Yeah, look, the corners of marketplaces are full of weird and wonderful things like, like fiction books. Um, isn't that right? Fiction, not fact. Yeah, fiction books. So I kind of find that they provide us with the richest information and the brightest characters along the way. And I'm always enthused when we get to chat about marketplaces because they still, they don't have the kudos for what it is to do. So before we jump right in, I'm going to ask you one quick thing. I want you to give me the retail report card. We're halfway through the year. A lot's changed since we last spoke. But give me the retail report card. What are they getting at this point in the year considering all that's been thrown at retail all around the world? You've got to generalize. And tell me where they are as you're sending them home for the summer.

So this is going to shock most people. I think, I think the, the really good execution companies, the Walmarts, the Checkers in South Africa, um, the, the Falabella's in Latin America, um, I think they get like a B+. Nice. Um, I think with the, the challenges that we are seeing in the markets with geopolitical tensions, and I hate to talk about the word tariffs because it's just, it's a long discussion, that so they can't get A's. I think the, the, the retail report card for the smaller to medium-sized retailers, I think you can get anything from a C to a flat-out F. Um, because of it— inventory challenges. Um, I think in Latin— sorry, in Northern America, I think we're about to start seeing pricing challenges and inventory available issues, which is not going to appease customers because customers want to go to a shop and just buy what they need. They don't want to hear about the fact that it's on some ship or whatever. It's not their problem. Um, but I think— oh, let me just say this out loud. I've said that in 2025, if your business has a flat year or anything like growth of up to 5%, I think you've done a smashing job. Um, I think flat, like, flat is good. But I think for me, the concern that I have is, is that We're in, in an uncertain era where uncertainty is gonna place major strains on, on retailers. And the retailers that can plan, execute, and be nimble to— like, as I show the Rubik's Cube and they can move it in various directions, they can do that. Those guys are good. So just a disclaimer, I listen to the earnings calls from Home Depot uh, Walmart, Target, Amazon, and others. And yeah, you can, you can very clearly hear who has their house in order, and you can very clearly hear who's in like, oh my God, I'm in, I'm in pain and this is only gonna get worse. So all in all I'd say, as I said, I think 2025 is, is not— we're going into the middle part of the year. I think we're now going to start seeing the, the difference between those who can execute and those who think they can execute.

So are you an American or American to use that movie expression? So let's jump right in, because in these moments, as you've described, marketplaces has always provided the place where opportunity emerges from. So people look at pricing arbitrage, look at inventory arbitrage, they look at software solution building. And these are all the sorts of places that it comes from. One of the reasons I think it's successful is they, they've got to think with scale, because if you're going to build a marketplace solution, you've got to think, how do I make this a global problem-solving entity on day one? So I think they've always got that at their advantage if they're thinking in the right way. So I feel that the next couple of years for marketplaces are going to be formative. However, in the last year or two, we have seen this huge influx of marketplaces. Some are niche marketplaces, some of them are general merch, some are marketplaces that really aren't marketplaces. So my first of our big 3 questions to you, Hendrik, is: when is a marketplace not a marketplace?

So as a fundamentalist at heart— nothing political, let me just get that out the way— but just as somebody with fundamentals on mind, I ask a simple question: do you have a network effect? So are you sitting between customers and sellers? So it's all good and well that you tell me that you have inventory available and that you can get like dropship and all of that stuff. Fantastic. But do you have a network effect where you're able to essentially, without spending lots of money, able to get customers to come to your marketplace, find what they need, buy it, and then have no worries about it being shipped? So that's number one. Number two, I think we need to just be mindful of the fact that there's a million, a million definitions for what a marketplace is and what's not. I think the biggest— for me, one of the biggest misunderstandings is a multi-brand retailer is not a marketplace.

So let's park there for a second because we've discussed situations where the marketplace team sits separate to the core team.

Mm-hmm.

That to me feels like someone who's got multi-channel experience or marketplace experience and they're trying to bring it to a business.

Yeah.

But they don't have the infrastructure support.

Yeah.

To make it happen.

Yeah.

That seems to be where the emergence of lots of these have been coming. And, and there's a secondary point that I'd love us to get onto, and it's the emergence of retail media. That media effect, that monetization effect that can be brought to bear is something that retailers are really zoning in on. One, because they love the margin effect. Two, they maybe don't have any other way to think about growing their business. But three, which I think is important and we need to figure out a little bit, and hopefully we can do some of it on the call, new marketplaces in old businesses are generally not affected by legacy issues— technology, people, P&L. So I can see how a marketplace strategically could be used to clean up an organization that's already got some of these things in place. Let's kind of break them down maybe one by one, or whatever sequence you want, but they're the three things that occur to me when we think about these, these sorts of issues.

So that this, this conversation could go on for hours, so I'll try to be brief.

For those at home listening, it won't, I promise.

Thanks, thanks, Vinny. That, that's, that's all.

Let's, let's just call a spade a spade.

Oh yes. Um, so legacy retailers What do you have in your favor? Number one, you have a brand. Number two, you have existing relationships with brands that are willing to sell to you at a wholesale price. Um, but this— there's a degree of control, i.e., somebody does checking to ensure that when we say that we have 12 cartons of whatever Coca-Cola product or whatever product you have, that's what you have. I think the trouble comes for when you use this— this— they suddenly like a plethora, or I don't even know what the right English word for this, but there's a— there's like this new sector where there's a variety of businesses that basically make it sound like out of the box you can just add a marketplace to your business, um, via SaaS fee, and then like 3 steps later you've got it. The truth is, is that that sounds good in principle, but what, what I've learned over the last 5 years is that the biggest misnomer for that, that sector is You still have to find the customer. You still have to find the retailer— the brand, sorry. And in most cases, it, it goes to— it becomes— then it becomes a spending battle. It becomes how much money are we willing to spend to get and acquire new customers. So that's not really, for me, a profitable solution, number one.

Number two, Can I pause there for a sec? Because the research done by the guys over at Smarter Ecommerce in Austria, Mike Ryan, he posed a hypothesis last year, which was when Temu were in market buying long-tail keywords, the acquisition costs for everybody else, or even the bid cost goes down because of the way that they bid aggressively. And what started out as being a case to say that Temu adversely affects the auction market He was able to prove the complete opposite, which, which I think in itself is interesting. And right now Amazon are starting to do that again. They're getting really bullish when it comes to spend and they always are, but, but they're actually creating the inverse of that. They are driving up auction costs for everybody else. So, and I know you're, you're saying that the cost for the marketplace goes up. However, I think it's worth putting that in context because we forget sometimes that marketplaces impact the way that we operate our own business or our D2C brands as well, because they absorb so much traffic, so much spend, and they produce so much content when it comes to how search performs and discovery unfolds when it comes to search in general. So I think it's worth just keeping those in the back of our mind because AI is starting to change how that's going to behave too.

I hear you, and I think it's important to counter what you've just said with What you're— look, I— Mike Ryan is a very clever guy. Let me just say, I'm a fan, Mike. Don't, don't expect a check in the mail, but I'm a fan. Um, but I think one has to understand one basic thing for me, and that is that when I talk about customer acquisition for marketplaces, I'm speaking about— in most cases, this is it's either branded search, which is in case some cases you have a lot of competition on, and it literally boils down to who's, who's got the biggest wallet and who's got the longest time for wanting to spend out of their minds. So, but I also think that one of the things that I've learned over the years, and, and this is not like major, like, aha moment, but when you deal with, with marketplaces, marketplaces essentially remove the brand out of the conversation. It's unbranded keywords, it's unbranded search that basically becomes a challenge. And now we go about the efficiencies of scale because, you know, with long-tail keywords, you know, how many competitors do you have? So it's, it's, it's having a dense, a dense battle for certain keywords versus uh, not so deep in, like, uh, not like on long term. It's a, it's a, it's a fascinating discussion. I just want to just, before we get going, I want to just make one thing very, like, I just want to get something off my chest. There is this new land grab happening in the United States which I think is an important discussion to have, and that is this is, this is the thing called retail media. Which is essentially— yes, it's high margin and everything, but let's just call it what it is. This is platforms wanting ad dollars from brands in the hope that it's gone— it's going to convert into sales and conversions. But the really good marketplaces, Vinny, have high conversion rates because they have highly converted traffic coming to them. And I think, you know, if you have 450+ retailers using your solution, or 500, or whatever number of, of retailers using your solution, the question for me is, do you have the actual eyeballs and traffic to do this retail media thing? Because at the end of the day, when I think about multi-channel brands Why are you on multiple channels, Vinny? It's because you need success to ensure that you generate the revenues at the end of the month. Am I catching a twist?

Let's take that as a point to jump in because my second question to you was going to be why do marketplaces have to fight so hard for attention? And I think we're starting to get into the realms of why. And there's a couple of things here that I think are really interesting. One, brands still need convincing in certain cases. 'Cause it's not right for our brand.' Look, I just don't buy that. I think it's a moot point. Your customers can be anywhere they want at any one time. So not being there just means you're not part of the conversation. Two, there's not too many brands that can occupy the position in someone's mind as much as they think they do. We all love to think that our brand holds that spot, but it doesn't. Let's call a spade a spade. As much as the retail media is a land grab, I call that on brand. The other side of it is—

Winnie! Slowly talking about you now. Those things that you mentioned, these are very much akin to an ostrich putting its head into the sand and basically saying isn't that why we're here?

I'm just saying maybe no one ever hears this so that's okay by me. It means we're safe to say whatever we want as well which I think is kind of the point of all this but It brings me to this point that I think is what people should be listening to, which is you're a brand, you're a skincare brand, you're in the UK, you want to get listed on multiple places that sell skincare. So you're going to say, I want to go on Amazon. Now your next question is, do we go on Boots or you go on Superdrug? The layer down in terms of your decision-making is what customers are on there, how are they spending? Do they have loyalty programs going that I can benefit from? How can I price for that? Do I have the margin in there? And is it right for my brand should never be really a question unless you start thinking about how they run their marketplaces. And I think if you ever listen to Paul Stafford talk, he's, he set up the Retail Media Network in Superdrug. He, he limits the number of brands per category that are allowed to sell using the Retail Media Network. So he's now saying I want the search and advertising experience to be relatable to our customer. He's the first media network owner that I have ever heard speak about the customer experience as being the genesis of what he wants to be the area that's evolving. I think if anyone is out there trying to build their marketplace, there's loads of podcasts Paul has been on. Get hold of one. We might even try to get him on here as well. We should.

Vinny, we should because what you've just said, I've not heard from everybody in the sense that the general take is it's a land grab. As I said to you, let's, let's get everybody, let's get access to everybody's budgets. But because at the end of the day, as I always say, everybody sells advertising but nobody thinks about the customer, customer experience about it. And let's be honest, in most cases the customer experience takes a massive dive down because you're suddenly layering in ads in search results that might be relevant or not.

But back to your point, yeah, I, I, I, I, I still think marketplace are searching for attention. I saw a post today by Colin Lewis as well. Colin is, is well spoken when it comes to retail media, and he, he straddles both sides of the coin. Well, um, disclaimer, myself and Colin are good friends for a long, long time. We're roommates MRF. Yes, we share, dude.

How dare you mention— how dare you do this? I mean, I thought I was your friend. Now you're basically coming from the top.

We're doing an event later this year in New York as well, Andrew. Don't forget that. So, um, you're probably too tall for New York hotels as well. People don't know that because they can't see you.

Thanks.

Um, Colin is not— he's vertically challenged. He's vertically integrated. Fits well in the travel case. Yeah, but Colin talks about these things really, really well, and he's able to help build the case for and against what marketplace should be. But he posted a question to me today, which was, will Amazon's media network— they just launched in Ireland today. I won't say the date because that's time-sensitive, but they just launched the ability for people to buy sponsored ads and ads in general on Amazon.ie. Amazon's big challenge right now is getting sellers to onboard because there wasn't a reason to accelerate your sales. There was no real lever for you to pull other than listing your products. Now there is. So when I was chatting to him earlier today, the, the conversation that I had with him is the one I've had with you before. If you look at the number of Prime members that are in Ireland, they don't have the full official number released, but it's a 7-figure number in a country with only 5 million people. So it's a big number. Most of them are UK Prime accounts. There will be a point in time, I am sure, if Irish people do not migrate onto the Irish app or the Irish version, they will be told by Amazon you now need to switch over to Prime.ie. At that point, you watch two metrics if you're a retailer to see, should I be getting involved? Many people are using their Prime account, um, and how many new Prime accounts are being added from that point on. They're the two metrics that are going to tell you it's going to be a successful place for you to play. Um, and, and yet you're going to have people that are spending their, their their ad euros on Meta and Google in 6 months' time, trying to fight against the tide, still getting their shitty 1.5% conversion rate in a category that they've got for 5 years, and wonder, why are we not doing better? Why do we only get 3% growth? And 3% is not a bad number, but could it be 7%? By diverting your time and energy and effort into somewhere else, can marketplaces make a difference? And I think That's fundamental to the problem here. And we'll talk about it in the next section, but eBay still has a perception problem. It has a gross perception problem, one that I don't know that if it's recoverable. And I think that's really sad given that it's still the third most trafficked site in North America, second in Europe. It's phenomenal. Like, it's still a huge part of what it is we do, yet they have to fight for minds of retailers to do things that they could do. And there's a million and one ways to use eBay, but I still don't get why marketplaces have to fight so hard for attention. Is it that the wrong people run them? Do they understand how to onboard properly? And is that in part why these newer marketplaces are doing better?

So this is a question that I've been thinking about for the last— since we've last spoken. So I think the biggest challenge is that the marketplace, marketplaces in general, don't really care about the churn for sellers. I don't think if, if, if, if they, if they gain, you know, if they gain 1,000 sellers a day and let's say they lose, they turn 500, you know, they've gained 500. Um, so that's the first thought. The second thought I think is, is that It's the, it's the network effect. And at the end of the day, I think it's also dependent on what the seller or brand is selling. Um, I think the point that you made earlier about Boots and, you know, making sure that only certain brands get access to retail media, I think that's, that's a really big story in the sense that I think the biggest challenge that we— there's a lot of challenges that I mentioned, but I think one of the biggest ones that, that I see almost like weekly is you're a brand, you get spoke— you get spoken to by an agency, and the agency tells you that you need to be on 30 marketplaces because that's where your consumers are. And then my first question to when I get that question is, okay, can you please look at your internal data and tell me where is the— the way— or where are the eyeballs coming from? And in most, most cases, the answer I get is blank stares. It's like Wait, what? What are you asking me? So, so there's that. So, so thirdly, I think the biggest thing that— maybe this is me just showing my absolute generalization for it, but I think there's a really big misconception about the marketplace sector and that marketplace selling is hard. Uh, it's like e-commerce. This isn't like a thing that you just get up, get done, and like 24 hours later, you know, your, your, your ads are converting, you starting to sell. No, not at all. In actual fact, you need, you need the, the mindset of trial and error, but also you need to be willing to say to the, the team that's leading the sector for your brand that, you know, I— we don't need you to generate like X amount of sales. But the reality is, is that having been on both sides of this discussion, I think one of the, the biggest misconceptions that, that most people have is that brands are willing to, you know, go everywhere. I, I think that's, I think that's the wrong approach. I always say that, and I'm a firm believer in this, you should be in a max 5 marketplaces, and you should know what is the needle mover for your brand i.e., what, what is the, what is the actual fit for the consumer that you want to reach? What is the marketplace that you cannot be off of? Sadly, in most cases, that is Amazon, just because of the conversion numbers. And then it's literally layering in where these other opportunities for you. But what is the biggest thing we both know, Vinny, is that brands don't have they don't give these managers, coordinators, heads of e-com, directors of e-com— you don't get the time to do these things. You literally are told you had— you need to generate a number by quarter so-and-so, and if you don't, goodbye.

So that's the poor cousin. It never gets the operational support, doesn't get the marketing budget, doesn't get anything you need for all those reasons. And the time frame for some reason seems a lot shorter, and That's, that's, I think that's a big chunk of why marketplaces struggle for attention. There's not enough good news stories about them, and good news needs to be, um, factored in over a longer period of time. Now I want to flip forward a little bit. I'm conscious of the time that we're spending here, but I started using Vinted. I wrote a comparative piece last week between Vinted and eBay, and I mentioned it with purpose because Vinted is the first marketplace that I've worked on that is truly customer-centric, and it really understands the difference between its buyer as a customer and its seller as a customer. So the user experience is phenomenal. Um, I listed, I think on my first day I listed 4 items. I had my first sale within, I, I estimate somewhere between 3 and 4 minutes. Um, selling price was about 40% lower than I would be selling the same thing on eBay. But, but I accept that. Now, some of the interesting things— it has a buyer— very buyer— the responsibilities on the seller to put in a lot of verification checks. So it does things like get you to photograph the labels, show people all the discrepancies of the product, anything that you might need as well to layer it in. But the data layer is incredibly strong. So when you go to actually list your pair of Zara jeans, you can find the brand really easily. Its brand spread is huge, its color matching is brilliant, size matching is great. But where it gets really interesting is on shipping. You're asked to pick small, medium, or large in terms of parcel size, and it already predicts it based on the photos that you've put together. So if it's a shirt, it's likely to fit in small, and it preempts and pre-fills a box. I don't have to put in a shipping cost, I don't have to put in a shipping time, I don't have to put in an estimate. What was really refreshing was as soon as I sold the item, I got a notification to say, here's the label that the buyer has has created for you. So the buyer bears the cost of shipping. And I've sold 4, 5 items since. I've sold through 3 different services: UPS, DPD, and the Irish Postal Service. All I had to do for each of them was go in and get my label scanned. They took the parcel, took it away from me, and in real time the tracking information was sent to the customer and me in real time. So there's no thinking to be done, there's no communication that's required, there's no, um, there's no what-ifs, there's no anxiety when it comes to post purchase, which is fabulous. The second part of this, which is around community and discovery, as soon as you list an item, people can favorite your item or like it, give you a nudge to say, hey, I'm watching this. It then gives you the ability to talk to somebody and encourage a discussion between two people. And having talked to more seasoned Vinted sellers, they say that that's the opportunity to say, I no longer want this suit, I wore it to a wedding, doesn't fit me anymore, there's no more weddings to go to, but we had great fun dancing on the floor, or whatever it might be. But it's to try and create an emotional connection that you have to it that someone else might say, now I can see myself buying that product. And it's a genuine connection that they're trying to create, which again is really unique because most of eBay's community interaction, if you can remember back in the heyday, was about, where's my item? You said this was blue and it's only a shade of blue, it's not real blue, I'm so disappointed. Creating nothing but friction and negative customer experience. So Vinted and eBay are two rivals in the, what I call, the pre-loved and the re-loved space. Do you like that? Pre-loved and re-loved. And I think eBay are losing ground on that market. I could see, if I was, uh, any kind of a user, I could see my mom being able to use Vinted, but I couldn't see her being able to use eBay. And that's No, nothing to disparage my mom. She's pretty good with technology, but it's just a benchmark, I guess, of how intuitive or not the interface is. And I could see Vinted continuing to grow in other categories if it handles it in the same way. I think its challenge is where do you stop? Like, what category do you stop at and where do you say geographic progression is a thing? And I'm going to leave it on this point and maybe you can jump in. They have gone deep in Ireland, which I said to you before the call is a very small island nation with a limited capacity, but they've given us the full range of features that make it feasible for us to do everything, cover all our postal service. So in effect, you have a full e-commerce engine for Ireland in the Vinted app should you want to use it. That is how complete it is across every piece of the infrastructure.

So I will say to you that I think Vinted is one of those pre-loved, re-loved platforms that I don't think is on most people's, uh, horizons or, or under discussion. Um, I think they do a great job. For me, when I think of them, I think the fact that they are— they were founded in Lithuania helps them a lot in the sense that They were able to do, um, trial and error a lot. Um, I do know that they've had some issues in the past with regulation, but I think the point that you make, and I think this is an important part for anybody that works at a brand, works in a marketplace, if you remove friction for both the seller and the brand, basically your network effect speed is gonna triple if not quadruple. Why? Because it doesn't take or doesn't need someone to move a mountain to list an item. We always joke when we speak with one another, and that is that listing products on a marketplace is most cases the biggest job that brands and sellers need to do. It's painful, it's not fun. But listening to you speak about Vinted basically makes it sound like it's fun, it's easy. Um, it's also— it's, it's, it's, it's mobile app based, so you know, you can do stuff pretty quickly. And I think for me, this, this yet again highlights for me the sad reality about how far eBay has fallen and how they're in a, they're in a position where they either need to open the checkbook, Vinny, and to say that we're gonna buy them, or basically they're going to be a competitor. And the, the reality for me, sadly, is, is that the boat has sailed and eBay is losing momentum because this was their thing. Um, so all in all, marketplaces are complicated. No, they're not. They do fight for attention, which no one makes— makes no sense. And then you have these upstarts like Vinted that are basically going the extra mile and basically making my friend in Ireland's head explode because he just sees things happen and then he basically says like, wait, what? Um, so all in all Um, for me, this episode of The Ostrich Report, um, was fun to do. But I think as a brand, as a seller, as a person who works for a brand, folks, wake up. This is your call to arms. Wake up and realize that in the current economic climate— and I'm most probably going to sound like I work for Bloomberg or CNBC or CNN. It's not going to be Fox, let me just get that out there. But pity consumers are going to go to marketplaces. Why? They're going to go there because there's actual access to inventory that meets their budget. So if you and your brand are not there, you are losing the opportunity for eyeballs. I'm stating the obvious, but I feel like I have to repeat this a million times a year because, to your point, no, we're not going to do marketplaces.

And I think that's a great note for us to kind of close today on. Um, every day is a fight for eyeballs. That's what commerce is. That's what retail is. So, um, what I'd love to do, and maybe we'll commit to this, is for the next episode, why don't we, why don't we unpack eBay a little bit? Why don't we take it down, see what's good, see what's bad, give it a report card? And maybe over the next couple of episodes, we'll do that with a few other marketplaces and just explore them a little bit. I think it'll be really helpful for people to get a handle on what's going on in there. So we'll do some research, we'll paint the good, the bad, and the ugly, and we will bring you up to speed on what's going on inside and outside of these marketplaces. But Hendrik, thanks so much for your time. I appreciate it as always, that fountain of knowledge that is your incredible brain. I look forward to sharing time with you again in the next few days.

Uh, sir, as always, appreciate your time. Um, this conversation was super fun. Um, and yeah, report cards for marketplaces— oh, you've got me all excited now because now I can basically just vanish into an AI bot and just basically get me all the information I want. Vinny, till next time.

You know, up front about your AI bot, I just—

I have to talk about it. It's just fact.

Just don't talk to it. Just don't talk to it. Stay talking to me. Stay on the Ostrich Report and I'll see you the next day. All right.

Bye, Vinny.

Cheers, my friend.