What Makes a Great Closer in 2025? Daniel G. Breaks It Down! | #Sales - Ep. 37

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This is the Russell Brunson Show.

What's up everyone, welcome back to the show. I've got a new guest here in the office today, just flew in like 5 minutes ago. Someone I've been watching online for a long time, watching him, very impressed with what he's doing, and just decided he wanted to do a podcast with me. He's like, I'll fly to Boise. I'm like, why would you fly to Boise? We're in the middle of nowhere. And him and his whole crew fly here, so I'm super grateful for that. His name's Daniel G, and I'm pumped to have you in the office today.

How you feeling, man? Thanks for having me, man. I'm feeling amazing. Other than I just, like, before this episode, I just pulled my hamstring, like I said, walking in here, but—

Between his hamstring and my two biceps, we're skimps here, but we got our lips will be flapping and we'll be sharing some good stuff. This is gonna be like the showdown between like, one-on-one selling versus one-on-many selling, because I'm scared to sell one-on-one and you crush one-on-one across the world. So yeah, maybe we can learn something from each other.

Yeah. And it's crazy because right before we just talked, I literally just told you, I said, this is going to be my first time in like a month or two months selling something big to everybody. And I'm not used to that, but I'm used to selling one-on-one since I was 14. Yeah, right. So it's a whole different game.

I think it's funny because I mean, one-on-one is— I get introverted so that like I get so much fear and anxiety that like I'll be selling one-on-one. I'm like, oh, you can just have it. Just don't worry about it. Like I back away. So I've never enjoyed it. But it's fun watching people who are really, really good. So when you were 14, what were you selling back then?

I was in door-to-door home services. It was my first job. I worked it illegally under my brother's, uh, you know, social insurance number. I was 14 and a half, right? It was like my, my grade 9 high school job. There was a sign that said, if you want to make $500 to $1,000 in commission, sign up here. And I said, does that mean money? And he's like, yeah.

I'm like, dude, commission equals money.

I'm like, I will do whatever for $500 to $1,000. I will dance naked in the school if it equals— so, so I, I started my first direct sales job at 14 years old. What were you selling? And, uh, it was home services. So it was indoor services and outdoor services, like grass services, it was window washing, driveway sealing. Yep. And then, um, and then at like 15, and if the next summer, I started building a sales team underneath that company. So I was in sales ever since. I started building sales teams since I was 15 years old. Um, and I did come—

did it come like to you naturally, or take a while for you to like get into it?

No, after the first week, I was hooked. I was hooked. Like, I thought everything was a lie after I made $800 in commissions in my first week. I was in Toronto, Canada. I went to school, I'm like This is all a lie. Like I said, you guys, you guys told me at the end, like, you know, focus to, you know, go to school to make a lot of money. I'm like, wait, I've skipped that whole process. I already made a lot of money, right? Like I went to my teacher and I said, miss, how much do you make? And she's like, oh, you know, $52,000 a year. I'm like, oh, what the heck? I made this this weekend. What you— so, so yeah, that was, you know, it, it, I was ruined early. Yeah. I, I was training sales since I was like 15, cuz I already had a sales team. So like what I do now, training objections and prospecting, whatever it is, uh, presenting, I've been doing it since a young age, right? I didn't start training it full-time until like 6, 7 years ago. I built businesses before that and everything, but, uh, it was just a passion project turned into a business.

Very cool. Yeah, I was looking at your bio right when you were waiting for you to fly in.

Yeah.

And, um, so check this out for everyone listening. So, um, if you're not familiar with Dan, you know, labeled number one sales trainer 2024, spoke at 750 events globally. Yeah, that's insane. Um, trained over 2 million people, and your quote is— or your tagline— makes salespeople rich. Yeah, 750 events. I don't even know how that's possible. Yeah, let's say every day, every weekend.

Uh, right now we're at like 3, 4 weeks sometimes internationally too. Like, it's been crazy. Like, for the last 7 years, my whole life was on the road for the last 7 years and done it all from every type of event, whether it's from people selling shampoos and skincare to people selling homes and insurance. Um, but yeah, I, I— the, the reason why I went so heavy on events, because the way I looked at it was, as everybody started to go online, I said sometimes now the online game is supported by the offline game. So I said my kind of winning edge would be like if all the— like, when I studied all the old-timers when I was growing up, like Brian Tracy, Tom Hopkins, Zig Ziglar, right? And I said, okay, if these guys were able to grow so big without social media, if I just do what they do— because their life was on the road selling seminars, which people don't know, they were on the road selling seminars. And I would think, how would these guys pack out a room of 3,000 people? First, I got to figure out that formula, because if they did it, like, what's our excuse? Like, they were doing it with just, like, direct mail and referrals. And so I'm like, I'm gonna master that game, but at the same time, I could speed up this process by going on stages, building the trust with people because I was young, Russell. Like I was starting stages when I was 24, right? 7 years ago. 7 years ago. I'm 31 now. So I said, I'm going to build the trust, work my ass off on stages, and then, and then just start posting all that content online because the subconscious thought of you being in front of other people, people online trust you a lot more, right? So I was, I was doing that for the last— Yeah. So that was us for the last 7 years.

So did you have a big social strategy and start or was it just take clips, post them, and that is what grew it?

I'm curious that like, Yeah, I mean, I'm, I'm still very hands-on with my social media. Like, I'm very, like, I'm, I'm just very, uh, intricate with my community. I'm going live every single day. I built my live stream, I built my whole brand off live streams on where, uh, Instagram, main platform, Instagram. Yeah, Instagram. I was doing, uh, Meerkat and Periscope, and then I enjoyed it. Yeah, I enjoyed it, and I said, wow, let's just shift over to Instagram. So I just started doing Instagram Lives, and I would just beam in my audience on live streams and do rapid-fire Q&As with them, and that's how we built up the brand, right? So then I would figure out who my audience is, and still to today, like Even if we are doing keynotes, like, I'll still look at my keynotes and be like, okay, I want these clips. And I'm very— I'm still in my social media. I haven't figured a way to fully outsource my social media 150%. Yeah.

Um, how often— you said every day you're going live at the same time?

No, now it's— now it's sporadic. Before it— before it used to, like, I used to train my audience to be like, all right guys, I'm going live at 10:10. Now it's just whenever we can hit the live button. And some days, you know, I'll miss it, of course, like when we're traveling, like something like this. But, you know, I try to— I try to stay very intimate. That was one of my also, like, winning edge things. I would always look— I would say, okay, what is everybody doing? I have to do exactly what they're doing, especially the old-timers in space. And it's like, what's one extra thing that I can do on top of them, right? So that was one of them, that was live streams.

I'm curious, um, for me, live stream back in Periscope was crazy. I click a button and my whole audience to show up. Nowadays the algorithm's like less. When you click live on Instagram, how many people show up?

It should be more. I mean, now it hovers between 300 to 600, um, but just based on where my brand at, if I had the same brand, 2020, it would be 4,000 to 5,000. Like, I just came— I was just landing in the airport, I see Gary on a live, and I seen 130 people.

So frustrating.

And I said, wow, when Gary used to be online, this was 3,000 to 5,000 people in 2 seconds, right? So, um, yes, just interesting. It's, it's, it's, uh, it's still crazy.

You click a button, they have 500 people show up, and you're just like, hey, what? You know, like, right, again, Brian Tracy, they'd spend a month filling a room of 500 people, and you click a button and it's there.

Like, it's And that's why I love content creation because listen, I, I'm a speaker, I live on a stage. So when I tell people and they don't wanna post content, I say, you don't understand what a room of even 700 people look like. That's a big room. That's a filled room. A reel can get that in 2 seconds, right? Like I always, I always try to still make that contrast, say 5,000 people view your reel. I'm like, that's a full stadium. When we do 5,000 people, that's huge, right? So like, like that's why I love the online game. I think it's still incredible even though The analytics don't play to our favor anymore, but yeah, it all changes, shifts back and forth.

I've been doing this long enough to watch cycles, and the next thing will hit, and then we'll, we'll move there and keep it running.

Yeah.

Um, that's really cool. Um, okay, so I don't know if you announced this yet, maybe I'm not allowed to talk about this, but you've got a book you're working on that's coming out soon. What's the book called? Am I allowed to talk about this?

Um, yeah, well, I guess, yeah, it's called The Sales Game.

Okay, very cool.

Yeah.

And, um, I know you spent a lot of time working on it, but, um, I'm more curious, like at least for me, I'm very much a frameworks guy with different frameworks. Like, what's your framework for selling that's different than what other people are doing? Or yeah, what's your— like, what's your way you teach selling versus other people?

Yeah, I mean, I've, I've— again, I've studied every— I've studied sales since I was 14. I was a nerd at sales, like, and I've always picked apart things, like, even little lines. I would always ask myself, I'm like, okay, does it work, right? Because anything can look good on social media, anything can sound good in a book. Um, buyers change, obviously, today's day and age. Like, you obviously, you know that. You mastered the online game. This didn't exist 25 years ago, what you're doing right now. Um, but I've always looked— I said, okay, the words now that are used from the books that used to be taught in 1980s— some of those people that train sales now, they're learning from a trainer that used to do sales in like 1960, and it just gets passed all along. And a lot of the words bring up like objections that are almost like debris. Debris means like it's like dust from the past. So when somebody says, oh, I'm not interested in something like that, usually it's like that objection's like debris from the past of how they think things are done today. So like what, like if I'm coming to sell somebody an opportunity and they're like, oh, but I don't do things like that, they might have the thought that that opportunity is done the way people used to do it 25 years ago, selling candles at home or something like that. So it's like debris from the past, a lot of the objections. So we, we do have a framework called NRS, called No Resistance Sales. Um, and it's basically to, um, take the resistance away inside of sales. So let's say for example, when we say like no resistance, like when the shoulders are always up, right? Like I believe there's just buyer states. Like there's a buyer state where there's resistance, there's a buyer state where somebody's overly excited, and there's a buyer state where somebody's ready. I never believed in saying like, oh, you have to have buyer personas where that person's a green, ruby, red buyer. I wasn't a smart kid growing up, so I wouldn't know all that.

Yeah.

Like, like I was just like, okay, what state is a buyer in? Which majority of the time they're always resistant to buy something. Right. So I said, even when there's objections or whatever the case is and shoulders are up, I always said, okay, what can drop shoulders? Because the point of sales, Um, I believe this. I, I was always in the closing mindset. I don't believe, and especially being in direct sales that, you know, I always heard fortune was in the follow-up. So I always questioned it. I said, fortune's in the follow-up, but I never wanna do that. I don't wanna follow. Cuz the average sales stat is that you gotta follow up with somebody 6 to 8 times in order to close a deal. Right. So I said, I hate that. That, that was just me being young. I said, I have so much ADD that I can't, I can't follow up with somebody. Yeah. 6 to 8 times. And I said, why has never somebody never written out a line in a book?— and I've read every single sales book— that fortune, yes, is in the follow-up. I get it. But the true fortune is in the amount of attempts that you do on the first phone call. That's where the true fortune is. And the real sales executive or the salesperson can attempt without the customer knowing it's an attempt. So you have to attempt. Like, why has nobody said if you attempt 5 to 8 times, maybe you only got to follow up 1 to 2 times? The problem with sales reps is it takes so long to close out a deal, whether it's a remote sales rep or whatever the case is, is because the rule of follow-up is you only follow up on The true objection as to why somebody couldn't buy. The problem is, is when you don't attempt 5 to 8 times, somebody's gonna have to slow this down. When you don't attempt 5 to 8 times, you're now following up on something that might not be the true objection, cuz you haven't got down to the bare naked truth. And that's what extends follow-up for so long. Like you might be following up on something that's not the true objection. So now it takes 8 weeks or 12 weeks to close out a deal cuz you think it's about the husband and the wife. Oh, she needs to speak to the husband or wife, but they're speaking to the husband and wife when they get home. So I was always saying, okay, fortune's in the amount of attempts without the customer even knowing it's an attempt. That's where fortune's in. Like, it's like, it's like how many times you can attempt without them thinking it's an attempt, right? Like, I was doing a show with Andy Elliott a couple weeks ago, or like a month ago, and I said, when I started door-to-door sales, you know, it was okay, attempt one, they would say, no thank you, I'm not interested. And they'd be like, okay, but I'm still not just— my husband does something like that. Yeah, but we don't have the money. And by the third or fourth one, they're almost tossing the middle finger and be like, hey, get out of my— get off my lawn, right? And I said it was always an attempt without them knowing it was an attempt. And I have this line in sales. I say, you know, you think like the lion, but you sell like the lamb. Meaning like you're hungry for the commissions. But in today's day and age, since everybody's so transactional, you got to sell like the lamb. And this is why salespeople were great back then, because when somebody gave them an objection, they were all lambs. When somebody gave our old salespeople objections, they'd be like, yeah, don't even worry about it. They were so calm. They had this calm— you talk to salespeople back then that are like 75 now, they had this lamb-like attitude that even when they get an objection, they'll pay no mind to it. They don't take gasoline and pour it on. Yeah, no, they don't take it and try to start a fire on that one objection. When they say, oh, I don't have the money, they don't make money the issue 'cause they know that's not the issue. They don't even worry about it. So what do you got? What do you got going on for the holidays? It's like magic because usually they don't let up the objection so they don't pay attention on it. So I'd say, you know, on the third and fourth attempt, when I was saying they used to kick me off their lawn, I'd be like, all right, yeah, don't even worry about it. And I was young, so I could play like, you know, the pittiness card. I'd be like, and I would turn around just like the lamb, and I would say, hey, by the way, just so I don't, you know, get fired from my job, I can't tell my manager that you guys, you know, didn't want to do something like that. It's not a good enough excuse. I have to give them a real reason so we can go back to the company to research and development so they can make our product amazing. I said, just so I can write on the iPad, you know, truly as to why you guys didn't onboard today, so I could take back to research and development so we can always make our product amazing. What was the real reason as to why you guys didn't need the product? Just so I could write it down on my iPad and take it back to my manager. Right. What was the real reason? Oh, well, you know, and then they, they would come back in with another reason and my foot's back inside of the door. And I would say the ability to know that a customer can exit, you could pull them back in. That's the whole point of sales. Like on any objection online, if a customer— our thing is always we sell exits, right? Because if we could sell an exit, we can pull them back in. Like whether that's prospecting, booking a meeting, if a setter's trying to get somebody on a phone call, whether it's through an Instagram DM, I can always get somebody to show up if they know they can leave the call. People don't show up to calls because they feel like they gotta buy something. So the whole job in sales is if you want to get somebody to show up, make sure that in your prospecting message, or if it's ads or whatever the case is, you guys are masters at this, make them feel like they don't gotta buy something, do something, or sell something to show up because their shoulders are down, right? Like a prospect's job. My, my thing is when you ask me what do I do differently in sales is I teach people how people buy first and then sell second. If I could teach a salesperson how people buy, Teaching sales is easy. So I always say a prospect's job— learn how prospects buy. They want to steal information, give it to them.

Yeah, I love just going back to your concept about buyer state because I, again, I don't sell one-on-one, I sell one-to-many. It's very similar. Like, my presentations are crafted specifically to get people in the state so when I do ask for the sale, they've already said yes 200 times with their head. They've said in their— out, you know, like, but I'm able to see that because like I'm seeing them. I'm, I'm assuming you're training people who are doing door-to-door sales but also phone sales. Like, how do you feel the buyer persona when you're not like in front of that person, or the buyer state if you're not actually in front of that person on the phone or something?

Yeah, that's a good question. So I mean, yeah, we, we train all sales, insurance sales, remote high ticket selling. That's how I start off. I have a high ticket sales agency. I built my business up before I went to go train on the road, right? When I seen the course space blew up, I said, oh, oh, let's, let's create a love matchmaking service. Closer with course creator. Boom. We started a high ticket sales agency back in 2016 in Toronto, Canada, in-house. We had a bunch of closers on the phone and you know, everybody, everybody was doing remote sales, right? We were closing for other coaches. And you know, when you, when you think of states and frames, you think of rapport, right? Rapport. What is it actually like if rapport had to be on a physical piece of paper? If I had to draw it out, cuz when people are like, oh, rapport, you know, find points of commonality with people. I said, okay, but how would it like look at it if rapport was on like a graph? How would this conversation look like? It would be customer talks, you talk, customer talks, you talk. So rapport is a process of engagement. That's what true rapport is, right? So when I'm talking to somebody over the phone and somebody's saying, yeah, Yeah. Okay. No way. And then you go in for the close. Well, you shoot yourself in the foot because you don't have a process of engagement. Like that's how rapport is supposed to be. You talk, I talk. It's like, I was just on a plane an hour ago. Lady's talking to me and I'm just like, yeah, no way. And I'm just tired. And I'm like, yeah. I'm like, I would say one word and she would talk for 30 minutes. You're outta rapport as a salesperson. You know, if now she tried to sell me a water bottle, I'm not gonna buy cuz there's no process of engagement, but a bad sales rep would try to go sell the water bottle after. Right? Like I would teach somebody, say, hey, by the way, how do you get them to open up a little bit more before you go in for the close? So I would say like for, for us, um, you, you'd have to have some sort of process of engagement on a phone conversation. Um, rather than, it's like finding the twinkle in the eye on a phone conversation. Like what is truly the easiest way to rapport is become generally interested in that person's best interest. And when somebody thinks of that, it's not just about finding points of commonality. Oh, you live in Boise, Idaho. Oh, I was there on, you know, last week on Russell's podcast. Yeah. That's great. But when you can genuinely feel and, and become interested in that person's best interest, that's where you have somebody sold. Like that is sales at the end of the day. When I can walk in somewhere and somebody says to us, a salesman says to me, whether I'm buying a TV or a car and somebody says, mm, I don't think you want that one. 'Cause you said you want it to last 20 years. Yeah. You might, you might wanna go to that one, Daniel. It might be even a little bit cheaper, but that one's gonna last you 20 years. Boom. I'm sold. Why? 'Cause that person gave me the perception that they're genuinely interested in my best interest. Right? So it's in, I believe in a phone conversation, I look at like rapport and process of engagement. I think towards the end of a conversation, when you look at the traditional sales funnel or sales system or cycle, it's usually build rapport with somebody, ask some questions, present your product, deal with some objections, close out the deal, follow up, make them a raving fan, whatever. That's the sales cycle. And I say, why has sales always been taught like this? Build rapport, ask some questions, make your presentation, deal with some objections, close the deal. I said, why has nobody ever said build rapport? Rapport is not something you do, it's something like something you did. You do it throughout the wholesale. At the end, reports should be like opening up and they should be more open than ever rather than like making it all exciting in the beginning and then closing it off towards the end of the deal. They should be more excited than ever. So, so the ability to find out their best interests and get them laughing towards the end of the phone call is much more important than get them laughing towards the beginning of the phone call. Does it make sense? Yeah, like somebody has to be looser. Like, like whatever I, I told, uh, my sales team last week, I said when you guys are asking for a payment, you're now asking that person to exchange something that is one of the mentally one of their most like scarce resources inside of their head. And her parents said don't give no your money away to nobody, and now you're going to ask for a payment on a phone call. They'd rather go shop to a big corporation than go pay a salesperson. This is the mentality of a customer. I'd rather go pay Costco than go pay somebody selling vegetables on a street. That's just how we were programmed. We're programmed to be marketed to on infomercials, whatever the case is. I'm like, they don't want to pay you. So now when you go ask for money, that's where like the resistance builds back up. I might just drop it even towards the end. So even when you're asking for payments, say something to even drop them. Keep rapport because rapport is the subconscious thought of there's something about this person I just like. I'm like, how do you get that ticking off throughout the wholesale? So even when you're asking for payment, you still got to tick that off. You can't just do it in the beginning. It's not something you did. It's something you do to the end. So, and I just said, hey, tell them they can pay us with a bag of cash. They gotta fly in a jet and they gotta drop off $30,000 with a bag of cash. Let them pause for a second and be like, really? And then my sales guy can be like, no, I'm just kidding. You just, it's just, you could just Visa or MasterCard. How do you wanna go? Just drop it a bit because, because their tension's going up the moment you're starting to ask for money, right? So I said, that's where I always looked at sales cycles. And I said, how do we just lessen it? It's not so much of a battle, but it's like a dance.

Mm-hmm.

Right?

Yeah. That's really cool.

Interesting.

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When was the last time you were like knocking door to door?

Have you done that since— No, no, no. I stopped when I was 17. I did it for 3 years and then I started another bigger direct sales job. And there's this itch in me like to go back and do it.

Yeah, we should go right now and go knock some doors.

Yeah, like, like really, like sometimes I'm back in my old neighborhood with like Steve, my videographer. We'll go visit my family. And I'm looking at the door, I'm like, Steve, is your camera on?

Yeah, I'm like, I want to do a good series for you, you knocking doors and stuff.

It would be, you know, we've been, we've been thinking about it. I actually, I still think, uh, and I also love calling, like I love, I 24/7 I'll still pick up a phone call when I'm in my office with my sales guys, and I'll still get on phone calls.

Um, stream that, you want other people watch you on calls ever?

Yeah, yeah, of course. Yeah, we, we did it last week, we did all live cold calling last week. I sold all live on a, on an Instagram Live. It was fun. That's really cool.

Yeah, man. Okay, so I saw some Instagram— I don't know if it was a week ago or a day ago, um, you posted a video, um, and I want to go deeper into this because this is, this is a funny example, but it's true in like in a lot of different situations. But the, the reel was basically you're not allowed to have sex until you've made at least $100,000 this month. So let's talk about that, and then I want to liken it to a lot of other, uh, things.

But that was kind of funny. Yeah, uh, well, I mean, it's blowing up.

Yeah, I'm gonna say how many people watched it.

I, I, uh I posted that reel already like 2, 3 times. Okay. Just because I like— you know, it's a good one. Well, I just like people coming in and be like, whatever comments are like, I just, I love it. I'll laugh at some comments.

But, um, yeah, 520,000 views so far.

I, I said you're not allowed to go on a dinner date if you're not making $10,000 a month because this new thing is always like, well, these ladies, they want to especially like, oh, these ladies, they, they're always saying they want to go to these fancy dinners or whatever the case is. I said, okay, so just go make more money. But I said if If dinners are expensive right now and it's costing you $500 to go out for dinner, $200— in Miami you're not getting a dinner under $500, right? Um, you're getting rinsed there. So I said, okay, how can you make sense of spending 10% of your wealth? And you want to be a business person, you're spending 10% of your wealth on one dinner date. Just think of it. I'm like, most, most wealthy people, rich people are gonna think when they're spending 20% of their wealth, it has to be on something significant, right? I said, in business you can't just flick the switch on and flick the switch off. I said, so number one, I said, start getting disciplined. I said, start having some goals for yourself. I said maybe at $10,000 you can afford with no stress to go on the dinner date, because I'm like, you want to be loose, you want to, you know, you don't want to be thinking about— and it's just an Instagram reel, I can't do a lot of talking on Instagram reel. My guys chop it up to get a little bit more hate, they're chopping it up to make it a little bit more intense. But, um, and then, and then I said, and then about the sex thingy, I said, okay, you're not allowed to have sex until you're making $100,000 a month, right? And, and I'm talking to salespeople that are in the vehicle, by the way, Like, people have to understand that message is to salespeople that are in a vehicle that can do it. Maybe if somebody's working a job, they're not in a vehicle.

It is completely—

that's not your audience, right? No, no, no, no, no. I'm talking to people that are looking at me like, how do I become rich in sales, right? So I'm like, okay, you're in a vehicle that'll make $100,000 a month. I said, okay, let's dissect sex for a second. Let's dissect it. Well, if you're a male, right, and you're not learning from Russell and Daniel how to communicate with other individuals, it might take long, meaning you have to you know, think about where you're going tonight, and then you gotta go buy some clothes, and then you gotta go pick the club and go to the Uber, and then, you know, go out and spend money on drinks, and then, you know, uh, figure out which girl you're going to try to pick up and then get her phone number. And then maybe you don't land the first Friday and Saturday night, and then you go back to the same club. So now you're 2 weeks in, you go back to the same club, and then you do the whole thing again, get somebody's number. And then, okay, finally you land Maria's number, and now you're out with Maria on a date, and you guys don't have sex the first date. So now you're 4 weeks in and you're on the second date and now you— maybe you have sex on the, on the, for— on the first month, and now you're a month in just for this process where you could be learning, studying, growing, building a business, or whatever the case is. You're a month in, and then it's good, and then, you know, and then you stay doing it. I said, for the young people, um, I said, I think it's so much easier to focus building because if it gets good, and then, then now you're doing it every day. And I said, that time I said the most deadly time as an entrepreneur is your 6 to 9 o'clock at nighttime. I said, you know, I said that's where entrepreneurs are built. Like that, it's, that's that bleed time. That's what I was, that's not what's shown in the reel. I said, you know, entrepreneurs are built from 6 to 11 o'clock and on the weekends. That's what we're built like, you know, we're, we're all in part-timers until it's full-time, right? So I said, don't, don't be like an, uh, a fake full-timer, be an all-in part-timer. So even if you don't have the ability, if you're working a 9 to 5, it's okay. You could beat the people that say they're entrepreneurs but they're working 1 hour a day but they got 12 hours on their head. I said they're fake full-timers. I said our business is built on the weekend, it's built on those gaps if we're all in, right? So I was just showing them, I'm like, you will beat majority of people if you're really, uh, you know, an all-in part-timer inside of business and entrepreneurship. You could beat a lot of fake full-timers inside of business, especially in the online space, right? Because it's online now, you have the ability— oh, I don't have to work today, or whatever the case is. So I was just teaching them how to maximize time on that.

I think, again, obviously it's a funny example, grabs clicks in headlines and stuff like that. But the reality is true in anything. Like when I was wrestling, that was my big thing is just like everyone else at nights was goofing off weekends, doing things, you know, holidays they were in. Like for me to become who I wanted to become in wrestling, like I was working out every night. I had to do those things to be able to become a different level than everybody else.

Right?

I think that's true in any area of trying to be a good salesperson, a good marketer, a good, like whatever you're trying to do, it's like, it's like you've gotta give up something in the interim while you're mastering the skillset. Otherwise you're gonna gonna— it's gonna take you way too long to ever actually master the skill set, you know?

Correct. Yeah. And I'm, I'm, I'm talking to young folks and I'm saying, guys, we have such an advantage. Our parents wish that they had social media and Instagram. Like, for example, going back when I was with Andy last month, Elliot, I was like, dude, because we're planning out some of these events, I said, okay, we gotta think bigger. He's like, okay. I'm like, think of it, if Tracy and Zig Ziglar and all these guys, if they packed out events with no social media we suck. I said, we suck. We should be doing— we should easily be doing 100,000 people in a stadium. We should fill up 60,000 to 70,000 people. If they did it without social media, we— like I said, who are we comparing ourselves to? Sometimes we just cut— like I said, because I don't think entrepreneurs— I know people say comparison is the thief of all joy, but I disagree. I think if you're a winner and if you grew up someone like yourself and you're in sports— I grew up in sports playing soccer— I think comparison is a motivator inside of business. I believe that when you compare yourself to the right people, if it demotivates you, I don't think you should be in business. This is the true message. I think if you compare yourself to the right people, you have a benchmark, and you could say as a team, okay, we suck, how do we have to get better here, right? I think comparison for the right people, it's almost like a motivator. So, um, I, I forget about the subject. Oh, but yes, I would say, yeah, I was saying just like, uh, in terms of maximizing time, I don't think— when I was saying that message, I don't believe that giving up some negative things is ever a sacrifice inside a business. I think when, when, when people say you gotta give up going to the clubs or drinking or whatever the case is, I'm like, we, we have to pause for a second and just think some of those things that we think is a sacrifice is already a negative. So it's not like, oh, I'm sacrificing going out on the weekends and drinking. I'm like, well, that's already bad. Like, that's already a bad thing to do. You mean you just have a little bit more love for your life and your business. So you have a little bit more self-love. That's not sacrifice. The true sacrifice as an entrepreneur, as a salesperson, is sometimes working in the office at 12 o'clock, maybe when it's somebody's birthday, sometimes missing somebody's wedding because Daniel has to be at this event or whatever. That's the hard sacrifices inside of life. So you have to make this divine line where it's like, okay, what are already negative things that I think is a sacrifice? Because I can't be in this guilty place of me sacrificing alcohol when it's already negative. That just means you love your business. The hard things are, and you have to identify giving up maybe a family function or, or being in the office, uh, when a friend has a baby shower, whatever the case is. Those are the true sacrifices inside of business.

Yeah, for sure. Okay, next question I want to ask you. So my followers, my listeners, we're funnel hackers. We geek out on like people's sales process and what they're doing, how they're doing. So I want to understand your business. Obviously everyone can see socially what you're doing, like it's out there, you're doing a bunch of cool stuff. Someone sees that, a reel, they watch something, and then what does the rest of your business look like? What's the back end? Like, where are you driving people? What's it look like? I want— I'm gonna break down and dissect that part.

Yeah, for sure. So, um, going back to the beginning, my stages was always to create the social media a lot larger, whether it's YouTube, Instagram, TikTok, right?

Um, because you don't sell the events, you get— I usually get paid to speak at them. You speak for free?

Yeah, no, get paid to speak at, unless it's friends' events, right? We know how the game works. Like, if it's friends' events, well, I'll go up and speak. Um, and, and the only reason why I wouldn't sell on stage even though sometimes I would have the opportunity if it's a homie's event. I just don't like shitting the bed. I don't like doing anything where it's like, I know Russell goes up there and makes $1.5 million. No, no, no, I'm not going up there. I'm just gonna shut my mouth. Yeah, like, just go follow me, here's a QR code. I mean, the real process is like, uh, I've had the same— I've had the same university course that we just kept developing over the last 6 years. We just keep enhancing it. Um, so it's for ever. So they come back, they then they can go into our low ticket, which is our university. And then from there—

so from there, are you pushing that through, through my Instagram? Yeah.

Uh, okay, organically.

Do you buy paid ads as well?

Yeah, we ran them on YouTube. And, and usually when we're doing launches to a new program, we revamp the program, we launch a bunch of new ads and then run.

But as a whole, you're not just— most of yours is coming organic social, most of the traffic sounds like.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, like, I mean, we, we, we could do a lot more running ads. Um, but I think now with the brand, we've, our retargeting's a lot better cuz now I figured out truly who my audience is and truly who I actually like talking to as well. Um, and then yeah, so that into a first, first model is they get into our low ticket, which is just our university. It's our World Class Sales University. What's the price of that? Um, $997 or they can pay monthly. Monthly, right? We just dropped it down cheap monthly, which is like $37 a month. So really anybody can come into that. And then from there it's backend selling inside of our platform. So I have my teams chatting and calling and everybody. So I get everybody inside of there and then all my closers and setters will send them into it.

So they're the closing centers, just focusing on people who are actually in the $37 a month inside. They're not, they're not going out to the social and contacting anybody, just the people who prove they're going to buy something.

Yeah. Cool. Are, are for us at least, I found our interaction and the way we've mastered it with chatting through people, um, inside of the platform and, you know, more so of like their concierge the moment they get in. Like the moment they get in, it's like concierge, book a meeting. Hey, what do you like about the program? Hey, what do you sell? What are your challenges in sales? Oh cool. Let's just book a free 30-minute consultation and go from there. Right? So, um, and again, like I, I, uh, you know, I, I've attended seminars since I was I was like, I was a weird kid again. Like, I attended seminars since I was like 15. I was a nerd. Like, my first Robert Kiyosaki seminar in Toronto, Canada, I think I was like 15, right? And I was just like, sometimes it wasn't even about the information. When he was like showing like the four quadrants, I was like, oh, he's tapping his shoulder to go inside of this room and he's watching. Yeah, it was weird. Like, I wasn't like— I didn't care about algebra and stuff. I'm watching the whole sales process go down. So now I'm just modern day. I said, okay, everybody. So like my first School, which is like my sales university. That first classroom is okay. That's like the low ticket. Everybody's inside of my seminar. And then you host that on school? We just moved it to it just recently. Not everything, actually, just probably about a few thousand students in there. It was actually just usually just our own bank of our own platform, and they would come in through our website, right? And yeah, and then I would just treat it like, you know, they're there now, they're inside of our platform, and now we can close them inside of the platform. It's just much easier.

Very cool. Yeah, jump on the call and then what do you sell them at that level?

What's the next thing? So we have a sales leadership, which is for people that are in sales but have a team. So if they're a high-ticket coach and they have a team of 5 people and they either don't know how to like hire, recruit, motivate, influence those 5 people to work, how do they keep their retention right? So it's all for sales leaders, which is our second. And then our boot camps and seminars inside of there too as well. We used to run conventions, boot camps, and seminars when I used to have time. And then for some reason in the last like year and a half, I started to say 30 or 300. Yeah, it was like busy. What was it, like 100 events last year? And I said I don't have time to host. Like, I did one convention last year, which was like our only like upsell for events, like your funnel hacking event. Well, that was our one convention and that's it. But, uh, Uh, next year and the second part of the year, we'll move into our own seminars and everything again. Cool.

Yeah. And you have something behind that you sell? Is that kind of the top tier right now? Uh, at our events or just in your— I'm looking at your funnels whole. So $37 membership site, call on the phone, sell the next level there.

Anything else? Is that— yeah, then it goes to $7,500. We used to have our coaching offer like plus $20,000, which was group coaching and one-on-one. Deleted it again because of time. Uh, and then finally, eventually now train my presidents and managers on how to coach. Because, you know, the hardest thing was— and I think this is with every business owner— how do you, how do you get people to want the people around you, not just want you, right? And, uh, my people wanted me because the personality and the sales, it was very relationship. Yeah, of course. Yeah. And, uh, that's just something we've been mastering now. And then yesterday we were with a friend talking about, uh, which was in the space for a while that we were talking about, and, uh, just, you know, asking what's our are, you know, because I'm always learning in the space. I said, now that we're going to start running our own boot camps and our own seminars and we launch the book and everything, uh, what's going to be the ultimate play for people that are sitting down right now inside of our seminars for something that is $50,000 plus, right? So we've just been designing that out now. Very cool.

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Watch the Hulu original series The Secret Lives of Mormon Wives, now streaming on Hulu and Hulu on Disney+ for bundle subscribers. Terms apply. Um, you know, most of your clients, are they— and you talked about the leadership teams, but are most of them like individual salespeople, or most of them are people with teams, or is it kind of a It's a, it's a split.

I mean, my, my sales guys would know that better now about the stats, but I still think that, yeah, it's a, it's a, it's just a split across everything. Like it can be an insurance rep selling insurance and it could be somebody that has a remote sales team of 20 people and then a brokerage of like 7 people or a network marketing company. Um, I, I, I'm sure your viewers know like about network marketing. I've tapped in heavy into that space training a lot of network marketing companies. So a lot of them have teams of like 3,000, 5,000, 20,000. Um, and When people ask, why don't you have so many high-ticket products? I understood my customer. If I'm in the network marketing space, network marketers are used to paying $47 to $197 monthly or opt in for an entire business.

Yeah, correct. And usually like it's hard for you.

So it was great, uh, because there was— I went to the network marketing model in the beginning to train a lot of direct sales reps. That's also where I started door-to-door. We also had a compensation plan, so I knew the game. I knew the game of recruiting friends. I knew the game of prospecting. I got that team building aspect. I understand leadership when I was young, so I understood how to reach it. But also at the same time, the crowds were so big that the people were my promoters instead of ads. Like, I would go look at my stats on social media, I'm like, oh, I'm doing exactly what my friend is. He's running $100,000 a month in ads and I'm doing that right now for free on my Instagram. And it's crazy because sometimes a lady would be at a big event and she would post me on Instagram, and then the husband would be like, hey man, I run a real estate brokerage, right? So I was going to very wide place of training. And a lot of network marketers move to— then they go sell real estate or whatever the case is, right? So, um, yeah, so that was how I structured my offers, designed around the audience that I was always around for the first 5 years of my career in trading. I had to structure it low ticket. I never had something where it was like $50,000 to $100,000 because it wasn't worth my energy and attention, right? It would just wouldn't sell.

It's interesting. See, look at Andy. He's— he didn't start there. He started with the bigger ones. So package is way higher.

Well, well, Andy was in car— what, Andy started off in car and door-to-door sales, right? And he has a much higher ticket audience. And that's why when we like sat down, we said, what, what a perfect blend. Like, if we were— because I would bring in masses, right? Like, tomorrow we go into Colombia, we do like 6,000 people in Colombia. I'm used to doing stages every weekend that are like 5,000 to 10,000 people. So I said, okay, most events you're speaking at network marketing events, uh, about 50%. Okay, yeah, about 50%. Then like insurance events, real estate events. Yesterday we did solar events, roofing events, right? Um, but, uh, I said I'll bring in a lot wide, you can bring in a little tight. So it's a perfect event, you know? Like if we had a stadium of 10,000 people, I would fill up there, fill up there. That's your game, you deal with it. Like when Jack was like, ground seats. Yeah, like when Jack's like, so we're gonna have seats at 20,000, I'm like, oh Oh, all right. You, Steve's like, just shut your mouth and let them deal with that. And then you deal with all that. You know that game, you know how to get a lot, webinars, et cetera. So yeah, yeah. I focused on the strength. So through it, like I, I never even in the last like 6 years, I, I only started focusing on high ticket in the last like 6 months now because it's so wide. And now we have a lot of high ticket customers coming through.

Right.

So cool.

Yeah. So I think a lot of people in our world, like they create something good and they don't know how to promote it. And obviously the best ways to get on stages and podcasts, all kind of stuff. I'm curious, like, because even getting on that— I mean, to get on that many stages, 100 stages a year, is not an easy project, you know what I mean? And I'm just curious, like, what's your process? How do you— how are you landing these stages? How are you getting them? Like, if someone's coming into this new and like, I got something, I should be on stages, but I have no idea what to do, like, what does that look like if you were to coach someone through that?

Real answer, no BS answer is this: I've never had— okay, I have to make this clear. Uh, and I'm not saying this is the route to go down. I'm just giving you guys my career. I've never had a speaking coach. I've never had a speaking manager. Still to today, I get every event from the last event. Like I've never had a layout plan of like, oh, these are who's gonna hire me. Or like, you know, people have speaking agencies and they're like, there would be a speaking agency and a management company. Like, I'm like, I dream of this. I'm like, where is that person to me? Like I worked with one agency and I'm like, I never wanna work with these people again.

Again.

It was a show. I have a friend sometimes that gets me a big event here and there, but 95% of my events are all self-booked. I'll reach out to you, then people start contacting you throughout the event, like, come to my event. Yeah, like when I— when I mean exactly when I— and sometimes on a different scale, but when I mean I get an event from the last event, it's like I've— like I've always just gotten either hit up at that event through networks and connections, just slowly building. I've— yeah, I've just never had an agency do any promotion. And I say, you know, I genuinely think this. I think if you love what you do, I think speaking, when you speak from the heart, people could feel it. And I don't think there's any true, true formula. When people say like, I want to be a speaker, my real answer is this. I say, wait, stop for one second. I get it. It looks fun. You wanna be a speaker, but it's almost the equivalent. Those words are almost the equivalent of you coming up to me and saying, hey, Hey, I want to be a professional sports player. Which industry should I pick? That's dangerous because like I've been like, I've never seen myself still today. I still don't see myself as a speaker. I've been training sales since I was 14. You can't pull it away from me. If somebody says no, thank you, I'm not interested, F off. I'm dealing with the objection in 2.5 seconds. Like it's just been in my DNA. So like I've been training on a certain subject and companies hire for that. They hire like companies hire you now more than ever, especially in the world that we're in where everybody's a speaker, everybody's a trainer, everybody wants to be a coach. They hire you solve a problem. So if they can't see on social media or something where it's like this person's going to come in and solve a problem, it's going to be hard for you to be a trainer or a speaker. I think the better question is like, where can I solve a problem and become best at it and then just show off online how good I am at solving that problem? And then yes, the, the truth is like in the first 3 years of my career, I did all my own events, all my own tours, and spoke for free everywhere and had 5 people in a room and just, you know, learned how to train. And I became a good speaker because I spoke to nobody, and I became a good speaker because I spoke on live streams. I speak. Like, I tell people that. I'm like, well, I want to be a good speaker. How much do you speak? Well, I don't have events. Well, there's a livestream app, but nobody's watching. That's the best time to practice. You know, like, yeah, exactly. Like, I speak. Like, I, I just— I talk. Like, that's how you get good at sales. You sell. Yes. And then there's platforms and you learn from us. But, um, I, I just think, like, how much do you speak? How do you get good at business? Do business. Yeah. You know, so I, uh, I still don't have— like, the truth is, I still don't have the formula. I'm just great. I've always said—

I think that is a formula. I think that's the problem people have is they're waiting for something. And it's like the—

because my—

like, I would give the similar answer. Mine, when I got started speaking, I went to events and the promoter would like— I'd met a friend that he'd want to speak at my event.

Sure.

I'm like, how's it working? He's like, you just show up at my event and speak. So I had to put my own flights, my own hotels. I flew out there. I was allowed to speak to sell. But, um, it was funny because like we'd show up and they're always like, there's gonna be 500 people in the room. You show up and there's like 12, and 6 of them are speakers. And so we're all selling to these 6 people, you know, everyone's pitching, but I did it over and over. Some weekends I would pay my own flight, my own hotel, I'd sell, nobody'd buy, and I'd fly back home. I'm like, I lost $3,000 by speaking here, but I gotta practice, and I practiced, and I practiced. Where most people are waiting for, like, I'm gonna hire, you're not gonna hire somebody, just get out there and start speaking and putting yourself out there. And one of the other things I realized too is like, I never got on other people's stages really until I built my own stage, right? And then people saw me, I have a platform, they're like, Oh, and they start asking again. You talked about what's the problem you solve. Like, I got really good solving like funnels, is my, my brain thinks in that world. And now when someone's like, we need someone to talk about funnels, like, like, well, Russell's the best. You may find someone else, but if you can get him, that's the best one, you know? Right. It opens up every door you possibly want to, but it comes down to like becoming great at solving a problem and just doing it. So I do think that is the formula. It's not trying to hire someone, you know what I mean?

Yeah.

Or waiting for somebody to whatever, whatever they're waiting for, you know?

Yeah, we say that too. I always say like, don't wait, create the stage. Like, you know, you gotta create your platform. And I just say like, focus on just becoming like, I'm a nerd at the end of the day. Like, yes, I have a big mouth. I love talking about sales, but like, I'm a geek about sales. Like, just like you guys are geeks about funnels and selling on stage. Like, I'm a geek about like sales, like shaking somebody's hand and selling. Like, so I always said like, how do I just become the best? And, and I truly, I, I truly always felt this inside of my heart. I said this since I was like 16, but you gotta earn a mic. You have to earn a mic. Like a mic is earned. It's not deserved, it's earned. You gotta earn a mic. Like that. There's power in holding a mic on stage. And I always, since I was like 16, 17, I would study these sales books and then make my own concept. And I, and I'd always say to myself and, and even to my reps inside of my, inside of my organization when we were young, I'm like, oh, I could train sales better than that guy. I could do it better. But I'm like, I, I'm not allowed to do it yet because they're gonna be like, who the heck is this kid? Right? But I always had in my heart that if I'm the best, eventually people will take notice of it. If I'm the best and I promote it online 24/7, eventually people will take notice of it. I said there was nobody in the world— and I truly believe this, like since I started training sales— said there's nobody in the world— if you line up 50 greats on stage, I will out-train them for 24 hours. Give me a burger and I'll train for 24-hour sales. Give me any single subject, any single crowd. It's just I just focused on becoming the best at educating and training sales and, and not teaching people that it's just words, it's understanding why you're saying the words. So I didn't just treat it like it was just school, because that's how people didn't learn at school. They would just study a test and forget it. I make sure if I left stages, people understood why they're saying what they're saying, because they would never forget it. If they just understood word tracks, they would forget it the next day. It's not implemented inside of it. So if when we're doing a training, and whether it's in Romania last week, I said, wait, wait, stop. Do you guys understand why I'm saying it? Do you understand why the script is written the way it's written? Because there's going to be a curveball inside of business. You got to understand it rather than just know it word for word, right? So yeah, there is— it's just becoming the best. It's just focus on becoming the best. That's it. And it's a good intention too. It's like you're intentionally saying, I don't want to think I deserve a mic. I am going to 'cause when you say I deserve success, what you're really saying is like, I don't wanna work for it. When you say, how do I earn it to your coach or mentor, it's like now you're saying to the universe, I wanna work for it. Yeah, it's like, how do I earn this mic? Okay, now you wanna work. So I never focused on the time. I always said my time will come to do a big event. I'll just keep doing the small ones, keep going negative like you. All the events in the beginning were negative. And especially for me, 'cause I didn't have your skillset, which was selling on stage.

Stage.

They were actually all— they were— you had no way to make your money back. Yeah, they're all break-even because my keynote fee was not $30,000 plus, it was $3,000 in Italy. So it's negative 6 on the front end, and I don't know how to sell on stage. I wasn't a master at that. Yeah, so it was always negative.

Yeah, you know, putting in the reps, man. That's what everyone wants to jump to, the, to the end line, and not willing to put into the, the work in the middle that no one sees. You know, it's like, well, you— I can see what you're like, I'll show you videos of me 10 years ago. Like, I can't do that, you know? Like, you got to put in the time and the effort until you, until you got it. So yeah, I love that. Well, dude, it's been fun. It's fun having you out here. Um, so, um, yeah, do you want to— I mean, obviously people follow you on IG. Your account's been blowing up.

When—

how long ago did you actually start it?

Well, we started like 7, 8 years ago, but just started really growing, growing in the last like 2 years, 2, 3 years.

5.3 million. You've lapped me like 3 times. So that's very impressive.

But yeah, that's my only platform though that we go heavy on. Yeah, yeah.

It's just like Daniel G, they follow you to come see and like plug into all the stuff you're doing.

Yeah, yeah, that's it. Yeah, yeah, that's it. Yeah. And then we have our book whenever it does come out, probably about a month down the road from now, which is just, it's just, uh, you know, I felt like people need a book that is modern day towards today's buyer that is fast-paced. Um, and, and again, like thinking like a lion and knowing you want to make money because now we're exposed to, wow, you could make money. So it's good to have that hunger, but also being that calm, cool, collective person that can be like a lamb in front of people. So when you're selling, they're like, oh, I don't feel like I'm being sold something. Right. And that's a true art of it. Right.

So sure. I'm excited for the book to come out. I love books. How long did it take you to write it?

About 6 years. Yeah. I scrapped it like 8 times.

Good.

You wrote a good book. Yeah. My friends like, well, do this and get this ghostwriter. I'm like, no, I want them to know that I wrote this and that there's spelling mistakes and there's grammar mistakes. Makes— AI has helped me with grammar though, I'm not gonna lie. Like, I, like, I, I don't have a ghostwriter, but the, the AI fixed this paragraph of grammar. It's helped me tremendously in the last like 6 months, right? That's awesome.

I'm glad you wrote a good book. It drives me crazy when people write a book in a weekend and it's like, ah, you want to create something that lasts beyond, you know, I mean, where you can actually put in your life. So I appreciate you. Yeah, good book, and excited for that coming out. What's it called again?

The Sales Game.

The Sales Game. Yeah, coming soon. If you're following the IG, is probably— is that the best spot to go to just kind of plugging everything you're doing.

Yes, everything.

Yeah, Daniel G. Yeah, but I say—

I said Sales G. Yeah, the Daniel G. Yeah, yeah, it was called World Class Closer. I'm like, let's just call it The Sales Game. Let's just have everybody— let's give everybody the game of sales.

Game of sales. Yeah, that's awesome, man. Well, thanks for coming and hanging out and being here, and, uh, glad to finally get to know you personally and hopefully do more stuff in the future.

So yeah, thank you for having me, man. Appreciate it.

Thank you.

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