How to Write Copy That Actually Sells (Even if You're Terrible at Writing)

You're sending out all these emails, you're doing social media posts and sales pages and you're not getting a very good response. What's wrong? Generally, it's your copywriting, I hate to tell you. So this is why you need to tune in right now on the Scale or Fail show. Because we're going to teach you all about how to create copy that is magnetic, that is going to attract your right audience right here, right now. On the Scale or Fail show. Welcome to the Scale or Fail show. I am Alyson Maslin. I am a business growth mentor. And on the show we are all about scaling, which is duplicating what you do, replicating it and multiplying it so that you can go from one to one to one to many and really get your gifts out there in a big way and at the same time driving up your revenue and your profits. Well, today we are going to do just that because it's so important that you are putting the right messaging out into the world. And, and you might find that as you've been trying this, it's not super easy to do. So that's why I have a dear friend, a client, and one of the best copywriters in the world, Jenny Hamby. She is a phenomenal direct response copywriter. She is the founder and CEO of seminar marketingpro.com where she specializes in promoting seminars, webinars and more. Since 1995, her multichannel marketing campaigns have netted responses as high as 84% and on budgets as small as 125 bucks. We're going to find out all about that. She has worked with heavy hitters like Jack Canfield, T. Harv Eker, Alex Mendozian, and John Asrath. Jenny has made a name for herself as the seminar marketing press, an expert voice on copywriting for today's information product industry. She is also the author of how to Successfully Market Seminars and Workshops, a home study guide that shows professionals how to develop marketing plans and promotional materials to fill seminar seats, as we call it, butts and Seats, as well as the co author of Stop Speaking for the Ultimate Guide to Making Money with Webinars. So, Jenny, so glad to finally get you on the show.

Allison. Thank you so much. It is so great to finally be on the show and to be here with you today.

Yeah. And I'm really excited. I want to dive into your story and I want to talk about copywriting and I know a lot of people really struggle with this. They pull their hair out and it's also very Time consuming, you know, So I love to write. I've written two books. But direct response copywriting is a whole different ballgame, right?

Yes, it is.

It's not just, you know, your romance story or your news story. Right. You have a special knack. And I just. Speaking from experience, I had the opportunity to work with you for a couple of years, and you truly have a gift.

Thank you. Thank you. That means a lot coming from you.

Yeah, but it's true. It's true. So how did you get into this film? Have you always loved doing writing? I mean, how did you make that shift into marketing? What's the story?

What's the story? Well, I've always loved words. And reading was always my passion as a child, from the time I learned how to read, I was constantly reading everything, like, even cereal boxes in the morning, I'd sit and read everything. And I think that plays into my ability to write really well. I went to journalism school. Believe it or not, people who know me think that's the funniest thing, because in college I was painfully shy. Definitely not a journalist type. But something really guided me to be in that program. And it wasn't until about six weeks after graduation that I figured out what it was. I went to a writing conference that was being held by UW Madison, which is where I went to school. And during one of the sessions, like, nothing really caught my attention. So I literally stepped into a room that was open and there was a copywriter speaking. And if you've ever seen in the movies where like the room goes dark and the spotlight shines down, like, that's how clear it was. Like, oh, this is what you've been training for. Like, I was utterly fascinated by the fact that this career even existed. And so as I got started in my professional career, I started a freelancing business on the side, writing marketing copy for small businesses. And then after about six years of working in the not for profit industry, I. I decided to go out on my own, start my own full time freelance writing business. And a few months after I started, I had the joy of going through the guerrilla marketing coach certification program. And somebody else who was in that class was a copywriter named Alex Mendocian, who, you know, who has gone on to do very, very great, big impactful things. And Alex and I hit it off as the two copywriters of the group. And part of that process, you pick the niche that you want to focus on. And at the time, I would write anything for money. Right. It didn't matter what it was. And going through that process, he's really the one who said, what are the niches you could look at? And it was event marketing. I absolutely love it. I love to learn. I love to share the excitement of learning things with people through information, products or events. So that's how I got started in that industry and in copywriting specifically.

Yeah. That's amazing. That's amazing. And Alex is so gifted. So it's cool that you all had that connection. And so do you feel that because you've been doing copywriting for a while now, do you feel that just that the field has changed, the trends have changed with copy since you've been doing it?

Absolutely. I mean, when I started out, we were very much doing direct mail print ads, like old school stuff. Right. And about, I think probably the first year that I was in my full time freelance business. So right around 2000 is when I first started seeing things go online. So the shift moved definitely online. And over the years it's changed. The principles, the basic principles of direct response copywriting are still in play regardless of the format. But what has changed are the tools. We're online much more, much more video, you're doing shorter snippets when we're promoting through text messaging or through social media, even short videos. So the trends I see you have a shorter window to capture attention and you need to be very comfortable writing not only for words on a screen, but really words that are being spoken.

Yeah. I mean, you really have to nail down your target audience and speaking to them. Right. If it's just a nugget.

Yes. And you have to be able to be very succinct and very, you know, be able to capture attention. And I think part of that is getting really good at the principles, really knowing your audience and what makes them tick and then also being willing to show who you are and your personality. You know, be really authentic in your marketing copy because people really in many cases are buying you.

Yeah. Yeah. Wow. That's. That's. It has changed. I know when I had my ad agency, God, over 20 years ago. Right. So it was totally different. You know, it was all about the magazine ad and so forth. And so I think there's more of a need for copy now than any than ever. I think people are needing to, you know, it's such a lot of noise out there.

There is. And you have to be able to write copy too. That I've always done it, but a lot of copywriters haven't. That really drives a response. You Know, I don't think. I've always loved working with small businesses, and we don't have big ad budgets. Right. We don't have millions to spend. So you always had to tie it back to, how is this piece of copy going to produce a response that I want, Whether it's clicks on a sales page or preferably somebody purchasing something. And I think the more channels there are, the more ways we can reach people and the more that's out there. You really need to be able to write copy that can produce those responses for you.

So what, do you probably do this all the time just because this is what you do, right? You're online, you see posts, you get emails, and you're like, oh, my God, big mistake. Or. Yeah. Or, you know, you're like, gosh, if they had only done this, I bet they would have gotten a lot more of a response. What do you see are some of the biggest mistakes in copywriting? Indirect response.

I was gonna say, when I'm online, I'm constantly going down rabbit holes. It's like the occupational hazard, right? I get hooked by the good copy, and all of a sudden, like, why am I here? Checking out the sales funnel.

How about you down here? My project's over here.

Yeah, exactly. Where did I start? Exact of mistakes, I think a common one is being very. We focused as business owners. You know, we're excited about what we're offering, and we think, you know, here's what we think is cool, but really, does it matter to your customer, and is it tapping into where they are right now? There's a saying in copywriting that you need to enter the conversation already going on in their minds about their problem that you're going to help them solve. And you have to be able to find that and tap into it very quickly, because we don't have a whole lot of time to capture attention. So you have to find that pain point pretty quickly and then be able to build rapport and basically grab them by the hand and take them where you want to go. And a common mistake I see is that you get so focused on what we or I think about our stuff that business owners can lose sight of what it is that's important to their audience. And then a second mistake is really not having your personality in it, being too formal in your writing and thinking, this is the way I have to write it to make it sound official. And no, you know what? These days, especially with social media, people like to know who's behind the brand. And if you're an Expert, you're a speaker, a trainer, or what have you, your personality definitely needs to come through because you are the brand.

Yeah. So backing up then about tapping into the pain of your audience and everybody watching this show right now has a different audience. What are some ways that the listeners or viewers today can do that? How can they be more accurate about finding out the pain? Are there certain methods that you use?

There are, and I'll have a handout later in the show to help with that. Really, one of my favorite techniques is to talk to your target audience. So if you have customers, like, find your perfect customers in your customer base, those who are raving fans about what you do and interview them. I have about 15 research questions that I typically do when working with clients. And if you can record those interviews and then transcribe it and what that does, it gives you the actual words and phrases they're using to talk about their pain, to talk about the solution that they want, to talk about the struggles and how they're feeling about their problem. And then it's. It eliminates the guesswork. You don't have to figure it out because they're telling you exactly what to say and what I found. When you can work those exact words and phrases in and basically regurgitate back to them what they've said and tap on the pain points that they said trigger those emotions that they say they have about that problem, it's like your copyrights itself. And then they say, wow, you really understand me. You told me what to say. Yeah.

I mean, that really is rapport building because everybody has a different filter. And some words maybe they hear and some words they don't even hear. Right. And I think we say things all the time. We don't even realize that we're saying, man, we make it so much more complicated, Jenny. Like we're trying to figure this out. Why don't we just ask our customers?

Right, Exactly.

We'll be sharing that in a moment here on how you can get those questions, Jenny. So can you share some tips on, let's say, email marketing, how to do.

It better and easier. Most importantly, you know where to get started.

I mean, there's always. It's not just one way, but what have been like when you think of some of your highest converting emails, what were some of the ingredients of those?

Honestly, a lot of it again is starting with that pain point. That's how you break through to me and create that instant connection and get them to keep reading. Like if they click to open and you don't grab them instantly, it's all over, right? And so when I create email campaigns, come at the conversation from the same angle over and over and over again. And that is another mistake that some companies make, that they keep sending out basically the same message over and over. And really, when you look at your audience, there are different subgroups within the audience, and different things will matter to different people. So if you hit the conversation from multiple angles, different pain points, different benefits, that really helps. So shake it up. Essentially, I like to do that. And I actually have been breaking down into a more formal structure. You know how I go through and do that. And that's one of the resources that comes out of what I'll be sharing later today. But really, look at all the different pain points, look at the benefits. Start the conversation there, and basically you want to grab attention very quickly and then figure out, like we map out, we know, here's where we're starting and here's where we want to end up. What's that bridge? You need to create a nice bridge to quickly turn it from. I have your attention. Let's turn it and show you where we're going to go and how. My solution, here's why I'm writing, because I know how to solve this problem for you. So in addition to having those different angles, you know, a writing tip that can help that I found to be tremendously helpful for myself as a. Even as a professional. One of the things that stops you, I think, from writing easily or to, you know, one reason it turns into such a huge black is that we have this editor in our head that's constantly chattering, saying, oh, that's not the right way. Oh, this isn't the perfect way to do it. And what I found. Oh, yeah, right. It's a very strong nagging voice. And what I found is if you get a timer, whether it's on your phone or a kitchen timer, set it for like 25 minutes and turn everything off and do nothing but write. Even if it's just, I hate writing. I don't know what to say. You have to keep writing. And if you force yourself to do that, eventually you train your brain to just shut off the editor and get it out on the page. Because the whole point is just to get it out of your head and then you can clean it up. So if I have. When I'm starting a sales letter or I have dozens of emails, I have to write rather than thinking about what's the best way to start this one, I just do a Brain dump. And I'll have one document with like all the different ideas that are running through my head because once it's out, it's so much easier to clean it up.

Yeah. Oh, I love that idea. I love that idea. Otherwise you're just stuck in analysis paralysis.

Yeah. And another thing you can do if copywriting isn't your full time job. And even as a copywriter, I find this is hard. It is really hard to switch from being creative and tuning into that inner voice of what you need to be hearing to put out to the world versus all the other things that we're doing. The more tasky things. Like it's two different sides to your brain. So I've really learned that for me personally, I can't do anything tasky in the morning. I have to. That's my quiet time. My brain is fresh. I can hear the voice that's telling me what to write. And I do the writing in the morning. And then when I get tired, then I move into the tasky things. But it's really hard to say I have to do all these things. And then quick, let me write an email to my list. Very difficult. So find that quiet spot where your brain is really still and create a time in your day where you can do that.

Yeah. Because it's hard to go from left brain analytical to right brain creative where it's. That's such good advice. And, and there's, you know, there are all kinds of email right there. I mean, you can like get short to the point. You could do story, you know, coming from a story, like a parable, you know, all kinds. And you know, you do all those things and you do that well. What do you think about email marketing? Do you feel, I mean, you hear this. Email marketing's dead. Email marketing is not dead. It's still the best way of communicating with people. What are your thoughts on that?

I am firmly in the camp of pro email marketing. I think it's like, you know, 20 years ago when people said books would die because everybody is moving to online book readers. Nah, you know what? Book lovers will never, ever convert completely to online books. You know, a digital book, it's just not the same.

I'm on a computer way too much.

Exactly. You have to be tactile. Right. I love to write in books and there's nothing like it. And I think the same thing. For now, email is fantastic and maybe that'll change over time. But I still think it plays a really critical role, especially if you take the time to nurture your email list. Now, if you're not nurturing it, you don't talk to it, or you're not giving good content and at the same time asking for the sale occasionally, then it's not going to work for you. But I think it definitely plays a role. So it's great to have an online following with social media, but what can you do to get them over to your email list and communicate with them? It's a much more intimate way to communicate.

Well, you said something just now asking for the sale. So what do you think is a good rhythm from just straight content, no offers, to making offers? What do you think is a good balance?

I think it's really good if you're doing mostly content, to always have a call to action. And that's a mistake I made with my illness, like I was. So, you know, I'm a shy marketer. I'm not very good about nurturing my list. I haven't been. And Alex kicked me in the butt about that years ago, so I have him to thank for that as well. And what I learned is, you know, I spent so much time sending out really good tips and I never asked for the sale and it's a mistake. There's a way that you can do it without being highly promotional, like share a lesson. Every email or share a helpful resource, share a tip, but then always at some point flip it and say, basically it's an invitation. If you're ready to learn more about the thing that I just shared with you today, here's where you can go to take that next step and gets under the radar because you're educating, you're helping, you're showing people that you're going to share good content with them. But then you should always have that invitation to take the next step. And it's not so much, I think in terms of you need to put it out there to increase your sales. Of course, that's nice. But if you do it from a space of I'm offering an invitation to let you take the next step if you're ready. If this is resonating and now is your time, then that's how to do it. And then you can mix in the straight promotions like, hey, this is the sale we have going on. It's time to buy, right?

And then what about. I think that's so smart because you have people, they're interested, they want to learn more. So you're missing out. What about adding in? What are your thoughts on adding in, you know, urgency, like, you know, only this many seats, only this much time and so forth, what are your thoughts?

You have to do it. I mean, even if some of your or most even of your audience knows that it's just a technique, it still works, you know, it still works. That's why we do it. Even if we see what the marketer is doing, it still impacts you, and it's because it's speaking to a different part of your brain. You know, deep down, that very reptilian part of our brain has a fear of missing out, and it has a fear of not having the resources that other people are getting, and that's what it's tapping into. So I think it's really important to use as much as you can the piece. For me, and I think for many marketers, especially as we're moving into a space and we have moved into a space where it's important to be truthful and authentic and all that, make sure you're doing it. And it actually is true.

Yeah, definitely. I think that we are creatures of habit and we can procrastinate till, you know, like the end of the world. Right. I'll get to it tomorrow. I'll get to it tomorrow. And I think people are so inundated that if we are not moved to make a decision, then you miss out. Maybe it's not the right fit, maybe it's not your time. That's a different story. But if it's something that you really want and it's calling you, if you aren't urged in some way to move forward, then, you know, a year goes by and all those other people step forward and have made the changes in whatever way, whether you're talking about gardening or you're talking about classical piano, or you're talking about business. Right. So, you know, I think that they. We have to be called into action at some point. And that's my thought about it.

Oh, absolutely. And when I'm working with event marketers, especially those who are newer to the game, like, I'm like, you have to keep the pressure on right up until the day the darn thing starts, and even after, because there are people who are sitting on the fence, and sometimes they're there and they know it and they just haven't decided, and other times they literally do forget. So it's really more of a helpful tip that you're offering or a helpful service that you offer to keep reminding them. And if you look at it, especially if you're in a business and offering something that is helping somebody transform themselves or their Business, you know, there can be some reluctance like I don't want to bug them, I don't want to be a pest, but really, I say shift it. Reframe what you're doing to. You're providing a service and you're kind of calling to their higher self and you're holding a space for them to transform. And by putting out that repeated urgent offer and like saying, hey, it's time, it's your time, you're really helping create a space for them to step up and be more of who they want to be.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, I have some people that have been on my list now since 19, 1996.

Yeah.

Oh my gosh. I ran into someone in the grocery store not long ago who I used to work when I had my homeopathic practice and he goes, oh, I still get your emails. I'm like, you've got to be kidding. After all, you're still on the envelope. That's awesome. Long copy, short copy. I mean, you know, there's long sales pages, then short sales page. What are your thoughts? So confusing.

It is. And of course as a good marketer, I'll say you have to test it. But I think you need to look at how much you're charging, what type of offer you're making and who you're marketing to. So if it's a low cost offer that's more of an impulse buy, you don't need a huge sales page. Right. If it's seven bucks, you're basically trying to get somebody to convert from a prospect to a customer. You don't need a lot of copy if you're marketing something to a group of people who absolutely adore you. Like when you send out our invites to the Pinnacle group, we don't need to know really much about the event. We just need to know when it is and where we go to buy our ticket. Right. When you're promoting to people who don't know you though, they're going to need more information because they have questions. There are many, many choices out there for training, for products, for pretty much anything that we sell. And that's where I think longer copy can come into play. I think it still works really well. You just have to make sure that however you're presenting it in that sales page is easy to scan through. So that's why the style of page, you know, it's probably been eight years ago. I call it the mindvalley style because they were the ones who really I saw pushing it out there where like the Background changes on your sales letter every couple of paragraphs. And it's just to draw our very distractible brains down the page. Right. So you use subheads, you, different background colors, use bullet points, add video, add graphics, do something to really engage the eye and use those subheads to meet a. To tap into the questions that they have about whatever it is that you're offering. Hit the benefits and hit the questions.

Yeah, so it really is about that. The questions, the pain, the promise. Whether it's an email or social media post, it's all just different formats. But really what you're saying is that you just. It's about connecting and capturing your ideal client's attention.

Yep. What questions do they have? What's already happening in their head when they think about that problem that you're helping them solve? And then likewise, what do they say they want? So what are those benefits that you're going to deliver to them? Because if they're seeing those things, they already know it resonates. Then your copy resonates because it's striking something within them.

Yeah, Honestly, copy is everything. It really is. And I know we did a live stream last year and we. During the live stream, we just were not getting a response like we normally did of people opting in. We changed the title three times, like in the middle of it, and then all of a sudden we started getting a lot more opt in. So I'm sharing that. For those of you that feel like you're doing webinars, you're doing things and you're not getting the response, don't be afraid to make some changes. You know, I mean, you were doing some emails for us. We were like, jenny, the emails. The title's changing now. So I think that's. I think that's really important. And so is there anything that you do to get inspired for writing? I mean, you know, sometimes it's, I think, hard to just sit and start writing. You do it because you do it all the time. But what do you recommend to people that are listening to this to say, you know, I really want to get more creative in my copywriting. What are some tips on that?

For me, it's a lot of getting in tune with my inner self. Like, when I write, I can't have music on. I can play exciting music to get myself jazzed up, get my energy level up, but I can't have music with words because I can almost like here. You know how we all have an inner voice that's constantly talking to us, and sometimes we listen and Other times, we tune it out. I have a voice like that for my writer, and I can kind of feel the words. And sometimes it's frustrating because my fingers can't keep up with how fast she's talking. So I have to find a play, like, get my brain quieted down and sort of zenned out. And actually, the number one song I play on my phone is the sound of a box fan. Because I just need. I need white noise, and that shuts down everything. Like, I need to go within, and I think that can help. So find a way to really. You would need to have your body relax. Like, I find sitting in a chair all day long is really, really hard. So yoga helps. Exercise helps to loosen up the body. It's like meditation in a way, Right? You need to loosen up your body and then just quiet the mind. So that helps. And then I also find, like, I love to learn things. So if I go out and I invest in a little education, you know, watch a video somewhere or go through an online training course, do a module there, that. That helps me. It inspires me because it helps me get more in touch with what I do and where I want to take my business, which then just feeds back to what I do for a living. So I'd find a way that would, you know, find something that gets you jazzed up, but quiets the mind so that you can get in touch with those words that are in there.

At first I thought, is that a song? The box band.

Hey, there we go. It's literally a box fan. A big, square, boring, old box fan. It just plays this lovely, lovely white noise that, like, within minutes, it quiets my brain right down.

That's awesome. That's awesome. Now, you've been in Pinnacle now almost two complete years. Our Pinnacle Global Network, which is our private mentoring and mastermind where we work with business owners all over the world. Do you mind sharing a few words on what the experience has been for you and your business? Sure.

For me, it has been phenomenal in terms of getting around other people who have bigger businesses, because as a writer, like, you come into this field as a solopreneur, essentially. You know, when I graduated from journalism school, let's just say when you look back, ooh. The salaries. Salary predictions were not good at all. And so I've always had sort of the solopreneur mindset. I've run my business for 20 years from home because that was really important for me to be available for my kids. But I've had this vision for a Long time about where I wanted to take it and grow it into something much bigger than Jenny being a freelance writer.

Right.

But knowing you want to do it and then knowing how to create that energetic space, really, to get your mindset shifted is really hard, because if you've never experienced it, how can you possibly do it? Right. And so the first event I went to, so the secret is, like, the first project I did for you was rewriting this Pinnacle sales page. And the occupational hazard for me is every time I write something, I end up buying it. So I was like, I'm totally doing this program. So at the first level up live, I went to, like, the second you made the offer, I was at the back table checking in with Jennifer. Like, here, take my credit card. I'm ready to sign up. But the thing that really cemented it for me was just being in that space of being able to talk to people who had bigger businesses, who had already been down that path, and using that to create a bigger shift in my energy. Like, I could see more like, I can do something if I can model what somebody else is doing, because I've seen that person and that person standing in that space of running a really successful multimillion dollar business, it becomes easier to model it.

Yeah. Yeah. Well, it's been really exciting to watch you grow. And, you know, and it's that I think that a lot of business owners are in the place where you have been, where you are, the product or service. And that's, you know, that's what scale or fail is all about. Right. It's how do we duplicate and replicate what we do so that we can reach more people and it doesn't have to be you 24 7. Right.

It's amazing. Yeah.

So it's been great. Jenny, working with you and all the work that you do really is about helping people scale because it's about getting your customers and whoever's listening, your customers, your message out to many more people. So don't keep your businesses a secret.

Right.

So you have this great download where you've got the questions so that we can get clear on our target audience and some other wonderful things. How do people find that?

Well, I think we're gonna put it in your library. Right. We're gonna put the handout there. So it's a handout call what makes your customers tick. And it's the research questions I use in my business that I've been using in my business pretty much since I started to dive into the mindset. And then within that Resource. You'll also find a link where you can go to my site and sign up for a short video training series where I walk you through the questions and explain in more depth how I use each of them to do things like we had talked about. Find those pain points, find the benefits that people want, and then how to use those as a springboard into stronger copywriting.

Fantastic. So to get that this sounds so fan, I'm going to download it on my own page. So go to Allisonmaslon.com library and it's a fantastic resource. And honestly, I think people throw thousands of dollars away and missed opportunities because they're not taking the time to ask the right questions.

Yes. And then tying back to what you said earlier, Bean, you have great advice that if you're something isn't working, it's not the tool necessarily. Keep playing with your copy because there is so much play that you can make with the copywriting. I mean, like you said with your. Your example of the title, so much opportunity if you just keep experimenting versus throwing something up and hoping that it works.

Yeah, fantastic. And if someone wants to just say they're like, I want to work with Jenny. She's got to write my copy. How do they reach you?

Best way to go, my website. Jenny or Jenny Hamby? No, seminarmarketingpro.com is the place to find me. And LinkedIn if you're on LinkedIn.

Okay. Fantastic. Seminar. Marketingpro.com Jenny Hamby, this is awesome. Thank you for coming and sharing your brilliance with our audience today. And I appreciate you being here with me.

Oh, thank you for having me. It is always a joy to see you.

So thank you all for joining us today. If you haven't grabbed a copy of my books, Scale or Fail, you can get it at Barnes and Noble. You can get it on Amazon. And if you want to learn more about scaling, go to alisonmousen.com CEO and until next time, you can find the Scale or fail show on All Things Podcast. We have an audio version, we have a video version. Whatever suits or floats your boat. So until next time, get out there, elevate yourself because you are worth it. Bye, everybody. People always talk about they want to be part of seven figure companies.

I'm now part of seven, eight and nine figure companies.

I've been introduced to some of the.

Largest corporations, Fortune 500 companies, and it's with Alice help. She's kind of expanded my horizons and my capabilities. And I think that's the most important thing.

Where she expands, she makes you know what you can do and be successful at that. Being with Alison and being able to learn who to hire and why to hire and how to develop a passionate.

Creative, inspired team was really, really important.

For me because I needed to shift some energy in my business.

And I feel like with her help, I've really done that. Pinnacle helped me grow my company to where at this point a year ago.

I made a million more than I did at this point last year.

So I really wanted to break that ceiling. I've hit that ceiling for several years in a row and Pinnacle has helped me do that by implementing the thought. It's actually just a thought process and how you view your company and how you view what you're doing. I think a lot of us entrepreneurs.

Are hard on ourselves and are hard.

On our companies when it's not that we shouldn't be that way. So I think it's just looking at things a little bit differently, putting into practice the systems that she teaches us.

For example, if you want an example.

Putting people in place to where I want my business to be at in two, three years. So I've got people right now in place.

And it's wild.

It's just like it's. All the work is coming in and we're in place and we're not stressed out. And it's just amazing. It's just an amazing place to be. What I love most about being in the Pinnacle is constant access to support. So whether it be my mastermind group or the recorded resources that Alison has produced for us, or the constantly cutting edge information that's coming to us on social media, Facebook ads, how to conduct webinars, you name it, we have a resource for it.

So since joining Pinnacol, we've added 12.

New positions to the company.

We've increased revenue about 43%. We've increased profit by 111% this year. More importantly, I've gotten out of some roles that I was in, like QA manager. And some of the marketing things that I was doing are now outsourced. Not outsourced, insource to a team member. And I've really focused in on running the business instead of letting it run me. Coaching opportunities out there. And a lot of times I'm a little bit suspicious. It's kind of a sales job. Are they in it for themselves? Are they in it for me? And at no time have I ever felt with Pinnacol that my best interest was not number one priority. And it's truly an organization and not just Allison and the coaches, but everyone there it's coming from a place of giving and working for mutual benefit. A lot, a lot of sharing going on and that's a great team to work with right off the bat. I laid a foundation for my coaching practice and I increased my prices and within one week I had signed two.

High paying clients that had basically paid for my coaching program with Alison. And since then my income has doubled every single month.

It's been tremendous. But being a part of the community has been the greatest asset. I've been so fortunate and blessed to be friends. So many other amazing entrepreneurs who I learn from on a regular basis who always have my back, like minded people that I surround myself with and the environment is so positive. I just cannot speak highly enough of it and I am always compelled to share it with everyone I know. I feel it is the biggest gift to introduce and share this opportunity to connect with this kind of people, community, with everybody that I know.

Don't be the company like I was being in business for over 12 years, looking back and saying, what did I do in the last 10 years? Do it now.

Now is all we have.

We don't have the past and we.

Don'T have the future.

All we have is now.

I've been in business for 21 years now and I've worked with a number of business coaches and I watched Alison.

For four years and the results that.

Her clients had when they worked with her. And I finally decided this is the next coach that I'm going to hire because she is the real deal. She is available to her people.

She absolutely cares deeply about each and every individual and the success of their business.

And you know what, we have to.

In business take risks.

And sometimes taking risk is hiring that new coach.

This is a risk worth taking.

There is nothing like it.

I can't even explain what the opportunity and the learning that comes with Pinnacle. Don't even think about it because if you think about it, and that's the number one thing that will hold you back.

Just do it. You won't regret it.

You just need to do it.

I mean, you have to stop being on the fence.

You have to get off the. The fence is boring.

The fence is.

Honestly, I was on the fence for.

Oh gosh.

I was on the fence for maybe.

Two years and it was a horrible.

Fence to sit on. I hated the fence because the fence kept me stuck. And it was when I finally jumped off the fence that my business skyrocketed. Sam.