Listening to Your Market to Increase Your Profit

Hello, friends, I'm Amanda Barr.

And I'm Rebecca Lou Brennan. And welcome to Dance Principals United, the podcast.

Together, we are passionate about helping studio owners with the business of running their studio.

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This is the Dance Principles United podcast.

Well, hello, Hope you are super amazing today. It is Beck here on the podcast, excited to chat to you all. And I have someone a little bit different with me today. We have one of our studio growth club members, Nikki, here. How are you going, Nikki?

I'm well, how are you?

I'm super amazing. I'm super pumped to have you here. Now, Nikki and I were doing a one on one session the other day and some of the stuff she was saying was just so great and she's such a leader in our industry and I thought it'd be so cool to have her on today and, and chat to you guys. But first of all, Nikki, I thought, let us know a little bit about your background. Now you run the edge in Ride, is that right? In New South Wales. And I know that you were an amazing performer when you were younger. You did all the things you did, the ballet, you did the musical theater. Just tell me a little bit about your background first and tell everyone out there a bit about your background.

Sure. Well, I like to say that I have, and it's very true, been in this industry for 47 years. I can't believe it. I started dancing when I was three. I mostly did ballet. There wasn't all those genres back then when we were younger, you know what I mean? Like ballet was the basic. We started with ballet and then I added jazz and, and went from there. I never had the privilege of doing tap, unfortunately, because my parents worked their backsides off to put me through dancing. So I'm super grateful for that. After I finished at my local studio in the Sutherland Shire, I got accepted to Waapa and I didn't finish my year 12, but I got accepted. 400 people auditioned and I was one of the 20 that got accepted into the diploma course and I studied over there with the beautiful now late Dame Lucette Aldis. And gosh, she was an amazing mentor for me. So I studied over at WAPA for a few years and then after that I got into a contemporary dance company called Ducks, which Swan, which is now defunct, unfortunately. And then from there I found my voice and I started singing. I worked for Bruce Leslie Scott for Dance Encore Production, toured around as a showgirl, singing and dancing. I've also Then came back to Sydney and then I got my RID teacher certificate because I've been doing RID forever and have taught in the USA at the Atlanta Ballet. I've taught, I've taught in Melbourne, I've taught everywhere. And then came back to Sydney, got married and then the studio.

Yeah, that is crazy. And so what made you, what made any of us, really. But what made you buy a dance studio? Like, was it your family? Was it just feeling a bit crazy that day?

Probably crazy because I was pregnant at the time with my son. So, yeah, absolutely. I always said to myself I'd never own a dance studio, funnily enough. And here we are some years later. I, I don't know, I felt it was the right time in my life. I'm always one of those people who like to seek and explore and expand and do all those things. I love training, I love educating myself. That's part of probably one of the biggest things about me. I love educating myself so then I can pass on that knowledge to the next generation. So for me, that was a great time. I've had my family, I'd got all those bits and pieces in, in place and I guess that I just. Yeah, it was the right time.

I love that. I love that. So you bought your studio and how much, when you bought your studio, did you know about business and. And how much did you know about teaching dance? Because I feel like, well, you know my story, obviously, and, you know, Nikki and I are lucky enough to have been very good friends for a long time now. But, you know, we all buy our studio because we're passionate about kids and teaching kids. Did we really know that much about business? That's the first question I want to ask you.

I knew nothing about business. It was just one of those things. I so excited. Yeah, I'm going to have this amazing dance studio and I'm going to put everything that I've learned into, into place and just run it and it's going to be so easy.

So. So you buy this studio and you think it's all going to be sunshine and rainbows, which we all did, and then you realized it wasn't sunshine and rainbows. So tell me about that journey, because I feel like most of us in our studio journey and you're, you know, running a very successful studio now, but I think we all hit that rock bottom point where we're just like, oh, my gosh, this is not what I was expecting it to be.

100%. I, I guess the journey was, you know, as I said, you know, love, loved, wanted, wanting to pass on my knowledge to the next generation and just sort of going. Going on the fly with everything, you know, not really doing any kind of CPD with business, you know, doing all the CPD for dance training and dancing and all of that, but not the back end. The most important, the administrative side, even though I had worked in a high school as an administrator and done all those things, wasn't really focused on that enough. And so therefore, when I took over the studio, the previous culture obviously wasn't the kind of culture that I wanted to have in my studio, and it was just a bit of a slow change into that. But I don't know, I just sort of. I. So I guess. I guess it sort of hit rock bottom with not managing my finances correctly and then. Then doing all the right things and it all going quite well. Pre covered, possibly moving into a new space and then the hit the fan, excuse my French. And yeah, it just. It just plummeted. And yeah, that was my lowest point, being in so much debt after trying to move premises during COVID And. Yeah, it was crazy.

I think. I think you're not alone there, because I think the majority of studio owners ended up in a lot of debt after Covid. Like, it was just such a time where we were. Didn't know what to do. We didn't know if we were doing the right things. Like, it was absolutely crazy. So you've completely pivoted now, which is very impressive. And the thing that I wanted to talk about most today was you pivoted to what your local community was. And I think a lot of us don't recognize this enough and don't think enough about the types of clients that we're bringing in. So the first thing I wanted to bring up was I know that you have a big Chinese community in and around your area and that you've really pivoted your business to accommodate them, which is really impressive because you're not Chinese.

No, no, there's no Chinese in my blood. But, yeah, I think it's. I think it's. It took me a while to come to this realization. I was trying to do everything my way. My way. It's always, always, you know, I'm the right way. This is how it should be. And not really listening to my clients, not really listening to the people who are surrounding me. And I probably. Maybe about what, three years ago, I went, this is not working. I'm. It's. It's not. I'm not attracting the right people. I'M not getting enough people through my doors. I need to start listening some more. And I think that was my pivotal point when I started changing things around.

Yeah. And so I've seen that, like, even on your website, you have, like, the Chinese language on your website. Tell me some other things that you've done to incorporate that into your studio. Sure.

Besides having somebody translate my website into Chinese for that. For them as well. We have been doing things like, you know, the Lunar Festival for the Chinese community is such a big, big deal. It's like their Christmas. So I've really tried to embrace that each and every year. Unfortunately, it doesn't always fall within our school period. So things have to change. But make a big deal about the Lunar Festival. I decorate the studio with all the decorative ornaments Chinese community would use for the festival. We attend the festival events, the kids get involved, we give out little red envelopes with little gifts for them because that's part of their custom and their culture. Some other bits and pieces that we've done, gosh, my mind's gone blank. But there's been other things that we have done to embrace our Chinese community.

And that is like, next level. And, you know, we talk a lot on the podcast about customer service and really like, making your customers feel special. And that is so insane. Like, you haven't just said, happy Luna and that's it. Like, you've actually gone to the trouble of decorating, giving presents out, going to their festivals, like, that is next level. And I think we all need to realize that to really make an impact in your community, you have to give that kind of customer service. You have to do that special stuff. You've got to show people that you care in other ways other than, than just teaching dance. I truly believe that, that, that community is absolute key, Right?

Absolutely. I mean, you always say, you guys always say that you, you, you need to listen and find those pain points of, of our customers. And, and I think that's, like, I said that when I started listening some more and having conversations with people are just about, you know, how busy. Because a lot of our clients, they, they do everything. They've got violin lessons, they've Chinese school, tutoring, gymnastics, drawing classes. It's so. Their lives are so crazy. And I think it comes from a lot of them who have migrated to Australia. They, they as children themselves, the parents as children themselves over in China didn't get those opportunities. So they want to give their children in Australia all the opportunities they can because they missed out as a kid. And that's what I find. And I didn't know that until I started asking questions and started listening and talking to my clients some more.

I love that. I love that. Now we were on a call the other day, you and I, and you had this brainstorming idea and I don't think you've started it yet, but I was like, that is so smart and I actually want to copy it. But again, it's you listening to your clients. Right. And going, okay, this is the problem. How can I navigate it? What can I do to fix it? Do you want to tell everyone out there about that?

Sure. So we tried to run different workshops. You know, they used to work in the past, but they're not working for us anymore. The kind of workshops that most dance studios will run. So I once again started listening and chatting to people and realizing that a lot of my clients, you know, they, they are high end. They, they do, they do a lot of ballet and that is my forte obviously. And they love exams and that kind of thing. They do those things outside of the studio as well. But what I was find, you know, the kids were dropping classes or they weren't coming to the workshops because they had to go to Chinese tutoring or maths and English tutoring and because they need to get into selective high school or oc, all those things. So I had a bit of a thought that I would probably introduce a new program where we're going to do a workshop or introduce it into my timetable for 2025 where we do dance and we do tutoring. So they'll do dance classes at the stud and then they'll go next door and they'll do tutoring and then they'll come back maybe English tutoring, then they'll come back to do another dance class and then they'll go back and do maths tutoring. Something along those lines. Yeah.

That's incredible. And like I love this even for my school and I think I've got a different community where I am. But you know, we still have those high end kids that want to do well at their schooling as well as well at their dance. And as a parent, like I would love that to be completely honest. Like even for bb, I would love to have, okay, she does a couple of dance classes, then she does some tutoring and then she goes back to her dance classes or however it works timetable wise. I just think any high school parent really is going to be so impressed by that. And I assume you'll just find a tutor that will be able to do that or how are you going to run that? Have you even thought about that? I'm like putting you right out there now.

I have started thinking about it and just putting some dot points down about how I'm going to approach this. But I think it was just more me talking to our clients and just seeing whether the idea that I had flagged was going to work. And a lot of them have said they really love it because it's like the one stop shop for them. They don't have to farm their kid back and forth from venue to venue. They just drop, go, they get to go home, do their cooking, do their whatever they're doing and then, and then come back. So I love that.

And if you're not a parent out there yet and you don't know what it's like, it is so crazy to run these kids around all the time. I can't even begin to tell you, you know what I'm talking about, Nikki. And like your life, you do literally just feel like a taxi and then you're trying to get stuff done at home as well and if you work as well, it is just so tricky. And I think sometimes we as studio owners forget how hard those parents lives can be. And you know, even I had a ballet teacher, a new ballet teacher come in the other day, Nikki, and she said, how strict are you with buns and hair? And I know you're probably really strict at your school, but I was like, not really strict because kids are coming straight from school to my studio. Most of them are car pulling. They've probably ripped their hair out during the day anyway. Like, I'm grateful that the kids are there in the first place. I'm not then going to get cranky at a six year old that their hair is not in a bun. Like it's just so I think sometimes we just have to be a little bit understanding of that. What, what are your thoughts on that? You're probably the absolute opposite. You're like, everyone has a bun.

You know, funnily enough, I think over the 13 years I have softened a little bit and much more understanding, especially being a parent, I am definitely more understanding. I do encourage the bun because it's really important, all that sort of stuff. But if they don't come in with the bun, I'll actually do it for them. So I just get the stuff out and I put their hair in a bun and I, and then I'll just politely remind the parent and, and educate them because a lot of the parents don't Understand why they need to have their hair in. Their child needs to have their hair in a bun. They don't, they don't get it. So it's just about educating them.

Yeah, I totally agree. I love that. And it really is about educating parents. Like, I always talk about the stockings under the leotard thing. Like, nowhere else in any society ever, apart from Superman, would we ever put stockings. But it's true. Like, why would anybody think that that is normal? It is not normal at all. It's undies, then stockings.

It's so true. Even leotard's going on back to front, you know, because, you know, our logo is on the back. But they put their leotard around the wrong way and it's like, well, I'm thinking to myself, that must feel so uncomfortable for that child. We're not that kind of studio. We don't have.

We don't.

Haven't gone back to the 80s where we're doing, you know, a physical and the, the G string leotards. But yeah, I mean, that's educating, right? You don't, you don't get it unless you're actually told. Because it's not. Yeah, they don't get it.

Not ingrained. And I think that's. Yeah, I'm always talking about that. I'm always self reflecting on that because it's. Just because I know it and because I grew up with it, doesn't mean that everybody else has known it and grown up with. Um. All right, I want to ask you a question. If you were speaking right now to someone who wanted to open a studio or start a studio or buy a studio, what would be your biggest advice to them?

Gosh, that's a loaded question, isn't it? There is so much advice I could give to somebody, but I think the biggest thing, apart from all, you know, doing your backend work with your admin and your bookkeeper and accountant, getting all those checks and licenses into place, is to just stay in your own lane and don't worry about the noise around you. For me, that took such a long time for me to not worry about what every other studio around me was doing and just trust myself and my processes and trust the vision and the dream that I had as a studio owner and where I want it, it's changed slightly over the years, but I think it's just stop worrying about what everybody else is doing.

I love that. And it's. It's not just other studios. It's even parents. Like, you know, when you get parents who See on Instagram what that other school's doing, and then they're like, oh, you should do that. And then as a studio, and you're like, okay, I better do that now. And then you do it, and then you're like, that was dumb, because that's really not me. And I didn't want to do that in the first place. And I. I've definitely been that in my journey as well. And, like, it's such an important thing for you guys out there to really know what you want out of your business. It's. I was talking to one of our SJC members the other day, and she was like, I feel lost in the business. And it's. I. We worked out exactly that. Nikki. It's because she's trying to make everybody happy instead of doing what she wants to do. And therefore, you know, she's just kind of all over the place. And I think staying true to what you truly want is so important. How have you done that? Like, if you've written down exactly what you want, do you just know it in yourself? Like, you know, do you think every idea of something new that comes to you, do you go back to your. Why? Like, how do you do that?

I think I tend to write. I'm very old school. I tend to write down a whole bunch of things and then just sort of work out from there where I'm headed. But I. It's more of a feeling, too, you know, and things are constantly changing. We're ever evolving. Society where things are. It's like a river, right? It's constantly moving, ebbs and flows. And so I think it's just like, I go back to being a great listener. I mean, I. I tell my students that these things at the side of your head are the best asset you'll ever have. Be a great listener, listen to people. Don't. And. And from there, you can make really informed decisions and. And take great pathways into moving forward to your dream goal or your dream, whatever it might be.

I love that. And I love that, like, with the tutoring, you're starting to ask your clients, is this something you want? You're not just doing it, you're actually, like, putting it out there and going, okay, is this something that we want, or is this not really something that we want? Like, that's so important, right? But also, like you said, staying true to yourself is. Is so, so important as well. Absolutely. Awesome. Well, it has been incredible chatting to you today, Nikki. You have been just so amazing. You've had huge growth in your studio this year especially. Right. Like, you're just getting bigger and bigger and bigger. My last question to you is, what do you think has made that happen? Like, you know, you've had times of no growth and now you're having the growth. Like, what is the one main thing that you think is getting you to kind of go up the staircase now instead of just staying at the bottom stair?

Holding myself to account is being the biggest thing. And. And I guess looking at my numbers every single week and just checking in, checking with myself, checking my stuff, just. Yeah, being accountable for everything. And, you know, getting those Facebook ads out there too.

God, Nathan's gonna be frothing over that. But it's true, right? So we, as our monthly session we just did in SGC was literally on numbers. And, you know, I've said this to you guys before, but every single Monday, I check my preschool numbers, my class placements for preschool, my main school numbers, my class places for main school, and my revenue. That is every Monday at 8am, the very first thing I do in the week. And that means that I'm setting the week on, you know, what's happening in my studio, how are things going? And I know Nathan does so much work with everyone on that, but it is such a game changer, guys, just to know those little things is such a game changer. Because the problem with us as studio owners is we just run all the time and we forget to work on our business. But when it's slapping you in the face every week, Nikki, you've got to kind of work on it. You've got to work on it. You just. You're so consistent, Nikki. And you're always, you know, Nikki's on every call. She's listening to all the things. She's open to ideas. She's just such a person that just keeps doing the things and. And that's where we see the growth always. So, yeah, you're absolutely incredible and. And so fun to be around as well. Always. The life of the party, you gotta laugh.

It's really important. Laughter is important in life, right?

Yep. Well, thank you so much, Nikki. It has been absolutely incredible. I'm sure you guys got so much out of that. But have a little think about your community. How can you pivot things? Who are your clients in and around you? Do you need to hold a lunar festival? Do you need to, you know. No, I'm serious though, guys. Listen. Listen to your community. Look at your community and. And think about how you can really support them, because that's that's so smart, what Nikki's done. Thanks so much for coming on, Nikki. We hope you all have an incredible week and we will see you next week. Bye, everyone.

Bye.

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