Wanna Know Where To Find Your Best Team Members?

Hello, friends. I'm Amanda Barr.

And I'm Rebecca Lou Brennan. And welcome to Dance Principles United, the podcast.

Together, we are passionate about helping studio owners with the business of running their studio.

Join us as we talk everything from marketing systems, studio culture, motherhood, life, and everything in between.

This is the Dance Principles United podcast. Hey, friends, and welcome to another episode of the Dance Principles United podc. I am so excited. We're in a bit of a fancy studio today.

It is very fancy here at Opus Media. I'm feeling so special in the amazing podcast room. They've even put pink lights up for us.

It's pretty cool. Gotta love that. So you do need to check this out on YouTube because we have upped our game so that you can watch us on YouTube as well as listen to us in your ears. But we're super excited. It's looking very nice. I was just saying to Tom, though, I feel like I need a chili margarita to go with my shirt. You do make the podcast even better though, right?

It would. There is a pub across the road, so we could have a sneaky Prosecco in between.

Maybe we'll do that afterwards. What do we think? So I'm excited. We're going to talk about, you know, finding leaders in your studio and bringing them up through your studio, which I'm super excited about. But first, tell me what's going on.

In the life of Beck. So much happening. God, life is so huge, isn't it? But I think the biggest exciting thing is we go to Italy in a month because Bibi and I. Oh, my.

God, that is so exciting.

My mom. Have to take my mom. She's so crazy and fun. Right.

Dance grandma.

She's so awesome. But, yeah, so really excited. We're actually going to the UK first, and Bibi's doing a photo shoot with Hamilton Theatrical, which is very exciting.

Amazing.

And then we go to the comp in Italy for a week. Shannon Atkins is there with us, which will be incredible. I adore her. Always a fun time with her. And then we're going to the Amalfi coast for five nights. Just because. Yeah, it's going to be a.

That's so good. Why don't you tell our podcast listeners the reason for your trip was your daughter BB Won Dancer of the Year.

She did. She won Showcase Dancer of the Year last year, so she won a trip to Italy to go to Worlds, which I've never experienced before. And yeah, Shannon said, like, the dance industry is very different there, so I'm super excited for that. They actually do workshops for the whole week, every day, and then they do a performance of what they learn in those workshops at the end.

Ah. So it's a little bit different to a normal calm.

It is, yeah.

That's exciting.

Yes.

What a great adventure for her. That'll be so amazing. How generous of Peter Oxford to, like, get that kind of a trip for his dancers. That's amazing.

Yeah. And I think there's, like, eight of us going or something.

So exciting. So exciting.

What's happening with you, Amanda?

Oh, what is happening with me? I'm having a bad day. I'm excited to be in these great studios, but I'm having a bad day. I. You know, one of those mornings with the girls trying to get everyone out the door. Nath, at the gym, the dog jumped up. We have this new puppy, right?

It's not a puppy anymore. It's like the size of a human.

It's the size of a human, but at six months old, and it started to stand up on the kitchen cabinets and, like, go through the lunch boxes, like, after we've made lunch and get. Take the sandwiches out. And today took the whole packet of crumpets and the whole loaf of bread off the thing, and it was just. Yeah, so it was one of those days. And then I forgot my laptop. I drove halfway here. You know, I was about an hour into the drive, and they called me going, you've forgotten your laptop. It's sitting on the desk. So I'm working the best I can off my phone.

You're crushing life.

Oh, I don't know about that. It's a bad day. It's a bad day. But, hey, we're here to talk about, you know, spotting leadership potential in your students. Do you want to talk a little bit? Like you've had heaps of students come through and end up teaching for you as well. Is it the best dancers, the loudest kids in class? What do you think? Like, you know, makes people stand out as, you know, potential leaders.

Oh, this. Look, there's so many different things, and there's so many different types of great teachers. I definitely don't think it's always the best answer, but sometimes it is.

Yes.

I also. I think the biggest thing for me is an eye for detail.

Okay.

I think that has to be really out there and that they have fun with the kids. I think that's like, I'm. You know, we get really high level kids. I know you did at your studio as well, but if you don't make it fun, they don't want to stay. And, you know, I. Even though I'm teaching high level ballet, I'm still having so much fun with them. And we're laughing and I think that's the biggest key is. And they've kind of got to be able to make fun of themselves ourselves, almost like, not in a bullying way, but just in a, like, you know, like, just to be able to keep it light. I think that is really, really important. Big voice.

Yes.

You know, you can't be quiet and teach a class of 20 kids.

You've got to use your voice. And obviously, you know, a lot of these things can be trained and you can train people on using their voice better. But some people just have a voice of authority and some people don't write. Some people can confidently speak in front of a class or a group of people, and some people can't. Sometimes there's a bit of both to that. Like, it is a learned skill, but it's got to be some sort of natural ability to it as well.

Yes. And, like, you can teach it. I've got a little girl at the moment who's teaching ballet with me, and she's a really sweet little thing.

By little girl, how old are we talking?

Oh, like 14.

Yeah. Okay. A teenager.

Yeah, yeah, sorry. I see. I see her as little girl.

It's so hard, isn't it? When she was a little girl, at.

Some point since they were two.

Yeah.

She's very quiet. Like, really quiet. But I. I do think she's going to have a good eye for detail. But I'm saying to her, like, just trying to get her to do little things. So, Lily, let's mark the role today. Let's use your big voice. And I have seen her get better. So sometimes, you don't know, sometimes they can become rock star teachers, but takes a lot more time with them.

Absolutely. Whereas I think some people just have it right. They have that natural ability. I always looked in my, you know, teens, the things, the skill sets I was looking for were people that were great with kids. Quite often they had younger siblings or something like that. I love to see the commitment levels from them. To me, that was a big thing. Not so much their natural ability, but their commitment to learning. Not just commitment to the studio, but just, you know, like, they're just a kid that just wants to be there and wants to be involved. Not a slacker, let's be honest. Not someone that was, like, slacking off. That's not what I wanted from a staff member. So I'd always Look for that. And I think, you know, sometimes if there was someone of influence in their class, because I think some kids can have influence in their. In their class, in their peer group, even if they're not the strongest, the best. But there's just that something about them that kind of creates that influence. Do you find that?

Yeah. And people that naturally will go up and help others that maybe aren't feeling comfortable or.

Yes.

You know, like, even in a tenant under troop, you can see the kid that you would say, okay, you know, Sally, can you please go up and help such and such with the choreography while I'm working on this? Like, you know, those kids that are going to be able to go up and talk to that child and help them to feel comfortable and. Yeah, I think you can definitely recognize that. But I know you had a heap of student teachers. I have huge, huge amounts of student teachers. It's insane how many we have. What do you think? How did you get them into the student teaching? Did you ask them? Did they ask you? Did you allow everyone to go in? I'm actually interested to know this myself. Okay.

So we changed it. I used to ask specific people, and that worked really, really well for me because then it was the people I wanted. Sometimes when someone would ask me, I'd be like, oh, okay, and let them in, even if I didn't feel they were right. So I used to have a smaller number of assistant teachers that were all fantastic. And most of them, I'd hand picked them. You know, it's interesting, some of them are still teaching at the studio today. Like, been at the studio teaching now for, you know, 10, 12 years. And they were part of that group where I would only ever have, like four or five at a time, but really great ones. And they'd stay with me for a long time because I gave them a lot of training, a lot of care, a lot of love early on. And that really, you know, built their skills and made them stay as well. Right. I was also able to offer them a lot of work because I only had a small number. Whereas towards the end, you know, I did change it up where it was like, application process, but everybody got a place. I do an application because I didn't want to make it too easy. So they had to fill out, like, full application forms of why they thought they should be a teacher, what they were going to do, a whole heap of things because I wanted it to be hard. But, yeah, it did mean that we had a lot, like sometimes 20 to 30 at one time, about Where I'm.

At at the moment, yes.

And some of them are great and some of them are not. There's such a hard thing though, right, because then they assistant teach for a few years and some of them, you know that you're never giving them a job. And then that's that really hard thing because they're a paying client and you've got to battle the. The fact that they're a paying client and you want to keep their parent happy and you want to keep them happy with the fact that you know that they're actually never going to be good enough to have a job at your studio. Do you have that too?

Absolutely. But I always just put them together with another teacher. That's how I combat. So when they get older, I'll put them both on a class, which I know isn't financially ideal, but it is what it is. I don't want to. I also don't want them to then leave the studio because, well, it's that thing, right?

Like, because if their parents are paying you whatever, 150 a week, is it worth losing 15 a week for that one class just to keep that parent happy? Yes, probably is. And that's what I would always kind of think about it too. So, yeah, I. Yeah, I have done that as well because I just thought, hey, you know what? But it's basically like me giving them a $15 discount a week or whatever that is for how ever much I pay them for the one class.

Yeah.

And I think sometimes you've got to think about it like that. That's. It's tricky.

It is tricky. It is tricky.

Such a tricky thing.

But I think you've got to value them as well. And sometimes I think, look, I've seen teacher training done really well in some studios. I know you have as well.

Absolutely.

And then I've seen it done really badly where the kids are just thrown in. There's no feedback, there's no watching them. There's nothing.

Sorry, sorry.

There's no feedback. There's nothing that's going to like help them along the way. It's like I said to you with Lily, I'm giving her feedback all the time and saying to her, okay, you know, do you want to. Let's try and get you to do this. I want you to go and talk to this person. So we're really big on the head teachers doing that with them. We do so much training on weekends. Like, one of the things that we noticed with our assistant teachers just a few weeks ago is they're not, not smiling enough. And especially in prison, it's so big.

Yeah, yeah.

I, I talk to them about it all the time and I, I like, I have to self reflect on my own self because I am very prone to having the resting face when I'm watching. You know what I mean?

You're having a resting face? Never. That would shock me. That's not as bad as mine.

Yeah, but like when you're teaching a child, they will see that as you either being angry with them or upset or, you know. So I'm always saying to myself when I'm teaching Beck, smile, smile at them, smile. And I think our teachers forget that. And especially when they're teaching younger kids, they need to always be smiling.

Absolutely. It's the body language too. It's not just the facial expressions, it's the body language. To me, that's a big thing. I used to. That was always my first teacher, assistant teacher training thing that we would do all the time. I would talk about body language, leaning against the wall, being nervous and covering and folding your arms. I feel like that's such a big thing that so many of them do or feel fidgeting and that, that can come across as you're bored rather than you're nervous or you're too cool or whatever that is. Right. So I think that's so, so important to really be tra. You know, that's what you started talking about was the importance of training them, not just throwing them in there and actually doing training sessions to start with and then giving them feedback. So what kind of teacher training do you do with your assistants?

Well, I actually didn't do the teacher training for that. And that's what I want to say as well. It doesn't always have to be you as the studio owner, how busy we are as show owners. My rockstar preschool, I have a few rockstar teachers, but Tanya Gould is just next level. Like she is the kind of teacher, she always puts her teacher hat on the second she walks in. And she is just the most bubbly, happy person you've ever met. And so I just said to her, can I just pay you to come out? And she loved it. To come out and talk to them about how you're bubbly, what, how to talk to them, how to talk. And she thought it was great so you could just pick a rock star like that to actually talk them through all of that sort of stuff. And I think they did a two hour training session with her on a Saturday afternoon and it was great. So I think. But what do I do with them so much?

Yep.

You know, my studio managers had one on ones with all of them. We're always giving them feedback. Our head teachers are always helping them. Some of them are assisting private lessons at the moment and then they're allowed to take 10 minutes of the private lesson to for those teachers to give them feedback like it is. It's a consistent process within the studio.

Yeah, absolutely. And I think, you know, that's important that it's some, a process that they go through. You know, we would do teacher training at least once a term just with the assistants.

Yep.

Absolute minimum. Always before their first class as well. On top of that, the teachers that had them had to speak to them about it every week after class, just as they're walking out, hey, you did a really great job with marking in the role. Please make sure next week, you know, give that correction to Susie, you know, on the side or a bit quieter. Don't interrupt me while I'm speaking, you know, whatever that is. But you can't expect them to know what to do. They're not mind readers. It's been a long time since they've been a preschooler and they're nervous. Like assistant teachers are so nervous.

Absolutely, absolutely. I wanted to go back to, you know, we're talking about training our assistant teachers, which is obviously very, very important. Absolutely. I'll tell you another really important thing. Having conversations with them about what they want to do when they get old.

I love this.

Like I think we forget, you know, obviously I have a high end school and there's a lot of my kids that want to go to full time and that's great but they're not the ones that are going to stay. So I'm going to put all this time, effort, energy into them and then they're going to go off to full time when they're 18 anyway. And then I've got to just keep churning it through. Whereas if you have the conversation sometimes they say to you, and I've had two in the last, last six months, say this to me, Amanda, that they're not really sure if they want to go to full time. And actually they just love real, they really love the teaching and they really love choreographing and that's really their two big things and they want to work on that. And then I can say to them, well, great, there's a career path, there's a career pathway here for you. And that's the other thing. We need to show them that there is a pathway for them because I think sometimes them and parents just think that it's just a side hustle, it's a fun thing, but it's not a proper job.

Yep. And we know that's so not true, right?

Yeah, exactly.

And I, that was a big thing that I was always all about and you know, obviously a little bit selfishly sometimes is trying to keep them in the studio rather than, you know, going to try their hand at performing or whatever. And so I really would benefit drive, you know, being a teacher, what an incredible opportunity it was. All the other career ideas that they could have at my studio, you know, if that was that they wanted to go to uni locally and get paid so much more than they would working at a local cafe and having so much more fun and impacting students lives. Like what a great thing for them to do for the four or five years that they're at uni or whether that's that they want to be full time teachers and you know, talking to them about the pathways that they could take and you know, that they could go on to, you know, be a studio manager or own their own studio. And I really would take a lot of time and love giving that, I guess, career advice and having that constant conversation. Because when they're 14, you can't just have it with them once. Right. You do it every six months, 100, they forget.

But we think, well and they do change and things can change in their little lives to make them think, maybe I'm not really about this after all. And you know, so yes, definitely, consistently having that conversation with them is so important. Also, I think letting them know that you will help them through the training process. So if they're like, I'm really into social media, great, I'll send you through your social media. I'm really into teaching ballet. Fantastic. I will help you with going through your Royal Academy of Dance teaching certificate. Like I, I really think upskilling them and putting them through courses is only going to benefit you and your business.

Absolutely, I'm all about that and I love investing in team. I think it's such a valuable thing. And also, you know, if we're talking about those really young people that were identifying really young, you know, telling their parents that you're going to do that as well and like actually following through, but having those conversations with their parents really early on, you know, and I think that's such a great thing. You know, when I would speak to a 13 or a 14 year old and I'd say I want to do this. And I'd then be calling their parents after I had a great conversation with them going hey, I wanted to let you know about a conversation we had. I told. And you know, relaying it to the parent as well so that you can one gauge their excitement levels for it, but also let them know that you're looking after their child's best interest. And you know, I think that goes a long way to build rapport, whether that's what ends up happening or not. But it's just such a good rapport builder. Showing them that you believe in their child is so important and generally you like, you know, there's some incredible kids in the studio. Like we believe in all of them and we want to see them succeed.

Parents genuinely don't think this is a real job though. Like it's such a thing. Like I'd. Whether it be performing as a career or being a dance teacher or owner, they still, there's so many of them that don't see it as a real job.

Yeah, that's so sad.

And you, I have to, I feel consistently tell the past stories of how many of my students have become either teachers actually or studio owners or dancers and how amazing their career has been in that for parents to go, oh, maybe it really is a thing.

Like it's, it's just, you know, it's crazy, isn't it?

And I get it though. I, I do understand it because I think it's seen as like a professional football player or as a music musician or it's just so. They see it as so rare for people to be able to succeed, which it is. It is hard, absolutely.

But I love that it's the, the same as we educate our parents on techniques, it's educating them on career progression as well. And I think that's so, so important. So I think it's think it's so important that if you see someone who is, you know, 12, 13, 14 and showing potential in their studio, really like call them out on it and bring them in and have a conversation whether you're ready for them to start assisting teaching or not. I think there's so much value to approaching them and giving them some validation, some love, some, all of those things because, you know, so my daughter's only 12 and I forget that, that she's only 12 because I was about to tell a story and then go, no wait, she's only 12.

Very mature though.

She is a very mature 12 year old and she has just started assisting teaching and I think her Personality should be a great assistant teacher because she is very confident. She speaks very well for her age. So I think there's so much to that. But, you know, as a mum, being called by the studio owner going, hey, she has so much potential. That means the world to me, especially, you know, I've spoken on the podcast quite candidly that she's not the best one in their class. She doesn't have incredible technique. She's not winning dancer of the year, and that's okay. But she does have huge potential to be an incredible dance teacher. If that's what she wants to do, you know, she would be amazing at that. And if that's what she wants to do, great. But just, you know, finding what people's strengths are and celebrating those strengths because the strength isn't always, you know, winning the trophy.

Yep.

I think that's a really important thing.

Absolutely. Flip side of that. Getting an assistant teacher in, who needs the confidence, who needs the.

Absolutely.

You know, I know I keep referring back to Lily, but she. She is that child. And she is quite a technical little dancer, but definitely not the most expressive on stage. Won't talk to anyone. Like, will not. Would not say boo to me.

Yeah.

But now is starting to talk to me. So amazing. And her mom actually reached out and said, I'm very concerned about Lily because she won't talk to anyone and she won't. So teaching's kind of bringing her out of her shell, so it can have that effect as well, I think.

I love that that's so, so valuable. So I think that's where we kind of want to leave it. We want to really encourage you. If you have an incredible child that you see potential in, make sure you start fostering it. Tell the parent, you know, tell the child, because that can keep their dance journey going longer. I've got to be honest, as well. It can keep their dance journey, keep them as a client. That respect that that parent has for you will, you know, just go up so much. I think it is such a valuable part of the retention strategy as well, for keeping them in class.

Yes.

I think that there can be so much to it. So, yeah, I love all those ideas.

And making them feel like a leader as well. You know, we always hear about our clients saying that their teens are dropping off. And I think when your teen feels so much a part of things and is. Is the one that is running the discos or running the. You know, it does help them to stay. Absolutely. So allowing them that opportunity. But. Yeah, fish them out. But also, don't then just disregard them. Really give them your time and effort, because I know from my successes they can become your biggest rock star teachers. Absolutely.

Keep them for 10, 15 years. And how incredible is that?

Absolutely.

So, so good. Well, it's been so good being in this lovely studio. I hope you guys have gotten some great value out of today's podcast.

We can't wait to be back in.

Your ears next week on the Dance Principals United Podcast.

Thanks, friends.

Bye. We hope you enjoyed this episode of the Dance Principles United Podcast. If you'd love to learn more from us, we have a special offer just for our podcast listeners. Go to the link in the show notes right now to get two weeks free in Dance Principles United Tribe. We would love to see you there.