Limiting Beliefs: The Hidden Rails That Guide Our Lives

It's about being able to integrate new knowledge, and if you can't integrate new knowledge because you think you have the whole story, then you're limited, period.

Welcome to The Art of Accomplishment, where we explore how deepening connection with ourselves and others leads to creating the life we want with enjoyment and ease. I'm Brett Kistler, here today with my co-host Joe Hudson. Good afternoon, Joe. How are you?

I'm doing pretty good, man. It's been a week of strange correspondence from the ether. You know, my work used to be so much so that I knew every person in it, and now I don't know people in it. And so I've been getting all these correspondents recently and it's been cool to feel the difference between being personally involved in somebody's life and their transformation and not being personally involved. So that's been cool.

Yeah, fascinating. Tell me what's an example of that that's most alive for you right now?

What happened recently was that somebody was on the forum for the Connection Course and they had had a session with me and I didn't have a strong memory of them because it was like a 6-minute session or something like that. And apparently I said something that really challenged them. They got them quite upset for a bit. And later there was this huge epiphany that came with it. But what I said to them apparently, in the way that I can be a dick sometimes, is that I basically said, "I don't buy your story." just like I dismissed what for them was like a defining feature of them apparently. And I was just like, "I just don't buy it. I don't buy that story." Or in my world, it would've been limiting belief. Like I just didn't buy the limiting belief. And it really, I think, pissed her off. It's hard to describe, but I wasn't there for her experience of it, but I think she was definitely challenged by it. I think definitely angry. And then it led to like this huge unfolding for her as challenging any limiting belief does.

Yeah. Yeah. It seems like that's really one of the common things that I see when you're, when you're doing sessions with people, it's, it's challenging those beliefs. And often I see people coming to you with sort of a, how, how do I approach this challenge in my life, but within my belief system, like batting them aside and people are like, no, no, no, no, no, no.

Yeah. That'd be a cool topic. Let's try to discuss it. Let's discuss limiting beliefs. How does that sound to you?

Yeah, let's do this. So let's start by defining it. What are limiting beliefs?

Simply put, it's an idea that limits your capacity to be yourself or limits your capacity to get what you want. It limits your capacity to be effective, to change your habits, to be happy. It also like, it not only just affects the way that you like what you want or your ability to get what you want, but it also affects the way that, like, how big your wants are, or if you want things that are good for you. Limiting beliefs affect, I think, everything that we do. Beliefs affect everything that we do, and limiting beliefs absolutely do, and they, and by definition, they limit us. So an example of this would be like, let's say you wanted to lose weight. You might have a limiting belief that says, um, "it's hard to lose weight," or "I can't lose weight, I've tried before." Those are two limiting beliefs that one might have. And if you were to bet, like if you were to bet on two people who are going to lose weight and one of them was like, "Yes, I can do it." And the other one was like, "No, I don't think I can. I've tried before, it doesn't work." Like who would you bet on? Just on if that's the only data you had. So that's what limiting beliefs are.

So it seems like there are many different kinds of them. And I mean, A lot of them people are aware of, and a lot of them people are maybe less aware of individually or even less aware of as a society, or like large groups of us are bought into them, which makes them a little bit harder to see this water that we're swimming in. So what are some of the different kinds of limiting beliefs that you've come across?

Yeah, so that's interesting. You could categorize in the way that you do, like there's the personal limiting beliefs and the societal limiting beliefs that most people fall into. I haven't thought about it that way. When I think about limiting beliefs, I think about it as the ones that, like, all of those, all of those are in the same category, but then I define them by the way that the mind plays a trick on you. And so the first way the mind plays a trick on you is that you just believe a false thought. And the second way is that your mind misinterprets an experience. So it's not particularly false as in like, the way you can prove something to be false. It's the story that you hold about an experience. The third one is thinking that you know the whole story, thinking that you have the complete truth. And those are the three ways that I see the mind really. There's other ways, but those are the three main categories I think about when I think about limiting beliefs.

Okay, let's start with that first one. Tell me more about the false thoughts.

Yeah, let's see. A good story on this one is a story about, My dad, my dad was, when he was about my age, maybe a little younger, he was the CEO of a company and he got fired about 2 years into it and he thought that he had failed. And he thought that he had like irreconcilably failed. Like it was just, ugh, and his system and he started to define himself as a failure. He hated the feeling of it, he avoided it, started to drink more to avoid it. His life literally started like grinding to a halt because he was this person who failed and then he was avoiding that sense of failure. And he was the guy who failed at the company and failed to provide for his wife and kids. And so, you know, I just watched my dad when I was, you know, in my, 18 to 20, it's just his life just grinding to a halt. And then some years later, I'm hanging out in, I'm a venture capitalist at the time, and I'm hanging out at one of those conferences where you can meet companies, and there was this company there with a really similar name to my father's company's name. The company, I think, was like Lumen Optics, and it was Lumen Energy or something like that. I can't remember. And I went and talked to them. I'm like, hey, man, my dad had a company was the CEO of a company and they're like, "That's our company." I was like, "What?" And they were like, "Yeah, your dad was the CEO and he was really successful over a 2-year period of time. He had cut the burn rate to almost nothing from hundreds of thousands of dollars a month. He had gotten us more customers. He had refined the product line so that there was a focus of the company." He was so successful, in fact, that the company that owned us shuttered us because we challenged their product, their main product, their main revenue source, this parent company, was challenged by our product, so they shut us down. We sued them, and because of what your father had done, we sued them so successfully that we won, you know, whatever, some hundreds of millions of dollars or $100 million, something like that. We rebooted the company and we had the right for the tech and we've rebooted the company.

Wow.

So I went back to my dad and I was like, Dad, you didn't fail. As a venture capitalist, I can say that the results you gave were good. I wouldn't have fired you. And this is the story. And to watch him consider the fact that everything he was was based on a lie, was based on a limiting belief, was based on a concept that was inherently not true, and like that recognition and what it meant for whatever 15 to 20 years of his existence, that's what I mean by a false thought.

So there's a lot to unpack there. That's a fascinating story. And so in this case, you find out years later that he didn't actually fail in the ways that he thought that he did. He didn't fail the company, but there is still a way that he lost his job and was not feeling unable to provide for his family. He didn't even share in the benefit that the company then later had from their lawsuit. So like, what if, you know, in some way he really did fail from some perspective?

Yeah.

In this case, it's sort of mixed. It's like he didn't fail at the things he thought he failed at, but what if he did? What if that had been what happened is that, He drove the company into the ground.

Yeah, you're right. So let's say he did fail. He did drive the company into the ground. So one person would believe that's a failure and one person would believe that's a learning experience. One person would believe, oh, now I'm more equipped to do it. One person would believe I'm not equipped to do it, right? One believes that there is such a thing as a failure and one believes that there's only learning experiences that you have. So that's another way that the brain teaches, like gives us false thoughts, is that we buy into a thought process and we don't see the falseness of the thought process or the other perspective of the thought process. So even if you say, oh, it's like so clear that he failed, you have to agree on the definition of failure. And then you have to think that that's you, it's not circumstantial. So all of those are potential limiting beliefs. Does that make sense?

Yeah, yeah. Okay, so you had mentioned, you know, in this list of 3 things, there's the false thoughts and there's the misinterpretation of events. How would misinterpreting the events be distinct from false thoughts in this case or another?

It's more misinterpreting the experience. It's not the events, it's the experience. So let me give you a story about this one. I'm with my cousin and some friends and we're at some boardwalk. I don't know, it's like '30s or something. They had this ride and it's, the ride was so big and so scary that it was like, at the time, a lot of money, like $50 to get in and do this ride. And it was, think of it, a Ferris wheel, but only one arm and only 4 seats, 2 at the top, 2 at the bottom. And the seats spun around and they went at high speed. So it didn't only like go in a big gigantic circle, the little thing you sat in went in mini circles, right? Scary as hell. And my cousin's like, come on, do it. I was like, all right, yeah, let's try this thing out. So I get into the thing and we go around and I'm just like frozen. My body is shaking. I'm like, ugh, like all tension, all tension. And I heard somebody on the other, the one on the bottom, which occasionally went to the top, to the bottom, but the other car of two people laughing. And I started laughing and all of a sudden it was exhilarating. It was like the most fun experience I had had as far as like that kind of adrenaline experience. And when I got off, I was telling one of my friends about it. I was like, "Hey, you know, I was having this experience." And the experience didn't change, but I went from complete hatred, resistance to this experience, to absolute like enlivenment, exuberance, to joy of this experience. And he said to me, yeah, it's, it's really fascinating in your body. When you're resisting it, you're releasing chemicals that are carcinogenic, that create cancer in your body. And when you're exhilarated, your body is creating chemicals that are anti-carcinogenic and you're having, uh, uh, less toxic neurochemical reactions. And that really hit me, right? The only difference between it was this is fun or this is terrifying. Same experience, same person having the same experience. And one was an interpretation of the experience that was terror, and one was an interpretation of the experience which was, this is exhilarating.

Yeah, it sounds like another way to slice those interpretations is that one was an interpretation that this is an experience to be resisted, and the other was interpretation that this is an experience to be welcomed.

Yeah, it's interesting because it's— it can be It can be both. So for instance, you can have it be, this is a good experience instead of this is a bad experience, some version of that. This can be resisted, but it can also be the opposite. A limiting belief can also be, I'll be happy when blank, right? It's the setup of future happiness instead of the recognition that the happiness is available to you right now, that you don't have to be different, you don't have to grow, you don't have to transform. You can do all those things. In fact, you will, but you get to be, you get to love yourself and be happy right now as you are.

Okay, so let's apply this to some other beliefs, some other interpretations that people have.

Yeah, so exercise is difficult. I won't be consistent in my exercise. Money comes from hard work. I'll be happy once I learn to speak up and tell my truth. All of those are this idea that I will have a certain experience when, "X, Y, and Z happens," or "If X, Y, and Z is happening." And all of those can be very limiting to your capacity to get things done, to your happiness, to your joy.

No one wants my anger.

Yeah, no one wants my anger. Yeah, that's right. That's right. So that's the distinction. And I make the distinction— there's obviously similarities between a false thought and this. The distinction is that one is an interpretation of experience and one is just, you know, it's more logical. And the misinterpretation of experience is more of an emotional lie that you tell yourself.

Got it. That makes sense.

So one's more of a head lie, one's more of an emotional lie. And that's why I make the distinction.

Okay. All right. So then getting onto that third one, thinking you know the whole story.

You know, I remember the story that stuck this in my system. So I'm just gonna use it. There, there was a Kobe, there was a, yeah, he was, um, I think he was Mormon, self-help guy. Back in the '80s, he had like a Franklin Planner, all sorts of things. Anyways, this is the story he told. His story, he's on the subway. There's a guy, there's a dad. He's got 3 kids and the 3 kids are acting out and Kobe is getting agitated and pissed. Like, man, control your kids, right? You're like, you're bothering everybody and like, You're a bad parent, all these ideas. And at some point the dad looks over and says, "I'm so sorry, they lost their mom just the other day." And Koby describes this as like instantaneous shift in his attitude. As one might imagine, I would obviously like, oh, all of a sudden there's deeper understanding. All of a sudden there's more compassion. Same series of events, totally different understanding because he went from thinking he knew what was up to realizing that he did not have the whole story. And it's like, the difference is kind of what I know, what I know I don't know, what I don't know I don't know. And that's what it is. Like this one, it's very much about just thinking that you understand it when you don't.

Seems like there would always be some other angle on any story that we have or any level of understanding that we think we have about any situation.

That's right. That's absolutely— you got it. That's exactly what— so, so for instance, let's say you're trying to understand the Chrysler Building, and this is neurologically, you know, neurologically, if you look at some of the neuro research, they ask about like, how do we know what reality is? And there's all these, all these ways of seeing the fact that we don't know what reality is. Just as an example, if we listen to tones and we hear One tone, we can identify that's a C. Another tone, that's a G. And together, they— we can, we can feel the two different tones and they make a chord, or three make a chord, or whatnot. But we can have distinguished— we can distinguish them. And if we're looking at color, we can see two different colors, but we blend them together, there's a third. We can't get the distinction between the two colors that made the third. So It just tells you that our sense organs can't see reality the same way, even from sound to, to color. So similarly, if you're looking at the Chrysler Building and you're an architect, you see it one way. And if you are an atomic scientist, you see it another way. And if you are taking a picture of it from one angle, you see it one way, and another angle, you see it another way. And all, all that's happening in society is that we keep on seeing things from new angles. Different understandings. And it's the integration of those understandings that create more solutions, better solutions, better iterations, sometimes worse iterations. But it's that putting those, that information together that gives us a more coherent thought process. So you could say, I've made my iPhone 1.0, I'm done, it was good. Or you could say, Yeah, and now I'm gonna make an iPhone 2.0 and a 3.0. And then you can say, which one of those is right? Which one of those was good? Which one of those, right? So as we see new perspectives, we can iterate and we can create new things. And the old things always have some limits. And if we believe that the old things are the way to go and we're not integrating the new perspectives, then we are limited in our belief systems.

It seems like maybe a risk that can happen here is that we can fall into the habit of seeing some gratuitous other perspective that also then flies in the face of our own experience. I could walk down the street and somebody could be being an asshole, and I can tell myself, "Oh, they must have had a really hard day." "so I'm just gonna give them a pass." And then we just walk through life giving everybody sort of a free pass on, you know, not, and we lose our boundaries because we are in just, you know, it seems like this is a similar limiting belief of rather than having the belief of that dude's a dick to, oh, this person must just be coming from a lot of trauma and there's a reason for it. And that could also, like, as true as that is, can also be limiting if it doesn't integrate other perspectives, including our own needs.

Correct. That, absolutely, that's right. So the limiting belief is stopping yourself because you think you know. The truth is there's always something you don't understand. There's always a justification to be gentle about it or to be mean about it. There's all those things are always there. The difference is, are you in an awareness of that? Are you making choice around that? There's more freedom to that. There's less limit to that than if you are unaware of it and you think you're right. And you think that the other people are wrong. Then you're limited. Then you cannot see solutions. Your solution sets are limited. And more importantly, great solutions come because I have one perspective, you have another perspective, and we find a solution that meets both of our perspectives without limiting them. So, and you see this happen all the time in business. One person's like, oh, it's gotta be technology-forward company. And the other is like, no, we have to be marketing-forward company. And one thinks they're right, the other one thinks they're right, and there's just a lockhorn situation instead of, Oh, there's something I don't understand. What is it that I don't understand? Oh, okay. I don't understand that marketing needs X, Y, and Z. Oh, I don't understand that the tech side of the company needs A, B, and C. Oh, how do we have a solution that gets them both? And then you get a better solution than a tech-forward company or a marketing-forward company.

What I'm hearing here is that to integrate multiple perspectives, which gives you a better, more nuanced perspective with which to make better decisions, In order to do that, each of the perspectives has to give a little and recognize where it's wrong, where it's incomplete, where the narrative glossed over some detail. And that requires both sides, or if from what you can control in yourself, you're recognizing that your story is not the whole story and being open and ready for information that feels like it conflicts with that story.

Yeah, without dodging your truth. Meaning if it still doesn't feel right for you, you don't go, "Okay, yes, because there's another side." Right. You still have to be in integrity with yourself. And you see me do this. Like, you've been in rooms with me where someone's like, "You're full of shit." And I'll be like, "Yeah, yes, yeah." I can't say that what I'm saying is the absolute truth. I'm not gonna say that that's true. I'm gonna say that, this is a helpful perspective, and it might not be helpful to you. You know, it might be only helpful at a certain time in a certain place for certain people. And if the perspective gives you freedom, fantastic. And if it doesn't, fantastic.

Yeah.

Otherwise, I'd be like, oh no, this is the right way. And I would be right. It is the right way for certain people at a certain time. You know what I mean? So it's about being able to integrate new knowledge. And if you can't integrate new knowledge because you think you have the whole story, then you're limited, period.

Okay, so to summarize what we just went through, there's these 3 general categories of limiting beliefs. One of them you described as having false thoughts, and that's sort of the cognitive one. Then there's misinterpretation of an experience, which can be a lot more somatic, just misinterpreting what your body's telling you. About an experience that you're in. And then the other one, thinking that you know the whole story, which basically stops new information from coming in, stops you from receiving, sort of feeding those first two categories. So now that we have this sort of a framework here, how does someone go about transforming their perspective to be less limiting?

Yeah. Yeah. How do you, how do you, how do you, How do you solve the quantum mechanical, you know, how do you solve for the boson Higgs particle? It's, I'm not gonna be able to say all of that information in a podcast and nor could a podcast, you know, fully encompass that because it's a little bit like listening to a podcast to learn how to paint or to learn how to look at paintings if you don't have the painting to look at. And to understand because doing this is not just an intellectual exercise. It's— there's a body, emotional component to it. And it's also— so it's better done in pairs. It's better done through experimentation and exercises. With all that said, happy to go into the basics of it. So the basics are there's two things you have to be able to see through the limiting perspective, and you have to be able to find the limiting perspective in reverse order. So you have to be able to say, "Oh, that's a limiting perspective," and then you have to have the tools to be able to see through it. And at some point along the journey, you kind of— every perspective you can see through. And that's— that there's a tremendous amount of freedom in that. Sometimes a little confusion for a while too, but when it settles and integrates, there's a huge amount of freedom in this. And so the first step is pretty easy if you can put your attention in the right place. So the first is a felt sense. If you feel constricted, if you feel the places where you're uncomfortable in life, where there's tension that isn't good tension, that's where the limiting beliefs lie. There's like binary thought is where the limiting beliefs If you wanna like look at intellectual, an intellectual way to identify it, binary thoughts, which indicates fear, which indicates that your thinking is limited. But mostly physical constriction, tension, stress, those are all really, really good signals, places where you're triggered, all really, really good signals that you're in a limiting belief pattern. Then there's another way to do it too, which is just in general, if you are feeling trapped, that's where you have a false belief. And the places where life, it feels like a chore, and that a future life feels like the key to your happiness, that's the misinterpreting of experiences generally.

Or like waiting for the world to change and be in alignment with what you think you want or what you think you need to be happy.

Or what you think the world should be.

Ah, yeah.

Exactly. And then places where you stagnate, not stuck, but just like, oh, like you just kind of are bleh in something, is usually where you don't have the whole story, you know? So you see people be like, it's really typical for some people, well, that's not the way that we used to do it. You know, that's not, it's been done a different way for years. I don't see any reason to change it. That is often like a stagnation and it also shows like, someone doesn't have the whole story. So this goes deeper. There's more nuance to finding it, but generally that's enough to be able to uncover probably 100. So start there, easily 100 limiting beliefs.

Okay, so let's say we start by exploring where we feel tension that doesn't feel like good tension, as you said, where we feel stagnation. And we start to find what these limiting beliefs might be. We start to develop the practice of seeing through them. Maybe we've got partner work, maybe we've got some exercises. How do you get rid of it? How do you free yourself of the pattern? Because a lot of times you can see that there's a pattern. For much of my life, I've believed that I have attention deficit disorder, right? Yeah. It doesn't mean that I'm actually any different now that I see through many ways that that story has limited me. I also still have certain personality traits that people could still point to and be like, "Haha, ADD right there. I see you." And yet, you know, how do you see through and then behave differently and show up outside of that belief system?

So there's a couple things. Oftentimes, so someone identifies this is the area where I have a limiting belief system. The next thing is figuring out what belief system is the one that's actually creating the tension. And that can be a little trickier. So it's usually the one that they absolutely believe. So if you want a trick to that, like in a situation that's creating tension, go to the things that you absolutely believe to be true. Those are probably your culprits. They're the water that you swim in. So look for the context that you're not questioning. So that's one thing. As far as getting rid of the behavior entirely, it doesn't work like that. It's not like, oh, I have an eliminating belief system that exercise is hard. And so once I think that exercise is easy, I'm gonna want to exercise. It might be that you just wanna exercise more. Or it might be that you find a way to exercise that takes so little time that it doesn't bother you to do it. Like, you don't know how the behavior is gonna change. So all you know is that, oh, I feel more free. Oh, I'm more in alignment with who I wanna be or who I actually am. And the second more than the first. It's like, I'm more in alignment with my authenticity. And so it's not so much about, it's, this isn't like a behavior control methodology. This is a realization. Methodology. So once you get it, if you get it in your whole body, not just your brain, if you get it in, if you grok the whole thing, then things are going to change. But you don't get to decide what changes. All you get to decide, all you get to really control, is the outcome, which is more freedom and more happiness, more joy.

Wait, I'm not used to you saying you get to control the outcome.

Yeah, right, totally true. Yeah, the outcome of more joy, not the outcome of my company gets bought, not the outcome of I become skinnier. All you get to control is if you go see through your limiting beliefs, you get more freedom, more joy. So not the concrete outcome, but the, the experiential outcome will— it'll start happening. It's as predictable as, um, dropping an apple. It's going to go to the ground or, or go lower if it at all— if it can. And so now I'm like dropping an apple on Earth or on a planet with gravity. Everything's going there.

There's more to the story, Joe.

There's more to the story, exactly, right? So you don't get to control the specifics of the outcome, like I said, and you do get to see that this practice creates more freedom and more joy. The other step that we're not really talking about is how do you get from Okay, that's a limiting belief to not believing it. And when I say not believing it, the brain is the first thing to stop believing it, but the body and the, and the nervous system, the emotions also have to stop believing it. And so that's where the tools come in handy. And it's why that they're hard to describe. It's better to experience them. It's better to do them with somebody. And there's tools in so many of the things, especially the masterclass where we're really looking at limiting beliefs the whole time and general categories of them and everything like that. But some of the tools are inquiry, basically questioning, kind of the devil's advocate of anything. That's a tool that allows you to see through things. Emotional fluidity is a large structure of a tool. There's lots of forms of those tools, but where you have the emotion move allows you to see through things on an emotional level. And allowing pleasure, love, safety, those feelings into your system is the other suite of tools. That's kind of more of the nervous system nervous system tool. So those are the broad categories of those tools. Examples of the tools would be things like, um, argue the counter case in writing. Like, write down everything that you think you know about it and question it, or write down everything you don't know about it is another really strong way to do it. Um, if you are caught in a belief system where somebody else is at fault, Byron Katie's work on blame is fantastic. You could do that form of inquiry. It's really nice. It has a good emotional component Those are some examples of ways to do it. Like I said, the emotional components, the nervous system components, shifting that is something that you really just have to practice. You have to, and you have to do it in experimental form. Not through reading a book or listening to a podcast.

Yeah, that piece that you mentioned on if you find yourself blaming others, I think that that can become sort of a meta-trap here as well. Where you come to understand this framework on limiting beliefs. And you see this in kind of what people describe as woke culture a lot, where somebody will see somebody having some unwanted consequence in their life and be like, "Oh, look, they just have a bunch of limiting beliefs." And then there's this kind of this way to be above them or better than them or to try to fix them or basically, you know, in some sense, sometimes just gaslighting people into believing that they are at fault for everything that happens rather than they're responsible for their experience.

And if a person is saying that, "Oh, look, they're not as good as me," they are having a physical constriction most likely, and that physical constriction is causing them pain, which is a sign of another limiting belief. The Tibetan Buddhists have a great saying around this. Comparative mind, they talk about, "If I think I'm better than you, that's comparative mind and that's misery." If I think I'm worse than you, that's comparative mind, that's misery. If I think I'm equal to you, that's comparative mind and that's misery. So no matter what it is, you will feel it in your body. You'll feel that constriction. You'll feel the limitation of it. Your mind will be the last to see it and the first to unsee it. And then your body's the last to unsee it. It's really fascinating how that works. Typically.

Yeah. Okay. So to— a final question, sort of close this out, is if somebody has listened to this episode and they've just started now developing the new limiting belief that I must be the kind of person who sees through my limiting beliefs all the time.

Then I'll be happy. Then I'll be happy.

Then I'll be happy.

Yeah.

What do you have to say for them?

Notice how that creates tension in your system and see through that belief. Or don't. Choice is yours. You get to do what you like. There's not like a wrong or a right in it. There's just, oh, this is a cool avenue if you wanna do it. It's just fascinating to me how that setup happens all the time. And I think it's the most common. When you talked in the beginning, you said there was kind of societal belief systems that are unquestioned and personal belief systems that are unquestioned. And I think that's one of the biggest societal beliefs is that if I do X, then I'll be happy. If I do X, then I'll be good enough. Then I'll be worthy of love. And that is, I think, one of the belief systems that are most limiting and cause us the most misery.

I think it can also be helpful to explore what we get out of our beliefs. For example, working out is hard. We may actually enjoy having that belief because we enjoy being the kind of person who does hard things and gets something out of them. And so maybe, maybe also exploring what it is that we enjoy about our limiting beliefs and really just relishing and enjoying that might be part of getting out of that Chinese finger trap sometimes.

Absolutely. Yes, yes, yes. Like, one of the biggest questions that I'll ask people when they're in a limiting belief system is what do you get out of it? What's the benefit to you? What would be scary to let go of it? Yeah, those are all great questions. Yeah.

Beautiful.

Awesome. Yeah.

All right. Thank you, Joe.

Yeah, man. Thank you. Talk to you soon.

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