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Welcome to the Naked Marriage Podcast. We're Dave and Ashley Willis. We're so glad you're here. On this podcast, we undress the truth about sex, intimacy, and lifelong love. Gonna talk today about how to have a second honeymoon in your marriage, which is something that every marriage could benefit from. And we're gonna talk about more than that too. So stick around. We've got all kinds of stuff in the works. But first, my lovely bride's gonna share a review.

I know, and I have a huge grin on my face. If you're watching on YouTube, you see it. That was about the most Georgetown, Kentucky, welcome to the Naked Marriage podcast I've.

Ever heard you do. I loved it.

Y'all, we're so glad you're up in here for Naked Merge. Naked. You said naked on another one of our episodes, and I didn't point it out, but I was like, oh, I love it. I love our roots. But anyway, and I know I have.

My accents flaring all the time.

So anyway, I just wanted to point that out. I loved it. I love it. We did our Kentucky parents proud. We're also first cousins, which we are not. We are not. Well, they don't know. Oh my goodness. Okay, so today's review is from SLWeb 2013, and it's entitled Amazing for All Ages, and they gave us five stars. So thank you so much. It says, this podcast is my absolute favorite. Interestingly enough, my husband's 75-year-old grandparents told us about the YouTube channel, which led me to the podcast. So funny, but I love that after 55 years of marriage, they're still investing.

In themselves every day.

That is the sweetest. Yes, I wanna be like that. I wanna be like them too. Dave and Ashley give me the motivation to actively pursue my husband and to cultivate a Christ-centered marriage. This podcast is perfect for all ages, whether you're 30 or 75. You guys, when I read that review, I just couldn't believe it. I was like, what? It's just so exciting that people, you know, who are way far ahead of us in their marriage and have so much more wisdom than we do, clearly still feel like they could learn something. And I just feel like we truly can learn something from them just in those actions and knowing that we've never arrived We can all be working on our marriage. It warms my heart.

It does. Thank you for sharing that. That means the world to us. It's humbling and it's an honor. Yeah. And we're so glad that all of you have tuned in today because it's going to be a fun episode.

Yes.

Fun topic. So let's dive in.

All right, you guys. Well, I have a big goofy grin on my face. If you're watching on YouTube, you can see it. But we're talking about what it's like and why to have a second honeymoon. Okay? Yes. And the reason I'm so goofy talking about this is because we actually just did this this past year, and it was delightful. It was.

And so we're going to talk about.

That, but also kind of get you brainstorming for those of you who are ready to have a second honeymoon. I want to say, first and foremost, coming out of the gate, think about your first honeymoon. Did you have one? I know some people these days are skipping the honeymoon and opting for maybe a down payment on a house or. Or they just didn't have the money and they're like, we'll just have a trip some other time. I mean, I totally get that. There's different circumstances for different couples. But for those of you who did have a first honeymoon, what was it like? Think about it. And for us, we went to Cancun and somehow, I want to say that you paid for our honeymoon and you scrounged together some money or your parents helped you or something.

More than 20 years ago, 2001.

He had just graduated from college. I'm still a college student.

He's been saving up. between the ring and the honeymoon. Now, my parents, my dad gave us frequent flyer miles to have the flight. Yep. And so I just had to, I paid for, I think, the all-inclusive resort, which.

That's right. We stayed at the Aventura Palace, which is part of the palace resorts in Cancun. But actually it was in Aventura, which is like a city over from Cancun, a little bit out of the, the bustle, you know, because we didn't want to have lots of people around. We really just wanted to enjoy ourselves, but it It was just beautiful and fun. And I just remember eating way too much. And, you know, we went snorkeling. I'd never been snorkeling before. And we had a hot tub in our room and we loved that. And it was just great. It was really fun.

It was so good. But I'm telling you, we've had a lot of trips since then that we've enjoyed even more. Probably more, yes. And that's why, like, the honeymoon isn't a one-time thing. It's a second, third, fourth, 100th, 200th over the course of your marriage to get away together. And really what this episode is about is just to encourage you and challenge you to get away together because we've done that on big scales, we've done that on little scales. We've done it through different seasons of our marriage. And I'm telling you guys, it is some of the glue that has kept us connected, having always something on the calendar to look forward to, even in those really exhausting, you know, raising kids, tough seasons of life sometimes to have something on the calendar to say, oh man, if we can just make it to here, we're going to have that getaway together. Sometimes it's just been a night or two away, just up the road somewhere, and sometimes it's taken a lot of planning and it's been more elaborate like this past couple years where we've done several like that one to Costa Rica, which was like a second honeymoon. That definitely was going to an all-inclusive place in just a beautiful country. We fell in love with Costa Rica. and it was like a three hour, less than a three hour flight from Atlanta. That's right.

We flew into it.

Two and a half hours and it.

Was a different world. It was. We flew into a town, and I hope I'm not mispronouncing this name, but it was Liberia. I think I'm saying that right. And it's a little airport, but let me tell you, Costa Rica, even in the COVID age, they've really got it together. They've got their protocols together. I felt very safe. It was such a clean airport. I was like, this is like the cleanest airport and just beautiful and nice people. helping you navigate. I want to give a little shout out because we haven't been able to do this, but we had a company help us to plan this and they did not sponsor the podcast. This is just free advertising because we love them. But it turned out this is so cool. So we went through a company called NAMI. So it's N-A-M-I. You can Google them and they do Costa Rican vacations all over the country. Oh, no, NAMI. I'm sorry. See, I'm getting it mixed up. NAMI, I'm sorry. There's another organization called NAMI that's for.

Mental health that I fell in love with, so I'm getting it mixed up.

It's Namu.

If you want mental health, go to Costa Rica on vacation.

It will help your mental health. It will help your mental health. So it's Namu, thank you, sweetie. N-A-M-U. And I'm sure it stands for something, but if you just Google that and put Costa Rica too in your search bar, you'll find it. But we were, you know, kind of going with them 'cause it helps when you've never been to a country to go through, you know, a travel agency of some kind and to navigate where to stay and what to see and doing different excursions. And with this being our 20-year anniversary, we really wanted it to be something amazing. And let me tell you, The people at Namu were just insane, but this is the coolest part. So we're kind of interacting with them and then all of a sudden, about, I don't know, a week or two into the process, excuse me, we got an email and the guy was like, Hey, one of our people, our travel agents, they follow your podcast and they were really excited. And his name is Yermy and he listens. And I just want you to know they listened to the Naked Marriage podcast and I was like, what? You know, and we were so excited, weren't we?

We were so excited.

It was just so awesome.

And they were great to work with.

They were great to work with.

This is not like a paid advertisement. We just we had a great experience.

And we had the best experience. It was awesome.

We've travel for us has been something that we don't tend to give each other big gifts, like, you know, big extravagant gifts, but we try to save up and do a lot of travel experiences because we believe Travel is the one thing you can buy that actually makes you richer when you share it with someone you love because the experience, the memory, something that you can never lose. And we've also enjoyed just seeing new places together and even new places in our own area. You know, we went on a little one night getaway or two night getaway, maybe not long ago to just a little town up the road. Hey, I think it was one night. It was 24 hours.

Yeah, it was a 24 hour getaway.

We did a little hike. We stayed at a place where we hadn't stayed. and we just explored an area that was nearby to us, but we had not really explored. And it was so wonderful. I mean, it was just so wonderful to kind of pause from our normal routine to make the planning and do the work to get a babysitter. And that's something that we've budgeted for since the beginning of our marriage, 'cause we haven't, some people are like, oh, we can't, we don't have family to watch our kids and they just let that be an excuse. We've never really had family to watch our kids and we have to travel a lot for work. Every now and then my mom has helped, but really it's been, you know, we've had to do the work of interviewing and finding reliable, and it is work, you guys. It's work, but it is worth it. And I'm not just saying like, you know, people are like, oh, well, some people make themselves martyrs, and I know this is gonna step on some toes here.

It will.

Because they're like, well, I just never, I never wanna be away from my kids. And, you know, I get that, but one of the best things you can give your kids is the gift of letting them see a healthy marriage. A gift of letting your kids see you prioritize your marriage and you come back better. You come back refreshed. You come back with new perspective and new strength. And you need that. You absolutely need that. And so your marriage needs that, your spouse needs that. So make that a priority. I think, I feel like couples should do this at least once a year. I think maybe you've never done it and you're like, once a year, my gosh, we've never done it at all. How can we start doing that? I think honestly, ideally you should do it more than get it way more than one a year, but at least for a starting point, once a year, put it on the calendar, make it something that you're going to do, you're going to budget for, and you're going to make this happen. And maybe it's a couple nights, maybe it's a week, whatever you can do to start with, you'll be amazed at what it does for you and you'll want to do it more often. I'm telling you guys in our 20 years of marriage, We've done this at least once a year. You know, most years there've been more. We've gotten away.

When we say that, we mean like the one-nighters. You know, it's been like a quick thing close by. But even those, you guys, some of my favorites.

Some of my favorite. But we've had probably at least one getaway annually. And there were some years where it's like we had to work and really had to make it happen to do a Three or four night cruise together, we could completely unplug and just reconnect with each other and get some fresh air and see some new places. And I'm telling you, those little things on the calendar were a fuel that kept us going. It did, and it's something to look forward to.

Dave keeps on saying, put it on the calendar. And I think what he means by that is, first of all, things are more likely gonna happen when you write them down and put them on the calendar. Just think about that, just in our daily life. I mean, it's gonna happen more if it's on the calendar. 'Cause you kind of remind yourself that's coming up and you tend to budget more for it and there's a plan in place, you know, 'cause you can't, these usually require a lot of planning, especially if you have children 'cause you have to find a babysitter. And it is hard to find overnight babysitters if you don't have family close by, but it's not impossible. You know, I had one of our dear friends we've had on the podcast before, Shanti Feldhahn. She's an author and researcher, an amazing person and such a sweet friend. And I remember years ago she was at her house doing like a little project with us. And she pressed me on this. And she was like, because I was making excuses about finding a consistent overnight person and how I was frustrated because I felt like it was so hard and this and that. And I was like, I don't know if we could ever have like a consistent one, like a person that we kept going back to, which would give our kids such stability if that was possible. And she was like, you're saying no for people kind of like what you tell me. And Dave looked at me like, I've already said this to you, but it took Shaunti telling you for you to believe it, you know, so Sometimes we're just so hard headed, right? And so she just pressed me on this and was like, you need to really find that person. And for us, that person is Kara. And she has been our overnight babysitter. Does it for work and for pleasure, so to speak, for years. I mean, how many years we had her now? Like five or six years. She is such a gift, you guys.

She is such a gift. The consistency, because now when she comes.

She'S like part of the family. Yeah.

Like the kids don't miss a beat. She just jumps right into their routine and we don't worry about a thing because that relationship is there, the trust is there all the way around. The kids are so comfortable.

It's been really beautiful.

A gift, but that didn't happen overnight. You know, took a lot of intentionality and that took a lot of time and finding that right person. But that person is out there for you guys. And you're probably not gonna travel quite like we do when we have to do for work to do these marriage conferences and things, which is something we feel called to do. life is a little bit unique in that way. But I think every couple needs someone that they can rely on to get away overnight. You know, when we've been around couples who've been married as long as we have, who have never gone away together overnight, and that's just mind blowing to me. And I'm not like trying to make you feel bad if that's you, I'm just trying to encourage you to see the value in this.

Yeah.

And to say, this is something that we need to start doing. This has been a missing to get away together with no agenda other than to reconnect and make it happen.

Absolutely. And I want to say this, first of all, I want to say go to care.com, I know you've probably seen the commercials, maybe even seen it online. It really is a good website. You do have to do your work and interview your people to find a babysitter, but when we were living in Texas and Cara was living far away and we couldn't use Cara as much, Oh my gosh, like we found an amazing girl that we used consistently for the two years we lived in Texas, and she was such a gift. And, but it took me interviewing how.

Many people, like five people.

Right, again, you've got to do the work.

And calling references.

I mean, I- the chemistry, the connection. Exactly, but my kids, I always know for us, and then this is all I'll say about babysitting, I know we're kind of camping out on this, but for us, you know, we've got a bunch of boys. So I'm always like on the phone before I'm gonna actually interview somebody, I'm like, are you used to multiple boys? Do you either have brothers or have you babysat multiple boys? And if they say no, I usually am like, I don't think this is going to work. I think you're not going to be happy because it's a whole different it's.

Just a whole different culture.

A lot of energy. A lot of energy. Right. Exactly. And I think it'd be the same for girls. I would ask, you know, same and or just multiple kids, you know, really feel them out, kind of get get a good feel for who they are because you're leaving the most important people in your life with someone. So I know it's it's it's a big deal and you want to find somebody you really trust. But the good thing about care.com, again, not a sponsor of the podcast, although we would love for them to be. they vet them a little bit in doing a background check and kind of giving you a little leg up on that. But then you still have to do kind of your work in interviewing them and calling their references and really getting a good feel for who they are. I remember years ago, we had posted something about this, like about maybe on our Facebook marriage page about like getting away. And I remember there was, there were several people who were like, you know what though, we tried it once It's just not really our thing. We ended up feeling more awkward than having a good time. And we realized that we just don't need this. And it's just not really our thing. And I get that, like, I mean, there weren't overwhelming comments, like an overwhelming amount of comments saying that. But I think, too, what people don't wanna say is sometimes we get so used to the kind of busyness of our normal life and taking the kids everywhere, work being crazy, all of our different things that we volunteer for or work for. Etc. That, that when we are alone, for some people, getting alone and going somewhere and not having an agenda is kind of terrifying. Craftsmen days are here at Lowe's with big savings on the tools you need. Save 100 on the Craftsman V20 six tool power tool combo kit now at 199. No matter what the project is, Craftsman's high quality, high Performance products empower you to build on. Stop by your nearest Lowe's store and check out the full line of Craftsman tools today. Valid through 6/18, while supplies last, selection varies by location. And let me just say this, that's okay. That doesn't mean you're too far gone. It also doesn't mean it's not for you. It just means that you're having to really get to know each other again. I mean, really. And I will tell you that having these little times away, even if it's just one night, In the midst of raising kids, in the midst of the busyness of life, it's really an effective tool to make becoming an empty nester not so daunting. Because that's why we do see this epidemic of people raising their kids, and then when that last kid goes off to work or college, them really feeling like they don't know each other and eventually leaving or just settling for like a loveless marriage. And, you know, none of us wants that to happen.

No, no, and I think sometimes why people don't do these trips when they're raising their kids is they convince themselves, well, someday we'll do this. Someday. When we're in the nesters, when we're retired, you know, when we're 70, then we're gonna start traveling and seeing stuff. But number one, you're not promised tomorrow. You know, we, you know, know somebody who had that plan and they're like, oh, we're gonna travel, we're gonna do all this stuff. And then the husband started developing severe health issues and their retirement, instead of traveling, ended up being her having to kind of take care of him. And then there was some resentment almost around that because they weren't that close because they had never done this sort of thing through their marriage.

Right.

And so even if they had the opportunity, I don't know that they would have enjoyed it as much because they, they kind of grown apart through the years and then didn't get to go anywhere. And so live life, guys, live, I'm not saying go deep into debt, do.

Stuff you can't do. No, no, no.

But budget plan, but live life and prioritize that time together because it's time you can't get back. And in every season of life and marriage, you're going to get something new from being able to get away together.

Right.

And, and connect in that way and to, and to get to know each other more and to, celebrate each other more. And I am just so thankful that we've done that. I think it's something, and I keep coming back to it, but it's just something I'm so thankful now as part of the rhythm of what we do. But it is, it's something that's given us strength through every single season of our marriage. And you can start now, even if it hasn't been your thing. You can start now and make it a priority and it can make a real difference.

It's never too late. It really is never too late. And so, you know, please, We know that for some, this seems so far off because they're like, I don't, I mean, we are so far in debt. There is no way that we could even justify doing this. I get those pressures. And we've had many years, many years where we've been like, Should we just not go this year? Should we just not take that two-day trip or whatever that we were looking forward to? And I remember you guys pray about it because every time, if you really talk about it, pray about it together, you will find a way and God will make a way.

And it doesn't have to be extravagant.

No. Some of my most favorite trips that we've had together have been like a couple hours away from us where we go hiking in a beautiful place.

Get a little cabin. Little Airbnb. Little Airbnb. And just enjoy outdoors together.

Right.

And it's simple, but it's so refreshing.

And you eat at your place. Like there's been times where we would cut corners in creative ways to make it possible where we would use our points to go fly, or we would just drive because we know we couldn't afford a flight, or we would, Make sure we had all our meals, you know, there getting something cheaper than having to go have a meal out every time and pay that kind of money. I get it. It can, it can add up. And, you know, some of you are seeing dollar signs, like the whole time we're talking and you're like, that sounds so amazing, but gosh, it just doesn't seem possible. You know, I can tell you 100%. Like, I get it. Dave gets it. We get it. We've had many years like that. And you also can feel guilty, like, well, but if I do this, that takes away from, You know, spending that money on our children. Let me tell you again, Dave's already said it. This is a gift not only to you all, but to your kids. And I think it's really healthy for your kids to see you take that time because they know that you love each other. And again, they might, if they're young and they don't understand, they may be like, why are you leaving me for a couple of days? I mean, you know, and of course, because they love you and it's not abandonment. You just have to remind them, listen, we love you and we miss you the whole time. But this is just mom and dad spending time together because we love each other and we're gonna be back soon. I'm gonna even bring you some goodies from our trip. I'm gonna bring you the special chocolate they make in this area. And then you're gonna forget we were even gone because I'm gonna bring you that little something. But it's so good. It really is like fresh wind in the sails of your marriage. And if you're watching this on YouTube, you probably see a twinkle in our eyes because it really is some of our most cherished memories. Yeah. And, just the laughter that happens. I think this too, I'm gonna say this, then we're gonna go into our question today. So many times we see couples who've been married maybe as long as we have or longer, they come to a point in their marriage where they're like, I don't think there's anything I don't know about my spouse. It's kind of like, we know everything about each other. What else is there to discover? Well, trips are, first of all, that's not true. But secondly, trips are one way to have, where you both are having a new experience together. and discovering something new about not only that area, but also about each other. Like, for example, when we went to Costa Rica for that second honeymoon, which was just this last year, we had the opportunity to do some different excursions and adventures together. And there was one that Dave wanted to do that I was just kind of like, oh, I don't know. And it was doing four-- what's it called? Four Runner? Not Four Runner. Riding ATVs. ATVs. Yes, four wheelers.

Through this jungle onto the beach.

Yes. And you were so excited and honestly.

She was not into it. But she did it for me.

I was like, I don't think I'm gonna like this, but it's for my husband. I can just tell how excited he is about it. So I was like, let's do this. I'm gonna kind of just go along is kind of what I told myself. You guys, we get on those ATVs and again, this Namu set it up for us. They took us to this place. It looks like a movie set. Like first of all, I mean, there's monkeys. Monkeys in the trees. Literally monkeys around, like spider monkeys eating bananas, literally eating bananas and fruit and stuff. and the people were just wonderful. We go and they start us out in the jungle and all of a sudden I hear this sound I've never heard. It's like this very guttural grunt roar type of thing from up above. And I was like, do they have like speakers like in the jungle? I mean, we're in a legit jungle. And our guide who was guiding us on the ATVs, he said, oh, no, ma'am. He said, those are howler monkeys. They're up above you in the canopy.

And I was like, and we looked.

Up and there's this monkey going. Oh, oh, oh, oh. Yeah. And I was like, What?

We're in it.

I'm so excited. Well, then we're going through the path. And again, they didn't allow the two of us to ride on the same ATV, so we each had our own and we're operating it. And I'm like, who am I right now? I turned 40 that year, and then I'm riding on an ATV. I'm like, I don't even know who I am right now. But we go, and it was probably an hour and a half trek to the ocean. And the whole time, it was just amazing.

The sights we saw.

And then riding on the beach.

Riding on the beach together. we were like the only ones there on this beach and it was, it.

Was the coolest thing.

It was just so cool. And it was one of those moments where I'm just like, thank you Lord.

That we did this, that we, I loved it. I want to do it again. We're doing it. It was, if you want to see footage of this, go to @davenashleywillis on Instagram. I have an entire thing about our travels if you want to see and get ideas. But if you're not into it, don't worry. But if you do want to see what we're talking about, you can actually get a visual because our guide was so gracious to take some video of it. But again, it was just a new experience together. And I think we discovered, like, it was just neat to do that together and be a little bit out of our comfort zone, but to get to experience something really cool.

So true. I'm going to share one fun fact and then we're going to do the question. Ashley said sometimes people don't do this stuff because we think I already know everything about my spouse. I read an interesting stat recently that said older couples are much less likely to be able to know what their spouse is thinking. than younger couples.

Really?

And the reason why for this research is that over time, most couples assume they know their spouse based on past experiences when their spouse has been changing, they've been changing, and instead of constantly communicating, there's just been more and more assumption and less communicating.

Yeah.

And in that, a lot of times, a couple who's been married the longest is actually most disconnected because they're making all these assumptions instead of really staying connected through communication, through all the changes of life. and like, I just don't want to be one of those couples that is slowly drifting apart through time, but we're constantly through every season of life, staying in tune, staying connected, learning new things about each other, experiencing new things together. And you can do that too. All right. So today's question, thanks for those who send questions. It says, my husband started a graduate program. We were working alongside three females most days. When it begins, they will have to travel together on long research trips. I don't want to interfere with his work, but I'm not comfortable with him traveling in a car alone with another female. How do I approach this with him?

That's a great question. And something we've talked about a lot on here about boundaries and just kind of being beyond reproach. It sounds like if they have to travel together, it sounds like they might all be together. And if they're all together, I don't know if that's as much of an issue. I do think the one-on-one could be concerning.

Sure.

I think it's really good that you're bringing up this question to us, but I would say if you haven't already, please talk to your husband about this because I think that he needs to be aware, not to make him have anxiety about it, but just to be aware and say, you know, I'm not really comfortable. Is there any way that, you know, if it's just the two of you, maybe you drive separately? I mean, I know this sounds silly, but I've been in work situations where we have driven separately because there wasn't a group. And I think that that's just smart. I know for some people in the professional world, you're rolling your eyes right now. Like, and I get it. We may not see eye to eye on this because you're like, it's just.

A workmate, like not a big deal.

It doesn't mean I'm going to jump their bones. It's just Bob from accounting. It's not Bob from accounting. Right, exactly. That made me laugh. But, you know, it's the truth. And you guys, I get it. I really do get it. I get that you're like, why are you making this so cumbersome? But let me tell you, for how many times we've shared something like this on our Facebook marriage page or in an Instagram post, You know, there might be one person who says what I just said, like, wait, it's just a work made, who cares? But then I get like 10 other comments who are like, thank you for talking about this. I didn't have boundaries in place and fell into this. And I'm so regretful. Like I would tell everyone I know to make sure they're beyond reproach because none of us are beyond temptation. You know, you just never know what kind of situation you want to find yourself in. And I would just say if there has to be just two people try to drive separately or, Even better saving on gas driving a group in that way that there's none of this one-on-one kind of business going on. When it comes to sun protection, why are consumers obsessed with Shiseido Clear Sunscreen Stick SPF 50+? They say, As a woman of color, it doesn't leave a white cast and is dermatologist-approved. It glides on smoothly, feels lightweight, and doesn't leave a greasy finish. Perfect for reapplying on the go. Plus, it doesn't disturb my makeup. Discover Shiseido Clear Sunscreen Stick SPF 50+ PF50+ for yourself. Shop now at Ulta before it sells out.

It might lead to some awkward conversations, but ultimately, I think it could bring people to even have more respect for your marriage. Yeah. Say, listen, this might seem like a weird rule. It has nothing at all to do with you or any individual for that matter, but early on, my wife and I, my husband and I decided that just to kind of protect our marriage, and to keep us from being in a position to be tempted or talked about, we were gonna have this rule. We're not gonna be alone one-on-one with anybody of the opposite sex. And it's created some inconveniences, it's created some awkwardness, but ultimately it's something that has safeguarded our marriage. And it's just something we stick to. And so just so y'all know right out of the gate, that's kind of a rule. So I can do stuff in group settings, But, but I won't be able to do stuff one-on-one and maybe it's you, if you're and your husband can agree on that rule, then he can maybe send out a text or an email all at once. So it's not like singling out any one lady and just saying like, hey, I know we're gonna be working together. I'm looking forward to that. I'm sure we'll be in group settings and that's great too. But I wanted you to know about.

This rule, which might again seem weird, but it's something that's really, you know, important to us and it's just out.

Of respect not only for my wife, but for others.

I've seen this not work out so well.

Because we have seen, we've seen this.

We've seen it, literally seen it.

Like, I can give you names of.

People, which we would never do.

We would make fun of us for this rule that ended up getting their marriage in serious trouble because they didn't.

Have rules like this. And it breaks our heart.

And it's heartbreaking.

That is just heartbreaking.

Absolutely. No satisfaction of them, like, you know, being proven wrong, so to speak, on this. But, guys, it's, It's sometimes- Just avoid it. I mean, that's- Sometimes your marriage has to look weird, 'cause what the world says is normal isn't working. The world says that normal marriage is like, you're just disconnected, you have separate accounts, you have separate lives, you have separate friends, you have separate everything. And that's normal. But guys, normal doesn't work. Normal, you're not listening to this 'cause you want a normal marriage. You're listening to this because you want a healthy marriage, a naked marriage. And that's gonna require doing some stuff that the world might think is weird. Because if what the world thinks is normal isn't working, then what is healthy is going to look weird to a lot of people. And don't be afraid to look a little weird sometimes. It's worth it. I want to say this too.

At the end of her question, she said, well, how do I approach this with him? I think she's worried that he's going to feel like she doesn't trust him. And I would say this, if he says something like that, I would say, listen, it's because I do trust you. And I feel like where we are right now, I don't want anything to come between us. I want to keep going towards the healthy marriage that we're cultivating and not going away from it. And I also don't want to be, I don't want either one of us to be wondering, like, you know, oh no, is there some kind of weird bond happening with this, this other lady or whatever? Because, you know, the truth is, on long car rides, you have to have conversation. It would be more awkward for him to be like, okay, I'm just gonna be like Fort Knox over here, just not talking to this lady. I mean, then it like, , would really make it weird. It's almost better just to have two different cars. So there's not that awkwardness. Right. And so it's just, I think it's just being very honest, but also looking for, okay, what, what is that? How are we going to handle this? Like as a couple, decide what, what method of kind of handling this, making sure you're beyond reproach, beyond temptation. Um, really, none of us are beyond temptation, but, you know, putting us in a place where we're not just asking for it.

Right?

And we're just really trying to have healthy boundaries, talk about that together, and then together decide, okay, what's this gonna look like?

So thanks so much for tuning in, guys. We'll see you next time.

Bye-bye.