Marriage Pitfalls

Welcome to the Naked Marriage podcast. We are Dave and Ashley Willis, and on this podcast, we address the truth about sex, intimacy, and lifelong love. We're so excited that you've joined us today. We've got a great topic and we've also got a great question at the end. At the end of every one of these episodes, we do a question and answer time. The questions you guys send in are great and I just love today's question, so make sure you stick around for that. But before we dive in, Ashley wants to share a recent review. And we so appreciate you taking the time to leave reviews on iTunes, Spotify, YouTube, wherever you're listening. We read them, they encourage us, and we love you guys for doing it. So, sweetie, why don't you share one with us?

Sure. So today's Review is from Snell4. It's entitled Amazing. Gave a five star review.

Thank you.

It says so much truth to these podcasts. Love listening to them to continue to build my marriage. Thank you so much for leading that. And again, like Dave said, we just appreciate you all even taking the time to leave a review. And. And before we hop into today's episode, we want to tell you about this great new resource. When the holidays start to feel a bit repetitive, reach for a Sprite Winter Spiced Cranberry and put your twist on tradition. A bold cranberry and winter spice flavor fusion Sprite Winter Spice Cranberry is a refreshing way to shake things up this sipping season. And only for a limited time. Sprite obey your thirst. Well, I'm excited about this topic today because we're going to be talking about how to avoid pitfalls when it comes to your marriage. And you know, there's pitfalls in every different facet of life. I actually read a book many years ago by Beth Moore, one of my favorite authors, and it was called get out of that Pit. And in the book, she describes how there's really like three different kinds of ways that we fall into pits or things that kind of end up being, you know, harmful in our life. And she says the first way is you're running towards it. Like you're running towards the sin. You're running towards the behavior you know is ultimately going to hurt you, but you're going there anyway. So you're running to that pit. The second way is you kind of, without realizing it, fall into the pit. So you weren't necessarily running after it, but you were kind of tiptoeing around it and you fall in. And the third one is you're thrown in by some or some kind of other circumstance. Just by life being hard, you're thrown in this pit, and you kind of find yourself there. And as I was reading that book, I remember thinking to myself, when it comes to marriage specifically, you know, it's kind of that way when it comes to pitfalls in marriage, that we sometimes run after it by a behavior we know is ultimately gonna hurt our spouse. But maybe we're brazen, and we're bored and lonely, and so maybe we go and we have an affair. We do it because we just are wanting to feel something. So we're kind of running towards that pit. But I think there's a lot of times when we're tiptoeing around something, like maybe we're flirting with another person, or maybe we're looking up that old flame online. And before you know it, we didn't go after the pit, but we find ourselves maybe in some behaviors that are unhealthy and harmful to our marriage. And then again, there's other times when there's just hardship that happens to us and we don't see it coming, like a diagnosis or. Or maybe just some kind of catastrophe in your life where suddenly you're in this pit, and you're like, how did we get here? I mean, we were doing the right things, and suddenly we're in this pit. So we're gonna talk about all those things and how to avoid the pits. But also towards the end, for those of you who are listening to this and you're like, listen, I'm in the middle of it. Like, I. You know, I'm in a pit. My spouse is in a pit, too. Maybe you even feel like you're in two different pits. You're not even in the same pit right now, and you're like, how do we even communicate when we're in two different pits? Or we have a message for you towards the end as well.

That's right. Yeah. And I know that right now, collectively, as we record this, we're kind of all globally in a pit together, so to speak, with the pandemic, the COVID 19 situation still kind of raging strong. So if you're listening to this in a time where that's still happening, then we all can relate to just some of the unique struggles that we're all facing, not only as married couples, but as individuals of all kinds and all seasons of life. But even long after that's gone, pits are just part of life.

They are.

I would even add, in marriage. I think a fourth pit would be the armpit. And the reason why I point that one out is because when mine start really stinking.

Oh, wow.

And I get close to, there's this pungent kind of goat like smell. He calls it the goat smell that it takes on, which is actually something.

Your dad came up with or your mom, I can't remember.

And it can create marital conflict, you know, so, like, this is not a podcast episode about personal hygiene, though I have found marriage goes better when. When I wear deodorant and bathe regularly. So.

And you, you do have some great personal hygiene. But we've been taking a lot of walks recently. And you run too. Like, he's been doing amazing. He's been running once a day and then walking with me once a day, sometimes even walking the dog or even walking with some of our sons. And so by the end of the day, it's pretty ripe.

Yeah. So. And I'm kind of nose blind to it. I don't see it.

But you're there to point out.

But we know that there are much more serious bits than just a little bit of. A little bit of odor. And we're talking about those bigger things. And some of them can be small, some can be big. I mean, we've had a recent podcast episode that you might have heard with our friends Tyler and Alyssa Gordon talking about overcoming past sexual abuse, which is just a horrific example of something. She was being thrown into a pit through no fault of her own, just by being treated in such a terrible way in that circumstance by her stepfather. And I think sometimes those past wounds can create current pits if we're not dealing with them in a way that's going to bring healing. And sometimes, though it's not something that tragic or that deep. It can just be a prolonged season of discouragement or it can be little nitpicky things in your marriage that are. That are causing you to be unkind to each other or sarcastic to each other instead of really sympathetic and encouraging. And we just have to constantly be self aware of what's happening in our own life, in our own heart, our own words, and in our own marriage to help each other pull each other out of that instead of pushing each other into those negative circumstances.

Well, I think really the first step is knowing kind of what pitch you have fallen in in the past, because. And we have to be self aware, like Dave said about this, but also we have to be brutally honest with our spouse in the most loving way possible about these past pitfalls that we fell for and that we. That really Caused us trouble. And you might be at a place where you really dug yourself out of that, where God has healed you, and you're out of that. But I think knowing kind of your kind of frailty, your own frailty, and where you might be vulnerable and falling back into that pit, it's so important to be aware of that. And in order to be aware of that as a couple, you have to be honest. You know, the Naked Marriage podcast is all about honesty, being completely open and honest, knowing each other in every way. Right. And so we have to be honest about these things. And there's one in particular that I feel like has really affected more people recently during quarantine, and that's the issue of pornography. And we're not gonna dwell on it because we have a ton of podcasts on it. So you can go back and listen specifically to our story. But just kind of to give the short of it, this was a pit that Dave had been in for years that I didn't know about at the beginning of our marriage. And so what we did at the beginning that I wouldn't have done had I known about this pit was we put a computer in a basement. Okay. So if you had a past porn problem, the last thing you do is go put a computer or any kind of device in a place of secrecy or did not have filters. You know, that was a long time ago, before we had cell phones that we could take anywhere. But I would say in today's time, it would be the equivalent of not having any filters on your phone or your devices. And so in those early, you know, the early kind of couple years of our marriage, me not knowing about this, I didn't even know that that was something that could have been. That was a pitfall for Dave. And so here we go. We move into a new house, put the computer in the basement. Because it happened to be where the best, like, Internet hookup was. And I was just creating, you know, without knowing it, this situation where Dave was vulnerable. And what happened, he ended up falling into that pit.

Yeah. Yeah. And I didn't deal with it the right way. Like, I tried to kind of climb out of that pit on my own instead of confessing that I needed help getting accountability, doing all the things God says to do when you're caught in a cycle of sin. I just let pride say, no, I'll deal with this on my own. Or maybe it's. Maybe it's not even a problem. I knew it was a problem by that point, but I just was afraid to Deal with that problem in a healthy way. And it took it coming out into the open for us to finally move forward and get healing. And so if you're dealing with any kind of struggle in secret right now and right now with the stress, I know that many of us are facing kind of under quarantine and the financial pressures that we're feeling. In fact, next week's episode, tune in. We've got a great episode coming up on kind of dealing with finances together in a healthy way. But I think a lot of us are turning in this difficult time to things that are making problems worse instead of better. We're over drinking, we're over eating, we're turning to things for comfort in an unhealthy way. And then it's creating sometimes these secret habits that are beginning, that are creating a wedge in your marriage. And so you have to, again, just be so self aware, be accountable to one another, right? Talk through these things and be very, very careful about the habits that you're starting because don't start some habit that you're gonna wanna quit someday.

It's so true. And you know, I brought up the pornography issue in particular because just the other day I received multiple emails from different, different places. Like from. Well, it wasn't just emails. It was an email, you know, several emails. And then it was several messages on Facebook and even on Instagram we were getting some DMs and it all had to do with this issue of pornography. And it was these wives writing me saying, and it's not just a husband issue, but it is. You know, stats say that it is more of an issue with husbands than it is with wives. But it certainly can go both ways. And it was these wives writing me saying like, I thought my husband was over this, but I found evidence that he's been doing this, or I walked in on him doing this. And they're just, you know, they're already feeling squeezed. But then to have this layer of a sin they thought their husband had overcome coming back in their life, it can be devastating. And so we wanna talk about this pitfall because maybe that's you. Maybe you've considered getting back into that old bad habit, or maybe you've been dealing with that and we just wanna encourage you to stop, to confess it to first and foremost the Lord. He already knows it's going on anyway. But we need to do that. It's the first step in having freedom from the sin in your life. But then also as a married person, we to need, we have to take that next step and tell our spouse and then be very apologetic. Be willing to do what you can to regain their trust and to get the help that you need. And we often recommend a great site for this. In particular, it's xxxchurch.com where there's filters and there's articles and there's even. I believe they still have online counselors that can walk you through this. But again, if you need more information about this, you can go back and listen to our episodes on pornography. But that is one that I do feel like, you know, the enemy is having a heyday with that and really pulling people back into the pit of the sin of pornography. And so we have to be so careful.

Well, and part of his. The enemy's lie about it is that it's not a sin at all. Right. And I think that that's maybe the most toxic lie our culture has believed that there's nothing wrong with this. This is just, I'm an adult. This is entertainment. You're just a prude or some kind of backward legalist to tell me that it's wrong. And we could tell you all day that the biblical reasons why it's wrong. I mean, Jesus said to look at a woman with lust is to commit ad in your heart. And there are many other places we could point to in scripture. There are all kinds of neuroscience and psychological research that's been done to talk about the devastating long term impacts of porn. You gotta admit that it's wrong. You've gotta start there. And again, we talk a lot more about this in those past episodes. Also our book, the Naked Marriage, where we dive into our own testimony in greater detail. And it's not just a book about porn. It's about thriving in your marriage. But we do spend some time on it, so.

And how Dave was able to overcome that. So we want you to know that there's hope. But we want to, on this episode specifically, we're talking about porn because it is one of those pitfalls that it gets so many couples and it causes so much damage. And so we just want to warn you to not fall for that. Don't fall for it.

And if you're there, don't stay there.

Don't say it's harmless. Yeah. And don't stay there. Get the help that you need. But I do think there's some other things that a lot of people kind of tiptoe around and that Dave brought up drinking. I think that drinking is one of those things where people tiptoe around that pit for a While. And then when hard times come, like time of quarantine or maybe something else happened in your life and you got some really bad news, and all of a sudden you go to drinking more than you normally would, and you start drinking more and more, and then it becomes more frequent. Like you're drinking more nights during the week, and before you know it, you're falling into the pit of alcoholism.

And.

And so we have to be so keenly aware of our own behavior. And as a spouse, you know, as a loving spouse, if you notice these unhealthy behaviors in your spouse, don't shy away from saying something. I think sometimes we convince ourselves, like, oh, it's just gonna fix itself. She's just, you know, she's just coping. It's just a phase. It's just quarantine. It's just this phase of depression she's gone through, or it's just this time of job loss. I mean, he's just coping. It's no big deal. And so we convince ourselves not to say something because honestly, deep in our heart, we're like, I don't wanna deal with it. Like, I'm. I don't want to fight numb, right? And so I just want to encourage you. Don't listen to that bad self talk. Because again, avoidance never solves anything, okay? Especially when you see your spouse hurting themselves. When you see your spouse going down that road and saying, listen, I love you. I'm not judging you. Any of us can fall into this pit, but I see you, literally, you are on the edge and you're about to fall down that pit, and I don't want to see you do that. And it's so much better. You all, when you were right next to that pit to walk away and grab. It's kind of like symbolically grabbing your spouse's hand and saying, I'm here beside you. I'm that person in your corner who is for you and not against you. And God has better things for you than you fallen for this pit just because you're lonely or you're sad or you're coping. And, you know, I've been seeing such wonderful kind of posts on Facebook, and I saw one the other day, especially during this time of quarantine, where it was talking about how we need to be so careful who. And kind of where we go, so to speak, in behaviors, behavior wise, when it comes to seeking refuge. Because right now there is so much uncertainty and we're all so prone to seeking refuge in maybe some old habits because it feels good. At the time. And so, you know, we need to be very careful not to go anyplace except when it comes to the Lord. I mean, he is our refuge. I mean, he literally is that refuge where when we're feeling lonely, you know, even our spouse can't cure our loneliness. We need to take it to Jesus. We need to go to the cross and say, God, help me, help me.

It is. Gosh, that's so, so true. We have to be so self aware because a lot of times a good thing can become a pit if a good thing is used in a bad way.

Exactly.

Something like porn is bad all of the time. But a lot of things that we'll turn to can start out good. Like food is a good thing. Yeah, I love food. It's amazing, man. It is so, so, so good. But when we start turning to food to be this, like, this unnatural source of comfort where we're just like way overindulging, you know, like entertainment can be a good thing. It can be nice to just chill and watch a movie, you know, Netflix and chill for a while. But when we just overdo it and we start losing ourselves and just streaming something 247 and we've lost the will to do anything else, that can be a bad thing. You know, I know there's probably in Christian circles some debate about alcohol itself. You know, I believe that we have a lot of freedom to be able to enjoy a glass of wine or whatever as a gift from God. And I could, you know, point to a lot of scriptures that seem to support that. But that's one of those areas that very quickly, when it turns into an overindulgence, can. Can have all kinds of side effects, you know, and it can hurt your health, it can hurt your relationships and lead to an addiction. You know, we had my friend Eric Kennedy here, we interviewed him and Kristin about a month ago on the podcast, talking about addiction issues in marriage. And he talked about how he fell hard into alcoholism and just what that did in his family. And thankfully, he's been sober for a decade and is a great testimony of God's healing power in that area. But we're not talking about any of these things to try to be a stick in the mud or say, just don't do this, don't do this, don't do this. But to just say, God wants good things for you. Jesus said, I've come to give a full and abundant. And if we're turning to anything other than him as that source for a full and abundant life, then ultimately we're going to be let down and possibly even harmed and stuck in a pit because of turning to those wrong things. And so we just, we have to be self aware. Black Friday Savings are here at the Home Depot, which means it's time to add new cordless power to your collection. Right now, when you buy a select battery kit from one of our top brands like Ryobi or Milwaukee, you'll get a select tool from that same brand for free. Click into one of our best deals of the season and stock up on tools for all your upcoming projects. Get Black Friday Savings happening now at the Home Depot. Limit one per transaction exclusion supply full eligible tool list in store and online.

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Wow.

I want to talk a minute about another thing that isn't bad on the surface and done in moderation, but can get to be a really bad thing if we use it in the wrong way or if we use it too much. And that is social media. And you guys know we are huge fans. I mean that's, that's a big way we do.

That's how we connect with you guys.

How we connect with you all. We love it. We think it is an amazing tool that can be used in powerful ways. But when it becomes kind of like Dave was talking about with the streaming Netflix or whatever kind of TV you like to watch, when we overdo it, we can get lost in some really bad pits and bad habits. And one of those, you know, I talk about this in my book Peace Pirates, which is available now. It came out on April 7th. And you might as well, you can call it, you know, peace pits. It's kind of the same thing is, you know, one of those is comparison. And how we can get lost in the pit of comparison is so easy when it comes to social media. And I've heard so many people say during this time of quarantine, it's become a little bit more of an issue because they're looking at these people putting their highlight reels on social media and how they're handling homeschooling and how they're handling quarantine and all the little Highlights. They're looking at that, and then they're looking at themselves, and they're like, wow, I am totally blowing this. Like, I'm failing miserable. I am failing miserably. I don't feel as peachy as these people seem to feel on Facebook or Instagram. I don't have those perfect pictures of my kids doing all these amazing things or my spouse and I doing creative date nights at home. I don't have that. Like, I must be a total failure. And so you have to be so quick to catch yourself and getting lost in the pit of comparison because it will steal your peace. It's a peace pirate. Because what happens is we lose our focus. And instead, you know, we could have woken up that morning, said our prayers, and we feel so thankful for the people that God has placed in our home. And we're like, this is. I can do this. You know, today's a good day. And then you start, you know, getting lost in social media, and you're like, wait a minute. We're not doing good. This is not a good day. I'm totally failing. My spouse is a loser. I'm a loser. My kids are failing. We are just totally missing all of these things. And then you start looking at your family, the ones you love the most, in a negative light. And then what naturally happens is we don't treat them like we should. We maybe have more angst in our voice than we were intending. And we're not, you know, having the loving conversations and the loving reactions that we would like to have. So please don't fall for that. But there's an even more sinister way that social media can drag you right into a pit when it comes to marriage specifically. And that is when you're bored. And maybe. Maybe you're bored even when it comes to your marriage, and you start looking up old flames. And then you take it a step further, and you reach out to that old flame, and that old flame reaches back, and before you know it, you have tiptoed around the pit, and you fall in, and you're caught in an emotional affair. And I hear from so many people, you all. Dave and I both have sat across, you know, in a counseling room. We've sat across the couch with a couple that. That is sitting far apart, and they're so hurt. And you hear one spouse say, I never meant to do this. It was harmless. I just wanted to know what that old flame was doing. I just. I was just curious. And I never thought that we would reconnect in the way that we did. And that I would do the things that I did and hurt my spouse in the process. And so, please, please. There is no good that can come from you looking up old flames. Nope, there's not any good.

Yeah. There's nowhere positive that that's gonna go. And so if that is a fire that you're playing with, then just.

You're gonna back off of that. Stop it.

Yeah, stop. Stop it. Nothing good is gonna come from that. We've got a whole episode on social media that I encourage you to go back and listen to if you haven't, because I do think that while Ashley said it is a great, great tool, it can, when misused, be something that can really cause a lot of damage in your marriage. But if you want to use social media for good, we would love to connect with you on social media. So we're on Instagram avanashleywillis. You can search just the word marriage on Facebook and find our marriage page. Or you can find us individually on Facebook as well on those public pages. We love to interact with you. There's. We reply to the messages you send there. And we love the good that social media can bring, but we also are just aware that it can cause some harm. So when we're talking about these pits, kind of a theme that has been in this whole episode, just to break it down as simply as we can, is to be aware that small negative mindsets and small negative decisions inevitably lead to bigger, bigger negative mindsets and decisions. And on the flip side of that, healthy choices and healthy mindsets will lead to more healthy choices and healthy mindsets. I'm telling you, on the days that I start out by carving out time to read the Bible for a few minutes and get alone with God for a few minutes before the chaos of the day sets in, those days go better, because that good decision, it kind of like, centers my heart and my mind the right places. You know, I'm more likely to. I'm more likely to make healthier choices, starting with, like, what I'm going to eat for breakfast, to am I going to go exercise or not? And one healthy choice builds on another. But negative choices tend to snowball as well. And so if you find yourself in kind of that negative rut, which we've all been in at times, I'm not trying to preach at you as a guy that's never been there. I am prone to make some stupid ongoing decisions, but we got to pull ourselves out of it and say, all right, this negative snowball has rolled long enough, and I'm going to stop and I'm going to start doing some healthier things.

You know, it just reminds me of what repentance really is. Repentance is literally just turning around and walking in the right direction.

It's that simple, you know?

Cause so many times we are, you know, whether. I think a lot of times it's because of how we feel. And right now, so many of you are feeling squeezed. We're feeling squeezed. I mean, we take turns having good days and bad days, and we try to drag each other out of the. It's my turn to heaven some days, you know, And Dave's like, no, no, don't walk down that path.

You had a bad day yesterday. It's my turn to be mad.

Exactly. And so it's like, as spouses again, we have to be in each other's corner. And really, if we see our spouse circling that pit, you know, again, go and grab their hand and say, no, no, don't go down that way. We don't have to do that. You don't have to keep on walking down that direction. I want you to come over here, and God wants you to come over here. Because don't let your feelings be your guide. You know, oftentimes those negative feelings that Dave is talking about, it might as well be footsteps towards the pit. And so what do we do? We repent and we walk the other way and we say, jesus, help me. And we need God's help. You know, we can't do it in our own strength. We have to have God's help. And when it comes to peace, right now, I know you guys are lacking peace. We have to just turn and say, God, help me. You are the one who brings me peace. And he will bring you peace. In the midst of this chaos, when it comes to feeling like you're tempted to do something you know is wrong, God is the one who's gonna help you out of that temptation. None of us. Listen, guys, none of us are beyond temptation. It takes us putting healthy boundaries in place and then really respecting those boundaries and not. Not crossing them into the pit, so to speak. And it takes God's help in doing this because all of us are prone to temptation. And so during this time when you're feeling squeezed, you have to tune into the Lord and say, God, help me, because we need his help. We need his help to make the right choice, to make the right decision to repent and turn the other way. And, you know, thankfully, his mercies are new every morning. He gives us lots of grace. We need to give our spouse lots of grace, but also, you know, be willing to point out maybe some unhealthy behaviors when we see them. And so, you know, the whole message of this episode is that we just want all of us to not fall for these things that tend to take us into a pit and just be so intentional and so keenly aware of our own frailty and our own vulnerability and to be willing to turn the other way and to walk away from these pits for the good for yourself personally, but also for the good of your marriage.

That's so true. One final challenge I give before we dive into this week's question is that the friends that you're, the friendships you're investing in, I think we all have some people in our lives that are prone to pull us into pits. And we have friends that are there to encourage us and pull us out and foster the kind of friendships of those people that are going to pull you out. You know, a good buddy of mine, Curran, called me this morning and I was just, you know, walking the dog and talking to him and just so encouraged by that phone call and just reminded of the gift it is to have good friends in our lives, even if they live states away. When we foster those relationships, it does so much to kind of keep us on the right track and invite accountability into our lives and the encouragement and the laughter that can come when you just have got a lot of shared experience with somebody. But you've got to keep fostering those kind of relationships. So, yeah, make sure your spouse is your best friend. Make sure you're focusing on your relationship with Jesus, but also foster friendships that are going to help pull you out of the pit and maybe create some distance from people that every time they're around, they want to pull you down into a pit. So we've got to make friendship a big part of the equation.

So true. I love that. And be thankful. Thank God for the great friends in your life, because they really are treasure. They're just treasure in your life.

It's a gift and you gotta keep fostering that. So we got a great question today. Thank you, guys. For those who send in questions, you can send us questions@nakedmarriagepodcast.com we also get a lot of questions on social media which we try to answer in real time. So send us questions there as well. But the ones we answer on the air are the ones that are submitted through the website. Sweetie, would you like to read this today's question?

I love, I love The Q and A. So thank you again for sending these in. Here is our Q and A for today. It says, I'd love to get your advice and thoughts on physical appearance fitness in marriage. I've been struggling a lot with my husband's lack of desire to be healthy, both in his diet, but also getting exercise. I don't want to sound vain by any stretch, but it's less about weight gain, but more about showing up for us as his best self and wanting to live a healthy, strong life for our future family. While I am consistently working out, walking the dog, et cetera, he isn't doing any of that. It has caused me to feel frustration towards him and lack of desire for intimacy. Thank you for all you do. Listening to your podcast, praying God's blessing over your ministry. Thank you so much for that question. And I think that's a great, honest question that so many people can relate to.

Yeah, yeah, no, it really, really is. And it's a delicate balance.

It is.

Because on one hand, as a spouse, we're called to, like, challenge each other toward. Toward better things. But on the other hand, we're also called to love our spouse right as they are and to encourage them and to let them know, I love you just, just as you are, while also helping them become their best self. And so finding that balance where you're helping him while not crushing him by making him feel like, well, I'm not good enough for her. She's not attracted to me. It's a tough place to be for both. I mean, I totally get where she's coming from and the frustration she's feeling. But it's a delicate situation.

It is delicate. And Dave and I can totally relate to this. I mean, you guys, through the course of our almost 20 year marriage, I've probably had about a 30 to 40 pound swing, I'll be honest.

Yeah.

And I've had, and this is not counting pregnancy, okay.

No, no. And I've not been pregnant that I know of. And I've had probably a 40 pound swing. So without a baby, like, so I was really, really working overtime. We've had some. We've had some chubby days. And you know what?

Secretly I'm laughing in here because it's just the truth.

I loved the chubby days because.

More to love, man.

Yeah, there was more to love. I was. I was just a squishy love machine, I guess. I don't know. Not really. I felt pretty bad. But I also enjoyed eating potato skins at midnight. And so it's like you gotta live sometimes, I guess. But I will say that throughout our marriage, we've tried to. We've tried to find that balance of, like, being able to just love each other right where we were in whatever situation we were in and truly meaning it. Like, hey, you're. I'm so attracted to you right now, just as you.

Well, you would always reassure me, because I always, like, when I felt extra voluptuous, which that's what Dave would call it because I would just call it fat, but he would call it voluptuous. I would just be like, oh, you know, I'd have a day where I was eating potato skins at midnight, and then I'd be like, oh, I'm so overweight. And he's like, sweetie, you just. You're beautiful. And he would make me feel good.

I meant it.

And I know you meant it. You're like, it's just variety.

It's variety.

And I'm like, okay. But it made me feel good. Because let me tell you something. Shaming somebody for their body is not motivating.

Oh, man. Yeah.

It's never motivating. And I've learned this the hard way because, Dave, I've always loved your body, no matter what. But there was this one season, actually, right after we moved to Texas, we both had gained weight. That was about two years ago. We were talking with this about with our friends last night. But we both put on a little weight, I think just eating, feeling we're both stressed because moves are hard.

We'll comfort each other over a pint of ice cream.

Well, not for me, it's not. For you, it's ice cream. For me, it's honey wheat pretzels. It's Cape Cod, kettle chips. Yeah, Anything crunchy.

I like the ice cream.

And you guys know who've listened to the podcast, he hates my crunching. So we may eat this separately. Like, he's eating ice cream in one room. I'm eating my pretzels and loving it in the other room along with my ice chips. But, you know, so, yes, we are stress eaters, but I will tell you, you know, it. I went through this phase after we realized, oh, we've put on this weight. We need to do something. And I was like, let's do keto. Let's both do it. And I was kind of militant about it. I, like, stopped buying anything that Dave loved. And, yeah, he hated it, like, so bad.

It was not a joint decision.

It was like, what was wrong with.

Me on, we're doing keto. And here's what we've learned is, like, we can join each other in health journeys, but neither of us can ever force the other to do anything.

And when we try, we can't force the framework. The way in which the framework, like.

When Ashley said, oh, you know, we're doing keto, or we're doing, doing this program or this thing, and we're going to do it together, like, for us, that always backfires. But when we each individually find a rhythm that works for us and then support each other in that.

Yes.

Then we found that that's been great and part of how we've joined each other and that is, like, we talk about this a lot. We go on a long walk together pretty much every day. And that not only is one aspect of, like, our health, but that's something we both enjoy that helps keep us connected. And we're not monitoring what the other one is eating or doing anything weird.

Like, that's never helped us.

It's never, ever, ever been good for us. We just kind of cheer each other on and whatever the other is doing and try to encourage healthy habits. We also try to, like, live and enjoy some junk food together, too, sometimes. But in whatever season you're in, you have to start with encouragement. Your spouse has to know, first and foremost, I love you. I'm drawn to you. I'm attracted to you. I adore you. I am committed to you. I want good things for you. That has to be where every conversation starts and then, you know, and then go from there. I know you're talking specifically about, like, lack of sex drive, lack of desire for intimacy because you're frustrated by him or you're, you know, maybe even though it's a word you didn't use, even, like, disgusted by, by either his body or by the habits he's taken on. And you're not drawn to him because you see him as not taking initiative and those things that you're drawn to. And if he doesn't care, why should you care? And I get that mindset, too. But what we have to realize in marriage is it's never our job to change our spouse. It's our job to love our spouse and to help encourage them. And God's the only one, along with that person themselves, who can ever change a person.

Yeah.

And so you, you keep loving and asking God to do a work in your heart to say, right, like, lord, look, while I'm waiting on. On my husband to hopefully adopt some healthier habits, help me be his biggest encourager. You know, help Me cheer him on in things he's doing now, instead of making him feel like my love is conditional in some ways. And give me a desire for him, even in. In this state right now, give me a desire for him.

Right.

And. And I believe that God will start right where you are. He won't wait for your husband to have abs. You know, you guys can. Because if that's the criteria, then Ashley would never have been attracted to me. I've always had a little laundry on the washboard.

You know, I'm a leg woman. I love you.

Oh, yeah. Well, yeah. Talked about this. You do like my legs.

So it's an ongoing joke in the family. I told Dave, seriously, I said, if you could have a mold made of your leg, like, into a charm, I would wear it around my neck. And that's probably the creepiest thing I've ever said.

I've looked into it. It's.

Our audio engineer and producer think we're weirdos, but it's an ongoing joke in our family because.

Oh, they're not even attractive legs is why. I don't get it. It's. Cause, like, the bottom half is tan, the top half's totally white. There's way too much hair. It's like, I don't get the appeal, but I'm glad you like them.

I love them, but that's neither here nor there. But the truth is, I think, you know, with this wife who's written in. I know we've had a lot of laughter here, but it is a real issue. And I do think it really does start with really asking God to change your perspective. Because here's the deal. What if your husband never changes? You know, we can't just keep on holding out this hope that he's suddenly gonna wanna have abs or whatever it is. And so, you know, just loving him right where he is in the season that he's in, and really not focusing so much on the physical, but really the good attributes he has that aren't physical, like how he loves your kids if you have kids, or how hard he works at his job, or, you know, how he does these sweet little things for you and just clinging to that, because I think sometimes we can become so hyper focused on these little things that we wish would change that we stop seeing the good things. We stop seeing the really amazing man that he is. And so I just challenge you to really kind of refocus your mind on.

That and don't believe the lie that you cannot have a great marriage if he's not in great shape, you know?

Oh, my gosh. Yes.

I'm telling you, some of the happiest couples I know, they don't care a thing about their diet or their exercise. I think we should all work towards health and all of that, but just know that, like, it's God's plan for love and marriage is so much deeper than what we. Than the superficial. Right. You know, Bible says God looks. The world looks at the outer appearance. God looks at the heart. And I think that in marriage, we have to look at the heart first, too. And then attraction comes from that. It's like our hearts being drawn to.

Each other, and it is. And, you know, looks fade. I mean, that's just. The truth is we're already, like, you know, Dave's in his early 40s. I'm hanging on to 30 for dear life. In my 30s for dear life.

39.

And so 39. Living it up. Living up the 39th year. But, you know, I mean, we're aging.

And actually joke about you're in your 40th year. Not to be. Oh, my gosh. Like, too specific.

I am, but I'm cling into the.

Age you started your 40th year. Just to get technical.

Okay, thank you. But, you know, we're already in those Middle Ages, and so the metabolisms change. You know, it's just. It's just part of life. And so we got to cling to other things besides the physical. Not that it's not important at all, but cling to the other attributes as well. Well, thank you all so much for listening and subscribing and leaving reviews. We just. We love that you take the time to listen to this every week, and we hope it's always a great encouragement to you, and we hope that you have a great week. We will see you next time.

Bye, guys.