GA 393 | Lean Storytelling with Adam Lawrence

If we don't have people engaged in the process, we get what we pay for. But if we have them engaged and they feel like they're part of it, you know, it's the hierarchy of needs, the feeling of belonging to something that's greater than ourselves.

Today, I'm very excited to welcome my friend Adam Lawrence back to the show. Now, regular listeners know Adam has been on the show several times, and we'll go ahead and link to those past episodes in the in the Show Notes. But today is an especially fun episode in my opinion. One of Adam's gifts is that he's a master storyteller. And really the best podcasts to me are when people are telling and sharing stories. And so today, Adam shares three of his favorite or some of his favorite stories from some Kaizen events that he's been involved in. You know, one had when he almost got himself fired. Another one was sort of a transformation of an associate. And just lots of really, really good lessons in these stories. So they're fun to listen to, but there's lots to learn from them as well. So show notes to everything that Adam and I talk about, including a link to Adam's book, the Wheel of Sustainability, which I highly recommend folks pick up. That's going to be all over on our Show Notes page. So go to GembaPodcast.com, look for episode 393. Finally, if you're enjoying the podcast, I really do appreciate I asked for this a few episodes ago for people to go give us a five star review if you like it and leave a little comment. And really, really excited to say that that happened. So thank you for those folks that did that. If you haven't done that and you do like the show, you know, please go give us a five star review and you know, share a few kind words. If you, if you think it's a three star show, maybe don't leave a. Just kidding. If you want to give us three stars, whatever us three stars. But we really appreciate it because it does help apparently in the, the algorithms of these podcast platforms. So whether you're on Spotify or the Apple podcast or Stitcher or whatever it is, it really does help us. So really appreciate it. Okay, enough from me. Let's get to the show. Adam, welcome back to the show. How's it going, my friend?

It's going well, Ron. Thanks for having me back.

Yeah, man. Well, thanks for coming on. We're going to link to all of your previous episodes. You know, you're one of a handful of Multi, multi, repeat guests. You know, we're gonna have Karen on next week, Karen Ross, and she's been on a bunch, but yeah, I guess you're in a competition maybe, you know, but every time I have you on, she comes on twice. So I don't know what's going on.

Well, you know, she keeps distancing herself. That's okay. I'll keep trying harder.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. But I really do appreciate you coming on, so. And you know the drill, Adam. We do like to have our guests share a quote. So do you want to get started with one?

Yeah, I sure do. So this one's from Clayton Christensen, who wrote one of my favorite books, not really in the Lean Space, but called the Innovator's Dilemma.

Oh, yeah.

And he really makes you think differently about products and disruptive technology. So he said, I think these are two quotes. I'm going to string them together. We hire products to do jobs for us, and understanding the job makes improvement simple. And I would encourage anybody listening to this if you have any interest. He tells a story about improving a milkshake and the job that a milkshake does. And it's just like a five minute video. Go on YouTube and check it out because it really makes you think. Nice. So anyway, that's my quote for today.

I love it. I love it. Good stuff. Hey, give us a rundown of your, of your background. Again, people listen regularly, probably remember you, but for those that haven't heard, just tell us. Who's Adam?

Yeah, so Adam went to school at Virginia Tech. So go Hokies. Right. Many moons ago, my first job was in Thomasville, North Carolina, at Thomasville Furniture. And I spent just about 30 years with the same corporate entity, going through a number of businesses in an engineering role and then a operations role and a corporate role and just doing things all over the world. The last six years, I was the lean champion for the same company in their technology processes. Last three and a half years, I've been out on my own with a company I called Process Improvement Partners. And I've been helping my clients solve complex business problems in a sustainable way. So I like to think of the people I work with as my extended family. We run lots of fun Kaizen events and we stay in touch and we implement sustainable processes. And they like to send me pictures of how things are working a couple years later. So I love seeing that.

Love it, love it, love it. Very good, very good, Adam. All right. Well, the thing I love about having you on, Adam, is that you are well You've got many gifts. You've obviously got a lot of background and really strong, lean thinker and all the rest of it. But you are a master storyteller, my friend. And so as we were brainstorming ideas of what to talk about today, you sent me over several, and one of them just jumped out. I think it was number five on your list.

List.

And it was something about, you know, some. Some of your favorite, you know, stories, crazy stories. I can't remember exactly how you worded it. Crazy things that have happened during Kaizen events. So I thought, man, that. That sounds really intriguing to me. So I know you got more than three. We'll just start with three, and we'll see how it goes. But what do you got, man? What. What was crazy about these. These events?

Well, so let's give you some background first before we get into any of. I actually listed six. I'm going to let you give me a number between one and six, and we'll. And we'll just do it that way, because I like them all. So what's great about Kaizen Events is if you expand people's thinking, they just come up with these amazing breakthroughs. But if you do things right, they connect to it emotionally, mentally. You know, the teams build so quickly, they get to do things they never got to do before. So when that happens and you're challenging convention, anything can happen, and often does. It can be emotional, it can be crazy, it can be, oh, Adam almost got fired. It can be almost anything. So I think what I like to do is create such a safe environment for the team members so that they can explore and be creative and get their inner child out and let nothing get in their way. And then we bring them back to reality by creating that sustainable process at the end or even during. So like I said, I got six that I listed out of hundreds. I'm going to let you. So, Ron, I'm putting it right back on you. You pick the first one and pick a number between one and six, and that's the story. I'll tell you. First.

Number four.

Number four. Okay, so this one comes out of a reliability event. So it was in Consumer Brands company in Missouri. And the idea was that their operating efficiencies were quite low and they know who they are, but I will not name them because I can only get myself in trouble, right? So the idea was I always take a Gemba walk, like weeks before the Kaizen to kind of get my mind centered around what is possible and kind of even scoping out what type of tools and application and what even the team should be. So it's very clear to me that reliability was the issue with this area. So we got a team together. Many crew members. They had never really been part of a Kaizen event before, so got one member from each crew and a bunch of other supporting folks and even from other locations. But it became apparent early in the Kaizen that some of the various crew members were not fond of each other. To put it nicely.

Okay.

And not to put people in a box. There were three female crew members that clearly did not like each other. Clearly did not like each other. But yet we were. We were working together. So during the week, they were working on sub in subgroups, working on different parts of the line and really learning how to level and square and do all sorts of things to make the line run better. Because I teach those techniques that were actually quite simple, thank goodness. Because I couldn't do it otherwise. Yeah. But we came to a point where we actually had the line running in a very smooth flowing way. Something that they admitted they had never seen before, which was cool. Based upon the numbers, you could tell that they absolutely, positively had never run it that way. It was now much cleaner, much organized. We removed a lot of equipment. There were three lanes of for products to go through, but they only ran two. So the first question is, how many. How many lanes of products do you run? And they said two. Okay, so why are there three lanes here? We don't know. So what would you like to do with that lane? I says. And they look at each other. Well, I don't know. Can we get rid of it? Ah, what a great idea. So we did. And it helped because it made it easier to operate the line. You know, all sorts of things were leaving. So they started to believe during the week that they had the autonomy authority to make the line better and do it their way. Okay. So we get to the point where we've done all the physical stuff. Now we need to create some standard work. Need to create some standard work. Now remember, there are three ladies that just do not like each other, but they represent three of the four shifts. There was a gentleman that he knew to stay out of it. He just knew that whatever they said was what should be. So we get to the point I throw a little smed in with my reliability events. Because what I would like them to do is not design their standard work around what they're familiar with. What I'd like them to do is design their new standard work around the simpler process, thinking in terms of how we might change over the line and how we might operate the line. So we get to the point. And so I always have the person representing operations, the supervisor, ops manager, whatever, he or she has to be part of this discussion. But we're now going to create standard work around the best way to operate the line. And how are we going to do that when we have three ladies that don't like each other and don't think either one, anybody does it the right way? So as it turns out, they say to me, well, we do it the same way. It should be obvious. And I said, how could it be obvious? We just took out 90% of the adjustments that we used to make. And they really couldn't answer that, but they didn't have a way forward. I said, okay, so let's do something different. Here's what we're going to do. Who would like to demonstrate how they think they should run and set up the line? So the first one of the crew members raises her hand. I'll give it a try, but it's going to be just like everybody else. I said, well, let's find out. So we created some spaghetti diagrams, and we basically timed and watched and all that. And this person went, let's call it clockwise, and it looked like he was going back and forth and back and forth and back and forth. So there's lots of spaghetti. So the other crew members, the other three were doing that while the mechanical folks were doing something else, and the ops manager was observing. And when she came back and finished, instead of taking over an hour that it used to take, I think it took like, 22 minutes. I'm making that number up.

I don't.

I don't recall. Top of my head. She goes, well, that's pretty good. That beats the hour. I said, yeah, but is it really the best way? You seem to be going back and forth, you know, so the other folks see the same thing. So the other lady raises her hand, or one of the other ladies raises her hand, and she goes counterclockwise, just. But as she was going counterclockwise, you could tell she was kind of figuring out how to not go back and forth, back and forth. She basically flowed in a U. Imagine that, right? We taught that earlier in the week, but, you know, it doesn't mean they retain it. In less than 12 minutes, she's done. The third lady says, I don't need to see any more. That's awesome. And the gentleman says that. And even the one. Even the one that did it the other way said, oh, no, no, no. Her way is the way to go. This is the way to go. And they're all like, high fives. So all these, they're all this prior stuff now, they're like, okay, now let's build that standard work. Let's make it so that everybody from here on does it that way.

Was there any animosity between the first lady, who, you know, took a little bit LONGER and the second lady who.

Went 12 minutes, not after she saw how much easier it was? So, so the actual act of doing, convinced or not, if the, if the other lady had told her how to do it, yeah, I am certain it would have been animal, because all week there was. But this way, basically, it just proved itself out. It just looked and felt. Plus she was doing the same spaghetti diagram. So everybody had to do the same tack, you know, process to observe. So we timed it and we spaghetti it and we took notes on it. And we're like, oh, my God. I mean, it's just. It just was so obvious, you couldn't argue. So it takes all the emotion out of it.

Oh, I love that so much. And the thing I love about it, Adam, is that, you know, I'm so passionate about telling people, you know, in business, and not even business, just life in general is quit debate debating on who thinks they have the right answer. You know what I'm saying? Like, if you want to debate anything, debate on what experiment do we want to run to see what we learn? Because, you know, it's all opinion when you're all standing around. Now, some people might have a more, you know, educated opinion, if you will. You know, an engineer is going to have a better opinion on how to build a structure than some, you know, doctor, for example. But still, it's an opinion. Let's run the experiment because the doctor might have some out of the box idea that the engineer was never trained to do. Right. So.

Right.

Yeah, I feel like just. Just quit debating on who's right and just debate the experiment we're going to run, you know, so I love that story.

So in the old days, we'd say actions speak louder than words, right?

100%.

But all, all of us lean thinkers would say, go to Gemba, try it, do it, stop talking about it.

See what you learn.

So thankfully, we were able to get them to do it. And then it was just that obvious. Now, had it been the exact same, I would have come up with some other experiment to try, but it was just so obvious. And it was such a win. Anyway, they were there and they were convinced. Okay, so that's story number four.

I know. I feel so much pressure picking numbers.

Yeah.

Like, the listeners are like, pick two, Ron, pick two. Pick three. You know, so. All right, pick two.

And you can find out how I almost got fired.

Oh, yeah. Let's go to two then. That's it. Go to two.

Okay, let's go to two. So this. This is a story from early in my Kaizen career. So I used to get sent to factories to just fix it, whatever it was. Okay. This was when in my corporate career. The other one was in my consulting days not so long ago, a couple years ago. This was in the late 90s. So people would send me to factories and I would spend a day on an operating line getting to know the folks and kind of identifying things. And then I'd pull the team together. It'd be like three operators, two mechanics, a supervisor, and we're just going to just tear apart the line. Yeah, right. Because they. They've been. No one had ever at that point, gotten people's opinions on the line. So they sent me to Macon, Georgia. A ceiling tile manufacturer, massive plant, Largest ceiling tile plant in the world, still exists. I didn't have written agendas. I didn't, you know, I wasn't following any specific Kaizen plan. I just knew that we would walk the line and figure out things we wanted to work on and all that good stuff. So the plant manager had brought me down, and they had a business unit manager who had been at the plant for many, many years. And they all the prior week had said, yep, come on down. We got a team for you, et cetera. So we kick off on a Monday morning, and it's just me and the team. And, you know, there's no management of any kind. This is how I learned about leadership commitment, or how not to try to get leadership commitment. Here's the wrong way to do it. And then clearly later I learned the right way, the non getting at them fired way. So anyway, Monday, we are just making changes to the line. And the operators on the line are actually remarking as, oh, my God, this is so much better. And. And, you know, we're just on day one. Here's what I noticed, though. The whole day, these folks who had never had the opportunity to make change on their line or even were never really thought of as creative people, you know, they weren't really treated that well mentally. Nobody ever come to visit us during the day. Here we are making all These cool changes, and I'm excited, The team's excited, and the plant manager never shows up. Business unit manager never shows up. You know, we're taking downtime, we're shutting things off, we're locking out. We're tearing this off. And, you know, we're not getting anybody's approval. We're just doing it. So send the team home. At the end of the day, I decide to walk over to the business unit manager's office because it was his line, and I have a little conversation with him. And I said, you know, these guys are doing great. I just wanted to let you know, it's just amazing. Already we're seeing these improvements. Oh, Adam, that's great. Good. Cool. I said, any chance of you coming to buy from time to time tomorrow? Because it would really mean a lot. Said, well, I'm pretty busy tomorrow. Got a lot of meetings, but if I have time during a break, I'll come by. Okay, great. So I, you know, I believed it. Okay, so Tuesday comes and day two, and now the changes are coming faster and faster because people believe they're allowed to do it, and we're just doing it, and they're seeing the improvements. This is a very big line. So there were, I don't know, multiple major processes on the line. So. And Tuesday comes and goes. I send the team home. Still nobody shows up. Still nobody shows up. So I walk to, you know, I waited until the end of the day again, respectfully. I guess I thought I was being respectful. And I go up there, but he's not there. He had something more critical. You know, he was going to some high school baseball game or playing golf or going to the bar. I don't know what it was, but apparently it was more important. It's higher priority. So now I'm not real happy. I wasn't happy in Monday because these guys are killing it. All right, so Wednesday, if you know Adam, you know he wasn't going to leave it alone. And in the old days, I didn't have as much of a filter as I do now, but I still don't have much of one. So I got a little smarter, to my detriment on Wednesday, because at first break in the morning, I decided to stomp over or walk over or something, I don't know. And he's in his office. So I start off talking again about how well the team's going, and it's just great. You ought to check it out, and it would be wonderful if you would. And he stops me and he says, okay, Adam, what are you really trying to say? Thinking, am I really not that clear? So I say it would be great for you to show your commitment to the team and the changes they're making. And right in the middle of that sentence he says, adam, if you're questioning my commitment, you can do that from corporate headquarters. So I don't really remember what was said for the next minute or two. You know, me backpedaling because I was, you know, much junior to this guy in, in the hierarchy, you know, but I wasn't fired and I just kind of went back to the team, tail between my legs. Didn't really, I didn't really hadn't talked to them about what I was trying to do. I was just trying to work the leadership to visit with them. Okay, well, we just kept working. Now, non coincidentally, he didn't show up that day either. But I noticed on Thursday people started walking by and then Friday we had a report out. And in the old days I had no things such as PowerPoints. We would just give a tour and the operators would provide the look what we did and look what we did and look what we did. And coincidentally, business unit manager, plant manager and a few others actually did show up now. So what I learned was I was not providing the proper image of what leadership commitment looks like now. It's 1998 or something around that time and I was younger and so I needed to learn that. Now the good news is we did a lot more line improvement projects in that plant and the business unit manager participated a bit more and we had a pretty good relationship afterwards, but we had to get that out. And of course the feedback on me made it back to my boss at corporate and of course, you know, I was doing what I felt was the right thing. But in those days, the relationship, and even in these days, the relationship matters more.

Yeah.

So I could have done a better job, but that really taught me that I need to prep better.

So I mean, yeah. So really, like, what's the lesson though in that? Like, because I mean, I've personally been in similar situations now where I had leaders and past lives. You know, when I worked in the corporate world, who, you know, I had one, one gentleman. The fact that he had more of a sales background and the fact that we actually had to produce something for this product was like annoying to him. You know, he just wanted to sell, sell, sell, sell. And I'm like, the bookings are great. You know, like, yeah, well, we gotta actually make it. And then it'd be good if we made it with pretty good quality. Ah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You guys take care of all that, you know, So I, you know, I've experienced it as well. It's like, what's your advice, though, Leaders who, you know, don't seem to be terribly interested or engaged in those things of continuous improvement or even, in that case, manufacturing. For me, like, what, what, what, what? What could you have done different?

Right? So fantastic question. So, because I. I didn't want to keep getting almost fired, right? So the goal was, what was happening was I made this assumption. We know what happens when you assume. I made the assumption that he knew his role. Okay? Now remember, I was doing something. I don't know, Remember is not the right word. I was doing something no one else in our company was actually doing. Engineers were the ones changing equipment and so on. You know, in major projects, we were doing this stuff in a week. So what I learned was I needed to create the image of what good leadership, commitment and support looks like and then verify it prior to just showing up. Yeah, right. So here's an expectation. At least have the conversation so that you can get aligned or if you're not aligned. These days, my image that I provide is the wheel of sustainability. I am able to describe what that looks like from each element of the wheel, how leaders participate. So if they don't run screaming from the room like I'm not scaring them off, then I know we got a really good shot at it. And then I can have something to reference. And we do this all in preparation. So the way we charter, the way we feed, the way we kick off, the way we participate at Kaizen newspaper or status updates or whatever and report out, I now know many, many, many years later. But I worked my way to this. All that preparation is more critical sometimes than the Kaizen event itself, right? Because what do we really want to have happen? We want to not only solve the problem, we want to keep it solved in a sustainable way. So for me, because sustainability is my focus, that's where I put huge energy to set up that team for that sustainable win, rather than let's just solve it. In the old days, we'd weld stuff so you can't move it back. Okay, that's cool. But you can't weld just everything, especially if you're doing virtual processes. Right? But. But how do we do it? So leadership has to understand their role. And sometimes that conversation is hard and sometimes they get it.

And sometimes, I mean, I remember maybe a strategy that I sort of used in My younger years managing up with these big bosses, and I was not a big boss, right. Would be like, hey, so we're coming in next week to do this event or whatever. And what works really well. In fact, the last time we were in here, one of your colleagues just kind of how we did it, you know. So now you're sort of like social proofing it a little bit. Right. Is like, hey, on Monday, around 4 o', clock, if you're. If you're able and you're available, or it didn't have to be 4 o', clock, but just sometime in the afternoon, if you swing by just for like two minutes and just say hello to the folks and let everybody show what you're doing, would that be okay?

Would.

Would that work? You know, and it's almost like you're getting them to buy in, like, but it's. It's their idea, of course. Right. You're just like letting it. Planting a seed and. And so, yeah, like you said, just over communicating and sort of getting before the thing even starts. Here's how it would work. Great. If we could do that. What do you think, Mr. Or Mrs. Leader?

Right, right. So you might be a little kinder in your approach than I am, but. But I do set. You know, it is all about setting expectations of how you set up the win. So everybody likes to win. We know that. So if you can create the image of what winning looks like in their role in it, and why does that look, you know, by kicking off the event and by participating and so on, how does that help the win then? I think, you know, I think we get at the same thing. You just sound a little kinder than I am. But when they deal with Adam, this is what they get. So they make decisions on that anyway.

Oh, you're kind.

Stop it.

You know, this big bully guy, you.

Know, I try to be respectful. I'm not always kind, but I try to be respectful. There you go. There you go. All right.

Well, let's see. I think we got a few minutes left. Let's jump to what we've done so far. 2 and 4.

2 and 4.

2 and four. Well, let's stay balanced. Let's go to six.

So I actually knew you were going to do that, so that's okay. I had my finger on it. Okay. And that's cool. So this one's actually pretty recent. This is a couple months ago. So it's clear in my mind. So working with an electronics supplier, manufacturer and distributor of testing equipment, this might have been the first event that I ever ran where my book influenced the person to bring me in. So that was kind of mind blowing for me because I write a book and I think only my relatives bought it. But anyway, their thing was sometimes the electronics equipment has to be tested. It's not operating as well as it could. So customer sends it back. They had this testing lab, you know, go through the various things that the equipment was trying to do and then get an answer. And it was taking too long to get answers. So we ostensibly scoped. We took a walk through the lab and it looked like, you know, grandma's attic, right? Because the lab owner had been doing that job for many, many, many, many years and he was the only one doing that job. And I didn't actually get to meet gentleman that day. So he was. He should have been my team leader, but he wasn't. So the person that brought me in became the team leader. So. But it was clear. I said, okay, we're going to apply 5s, but we're going to think about flow and visualization and all these other things to try to drive time to customer. Cut the time to customer in more than half, you know, okay, get that done. Because that's what matters to the customer, right? Is give me my answer. Either replace it or, you know, tell me it's warranty or it's not warranty or whatever. But I want to know because I need the equipment running again. So it was a pretty small space. We got a small team together, so we were going to kick off on a Tuesday. So I come in on Monday and my sponsor was kind of angry. Why are you angry? Well, we'll call this guy Ralph because I'm going to make up a name. Ralph. The lab owner cleaned up. He had never cleaned up the lab. I mean, it was a total nightmare for if anybody had to run the lab, he's the only guy that could do it, apparently. So he had cleaned up in air quotes. So I walked through it and I go, dude, he just got rid of clutter that he knew. He has no idea what. All he did was save us two to four hours of work. I said, so don't stress it. I promise you that what he did will be helpful, but nowhere near what's going to happen. So anyway, but they kept warning me about this lab owner that he's not going to want to do anything because he's been doing it his way for so long. Don't worry, we're going to make it beneficial to him on the path to making it Beneficial to the customer. So like any 5s event, go out in Gemba and first thing we're going to do is we're going to look at the whole process and anything that's in our way of getting to the customer's clutter, right? So get the clutter out of your way. Either get rid of it or donate it, or move it somewhere else out of your way. So what was interesting about that, they thought this guy was going to be totally against getting rid of anything. But very early on he's getting rid of stuff and everyone's looking at like, what happened. Now I'd like to say I had something to do with it. The way I engage people to see that it's value to get rid of stuff because it's keeping you from doing so. He had log books from the 70s and I'm not making that up. So there was stuff there that clearly wasn't being used. So he was able to see that. And what I'm also thinking happened was he never got help. Nobody knew how to help him. So he had a whole team there to help him. And they were there. They had given. This was their first Kaizen event, I think in over a decade. So nobody had real experience with it. So through the week we go through the yeses, which was really cool. And I realized we probably got rid of 70 to 80% of what was in the lab. So even some big level furniture and equipment went away. So all of a sudden you could see I can get through here pretty easily where before you couldn't. And we were able to clear up some wall space. So we created some visualization of the process so that everybody. This guy was the kind of guy, if he came in and said, hey Ralph, I need a favor. Can you build this for me? He would do it. And that was one of the things that was getting in his way of getting the real work done. Because Ralph could do anything. So people just kept doing it. He had no way of saying no. So we put up a whiteboard. We found one little space, we put up a whiteboard and we said, okay, Ralph, what are the three basic processes that matter the most on the way to finishing your testing for the customer? And he identified them. I said, well, why don't we put a red magnet in each one and then when you get it done, turn it to green. Now people can see the status and the progress. And when they ask you, can you do this? You can point to your board and say, okay, what's more important? Your requests are my thing. He really liked that because now it wasn't just him trying to be nice to everybody. Just like in the earlier thing, we took the emotion out of the process. But as us facilitators do and those of us that have done it hundreds of times, we want more. And I realized that we were at a point where things were just getting pretty versus improving. You know what I mean? So we got the big breakthrough stuff. We clearly had cut the time in half, if not more. I mean, I knew that, but I saw four hours of opportunity. So I say this was like a three and a half day session. Three and a half day, Kaizen. I said, let's try something. Say, Ralph, we're going to teach you guys a technique called spaghetti diagram. So I teach that. I give them all layouts. I had already prepped this the day before. And what I like to do is I'd like you to demonstrate in your new newly laid out lab the steps you would go through. And we're going to just watch you and see if it's better and see if something could be even better. And he goes, well, I don't even know how it could be better. This is awesome. It's like, I don't either. Let's find out. Right, so we start on step one. Well, the equipment comes from the. Comes to the receiving dock. Do you want me to walk out to the receiving dock, go to the receiving die, and then come back in with something that looks like equipment? Okay. And then the next step is X. I don't remember what it was. And we put it in this. Yeah, I don't remember the sensor B. I don't know what it was. Yeah, doesn't matter. But everything went through sensor B. And do you want me to. Yeah. Demonstrate it. So then. Okay, step three. Step four. There were like 14 major process steps. So how'd I do? He says, he says, oh, no, by the way, when I was doing it, it just didn't seem like that was too efficient. Well, we held up our spaghetti diagrams and yeah, back and forth, back and forth, back and forth. So I said, look, we got a few hours here. Let's see if there's just a couple simple things we could do. Because I saw three things that were like really, really simple dimple that we could do. But I wasn't gonna say I want them to do it. It's theirs. And they found those three plus two more. And in an hour we had rearranged just three little three or four or five things. Okay, let's do it again. So he goes, I know, let me go to the receiving doc first. Yeah. Yep, yep, you got it. And we do it. And the spaghetti Diagram looks like 75% better. Nice. Just from that. Just from that. So want to give them that one. So all of a sudden, boom, they've got. Okay, now they prettied it up too. But what they really had was flow, right? They had improved safety, improved productivity, improved customer experience, visualization, flow, no clutter, all this thing. And everything makes sense, right? So we, we. And what was also cool during that week was there were other labs. And you know, everybody was very skeptical, of course, because this first one in such a long time, they did all sorts of other stuff that was just amazing. Good standard work, really simple stuff anybody could follow. Now, Ralph wasn't on his own, right? People could actually do stuff. And there was a guy he always had to get information from. And the guy was on the team. And the guy goes, well, if I just made this chart, 90% of the time he had to find me would go away. Let's put that on this new wall that's available. You think that's a great idea? Okay, so we do all that. And that's cool. And what was neat was during the report out this lab owner who didn't really want to say anything once he started talking, he's telling him how I didn't realize all the stuff I had in my lab that was getting in my way and keeping the customer from getting what they need. And he says this in front of everybody, which just made me feel fantastic. What I found out was two or three weeks later, I always do the 30, 60, 90 follow up or something such. How's it going? They don't send me pictures all the time. And the team leader says, Ralph has been making improvements since the session. And he keeps coming in my office to show me. That is wonderful. I said, have you done any of the other labs yet? Nope, but everybody's asking. I was like, well, if you need help, I know a guy.

Yeah. I'm telling you, I feel like the most important aspect to that story, we could easily get lost in the success of spaghetti diagrams and motion studies and 5s and all the rest of it. And don't get me wrong, that's all great. That's great. And the tools we know work 100% of the time. They work. However, the biggest breakthrough in that story to me was that early in that story you mentioned, people were saying, oh, Ralph will never go for that. So everybody had this preconceived notion on Ralph. They were judging him or whatever you want to call it. Right. And. Yeah, and. And maybe in fairness to them, maybe Ralph's personality is. Sends off those vibes. I don't know. But you ran the experiment, right, like we just said in an earlier story, and you went in and you gave the guy a chance, you know, and. And you probably. And I don't mean to be overly dramatic here, but you could have changed that man's life, you know, like, for the rest of his life, you could have changed him.

Right.

You know that. Now somebody has trusted me. Somebody's helping me. Somebody's listening to me.

Right.

I mean, we've all been involved in Kaizen events. I know you have, Adam, because we've talked about them before where, you know, walk in on day one and there's a guy in the back room with his arms crossed and a scowl on his face, you know, doesn't want to be there. And, you know, again, my personal style is to just not be too overly aggressive with that person. Just bring them along slowly. But I can't tell you how many times. There was one in particular, I remember like it was yesterday. A gentleman literally wept during the report out.

Yeah.

I mean, he cried. He was a grown man, you know, and he was just like, hey, no one's ever listened to me like this team did, you know, And I mean, and. And that's the true power of all this stuff that we do as practitioners. So I hope people remember.

Yes.

Get good at the tools. Watch your Gemba Academy videos. Bring in Adam to teach you how to do smed. Fantastic. Do all that. But remember, in the end, it is about people and the way that we interact with one another. You know what I mean? And I feel like continuous improvement can be the great uniter in this divided world that we're in, you know, because in the end, most people genuinely want to make things better.

Right.

Whether you're right, you're left, doesn't matter. You know, we want things to be better in our workplace in particular. So let's leave our. All this other stuff at the door and figure out how do we fix what bugs us to steal Paul Aker's line. Right. Or, you know, just make things better. And I mean, if we just did that, golly, at least our business world would be so much better.

Right? Totally agree. Yeah. Tools are fun, but the tools are the easy part. What's important is, like you said, the people and how we do something that actually helps them on the way to helping our customer. Because if we don't have people engaged in the process, we get what we pay for. But if we have them engaged and they feel like they're part of it, it's the hierarchy of needs, the feeling of belonging to something that's greater than ourselves. Right. When you have that Ralph had that he felt now people cared about him and they're willing to help. The team was there to help him because his job was so critical on the way to helping the customer.

Fantastic.

Wow.

Okay, so we'll have you back on here in another month or so. We'll finish the other three. You got to keep track on your little check sheet there, which ones we covered. And you got three more that you owe us down the road. How's that?

Okay, that sounds fine. There's one about beer, so. Oh, boy.

Okay, everybody, stay tuned. Now, when are you going to have Adam back on? Awesome. Hey, Adam, if folks want to connect with you, what's the best way? Website, social media, what do you got?

Right, so Find me on LinkedIn. I have my personal page. And then also process improvement Partners. I have a number of followers there. I love when that number goes up. That's kind of fun. I do have a website, PI-partners.com. you will see these and many more stories there. And even can see the book. We're gonna, you know.

Yeah. What's the name of the book in case people don't know.

Right. The Wheel of Sustainability. Engaging and empowering teams to produce lasting results. So you can find that on Amazon. I do have a YouTube channel. There are now 31 subscribers, so I think I've gotten beyond my family.

Okay, that's great.

Well, we're gonna link a Google business page, too.

Oh, wow, Fancy. Okay. Hey, so we'll link to everything. So this is show notes, GembaPodcast.com. this is episode 393. Okay, so go check that out and listen. This Wheel of Sustainability, we've done a number of podcasts on it, but if this, you know, if you are a lean thinker, I would argue that there's a few books that you've got to have on your bookshelf. You know, Lean Thinking, Toyota Way, the New Toyota Way, maybe a Toyota Kata, you know, action guide, practice guide. Always call it action guide, practice guide, something like that. But this one, Adam's book, I would argue it's a must read. Okay, It's a must read. So really, everybody needs to go out and get that as well and put it on your. Read it and then put it on your library and refer back to it over time. So, Adam, thanks again for coming on, my friend. It's always, always is so fun. And I always feel, I feel better for having talked to you. So thank you.

Well, thank you, Ron. Thanks to your listeners. Yeah.

All right. You take care. We'll talk again soon.

All right.

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