GA 519 | Lessons from Abdul with Robb Holman

If we want to become more aware in the craziness of the day, we've got to become more aware in the stillness of the night because so many people want to become more aware, more present in the hamster wheel that they're kind of running in. Got to take the kids over here. I got to go to this business meeting there. I got to do that. I got to visit this person in the hospital. And they're like, I just want to get quiet.

Today I am very excited to welcome my friend Rob Holman back to the show. Now, Rob has written a book that's going to be coming out on April 1 called Lessons from Abdul the Hidden Power of Receiving from Anyone, Anytime. And let me tell you, this episode you're about to listen to is powerful. It's one of the most moving episodes that I think that I've ever recorded in 508. This is 19. Just very powerful. I don't know how else to say it. Rob really opens up about this story of this gentleman named Abdul and the impact that, that he's had on Rob's life. Started at years old on a basketball court anyhow, so we talk about that and then towards the end, Rob opens up and is extremely vulnerable and shared very well a very moving story of his wife who is actually unfortunately going through breast cancer and treatment and that sort of thing. And so Rob sort of ties it all together with the, the message of, of Abdul. And now Rob and I are both people of f. Faith, men of faith. And so it comes up quite a bit. And so, you know, if that's not your thing, we've got 518 other episodes I guess you can listen to, but hopefully it's okay because it comes from the heart and Rob is a fantastic guy. So show notes can be found over@gembapodcast.com look for episode 519. Now also please scroll down on whatever app you're listening to and at a minimum, please go and connect with Rob on LinkedIn and just let him know that you're, you know, sending him pause positive thoughts and prayers and energy towards his wife Karen and, and her situation. And then, hey, man, if, if this book Sounds Interesting, it's 99 cents right now, like a pre order thing. So if you, you get in on that right now, I guess, you know, the price is going to go up on April 1st. So I can't wait to personally read this book. And I think I'm going to try to have Rob back on maybe Summertime or something like that to, to revisit how things have gone post launch, but great stuff. Okay, enough from me. Let's get to the show. Rob, welcome back. How are you? My man?

Ron, Such a joy and honor to be with you. It's always a pleasure, and I mean that with any. Every sense of the word to be with you, whether it's informally, formally live, not live. So great to be with you.

Oh, man. Yeah. Well, audience doesn't know about you. And I've been chatting for like 20 minutes before we hit record, so I was like, stop. We got to stop talking and get some of this on the. On the recording here. So super excited. So, yeah, you were on. We looked it up right before you were on episode 305, building trust and leveraging conflict. And then 403, moving the needle with Rob Holdman. So. So we're going to link those up in the. In the show notes for people to go back and after this one to go and catch up on those if they've not heard it. But hey, man, you know the drill, Rob. We like to get going out of the gate with our guest sharing a quote. So what do you have?

Okay, I got a really good one for you. I'm sure you've never heard any guests ever say that before, but I mean it with every fiber of my being around. All right, here it is. Life is not about waiting for the storm to pass. It's about learning to dance in the rain. And it's by Vivian Green.

I love that. What's that mean to you?

Yeah. So the temptation is to remove or check out of our current set of circumstances when they become challenging or overly challenging or perhaps even pray for them to be completely removed. Who doesn't want that?

Yeah.

Especially when it's a major trial tribulation. I'm not saying we shouldn't want it to be removed. Pray for it to be removed, because I certainly do if I'm really honest. However, if it is not removed, what does it mean for me in the midst of it to have a higher perspective.

Yeah.

Maintain a positive posture in such a way to where I become a change agent to those set of circumstances.

Man, that's powerful. All right. And I think we'll probably revisit that a little bit more throughout the episode, but wow. Hey, man, I'm super excited to have you back on to talk about your. Your new book that's going to be coming out, what, April 1st? Is that camp?

Yeah.

So lessons from Abdul, the Hidden Power of Receiving from Anyone Anytime. So now we didn't in Our pre talk didn't talk anything about the book because I didn't want to ruin it. It's like I had no idea what this book is all about. I mean, I know you, so maybe got ideas, but really I. I have no clue. So, yeah, just high level elevator pitch. Like, what is this one all about?

Well, I think a great starting point is I'm going to share something with you and the audience of a very brief story that may be familiar to probably most, but not all. And there was a man that was in a flood, and it was a bad flood. And in the flood, he cries out to God and he says, please save me. I don't want to die. With no response immediately. Shortly after, a person comes over in a canoe. Jump aboard. I got you, I got you. The man waves him off. Nope, don't worry. I prayed to God who helped me. Short time after that, a team with a boat comes and says, come on, man, you gotta go. The storm's getting worse. The flood's coming. It's gonna get worse. You're gonna be taken under. No, no, I got it, I got. Matter of fact, God's got it. He's got me taken care of. And they leave. Third helicopter. You don't know. I mean, the air is starting to pick up everything and you know, guy.

Jumps in the water, you know, with the thing.

Come on, come on.

Yeah.

And yet a third time. And the man waves him off and says, no, no worries. I'll be fine. God's got me. Sadly, tragically, the man dies in the flood. He's brought before God the very one that he was praying to to save him. And he said, God, why didn't you save me? He said, well, I did three times. Attempted to anyway, three times through these three different efforts. And you waved off and said, no, no, no. Now listen, Ron. Some could be listening. This be like, Rob, I'm not spiritual, I'm not religious. Some could be, and they want to take what they can from that story. But really, my main purpose in sharing it has everything to do with a man that was given an opportunity for his life to be spared, to be saved through the receiving of others in his midst. And he denied them. And I know as leaders and managers and influencers in the business world, organizations, etcetera, there's a lot out there about giving. Give, give, give, give, give. And we have books and we have podcasts, everything to give, give. And I'm all about giving selflessly. But think of it this way. If everyone on the planet, all the Leaders, all the influencers, all the managers, all the team members and working professionals, everyone was giving, everyone who'd be left to receive. So my book, lessons from Abdul the Hidden Power of Receiving from anyone at any time has everything to do with bringing a needed balance to both giving and receiving. Because I'm a firm believer that we can only give what we have received. In other words, another way people might put it, like, you can only give what you got. And I think there's always a deeper well to be dug in the area of genuine and authentic receiving so we can give more selflessly out of that place.

Okay, so Abdul, like, is that a person? Like, what, what's this all about?

Yeah. So Abdul, 10 years old, big basketball player. I am, always have been, always will be. Ron, when people ask my three kids, you know, 15, 13, and what do mom and dad have to say about basketball? And they always say, well, mom and dad say we could do whatever we want in life as long as we play basketball. Big basketball, family. So I go back to 10 years old and I'm playing at a local YMCA and, and I'm getting ready for my game to start and there's a game ending and I'm peeking through and I'm hearing this really, really loud voice, one of the coaches of the other teams before we're ready to play. And I'm looking around trying to find the very person that's this loud, booming voice. And I find this man, African American, about age 40, did not wear clothes the way I wore clothes. It was old, kind of ragged clothes. And I had to inquire about this guy. I was intrigued by him because he didn't look anything like me, didn't sound anything like me. And so after my game, I made it my purpose in this YMCA basketball league. But who is this guy? And I found out 10 years old. Yeah, 10 years old. I had this deep kind of like curiosity about it. And people said, oh, you don't know him, that's Abdul. And I said, can you tell me more about him? And I find, I went on a fact finding mission about Abdul. And he was very poor and again, middle aged, but yet a really extraordinary coach within this town that I kind of grew up in or right around. Long story short, I start, I asked Abdul if I could play on his team. And we kind of talked through that a little bit and had exchange, you know, at a future season. And there started my journey with Abdul had nothing, very little in common with him, I shouldn't say, nothing, but very little in common with him didn't look the same. I was Christian, I was white, I was young. He was African American, he was Muslim, he was older. I had a middle to upper class upbringing. He was poor, working class, but yet we had the game of basketball in common. Here I was as a 10 year old, Ron, and that maybe the purity of my heart, the intrigue, the curiosity, the discovery mode, there's something deep in my heart and soul at age 10 that I have to learn from this man. And that started a course of so many years of learning. And the lessons from Abdul are the very lessons that helped me become a better receiver from those that are very different than I am. And receiving in different ways, receiving help or support, receiving unique and different perspectives and receiving compliments and praise without just kind of like, it's okay, man. No, no, I don't need, you know, it's really my team. It's really my team. And I'm so glad I did. And I went through that process with him because these are truly life changing lessons that I learned from him that helped, you know, dig a very deep well within me to give in and out of that place.

What was the very first season that you played under Abdul like? So I guess you were 10, 11?

Yeah.

What was that like that first season? How many games did you win?

Well, even before the game, we didn't win many games. Let me be honest with you. I'll tell you why in a minute. It was a culture shock, okay? Because here this man, again, very different than I was. He had. He was giving everyone on the team that maybe knew him prior, you know, with previous understanding and knowledge than I did about him. He had nicknames for people, but I wasn't given a nickname because I was the newbie. Yeah, he ran things in a very old school way. It's almost like the movie.

Who?

The basketball movie. Hoosiers.

Yeah.

Set chairs out. You had to do fundamentals a certain way. If you, if you didn't do it right, go down and give me 20 fingertip push ups. I was like, who is this guy? What is he about? Not to mention we didn't win many games because Abdul's philosophy was not about winning in the short term. We get blown out by 20, 30, 40 points sometimes. I was like, does he know what's happening to us? But yet he would continue to instill the fundamentals. He would continue to build upon the cultural values, knowing that in time they'd pay off. But there was not a media or short term gain. By no means.

Okay, so how Long did you play with him then?

Played with him from 10 through about 17. Yeah, 17. So a number of years, not just in recreational basketball, but as time moved on and I grew more mature, my skill developed. A basketball now, Ron, you know, Amateur Athletic Union, of course, but I'm 48 years old, so I'm knock on the door, 50 a little bit. So back in the day when I was 10 through 17, Au Ball is not what it is today.

Okay.

It was much more hidden, it was much more underground. Now with LeBron James and some of the big basketball stars out there, they made it much more attractive and above ground to where it's a year round sport. But when I played, it was Abdul just taking a handful of kids and we're just driving somewhere. We didn't even know who we were going to play until we actually show up.

So fascinating because you've gone on, you know, in previous episodes you've talked about this, but you went on to have a pretty serious basketball career. Right? Talk just a little bit about that.

Yeah. So played four years at school right outside of Philadelphia, Pennsylvania Widener University. Had a really good, made the NCAA Division 3, but like really good Division 3 team, made the NCAA tournament, made a nice run a couple times. And then I moved on to play seven years of professional basketball. And talking about the person that shaped not only my basketball life, but my leadership life and just life as a mere human being was Abdul. Because these lessons he shared for me, age 10, all the way through 17 and even beyond, in a very informal way. I didn't handle my in a good way. I didn't handle myself or my own self perspectives or other people or even my circumstances the way I did prior to meeting him and spending time with him. So I'm so grateful.

Walk us through maybe just a few, few of the things that you actually learned from him.

Yeah, I would say the first one is just having greater self awareness. Now I know so many people in your circles, your influence on the podcast, they hear that time and time again, I'm sure. Right. We got to have greater self awareness. Right. If we want to make a better difference with our team members and our organizations, we've got to become more self aware. Well, Abdul was, I like to say, a pioneer in the area of self awareness. Before EQ became popular, Abdul really promoted this and it meant take a deeper, closer look at some of the obstacles or barriers holding you back from deeply receiving from others. Okay. And I'm going to name a few things that really, through his teaching, through his Lesson of really having greater self awareness, awareness deep within, as he would say. But here's some obstacles that can hold us back from genuinely receiving from other people. Right? And here's. So here's what I learned. Number one, it's hurt. Hurt can hold us back. Okay? So when we are. When we're hurt from someone in our life, right, it could be relationship with a loved one, it could be a team member in the workplace, whatever. There's a little bit of a sting there, there's unforgiveness in our heart. Whatever the case may be, someone's wronged us, they've spoken poorly about us, what there's hurt and what we naturally do, I think it's a survival mechanism, Ron. We will put up these barriers. So when someone wants to give us something, a good something, not a bad something, but a good healthy something, maybe a praise, a compliment, wants to help us or support us in a certain way, it just kind of bounces off because there potentially could be some hurt there. All right? Another area of this kind of self awareness is, is. I call it the path of least resistance. Okay. It's very easy for us to surround ourselves. Now. This has everything to do with really receiving from people with diverse perspectives or opinions. It's very, you know, it's very. It happens so much for us to surround ourselves subconsciously or consciously with people that I call mini Me's, right. That are going to validate our own opinions, our own thoughts, because we feel better when people validate our own opinions and thoughts.

Echo chamber.

Yeah, there you go. But for us to step out of that or go against the default, kind of a counterintuitive way to actually seek out someone, like I did with Abdul, that's very different than who we are. Different upbringing, different way of life, dare I say, could have unique perspectives and opinions based on a variety of different things that in and out of that authentic place, we have a lot to learn and to absorb. So we've got to be aware of that. And so the path of least resistance, and I'll just mention a third one, third one, is the proximity of, or I should say, the paradox of closeness. So paradox of closeness says this, that basically the more that we spend time with people, family members, close friends, team members in the workplace, we get familiar with their ways. They're idiosyncrasies. They're good things, but they're idiosyncrasies. They're the things that annoy us about them. And so it makes it far more difficult the more that we actually get to know someone and all that they are to actually receive from them. Familiarity breeds contempt. I mean, it's one of those things that. So even in that. The closeness of learning how to receive, because it can be so challenging and so difficult. So some of these things all fit under, you know, these three particular ways of receiving or the challenges of receiving fall under the bucket of self awareness that if we can actually start to learn some things about us, why we put up barriers of holding us back from receiving praises and compliments, support different opinions and thoughts from other people that might be different than ours, then at least we're a step. We take a step forward of perhaps doing something about it, you know, so.

You know, one thing that kind of came into my mind when we talk about the importance of receiving.

It'S also.

What'S challenging, at least for me. I'd be curious to get your take on it is there's so much noise out in the world. You know, like, we're speaking right now. It's Lent and for us Catholics. And. And like, I, like, I've. I've sort of, like, turned off all my social media except for LinkedIn for work stuff, you know, and just really avoiding just the news and TV and everything. And. And it's been great, right? It's been great. I feel like the distractions of the world. I'm more focused on God and in all the rest of it. But so, like, how do you receive well when there's so much noise? How do you separate the signal from the noise?

Yeah, I think you're hitting right on it. If, if we want to become more aware in the craziness of the day, we've got to become more aware in the stillness of the night, because so many people want to become more aware, more present in the. The. The hamster wheel that they're kind of running in. Got to take the kids over here. I got to go to this business meeting there. I got to do that. I got to visit this person in the hospital. And they're like, I just want to get quiet. All the more reason we've gotta, like, know our default mechanisms, and we've gotta be willing the same way that our kindergarten teachers when we were younger Ron, used to say, it's rest time. And I know I didn't like rest time, you know, back when I was five, six years old. That's why I would shimmy over to my closest, you know, little classmate and talk their ear off. But since then, in the last 43 years, I've learned about the importance of, of being quiet, having times of silence with intention. The same way that we would mark off our calendar or our calendars with our largest client, our biggest team member, on a one to one basis, the team meetings, we need to do the same with times of quiet, silence and reflection. And when we do that, now, I'm not saying our mind doesn't wander in those times of silence when we do get alone, but step one is complete. We have it on the calendar and we're going to go to this quiet place. For some, it could be a certain place in the house when no one's around. Others it could be going, if the weather's nice, to a local body of water and putting a chair out. Whatever's going to get you into your kind of faithful zone of getting quiet and silence, your mind could still wander a little bit and sometimes you have to journal your thoughts. But when we learn the discipline of doing that, it allows space, time and attention to something called awareness. Awareness of who you are, awareness of what can hold you back from receiving, awareness of your surroundings. And then when in and out of that, hopefully it's a consistent place. Once you get that in the calendar now, you enter into the real world again and you start, you start getting a little bit better at it.

Yeah, yeah. Something that I started doing just right here at the beginning of, of, of Len for us is, is I, I, I said I'm gonna set my alarm for 5am I typically before I normally get up, 6, 6 15, but historically I'm sort of one of those lazy, kind of hit the snooze and you know, whatever. Next thing I look at 6:30, you know, oh, I got, So I said I'm going to set my alarm for 5am and my goal is, and I'm not saying this to brag or anything like that, even though it probably sounds like I am, but my goal is, alarm goes off at 5am I have two seconds for my feet to hit the floor. And I don't want to.

Yeah.

But it doesn't matter. I have two seconds. So my feet hit the floor and I go out and I drink this athletic greens, you know, vitamin drink. I slam that down. Then I make a, some, some coffee and then I go sit in my living room in the dark of the living room and for an hour.

Yeah.

And I'll do some spiritual reading and praying and whatever it is. And oh man, it's been a game changer. Just at least, at least an hour. Sometimes I look up and it's Been an hour and 10 minutes or whatever and then I, I head off to the gym and, and then I'm then, then I'm off to the. To work. Boy, it's been a game changer and I think I'm going to keep doing it, you know, just indefinitely.

See, I'm so, I'm proud of you, number one. Secondly, you're an inspiration to me and so many others listening right now because I think we all can get caught up in the world as we mentioned earlier. And Ron, I. We can always rationalize things. Well, you know, I want to do this however I think I should, but. Yeah, but when we really take the necessary time because isn't it true whatever we really really value, we'll find time for.

Yeah.

If we find time for a really, a good group, a small group of friends that are going to encourage each other, whatever, we'll find time to be with that group of friends.

Right.

And so just having an honest conversation with ourselves about the things that we really sincerely value the most, putting them in the schedule and then that discipline slowly but surely becomes a lifestyle that we live.

Yeah. All right, so I want to go back to receiving and so many people listening are, you know, continuous improvement professionals or they're, they're managers and leaders and businesses and families and all the rest of it. Like, what are some practical tips that you can give us for being better at receiving in a professional, you know, workplace environment?

Yeah, so I want to get real practical, real because I think a lot of leaders, a lot of managers, working professionals really deal with this. So let's say you do a great job at a project and your boss or team member is quick to give you some praise. Hey, Ron, you know what I saw that you saw that project through in the right amount of time. The wisdom that you shared with the team, how you just serve them beyond belief. I just want to say thank you for doing that. The temptation, dare I say, the default mechanism that most leaders have, and I think they have a, the right heart in doing so, is to deflect earlier than later that praise and say thanks. But it was really my team, my team did a great. And then they go down the road of the team. Now it sounds admirable, praiseworthy, excellent. And I'm not saying I think a lot of leaders, a lot of people really are good hearted in that process.

Right.

But what I want to encourage people to do the next time you receive a compliment or a praise based on who you are or what you've done, start off by some Gratitude, specifically for, you know, towards that individual that offered that praise or compliment. And don't be quick with it. And that's going to change a perhaps a natural default mechanism of just kind of like deflecting it and then going down a certain road, you know, relating to your team. We'll get to that in a moment. But that alone, I think helps is just like, allow some space, allow some time to really receive, breathe that compliment or that praise in and don't be so quick to deflect. So that might look like this. Hey, thank you so much. You know, I did work pretty hard on that and spent a lot of time and I like to consider myself pretty focused in the midst of that. So I just want to say, from the depth of my heart, thank you. Like, I received that. Really appreciate that word of encouragement. I really need that right now. Wow.

Just that word. I received that.

Yes.

I don't know if I've ever heard that in my whole life from another human being.

Like, right. And that also, not only there's power in the words we speak, but do you also notice what else is happening, Ron? It's giving us more time than going down the natural default of deflection. So the more that we actually, like, use those words I'm receiving, we are doing a natural pause, but we're also not so quickly going down the default mechanism road. So in that we're allowing space, we're allowing time to let it absorb. We're absorbing it or the potential to absorb it. Okay, so that's something I really encourage people to do. And secondly is within 24 hours after that word of praise, compliment, encouragement, have a time of reflection and be mindful in that. What did you do well? What didn't you do so well? Again, it's more of that awareness piece. And also let those words, not just like lessons learned from, like, did I do it well? Did I not? That's awesome. Important part of it. But just let those words absorb those words of encouragement even more. Allow more space to digest. Because what we'll find is when we allow space, time, and the room to truly digest, not just on the spot, but later in reflection, there's a purity in digesting it. We actually don't get a bigger head, we actually get a smaller one. It's fascinating because we know at the end of the day, the gifts we've been given, the stewardship we've been given to do what we did to where someone felt the need to give us that compliment or encouragement. Really at the end of the day in the most innocent way, we did nothing to truly receive it. That it was a gift from God to have us respond in that kind of a way. And now you talk about a deeper well to be dug in the area of receiving. Oh, so those two. There's other, you know, steps I lay out practically in the book, but just for time's sake, with the podcast, ron, those are two things. The immediate and when. The first 24 hours. If you're just committed to a process like that, watch and see what begins to happen.

Wow. Wow. So good. Man, I cannot wait to read the book. So again, this hasn't been released yet. So what, April 1 is when it comes out. Is there like a pre order or anything like that?

Yeah, thank you for that. Yeah. So the ebook is available pre order right now. And then April 1st will be global. Like wherever you can find books, it'll be out available on hard copy, paperback, ebook, et cetera. But right now for just 99 cents, pre order eBook. And just. So, yeah, you'll get it downloaded into your, into your folder. But it's the price, you know, I want to offer your audience, certainly the pre order price at $0.99 for the eBook.

Okay, yeah, that's crazy. Like you can get that now or you have to wait till April 1.

No, you can get. Well, here's the thing, right, here's the catch. So you lock in that price and when the books pre ordered, certainly you'll get it into your, you'll get it, I guess a download into your Kindle or whatever on April 1st. Price of $0.99 in the pre order. Yeah, okay.

Yep, got it, got it. Oh man. So good. It's so good. So what else is going on in your life, Rob? Because I know, you know, you, you shared some stuff with me earlier a little bit. I mean, was there any else that you wanted to open up about to the audience and those listening?

Yeah. So everything Abdul shared with me in this book and more. You know, in the book there's 10 lessons from Abdul. I didn't know that the lessons he instilled in me throughout a course of years was going to prepare me as well as it did for what we're going through right now as a family. And I'm going to be completely real with you and your audience today, Ron. My wife, about five months ago now, she was diagnosed with an aggressive yet treatable form of breast cancer. As you can imagine, five months ago, it rocked our family. Really, really good. It rocked me as, I mean, my wife and I Have been married. It'll be 20 years in May. So in just a couple months, we'll be married 20 years, have three amazing kids, 15, 13 and 8. Well, this disrupted our plans pretty well. And so I've been a caregiver to take care of my wife. I'm working part time right now. And the delay, this book, Lessons from Abdul, has actually been delayed three months or so, because as important as this work and this project is, what's far more important is my wife and my family and making sure that my wife not only survives, but certainly thrives during this season coming out of it. So here's where we are. After the diagnosis, you can imagine a lot of uncertainty, a lot of different things going on. Like, has it spread? Has it not? Some of those answers, in short, you find out within the first week. Others you have to wait for over a month to find out with with certainty, has it spread? Thankfully, it has not spread, but we will not find out with 100% certainty until she goes into surgery. And that's going to be in about two weeks. Thankfully, she did complete four months of intense chemotherapy. So, I mean, you talk about a true inspiration to me, to my family and to the rest of the world is my wife. I mean, brave, courageous. Our faith, as you know, Ron, is an anchor to our hearts, our souls, every aspect of who we are. But the support system has truly overwhelmed us. And I want to share a specific story with you as it relates to chemotherapy. This is, I believe, our second or third treatment. And that's a process all within itself. And there I was, and my wife's receiving treatment, and I'm by her side. And there was one moment in the midst of this where we just glanced at each other. You know, sometimes we're reading during treatment, sometimes we're talking. Sometimes the nurses would come in and out. This particular time where we just happened to glance at each other, and it might even get a little emotional. Tears started to well up in my eyes and in my wife's eyes. And now I'm holding hands with her. We didn't say a word, but yet we knew exactly what each other was thinking. And that exchange between my wife and I later to find out that we knew exactly what each other was thinking. And in that moment that I'm with you, that's what I was communicating through my eyes. I'm with you. And she was receiving from me. Being with her, she was giving. Even in this fragile state she was in, she was giving to me, and I was receiving from her. There was this mutual exchange of both giving and receiving, not to mention as we welled up in our eyes together and looking in each other's eyes, we also knew that we had the most wonderful, intimate and support and powerful support system that one and a couple could ever have. And family, friends, people at church, etc. And we knew we could not and would not do this alone. Little did I know that all these lessons from Abdul of learning how to both receive and then to give more selflessly out of this place of receiving would only help me in the most trying time of my entire life.

Wow.

And I'll tell you, my wife now, she rang the bell. And those that understand that significance, when chemo treatment has completed, you ring the bell and you ring the bell to share with the nurses, everyone else in that treatment center. I've done it. I've been through what everyone else gone through with treatment. My heart remains with those that continue to go for treatment. This is a huge milestone in my life. And as she rang that bell with tears, the nurses and everyone else around just knew the significance, the importance of it. So I share that with everyone. To say now that chapter has come to an end. A new chapter beginning where Karen is going to have surgery with about a six week recovery for the surgery that's going to be in just a couple weeks beginning. So we welcome everyone's positive thoughts and prayers and Ron, thank you for being in our corner and just. Oh yeah, I wanted to share, you know, in life's most trying and challenging moments, times and seasons, when we learn how to receive at any time in our life, it's like we're building up a rich deposit.

Yeah. Oh my gosh.

When we really need it.

That's so beautiful, man. For sure. I'm gonna, gonna pray for, for you and Karen and ask everybody, you know, listening, if you're a person of faith or even if you're not, if you just send some prayers up, you know, I know you, they'll be heard. And yeah, you and I were, were talking a little bit. I, you know, have been going through, you know, just life and you know, there's always challenges in life and, and well, my wife and I have been really working on like surrendering, you know, so if you have a difficult situation or a, you know, situation with a child or, you know, I have my, my mother is, is elderly now and I'm basically her caregiver kind of thing now. And so, so we're really working on surrendering. Right. And, but I've really struggled with that over the years is like, because you can always say that, oh, I surrender my child to you, God, you know, and that's great, you know, but what does that mean? You know, and so like I've really struggled with that and it really just came to me very clear to me really over the last several weeks, to be honest. And, and it was that because I, I would think, well, wait, surrender. That just means that I just sort of wash my hands and I'm good. I don't have to do anything because God's got it. Well, not quite. You know, I' dad, I'm still a husband, I'm still a son, you know, and so there's things that, that I need to do, right, to, to do my best, right? But really the surrendering comes in on the results of it, you know, so if you, you know, you do your best with your child or you do your best with your elderly parent and, and then whatever happens, happens. And you can't sort of wreck yourself with the, the control, if you will, of how, you know, because obviously we have an ideal situation, how we want it to go, but it may not go that way. Right? That might not be the will of God. Right. And so anyhow, I share that. I shared that with you before we started recording. But I thought, man, it's, it's. Man, life is, it's tricky.

It is, life's tricky, Ron. And it's a bit more fragile than we even like to think or imagine. And I don't say that in like, you know, I don't want to cast fear on anyone. It's not that I think there's these wake up calls in life to be like, you know, I guess I'm not going to live forever on this earth in the same kind of a way. And I don't think we always have to go through major trials and tribulations to have that, for lack of a better term, awakening in our life. I think we can learn in other ways, even more subtle ways. But I think those times are really significant. They're really significant as it relates to taking a closer look and deeper dive in our own life, personally, what matters most to us. And kind of reprioritizing some things, it just helps put things in proper perspective. And when things are put in proper perspective again, I'm going to go back to something I said earlier. We can become the change agent I believe the world is waiting for us to be. And as opposed to being like caught in the rat race down below, having a higher perspective on ourselves, on others and on our life circumstances. I think now we can be more proactive and less reactive. And I think that's where the most extraordinary leaders, managers, dare I say just even human beings, they operate in and out of that place.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Last question.

Yeah.

Have you maintained any sort of contact with Abdul?

Well, I'm gonna leave you and the audience in a little bit of suspense.

Okay. Okay. Okay. Well, stop record.

However, I will say this. The, the conversations have significantly decreased, if I can say that.

Okay.

And I'll leave it just at that.

Okay. Wow. Cliffhanger comes out. We're gonna have a book study and then we'll have a follow up and we'll get deeper into the, you know.

But I, I, I will, I will say this. I am so grateful for Abdul in my life, if people can't tell already.

Yeah.

Because he invested so much into me not doing it for any other reason other than he believed in me. He may not have believed in so much that I believed in, but he believed in me. And if that can be a takeaway for our audience today, whether who's that one person in your corner that believes in you far more than what you do or don't do or what you believe in or don't believe in? And secondly, are you that person for at least one other. Yeah.

Wow. So good, Rob. How can people connect with you?

Yeah, the best way, I think two, actually, three ways. LinkedIn. I am just so active on LinkedIn, Ron, and so I encourage people, People, if you're listening to this and you just want to ask a question or comment, please. I'd love to become friends with you on LinkedIn. So hit me up on LinkedIn and I'll certainly get back to you there. And then two websites, I think, one, just a general website for all my, what I call inside out leadership resources, robholeman.com and then for the book that has, you know, testimonials for the book, you can get a free, you know, preview chapter of the book. Book. Just go to lessonsfromabdul.com got it.

And it's Rob with two Bs.

That's it.

H O L M A N A.

N. You got, man, you're good with the two Bs. People are like, Rob, have you always had the two Bs in your name? You know, I always some rebellious act of adding a B or something later in life for me. But no, it's, I'm a Robert, but yet it is Rob with two Bs is the name I go by Got it.

Got it, man. We're gonna link everything up in the show notes. So everybody go out and connect with Rob and. And let's go flood Amazon or wherever books are sold and buy this book because I can't wait to read it, man. I really, genuinely can't wait.

So listen, thank you for the gift that you are, Ron. Not only to me, but so many. I mean, certainly your audience, but people and leaders throughout the entire world. Thank you for doing what you do, but more importantly, who you are. Really appreciate you.

Well, thank you. All right, Rob, take care, buddy.

We'll see you.

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