Ep #3: How to Effectively Transition Roles in an Advisory Firm

Welcome to the Advisor Summit, the podcast where financial advisors gain analytical insights and tactical strategies from the industry's top minds. Each episode we bring you exclusive conversations with founders, C suite leaders and industry innovators, uncovering the trends, tools and techniques shaping the future of financial advising. Whether you're looking to scale your practice, enhance client relationships, or or stay ahead of market trends, the Advisor Summit is your go to source for expert guidance and actionable takeaways. Hi Ali, welcome to the Advisor Summit. We're so excited to have you on and thank you for being here.

Thank you for having me.

We are ready to just dive in and I think you are such an inspiration to so many people, not only with kind of where you've started, with your background and what you've kind of launched and become today, but also just the person that you are. So we'll just dive right in. I kind of want to know, you know, for those listening, that how you really became the CEO of COO of Merkle Financial and what that kind of transition looked like and where you started and how you got here.

Yeah, so I started on the operations side and I was an operations specialist, that was my title when I started and I was doing pretty much everything you could think of in like a normal five person financial advisor office as far as operations go. So I was doing paperwork, I was answering the phones, I was often going into a lot of meetings with Lauren and his then business partner and taking notes or kind of running the computer and the software during those meetings as they would stand up and kind of point things out to clients, things like that. I was doing a lot of the financial planning in all of our software, so retirement analyzer, nitrogen, things like that. And then also just kind of handling service requests. So when people would call in and need different things, I'd research things for them or just facilitate those transactions as necessary. And then because we were a really small office, there was always random things that needed to be done. So I would fill in at the front desk or I would attend a seminar or workshop, help facilitate the event, sometimes do the introduction, clean the kitchen, take the trash out, all of that stuff when you're working for a really small business. And I think it was the perfect way to get introduced to an advisor's office. Right. Because I was doing a little bit of everything from the beginning. I've never really known anything different and I still find myself doing a little bit of everything when necessary in my role now. So then I was doing that for about a year, a year and a half, When Lauren approached me about helping with the TV show. So I had a theater background. I love to write. I had the financial experience as well for working on the operations side. So he needed help with the TV show. So he asked if I would want to write and produce the show, take that off his plate because he was doing all of that himself. So I started doing that in addition to all of my other operations responsibilities. And that was really fun because it was a new creative outlet. You know, I think that was the one thing that was really challenging for me in a strictly operations role is I got a lot of people interaction, but not a lot of chances to be creative. So because, you know, there's usually like one box to be checked on a form. Right. There's no other option, and it's either right or wrong. So this was a new way for me to use all of the financial knowledge that I had gained in my role, but apply it in a creative way. And I loved it. I absolutely loved that. So much so that I eventually transitioned for a very short period of time to a full time marketing content role. So I was writing the TV show. I was writing like any email or white paper that we would send out, you name it, content for seminars, content for online. Yeah, all the things that was. I was pretty much just like putting all of that together. And then that's when Covid happened. And just before then, Lauren had bought out his business partner. So the dynamics of our small office changed. And then we also added, I think five new team members that year. So it was a really fun, but chaotic. And so then Covid happened and we were like, you know, because it can't get any crazier, how about a global pandemic? And it was right around that time that Lauren had approached me about needing some help, just getting more structure within the organization, having someone be really the point person for the team so that he could both do the business, you know, managing. But also he was working as a full time advisor at that point. He would not really stepped out of a lot of meetings. So he was trying to cram a lot into his schedule.

Yeah.

And I was very hesitant at first. I think I actually told him no. And then things started to escalate with the pandemic. And I was like, maybe we should send an email, you know, about. And he was like, you can if you would like to be coo. And so then I was like, well, I mean, at this point, what have I got to lose? So that was in 2020.

Okay.

And so I initially, I Had to keep a lot of my responsibilities of the marketing role that I had for a while until we were able to get more team hired, get more people trained. And then I really didn't start doing just, you know, my main COO responsibilities probably until a year or two into that role, and I was finally able to hand things off. But now I am primarily strategic planning. I oversee the leadership team, and then I do, like I said, do a little bit of everything. So I will cover for anyone who needs additional coverage. Right now, I'm the interim director of client experience until we get that position filled. So, yeah, you name it, and I probably have my hands in it in some way, shape, or form.

I love that, though. I think it speaks a lot to your character and the type of person you are because you're a doer. You're like, this is what needs to happen. Cool. Like, no qualms. I'll clean the kitchen. I'll take out the trash. I'll also introduce seminars. And I think that that's a lot of what needs to happen in these financial firms. There's not really a one size F all. Even if your role is, you know, a specific title, it's. It's really not. And the best way to work together is by being able to encourage each other, help each other, no matter if it's not your position, you know, that's just a huge factor of it. Do you feel like the transition from, you know, your role into now CEO, you talked a little bit about taking some time to get everybody trained and to get everybody up to speed on how you wanted things. Walk me through that a little bit. Was it a difficult thing for you to manage, you know, people in that position? Was it? Do you have any tips or guidance for those that maybe are moving from one world to another? And then now we're training that upcoming team member.

Yes. It was awful to be okay. Love it.

I love transparency. This was not fun. You know, that's okay. It's not all cheery all the time, and that's okay.

And I think it's totally okay to say that, and I tell everyone that so that they can learn from our mistakes. Because you don't know what you don't know. And, you know, Lauren and I joke about that all the time. Like, hey, remember when we just decided to go for that? We had no game plan. So after that, first year was really hard, not only because of COVID Right. So all of a sudden, I had responsibility that I never had before. I was managing people that I Had never done before. But also, those were my peers before and my really close friends. So it was really challenging to all of a sudden one day be like, best buds, and then the next day have people, like, stop talking when you walk to the kitchen because they're like, oh, she's the boss now. You know, like, that dynamic was really hard, especially during COVID when really my only social interaction I was getting at the time was from work. And then that, you know, was just. It had changed so rapidly. And I don't fault anyone for that. It's just it. I think it naturally happens anytime you have a peer move into a.

Well, there's pros and cons, right? Like, you love that they respect you and that you enjoy that they are, you know, again, respecting you in that position. But the con is you almost feel like you have to kind of be sad about a friendship potentially being gone. So that's a good reminder for people. It can be a kind of lonely when you're in the top kind of C suite positions.

Yes, it can. And, yeah, loneliness is a great way to put it. And for a while I was like.

So this is it.

It's just me. I had all these really awesome relationships, and now I feel like it's been ruined. But it just took me a while to find my footing. And Covid was so difficult because all of a sudden I had people texting me every day at 6:30 in the morning, being like, I kind of have a tickle in my throat. Do you think I should come? Right. So it was like, I have never done this before, and now the stakes feel so high. Like, it was just so challenging. But what. Once we kind of got through that, we had added more people to the team as well. So again, being able to shift the workload a little bit, and Lauren was really helpful and helping me identify what to let go of, what to train people on. And quite honestly, you know, becoming a mom completely changed my perspective in this too. Where before, I think I was like, very like, climb, climb, climb. What's next? What's next? I can do everything. I'm superwoman. And then I had a baby, and I was like, I just really want to feel good about the work I'm doing here so I can go home and feel great about what's happening at home. And that allowed me, I think, to let go of a lot of things that maybe I was felt like I needed to do or felt like my team needed to see me do. And then it helped me build better relationships with them because As I handed things off and trained them or, you know, mentored them through things, it was. It let us. It let us connect in new ways. So it's all just like allowing everyone to grow at the same time. And that was really fun for me. It didn't feel like it was me on my own now. Now we were all kind of, like, doing it together. So it took. It took a couple years. I'm not gonna lie. Like, I would say 2020, the second half of 2023, all of last year. And, you know, now I feel more confident than ever. But it definitely was a slow burn.

Yeah, no, I think that is so key also is. It's funny, motherhood just changes you as not only, you know, a person in your personal life, but also in professionalhood. You know, that's a very different dynamic. And you do learn to kind of not sweat the small stuff as much, and that's really helpful. You also talked about kind of moving from more of just peer to peer role to like, a leadership role that you hadn't been a leader before. Yes, like, naturally, you know, I do think people would tend to follow you. You're an awesome person. So of course they to. But was there anything that you could maybe help speak to? Was it a book or, like, trainings or anything that kind of helped moved you into being a better leader that you would recommend for those that are potentially, like, transitioning from that kind of marketing or, you know, other role into a C suite position?

Yeah. I think there's, like, two things that it took me a long time to figure out, and that is like, leadership and management. Right. There are, like, tangible things that people just want from a manager, which is like, clear expectations, clear communication.

Yes.

Organization. And it doesn't have to be perfect, but like an agenda for a meeting or like, small things like that, you know, that allow people to feel safe in the consistency that is their workplace. And then the leadership piece of it is more intangible, but it is relationship building, and it is trust, and it is knowing that if somebody's coming to talk to me, you know, I don't have. I'm not reactionary. You know, I'm willing to hear people out. And if there's an issue, you know, it's not like the sky is falling. Right? Yeah. Being like, okay, tell me what's going on? That helped me a lot, figuring out that piece of it, because then I could kind of separate the two and kind of like, think, okay, here's the management tasks I need to do, and I'm I need to, you know, communicate to the team. But like the leadership piece is more of like how do I show up every day and how do I show up in certain situations? I really worked hard on not being reactionary because by way of, you know, getting into my position, I think all of a sudden the team thought, okay, great, now we have someone to like.

Take ally.

Concerns with. And so, you know, Lauren was not available all the time. And this is part of why he, you know, asked me to be in this role is because he needed someone to help address these things. But I was getting so burned out. Overwhelmed. Yes. Of getting bombarded. And I had to learn how to like protect my own time and energy and say like, okay, I can't do this all day every day. Like there are some. I need to shut my door for a couple hours a day to like, yeah. Not only get things done, but recharge a little bit too. And then really practiced, you know, not having a reaction when people come and came and told me something because I was trying to convey to them that I do care about their challenges and the things that are going on. And even if it might get me a little worked up. Right.

Like it's.

Yeah, in the end going to be fine. And once I've. Once I mastered that and I do think I have gotten pretty good at that, it totally changed my, my energy on a day to day basis because I felt so much more in control of my own self that really no matter what people were going to throw at me, I knew we were probably going to be fine and I was going to be fine and they were going to be fine and we were going to be able to find a solution to this together. And I do think people appreciate that from a leadership perspective too of knowing that it can take someone. Something to someone and not have them, you know, blow up or I was.

Just going to say that I feel.

Like a team needs a safe sounding board, which is rare. Like most people are reactionary. And I think that that was huge for you to learn that that was one of my questions was give us a specific example of like from a leadership position, what you've changed and how.

It'S changed the team.

It sounds like that's probably it is just being able to just take it to the face and not react and then is the quiet time when you sit on it and come up with solutions. So like how does that end then if you just are non reactionary? They have a safe place.

Yep. Then.

Then what happens?

So a couple things and that has changed over time, too. So I used to just kind of take it upon myself to be like, okay, give me everything and I will handle it. And then I kept thinking, like, okay, that's not probably great either. Right. Because a lot of things I can't do without getting other people involved. And I'd actually. I'm not sure if they want me to do anything about this thing at this point in time. Right.

Like, it might.

They might have just been there to, like, blow off steam.

So, yeah.

A couple things that I like to add at the end of those conversations is, what would you like me to do with this information? And how can I support you in that? And then I will often give them a couple examples of, like, if it's someone who's maybe having, like, a challenge with another team member, you know, I will offer to talk to them, but, like, or facilitate a conversation, or I'm happy to, like, just sit on this while you think more on it. Like, I try to really ask and be transparent with them of, like, is this just you letting off steam, which is totally fine. Is that going anywhere? Or, like, do you want me to take action on this and that? That allows me to, like, feel some peace after those interactions, knowing that I'm not potentially letting them down because they had a different expectation of what. What the interaction was. But we can all leave there together being like, okay, yeah, I'm gonna do this, this, and this, or, you know what? No, I feel better just kind of getting it off my chest. And if I need something, I'll come back to you. Like, okay, great. And then in the after time, I'll kind of, like, give myself a chance to. To sit on it, reflect on it. And if I feel like there is something that I do want to follow up on later, I always try to do it. I try never to let anything sit Summer.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think it's great, too, because I think the role of a leader, like, and you kind of mentioned this, and this is really back to kind of this example too. Sometimes as you lead teams, they do feel like there is chaos, and they do feel like there might be some unstructured moments. And I think as a leader, it is your job and your duty to help them feel stable in that even if your position feels chaotic, even if, you know you're not 100% sure of the direction you're going to go or you're unsure how to handle things, your job and role as a leader is to ensure that they feel confident that they are, like, Nope. This will get handled. Maybe I don't have the solution now, but I will in the. In the near future is a huge thing.

So.

And I think you bring that to the team.

Yeah, that was something I had to learn how to do, too. And I think it's because when you're off, when you're in a leadership role, you have so much more information than everybody else. All the time. All the time. Like, I. It's hard to convey to someone, like, there are things happening all the time that you have no idea about and not potentially not in a bad way. You know, there's new business opportunities that are coming up, or, you know, Lauren and I are working on plans for things that it doesn't. It would be irresponsible to, you know, share with anyone because they might not come through or we might not totally agree on it yet or something like that, or a team member might be going through a challenging time or pursuing a new position right there. We have to be respectful of the context. Right. You have to be respectful of the person that you're. You're dealing with. But that just, like, ends up being a lot. Sometimes I feel that. I feel often like, wow, I sit with a lot of information that I sometimes don't know what to do with. And at first that felt like chaos. And I was like, this is just the way of the world, guys. Like, it is chaos. And Lauren has. Has helped me, you know, be that filter a little bit more to be like, it is chaos. That's why you're here, because I know you can handle the chaos. Right. But, like, a lot of people are looking to us to filter that for that and provide the stability and consistency of knowing that there are things that are happening and we're going to be okay. And here's why. Because we have a plan for those things. But that took me a long time, too. And I think that also comes from working in a very small environment where we only had four to five people on the team. There wasn't a lot of hiding things when it was chaotic. And now when we have a larger team, the work that you do isn't as visible to everybody else. The planning isn't the same, and your group conversations aren't the same. So it does make me feel a little bit more pressure to continue to provide real consistency. And I feel more pressure because there's more people, you know, looking to us to give that. But I. It gets easier. I feel like, like I said, every year, it gets easier and easier to.

Do that when I feel like you've really defined your role well, that it's like, this is what I handle and how I can help you. And also everybody has a different capacity. And the more you're in this role, the more kind of chaos that's thrown at you, the higher your capacity level becomes. So maybe you're sitting with all this information and all this because you have that capacity of capability, whereas some of your other team members, again, like you said it would be irresponsible because they can't handle that capacity. And that's okay. That's a transparent business. But it's also like knowing and understanding your team and how that, like, looks for each of them individually. So, yes, I think it's huge. You've definitely transitioned well. Was there any, like, process or anything that maybe you can speak to? Whether it was like, trainual or any. Any type of different vendor that you've used, that's been helpful to kind of make sure the team's all aligned and on the same page as you've become this leader and even during that transition, maybe something that you wished you had put into place beforehand, Anything of that nature?

Yes, I would say a couple things. One, I live and die by our strategic plan, and I joke that I'm kind of like it's advocate at all in any all things. It's like I'm here representing the strategic plan, but having an actual plan every single year of like, what we want to do, what we want to accomplish, how to get there, has aligned us so much more than we have ever been before. So, yes, like having real processes in training and having a consistent sales process and really having all of those things really aligned for the team has been. Has been able to scale. Allow us to scale and grow faster, for sure. But I would say, like, specifically in my role, where I am overseeing not only like, the daily operations and making sure things are, you know, happening the way they need to happen, but also that we are achieving all of our growth plans that is in alignment with Lauren's vision. That's where I really rely on the strategic plan to come back to it daily and say, okay, are we on track with this goal? Are we on track with this project? Because this project affects this project and this project affects our production and that it just gives us a language to speak, a common language for all of us to speak. As far as, like, getting to the same place, which is, you know, perhaps production, maybe it's a new office that we're opening. Anything like that. And then it really allows Us to, to set them in stone. Right. I think part of what we struggled with when we were really, you know, we were smaller and we were really scrappy was our goals felt like they were constantly changing because our business was changing so rapidly. But being able to really have it on paper and say, no, no, this is what we're after this year and this is how we're going to get it done has allowed us to find opportunities that we wouldn't have found before, but also provide a real consistent experience for our clients and scale at the.

Same time and give team members a roadmap like, hey, this is where we're all going. A path, a guide, a map of some sorts. How do you come up with this strategic plan? Do you utilize like, eos, or is it more just concepts that you and Lauren have created? How do you come up with that?

Yeah, I. So I read EOS back when I first got my. My job because again, I was looking for things, so it was eos. And Brene Brown is where I started. Yep. And EOS gave me some framework. Right. They. We do utilize their, their framework when it comes to goals and quarterly rocks. So I've taken things that I think are applicable from the, from that framework for our business, and I've changed it year by year. So it kind of is a. It's a. It's a real hybrid.

Yeah.

But for us, we. We set out with a production goal, and then we have maybe six to eight annual goals. And then with that, we look at those annual goals and say, okay, how are we going to achieve them? And then from there, we build quarterly rocks per team. So those are like our projects that are designed to fuel those goals. This year, I also put a definition of success around those goals because last year we were kind of like, I think we met it right.

I think we did.

So this year we actually have a way to define it. And then we also have individual team member KPIs.

So interesting.

Those don't. Those don't really impact the. Might not impact rocks or this year's specific goals, but they are specific to the role so that someone can objectively look at it and say, I am doing good at my job. And the director can look at it and say, you are doing good at your job, because this is what we have defined as good. And that I really, really, really wanted for people because I wanted that when I was starting out, I really wanted to feel like I was doing good at my job, but I had no measurement of how to measure myself. And I Had no idea how anyone else was measuring me either. So that to me was really important to get off the ground. So we added those last year and then we totally refined them for this year. I think they're in a really good spot so that, you know, if you have to make a hard call on is this person a good fit for our team, it's not just a feeling. Yeah, but we can actually, we actually have things to say. You know, this is what we're looking for. And you know, we're either there or we're not. Which I think is helpful for both people in leadership roles and the person themselves.

Yeah, well, you know, we're such data analytics numbers people, so that speaks right to our heart. Not to associate people with numbers, but I do feel like having measurement durable goals. Like you said, it's great for the leadership team, but also for someone in that position, like, you don't want to just rely on the casual email that gets sent out like, hey, you're doing awesome. You're like, right at what, you know, in what area or where do I need to improve? Like, thank you for thinking I'm awesome. That's cool. But like, what can I do better? And like, what can I continue to do well in? So I think measurable items. Do you have any examples, like let's say for a marketer, what, like some KPIs that people could put into action today in their firms. And it doesn't have to be necessarily like very detailed, but just some kind of big picture items that they could start to place into action today.

Yeah. So I, the way that I told my leadership team to approach KPIs is to look at each individual role and start by saying what is good. Right. Because we as leadership get to decide the expectation. And I think that really matters when it comes to something like customer service. So I'm a huge believer in customer service. I love working with people and I think it can completely transform your business if you spend a lot of time focused on it. And so I get to decide what is my level of expectation when it comes to customer service. And then that should be the cape. Those should be the KPIs. So for a marketing position, I would say, you know, some of our KPIs we have are we have to have so many registrants per workshop. We need to have so many people schedule after a workshop. For some of our more creative folks. They are very project based. Right. So we're looking at their workload every month and saying, okay, did you complete 90% of the projects that were on your plate this month for customer service, like on our client servicing team, right, we're looking at like, we're all voicemails responded to within 24 hours. We're all emails responded to within 24 hours. So that's where I would say, like, set those customer service expectations that you really feel represent your organization, and then you could build those into the roles to say this, this is it. This is what we need. And then someone can say, you know, I worked at this place and that was, you know, we didn't do it there. Like, okay, that's totally fine, but, like.

You don't work there anymore how we do it here.

Right, exactly. And I think that's really important for us as leadership to say, this is what a good. This is what good is. Because I really think people are. Are looking for that, Right. They want to know whether. Doing a good job and. And so it's up to us to define that for them.

Yeah, I love that. I think that gives so much freedom also to the leadership team is you get to define what your firm is. I feel like so many. And it kind of touches back to being reactionary and how that's not necessarily the best thing as a leader because you don't want to react to so much around you that you no longer know where your good focus is. You don't know that baseline anymore because of all these outside things happening. And it's the nature of our world. Right? Everything is going to happen to you. Everything is going to come at you because. But we know this is our bare minimum level of success, is treating our clients and our customers at this level and everything beyond that. We can continue to move forward with excellence. So I've seen it. I mean, I've seen it in just the way you guys do things, and it's just incredible. And I think for any firms that maybe are struggling with that, I would say maybe it's a leadership position role to really take a look, sit with your team, understand what your metrics are, understand what your measurables are and your processes and your definitions are, because the rest of the team will follow in that for sure.

Yes, absolutely.

Yeah, I love it. Is there anything that you've, like recently potentially faced in your firm that you feel like other firms might have to overcome in the future? I mean, you guys are at like, quite an adequate big firm level. And I know maybe a lot of these smaller firms maybe are where you were started. So is there anything that you've kind of had to overcome in that transition that you can kind of give advice to for other firms.

Yeah, I would say, you know, one of the things that I am constantly thinking about is how do we grow with our clients, not without them.

Yep. Love that.

And if you are in a position to. To scale and. And work in a capacity where you maybe have multiple offices or your team has doubled in size, you know, it can be a challenge because there are a lot of our families who are used to a completely different operation. Right. Families that have been with, you know, specifically Lauren, working with Lauren for over 10 years. And they remember when Lauren used to answer the phone.

Yep.

So I didn't remember when I used to answer the phone or, you know, and. And the growth is so exciting for the team. Right. It is thrilling when we bring on new team members. It is thrilling when we. We develop new positions within the organization.

Right.

Like, there's just an energy and a buzz internally when you are growing and the team can see it and feel it. We're about to do, hopefully, some remodeling of our office, and everybody's really excited about that. So there's so many things that are positives for the team when you are on a really great growth trajectory. The challenge with that is how do you also educate your clients to feel that they are. Are benefiting from that as well and not feeling like we've completely changed who we are. Right. You know, and I feel. I feel for them, you know, because they. They. Some people were, you know, used to coming into more of like a mom and pop style shop where we had five people. Everybody knew them by first name. We all knew who their grandkids were. Right. Like, it was a different feel. And I think so many of those elements are still there. They are still there. In our operation today, it just looks a lot different because we have a bigger building, we have a larger team. There are more people to introduce them to. People don't see Lauren in the same way that they used to. So that's always on top of my mind. And it has been a challenge for us to keep thinking, how do we keep them at the center of this growth. Right. Because it's really easy to keep your team at the center of the growth because they're excited by it. And day in, day out, yes, they can see the fruit of their labors. They're like, oh, yes, it's really exciting internally. I think it's just something you have to really stay on top of is how does that also look externally to the families that you serve.

Do you feel like most of your clients are hesitant with these changes, or do you feel like a majority are more rooting for you and excited about the changes? How is the like, feel and the vibe there?

I would say majority are rooting for us for sure. And I think that is a testament to the relationships that we've, we've focused on. And we really put an emphasis on relationship and customer service. So that's fantastic. Right. We just had our client appreciation event in November and it's always a wonderful feel. Good. Like, I just love when people walk by and they're like hugging Lauren and saying, like, I'm so proud of you. Because again, you know, they've seen this thing that he's built, you know, transform. But there are people who are more hesitant and rightfully so. They want to, they want to know that the service that they were promised isn't going to change. They want to make sure that, like, the things that were appealing about us when they joined our firm are still there.

Right.

They have, you know, a team that they know people that they trust are going to pick up the phone, that they can come to the office and be a part of our events and our activities and things like that. And we love when our families share that feedback with us because if they, if they don't feel like that's happening because it allows us to change things or tweak things or say, okay, if this person is thinking about that, there's probably other people thinking, so how do we, how do we account for that long term? It's really helped us change our, our process as far as like introducing new team members. You know, how do they, how do we make them feel like it's exciting that there's someone else on the team and here's how they benefit from that. So it really just informs a lot of the decisions that we make on a day to day basis and it informs our strategic planning of, like, how do we make sure that this is, we're not losing touch with them even as we are. We have our eyes on, you know, other things that are happening and making sure that they are continually at the heart of everything that we're doing.

I think it's that cognizant of awareness though. I mean, you all have such a heart for that that it's being continually aware of your client. Because at the end of the day, that is who makes your firm. Yes, we as a team love each other and want to do well and want to be the successful firm, but we don't have a firm without our clients, you know, and I think there's a lot lost in that. That as they're growing and as firms are scaling, it's hard to say, okay, yeah, we're doing all these great things, but what is at our core, like, who do we really serve? I mean, it's a great reminder, even for Erica and I. Like, we are, you know, in such a cool, awesome, like, experience, explosive year, and we're so happy about it. But it's like, how do we still service our firms to the level that we want them to feel like they are served excellently, that they are heard, that even as we grow, we still have that core feeling of family? And I think that's awesome. When you have a good team, it really is helpful because you're like, no, everyone. I mean, I laugh. I was so similar to you. I just remember I was a support person. You know, I was reading those support emails and I was doing the scrubs, and now people, you know, still come to me and I almost, like, love it because I'm like, I love that, you know, feel so connected. But I'm actually not the best for you. Like, even I'm not the best. And I never want to be the best support role because that's not my role. So I think it's interesting. It's awesome. It's good to remember, like, the heart of your firm and who you are and what you do.

So, yes, it is. And it has challenged us as leadership to also think exactly like that is like, you know, I know a lot of people. Laura knows a lot of people. We also don't see our clients the same way that we used to because we are in the back, you know, we're back office now. We're not client facing at all. And so it is important for us when we are in front of clients to think like, okay, how can we talk up the team? Right? It's not about me. I'm the last person that they should be interested in. And I need to focus on, like, who can I introduce them to? Who can I get them connected with? Do you know this person? Like, try to think.

Yes, yes, yeah, yeah.

And they're like, oh, exactly.

I feel like too. I mean, you and I, you've touched base on this a little bit, but you and Lauren have a great working relationship and that's very solidified. I feel like, for. Could you give any advice for anyone kind of in your role that maybe isn't as connected to their advisor or ways to make sure you you share the same vision and are really relaying what they want. Did that come naturally? Was that something that you both had to kind of work on? I feel like it's. You guys just really are aligned in the vision, and I feel like that's pretty rare. But also want to encourage others to try to get there.

Yeah, it. It came. It came. We had to work out.

I love that, though. That's human. Right. Like, we kind of didn't choose each other. Like, this isn't a marriage where we got to choose each other and say, yes, this is a, you know, company, and this is an organization, and we want to be best in our roles. But.

Yeah.

Through that.

Yes. Now, to be fair, I do feel like Lauren and I have personalities that complement each other, so. Right. Like, I'm very extroverted.

Yeah.

Pretty outgoing. And Lauren's a little bit more. He's more introverted and he's. But he's a risk taker in ways that I am not. So I do feel like we balance our personalities, balance each other out, luckily, that way. But, you know, when he was buying out his business partner, things change rapidly. Like, we all of a sudden had to make decisions and rebrand our whole organization. That was really exciting for me to be like, oh, let's go. Right. Like, what do you need? What do you need? What do you need? Just, like, give me things. I'll get the signage for the building. Sure. So that experience, I think, allowed us to build trust with each other because I was all in. I was bought in of, like, let's. All right, who cares? Let's do it. And he had something that he could go to for help. And so working off of that trust and coming back to that has helped a lot. As we have figured out, like, how do we communicate best with each other? We also know after working with each other for so long, what each other's little triggers are like.

Yeah.

And. But I do think that there is a sense of, you know, being as. As honest and respectful as you can if you're someone in my role with your. Your CEO, your advisor, whoever it is, because you have to take things to them. And if I had just waited for Lauren to bring things to me, like, we would not be able to do our individual positions. We would not be in the position that we were in because our brains work differently and we're focused on different things. So by me being able to take initiative, to say, like, here are all the things I think are important. Here's what I want to do about that like, tell me what I'm missing. Tell me what your vision is. You know, there's a lot of, like, that back and forth. And I do really rely on what his vision for the company is and where he wants to go. But he also listens to me, and I really appreciate that. Where he'll bring stuff to me and say, this is what I'm thinking. But, like, I don't know. What do you think? I'm like, yeah. And I. I love that, and I really respect that he does that. And it's not just, you know, my way or the highway or he'll say something, and I'll be like, yeah. Or vice versa. I'll be like, we should do this. And he's like, maybe we should talk about that. Right?

Yeah.

Those things we've had to work out to be able to feel, me especially, feel comfortable, to challenge him a little bit more. But it just. Like any relationship, it just takes time and effort and apologizing. Like, there are days where we start the day by being like, well, yesterday wasn't our best day, so I'm sorry for this. And he'll be like, I'm sorry for that. And then, you know, you have to, like, manage that. You have to, like, keep. Keep on top of that or. And not let those kind of things fester or like, hey, you said this, and that did not sit well with me. You know, like, it is an actual relationship that you have to spend time on and to make sure that, you know, you're being forthright and communicating what you need to. And then again, that just builds trust. So that when you're in the thick of it and you're in tough moments, it's like, well, yeah, I know you.

Have my best interest. I already know that. It's not something that I have to guess on. And I think, too, like, as in your role, you are really the barrier to so many people and so many things for him that he maybe doesn't. And not to say he's, like, blind by any means, but it's like, you really handle so much underneath that he doesn't actually know when you hit the top of the iceberg. You know, it's like, there's actually all these things happening below, and, like, I'm giving you this, you know, 30% picture, and that is your role, and I think you do a tremendous at it, and he trusts you in that to handle that and do it well. So I love it. But last question. Where are. This is our kind of theme question. We're always about trucking and onto the next adventure. So where are you trucking? What is your summit this year, either personally or professionally? Like, what is your big, big thing you want to accomplish this year?

Yes. Well, we're coming off a really great year last year. So last year was our. Our record year, and so we are in a position to have another really great year, and I would love to have another really great year. Right. I don't want last year to just be kind of a fluke and, you know, say, oh, we'll always remember 2024. Like, I want to really capitalize on our. Our. All the work that we've done in it, and we have a really awesome team. And for me, I got to add two new people to my leadership team last year. So, you know, for. For me, I love the fact that I now have someone to. To lead and guide every department, and then I get to be there for them.

Right.

Like, that's always been a real challenge for me, is feeling like I have to be everything to everybody all the time. And that's a lot when there's, like, 30 people and they're all kind of expecting something different from you. And I feel so much peace from being kind of, like, relieved of that by having the awesome leadership team because now they can be that person for the rest of the team, and then I get to feel the satisfaction of being, you know, a guide and support for those five people specifically. And I really love that also. I'm going from being a mom of one to a mom of two this year.

We're so excited. We need another little bra, and she's.

Coming, and I am thrilled. I'm so excited. And my husband and I are just over the moon about having another girl, But I'm a little, you know, I'm a little scared. You know, it's hard enough being a working mom of the toddler that, you know, adding one more to the mix does make me nervous, but mostly just because, you know, I feel the. The. The pressure of trying to make sure I'm doing everything for my family that I can.

Yeah.

And also not letting anyone down here. So.

Yeah.

Yeah. I do have such a fantastic support system here at the office that, you know, when things happen, things happen, and everybody kind of shifts and adjusts because we know life happens.

Yeah.

Yes. Yeah.

That's natural. I want you to know. That's very natural. Both Eric and I have felt that, especially moving into your second, you're like, okay, did this well with one, but, like, what happens with the next is this the same? Is it different? So it's supernatural, but we're rooting for you in that. I mean, it's huge.

Oh, thanks. Yeah. And you get kind of comfortable, you know, with one. You kind of get through some of those stages where you're like, most nights, we all sleep through the night. Most tonight, you know, I'm getting eight hours. And most nights, you know, I can two weeks at a time without someone getting sick right now. Right. Add one more little person to the mix, it. It changes. But I think it's gonna be great. It'll be.

But it also brings twice the joy. I will always say that. I think it brings twice the joy. Even more, because you watch them kind of become little buddies and friends and watch their communication, and it's really cute. So. So don't be nervous. I mean, it's a lot, but, yeah, it's. It's twice the joy and twice the. Twice the craziness. But you're a leader. You live in chaos, and you have the capacity for it, so it works well. So well. Thank you so much for just sharing your expertise with everyone on the podcast. And we're so hopeful and thankful for you and hopeful people can learn from this. And thank you for just action items like KPIs for your team and understanding, kind of the vision of where you should be, direction for your strategic plan. So we appreciate you. We're rooting for you. We'll see you soon.

Thank you.

Bye.