https://www.listennotes.com/e/748e790e127e4873a549d080314635ff

Foreign.

Welcome to Executing the Vision podcast. I'm your host, Brad Hunter, president of Emerge Labs. On the podcast, we'll get to know the person behind the vision, their successes, their challenges, and their plans for the future. If you're interested in becoming a guest or know someone who might be a good fit, stick around to the end and we'll discuss how to apply. Now, enjoy the show. Well, everybody, like to welcome you to another episode of X Gift Skewing Division. I'm your host, Brad Hunter. Today we've got Jeff Jones joining us here from the podcast. And Jeff, go ahead, introduce yourself a little bit about, you know, what you've done, and then let's hear kind of just your story of where you're from.

Sure, yeah. So I'm currently the CFO for Twisted X. Twisted X is a footwear company. We're based in Decatur, Texas. Started as a cowboy boot company, but just over time have evolved. We sell lifestyle product. We still sell a lot of work product, outdoor product. We're very innovative footwear company and so been here nine years. I've had a blast. Learned a lot about footwear, for sure. You know, looking forward to what the future brings there. As far as Twisted X, some very.

Cool stuff, I'll say.

Yeah.

Looking at, I mean, really cool, like from the, like I said, both sides, the cowboyish side of things and the work side of things, it seems to me like a brand that really, I don't know, would be heading in a good direction. You know, as soon as I saw the website, I was like, wow, that's really great stuff they've got.

Yeah. You know, one of the cool things about working here is, I mean, we, we have our values and really our four pillars are product, planet, philanthropy, and people. And so everything we do is we've got to create great product. We've got to make something that people want to buy. Otherwise, we can't do the rest of it. Planet we're huge on sustainability. We're a net zero carbon company. We're actually trying to be carbon positive and working that into our plan today. Every product we have has some level of sustainable or recycled or upcycled materials in it. Philanthropy is a huge piece of what we do. We work a lot with first responders, veterans. We spent, sponsor or donate money to a counseling center that has a counseling program for people dealing with cancer. We work a lot with, you know, underprivileged kids. Core of it is our people, both the people that work for us and our partners in the marketplace. So we're we're very purpose driven and it makes it fun to walk in the door every day.

Seems like a wonderful spot. So tell us a little bit, where did you grow up?

I grew up in East Texas in Tyler. My dad was a lifelong East Texas resident, except for when he was in the airport workforce. So grew up in Tyler, ended up in school in Abilene and then wound my way back to Fort Worth. When I went to college, I wanted to be a psychology major. And my parents at the time were not going to be able to help me a lot, but they said, look, we'll help more with your education if you'll get an accounting degree. My dad's best friend was a cpa, so hey, follow the money. So I got the accounting degree, but I've always had this bent towards what makes people tick and how do you get the most out of people and help everyone succeed. So it's something I've kind of blended throughout my career and I've spent a lot of time in small growth companies because I got to do a lot of different things and mix all that into what I was doing every day.

Yeah. And so then walk us through your, you know, your kind of career path because going through, you've done a lot of really great things.

So. Yeah, so, you know, accounting degree. So you start out in public accounting. So I went that route for a few years, then went into work, went to work for a home health care company again. It was a company that we went from 35 employees to over 500 in a matter of three years. So it just, it blew up. Learned a lot there. All about, you know, being able to adapt and change as we go. Left there and went to work for a retail company that a friend of mine from college was wanting to grow in the western industry, which you were asking about. Growing up, I spent a lot of time out on my uncle's farm and all that. I've just always been a jeans and boots kind of guy. And so going to work for a western retail company was fun. I came in as the controller. Day three, I became the IT guy. Day four, I was the HR guy. After the first year, I was the general manager for our retail stores. We opened, you know, started a catalog business and I quickly was managing the fulfillment team and the customer service team. So I got to do a lot of, like I said, a lot of different things and see business from a very holistic standpoint, which is really what I have enjoyed and something that I think has really helped me be successful. Not to be Siloed somewhere. It's been a lot of years with them left there. Tried to do a thing with a friend of mine. It didn't pan out. Then I wound up in a trailer manufacturing business again. Horse. Horse trailer manufacturing business again. More kind of handling the accounting and finance. But I was also dabbling and helping with some marketing efforts and doing some different things. Had an opportunity to go to work for a friend of mine for a large western footwear company as a sales rep. Spent one year as a key account rep with their number four account and two of their top hundred accounts. And so I got to see a very different slice of the industry. Being a. Being a sales rep and working on commission and love that my client or my biggest customer ended up selling to another large customer. So my. The job changed and decided to go look for something different and wound up here at Twisted X. Kind of back in what I've done most of my life. But then with that added experience of actually being a sales rep, actually, you know, having to move products, all sorts.

Of different exciting experience, but somewhat in that same realm, right? Kind of in that similar ish industry.

Yeah. I mean I've. I've kind of stayed in the Western industry since 94. I love it, love the people, you know, love the mentality of it all. And this is the way I dress all the time. Boots, jeans, hats.

Well then, yeah. So what I'd really like to start diving into then is just focusing on a lot of the different lessons you've learned. You know, it seems like from all these situations you probably have a lot of good wisdom to kind of pass along. So, you know, first question from growing up, what was the most important lesson you learned in childhood that you feel applies today to your success?

I think my, my dad instilled a strong work ethic in me in the very beginning. But not just do the work, be the best you can be at the work you're doing. And so I've always grown up with this idea that I had to be invested in myself and becoming the best me I could be. So whether it was when I was growing up playing basketball or, you know, as I go through college and, and get a job, it was always, how do I get better at doing what I want to do so that I can give the people I'm working for or working with the very best of me. And I think that's just been critical even today. That has translated into, I have a leadership theory or mantra called soc leadership, and the S stands for self. You have to Invest in yourself and be the best leader you can be. Be the best co worker you can be. Be the best whatever you can be by investing in yourself too, to then be able to pour out and help other people.

Right. And how do you think, and I think that I agree with that a hundred percent. And you know what? I like sit back and think of that comment from maybe a person's perspective that doesn't happen to live that way. Right. A person's persp that comes into a situation and that just, they look at it like, okay, well, whatever. I want to get this job done, I'm not that excited about. I'm not, whatever, just going to get it done. Right. And how do you think you kind of flip that switch into those things that really, you know, it seems like in general what you're describing is having a real passion for whatever you're going to do, you have a true passion that you want to do it the best you can do. You want to be the best you can be. And how do you think a person that doesn't live in that space, how, how do you think they could flip the switch to look at it in a different way?

Growing up, my mother, if she said it once, she said it a million times. Attitude is everything. And so, you know, just how you approach things determines how you're going to work through things. And, you know, as a young kid, even as a young adult, I, I didn't, I didn't get it. But the older I've gotten, the more I've, I use the word gratitude a lot now in the good things and the hard things. There's lessons that we learn, there's growth that comes from it. And even when it's painful or not enjoyable at the time, somewhere down the road, that experience is going to have value to you. And so I tell my people and tell anybody I'm working with. I'm a big proponent of just having a gratitude journal and writing down the things you're grateful for every day, whether it's a good thing or a bad thing, whether it, it brought you joy and, you know, brought you some sort of success, or whether it brought you a challenge that you're going to grow from and learn from. It's that attitude of gratitude. And it sounds a little cliche, but there's a reason because it, it is meaningful and it does work.

Yeah. Yeah. And I, I, from books I've read and things I've seen, concept of gratitude tends to be one of the biggest underlying things for most very successful people. Okay, next question here. What mistake did you make early on you wish you could do different talking.

When I should have been listening. You know, when we're kids and we all, you know, joke about childhood or even our kids, they know everything. And, you know, I remember that I used to always feel like I needed to express my opinion or tell people, you know, how I saw it, like, to be able to stand out, I had to be talking. And what I've learned over time is that asking questions and listening makes me a lot smarter person than talking. And so today, you know, I, I lead a team here, and it's my choice. I can either go in and tell them everything I think they need to know every day, or I can ask them a lot of questions that either one get them thinking so that they want to go learn more or just gives me more input. You know, as you, as you grow in over time in your, in your job or, you know, your, whatever your title status in the company, you get further and further away from where the action is. And so you think you know what's going on from sitting up here, but it's really the people that are on the front lines that know what's going on. And instead of just talking to them all the time about what they need to do, I'm wanting to tell me more, tell me more, and let's make decisions together. And so I would say that was my mistake, was always feeling like I had to have the answers, whereas today I want to seek out answers.

Yeah, yeah. I love that whole concept. I agree. I can in a consulting thing, anytime I come into a company, the thing that really surprises me the most is that idea of. I think it's more standard for what you. The latter more standard. Right. For the people in charge, just come and tell them what they need to do, how they need to change, and it's just not. And I feel like when you explain that to people, you know, the, the mentality behind doing it that different way, and it doesn't, it clicks pretty quickly. Right. It's not a concept, but the nature it seems to be as you get in that, as a leader, you get in that thing of like, well, I'm in charge, I need to make the decisions. And so everybody sit down around the table. Here's what everybody needs to do. Okay, go. Not taking the time to just first listen. I mean, obviously you're going to have your ideas, your thoughts on what the right direction is. But yeah, that ability to listen to me, it's twofold because it's that ability to listen, to understand other perspectives. And then that also, then the buy in I feel like you get from the staff if they've been heard is exponentially higher than if they've been told.

Yeah, and, and that's, you know, one of those things that, you know. Again, coming up, I kind of had this concept that have all the answers. I had to know the right thing. I had to appear like I was in charge. And, and again, I've just, I've kind of learned that it's really important for my people to see me as a human to not have all the answers, to need help to seek out, certainly get that buy in, but even more to let them know that I'm, I'm just, I'm just another person just like you are. We're, we all have a job to do and I need your help to do my job better. And I'm going to give you my help to do your job better. And again, it's that, it's, it's, it's, I think it's how we really come together and create a culture that team culture as opposed to, you know, the dictatorship of I know best and you're going to do what I say.

You've been in a lot of different businesses. What do you think most businesses do wrong?

Well, I, I think a lot of it is not knowing what they're, what's in their blind spots. Especially, you know, when a business gets going and you, and you're having some success. But, but even when you're struggling, you're focusing on top line growth, you're focusing on what we're doing that's getting traction. You're focusing on all these things that you feel like are going to make you go forward and you don't stop and look at what are the blind spots, what are, what are the things that other people see that I'm not seeing where we may have a weakness and to be able to go and do something like, you know, to fix it. And that's, I think that's what happens. You see a lot of these companies, they grow real fast and then are going back down because they knew what was getting them there, but they weren't looking for what, what's the next person seeing where they're going to come and find a way in to surpass me. And so I think a lot of people focus on, they focus a lot on what's bringing them success, which is important. You have to do that, but you also have to stop sometimes and go, okay, what could be going wrong. What, what do we need to be prepared for? Where, what are we not seeing? What do we, what do we not know that we need to know? And, and they, they don't take that step. And so it'll, it allows an opening for someone to, to come in and take market share or take their employees or whatever and, and go rot. Bomb.

Yeah. Yeah. It's funny, I feel like a lot of times the more successful a company is, the more blind they become. Right. You know, it's, you know, I feel like in the tech sector and things like that, it becomes so evident that, you know, just some of these companies that, you know, might have been a more traditional company but were doing well, but then just didn't really care to dabble in any of the tech side of things. And then suddenly some other competitor up and just puts them out of business before they even know what's happening. You know, feel like that the past several years have really shown that point. Well, that, you know, just because what you're doing today is successful, you know. Yeah. A. You have to be really willing to look at other ways to do business and, you know, just what's the future going to bring? And yeah, I feel like a lot of times it's almost the more success you have, the more whatever, you just, you're blind. You don't care. Right. You just simply don't care. Because who cares about another opinion? What I'm doing is working great.

Actually. I read a story just, just recently about an executive that went into a room with their team and they were just fixing to launch this new product. And the executive goes in and says, I've got some bad news. This launch is going to be a failure and we're not going to go forward with it. And the whole exercise was to get people thinking about, well, what's going wrong? What do we do wrong? What have we missed? What did we not see? And, and it started that conversation of what have we not seen? And then obviously it's like, okay, this was just an exercise, you know, but now, now we have more, some more data to work with on how to be, how to continue that success. And you know, you can scare a lot of people to death doing that. But I thought, you know, that's a pretty, pretty good exercise to get people to be, to stop and think because we, we get on this track of what am I doing and how am I going to make this work? And we forget to, we forget to look at where we, we may have left an opening that, that we don't know about.

Yeah, I love that. That's a fun, that's a fun exercise.

Yeah, I'm gonna try it one of these days.

So you've done all sorts of different things. Do you feel successful?

Yes. And not measured against my 25 year old success, but measured against how I see success today. You know, when I was younger, it was about the, the money and the things and it was about climbing the ladder, it was about getting the titles and you know, it's easy for somebody to go, well, now you're, now you're cfo. So you, you know, I've learned that when, when I go out and it's just me and my wife and people ask me what I do at Twisted X, I tell them I'm, I'm an accountant because I don't want the title to be. Fogs up the situation.

Right.

Success for me has simply been how do I help the people around me grow and be successful? And how does that help the company and help me be more successful? And so I've really, I've really changed my measure of success by looking at the people around me, especially the people on my team, and what have I done to help them be a better human today than they were a year ago? You know, what, whatever the, the time frame is, that's really where I find success. The other piece of it is do I have peace in my life about what I'm doing both professionally and personally. And so if, if I can determine that, you know, I have this inner peace that, that I'm doing all the right things for people in my professional life and for me and people in my personal life. And I see that success, that growth in people, that's when I believe I'm, I'm truly succeeding. You know, it comes back to, and I really appreciate our, our CEO and his, his focus on the planet because he's always, we need to leave the planet a better place than we found it. And so that's kind of just adopted that into my personal success theory is am I, am I leaving people and places better than I found them? And if I am, I've, I've been successful and all the other stuff, I mean, it's going to come with it. You know, I mean, I earn a good paycheck and you know, I have a roof over my head and food on the table and I'm very fortunate in that sense. But it all goes back to am I leaving things better than I found them?

That's a great, a great description. Overall, you Gave. I feel very, very different from what I feel like most people tend to go to in that situation. Right. Just a totally different mental space than I think. Especially when a situation like this, when somebody is asked that question, the feeling of success tends to be very financial, business oriented.

And I think that's, you know, it's somewhat to do with the world. We grow up, you know, we get those feelings and you know, my, my, my dream car is a Mercedes G550 with the AMG package. I would love to have one of those. Yeah, it's probably not going to happen. And that doesn't define who I am. Again, when I was 25 years old, I felt like it would define who I am a lot more than I do now think. You know, thankfully we do get a little wisdom as we age, but. But yeah, it's just, what, what are we doing to make the space where we are better than we found it?

Another question, kind of, you know, you've been talking a lot about working with your team and making them better. As somebody that's listening to this, if they are wanting to, you know, work their way up through a company, what type of traits do you look for in your staff?

Great question. One, one thing I always look for, and this goes way back to when I was working in retail and we were interviewing people and I always told my managers, find out if they're willing, are they willing to jump in, are they willing to work, are they willing to do things that aren't on their job description? You know, that that person that's like, well, that, that's not my job. That's not the, that's not one of the people I want working for me. I want people just to be willing to do whatever, whatever needs to be done. That, that's a big one. The other one is I'm going to give people things that I think will help them grow, that I think will help their ability to do the job, that I think will help their ability to just be a better human all the way around. And I watch to see do they embrace that or do they not care about that? Because again, I want people. I hope I instill in people some of that same idea that I have of leaving things better than you found it. So it's, how do we, how do we be better to do that? So willingness and a desire for growth are probably two of the biggest. And then, you know, a lot of it, again, it goes back to attitude. Is, is everything, as my mom said, what is their attitude? I've got A young man today, he's been an intern for us, and today's his last day with us. He's going back to school. And I was just talking to him, you know, about his attitude that it was just so refreshing to walk in and talk to him every day because he had a smile on his face. He. He wanted to figure out how to grow, how to learn. And that's just invigorating when, when you're around those kind of people, when you're a leader and you've got those kind of people working around you who make you feel better about that, you, that you cross paths with them, they stand out and, and they're, you know, they're, you know, they're going to be able to continue to rise through the ranks because it's just a positive, can do attitude. You know, I've worked with a lot of people that when you bring up something, hey, we need to do this, and the first words out of their mouth are, well, we can't do it because of this. You know, the negativity kills a business. And, and so you've got to have those people that are just that attitude of, we're going to figure this out, we're going to. We're going to figure out how to move ball. Will there be challenges? Yes, always. There's always challenges. But you can either see the challenges as a mountain that can't be moved, or you can see it as a stone that you can push, Push further along the path. And so those are probably the big three for me.

Yeah, yeah. I like to ask. I'm especially big on the idea of presenting solutions. Yeah, right. You know, just, hey, don't come to me with a problem first. Tell me what the solution to it is first. Then we'll talk more about what the actual problem, but have a solution, you know, And I feel like if you, you know, kind of train people in that fashion, that really helps. It just make some pause.

Right.

Make some pause. And like, okay, here's what went wrong. I have to first think about how maybe this could be fixed and present it in that fashion. I think that that mentality, I've found, makes a big difference.

You know, this is. This is probably a story I shouldn't tell about myself, but it goes back to college in a class, an accounting class I was struggling in. And I went to the professor and. Because a lot of people were having trouble in this class and, And I said, hey, you know, everybody's talking and we're all having trouble with, you know, whatever it was, and our grades aren't all that good and you do things this way and I wondered if you have considered doing it this other way that, you know, several of us think might be better for us in the long run. And he just leaned back in his chair and I'll never forget, he just said, well, first he said, I have a lot of students come and complain to me, but they never offer solutions. You're one of the few that has ever done that and I congratulate you for that. Second, I'm not changing anything. I'm doing okay, but, but you know, it made an impact on me when he told me that because it, it obviously resonated with him that even though, you know, he had his plan and, and he had been doing what he had been doing a long time, so he really didn't need a, an 18, 19 year old kid telling him how to change. But you know, the fact that he acknowledged that I did that and, and it, that that story has stuck with me of come up with solutions.

And now, okay, so you have been in the, you know, numbers side of the business for your whole career. Now you've dabbled in other areas. What section of the business is most challenging? You know, just of any given business, like, what part of it is most challenging for you?

People always, you know, as, as good as our culture is here. And I think it's one of the best I've ever worked in. Everybody still fits in their little, you know, silos. And so this department, you know, they see everything this way and this department sees it this way. And, and everybody wants the best for their department or to make it as easy for them or, you know, what, whatever the measure may be, getting people to communicate. And you know, I've used this, the exercise several times with how did you get to work today? And it, you know, it always starts with, well, I, you know, I just drove here. Okay, how'd you get in your car? Well, I walked out in the garage. Okay, but how did you get in your car? And you know, you, you dig down into the details of how they unlocked the door and started the ignition and then you even back up to how did they wake up? An alarm clock. And, and after a while, after I've just, you know, numb their brains with that, I'll say, can you imagine how many people have been a part of you showing up for work today? From the, from the person who made the chip in your phone or your alarm clock to the person who put the keys together for your car and the Motor and the engine and the tires and everything else. Can you imagine how many people have been a part of you just showing up in the front door? It's no different in our organization to get product from the beginning to the end takes a lot of people, and they all have to play a role in that. And if you're not aware of the people that are in front of you or the people that are behind you in the process and how important they are to not only the process, but to your success, you're missing the whole picture. It's. It's always how do we get people to work together, to come together? And, you know, again, it goes back to that success and climbing the ladder. And, you know, what do you have to do to get ahead of the next guy? And how do we. How do we change that so that everybody appreciates what other people are doing? And sure, certain folks are going to come up faster or, you know, have different qualities that make it important for them to climb. Climb the. Get into the next position that another person may not have. But nonetheless, we're all equally important in the chain. And so that's. That may be the thing I have struggled with the most in my career, is helping people understand. I used to do a class at one of their. Yeah, I guess a class. Another place I worked called it a leadership development class. Because I, you know, part of my theory is if two people are together, one of them is going to be the leader, and I can either help equip them to be a good leader or trust that they may not be a. You know, they could be a bad leader. And one of the things we talked about a lot was personality types and conflict styles, which I ended up going back to school and getting a master's in conflict resolution, because that's what every accountant does, right? And I learned. I mean, that's where I learned a lot about how conflict happens and how. How conflict starts and how we resolve it. But so much of it is our personalities and, you know, just the way we get information, process information. I'm. I'm more of an introvert at heart. If I'm talking to an extrovert, they probably want all the facts. They want to get everything they can out on the table, and they want to make a decision today. I want to think about things a little bit. Let me get back to you this afternoon or tomorrow. And so if you're pressing me to give you a decision today, I might yell at you because I'm feeling this pressure and all these things come together in this thing we call a job. But it happens in our families and everywhere else. There's a lot of different factors at work. And how do you get all those to mesh so that this thing we're doing of selling footwear from beginning to end goes as smoothly as possible, is. Is as successful as possible, and has all of our people feeling like a team. And. And that's. Boy, that gets to be a struggle. And especially the bigger you get, the more people you have, it just compounds on itself.

I'm sure you had to see that when you had that company where you started with, like, 35 and ended up with over 3,000 or something. Like, my experience. And then I had a similar experience, you know, started like, as one and ended up just over 3,000. And yeah, the. The different stages you go through. Right. There's definitely that stage where it's just kind of one big happy family.

Yes.

You know, you get then. Then you hit about. I felt like it was about 250. You know, you start getting a little north there suddenly, you know, you just kind of got to bring in some outsiders.

Yes.

You know, and then, I mean, hey, the outsiders are, you know, they might have a lot of strength and quality, but in the end, they still. They are outsiders now.

Right.

You know, and then it kind of evolves into this thing over time or. Yeah. Like, the. The higher. The bigger a company gets, just the more challenging that that basic piece of it really becomes. Right? That piece of, like, everybody to just be on the same team and excited to work together.

Yeah. Yeah. You know, I mean, once you get past people, there's, you know, there's the challenges with operations, there's the challenges with choosing the product or making the product. I mean, there's all those challenges. But, man, I have just really seen, you know, how difficult it is when everybody's. There's just friction all the time because somebody's afraid somebody's going to step on their toes. Those problems weave themselves deeper and deeper into the. Into the fabric of the business, and then you've got a lot of troubles if you haven't addressed it.

And then now. So what's the future look like With Twisted X?

We're always innovating. Tell people about our CEO. He's that guy that he wants to go so fast that he cuts the floorboard out under the gas pedal so he can push it through the floorboard. So we're always looking to evolve to bring in new technologies. A few years ago, we. We had a comfort technology that we patented and It, I mean, it has really helped us and now we're creating some variants of that to just create the most comfortable shoes you can. And we keep moving into some different categories. This fall, we're going to be launching a new product line that's completely different than anything we've done in the past. But it's, it's all based off that comfort technology we have, and we feel like that's going to help us not only in our core market, but it's going to open doors into, into other markets also. So we have Twisted X has been evolving ever since I've been here. We started as a Western company. It's probably still our core Western base, but we're getting into more and more mainstream shoe stores and, and, you know, shopping little chains, mom and pop, Main street footwear chains. And so those evolutions just continue to happen. Footwear is still our deal. We're going to stay in footwear there. There are some other opportunities to, to branch out into some other product lines with some companies working with us. And, and that may happen too. But yeah, we're going to continue to, to grow and inn the footwear space and bring new products to market. That comfort and quality are just going to be our foundation.

And in that space, as far as growth, you know, obviously you're trying to get into more and more retailers, trying to get more of an online presence, trying to get. Is there equally problems then where on the manufacturing side where, you know, suddenly whatever, some, some boot you guys have really starts to get popular, really blows up and you just can't even keep up with it, or does it tend to be that concept of if you keep growing the marketing side, the back ends fairly consistent and easy to deal with?

Yeah, you know, we're dealing with the mindset of the consumer, so you never know what they're going to do. And so, yeah, we've had some products that we've introduced that we were like, oh, this is going to be a pretty neat product. And then we were scrambling to get more of it made. And, you know, whether, however we're shipping it in, we're having to fly it in or do something different to get it here faster. And I mean, there was one shoe that we had that I don't think we got caught up. Maybe by the end of the, of the first year we were starting to get caught up on production. That doesn't always happen. You know, we introduce enough and, and some variants that, that most of it we can build on and give our marketing team, you know, Runway to promote it and do those things. But every now and then, you get one that just takes off and. And it's both a great feeling and a frustrating because you're like, I know I got to get it out there, and I know people are asking me for it. But, you know, you get tired of saying, it's coming, it's coming.

And what do you see for the future of yourself? You just want to stick around there, you think, for the rest of your career. You got any other plans in mind?

You know, I'm approaching an age in life where I'll. I'll turn 60 at the end of this year. And so, you know, I'm kind of starting to think about what's next for me. And I'm gonna. I'm gonna hang out here for a while because it's fun. We've got a great group of people. It challenges me, but there's gonna become a point where I want to spend a little more time fishing, a little more time golfing, a little more time with grandkids. So I've been working through a program to get my coaching certification and want to do, I call it mental momentum coaching. But, you know, just helping people be a better version of themselves. And then obviously, I can do some consulting too, but I don't. I don't know when that is going to come. It's not here yet, but I'm just kind of planning for that because I never see myself not working, but maybe just three days a week, that would be a good retirement for me.

Well, and so where twisted x.com is a website, correct?

Yes. Yeah. Now, one thing about us is we do not sell direct to consumer. We're old school footwear wholesaler, so. But on our website, you can find a lot of our retailers where you can get it online or in brick and mortar stores.

Well, cool. I love the stuff. I'm gonna get on there and buy something. When I first. First looked at it, I was like, you know, I like this kind of. Well, hey, it has been wonderful talking to you. Anything else that you'd like to leave the audience with?

You know, again, I guess my one admonition to everybody is leave whatever space you're in better today than it was yesterday and better tomorrow than it is today. And if we can all do that, we can all see, you know, humanity is one humanity. This, as a friend of mine calls it, this spinning ball of chaos is going to be a much more wonderful place.

Excellent. All right, well, thank you, Jeff.

All right. Thank you, Brad.

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