Suicide Prevention Saturday - Interview with Hold My Guns founder

All right, it's Saturday night. You know, one of these days I gotta do like an actual Saturday Night Live, you know, falling downstairs. I need Chevy Chase for this. But anyway, uh, that's only if you're old enough to know what the hell I'm talking about, and only the replay viewers get to see this, so there's that. All right, so, uh, happy Saturday everyone. Uh, my name is Brooke Cheney, it says so right there. Um, I am the owner instructor here at A Great Start Shooting School. I always— everything is backwards, so I never know where to put things. And we do Suicide Friend to Saturday every Saturday night for 10 or 15 minutes usually. But tonight— oh wait, because 2 out of every 3 gun deaths you hear about when people are talking about gun violence are suicides. So if we really want to save lives, we really need to focus on mental health awareness and suicide prevention. Tonight my special guest is Sarah Joy Albrecht from Hold My Guns, and I hope I said your last name right because I never know. And, um, she's going to introduce herself. Oh, and this means, because I've got a special guest— wait, she's over there— um, that this is going to go longer than 15 minutes. So just hold on to your little horses. Um, for those of you watching the replay, I hope to tag this so as we talk about different things you'll get to jump to wherever you want to go because we're on Facebook and YouTube. All right, with that, Miss Sarah, introduce yourself please, ma'am.

Thank you, Brooke. Hi, I'm Sarah Joy Albrecht. I'm the founder and executive director of Hold My Guns, and we are a 501(c)(3) nonprofit. We partner with retail FFLs, gun shops across the United States to provide voluntary firearm storage during times of crisis, like a mental health crisis, whether it's the gun owner or someone in the home, or personal needs such as during deployment, or maybe someone is selling their home and they don't want someone to have unauthorized access to their firearms. While they're staying in a hotel room or while their firearms might be in their car. So it provides a way, a non-legislative solution for people to take personal responsibility and practice self-governance so that we can support gun owners to help them with whatever they need during those times, that we can help take care of their firearms and, uh, and, and just, and support them. So I'm really grateful for this opportunity that we have. Since SHOT Show, two gun owners have stored firearms with us, presumably during a time of crisis. We don't always know why that individual's storing firearms, and so it just really is a beautiful thing to see a practical application of liberty where we can save lives, protect property, and preserve rights.

So What you just said though is that it doesn't have to be someone necessarily in crisis, because when someone comes— because I'm sure a lot of people, because like gun owners, sometimes they're a little bit paranoid. Um, so it's like if I came to you and said, you know, Sarah, I need to have my guns held on to for the weekend, no questions asked, right? Isn't that kind of the beauty of Hold My Guns?

Yes, and it's very important that we set it up that way, um, and to recognize that not everybody storing a firearm is doing it because they are in crisis. You know, like I mentioned, you know, maybe someone's just selling a house and we know that for whatever reason that gun owner is storing a private firearm, that private reason can mean that they are helping to prevent suicide, negligent shooting, unauthorized access that can result in theft of firearms, which can lead to stolen firearms used in crimes. So it really is a way that a non-legislative way that we can provide the solution to answer a lot of the concerns that people have related to firearms. And I'm a range safety officer, and it's, you know, a lot of times, Brooke, people say, well, you know, people are going to always find some way to take their own life. I hear that all the time. Um, and so why do we care so much about firearms? And I just have to say, well, as a range safety officer and as someone who's been in the firearms community like my whole life, I think it's important that whatever sphere of responsibility and influence we have, that we make sure that we're doing our best to support people in our community. And that's really the heart of why I'm doing what I'm doing. We lost an 18-year-old friend to suicide by firearm. And when my kids and young people in the community came up to me and said, Mom, Mrs. Albrecht, you know, we really care about preserving rights. We know the importance of that. But our friend is dead. And how can we help people when there's a family in crisis? How can we help them store firearms? Not everyone has a lawful way to do it, or friends or family who can help. And that's really how Hold My Gun started.

Gotcha. Um, MK Joe says hi. That's one of my YouTube guys. Um, guy that comments is trying to be funny with Hold My Guns when they're done holding your beer, you know, hold my beer, watch this, right? So it's a catchy name, right? Yeah, exactly. It's like, you know, it's like hold my beer, watch this, but, um, it is definitely a different, uh, sort of thing. Now, one of the things you kept saying is that it's a different non-legislative way to allow people to take care of things. I have to ask because, you know, I'm big in the politics garbage, and I do call it garbage because it kind of mostly is garbage, but it's like, what are some of the biggest challenges that you face when you're trying to do something? Oh yeah, and that's— I don't think we mentioned that this is a national idea. This is not like a single state where, um, she's trying to get stuff done. It's nationally. So how are the national laws— the fact that every state you go over is different— how do you help people who want to become part of the Hold My Guns community navigate all the insanity with everything?

Yes, that, Brooke, is one of our biggest challenges. And as you said, we are set up to be a national organization. Right now we have partners in Louisiana, St. Bernard Indoor Shooting Center, in Missouri where we have a partner in Branson Cerakoting and laser engraving. And then we have in Massachusetts, Casey Small Arms, and then upcoming American Trailhead in Georgia and Randall Family Firearms in Washington State. And as you know, in Washington State, there are a lot of gun control laws. And so, you know, something right now the, that particular location is in what we call attorney review. And one of the most difficult aspects of Hold My Guns, like you said, is that there are so many laws and every law, every state has different laws. We never want for it to be a barrier where somebody in crisis or for whatever reason they want to store a firearm has to make a choice between saving their own life or someone in their, in their home. And worrying about crossing state lines, like, oh shoot, you know, if I cross state lines into like New Jersey and there's a magazine limit and I'm not allowed to have this particular kind of firearm, then that person has to make a choice about, you know, helping their situation in their home, their private situation, and worrying about getting in trouble. And so it's so important that we have a partner in all 50 states. And what we do in our process is we provide a template to our FFL partners, and we work with attorneys licensed in their state of operation to make sure that the process follows their state and local gun laws. Because again, we want to make sure we're reducing liability to our partners, but also making sure that gun owners in crisis don't have to worry about, can I lawfully store firearms here? And I have to say that We also store non-serialized critical parts. We can store that as an accessory. So there is always that option if a person is concerned, hey, you know, you can always store like a barrel or a firing pin, and it helps to reduce that temptation of using a firearm to take, to take someone's own life.

Right. And this is like legislation that's coming before us is the whole trying to make every single piece of a firearm into a firearm makes things so much more difficult. One of my students, Fiona, says it's a great idea. She needs something like that for later this year. Because like in her household, for example, she's the gun owner, and so she's the only one who legally has access to her firearms. So when she leaves the house and her, her family is home, they're not— I mean, not that she doesn't have safes and stuff, but it's also nice to know that you can add another layer of security onto there. Yeah. So one of the other things we want to talk about is let's talk about QPR.

Awesome.

Because, um, hold on, I'm trying to be all fancy, like, hold on, let me see if I can show people this. Hold on, technical. There it is. Ta-da! Actually, I'll make it a little bit bigger. We can still talk. All right, so do you want to tell people a little bit more about QPR?

Absolutely. So QPR stands for question, persuade, and refer. And similar to CPR, QPR is a process that you can use to help someone who is experiencing a suicidal crisis. And I love the way that it is, that approaches talking to people. It is especially helpful, I think, for range safety officers. And one of our goals at Hold My Guns is to, to help train and certify those who are firearms instructors, range safety officers, firearms professionals, gun shop employees in QPR. Because the process is one that helps you identify when somebody's in crisis. It encourages you and gives you ideas for how to talk to them in a respectful way, in a de-escalating way. And then that R, that refer, is referring people to appropriate resources. It does not set up that gatekeeper to be a counselor, but it gives a clear line to say, okay, here are some resources. How can I encourage you to make this call, or can I go with you, or can I, you know, sit with you and we can talk about what you're going to talk about when you call the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline, or here are some local resources, or here's Doctors for Responsible Gun Ownership that, you know, here's a resource where you can find 2A-friendly practitioners. So it's important to have, as I really want to, I can't encourage people enough, if you're a firearms professional, you're working at a range all the time, to have have some suicide prevention training so you can notice warning signs and save a life, and that you know how to talk to them and de-escalate, and you know how to refer to appropriate resources and to have those resources on hand. I will be teaching this certificate course at the National Girl and a Gun conference.

I'm really excited. Hold on, hold on with the QPR stuff. Um, in your bio it says you are a QPR suicide prevention gatekeeper instructor. So the question I have for you is, do you do the online training or is that as you go, or do you just do in-person training? Which one do you do?

Doing in-person, um, but it is an option. Like, people have asked if we can do an online training, and I would definitely consider doing that just to help to get it out en masse. Um, but the one in, in, uh, for National Girl to Con Conference will be in person. And, um, I, it's just so important, I think, not only to have that training but to take it up to that next level, which I'll be talking about at that conference, and including that in the standard operating procedures, which every gun range has, to make sure that whoever is working on that range today or whenever there's, whenever there's an event, that that is included in the planning for that event, that people not only know, you know, how far away the, the the local hospitals are, but also to know the crisis resources available in that area. So that certainly is my heart.

Yeah, for those of you who want to stalk Sarah, you're going to find her in Colorado on April 28th through May 1st, um, is a Girl and a Gun conference. If you're not signed out— signed up yet, chances are you're not gonna. I'm pretty sure that it's sold out because I'm pretty sure it sells out every single year. Um, it is a great place to go regardless of your level with, um, with firearms. It is the most amazing event of the year. It is the least expensive, uh, training you're ever going to get with the most amazing instructors like Sarah that will be there teaching you stuff that you didn't even know you wanted to know. Um, so yeah, A Girl and a Gun, like, uh, Hold My Guns, is a national group and we have chapters in pretty much every state. In some places we have multiple chapters. Here in Connecticut we have two. So, all right, so see, Sarah and I beforehand, we talked about having a list of what we need to cover. So we talked about storage and some of that. We talked about QPR, because again, I'm always trying to come up with resources for y'all. And let's get into the personal safety, because I know some of my friends here have short attention spans. So if we hit all of them in the first half hour, we'll get all the information out that we want to.

That sounds great.

All right, so Sarah, tell them all about your, um, what it's called properly because I'm not reading my notes well.

Sure, it's very simple, um, Personal Safety Plan. And I designed this Personal Safety Plan, uh, because I saw that there was a need to plan ahead and to know what resources you want to have available and accessible during a time of crisis. I think one of the biggest things that we can do for our own mental health and for suicide prevention, whether it's for us or for family members and loved ones, is to think ahead and understand that, humbly speaking, any of us at any time could find ourselves experiencing a crisis, and one that can lead to a mental health crisis that can lead to a suicide crisis. And just, you know, speaking frankly, like none of us knows if on the way to the grocery store or the way home that maybe we'll find ourselves in a debilitating car accident. Maybe, you know, unexpectedly we might lose a loved one. I recently lost my pastor. He was only 57 years old. He passed away from a heart attack at the gym right after SHOT Show. And so I don't, on one hand, you know, I don't want to dwell on things that are morbid too often, but I think it really does us a disservice when we think, "Oh, that'll never happen to me." And then we find ourselves in this horrible tailspin where we're like, "I can't even think. I don't know who to call. I can't remember like which friend said that I can call them," that kind of thing. Or, you know, when we're in that crisis mode, like, "What are the things that will help me feel better? I feel so terrible. I don't even know what to do anymore." And so I created the safety plan because I I used to be a childbirth educator and a doula for 11 years before starting Hold My Guns. And so I have a lot of experience with helping many clients to come up with a birth plan and a postpartum plan as well. And I realized how important that was, especially for heading off some of the symptoms of postpartum depression. I made sure that my clients had like a meal plan and they knew who was going to be helping them after their baby arrived, and we knew the things that were triggering to them. A lot of my clients, I had specialized training in helping women who had experienced sexual trauma, and that can really be a factor, a risk factor for postpartum depression. So I'm bringing that concept to the firearms community and to suicide prevention, knowing how much we care about preserving rights and that none of us want to be along for the ride or having, you know, doctors calling because they're not familiar with us, they don't understand firearms, and all of a sudden it escalates to a situation where we can lose our firearms and lose our rights. So the more we can take a proactive approach, the better chance we are going to have at preserving rights and the better outcome we're going to have because we're heading things off while they're still small as opposed to waiting for them to escalate. So some of the things that we have on this page plan, and, and you can find it on our Linktree, on our social media. And this, the version that you have up right now, was a collaboration that we did with A Girl and a Gun. It's a little bit more enhanced, it has more information about what's on the plan. And then we also have a 2-page, just bare minimum version, it's just a text version of the same plan. But in this plan, regardless of which version you look at, and this is something you can download and just keep this paper with you wherever you are, keep a copy in your safe, or give one to your support your team, people who you trust. We have on there things like indicators that you might need to refer to that safety plan. So like, you know, I, I have one of my kids, every time they have a stomach ache and I know that they're having anxiety, I'm like, hey, do you have a test coming up? Do you have a big homework assignment? Do you need help? And so they will say yes. And knowing ahead of time, like, what are the things that are triggering for this person and how can I help? Whether you're writing it down for yourself or you're helping someone in your household identify, like, these are the ways that you know that I'm stressed, these are the things that you can do to help, it can really make a difference.

Um, you know, a lot, a lot of people don't realize that because we're usually the ones— it's the hardest to figure out what's going on. Yeah. And it's just like when you break it down and someone makes you actually break it down. Um, I just want to go back a little bit because Comments. So, uh, one of my, uh, he's— I know two people have to give up their firearms, attempted suicide and domestic with his wife, and didn't get them back. Here in Connecticut, I mean, again, I don't want to go down too far the rabbit hole, but you know, red flag laws, that sort of thing.

Yes.

Um, the police in Connecticut will hold stuff for up to a year, and sometimes court proceedings take longer than that. So that's one of the reasons, like, here. So that's why your solution of holding my guns is way better. Mr. Peter Strada would like to say hi. Since he saw you at the USCCA convention. He is our outreach coordinator here in Connecticut for CCDL. Um, uh, he's— I forget which part of it though. Um, CCDL does so very much. Um, sorry, I just— it's like one of those things, I, I've got pages that I've already missed. So, uh, Guy that comments, uh, a line I've heard: trying to help people's mental health is a permanent solution for a temporary problem. 'But life is temporary.' I don't hear it repeated these days. So I'm not sure what Guy that Comments is trying to say, but mental health is a— is, is something that we always have to work on. It's just like health in general, right? Uh, and Gunnel's website says, 'Thanks for all the focus each week.' Tara Smith's Kitchen, um, she always likes to pop in, say hello. And where else are we? Oh, and DJ, he's been putting up the links for all the things we've been talking about. So if you're on Facebook and you're not seeing them, you got to go to the YouTube channel, but DJ's got them all up in there. And I tried to put most of the links up prior in the description. So there we have it, we're caught up. So we talked about storage, we talked about the personal safety plan. It can be super simple or easy. QPR training Um, is it always the same? Because like I went to QPR training and it was like a 4-hour, 4 to 6-hour course. Is it always roughly the same?

Um, we, we can do the standard gatekeeper training. So the instructor training, that was like, it was a very, very, very long day and we really crammed a lot in. And we also had a lot of homework that we had to do beforehand. But we can typically teach this class in about 2 hours and it includes like a role-playing scenario. But what I bring to this, it's a little bit different, is I'm talking specifically to the firearms community. And so when we give examples in the class, it's going to be about people who are on the range. It's going to be with sensitivity to understanding that some resources might not be understanding of the firearms community, and so trying to point people to resources that are appropriate. It's it is learning how to help people in a way that is de-escalating out in the range. So that's a consideration that we have. And then also that QPR class will— it includes information about like, you know, disassembling a firearm and making sure that it's properly stored and best practices for all of that as well. So it is— the cool thing about QPR is that regardless of which your, like, sector, I guess, that you're speaking to, that you can always customize it, which is something else I like. But in the class that I teach, I also encourage the importance of having this in your standard operating procedures as a range, as a gun shop, as a firearms instructor, a range safety officer, whatever you're doing as a firearms professional. This is something that should always be in your mind to help save lives.

So, and then are you also working with NSSF as far as that goes? Because I know they also, like, I know the stuff— I don't have it in front of to me, of course, but the stuff I hand out in my classes are the NSSF, Have That Brave Conversation. And so here we have National Student Sports Foundation, for those of you don't know what NSSF is, and they have a whole suicide prevention program as well. This is what I use in my classes. And are you partnering with these guys at all? Are you using any of their information? Is there a link between you and them in any way, shape, or form?

Are there links? In a sense, yes. Bill Broussard, who is the communications director for National Shooting Sports Foundation, and I both serve on the Northwest Pennsylvania Veteran Suicide Prevention Program, which I absolutely love that, that Bill is a voice for the firearms community in those work groups. So I have a friendship with Bill, a professional friendship that I just absolutely appreciate and value. I love the work that National Shooting Sports Foundation has done with the American Foundation for Suicide Prevention, and their collaborative toolkits are excellent. I encourage all ranges and retailers to have their suicide prevention materials. It is done in a way that is very tasteful, and it is like even the imagery that they use, it's appropriate for our community. It's, you know, culturally sensitive. And I don't— that could be, you know, taken too far. But what I'm saying is that they really understand their audience and they do a really good job. So although this is not a collaboration with NSSF, they're certainly aware of our work and they're aware of Hold My Guns, and they always encourage people to use their toolkits, which are available through that link that you had up a moment ago, Brooke, and you can get those for free online. So the other awesome thing that NSSF does for suicide prevention is working with Project Child Safe, and I love the resources that are there because it helps you to— there's even specialized conversations, for example, of how to talk to teenagers who might be experiencing a suicide crisis. So I am really grateful for the work that they do, and whenever I can, I always include their materials or send links to people to check it out. Thanks for putting that up.

Yeah, I'm like, took me a second to find them. Like, oh, I didn't have that tab ready yet. Um, but yeah, so Project Child Safe. So one of the things actually just happened here in Connecticut is the governor's bill SB 16 that was going forward. One of the things they wanted was to make sure that that every, um, gun had a lock with it. Because right now all handguns are always sold with locks, and they were like, well, long guns should be sold with locks too. So the, the Second Amendment world, we've already been doing this. Like, they're available at any time. Um, so it's just one of those things where, um, own it, respect it, secure it. That I think the Second Amendment family takes their security and their safety so seriously. And it feels like the anti-gunners never seem to want to actually talk to us to understand that. Ready? I want to look at people when I say this. We do not love our guns more than our children, because so often that is the rhetoric that we will get. It's like, Second Amendment? Well, you love your guns more than your child's safety. And it's like, uh, no, that is not it at all. We believe in freedom. We believe in your rights. Um, and if you take anyone's rights away, you're going to end up taking other people's rights away. It's that whole thing that, um, whatever you believe in, you want to allow others to do the things they want to do, as far as you want to keep yourself safe and happy. And not everybody else is going to have that same idea of what safe and happy is going to be. But you want to respect other people's rights regardless of what it is, right?

And why do we carry in the first place? Because, well, I don't—

so there's that, right?

But I mean, but that's really the, the answer to the argument is, you know, when people say, well, you care about your guns more than your family or your children, it's like, you know, we— there are people in our life, or protecting ourselves, um, having firearms to protect the people that we care about and to protect the things that we've worked very hard for, like our home. Um, you know, it is so important that people understand the whole reason why the— why our rights are preserved with the Second Amendment in the first place.

And how many of the stories like this have you heard from Tara? It's, you know, the amount of people that I know, both men and women who got with someone and then had to get rid of all of their guns and then slowly get back into it again. And it's just like, if Hold My Guns was around then, they could have stored them for a while. I mean, who knows how long, but it's like— but yeah, I, I don't carry. It's not my thing. I'm not really big into self-defense, but I learned about firearms because I had kids in the house. So I want to make sure that I am not going to be one of those accidents that occur And it's just, it's amazing to me how many people think, oh well, you know, you love your guns more than your kids. And it's just like, no, freedom of choice is what I love. Um, that, you know, and, and looking at violence, because they always talk about gun violence, and it's just like, I've been the victim of violence and it had nothing to do with guns. And violence is violence. And if we don't start talking about how to prevent that, just like talking about how to prevent suicide by gun. See, Jake and those guys are working on me to make sure I say it properly. Um, sorry, from Walk the Talk America. For those of you who've seen— I saw— had Jake on last Wednesday.

Cool.

Um, but yeah, it's, it's amazing. And, um, Jake is saying that he's really excited about how well he's being received by the gun community. And just to make sure people understand, the gun community is not all gun owners.

That's right.

And do you want to explain that? Because I know what I mean by it, but what do you think when I, when I say that? What do you kind of think about, right?

I think that's a great point, Brooke. And so many people think that, um, you know, in order to support somebody's right to self-defense, that they have to be a gun owner. And that just simply isn't true. You can have— you can uphold that right and advocate for it and make sure that you're scouring legislation and say, wait a second, like, what are you really saying here? Regardless of whether or not you own a firearm, whether or not you, you know, rent one at the range to shoot, or whether or not you carry, the point is, is that you care about liberty and preserving rights, and you want to make sure that if people want to exercise that right, that they have the right to do that. So we welcome people in this community regardless of whether they actually carry a firearm or they own a firearm. The idea is that we care about the rights that are protected by the Second Amendment. Yeah.

And with that, I'm going to say Gina says hi.

Hi Gina.

Gina often talks about how welcoming the Second Amendment family really and truly is. Um, And just because she is unique and we call her the Unicorn, and if you ever want to find out why, go find an interview that's got her. Uh, there were plenty at SHOT Show and places like that. Mr. Gizzard Gary says hello. Oh, hello, good to see you. Let's see, who else do I have? DJ, DJ 2 Live Moo, there we go. Sorry, I was reading the things as I was going. Um, all right, back to Tara. Whatever you allow the government to do to someone else, even someone you consider your enemy, the government can and will do also too. Yes, thank you for that, Tara. That's exactly what I was trying to say that I was not doing a good job of.

And it's also important to mention too that whatever, uh, laws that are out there, that you are putting people's life on the line to enforce. It's not just, well, we're trying to just create this idea of change. You are putting law enforcement officers' lives on the line to enforce it. You are putting gun owners' lives on the line when, you know, you have police showing up at your home because someone has reported you for a red flag law, whether or not it's a legitimate report or not, which again, ex parte hearings, you might not even know that someone has reported you or that this red flag order is out for you. So, um, it really is, uh, interesting when people take a moment to understand the implications of legislation and how people have to put their life on the line to enforce it. There was a case in Maryland when red flag laws first started where there was a family member that had expressed some concern for a gentleman, and they reported him. It was turned into a red flag situation. When law enforcement showed up, he had a firearm. He brought it to the door. He didn't know who was going to be, you know, knocking on the door. And he— they, uh, in that, um, talking with him, ended up shooting him, not realizing what was going on there. And later, a family member commented like, oh, I was just trying to get him help, like, I didn't know that it meant that he could die. And so I think people have well intentions, especially people who are not familiar with firearms. They're very afraid of them. Um, you know, they, they think, well, if we can just push this legislatively, then maybe it will change how people interact with firearms. But they really miss that big picture, and that is when you're taking away somebody's rights, what you're actually doing is creating criminals out of, you know, lawful Americans. And so, um, we just have to be very careful about using legislative answers to solve things like mental health and firearms. And that's why Hold My Guns is so important to me, why I'm so passionate about it, because we're actually empowering people to get to the heart of the reasons why they might be in crisis and not just, you know, looking to remove a firearm, which really doesn't solve the underlying issues. We want to empower people to have that distance so that they can get help and that they're not losing their property, they're not losing their rights. We had a psychiatrist support us early on and he said, Sarah, if we can— he was from California and he said, you know, the process has always been to immediately confiscate firearms. He said, what that does is it makes that patient fixated on when am I getting my firearms back and am I going to be losing my rights? They're not focused on getting better. But if we can have agency, personal agency, then that patient will say, hey, I'm doing the right thing. I'm storing my firearms off-site, and then they're focusing on what can I do to get better. And that's really the heart of what we're trying to do.

And then again, back to our unicorn, Miss Gina, um, the subject of an attempted red flag law by some anti-gun rights people in San Diego. Fortunately, one— someone in the DA office stopped it because they knew me. Now everyone knows Gina, so she has an unfair advantage for the most part. So, but it's one of these things where it's like, when Connecticut was going through red flag laws, we talked about this. It's like, here's someone with a vendetta against Gina to take her guns away from her. Now, what if they were really, really mean? Like, they were trying to take her guns away in order to harm her. And this is why when they come out and say, oh, we're doing this so that we can save women's lives, I'm like, but if you're one of the women who wants to protect themselves with their firearm and your ex puts— says, oh well, she's gonna hurt herself, and go take her away her guns. I'm like, well, all you're doing is creating a victim so that now her ex can come in and take, take her. And these are the sort of things that, oh, that would never happen. And I'm like, what fairy tale land do you live in that you've never seen people lie? And I, I never understand how they figure out, um, how they can be in such denial over a lot of these things. Right? It's the unintended consequences. The fact there's already laws generally, um, if— what is RPO? Um, there's, there's another law that's usually in most— at least here in Connecticut— where if you're worried about someone, um, you can have them taken away by an ambulance. Because like Jake said in our interview last week, it's like, if I'm suicidal, you don't just take away my firearms, you take me out of the system where I can hurt myself because you take my firearms. I've still got all my drugs, I've still got all my knives, I've still got my bathtub, I've still got all the different ways that I can kill myself. So taking guns away from someone who's suicidal does not make any sense. You need to get them help. And so there's just so many failings in some of the political solutions that really are truly just about gun control, not about actually helping people. But like you said, to people's benefit is they are they think they're trying to do something good, right? Because like, oh, this person's in crisis, quick, take their guns away. It's like, no, this person's in crisis, take this person somewhere where they can get the help they need. Hence the R in QPR. Yes, resources.

Absolutely.

Um, all right, so we got QPR training, laws across state lines being a huge pain in the neck for you, um, trying to get it. Because like here in Connecticut, I couldn't Even if you had someone in Connecticut, I can't just give it because the way the laws are written in Connecticut, that would be an illegal transfer. Uh, ghost guns— we talked about that earlier before we started the show. You want to tell people about why ghost guns and all the stuff that's coming out against them is such a problem again for Hold My Guns?

Yeah, it's— well, first of all, um, people have many different— when, when they use the term ghost gun, they think about, um You know, well, at first some people said, well, maybe it can pass through X-ray and you won't see it if it's going through TSA. You know, some people would call a ghost gun a firearm that the serial number has been scratched off or defaced in a way that it can't be read anymore. And then other people think about privately manufactured firearms, which in most cases are perfectly legal, but they might not have a serial number on them.

Um, and don't forget about assassins. Ghost is an assassin, so there's that. So that's what makes it super scary because we're talking about assassin guns.

But really, um, you know, the serial number on a firearm doesn't make it any less scary, um, and it really doesn't do a whole lot to reduce crime. Um, but when it comes to storing firearms, it can be tricky because in order to do a firearms transfer at a gun shop, you have to enter in a serial number. And so when we're storing a complete firearm, which is that upper and lower, it has this, the serial number, that has to go into the acquisition and disposition logbook. But that being said, if a person just wants to store a barrel or a firing pin or other non-serialized critical part that would make it inoperable, that is always an option. We can store it as an accessory. So that's something really important too for people who, um, have privately manufactured firearms but they're still concerned about someone in the home who might be in crisis. They can always store a part as listing it as an accessory. And that is, we always say check your local state and local laws, but typically storing a non-serialized critical part is a great way to help protect someone and, you know, or yourself to remove that temptation of using a firearm for suicide. So it is an option that people who have privately manufactured firearms or ghost guns, if you use that definition, um, are welcome to use for Hold My Guns.

Yeah, and like P.N. Wood said, ghost guns are not a thing. If you're a criminal, you just grind it off, and they really aren't a thing in crime that much. Do they appear? Yes. Are they majority of the crim— the guns that are recovered in crime? Not generally. Not the ones that they're trying to get rid of, which is mostly the home manufacturer stuff. And This afternoon on the weekly bullet, um, for the Second Amendment Foundation, we were talking about the same thing, is everybody has a different definition of what they think a ghost gun is. So, um, and yeah, this is always our favorite, right? If you're okay with committing felonies, gun laws aren't going to stop you.

Exactly.

So, um, so anyway, Gina says, good, keep up the good work.

Thank you, Gina. I had a great time with Gina at SHOT Show. Um, We, we went to an event for women that was, um, it was, it was really cool. It was at a mob museum in Las Vegas, and it was just a really great night. But I enjoyed hanging out with Gina and many others at that night, and I loved being at SHOT Show this year and being around like-minded people who understand things that we're talking about tonight. You don't have to explain like, well, technically ghost gun, or, you know, it's just so refreshing to be around people yourself included, Brooke Cheney, who in our community who genuinely care, and they actually care about saving lives, protecting property, and preserving rights. So it's, it is awesome that we have so many friends that are watching tonight.

And Gina agrees, that was a blast. And so this is the thing about that I said before about there are people who own guns and then there's the gun community. Gina is part of the gun community. You are part of the gun community. Jake is part of the gun community. It's like those of us who really pay attention to all the stuff that's going on. So questions, ask us if you want to learn something new, because I know when I go to the Capitol, when we're back live and in person, when you say something like the unintended consequences of that example of here's a red flag law, I've got a horrible ex-boyfriend who knows that I have a firearm to defend myself, and he then goes and says she should take her guns away, and now I'm, I'm a hapless victim. And it's like people like, oh, I never thought of it that way. Like, I know, right? Because you're just not so excited about doing that sort of thing, right?

And the reality is, um, like, like, um, PNW Woods was saying earlier about criminals, um, they're going to find a way to fight to get a firearm. They're not going to do it through lawful channels. And, um, you know, criminals think about things like red flag laws with a criminal mind. And I think we really need to take off the rose-colored glasses in the firearms community because we're, you know, we think about being, you know, law-abiding citizens, but we don't think about how criminals can use and exploit, um, this legislation that, um, can really be turned against us to, um, to disarm us, to create a situation where our rights are taken away. Um, and, and I wish that, that the legislators realize this too, is that this is not helping, um, people who are, um, are lawful gun owners. This is actually enabling, I think, criminals to, um, to exploit these pieces of legislation to disarm people and make them victims. So it is, uh, it's actually frustrating.

Just came out, um, I don't know, last month, month before, but the USCCA came out with Inmates Tell You How to Avoid Danger. And this is one of those things where this is probably going to be my favorite episode ever, simply for the fact that so many people don't know how to think like a criminal. They don't understand, um, as Gina says Criminals are called criminals because they don't care about the laws.

They don't care.

Um, and the more we stand up, the more we try to educate people, uh, about the unintended consequences. You know, some people really are just about gun control, and that's— we're not going to change those people. But there are plenty of people have best intentions and are just slowly killing us. All right, so a little tiny, um, break. DJ should be queued up. But at 9:35, my friend Barbecue runs a barbecue show on his channel, Guns and Barbecue, and he's always a big supporter here. However, um, he actually moved his time. He used to have 9 o'clock on Saturdays, but because of Suicide Prevention Saturday, he actually moved it, but it started at 9:35. So anyone who wants to go see Barbecue's channel, you can watch the replay with me and Sarah. We'll be done by 10. Um, or of course you can always watch the replay of barbecue as well, but I just wanted to plug him real quick. So, um, let's see. CNT, I'm on the road driving, so if I don't respond to someone, it's because I can't see it. I have to stop real fast to get gas. All right, so hopefully while he's driving, he's not responding. It's when he was getting gas, of course, that he typed that. So, all right, um, what else? What else? Um, QPR. Question— what is it?

Question, persuade, and refer.

And can you give us a 5-minute version, like a little tiny version of how do you do that? How do you do that QPR? Because I thought that was useful.

It is, it's really helpful. And it depends on the situation. When I think about, um, how we use this on the range, we— let's think about a scenario where, you know, maybe I'm the RSO that day and I noticed that someone, first of all, that they're not walking with confidence. They kind of look like there's— it's very important with situational awareness that we're not necessarily judging people, but we're aware of people's microexpressions on their face and how they're carrying themselves. And so we might notice this person seems a little bit off. And so we might start out by just saying, hey, how's it going today? You know, what are you shooting? Or "Um, you know, what are your goals with target practicing today?" And just be really positive.

And that person might say something like, "Um, well—" So that's the question portion of things, just so we all stay on track.

You're asking questions that are normal. You're not just jumping in and being like, "Are you okay? Are you in crisis?" Like, that is really— you want to establish some trust and rapport, and you want to kind of get a feel. Is this person really in crisis or not? And, and So maybe they're saying something like, well, I'm here today. I'm not really having a good day. Oh, okay. Well, tell me about that. And maybe they're like, well, my spouse just died and I'm just here by myself. And there's kind of like trailing off.

And this used to be something we did together and now I'm lost and that sort of thing. And how many times have we read those little doohickeys where someone was having a bad day at school, packed up their entire, um, all their books, dropped them, someone else helped pick them up, and later that person who helped pick them up found out that that person was going to go home. But because of that little act of kindness— because honestly, just that, how are you doing today, could be enough to save someone's life.

Yes, people notice. Uh, when, when I took my QPR training the instructor said something that will stick with me. And she said, have you ever gotten a new haircut and you walk in and people are like, oh my gosh, your hair looks amazing. Or you go get a haircut and you look in the mirror and you're like, wow, this looks great. And then you go out and your friends don't even notice. And you're like, do you notice anything different about me? Right? And you're trying to get them to notice. And so she reminded us that people, they notice when people notice and they also notice when people don't Um, I mentioned a little bit ago that my pastor had died just suddenly, and I went into the gas station. I was grabbing, um, a soda and, um, a couple other things, and I had been crying in the car. It just was really hard. And I walked in, and the person at the cash registers, they were like, are you okay? And I was just like, I'm not okay. I just lost one of my very close friends. And I was like, I think, of course, as a suicide prevention instructor, that really mattered to me. But I just said, I want you to know I appreciate your asking and I clearly have been crying and you really made my day. And they were like, well, I'm not a religious person, but it sounds like that person really made a difference in your life and I'm really sad for your loss. And so even just saying that, I don't know if they've had any training at all, but that's what that question is. When you're talking to people and just affirming like, wow, it sounds really sad. I'm sad to hear that your spouse has passed away. And just encouraging people on that. And then you might take that to mean like, or take that to the next step and say, you know, are you okay today? Or maybe even if you really think that they're not, as a range safety officer, you can always say, you know, it's not working out today. Maybe you should come back on another day. Other things that you might be looking for, Brooke, are things like, you know, evidence of drug use. Like if their, if their eyes look like maybe they're kind of red and bloodshot, or you smell alcohol on their breath, or things that you would normally flag somebody for on the range as a range safety officer. But those things are risk factors for suicide. If a person is inebriated, they're high, their chances of taking their own life because they're impaired with their mind are increased. So those are other things that you're looking for. And then you have question and then you're persuading. You're saying, you know what, you've shared these things with me and sometimes this can indicate that a person is in crisis. Are you thinking of taking your own life? That's part of that question.

And then that's where everyone freaks out. They're like, but Because here's the thing we did in QPR was the whole thing of, but if I ask them if they're going to take their lives, aren't I suggesting that that's what they're already thinking? And aren't I going to make them decide to take their life? I mean, that was the conversation we had in my class a ton. Yes.

And actually, um, their QPR will say that studies have shown they're an evidence-based program, that if somebody is actually thinking of taking their own life, to ask them a question like that is actually very comforting. It that person realize like, wow, this person cares about me. And it's actually relief that somebody cares enough to ask that. And then maybe they'll say, oh no, I'm fine. You know, and then you might choose to stand there with them a little bit and figure out what's up at the range. Or they might say, yes, that is the case. And then you can, you know, help them to connect with appropriate resources. The reason—

like, are you in crisis? Call 800-273-8255 or text Yes.

And you have that across the screen here and it's beautiful. And that's a number that every range safety officer should have. And that number should be posted at a range so that people can quickly see it. And I would love to see that as something that, you know, ranges and gun shops do voluntarily, that they have suicide prevention crisis numbers up for people to see and to call.

And the thing about Tara's thing about we are social animals, instinctively read cues from others and also have instinctive need for acceptance. Ever notice loners will talk your arm off? If not, there's usually some issues. And here's the funny thing, like you were saying when you were having that bad day, when we turn into the loners, when that's not usually our thing, this is back to the personal safety plan, is to help you realize sometimes we're the ones who turn into the loners and don't want to talk to anyone, and to pay attention to those cues as well.

Anybody can have a hard time like that with when something— life just throws one curveball after another and then before you know it, it's like, I don't even know which end is up. And it is so important that we think ahead before we're in a time of crisis to think about what are the things that can help me, what resources do I want to make sure are utilized, trusted resources. And, you know, we talk about firearms and other lethal means which our safety plan does not just limited to firearms. There's a section in there for other lethal means as well. But what are my wishes for how these are stored and, and what accountability do I need? That is all in our safety plan. But we need to think about those things ahead of time so that when we're in crisis, we're not spinning and, and we don't have an answer for that.

All right, so as we're coming to the end of our hour, I just want to review stuff real quick. So, um, we started with, uh, hold my guns. And when you get there, this is what you're going to see. DJ already put the links in the, the chat. It's also in the, um, description for this. Then we've just been talking about the QPR. The important thing about this is to understand you're not becoming a counselor when you take QPR. You're just starting to learn a little bit more about how to react to and what to do if you see something. Um, we were talking about some of the resources that are on Hold My Guns. NSSF's Project Child Safe is so that guns can always be locked up. It's as simple as a cable lock that they provide for free. Uh, Sarah's going to be at national conference on April 28th, May 1st for A Girl and a Gun, and she's going to be teaching the QPR training. So if any of my Girl and a Gun sisters are watching this, make sure you sign up for that. Um, our National Shooting Sports Foundation also has free pro— um, free resources for you if you have a gun range or a, um, a gun range or a gun shop or that sort of thing. And they do actually have posters up that will have the suicide prevention, uh, hotline, which is the one that's scrolling across the bottom of the screen now. Oh, Sarah also has the, um, Linktree which brings you to Hold My Guns. You can do donations for her, obviously. Please do support her. Let's not forget about that part. The Girl and a Gun safety plan we talked about. And then if you scroll down here a little bit more, um, there's the personal safety plan, which is the one you just print out and it's easy to fill in, whereas the Girl and a Gun one looks all pretty, but it's more reading, so you have to make it up as you go. Um, as she said, this is the pretty one with all the pictures, and this is the one you're just gonna print out. And you just— you, you want to do this and then share it with somebody. If you have this plan, you want to make sure that maybe it's like when your kids were in school and you had to do that fire escape plan, right? And everybody had to know what the plan was. It's no good if you only know the plan because no one else will be able to be safe in your house. So great, that's everything that I know of that we talked about this evening. Thank you for asking people to donate too.

That really is how we're able to do things like that, like getting to Girl and a Gun costs money, um, you know, going to SHOT Show, that costs money, and it is our heart to do that. And when people donate, it allows us to focus on the mission. It helps to cover our costs.

And oh, and that's an important thing to remind people about a Girl and a Gun conference. Even though if you're a participant and you're paying, you're not paying any of the instructors. They're volunteering their time. They're not getting paid by a Girl and a Gun. And that's one of the things that makes it so amazing. And in the gun community, that helps a lot, is that most instructors will volunteer their time for so many good causes, not just a girl and a gun. So yeah, so that's another reason to— just like with DC Project stuff, for me, I have people donate to help me get to Florida, to get to training, all of that. And so yes, definitely donate, help Sherry get to Colorado.

Yeah. And so it can be an uncomfortable thing to ask, you know, for help in that way, but the way that I see it is that when we donate to causes that are important to us, that is a way— it is a way for us to participate in the mission.. We don't necessarily have the time to be reaching out to gun shops all the time, but I do. And so it allows us to be able to do that outreach and to share things like QPR training with the firearms community. I want to give a shout out to H&K, Palm Pepper Spray, Mantis, and Active Self Protection. They did a tremendous fundraiser for us at SHOT Show. We're able to raise over $27,000. Towards our mission. So I'm really grateful for them. And, uh, and I noticed, Brooke, that you had the U.S. Concealed Carry magazine there for January issue. If you turn to page 143, there is a feature on Hold My Guns. And so, um, it was just really awesome that USCCA recognized— thank you— that they recognized.

I didn't even know that. We didn't figure that out ahead of time. This just happened to be the one that I'm like, I'm like, of all the ones, this is going to be my favorite. Yes.

So excellent resource there.

Did not know. But all right, well, I think we've done things. We've given people resources. We've explained some of the bad things that happen when they try to legislate safety versus teaching safety. Um, lots of places to go for resources. It's like the Linktree has a bunch of things. Um, your actual page also has a bunch of different links as well. Um, QPR training, super simple. You can do it online, you can do it in person. I know, I've been through it. I'm not as, you know, I didn't become an instructor. Someone suggested that, but I'm like, no, I'm good, thank you. However, I know, well, at some point I probably will, but it's like you're not signing up to become a counselor. You're just signing up to answer most of the questions people will ask me which is how do you know and what do you do. And that's actually after QPR is when I started doing the, the, you know, call 211, because here in Connecticut you'd call 211 and you can get directed to a counselor, or if you need to, you can theoretically find a bed if you need it, or something along those lines. So, all right, well, Sarah, thank you for spending your Saturday night with me.

It's been fun.

These are my Saturday night dates. This is what I got for a life.

I love it. I love to do things with my time that are really— that I feel good about. And I really have enjoyed this conversation tonight, and I hope that those listening know that they are loved and cared for and that there are options out there, even if there is not a Hold My Gun storage location in your state. Please feel free to reach out because we do have FFLs that have said if you ever have a need, give us a call. Even if they're not an official partner, there are, there are resources available. So I just thank you everybody for listening tonight. And, uh, this is such an important conversation. Brooke, thank you for doing this.

Sure. My pleasure. And, uh, Ozzy Osbourne is gonna— Osbourne is going to bark at the moon for us because, you know, it is a full moon currently. So there's that. Um, and DJ has to get off to his other 3 dates because he runs a lot of, or helps with a lot of different channels. So yeah, Sarah, thank you again for being my monthly guest, because I'm trying to do this just once a month. And I look forward to hearing the success stories of Hold My Guns. And it's always fun when we get just one and then we get to build on that. All right, say good night, everyone.

Good night, take care.