Suicide Prevention Saturday - Where Passion Turned into Purpose

Hello everybody, it is Suicide Prevention Saturday, and why are we here? Because 2 out of every 3 gun deaths we hear about are suicides. And if we want to save lives, we need to talk about mental health and suicide prevention. And there's a bonus to that. If we actually address suicide prevention and mental health, guess what else that does? That actually helps reduce violence in general as well. So thank you all for joining us. For those of you who are live, yay, chat it up over there in the chat. And for those of us who are watching the replay, thanks so much for popping in. Do do leave a comment if you've got other things you'd like us to talk about, or if you have someone you think we should talk to, because tonight is one of those special nights where I have a guest. And so without further ado, poof, I'm just gonna throw them up here. Hi everybody, say hi to Caleb.

Hello everybody.

Uh, I met Caleb, uh, a week ago, two weeks ago, a week ago, I don't even know.

Sounds right.

Yeah, something like that. Um, we just became USCCA training counselors and he happened to be in my class. And Caleb, I could introduce you, but I do find it's probably better if you just introduce yourself because you're better at it than I am because you've been doing it longer than I have.

Valid. So my name is Caleb Morse. I am a, I think, 13-year Army veteran, was medically separated back in 2017 or '18.

Caleb, those of us who are not Army, Medically separated. Does that mean that you were discharged because of a medical thing? It sounds like you're getting medically taken apart when you say medically separated.

Because medically retired is to a certain degree, then Uncle Sam says, look, we take responsibility for this and you get retirement pay for it. Okay. Medical separated or medically separated is like, hey, look, we can't change the oil anymore. Oh, what's going on with the screen? Uh, we can't change the oil anymore. We got to go ahead and you're no longer mission capable. Uncle Sam used you for what we can. Have a great life.

So, okay, yeah, just like, because I'm like, I don't know what you're talking about.

Others, yeah, sorry about it.

That's all right, it's all good.

So, uh, but then left, left the service, worked in the private sector for a while. Um, I've been a gun— and more than a gun enthusiast, but for most of my life. I got into the gun industry at 17 years old, uh, working at a— back then it was a small gun shop, ended up being across 3 states, 7 locations after I left the service, and really enjoyed what I did with them. But that kind of is more what I do. Who I am is a husband of 20 years, a father of 2 great kids, and a lover of God and a lover of Christ.

So that is awesome. Yeah, we've got, uh, I got 5 years on you. My husband and I were going for 25, um, and we got 2 great kids. Most of the time.

Most of the time you get away with it.

So that is awesome. All right, so for those of you wondering, why did I bring Caleb on to Surf Friends Saturday? Well, Caleb's been doing some other work besides just a gun store, but right now he has an amazing gun store, and I wish I could get to the home page because all of a sudden I can't. It is called The Rustic Renegade. Oh wait, did I get here? I got here. All right, I'm gonna throw that up. Hold hold on a second. Um, he is both on the interwebs as well as YouTube, and I actually got to call his shop yesterday, and I had so much fun just listening to the voicemail. Because when you call, I'm just gonna say— wait, let me, let me pull up— where is it? Where's the phone number? You should just call and listen to the voicemail if nothing else.

Yeah, our, uh, our phone system, and the biggest thing is trying to, to convey who you are, right, in today's 15-second world. Uh, so when you call us, it goes through and it talks about who we are. And we're a group of people who are trying to show the grown men of Acadiana— Acadiana is our region— what grown men look like. Uh, because there's a lot of grown boys running around the world today and not grown men. Uh, and you know, with terms like toxic masculinity being thrown around, what I think is the main issue is the erosion of masculinity. We have grown boys who don't know what it means like, or means to be a real man. And a lot of us grow up without that positive father figure or that constant father figure. I know myself was included with that. So it's trying to show someone what the biblical version of a man looks like and how that you should live your life and treat your family and pursue business.

And now, how long have you had The Rustic Renegade?

And how did it start? July 4th will make 5 years going on 6.

Oh, well, happy birthday.

It's coming up fast, and it's been a passion. It's grown differently than what we thought it would. You know, in the beginning, it was a place to help pay the bills and to give us a livelihood, and it's turned into a passion and a movement, not just for ourselves but for our community.

Very cool. And what was the idea behind it? Like, I mean, I know it was to pay the bills, but like, what was your vision and how did it change?

So working in the gun industry, I'd been in it for a while in the military, everything else, and I'd come through a lot of different shops, um, and I always felt like I should thank a place for allowing me to spend my money there when I was done. A lot of shops say they're customer-focused and driven by by customer service, but they don't really— they're not really— are because we're all bound to that dollar. Well, we changed that, and we said we really want to focus on customer service. We want to focus on doing more in the community. We want to focus on outreach. So we do like a Wednesday morning Bible study. We do St. Jude fundraisers. We do a ton of veteran work because myself, I'm a veteran. So we do a ton of veteran work in the community, and we're just a constant presence in our community to show people what a small business can be and to show what a true leader in the community can be. And that's what we've evolved evolved into is much more than just a place for you to come and purchase wares. We're a place that furthers the mindset and the attitude that we want our community to be invested with.

That is awesome. And you did have me laughing at a— when you said, spend my money there and thank you for letting me spend my money there.

I mean, there's so many shops you go into and you're like, thank you, sir, can I have another? You know, it's just, it's so disheartening. Especially now post-COVID, customer service has become something that you don't get.

It is not anywhere. It's like, it is absolutely— it looks— I mean, in Connecticut might be slightly different than Louisiana, but it's one of those things where I'm like, you definitely feel like no matter where you go, you walk in and it feels like the clerks and the folks waiting on you are annoyed that you're bothering them. And it's just like, okay, I remember having this job and I was pretty sure the goal was to make you feel welcomed and hey, have some whatever, a smile at least, or pretend that you care about something that you're doing.

Well, it's taking ownership for what you do and, and we instill that in everyone that works here. I mean, we're a small shop. There are 5 employees, uh, that work here and out of the 5, 4 of us are veterans.. And we just try to wear our heart on our sleeve and to let the consumer know and let each other know that the only way for us to be around tomorrow is for us to do the best job we can today. So that's what we try to impart upon our customers.

All right, so you're officially just beyond the toddler years at 5 years. Feel as though you've grown a ton in those 5 years?

We have, we have. And it's, uh, We're on the precipice of more growth, especially because of the suicide outreach that we do, which, I mean, if you don't mind, I'll jump right into that. Yeah, so even bring some of it up. Whenever we started doing suicide outreach and everything else, it really started just from a good buddy of mine asking for help. He and I were in the Army together, we contracted together overseas, and he showed up one day. This is over the course of a few months, but he shows up one day and he's like, Caleb, look, I don't, I don't want my firearms anymore. Um, I want you to buy them, uh, and I'm leaving. I'm like, well, what does that mean? Uh, what is— what does you don't want them anymore mean? What is— you're not okay? What is— you want help? Like, let's figure this out. And, uh, he's like, I don't want to talk about it. So let me go grab a cup of coffee, I'll be right back, we'll discuss it. And when I came back, he left his firearms on the table and he and his dog were gone, uh, and he vanished.

That had to be a, an oh my goodness moment.

It, it was. So, um, we took the firearms into our bound book like we're legally required to, uh, and I started calling him, started going through the process trying to find him. And a few months go by and he calls me, lets me know where he is, what's going on, and, uh, his mental state. And we just kind of tried to help him, um, just doing what I thought was the right thing. And, uh, he ended up getting some help going down his separate path. Well, then a few weeks later, another vet shows up that we're talking to because we're active in the community, and he's like, hey, look, I'm in a rough spot. Um, I don't think I should have my firearms right now. I was like, well, I mean, I'll hold on to them if you want. He's like, well, do you mind? I'm like, no, you know, there's ways we have to do this legally, but, you know, we can do that. And it started snowballing, and more vets heard about it. More vets started finding out about it, and they were bringing us firearms. And some of us weren't even bringing firearms. They were coming in saying, hey, look, man, we appreciate what you're doing, and my brother-in-law or my dad or my husband or whoever, they're having some rough moments in time. Can you talk to them? I was like, I'm not a counselor, but yeah.

Oh yes, you are. Yeah. Me either. I'm not a counselor. I don't have any PhDs or anything next to my thing, but people call me too. So I'm just like, uh, you don't— you know, you know, God calls, you are chosen. You don't get to choose.

There's that. So it, it evolved into that, and I started talking to my lawyers, and I'm like, look, this is what we're doing. Um, do you see a problem with this? And they're like, do we see a problem? Like, you are insane. You shouldn't be doing this. You're putting your livelihood, everyone else's livelihood, and all this on, on at risk.

And, and why is that? Like, a lot of people don't understand, like, the intricacies, because everyone thinks, oh, we need more regulations around firearms, there are enough regulations. But the reality of it, there's so many regulations. I'm assuming that's part of what the challenge is for you.

Well, it was that and Louisiana, we, we have implied liability as well as express liability, right? So as a business, if they would bring it to me as an individual, it'd be different. But as a business when I take possession of their firearms under the idea that they're not in a good mental state, um, if I give them back to them and they hurt themselves or they hurt someone else, I could be found liable in Louisiana.

Gotcha.

So the lawyers are like, we can't do this. I'm like, nah, well, screw you. Yeah, I think it's worth doing. If one life is worth saving, we're going to save a life, right? That's the way it should be. Right. Um, so I'd been doing that now for about 2 years maybe, and I got a call from, uh, Joseph Constance and Miss Gala True with the VA. And, uh, they were like, hey, uh, are you familiar with these programs? And they said a few of them, and I was like, yeah, I'm familiar with those. Um, and they're like— they mentioned one, and I was like, yeah, I'm on their little map, uh, as a place that stores guns and this and that. Like, what do you think about the program? I'm like, well, it's a waste of time and it's lip service. And I'm not a fan of either one of those things. And so what makes it a waste of time? What makes it lip service? I'm like, well, there's no follow-up, there's no communication, there's no training, um, and all they care about is putting your name on a map and whatever taxpayer money they're getting from that. And they were like, well, do we have an option for you? We're not going to put you on a map, we're not going to give you any money because there is no money to give you, but we want to train you and we want to do stuff with you.

Gotcha.

Um, and it evolved into, at the time I think it was 4 or 5 FFLs, uh, that were willing to hold firearms and to, uh, help individuals, um, regardless of what the law was in Louisiana. And we started the Army Project. Uh, that's the name we came up with, that's the idea we came up with. We built a curriculum for it for us all to go back and forth through our a hive mind on ways to navigate these waterways, um, and do things legally to where no one gets in trouble and no one's at any risk. And the more people we try to get involved, the more people told us, man, we wouldn't— we want to do it, we can't. I can't put my business at risk, my employees' business at risk. I can't put my life, everything at risk. It's not worth it. So we're like, okay, well, if we get a law passed, will that help? Oh yeah. Oh yeah, we're in. And, uh, we started talking and started reaching out to individuals and, uh, had no clue how getting laws passed worked.

None. Laws getting passed is a huge pain in the neck and it usually takes years.

So it took about 60 days. All right, we, uh, we got involved with the, the regular session and, uh, we made some phone calls to some friends of ours and We said, what do we do? How do we word this? And got in touch with people. And I was actually asked to go and speak in front of the Louisiana House of Legislators for the committee. It passed committee unanimously and went through the House, passed unanimously, went to the Senate, passed unanimously, and was signed into law, which removed any implied or explicit liability from anyone who's taken a firearm in on a hold status for anyone. And we made sure we didn't put in the legislation, for whatever reason, we just put anyone, right? And since then, we've talked to Arkansas about having something similar. We've talked to Oregon State, Washington State. I believe either South Dakota or Montana just passed a law that goes even further. It talks about leaving them with anyone, not just an FFL, just because they have such an expansive amount of property up there, right?

Oh yeah, no, and this is one of those things, like, um, have you heard of the Hold My Guns project? Okay. So it's one of those things where I, I've talked with Sarah, actually I've had her on here before, and it's like people don't understand like what the patchwork quilt of regulations, laws around firearms, just from state line to state line. And so I'm like, when we're done, I'm having you send me your legislation and I'll see about getting it put forward in the next legislative session. Because I too have gotten the phone calls where someone's like, hey Brooke, who do you know that will store guns for us? What FFLs? And so far in Connecticut, We have one store, um, and I'd have to look it up because I don't remember off the top of my head. But, um, so yeah, but this is one of those things is like people want to save lives, people want to do good things, but they don't realize how hard it is for anyone to get anything done.

It is, it is a ton of work. And then, you know, you're restricted on space. Um, you know, we're like I said, 5 employees. We're not a huge shop, but we have a decent-sized showroom and I allocate space in our vault just for firearms that are on this project. In the beginning, we had, you know, uh, 10, 12 firearms that we were holding for people and going through and helping them get the help they need, um, pointing them the right direction from what we had learned. And then 10 turned into 20, turned into 30, turned into— now we're currently sitting on about 450 firearms. Yeah, um, this year, not total, just this year.

So that just shows what the need was once people found out how to find you as well.

Yeah. And then the other thing we've done is, so in Louisiana, you can bring your firearms to your local police or sheriff department. Let's say you're going through an issue or going through divorce or anything's happening, and you're like, look, I just don't want them in the house right now, or this person in the household, we don't want them having access to them, we don't know where to bring them, can you put them in your evidence locker? Law enforcement will do that. I don't know in other states, but in Louisiana they will.

Yeah.

The problem with that is 60 to 90 days by law it becomes property of the agency.

Yeah, we do have that problem here in Connecticut as well because we have a lot of the red flag laws and the risk warrant laws and all of that, where I think we have a little bit longer. I think we have 120 days here in Connecticut, and then once it gets up to a year, then they're required to actually destroy them.

So, so we don't have— yeah, we don't have the legal requirement to destroy them but they have that option. So what we've done is gone out to some of these smaller agencies, and Louisiana is kind of rural, uh, so we've gone out to some of these smaller agencies and we're like, look, when you get them for this— because if they're put in evidence, they don't always get taken care of. I don't know if you've ever seen a firearm that goes through the evidence system. It can go in brand new and come out looking 100 years old. Yeah. So we have police departments that refer them to us So they bring their firearms to us, we do our own chain of custody, uh, we have a little contract that we have them sign that goes through our processes, everything else, and what we expect of them and what they expect of us, stating that we want to give them their firearms back and the processes we're going to use to do that. Um, and then it also gives them direction on if they're having thoughts of suicide, if they're having thoughts of others, if hurting others, if they're having issues, uh, with mental health, with depression, with drug and alcohol addiction. It gives them some direction for all of that. And then we have other shops that are on the program that just do that as well. So not everyone has the, the, the space or the drive to house this many firearms like I do. So we have other shops that you go in and they're just a point of contact. They'll tell you how the process goes, they go through the entire thing, and they're there for community relations. And if they don't have space, they ship the firearms to me They come here, I clean them, I maintain them. We try to give them back in a better condition than we got them. And whenever you go back to that FFL and you're like, look, I want to pick them up, ship them right back. And all that at no charge to the user. And one of the things— the biggest hurdle we have now is funding, because we have little minuscule VA oversight. And if the VA were to offer us funding for this they wouldn't want minimal oversight. So we don't, we don't want them having access to a bunch of information because, look, I don't know if you've ever worked for the government.

I have, actually.

They can screw up anything. So, yeah, to give them more access than what we think is, is responsible, uh, we get accused quite often of trying to do a backdoor gun grab and all that kind of stuff. And I'm like, look, talk to anyone who's ever used the program. Yeah, I'm giving— I'm begging them to take their firearms back because I want them to have them back, because I want to take them hunting, I want to take them shooting, I want to just enjoy life with these people when we're done.

So, and so since we mentioned the whole money thing, is there anywhere here that people can actually donate?

Not right now.

Look, not right now.

All of that is, is done through the VA. So there may be something in the future that we're working on. Okay. But, but as of right now, I don't— we don't see a way to keep them separate. Okay. Because if we started not-for-profit or anything else, yeah, then it can't have the VA oversight that the VA wants to have for, um, government— not record-keeping, but government tracking. Because all they track is how many firearms have come in and how many new people we have talked to about the program.

All right. And as far as the program goes, is this where you're helping people find resources to get counseling or substance abuse issues or any of that? So you've got like a network of counseling or what do you actually have?

One, we have a local VA office that we utilize. I don't know if you've ever been to any of the VA psychiatrists before, but I've just heard people tell me stories about them. The local level is one thing. When you get to the higher-ups in them, Their higher-ups are phenomenal. They really are. But I think that the VA is just so understaffed that it's hard not to burn people out. That's the God's honest truth. I would love to tell you that when they get in there, their heart's on fire, they're doing things and they're just trying to change the world. And I think that a lot of them are in the beginning. But as a vet, we're not the friendliest people all the time.

Are you saying you get cranky from time to time?

Oh, hitting the VA. Like, if you think you've got an old crotchety grandfather or something like that, go sit in the VA for 30 minutes on a random morning and you'll be like, man, Pawpaw's a saint. Uh, I mean, it would burn anybody out. So we have a lot of people that are in there that just lose the care, they lose the drive, they lose the passion, and they forget why they started. So we work with other clinicians who are vendorized with the VA. So the VA covers the treatment and they do couples counseling, they do individual counseling, they do PTSD counseling, they do drug and alcohol and substance abuse, they do EDM. There's EMDR. Sorry, not EDM, that's a measurement. EMDR.

Well, once you start throwing out acronyms, none of us know anyway.

EMDR, electromagnetic. I can't remember. But think of it as better shock therapy, if that makes sense.

I've actually had relatives who've gone through that. So it's not like you see in the horror movies where someone's got a thing in their mouth and they're getting shocked while they're awake or anything like that. But yeah, because there's lots of different types of therapy for sure. Because One of the things we talked about here at my school is like one size never fits all. And so also when we're talking about therapy, whenever it's like, oh, I've tried it all. I'm like, no, you probably have not. You've tried something that didn't work. But there's still more out there.

There's so many things like we even work with— there's a local group here called the AVA, the Acadiana Veteran Alliance. And they have what's called the HEAL program. So I'm not sure if you're familiar with it, but they have the salivoganglion shot. And what that is, is it's a shot to the base of the skull that inhibits the— not dopamine, but it's the depressive chemicals in the body. So if you have somebody who has extreme PTSD, somebody who has extreme depression, it curbs it. It doesn't stop it. And we make sure to explain that to people because I do some fundraising and things with them and donate to that to help people get that program because it's putting on a tourniquet so that you can get surgery. We stop the bleeding. So we can get further help, right? And that's what I love about the Armory Project is we're not just here to say, hey, we'll hold your firearms, good luck, good luck, have fun.

Yeah, I'm sure you'll figure something out.

Let us know when you have. We're here to talk to people and help point them in the right direction because we were all lost at one point in time. You know, I can't sit here and tell you that I've never been depressed in my entire life. The first time, the first time I felt depression was when I left active duty service.. And I didn't know who I was when I wasn't in uniform. Yeah. And Sergeant Morris is very different than Caleb Morris that we have today. It took a lot of soul searching to figure out who that was and, and a lot of painful revelation where I realized that I had let my family down because I was chasing glory as opposed to chasing family. And I still struggle with making sure I put my family first. And then the next time I learned what depression was. Uh, I was competing in— I was in the National Guard at that point, and I was competing in the NC Over the Year competition and passed out during a run and found out that I had a bunch of scar tissue in my lungs. I had COPD. And my wife jokes, because every year we were married, I got bigger, stronger, and faster. She thought she was married to Superman. And I went from being Superman one day to my grandfather the next. I couldn't walk 100 yards. Without getting winded. And, uh, I mean, I was running 3 days a week, working out every day of the week, and I was in really good shape. And then all of a sudden I couldn't do any of it, and it was like all the strength that I thought I had was gone. And for a year I struggled with, with depression. And, uh, if it wasn't for my amazing wife, I don't know who I would be or where I would be. And she, she has been a rock and she has kept me on the right path and she pushes me and drives me to be the better person that I, that I should be for her and for our children.

How old are your kids?

I have a 19-year-old and a 14-year-old.

Oh, see, I got the ones in the middle. Mine is 16 and 17 or 17 and 18.

So, you know, 19, he's doing great. He's off, he's in college, he's pursuing things. Our 14-year-old Uh, he's, he's got his mindset. He wants to go to West Point. He's got his path drawn up and he's pursuing it. So, uh, both two very different but very amazing young men. And I'm, I'm so very grateful that my wife— because she raised them more than I did at the time, you know, when you look at 13 years in the service, uh, active and guard, I was gone 7 and a half years of that. Yeah. So She did everything. And I mean, she just did such a wonderful job with him. And not everyone has that kind of support. And that's, that's when we look into what we're doing, you know, and a lot of the issues we have, like in Louisiana, where a white male veteran is 65 to 67% more likely to commit suicide than anyone else. Let's look at why, right? A lot of times it's trouble in the household, it's drug and alcohol abuse, it's, it's childhood trauma that never got dealt with.

Um, you guys are offering couples counseling, and I think a lot of people forget that that is part of helping, because like, I— in my family as well, it's like you have to involve the entire family in the healing process. Uh, have you met Mario Mosen or seen his channel on YouTube?

That name sounds familiar, but, uh, I don't know.

So he talks in depth about his PTSD. He's out in California.. And, and it's like, you know, read through the comments sort of thing. And it's just like, oh, this makes sense. And he does talk about like the, so many people don't understand, like as the wife or whoever stays home, cuz it's not all men that have PTSD. It's not all women who stay home, but it's just like the partners. And it's like, and also just here at the, at the Capitol, sorry. I've talked to some of the wives whose husbands are having issues and it's just like, and they don't know what to do either. And so it's just like the fact that you mentioned earlier that like, yeah, you show them couples counseling as well because it is about the family.

And so I think that's totally awesome. And if the family is your main support, right? So we can't just focus on one leg because then we're not evenly yoked. So we, we have to go through it together and we have to learn how to deal with the trauma together because once, once you leave these walls, your family's the one that has to deal with it.

You know? So what is your favorite success story or what are some of the stories that help keep you going? Because that was one of the things when I was with Jake and, uh, on their Walk the Talk America show, they asked me as like, what is it that keeps you going? What is like some of, some of your favorite wins that you've had?

The main thing that keeps me going is I, I believe I can help one more, right? So I just want to help one more person every day, uh, and that's, that's been a blessing. My favorite success story is he's become a friend of ours. We have a friend who we brought hunting, uh, and he was going through a rough spot in time and, uh, was dealing with a lot of trauma and went hunting. And after we— after I left early, he ended up calling and, and said that he was pretty much done, uh, that he had checked out. And the conversation and the night we had restored his faith, and he's still with us today, and he's doing better. He's constantly trying to improve, and it's, it's lit a fire in his heart and his soul that I don't think will be put out anytime soon. So that one is phenomenal. I would love to tell you that I talk to everyone that we've helped, but I don't. I try to keep in touch with them, but it's so many people that it would just consume me.

Well, and it's not meant to be that way because there's also people that you've helped that you've never met. And that's one of the things why, again, back to doing just this, the series I run on Saturday, it's like, There are the ones we get to hear about, the ones who reach out to us and let us know, hey man, it made a difference. And then there are all the people that we'll never know that have your— are grat— have great gratitude for you because they're the wife, they're the sibling, they're the person who didn't know what to do, but you were there for them. And I think in this work, we forget about that sometimes, and sometimes we need to be reminded, sometimes not, but It's like every life you save, all right, if you, if you help one more, since I'm going to take your tagline now, um, that every time you help one more, you then get to have them help one more as well. So that one more is hundreds, if not thousands.

And we did a, uh, we've done an article with CBS, um, We've done an article with, uh, New York Times or the Washington Post, I don't know which, and going through with them some of the things that, that people have said to us, some of the emails I've gotten, uh, it's crazy the, the chasm that's between the two, where we have people who are so grateful, so thankful and they want us— they want to know what they can do to help us do more. And then we have the other side where people try to attack me personally, uh, and, and they, they just spill vitriol and make things up. And it's like, man, why, why not just try to help somebody, you know? And, but I think that goes to some of the— some of the people are just in such a dark place, that's all they can do. And those are the people that we still want to help.

Well, a lot of people are afraid of giving up their guns or having somewhere that will take their guns because that's all that they can think of is, "Oh, you stole my guns. You stole my buddy's guns. How dare you?" And it becomes that thing where when people only have a piece of the information, they just have that knee-jerk reaction of, "Who are you to take my friend's guns? Because if you're going to take his guns, then you're going to come take my guns." And while you're attached to the VA, and I know from talking to many veterans, there is, oh my gosh, the VA totally sucks and they're horrible. And there's the other side, just like your emails where it's like, oh my gosh, if it weren't for the VA, I'd be dead right now. And so, you know, there's, I don't know if there's equal amounts of those stories, but just the fact you have the association with the VA, I can understand why some people are going to lash out at you because they can't really lash out at VA more than they already do.

All right, we've had people come and they're like, you know, Caleb, what can you do to help me with this headache with the VA? And I'm like, look, uh, I have no strings. I have the same problems that you have. Uh, so like one of the things that the VA has listened to us on is we have an advocate. So we have VA advocates here who don't work for the VA, who are veterans, who know the headaches that we have. And the VA here locally is helping them draw a roadmap to where if someone calls and says, hey, look, I'm a Vietnam vet, never been enrolled with the VA, I've got all these problems, what do I do? And then that's actually a buddy of mine. We were high school friends. He's still one of my best friends. And he has just become consumed about helping veterans. And it goes into helping people is addictive. It is one of the most addictive things I've ever done in my entire life. And it, it just, you want to help so much more when you realize you can make a difference and you're like, okay, I have purpose. Because that's what you lose when you leave the service is you lose your purpose and you have to find that purpose again. And it just developed into helping people is a hell of a purpose.

So where do you see yourself going from here? What do you, I mean, I know like we talked about money, Like, one of the things you and I talked about last week when you were in class was like, you said how much it costs to have all of these firearms, the physical space and the cost because you can't put goods in those spaces and all of that. And then raising money. And what are you hoping to get done? Are you— I mean, you touched on that, possibly doing a nonprofit, but there's probably that because of the VA. And, you know, what do you think is the best road forward for you guys at this point?

We, we, we'll probably— well, we most likely will eventually have a not-for-profit or a nonprofit, um, where we'll set up a board and everything else and, and kind of grow with it. And that— I would love for that to happen and then for us to impact more people and make a difference and, and just go all across the United States because, um, We've already got Arkansas pretty much on board. We've talked to some of their legislators and they're going to be passing laws. We worked with Colorado with some of their people there and building a similar program. But it's going there and helping them set them up is the difficult part, right? So I would love to see us just spread to more states and get to a point where, like Walk the Talk America, we're more commonly known.. And people are just on board for it. I would also love to see the same, the same breath. I would love to see the day that we're no longer needed. Right. Absolutely. I don't think it'll ever happen.

No. But I would love to see that day. Yeah. My understanding is that would be a significant amount of reform within the military arm as far as preparing veterans for when they're leaving versus, hi, have a nice day. That's your last meal. To you.

Have some good luck. I wish that when I had raised my right hand, uh, Uncle Sam would have said, hey, you should read On Combat and On Killing by Lieutenant Colonel Dave Grossman. Those books would have really helped me when it came to fighting demons that I had to fight, um, because the military does a great job of preparing you physically for what you'll go through. They don't do much at all mentally and emotionally for what you'll go through. And that burden is way heavier and it's way more difficult to carry because, hey, mission first, soldiers always. We hear that all the time, or we heard that all the time. But the truth of the matter is it's mission first, soldiers somewhere in the middle. We'll find you on the back end. It's just so damn hard. And then we lie to each other about it. Yeah, you don't want to appear weak, you don't want to appear, uh, broken, you don't want to appear vulnerable. So we put on this mask of Superman, and whenever the mask is finally torn off and we're standing there broken, we don't know how to deal with it, you know. And just as men— and I can only speak from the male point of view— just as men, we talked about it this morning in my Bible study, It's that same thing. Like, you're asking me, man, hey man, how you doing today? I'm fine, I'm good. Yeah, you know, and, uh, we just lie about it because we think no one wants to hear.

A friend of mine, uh, he has a reply for that. He's like, what if you ask me how I'm doing? I'm like, are you, are you asking or do you really want to know? And because most of us, even when we ask, hey Caleb, how you doing this morning? We usually have enough on our plate. We don't want to hear what you have to say. I mean, let's be real. I mean, it's like, yeah, it's not just dudes, but it's part of our busyness. And like you said, the fear of showing our emotions. That's why it's like, sorry, I have a little bit of allergies, drives me crazy. But it's like, I'm a big crier and it's just like my emotions just come straight out whether you want them or not, or whether I want them or not. So I have not a chance of being the tough person in the room, but at the same time, it's like you guys being strong and being able to hold it together in the things that you face, it's just insane. It's like the mom who goes and picks up the car off of her kid kind of thing. It's like, you don't know what you're capable of until you're doing it. But from all the vets that I've talked to, You guys also have just— it's like you have a mission, you have a mission, you have a purpose, you have a purpose, and then you don't. And it's just like, to me, that feels like if I was driving a car and all of a sudden I slammed into a brick wall. It's like— but it's all mental, it's not physical. And like the wives I've talked to, it's like, well, he comes home, he's a different person because he's not the same person I met before he went in. And this is why, like I said, I was super excited about the couples thing, but it's just like, if you're a wife or a husband of a veteran, realize just like, it's so hard for them and you're not necessarily gonna understand them all, but at least have that grace. I mean, do you have any— wait, you said your, your wife is your superhero, right?

So the question is, got any tips that your wife could like throw out here? Our biggest thing is communication. Like, um, if she asks me a question and I don't answer it, she forces me to answer it. You know, she, she's not afraid to shy away from the difficult conversations because she'd rather have a difficult conversation. She doesn't let me hide in my insecurities. She doesn't let me hide in my false bravado. She's like, look, if you're going to be honest with anyone, you're gonna be honest with your wife. And until you can be honest with someone else, you'll never be honest with yourself. So she, she makes sure and she ensures that I am honest with her and with myself. Um, when we were going to open up the shop, I tried to buy the other place that I was working at and put in everything I had into it and failed multiple times, but didn't want— I was a dog on a bone. I didn't want to give it up. So I failed and failed and failed. And finally one day I realized that I had just ruined it and sat outside with a bottle of whiskey and my sorrow and drank until the bottle was pretty much empty and was crying. My wife comes outside, she's like, what is going on? And I was like, well, I'm drunk. Yeah, yeah, yeah. She's like, what's going on? I told her, I spilled it all out. I'm like, I failed. I've done this, I've done that. You know, I've just ruined it. And she goes, well, what happens tomorrow? I'm like, what do you mean? She goes, if you ruined everything, what are we going to lose? I'm like, the house, the car, the this, the that. She goes, I'm here, the kids are here, what else do you need? And I was like, well, I need, uh— she's like, what else do you need? And I was like, I need my wife and my kids. She goes, we're not going anywhere. She goes, you can't screw it up. And she meant it. And for the first time in my, in my life, I realized what in sickness and health meant. And I was like, that's it, we're good. And I went in the next day and, and gave a 6-month notice to the owner of the company. And I was like, I can't work here anymore. You backed me into a corner and I'm never going to be in a corner again. My wife told me, she was like, look, I saw a man who was filled with fear and self-doubt. She goes, that's not the man I married, so be the man that I married. And she was just— she's not afraid to be real, raw, and honest with me. So in any marriage, any relationship, if you care about that person, be those things. Don't placate, don't pussyfoot around the questions, man. Be blunt. Let people know how you feel.

Love them, hate them, whatever. Let them know. Got it. Um, when I've talked to some wives— because my husband is not military, but so I just have the secondhand information— but they're just like, the wall that gets put up so often is that I don't want to tell you what I've been through because you can't handle it, because it's horrible. It's like taking someone else's life. There's just nothing that's good about that. I mean, it's your job and it's like, for most civilians is like, they don't get the idea of that and they can't, they're like, oh, I can't, I can't put this burden on somebody else. And it's just like, I don't know, I guess it's that communication part, right?

Is, yeah. And it's, it's understanding that, you know, as a vet, we're no different than anyone else. You know, we, we all have experiences, and everyone's experiences matter, uh, be them good or bad. They shape us into who we are. There are people that as a young child were abused, used, and everything else, and if they don't come to terms with that, it perpetuates the system. And if we don't come to terms with our own trauma, it perpetuates the system. So I mean, my wife went through so much. Our firstborn child, I was there for, for the, the act of making him and then came home to a 2-week-old, you know. Uh, she, she dealt with it all on her own. And if, if I thought that what I went through was worse than what she did, going through the entire pregnancy, going through labor and everything else, then I came home for 2 weeks and I left again for 5 months. So pain is pain.

You can't diminish someone else's pain, but don't think that your own pain is greater than theirs. Yeah. And it's funny, I was, I've been thinking about on this, this week actually, is that everybody has trauma. It doesn't matter how old you are. It doesn't matter what lifestyle you are. It just is. Everybody's had trauma, whether it's your mom or dad yelling at you, whether it's actual abuse, whether it's I don't know, getting nightmares and night terrors and stuff like that. It's like all of us have some form of trauma and most of us don't want to admit it. And some of us are better at dealing with our trauma than others. But it's like one of, one of my vet friends, he's like his moment of clarity and calmness is that one day he was out hunting and he came across a baby fawn curled up in the field. And he just looked at it and it just looked at him. And so now whenever he has a bad time, he just thinks about that baby fawn and that brings him back to being calm again. And so I think one of the things, regardless of whether you're a vet or whoever, if you have struggles, keep looking if you haven't found that baby fawn yet.

Yeah, there's, there's great books out there. Resilience is a phenomenal book. It's, I believe, a Navy SEAL. It's a compilation of letters written back and forth The Man of the Seals. And I didn't read growing up, but now I've gotten to where, man, I just devour books. Um, and there's, there's so many good ones on mental health, on purpose. And it's build your library, build your library, build your friendship circle, have people that will build you up.

Absolutely. All right, sir, well, we've made it to that 45-minute mark, and shortly at the top of the hour is our next show, uh, over on Hillbilly Up's channel. Uh, we like to get off of here so that people can go over there because Hillbilly sends folks over here as well. And, uh, I'm so glad I got to meet you. It was a pleasure. Where were we? Cheesehead, Wisconsin. Yeah, uh, hopefully someday I'll come out, uh, to— I keep saying— we— you and I were talking about New Orleans, so my brain is in New Orleans.

A little bit further west.

I'm in Lafayette, but it's okay. All right, I'm sorry, but, uh, yeah, so anyway, um, who knows, maybe someday you'll get up here to Connecticut. You never know. I'm sure I will be. I have my own private range.

You're welcome to come play.

I'm all about a range. Oh yeah, so where are you going to be teaching? Because like you've got the shop, you've got the, the, the, the storage and all of that, but you just became a training counselor. I am—

I forgot to ask you about that. My bad. My classroom, we actually just this last Saturday had, uh, 52 other instructors from out of the state of Louisiana where we talked about, uh, laws, how they're changing. We had a lawyer come in, speak, a few others. We had a facilitator come in to talk about how to present information. So I have a big classroom here, uh, I don't have a range. So we have a range that we utilize called the Fusillade Complex, uh, that I love. This place is outdoor range. We have handgun, rifle, shotgun, and a 1,000-yard range as well, uh, so that depending on the classes, we're allowed to use that range and teach with it.

So that's what I'm looking forward Very cool. Very cool. All right. Well, I appreciate you taking out your time and giving it to me and all of my audience, all 20 of them. So I got nothing else. Real quick, let's go ahead and show people where they can find you online. We can go to the Restless Renegade, and if I get really fancy, I can throw that up all at the same time. You'll know you're there if it looks like this. And then we've got him over on Facebook as well. And you'll know if you're there if it looks like that. And then most importantly, we want to go to the Vision Coalition. As far as the Armory Project, um, if you got friends down in the area, let them know this is there. If you are not local to Louisiana, I have a feeling Caleb would be willing to let other gun shops them.

So what's that? Most definitely. The more people that ask about it, if they go to thearmoryproject.org, uh, the more people that ask about it, the easier it is for us to get into other states and help spread the word and just do what we do best.

All right, so then my— to all of you watching replay viewers and live, go to your gun store, introduce them to this, uh, and then go from there, because it is hard for gun stores to do this sort of thing. Like Caleb already talked about, it's like between the storage, the legality in each state is unique, so it is a huge pain in the neck. This is one of the things I learned from Sarah Joy over at Hold My Guns, is like, it's so hard. And if we're trying to save lives, we have to make it easier for people to do stuff. Yes, ma'am. All right, sir, thank you. And oh wait, wait, Caleb gave me one more, uh, he found his, uh CBS thing. So I'm gonna throw this one up there. Hold on, give me a second. I will— we'll get the actual banner up, maybe, or maybe not. So this is from CBS News, and, uh, if y'all want to do that, let me grab this and I will stick it in the conversation that we have, um, or sorry, the description down below. Awesome, awesome. All right, sir, thank you very much. And yes, I can't say less than a 5-minute goodbye generally. All right, good night everybody.