Managing a tricky toddler

Hello, it's Camilla McGill from My Parenting Solutions, and I think you people are being told that I've gone live, and I'm waiting for a very special guest, Tess, who is going to come and join me any minute now. So hopefully Tess will— yeah, she's joined! Fantastic. Now I'm either— I might better ask you— yes, please Brilliant. Okay, let's go. Looks like that's all gone smoothly, and Tess any minute should be joining me.

Yes!

It all worked! It's always a little bit of a, you know, kind of wait. Ah, is that gonna work? Fantastic. So you're down in— where are you, Tess? You're down in Eastbourne?

Well, it's Hastings.

Pastings. Okay, lovely. I'm just going to turn my volume up a bit. I'm a little bit quiet. Yeah. And well, it's so lovely to have you here. So I invited you on because you came on my program, The Tantrum Taming Toolkit, and it was just lovely to have you on. And you were really kind of there every week on the group calls. I know that you were watching the online part of the program, and, and, and I guess it's just wonderful always useful for other parents to hear direct from a parent rather than from me about a new parent's experience of accessing what I teach. And so I just thought, you know, I invited you and you said yes, which was lovely because not everybody will. You know, some people feel a bit kind of shy about it or, you know, just, yeah, or kind of awkward. So, so I guess what I'd love to know from you is Like, when you saw that I was, um, pushing, offering the Tantrum Taming Toolkit program, um, what were your thoughts? Like, um, yeah, how— what was your response to it?

Well, I guess, um, just to kind of give a bit of background, I've been following you, um, on Instagram since I think it was like the beginning of the pandemic. Yes. Yeah. Great.

What were your feelings like as a parent with a little boy who was cheeky, a bit wayward, a bit, you know, kind of doesn't want to do what you ask? How did— and then also, like you say, you were a little bit at loggerheads with your partner who, you know, perhaps just parented in a different way or just had a different approach. What was that feeling like? I mean, I know how I felt with a wayward toddler. What was it like for you? What, like, that kind of not knowing, or that—

Yeah, I suppose it's just that you feel out of control.

Yeah.

And you just— I was kind of thinking about it earlier, because I was thinking about preparing for this, and I think when you have a baby, you're kind of like really thrown in the deep end.

Yes.

Kind of, you don't know what you're doing.

Yes.

I feel like every stage of parenting you sort of go through this, um, sorry, there's a lot of noise going on in the background, so I'm just gonna shut the door.

Oh, okay, don't worry, I've got an alarm going on in my back. Someone said a wake-up alarm going off. I was like, oh God.

So, and I think, yeah, so like I said, you don't really know what you're doing at any stage. And it's like just as soon as you kind of feel like you've got it cracked, yes, it starts again. And I think also having the— having a new baby as well, yeah, kind of— you're exhausted anyway from looking after a new baby. And yeah, I think it's just that sense of feeling out of control, not really knowing.

Yeah.

And I think because you don't really know what to do, it quite often ends up in like shouting.

Yeah, yeah, that part of that is not knowing what— productive, totally counterproductive. And part of the not knowing what to do is not knowing what your expectations should be. Um, and that's a lot about what I talk about in the program. It's like, you know, well, I've seen my friend's child and, and he— although, you know, because of the pandemic you weren't seeing so many children, but you know you think, well, he sits and gets in the buggy without a massive fuss, or, you know, and so what should I be expecting? Like, is it me, you know, is my child being like this because I'm not parenting him well?

And I think I always sort of felt, I've always felt a little bit like that. I'm quite, I suppose I'm a bit of a perfectionist anyway, which I think is It sounds awful, but you kind of project that on your child and you think, why aren't you acting like how I'd expect you? Yes, the other children are acting. And I think the great thing about your course as well was kind of embracing the characteristics that your child has, like parent and the child you have. Yeah, yes, that you wish you had, which sounds like you wish you—

no, I totally get that. Because we so take for granted the things that they do do. You know, part of it is that the way our brain works, because we're kind of programmed to look, look out for kind of mistakes. Um, and so we notice far more the things that they're not doing or they're doing wrong than we take for granted the things that they do do. But I love the fact that you repeat that back to me because that's a— it actually came from a parenting expert that I worked with called Bonnie Harris, who's brilliant, American lady. And, and she told me that, and I was like, oh God, that's actually really good, because, you know, this is the child I have. Um, you know, when I had two little boys, I, I wish for little girls who would sit quietly and draw, you know. And then I get two little girls who sat quietly and draw. But I realized that there was other things, you know. My boys were much They were much straighter. You could kind of— you just know what you're getting with a boy. Like, they'll tell you things, and girls will be a little bit cunning about how they, you know, they're sort of, you know, the female sex, isn't it? So yeah, I mean, I think it's such a great one, that parent, the child you have, not the child you wish you had. So, and also, I guess what was happening for you is that kind of a bit of a lack of confidence with not knowing and, you know, being a little bit of a perfectionist yourself, which I know I am, when they're not doing the right thing, you lose confidence in yourself as a parent. So I think, you know, parents find that really hard. And what would you say the kind of benefits were from the programme for you?

I think the main benefits were kind of really reframing our mindset, and that wasn't just me, but my husband Marv as well. So I think for me that was a really big outcome because we both kind of were aligned on our thinking, and it just made us kind of be a lot stronger together as a team. So working together as a team rather than sort of— because quite often previously when Edward kind of, you know, had a moment, we'd both— we'd sort of end up arguing ourselves. So obviously that's quite counterproductive.

Yes.

What else? There's loads of things. But I'd say one of the key things as well is learning how to deal with certain situations. And for me, it was really using like the descriptive phrase.

Yes.

So that's one of the things from the course. So kind of using that sort of positivity to bring out the best in Edward.

Yes.

And that's made such a really big difference.

Yeah, even, you know, and that's that— I think the big, you know, the change for me when I learned all those years ago is even in the moment when they're being really difficult, finding something to praise.

That I think because he's still— sorry, I'm like, my battery is really low.

Oh, I've got that, I've got mine plugged in kind of propped up.

That's what I need to make sure I do.

Oh, I've lost you there. We— somewhere.

I definitely think having— because obviously Edward isn't— just because we've done your course, it doesn't mean he's like perfectly behaved all the time. And I think that's one of the key takeaways, is that it's not necessarily going to change his behaviour completely, but what it does is it allows us to know how to handle it better and also stem any kind of—

Oops, I think we just lost you for a second there. I think we lost you for a little bit there.

Am I back?

Yes, you said you don't expect, you know, always to have good behaviour, but it's more about knowing how to deal with it.

And even if it's what we class as like bad behaviour, that we can, and we sort of respond quite positively or try and turn the situation around. And I've really found that that's made a big difference. I think the other thing that's really worked for us— so Edward loves routine.

Yeah.

And anything like that. So we've sort of introduced new rules.

Yes.

Into, like, into our existing routine. And when I say rules, it sounds really harsh, but obviously in your course you kind of explain that rules kind of— it helps to give expectations to the child. They know what to expect. We know what we expect as well. I definitely feel like he really responds to that. So for example, it sounds really simple when you say it out loud, but he was really, you know, being very difficult about getting dressed for bed and in the evening, and he still has milk. So now instead of sort of giving him his milk as soon as he gets out of the bath and then trying to get him dressed.

Yes.

No, now you have milk once you're dressed.

Yes.

Incentive, and then you can like, you know, praise.

Yes.

Or whatever afterwards. And yeah, that's what, as I just said, reward. That's another thing I really liked about your course is that it's not necessarily rewarding with like toys or rewarding that good behaviour because you don't want to always be like, oh, you've behaved well so we're going to reward you. Yes. Small things like giving praise or like the stickers or anything like that.

Yeah.

And that's just really— it's just, I feel like we've just got a bit of a calmer household overall.

Yeah.

And we know what to expect, he knows what to expect, and that just makes for a much harmonious way of living. So, you know, it's obviously still not without its challenges, but I think the other huge benefit of the course with you is, you know, we found Edward's behaviour particularly difficult. I would say he's quite a difficult child. Compared to some children. You know, he's really energetic, he's very determined, he's very independent, and mixed with like confidence as well. You know, these are all great qualities to have, but not as a parent of a toddler. So I think he's particularly difficult, but even saying that, I think the tools that we learned from your course will see us through kind of like the whole, the whole of our parenting. Yes, really, like sort of every stage. I've even started using some of them, some of the things I learned on my husband. Yeah, he knows, but just like the way I frame things differently so I'm not seen as like nagging.

Yes, yeah, yeah, yeah.

And so it's good for kind of like any relationships. And the other key benefit as well is that the modules are— and so if people aren't aware, you have like the sort of the Zoom calls where you have the interaction, but there's also, we've got the modules that you obviously pre-record, and they're brilliant because we can just go back to them.

Yes.

If we need to, and I think that's really good as like a refresher because You do sort of a kind of— I found that you start to transition back a little bit sometimes, or forget. So it's, you know, I've kind of— me and Miles have sort of decided we're going to try and like refresh ourselves every month or so, and just to watch a few bits back, or like watch any of the roleplay videos that you do, and it just kind of keeps it fresh. Yeah. And I think But any job that you go and do, you, 9 times out of 10, you're going to have training for it. But being a parent, it's like you're almost expected to know what to do, how to react.

Yes.

And actually, I found that doing the course has— because, you know, you feel a bit silly actually thinking, oh, I need a course to tell me how to look after my child or tell me how to parent. Yeah. But I would really suggest that— I feel like everyone needs to do a course like this because it just teaches you so much in and about yourself as well and about the way you handle things.

Yes.

And yeah, I've just found it really beneficial. Also the fact that it's not just all kind of how you respond to your child but also really understanding their brain activity and the science behind it. Act the way they do. And I think that particularly really helped my husband to kind of understand and get it.

Yeah.

Why he wasn't able to reason with Edward when he's, you know, having a tantrum or being really, like, really playing up.

Yes.

You know, and I think the course, doing it as a pair, doing it as a couple, it's obviously if you're in a couple. Yes, it was really beneficial for our relationship. Yeah, yeah, I answered everything.

I think you really have. I mean, it's, it's so interesting because, you know, when I think back to my learning from, from in the early stages of going to classes, it was just the class, it wasn't recorded. So, you know, and you do But if you can just, like you say, just dip in once a month and you watch, I'll be updating it because I'm like you, I'm a perfectionist. And I was thinking, oh, I just added this. Or if somebody gives me a scenario, I'm like, oh, I'll just do that in a roleplay. And I don't know where Piggy is, he's gone on the bed. But, you know, just bringing up my Piggy and doing a roleplay. So I know I'll add some more of those in. But yeah, just that kind of, you know, refreshing And as you say, you know, it's what I've tried to make it as is like it's principles and foundations for positive parenting. Obviously, there's a focus on the challenging behavior and the tantrums because those are the things I think we find the most difficult to deal with. You know, probably if you had an easy peasy child, you might not think, I need the program. I would still say you do because actually an easy peasy child will still need their confidence boost. They still need to be taught to speak up for themselves. They need to be taught to value themselves. So actually, you know, but, but it's those challenges that tend to draw parents in. Then they think, oh, I really need this. But once it's not just about those difficult times, it's about, you know, I mean, I've just found like the really lovely thing is like, you know, going on a walk with toddler and thinking of 10 things you can praise them for. And that's just so lovely, whereas we're not programmed to that, for that, you know. We're programmed when they let go of your hand to say, no, no, no, you've got to, you know, it's dangerous, you've got to hold my hand.

Definitely. And, and I, I think also what, just what you said, it is that kind of praise, but also what it's taught me, particularly my husband, because obviously I was following you anyway, so I'd already picked up a few things.

Yes.

That whole thing of not just saying, oh, well done, good boy. It's like actually explaining to them why.

Yes.

Why the behaviour has been good. So, oh, well done, you, you know, you put your shoes on all by yourself.

Yes.

I've actually had to print out like a list of adjectives.

Yeah.

So that I can use some different ones with him, but you know, like sort of experts saying to him, oh, you're so creative.

Yes.

Picture. So it kind of really helps to build their confidence as well, which I think is really important for, you know, like you said, laying the foundations of being a confident adult.

Yes, yes, yeah. And like, you know, you were saying that you sort of— there's so much of looking at yourself and thinking, you know, is this about me and my perfectionism, or should, you know, maybe I should just let this one go because who cares if they haven't done whatever. I mean, I'm not saying like if you've asked them to tidy up, let it go, but you know, there's things that we can perhaps, you know, wait or not make such a big deal of.

But it's that expectations thing as well from both sides. So he knows what to expect, but I think it's also for us to have realistic expectations of what he's capable of. And, you know, if he's really tired, yeah, or hungry, is he really going to listen? Can we really expect him to do that?

Yes.

Probably no. It's kind of, you know, lowering your expectations a little bit. Yes.

Yeah.

And I think that helps as well because it helps you feel like not such a failure as a parent too, because you recognize that actually eventually, you know, you're just going to get into a stalemate situation and you're both going to end up being more unhappy. Yeah. Whereas, like you say, sometimes if you just like let little things go.

Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Or also, it does.

Or just think, you know what, I get it, he doesn't want to do this. I really get why it's that, you know, he's resisting. Because, you know, they have such a different agenda to us. And yeah, you know, if I've said it's time for your bath and they run off and, you know, shout, "Get off me," kind of no wonder, you know.

It's like, yeah, they're kids. And you think sometimes the things that we kind of like ask them to do, it's like this, the whole thing of You know, the TV's on, yes, or if they're really engrossed in playing with a toy, yes, and you just go up to them and say, "Right, time to brush your teeth." Yes. Like, of course, like, if that was you, you'd be like, "Well, no, I'm like doing something at the moment. I'll be there in a minute." Yes. We do that as adults, so to expect your child to just kind of like drop everything and be like, "Oh yes, I'm going to do this boring thing of brush my teeth because you told me.

Yes.

So that kind of expectation, and then also learning the method to kind of get past that. So, like, you know, getting down to their level, engaging with them, talking about what they're playing with, and then saying, you know, and now it's time to brush your teeth, or, you know, can we take Teddy with us?

Yes. Should we brush Teddy?

Like, that morning Teddy went and brushed his teeth.

Yes.

And the difference that made, because teeth brushing is like one of the worst things in this household for us. So, and that really, really worked. I was like, can you show Teddy how to brush his teeth?

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

It's kind of like being a bit creative as well and thinking a little bit like a child too.

Yes, standing in there as well. Yeah, it is fun, and it makes you feel much, so much more competent as a parent, doesn't it, when you're you know, you're a little bit more cheerful, you're a bit more playful, you realize that, you know, playfulness makes a difference, you know. And you might be thinking, why should I have to? But actually, why shouldn't you? You know, like, what's the big deal if Teddy comes and he gets involved in toothbrushing? How lovely. And then, you know, you've had a game with it, and then Edward's also brushed his teeth.

So, you know, so rather than me being like 'No, you need to brush your teeth. Come on, Edward, brush your teeth.' That is usually what happens.

Yeah, but you know, you kind of know that there is an alternative, and if you stop— and sometimes it just is like, 'Oh God, come on, Tessa, come on, you know, stop.' I do think that's the other thing with the course, though.

It does— as much as sometimes you might kind of go back to your old ways. Yes, for want of a better phrase. It does make you stop and think again.

Yeah.

So quite often I'll sort of try and either count to 10, or I'll try and walk away now as well. Yeah, if I can, I just try and walk away, um, from the situation and come back, because, you know, sometimes it is just too much. And I think that that really works rather than me biting and responding by shouting or losing my cool. Yeah, because it always just ends up so much worse.

Yes, yes, yeah.

Sometimes you might want to because you're like, ah, yeah, yeah.

Oh, brilliant. Well, just like before we go, because, um, we've chatted a long time actually, No, it's good, it's lovely. I mean, I don't apologize. What would you say to somebody who might be on the fence, like, you know, they're thinking, oh, it's gonna be— so in case anybody's joined, we're talking about the fact that Tessa joined my program, the Tantrum Taming Toolkit, which is open for registration this week, and we start next week on our first group call as well as given you access to the online part that you have lifelong access to.

What would you say to somebody that was like, "Should I?" I would say it's a really positive investment in your child's future and in your future as being a parent.

You know, it's not just this like kind of one-off I really wanted to speak to your mom and ask her what she did. And Scarlett said, well, as it happens, she's, she's a parenting coach. And the woman went, ah, now it makes sense. So, you know, it isn't just—

Camilla, that's one thing I didn't say. I've kind of talked to all about the course, but actually what made the course is you doing it and you're really non-judgmental, you're very realistic, but you're also very optimistic. And, you know, all of your content is just delivered in a really nice way and in a, like, in a believable way. Yeah, something you feel like you can actually achieve as a parent. Um, so yeah, I didn't really mention that part, but obviously the course content is great, but really it's, you know, it's down to the fact that you're— the way you're delivering it. And because you've got experience of like bringing up 4 children, kind of gives you that reassurance that obviously you do know what you're talking about.

And, you know, I know how completely terrible it can be. You know, this gorgeous daughter who's babysitting can be really off with me sometimes.

And yeah, using your own experiences during the course, and it really does, you know, especially when you talked about Nico and stuff, yeah, it makes me feel like I'm not the only one that is going through this or has gone through this.

Yes.

Dealing with a more difficult child.

So yeah, and then you get it right and they come out the other end and people say they want their child to be like yours.

Yeah, that's amazing. What a great endorsement, wasn't it?

I know. I said to Scarlett, could you just record her. Brilliant. Oh, listen, Tess, I shall let you get back to your evening. Thank you so much. This will— if you've only just joined, this will be in my IGTV and I'll pop it up on my story. But it's just been lovely to speak to Tess, who came on the Tantrum Taming Toolkit and is a big advocate. So if you're thinking of joining, I'm actually going to put a link in the bio which actually takes you straight through to the page. There is a webinar tomorrow night The 3 Secrets to Managing Tantrums and Challenging Behavior. So anybody that would like to join that, that link is in the bio. Or if you'd like to check out what's actually in the program, which like I say is being launched this week, then I'll put that link up as well. So that's all from us, and I'm sure, no doubt, we'll have contact again soon. Take care. Pleasure. Thank you for coming. Bye-bye.