Next Level 283: How to Bullet Proof Your Portfolio During Crazy Economic Times and Become a Financial Beast with Eric Miller

If you want to have success, if you want to be able to build significant wealth, you have to have a plan of knowing where 99 cents of every dollar is going to go before it comes in.

Welcome to the Next Level Income show where it's our goal to take your income, your investments and your life to the next level. I'm your host, Chris Larson. If you haven't yet, get a copy of our book for free at our website, nextlevelincome.com. that's www.nextlevelincome.com. just click on the book link and I'll even send you a copy if you put your address in. On today's show, we have Eric Miller. Eric is a seasoned financial planning professional with over 20 years of experience dedicated to empowering private practice owners and associates. As co owner and chief financial advisor of Econologics Financial Advisors, a registered investment advisor, Eric specializes in strategic financial planning, including investments, retirement, asset protection, tax strategies, debt elimination and business transition planning. A registered financial consultant and graduate of Capital University, Eric is also a prolific author and speaker and has published countless articles, videos and podcasts. And he is the best selling author of how to Become a Financial Beast. He has presented at hundreds of events nationwide and weekly hosts the Financial Beach Podcast. Eric, welcome to the show.

Hey, happy to be here, Chris.

Yeah, I'm excited to have you on. As we shared in the intro here, a little bit about what you do, Eric, and we're going to have a nice conversation, maybe try to figure out what investors can expect out of the markets today, but also what active steps that they can take to really create a more robust portfolio for themselves, for their future and for their families as well. But I would love for you to share a little bit about your path and what you do with your group.

Yes. And thanks again for having me on. It's pretty simple. I think I always knew that I wanted to be in the financial industry of some kind. I'm of that age, Generation X where we used to have the USA Today. Remember the USA Today? Oh yeah, the, the, the different sections and I always loved the money section but I realized I don't know any what any of these things mean so I had to do a lot of self study in that area. But I just loved and I knew that I wanted to help people in this with their personal finances.

Yeah.

So we had the bright idea in 2008 to start our financial planning company and you know, you can imagine what happened in 2008. It's a hell of a time to ask people for money and investments.

Oh, yeah. Wow.

But we knew. We also. I come from a health care background. My family's in health care. And I saw the good, the bad and the ugly of people in this space. Yeah, very excellent when it comes to helping patients, not so much when it comes to managing money. So just decided this is the group, this is the tribe that we want to help. And ever since 2008, that's what we've been doing.

Wonderful. Yeah. Well, I think, hey, if you can start in, in a downturn like that and build a robust business, then you can survive in any market. So, yeah, I'm sure that wasn't easy, but it may have been. May have been the ideal time.

It seems like those are. Those are always the best times to start when there's a lot of turmoil.

Yeah, yeah. And, you know, the value you provide during those times is. Is tremendous, I think. You know, and I like you. You know, I've been. I've spent a lot of time in the health care space. And it's interesting, you know, there's some stats out there when it comes to doctors, when it comes to surgeons. And when I work for Medtronic, I was with them for 10 years. One of our company policies was that we weren't allowed to fly with physicians. And the reason was that there was a. There was an accident with that company and, and several people passed away in that. But, you know, doctors, I mean, look, I've worked with neurosurgeons, you know, some of the brightest individuals out there. Incredible. But, you know, it's, you know, when you're smart in one area, sometimes you think, oh, my intelligence and knowledge in one area moves into another. And, you know, doctors can, Can. Can sometimes say, oh, yeah, like, I can manage my investments. I could fly a plane and do this. And they don't always trust the systems that are out there. And that's where, you know, some of these, These statistics have come through. So I think, you know, what you're doing with practice owners is terrific. But you specifically, and I looked at this when I was doing my mba. You're. You're registered investment advisor. And some people might not know what that is, but you know what I discovered? You were chatting before the show, that that was one of the things I wanted to do coming out of my mba, but there wasn't a lot of opportunity in that space 25 years ago. And what I found was the options that were out there. To be a financial advisor, you're basically just a glorified salesman with A product package that was limited. Eric, do you mind explaining to the audience how an ria. How a registered investment advisor is different than a quote, unquote, traditional investment advisor?

Yeah, there are different tiers, definitely, to this game. There's different licensing that you would need. You know, there's nations. People get. And I think everyone gets all these things confused to some degree. I would say that a registered investment advisor probably has the highest standard of care. There's, you know, there's a. You know, there's a loyalty, there's a Jerry. Responsibility that we have to our clients. And I say that because, look, I mean, I've met. I'm sure that they're, you know, physicians out there that have degrees and have licenses, but you wouldn't send your kids to them. So there's definitely, like, quality. I mean, you still have to be good at your job. You still have to love what you do. You still have to have a system in place. But I think by and large, the RIAs, you know, are allowed to do couple things. Not only can we do investment planning, investment management, we can manage money, but we do financial planning, which is, how do we. How do we manage the resources of a household? And if you're going to ask me what's more important, like the actual investment performance or the system that you set up to how you manage your. The. The discipline that you have, the habits that you have. Yeah, um, all those things. I think that they're probably infinitely more important than the return on investments. So we try to concentrate on both of those things, and I think that they are very much required if you're going to have success with money.

Yeah, I love that. You know, it's kind of like going to see a personal trainer. And it's like, okay, I can. I can go to the gym. I can do a specific workout. People get bogged down. It's like, oh, how many sets do I do? What do I do with this? But that plan, like, am I eating the right food? Am I working out on a consistent basis? Do I have that discipline ends up being more consequential than, like, what am I doing day to day and doing that? And I think, you know, what you said is tremendous. It's like, do you have the plan that's in place? And as, you know, as the markets go up, the markets go down, asset classes rise and fall. And, you know, we've seen gold on a tear this year. We've seen the markets, you know, we've seen bitcoin over the last decade. It's like, okay, do you have a plan? And that's what we talked about before the show. That's what the ultra wealthy do, you know, that's how the, you know, the billionaires, the ultra wealthy, the family offices, the endowments are different. And you bring that same sort of structure to your clients.

I think so. I think that's a big mistake that a lot of people make. And if, you know, not to jump into it, but I will. I think one of the, the key disciplines that you had mentioned, the family offices and I guess the ultra net worth, which I need, I needed that defined. Like, what's the difference between a high net worth and an ultra high net worth?

Yeah, I think I, last time I checked, like, ultra high net worth is like 30 million or above. Then you have, you know, you're sent to millionaires at 100 million. You got obviously your billionaires. But, and I might, you know, that may change. But I think last time I checked, ultra, ultra high net worth was 30 million or above.

And I would say one of the distinguishing features that those people have is that they know where their money is going to go before it comes in. And if you look at the fundamental mistake to that most people have, most people do make money comes into my bank account and then I decide of, of where it goes. No, no, no, no, no. If you want to have success, if you want to be able to build significant wealth, you have to have a plan of knowing where 99 cents of every dollar is going to go before it comes in. And that's true for your household and it's really true for your business as well, if you want to remain profitable. And that's kind of one of the, I wouldn't even say it's a secret. It's just one of the disciplines that I've seen successful people have with money that do that.

I like that. It's like going to the grocery store. It's like, do I go to the grocery store without a list when I'm hungry, or do I plan my meals out ahead of time and say, hey, I'm gonna go to the grocery store with the list and I'm gonna avoid the junk food aisles and you know, stick, stick to those things and I'm probably gonna get a better outcome when it comes to my meal preparation?

Yeah, well, and it sounds so simple. It's very difficult to do. It's very difficult to do.

Yeah. So you're, you're as much of a financial coach as you are a specific asset allocator is that fair to say?

I would say so. I think most of the conversations that we have with people, you know, I mean, does it involve around portfolio construction and management of investments and all? Absolutely. I think the, the big picture things though, how are we going to exit? What's our transition plan? What do we do with the money afterwards? You know, how do we handle the day to day problems of running a business? You know, all these things that for me to be a successful financial advisor, I just can't say I focus only on just your investment portfolio. I mean, I have to know about debt and taxes and state plan and asset protection and all these things where I may not like actually implement that. But we know what the, the, the basics for you to be successful in those things. So.

Yeah, yeah, I love that. So, you know, you mentioned that one of the big mistakes that investors make is they don't have a plan before they get their money. What are some of the other big mistakes that you see out there with investors that are, that are, you know, fairly easily to avoid or address?

I would say another, another problem is under estimation of how much you need. Okay. And I'll, and I'll say that because people always ask me all the time like hey Eric, where, you know, where's money? I go, where does money come from? And people will say, well, it comes from Cotton Bush or comes from the Federal Reserve or comes from the US Government or most people have no idea where it comes from. That's another story. I'm like, no, money comes from necessity. It's because you, you know, if you really look at it, why is it that you're making the amount of money that you're making right now? Because that's what you need, that's what you think you need. Okay. So when you start looking at the issue that most people have, they're fearful of running out of money. You know, large part of the population, even accredited investors, people that are, you know, when that, you know, a million, 3 million, 5 million range. But by and large, I think most people just underestimate how much they're going to need to be able to live the life that they want to live. Their math is wrong. So I think I would challenge a lot of people to let, look whatever you think you need. And I think the average, you know, I hear out there, you got 2 million or 3 million, it's like, okay, that may be enough just to get by barely, but is really the life that you want to live. So I just challenge people to like rework your numbers and make sure that you don't underestimate what you think you need to be able to live how you want to live.

Yeah. And I've just live this experience this with my stepfather who unfortunately has dementia and we moved him into an assisted living facility. And the numbers have been eye popping when you look at it. And you know, you look at some of the options that are out there, like specifically here in Asheville, it's a two to 15 year wait to get into the top rated communities. And then I found out if you want to get into those communities, you have to buy in like a, like a vacation condo. So you're talking about 100 to over a million dollars just to get in there. So yeah, to your point, you know, if you say, okay, what, you know, what are my needs on a day to day basis, where is my equity? Where is my money? You know what, what if this scenario happens? What if that scenario happens? You know. Yeah, can I, Oh, I don't, I'm not going to have to pay. My house is paid off, I don't have a mortgage. But you may end up in a situation where you say, oh, I want this option where I'm going to have a higher level of care, a more social community, you know, I'm going to move to a different state to be closer to my family. And all those things can have massive swings in the amount of money that's needed for an individual or a family that's retiring.

And that is the fundamental flaw that the traditional, not to jump ahead, the traditional financial planning computations take into account. If you talk to anyone that's in the space, they're gonna, hey, what's the target? Well, most of my guys tell me I need to save like 60 to 70% of my current income right now in retirement plans.

Wow.

And, and that comes right out of the CFP booklet by the way. That's not me just making that up. That comes right out of the certified financial planner, which is kind of like the highest designation in our industry. And logically think about that. Like, I don't know that anybody wants to live on 60 to 70% of what they're making right now. I know I wouldn't. So the math is wrong. And yet that's what most advisors are teaching their people. And that's I think, a mistake.

Yeah. And I feel like that comes from like the, you know, the quote unquote traditional or kind of like the old school planning which is like, oh, I'm going to work, you know. Tom65, I'm going to retire. I'm going to have Social Security, I'm going to pay off my house. I'm going to live on less than I had. But I don't know, like, I don't. I think you'd probably say the same thing, Eric, and most of our listeners that are listening right now would say, well, no, I don't want to be poorer, you know, when I, I want to have more options. I want to have more wealth, I want to be able to travel, I want to be able to maybe help my, my grandchildren out with, you know, whether it's college or a home purchase or, you know, maybe they want to, you know, start or maintain a business or transition as they transition out of their practice. And yeah, it's like, okay, well, can you get there? You know, I think, you know, you know, people that you, you know, the clients that you work with, a lot of these listeners have that option, you know, they just may have to restructure and look at some of those things. And then, you know, you mentioned, you know, you don't want to jump ahead, but, you know, let's talk about, like, how your practice is different than, you know, a typical investment advisor. What options from investments do you offer that most investment advisors don't?

I'll start there in terms of, I think, our investment philosophy, because if you talk to a lot of people in our space, specifically invest our RIAs, and I get it. I mean, their, their paycheck is based upon how much in AUM assets under management that they have and them getting a percentage of that. And by and large, most of them, I think, understand how to manage. And those are mostly in public security. So those are going to be, you know, either in mutual funds or ETFs or individual stocks. But these are all going to be publicly traded companies, marketable securities, so to speak. 95 of their investment recommendations are probably going to be based upon that right there because that's what they know, that's what they get paid upon. Not knocking them, I'm just that, that's, that's kind of their system. I don't know.

That's how the business is structured.

Yeah, that's how the business is structured. And I don't, I guess that I look at it, I never went into it where, like, I have a bias towards one type of investment because I always, you know, I learned early on that I don't want to be on one of anything. And that includes one type of investment. And I think people would be surprised to know, like, wow, even Though in the public security space where you have all the ETFs and all the whatever else, you know, term you want to use. There's other areas, other institutions, okay. That can provide yields and fairly competitive rates of return and just different experiences than just investing in a diversified portfolio of stock, you know, of, of stocks.

Yeah.

So we start looking at of course, you know, of course there's real estate which people, you know, have the ability to do. A lot of people don't want to do that because they're like, I don't want to manage, you know, the tenants toilets and trash. And then of course there's syndicate out there that, that, that do that. You have insurance based products, you know, so we're an insurance agency as well. And people of course they knock them because they see every, and oh, these are rip offs. And I'm like okay, well I looked and I found that a lot of these products have use especially if you're trying to build guaranteed income and then you have the alternative investments.

You mind if I mind if I step in real quick? So you know, I was, I was shaking my head when you said that because you know, I heard the same thing, you know, 20 years ago. It's like, oh, just you know, buy term, invest the difference. And I was having this conversation a year or so ago with, with an advisor, Eric, and he said, oh no, like whole life, I would never recommend that to my clients. And that's the cornerstone of our portfolio is cash value life insurance.

Yes.

And then I, then I said well let me, let me, let me just share, you know, a situation. What if you have somebody that wants to leave a legacy to their family, they want guaranteed return and they also are going to, you know, understand how to utilize the cash value either as a retirement stream or potentially, you know, borrow against it, leverage it, you know, to put into some different investments and do those sorts of things. And I said let's say their net worth is 5, 10 million or more. And he's like oh well yeah, it would make sense in that circumstance. And I said well, I mean that's, I want to be in that circumstance. I want to be worth eight figures, nine figures. I want to have that and I want to make sure that my family's taken care of because my father died when I was five and we fortunately had, he had small life insurance policies but those helped give me a little bit of money for college. So I was able to come out of college through working and scholarships and you know, go into, you know, public institutions. I Had almost no debt coming out of college because of that. And it wasn't, it wasn't a lot of money. It would, wouldn't even pay for a year of college today. But I saw the value in that. And then my mother passed away in 2011, almost 15 years ago now and 14 years ago, technically. And I heard my, my stepfather, I said, well, did she have life insurance? My stepfather said, no, it was too expensive. Yeah. And I thought, well, you know, no one, people say insurance is too expensive, but when they use it, I've never heard somebody say, you know what, I needed the insurance, but I had too much. I wish I had less insurance when they needed it. And I said, okay, this is, you know, so it really, that's what led me down the path of exploration towards whole life insurance and those guarantees that are provided. So I would, I, I changed my tune very rapidly through those experiences.

Just in, in the last six to seven years, we've had a lot of people in the healthcare space have, have sold their practices and, you know, we're getting people that are having 6, 7, 8, $10 million sales.

Yeah.

And I can't tell you how gratifying it is to just carve out a portion of that money, put it in something that I know is going to be guaranteed. And, and look at that person say, you know, what if everything else goes to hell in a hand basket, okay. Then you're going to have this guaranteed income for yourself. Okay. And in conjunction with your Social Security, you can more than pay for your basic lifestyle.

Yeah. It's like, it's like a pension. It's like a personal pension.

Exactly. And there's a peace of mind to it. And I, I just think that you're foolish to think that anything else, you know, do people abuse it? Are there, you know, are there abysmal insurance salesmen that only do that? Yeah, but there are abysmal salesmen in every industry. So I think this is where I think going to a planner that understands all three of these things.

Yeah.

Is, is really, really prudent and I think of, of high importance. So.

Yeah, no, I appreciate, I appreciate you sharing that perspective. And you know, I think a lot of, a lot of investors don't understand, you know, a lot some of the benefits that are out there and some of those guarantees and you know, when you have that as the, you know, part of your, your financial foundation, there's a lot of security there, then you can comfortably invest in some of these other areas that may, may yield higher returns.

Yeah. Because the Alternative investment space is certainly one. And, you know, is the risk increased? Absolutely. Is there potential for good returns? Absolutely. You know, is it an area that people don't really know too much about? For sure. And that's just because they haven't been, I think, like, it hasn't been made available to them, you know, by, by RIAs.

Yeah. Yeah. So I cut you off a little bit there as you were getting into the alternative space. So as you talk about that, like what, what types of investments fall into.

That alternative bucket, you know, for the way that we look at it, it's going to be mostly just private investments. So there would be, you know, even in the alternative space, I, I would put like gold and silver in. In the alternative space, for sure. You know, as, as a, as a commodity, private thing. So we, we have a couple of, you know, on a platform that we have private lenders that are lending to private equity groups and, you know, their offer of, you know, a yield for, you know, based upon, you know, the, the rates that they're lending at. Right now, there's real estate, there's hedge funds. All these things are out there. And I'm not, I'm not going to pretend to, like, know the ins and outs of every one of them. I only probably use selectively, like two or three of them. But we've gotten good outcomes. I understand them. You know, in any type of investment, you have to understand the operator and do they know what they're doing? And I think that is. That is paramount when trying to build a portfolio, is that you have to know what you own and you have to know why you own it. And most people cannot answer that question. We ask them, like, what do you own? Why do you own it? And it's kind of amusing to us to do that, but it's a starting point of education.

Yeah, no, it's fantastic. And that's a big part of the value and getting investors comfortable with the plan that they have in place, but also helping them walk through. That's one of the things we do with our coaching group, is explain to investors the questions to ask because they don't even know some of the language and the questions. And that's one of the tools that we built, is to help investors have conversations with syndicators so that they can get that information to become comfortable, because it can be. It can be very overwhelming, which again, is, you know, is part of the value that you provide. Now, Eric, you all specialize at your firm, really working with practice owners, so, you know, doctors Dentists, which, which some, you know, oral surgeons. Like my, my wife's cousin is an oral surgeon, so he falls into, you know, the surgeon bucket. But also I went to Virginia Tech and I, I roomed with two veterinary students. And, you know, you work, you work with those.

Taking a veterinarian.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So, you know, you met, you brought something up earlier. And feel free to expand upon the clients you work with. But, you know, a lot of practice owners, as they get older, we're seeing private equity buy up some of these groups. So one of the things that you do is you help practice owners work through that transition as well so that they can leverage the equity that they've built through many years of practice.

Yeah. You know, one thing I learned, and there's. I don't know if you ever read the book by Benjamin Graham, the Intelligent Investor.

It's one of my first. Absolutely.

It's a tremendous. I would highly encourage everyone to read that book if they really want to understand, I think, the basic principles and fundamentals of investing.

Absolutely.

There's a great line in there. It says the great successes are made through concentration. Great successes are made through concentration, but great success are not kept through concentration. And fantastic. What I mean by, of course, what I mean by that is like you're going to get wealthy rich by kind of, you know, concentrating into an area. A lot of our practice owners, most of their wealth was in their practice and the building that they owned. And they were benefited of that because a lot of these bigger private equity groups are coming in there and they're saying, okay, we'll give you 8, 10, 12 times earnings and we will buy practice from you. And they keep the building, of course, which is a great income stream for them. And then from there, you know, all of a sudden people have 7, 8, 10, $12 million and they're like, in the world do I do with. I've never seen this. All this money, I've never anticipated I was ever going to get all this money. So we do help them at that point in time, really show them how to construct, I think, an intelligent portfolio that can provide them what they need. But more, more importantly, never have to worry about touching their principal and, or ever seeing their net worth go down and running out of money. That's the fun part of what we do, is to be able to do that.

No, I love that. And, yeah, and it's. I, that's what I tell. I was just talking to my, my son's class here in the last few months. They Invited me to come in and talk about, you know, kind of personal finance and what I do. But what we really ended up doing, we were going into the summer and, and I asked all the students, I said, I said, before you can invest, you got to make money. I said, what are you guys going to do this summer to make money? So they all went around. It was really fun, Eric, to hear the kids talk about, oh well, like I'm going to play at my parents restaurant, like play music and I get tips. You know, my son went out and started like a power washing and a dog walking business in the neighborhood. And you know, it was really cool to hear that. But my advice to them was as you get older, pick something that you can make, you know, be successful financially and you know, either a career or a business. And I think a lot of, you know, as you were mentioning, you know, a lot of physicians that are out there are also business owners and do that. And that's kind of like the, it's kind of like the dirty, the dirty secret of investing, which is, well, you got to make money before you can go out there and invest and do that. And that just, that just comes down to hard work. So yeah, if you've done that hard work and you've put all that time in, you know, you know, your, your group helps physicians, business practice owners figure out, hey, how do I keep as much as possible and then really build this bulletproof financial fortress.

I think that's, that's spot on. You know, one of the print, I think the basic principles you were talking about, if everyone understands, I think these three keys, you got to know how to acquire money for sure. How to, how to go get it, how to control it, I think is where people fall down and then how to invest it. And if you know how to master those three skills, you really shouldn't have any problems with money. But yet, you know, here we are in society right now where I think 75% of Americans live below what, $70,000.

Yeah.

So the education component is definitely missing.

Yeah, I love that. And you've written, you've written a ton of books. You know, I want you to share a little bit about that. But before we get to that and wrapping up here, I want to have a little fun, Eric. So, yeah, you know, the markets are at, you know, I would say, kind of crazy valuations right now. So, you know, are you having clients calling you and say, eric, I'm nervous about where the stock market is. You know, how do you, how do you coach your Clients through markets today. Tariff uncertainty, tax uncertainty, geopolitical uncertainty. You know, how do you comfort your clients and, and direct them back to that plan that you've built for them and what is some advice that you provide them during times like this?

To me, it. Any investing strategy needs to, number one, you have to have a strategy, and a lot of people don't. I mean, I just looked at someone's balance sheet the other day. It was a brand new client. And I'm just looking at everything that they own. And they got like, I, bonds and they got this and they got that. And I'm like, this person clearly does not know what they're doing. They have no strategy. They're just throwing things up against the wall. Yeah, you have to have a strategy. Most importantly, you know, these big endowments, these big institutions, they all have what's called an investment policy. Policy are guidelines. These are rules of how you're going to invest money. Okay. And I think that every household should have, and sit down and have a really simple investment policy. Okay. And that would, I think, eliminate a lot of the, what you were just talking about right there. The worry, the concern, the anxiety and all those things. If I know, okay, I'm going to put money into this pot. Here are the characteristics of this pot. They're, they're. Prices are going to go up, prices are going to go down. But I'm not going to let the craziness of the world, which is their disadvantage, become my disadvantage. So I'm not going to respond to that when we start seeing the craziness. Another principle out of, you know, the intelligent investor right there. So I think having an investment policy is how we kind of navigate working with our clients. And it really does in this, you know, constant repetition of, all right, great. I know that your accounts are going up 10, 15, 20%. That's great. But this doesn't always last. And there's a reversion to a mean at some point in time. So just be prepared for that. I think if you handle that with repetition and, you know, our, our service models, we're talking to our clients at least every six weeks. So there's constant communication right there.

Yeah.

So I think just a combination of those, there's not, there's not a perfect answer to it. Emotions still get involved. People still see, you know, all the, just like you said, geopolitical and, and it's like overwhelming. But, you know, 99 of your financial condition is under your control, has nothing to do with external factors. What are you doing that that is going to dictate the outcome.

Yeah, that's why it's great to have that coach on the sideline as you're going out there. And you know, the, the, you know, I think of it like my boys play lacrosse right now and you know, the games, you know, scores going up and down. But the coaches are always there kind of directing them back play by play by play and saying, hey, here's the playbook. This is the plan. This is what we're doing in this situation. Get out there, do your job and control what you can and do that. Eric, what is the best way for our listeners to learn more about what you do? Find out about your books, gain more information. I know you also have, you've got some great resources at your website, wealthforpracticeowners.com, which we're going to put in the show notes here. But what's the best way for people to get in touch with you and learn more about what you do?

That'd be a great way to do it. Well, for practice owners.com you can go to our, our website as well, just econologics.com and that'll take you direct our site and we have, we have assessments, we have books, we have all kinds of resources that if you're in the healthcare space, we got you covered on really anything that you would need to at least help you make good decisions when it comes to your money.

Yeah, I love it and I'm excited to, to be on your podcast here coming up. And I love the title Financial Beast.

That's right.

Yeah. So I'm excited there all that's on your website. Great. You've got to check it out. Check out the education hub@wealthforpracticeowners.com he's got articles, videos, webinars, trainings on there. Tons, tons of information there, as well as a financial scorecard. Eric, it's been great catching up with you today. Thanks for sharing your wisdom and advice with our audience here. And any last words?

Any last words? Well, I guess, what can I say? I don't know. I'm actually having a blank right now. You know, just. And you know what? I think people need to enjoy themselves in their. Don't be someone that looks at money as something that you need to hoard. I think it's something that you can use as a tool. And I just want, I want people to be able to enjoy themselves. And having a lot of money is something that allows people to enjoy themselves.

I love that. I love that. And I would say be grateful. You know, we live in such an affluent society. If you're, if you're listening to this podcast, you are probably in the top 1% of 1% of the world's population. And you know, thank you for listening, Eric. Thank you for sharing your knowledge again. I appreciate it. Hey Chris, here again. I hope you found this episode valuable. Now I have one more thing to gift you. We have a page for my coaching clients where you can get a free copy of my book as well as much more from previous guests on the show. Just check out nextlevelincome.com coaching to get a free copy of my book, audiobook and much more. I'll send you a copy of my book and cover all the shipping costs as a thank you for listening to the podcast. Also, please like share and take just 90 seconds to give us a rating on Apple Podcasts.