3 Secrets to Integrating Your Psychedelic Transformation

Welcome, soul healers, to the Heart Led Soul Fed podcast. I'm psychic medium and old soul Christine J Gold. This is a safe space to explore all things mystical and magical, embodying practical spirituality and truly reclaiming who we are at a soul level, living this lifetime heart-led and soul-fed. Subscribe on your favorite way to podcast and let the healing begin.

Hi, I'm Susanna Rose Stokes. I am a lead facilitator and co-founder of Metamorphosis Ventures. Metamorphosis Christine J Gold is a collective of organizations that is designed to help you remember your full power and to remember truth. And ultimately what our goal is, is to create spaces that allow you to fully open into everything that you are meant to be. I learned through all of these experiences that Our world needs a lot more space for you to be your full self and to express all of the emotions, the traumas, the feelings of stuckness to let you grow and expand. At Metamorphosis, we have retreats, we have coaching programs, we work with sacred plant medicines that are deeply special to us in our community. And we do it for you so that you can be the version of yourself that you know you are.

Hello, welcome, beautiful souls. Welcome to episode 277, season 5. And yes, that was just a little intro to our guest today, but I'd like you to do all those those wonderful things. Uh, let me know where you're tuning in from if this is your first time joining. If you're on the replay, say hello, let us know where you are in the world, and do all those wonderful things— share, tag, and comment. And yes, today is about Metamorphosis: The Three Secrets to Integrating Your Psychedelic Transformation. And I'm going to welcome in our guest, Susanna Rose Stokes. Thank you so much for being here.

Thank you for having me, Christine. It's really wonderful to be here with your beautiful audience.

Thank you so much. So yeah, we did a little intro on, um, I, I guess that would be your, your dream. I call it like a Moby Dick, your big whale that's already happening, that retreat center. That's something that we have in common. So if you just want to introduce yourself just maybe a little bit more, I know you're you have energy priestess and you have all these other modalities, but there might be something that sparks something for someone else.

Yeah, um, I started my life off as a Marine Corps officer, my career off as a Marine Corps officer, and, and after going to war, I had a spiritual awakening that led me into working with plant medicines and very quickly realized that it was actually a modality that, that I worked with, um, you know, in past lifetimes, in this one. And through that spiritual awakening process, um, and the integration of it, I, with two of my really beautiful, powerful sisters, founded Metamorphosis Ventures and House of Embodied Metamorphosis, which are organizations that are dedicated to transforming human experiences. We work with lots of modalities. Plant medicine is one, energy healing, and plenty of emotional and empathic empowerment as well, much like, much like what you do.

Wonderful. And I couldn't imagine what it would be like to be in the Marine Corps as a woman.

I have never been one to choose the easier path. I'm definitely here on a soul mission to really expand. And as in that journey, it requires going into some places that are really uncomfortable. So, but at the time, it was my dream. I knew I wanted to be in the Marine Corps since I was 4 years old and watched my older brother graduate from boot camp. And I went to the Naval Academy, and a lot of this was around becoming the kind of leader that I expected my father wanted me to be. And he was the representation of sort of the culture around me. And then stepping into the Marine Corps, I confronted the sort of depths of patriarchal belief systems and things like that. And also came out with some of my dearest mentors and dearest friends and partners even. So it was both a blessing and a deep challenge, and I'm really grateful for, for that period of time in my life.

Yeah, especially while being empathic as well, I'm sure. Maybe you want to speak to that a little bit. I mean, being in, in war and different culture, um, I mean, how, how did you, how did you manage that?

Yeah, it's interesting because at the time I don't think I knew that I was empathic. I didn't understand that about myself, and I'd created a lot of structures around my heart space. I'd call them walls, emotional walls that were really protecting me from being— from feeling hurt and feeling pain. And I was sort of the little badass that was like, I can do anything and I can, you know, take on any any issue when I can. And, um, over time, when I was confronted with misogyny a few times— and to be honest, there were very few sort of open, direct misogynists in the Marine Corps. Most, most of the guys are a little more subconscious about it, right? They don't know, uh, that they're being that way. But there are only— there are a few that I encountered that were really didn't like women in leadership roles. And that hit me pretty hard because I'd never experienced, up until that point, I'd never really experienced targeted discrimination against me because of something I couldn't control. And caused— and then I went to war and was in Afghanistan and was in a unit where the misogyny was just a little more like a boys' club. It was a little more unconscious. Sort of exclusionary. And I realized that, uh, that's when I started to realize how sensitive I was. And that's also when I lost faith, faith in God, and lost my faith almost entirely and became pretty atheistic or agnostic and completely disillusioned and lost my sense of reality for a while.

Two things jump out. I want to ask about your spiritual awakening. How did that— what was the— it's always the catalyst. There's something, either an NDE or abuse tends to be up there as well. Uh, what was your spiritual awakening? What was that pivot point? I call, I call it.

Yeah, yeah. There, there definitely are so many ways that we can step into the awakening journey, um, and I'm— it's, it's a delight to see different people's versions of that. And mine was, uh, mostly facilitated by, by plant medicine as a result of probably lots and lots of trauma and abuse that, that led up to that. And then once I was kind of cracked open, there was no putting the egg back in the— the yolk back in the egg, right? Like, it was just a cracking open. And my, um, the, the primary medicine that, that did that for me was bufo, which is 5-MeO-DMT. And, um, 5-MeO is, is known to be a very powerful medicine, and my experience with it was quite difficult. And actually, it's— I think kind of perfect for this conversation because we're talking about integration. And my integration of bufo was very, very challenging, and I felt like I didn't have the support I needed. And, but, but a couple weeks or about a month after that, I was on a journey with LSD that was more recreational. And it was in that moment, coupled with the opening that I'd had with 5-MeO, And of course, I didn't know. Nobody had said, hey, maybe you shouldn't go on other journeys with other medicines a month after you've been engaging with bufo. I had no clue because there was no, you know, there's no like handbook for this stuff really. And, uh, and yet it was a beautiful journey. And I had— I was meditating on the top of a sort of hill mountain in California and experienced a whole download of the universe, kind of like a tornado of energy that said exactly why I'm here, who I am, why I am a perfect amalgamation of my parents. And it showed me the perfection of who I am and what, what I'm here to do. Yeah. And then that really— that process, like, it's like, oh, okay, great, thank you.

Thank you. That's a blueprint.

Now what do I do with it, right? And that's where the integration piece came in.

Yeah, so you got your— well, people get downloads, awakening. I mean, there's so many. Everybody has different languaging. Uh, a blueprint. I love blueprint, but it has to be activated. So maybe you want to talk a little bit about all the different types of psychedelics. Like when you say bufo, what— yeah, for me I'm like, yes. I don't know.

I'd be so happy to. Um, yes, absolutely. So bufo is also 5-MeO-DMT. Um, and right now I couldn't tell you what the MeO part is, how to— what the actual chemical compound is, but dimethyltryptamine is, is the DMT piece. And 5-MeO bufo is— comes from toads, um, specifically the Sonoran— yeah, the Sonoran desert toad. So sometimes they say it's licking the toad, right? Um, And, and it's not— you really can't go and lick, by the way. Don't try that. It won't work that well because if you try to eat it, um, it's toxic to the, to the body system. So what they do is they will take the venom out of the cheeks, uh, of the toad in a very gentle way, um, and then they'll dry it out and it will become crystallized, and then you smoke that.

Gotcha.

In a particular pipe. Um, and then LSD, which many people know, right? Um, that is not, uh, one of— although that's in— it's technically on our, on our list, it's not one that we use as ceremonially, um, but is absolutely one that has facilitated some really beautiful awakenings and, and clearings for me. Um, psilocybin For many, many people know what that one is. That is the, the primary medicine that House of Embodied Metamorphosis works with, and that is mushrooms, right? So, um, and that comes in many different strains. The strain that we cultivate is called Trinity, and it's a subgenetic blend of 3 different other strains that are all psychoactive. And then, um, let's see if there are any— mescaline. Mescaline is the active ingredient in both peyote, which is the cactus that is native to North America, and peyote is utilized by the native people in North America and also very endangered and very protected by the native, the indigenous people of North America in their ceremonies. And then, San Pedro is the South American sort of equivalent, although they have very different energies in how they work in the body system. Yeah. And so those are, those are sort of the primary ones. There's plenty of other— of course, there's, you know, hundreds of plant medicines. These are the most psychoactive of them.

And I mean, I— we're, we're familiar with ayahuasca, which is totally— yeah, yeah. Which a lot of people Well, when I was in Peru, seemed to be trendy, and then they found out what actually happens or what they actually have to prepare for, like detox, and then like, oh, that's too hard, I'm out.

Ayahuasca requires a dieta in preparation for, and also, as I learned somewhat the hard way, following, because really after your ayahuasca work, which I also, I did my ayahuasca work down in Peru in, in the jungle. Um, afterward, your body is hypersensitive to anything that is, that is out of alignment with that medicine. And it's also an MAOI inhibitor, so there are very particular things that are contraindicative. So it needs to be cared for very carefully in, in your preparation, even like not eating citrus and things like that. So, but psilocybin, mescaline, you know, we can cleanse the body system a little bit before. Same thing with bufo, but those don't have the same contraindications with diet. And so, that's why ayahuasca is really quite a journey. It's usually, you know, a 30 to 60-day experience if you properly engage with her.

Mm-hmm. Yeah, absolutely. Um, so what are the 3 secrets to integrating your psychedelic transformation? I mean, you know, I mean, growing up when you heard psychedelic, for me I was like, oh, those hippies in the '60s, right? Yeah, there seemed to be some judgment for sure, and then fear, and then, oh, that's not for me, I'm not a druggie. There seemed to be a lot of labeling that went on there and misinformation.

I mean, it's, it's still there because I can tell you that, like, working up to— I, I was completely substance-free other than alcohol because the military loves, loves their alcohol. Oh yeah, I was— yeah, that's, that's the drug of the military. Um, I was completely substance-free until I got out of the military when I was 27, 28 years old. I had never— I had, I hadn't had cannabis Not a thing in my body system.

Oh, wow.

And so I was absolutely terrified of the concept of LSD because I'd been told that LSD would make you jump out of windows and that it would bond to your DNA and they could find it 20 years after you're dead. And all of these little sort of myths, some of which may be true, um, you know, that it changes you forever. And I was like, you know, now that I've sat with it, I'm like Well, yes, it does. But it doesn't change you in the ways that I think some of the fear-based narrative has been. So, so I completely understand that perspective. And also, as a veteran whose post-trauma has been really helped and healed by this, and I've watched so many of my brothers and sisters from both the military and also just from my community heal with these medicines. I've come to recognize the difference, in my opinion, between drugs and medicines. And to me, these are true medicines that have been around for quite some time. And interestingly, ayahuasca is the newest of them all. She's really only been around for a few hundred years.

Okay.

And because she's a combination of two plants, of the chacruna plant and the ayahuasca vine. And so the combination of those was a very particular— there's a brewing process that some shaman had to like download and, and, and understand because the plants don't even grow in the same area of the jungle. So it's completely like unreasonable that ayahuasca even exists, um, if you think about it logically. But psilocybin has been around for quite literally billions of of years. Um, and so, um, that's one reason why, you know, why we, why we work with, with psilocybin, because she's an oldie and a goodie.

Yeah, I mean, I love mushrooms, period. So being vegan, I— yeah. And, and my sister is— she's a little more versed, and we've had some mushroom tea, and I've tried some CBD. I tried THC, but I tried way too much. It was not a good experience. And my son laughed at me and he said, Mom, you've got to make sure you take the right amount and you need to make sure you have someone with you.

Oh, this is so powerful. And kudos to your son, he knows how to do it. And THC, you know, I'll say two things about this. First is that THC in my world, um, and my body, especially as an empath, a highly sensitive being, THC is the most disorienting of all the medicines.

I would agree. I was a babbling fool up to all hours at night. I couldn't move. I felt heavy. It was so weird. Anyways, yeah.

And, and I've had experiences like that with THC too. And, and so it's interesting because we get a lot of people who come to us and they'll, they'll have some fear around going into the journey. And I'll say, well, what are your experience— what's your experience with plant medicine. And they'll say, well, you know, I've, I've done cannabis, I've done— I've smoked weed, and sometimes I smoked a little too much, and then I paired it with alcohol. And I'm like, oh no. Like, I understand why they have this fear, because THC, and especially in the ways that it's cultivated now, um, THC can really take you to places that are, um, that are both dark and also out of control. While psilocybin, I found, can also— there is the possibility of what people would call a bad trip. I think a bad trip is really just an incomplete trip. We can talk about that.

That's funny, I like that.

But the, um, but essentially it doesn't take you to these places of, of total out of control the way that, the way that cannabis does. And also what your son said was so accurate because what we talk about is set mindset, the intention with which you are sitting with the medicine, knowing that it's a medicine, right? And it's going to do some work on you. Setting, which is the environment that you're in and the people that are around you, who you have near you that's holding that space. And then dosage and knowing that all three of those match each other, right? If I'm going to a concert, for example, Maybe I do a little microdose of psilocybin, and that's just enough because it's going to be a very stimulating environment. I don't want to take a macrodose if I'm going to a highly busy populated event that is uncertain, right? So that's just one, one example of how to, how to keep those things in mind when you're on your journey.

Yeah. And then we're going to circle back to a bad trip is an incomplete trip.

Yeah. Um, yeah, this is such a big topic because there are lots of people who will say, well, what about a bad trip? And usually I ask, well, you know, what's your definition of bad, of a bad trip? And they're like, well, I'm uncomfortable, I feel feelings that I don't like and they don't stop, I usually feel like I can't get out of it, I'm looping. And my experience as a facilitator is that people— we almost always go into some experience of that, but that experience gets to be temporary if you are in the right environment, if you have the right dosage, and you have the right facilitation, either tools or facilitator, to help you move through whatever that is. Because really, that's just a block. That you're facing, we call it a gate in our work. So you get to the gate, the resistance gate, and you have all the resistance. You're like, "I don't want to go there. I don't want to think about that. That's in the past. We're not going there." And so what happens is the medicine will loop you around until you face it. And if you don't face it before the medicine completes, like before it's over in your system, then the whole experience was just the medicine saying, this is what you need to look at, and our system saying, no, I don't want to, I don't want to do that. I don't look at— I don't want to look at that. I don't want to look at that. So it's really a result of resisting the potential healing that the medicine is trying to do. And when you sit with a facilitator, the chances are much higher that, A, you'll have the right environment and dosage to get you into a place like that. And then you'll have the facilitator and the tools to move you completely through, so that on the other side you feel that sense of, ah, oh yeah, okay, yeah, I did it. And that's when you get the, like, upswing, and suddenly it's no longer a bad trip. It was just a temporary challenge.

Yeah, I love that. And I had asked the community if anyone's ever done psychedelic psychedelics, if they had questions. Um, and we were just talking about cannabis, so Brandy might want to go back. Yeah, and have a look.

Yes, definitely.

And that's, uh, one of my, uh, while she graduated, one of my students. But, um, yeah, I feel it's really, like you just said, really important to have a supportive team and to help people go there. Because I hear it a lot, I don't want to go there. So why do you think people don't want to go there?

I mean, I think you and I probably have very similar experiences when someone's like, um, especially for those of us like you who holds that energy of transformation, right? And you're like, that's why I'm in your life, is to help you, like, help you move through this. And that's a very powerful energy to hold. And it can be really uncomfortable because most of us fear change. Change is programmed into our body as dangerous, as risky. And so most of us are still living in that survival realm, which is the physical body system. And in my world, you know, the body keeps the score, right? So the body is just a memory bank for all the ways that we have done it. And those are the ways that are safe. And even though they may have been uncomfortable, I know that way won't kill me, so I'm going to do it that way. And I'm going to keep doing it that way until Christine comes into my life or Susanna comes into my life and we say, "You got to move. You got to move out of this. You got to move out of this pattern." But that facing of the edge, I sometimes think of it like a trust fall off a cliff.

Yeah.

It feels that way. It feels like I'm standing at the back of a cliff or at the edge of a cliff and I just have to fall and trust that either the facilitator or the universe or God or myself, something is going to catch me on the other side. And that's a really big decision to make. Um, so I don't take it lightly. And also, I am definitely the one that's standing there going, okay, I'm gonna push you, Jess.

Yeah, that's me too. And I feel like there's a lot of people— and I will say this, when I started, yeah, I did all my readings and healings and I wanted to heal the world, but then I soon realized that's not possible. That is an ego mindset, wanting to heal the world. And I get it, we're excited, but as you start transitioning into coaching, into mentorship, when I put people through a 6-week— and I'm sure you've seen this— they're like, amazing, sky's the limit. And then something happens in their life, crash. So what I now extending is at minimum 12 weeks for sustained change and transformation, and to go, okay, I— that's my old life. No, that's me anymore. And I see these wounds and all these things coming up, triggers, traumas. I've already dealt with that. I'm good. So 12 weeks, 6 months, 1 year. Honestly, I feel the 1 year is the biggest transformation.

Yeah.

And I want my clients to leave the nest, you know, little baby birds, whatever you want to call them, right?

That's how, that's how you know you're successful. Like, you're like, bye, I'll never see you again.

And that's what I want. But, you know, I'm going to hold myself to account that there, there are some people, some of my clients that have slid back, but I feel like they're too scared to. What would you say to people that are too scared to? You know, in that Hero's Journey, Joseph Campbell? Yes, same idea.

Oh, that, that innermost cave, um, where, where the elixir lives, like, that's where it is. I just posted something recently on my social media that said, the path to your power is through the parts of yourself that you avoid.

Ooh, I love that. That's a quotable. Yeah.

That's it right there. That is where your power is. That's where your purpose is. It's all in those places where you don't want to look because it's under the bed and there might be some monsters in there. And what's interesting is, of course, once we turn the light on, we realize it's just, you know, there's no monsters. It's all love. It's all me. And so I suppose if there's anything I could say is that, A, getting comfortable, and this is, I think, where also some of our secrets to integration are going to be helpful, but A, getting comfortable with the uncomfortable, knowing that pain is a notification and pain is temporary. Very true.

Yeah, that just like instant gratification, there's so much of it out there.

There's so much, right? Because we live right now in a very indulgent time. I think some of that is a result of, you know, being in the Dark Ages for a long time. So we're all like, I need every fuzzy pillow I can possibly get. Make it comfortable because I'm so uncomfortable inside. And that's okay. I, I do— I believe in comfort, and there are containers in particular places and moments, temporary times, when it's okay to feel a certain amount of pain, not to re-traumatize or not to cause more damage, but simply to go into the place that's hurting, kind of like surgery, right? And cut the thing out, and then, and then you can heal. So I, I definitely say, um, that. And then on— and then the second piece is that what you ultimately find when you go into those places of shadow, of darkness, of scary, of whatever it is that you don't want to see— after you see it and you have compassion for those parts of yourself, you realize how much you love yourself. And that's deepest and the most powerful form of love I think anyone can have. And so it's worth it. That's what I would say to those clients is it is so worth it to stay with yourself in those moments when it's really hard. Know that it's temporary, and know that it is so worth it on the other side.

Love it. I'm gonna have so many sound bites. No, I love going back because a lot of times when you're on the show, you don't— I mean, you're listening, but then when I go back and I'm like, oh wow, oh, that hit, that hit, that hit. So thank you for all of that. Um, lovely Brandy, such a power. She says, I have too much trauma in my life to do that. What would you say to Brandy?

That is such a powerful point. I say I totally hear you, Brandy, and I want to just like give you a big ol' hug because first of all, the fact that you are recognizing the trauma that exists in your life, especially if there is a lot of it, that alone takes courage. So if there's a lot in your life and you're not avoiding it altogether, right, that's strength. So you're like, whoa, I'm looking at all my trauma and this is like— I think of it, I use this metaphor of the family storage unit sometimes. Like you open the storage unit and you realize there's a whole lot more stuff in there than you thought. And then you start to go in and it's kind of like a Mary Poppins storage unit and then there's more and there's more and there's more. And you're like, oh no. And there's a total sense of overwhelm of how in the world will I ever get through all of this? And that sense of overwhelm is actually the first step to opening yourself to literally taking the first box and pulling it out and starting to go through it. And it's a step-by-step process. And this is actually why we're talking about integration today because my favorite part of working with both plant medicines and also just change, just the nature of change, is knowing that this idea of a big leap of like, "I'm just going to get a bulldozer in here and try to like clean out the whole storage unit at once." Heck no. This is a daily decision for me to go and spend 15 minutes cleaning the storage unit and then I'm going to come back again and I'm going to do a little bit more tomorrow. And each day it'll get a little bit cleaner. And then in a month I'll be like, whoa, oh wow, I've made like a whole lot of progress. And then in 6 months, I've gone through, I've gone through half the storage unit, right? And then I start pulling my friends in and my coaches and my therapist and they start to help me with the really big stuff. That I can't do on my own. So that's what I would offer you in this, is this is not something that you have to, A, take on all at once, and B, take on all by yourself. You have a whole community of sisters to do that with you.

I love that. That's beautiful. And, and as you were describing, I mean, we— that's a compartmentalizing. You put— women are really good at putting boxes away and in our hearts and the la la la. Um, and then when you're talking about like the, the opening up, I thought of Storage Wars. Yes, the visual. I'm gonna bid on that. No, I want all that stuff. Oh my God, no, I don't want it. You can have it.

You're gonna have all that stuff. No thank you. Um, yeah.

And so, and she's also talking about that she wants to help people with, and I believe this is sexual abuse.

Mm-hmm. Well, one of my first introductions to supporting people in a sort of facilitator kind of way was I was a uniform victim advocate in the Marine Corps, which meant I helped survivors of sexual assault move through the process of advocacy and go to the doctors, and I basically was their advocate the whole way, and also was a survivor of assault myself. And so that— I do believe that, that for the things that you have gone through, this is where the, the wounded healer archetype— and I don't mean that in a negative way, like, we are, we, we are wounded— that is what creates the desire and the intention and the momentum toward helping others with that gift. So it is your power, right? It's, it's the place that— places that we avoid that, that really allow you to step into that power. So I think that's a perfect way. And the first step is to go through your own storage unit of stuff so that you know how to do that and you get a process for it and even a framework for it. And once you do that and you feel like you've gotten to a good place where you have like enough space in the storage unit, you can start bringing other people's stuff in. Then you should, you should absolutely reach out and start to support others.

That's lovely. Um, she's quite, she's quite engaged in this. Yeah, which I love. Um, I've been there. I've healed a lot just the last few years to heal.

Congratulations. That's beautiful.

And is there this conception that once we're healed, we're done?

I think that there are egoic attachments to the done.

Yes. And I'm like, thank you. Thank you.

You're not done until you're dead, friend. And even then, you're going to have some other stuff probably in the next life. So depending upon how you believe about it. Yes, uh, we do have attachments to being done or complete. I, I personally believe in completion of certain cycles. Like, if we enter into a lifetime with a particular karmic cycle that's got a certain frequency, a certain emotional experience, we can complete that cycle and then move on to the next layer of that. Um, but that doesn't mean that once you're done with that, you're just done. Done.

Yeah, and I'm not implying on anyone, I just— I see it online a lot. Why is this happening to me? Oh my God, I thought I was done dealing with this. Why does it keep coming? Like, we love to do the why. So it's, it's not, not personal, honey. No, it's just come back around to see if you're like paying attention and, and going— being, you know, sucked into it, or you're going, oh, I see you. You're that old friend I used to have. Well, no longer.

That's so funny. I just used that phrase with a woman that I talked to before this. She was talking about imposter syndrome and she's like, yeah, and then imposter syndrome came up again. I was like, oh girl, I was like, you know, you're good friends with imposter syndrome. I was like, that's an old— y'all are old buddies.

I love that. I love the synchronicity of this conversation.

I see this as a spiral, um, the, the, the path of enlightenment, right, is this spiral that we go through.

And yes, and it should be— it, it is up. If it— if you find you're going this way, then you need to kind of recalibrate.

Definitely. But the spiral goes back on itself, right? So I can go— I will be in quote unquote the same place, but vertically I'm up. So it's the same, maybe the same situation. It might be a karmic loop but if I've progressed, like you said, then I'm now at a different layer. I can see the problem from a different vantage point. So I'm having a whole different experience of the same thing that happened before. And those little moments can, if you allow them, I think, give you a lot of confidence in, in your process and your progress.

Absolutely. And then, well, This is interesting because I'm almost completed my, um, certification as a coach. So my big thing is I went to see therapists for years and never got anywhere. Yeah. And then Brandy's talking about how her therapist doesn't believe me.

Yeah.

What would you— what would be your advice to that?

If you get the sense that your therapist or the person that's working with you doesn't believe you, then I don't foresee there being forward movement in a trusting relationship there. I'll just say it that way because it doesn't feel like— if they are, if they're saying or they're giving you the impression that they don't believe what you're saying, then how is— how could you trust them? To show up to hold space for you, right? That doesn't necessarily mean that they're wrong or right or anything. It's just that relationship is no longer trusting because to me, a therapist or anyone who's here to help you needs to be in belief that whatever you're experiencing, you're experiencing. That's your truth. That's your experience. That's what you're going through. That doesn't mean that they may be able to have another perspective where they say, "Hey, let's get you out of this vantage point and get you up to that next level, right? Because I see it from a different perspective and I can help you see it from there." But that's uplifting, right? That's an uplifting spirit of, "I believe you and here's another way of seeing this." And I think that's actually what a coach and/or therapist does in a lot of ways. Is to help you see it from another perspective and to get out of the stuckness. But if they are just straight up saying, I don't believe you, then the trust is broken and the likelihood of you trusting them to support you is, uh, is probably nil.

So absolutely. I, I, as I like to say, next. You know, it's like finding the right doctor that will listen to you.

Oh yeah.

Right? Just because they're a doctor doesn't mean they're in alignment with your values and who you are.

And sometimes we grow out of alignment, right? Whatever that therapist or that coach could support you in for that period of time, they've served their purpose. And now the contract or that particular work is complete and you've gone through a cycle with them. And now it's time to move on to someone else who has different skills and different tools, um, to take you deeper into that storage unit. So that may be— it may just be as simple as that, right? That, that they're like, I just don't have the skills or the tools for this. That's okay.

Very true. Which, I mean, I have a lot of modalities, but if I feel ill-equipped, I will recommend them to somebody else. I will refer them. I will pass them on because I want them to heal. I want them to succeed. I want them to be empowered. I want them to be like, oh my, wow, I am— my life is transformed. Because in this world of information, we don't want your information, we want the transformation.

I will— like, that's a, that's a good sound bite right there.

Yeah, yeah. Okay, who's marking this down? No, I'm kidding.

Yeah, right, it's like, write that down.

Uh, Brandy is again, I think you kind of talked about this, but how to stop the cycle.

I mean, on some level, the, the cycle of life and the cycle of your, your spiral will never end, right? So there, that is part of the contract you sign up for when you choose to be a human and go into the human experience. There will continue to be a cycle. So making friends with the cycle rather than resisting it can be helpful because then you won't, um, yeah, feel trapped. But stopping the cycle of a karmic cycle, which I would consider to be like a loop— so if I'm in the spiral, right, and I, I stay on the same level and I keep going around the same circle, that is what we would call a karmic loop.. And a lot of people right now especially are in karmic loops. Um, and I personally believe— you mentioned at the beginning that I, I refer to myself as an energy priestess. I believe that the priestess frequency and people who are called to be priestesses are here to help people get out of karmic loops. I believe that's like what— that's like the whole lineage of being a priestess is. And so I would recommend finding someone who is a priestess, uh, whatever their version of that is. It can be emotional, it can be, yeah, heart-centered, it can be energetic, um, whoever you're drawn to. Generally a woman, doesn't have to be a woman, there are men who hold that frequency too, um, and are leaders in a divine feminine way and are generally heart-centered facilitators or healers. And what they can do is take a really deep look at what pattern is repeating itself in your life and then help you take the steps to get unstuck. And that does require commitment and discipline to actually making the change no matter how uncomfortable it is. And knowing that the pain is— the pain of the transformation is temporary. So yeah, that, that's what I would recommend.

Love that. And, and trust. You have to have a, you know, an undeniable trust. And, and really, that's, that's the most— trust in yourself and just trust in the universe, the process, that it's going to work out for your highest best, highest good. It's true. I, I love the dog chasing its tail analogy when it comes to karmic loop because it makes it fun, and then you can look and laugh and go, yeah, that's what I'm doing. Ah, um, because if we can't laugh at ourselves, then we're taking life way too seriously. So, um, I, I agree, that's something I am working on more and more every day. So, um, gosh, anybody else have questions? Um, I know that, uh, at the beginning, or the podcast forum, I always ask my guests a couple questions. I already asked you, what does magic mean to you? But I really— I'm feeling more called to, how can we as a collective energy help make your dreams come true? Your dreams.

Oh, my dreams. Oh my goodness. Um, gosh, what a beautiful— what a beautiful request. Ever since I was a little girl, I would wish, I would make my birthday wish world tolerance. Not world peace, but world tolerance, because for me tolerance is this ability to to just allow other people to be as they are and to be as nonjudgmental about them. And in order to do that, I believe now, now that I'm older and have gone through this process of tolerance within myself, it really is compassion, right? It's about— and that's actually the third. So the 3 of our integration techniques are clarity, consistency, and compassion. We talked about consistency a lot. And clarity to see this, the storage unit of things that you've got. But the compassion piece is having compassion for all of those parts of yourself that you don't want to see or seem icky or nasty or mean or manipulative or whatever parts of yourself that you think are wrong. They are not. And the more you can do that for yourself, the more if I'm, you know, if I end up in your world or if I meet you on the street or if we end up, you know, in line at the coffee shop, the more I know that you'll be tolerant of me when I'm in front of you too because you have given tolerance and compassion to those parts of yourself and grace. So that really is like, that's our last, you know, that's the final integration technique and it's a daily practice. So that would make my dreams come true, my little girl dreams, no joke. And my birthday wishes is if everyone could learn how to really be truly and deeply tolerant and compassionate of themselves.

Oh, that's beautiful. Thank you for sharing that. And you've got kind of like a rainbow prism ism going on in your screen. I love that. I know, of course, I notice light shots all the time. So wow, I mean, we are light, right? Um, as we wrap up, is there anything else you would like to share with, uh, with us or anyone else that's listening, or if they'd like to work with you, anything like that?

Yeah, absolutely. Um, so Metamorphosis Ventures is our coaching organization that houses all of our for-profit coaching work, and we have facilitators that we train in-house to help facilitate your integration process, basically. Oh, this light is so bright. I love that. Um, and then House of Embodied Metamorphosis is our ministry. It's our 508 faith-based organization that allows us to serve plant medicines legally within the United States. And so those of us who are founders are also ministers of that organization and quite literally are priestesses in that work. And so I'd love for you to either visit our website, which is metamorphosis.ventures, and learn about both of those organizations. Join— we do have a WhatsApp group, which I can share with you, Christine, that is open to people. That's an announcement thread that people can join so they can see what we're up to. And then, and then, yeah, follow us on Instagram. I'll send Christine all those, all those links, @EmbodiedMetamorphosis. And then if you are in a place of being ready to transform in a very powerful, potent container, we have a method that's called the Metamorphosis Method. That's 8 weeks And the middle of that is an on-site retreat. And we're doing a lot of women's work lately. It's not all women's work, but, but we are really focusing on that because the divine feminine is rising and here she comes. So if you want a community of really magnificent human beings, um, not far from this beautiful, this beautiful community that you've built, Christine J Gold. Um, we're here, we're here for you, and we would love to have, um, to have you at any one of our sessions, uh, at any time. And you're also welcome—

you're— yeah, sorry, go ahead.

You're also welcome— I sometimes just give my personal email because if someone has a question, I want them to ask, you know, directly. And so my personal email is susannah@metamorphosis.blog. Adventures.

Perfect. And I have most of those links in the description as well, but if anybody is— can't find it, or just ask in the comments, we won't leave you hanging. All right, well, thank you so much. And you're in— did you say North Carolina?

Yes, I am in the Blue Ridge Mountains right outside of Asheville right now, and it is a gorgeous, gorgeous sunset kind of time right at the moment. Really nice.

Perfect. Oh, lovely, lovely. Well, thank you so much for being here. I appreciate you. And, uh, everyone, uh, just a little bit of housekeeping. If you would like to join our Soul Healers Community, this is online. And yes, my Moby Dick big dream is— big whale of a dream is our Soul Healers Retreat Center, which is coming. You'd like to join our 1-year mentorship and private community as well, there is the Dark Night to Light. That's your 12 Weeks to Transformation. Uh, this one comes up quite a bit as well: Empath and Narcissist Heal the Power Struggle Forever, because really that's what that is. Um, I also do March energy updates. You have to join my YouTube channel for that. And I just did this video on 5 Tips to Becoming Bullyproof, and I've had so many comments and feedback. I, I'm blown away. I'm just blown away, you guys. Uh, as well, if you're wanting to take my free empath, uh, course or a quiz, my free Empath Empowerment Quiz, you can scan, scan the QR code right there. Take your phone, take a picture. Um, if you need the link, it'll be in the links below. But, uh, I want to thank, uh, everyone for being here. I want to thank Susanna Rose as Well, um, beautiful soul. Um, I learned a ton. I'm definitely going to go down the— more down the psychedelic, uh, route because that's where I'm being called, um, for my evolution. For, you know, just because I coach people and heal people does not mean I don't have things that I need to work on, clearly, right? I am always open about that. So, um, thank you so much for being here. I'm sending you all lots of love. Take care of yourself.