In this panel, moderator Chrystal Hurst talks with Liz Curtis Higgs and Nicki Koziarz about navigating deep personal loss and chronic illness. Liz shares the trauma of losing three brothers and her husband’s parents within three years, describing how grief pulls her family together and how she finds moments of joy even amid sorrow. Nicki reveals her mother’s battle with brain cancer, describing the daily emotional toll and the privilege of walking alongside a loved one in suffering. Both women emphasize that true comfort comes from God’s faithfulness, prayer, and the presence of a supportive community. They discuss practical ways to encourage others—simple gestures like a text, a prayer, or sharing a blog post about what not to say at funerals—highlighting how small acts of love can sustain people through hardship. The conversation underscores that suffering often deepens spiritual growth, that joy can be found in acts of service, and that a network of friends, family, and church members functions like a layered “pyramid” of encouragement.
Chapters
Okay, I'm curious. You are a great encouragement for people because of your personality and your joy. Like you said, you can just walk into a room that does not have it and bring joy. You can inject joy into that situation. But I'm curious, when you're having a bad day— actually, I want to know if I can ask, um, what are bad— what are an example or two of what have been bad days for you? Because you are always, you know, and, and what helps you? What injects, or who, what is, what does your environment or your circle look like that helps you in your days?
Well, sure, of course I have days that are hard. In the last 3 years, I've buried all 3 of my brothers and my husband's mom and dad. And he's an only child. So that's 5 very close to me deaths in 3 years. It's been hard. And some I know I will see in heaven, some I don't know if I will see in heaven. So you don't even have that deep, deep, deep comfort. So sure, I mean, troubles come my way just like they do everybody else's. Um, but for me You press through. And it doesn't mean that you don't feel. You feel your feels. You cry. It's pulled our family together in an unbelievable way, which is a kind of a beautiful, you know, fruit from a very sad situation. But even in the midst of sorrow, there's always going to be some joy. And people always have it harder. I mean, that is a tragedy to think about all those losses. But none of them were my children. Do you know what I'm saying? I mean, there's—
there's always something.
There's always somebody I know who has a much more painful burden to bear. Health things. I've got a friend who has stage 4 cancer and has for 3 years. She's lost 100 pounds, and this is a woman who was small to begin with. So she's this tiny person. Everything hurts. She can't— I mean, just watching her just getting up every day. And she puts on— I just love this woman— she puts on makeup and does her hair and dresses up every day, even if she never leaves the house or anyone sees That's a level of commitment to life. That's why she's still alive after 3 years. Most people wouldn't be. But she keeps me going. She keeps me thinking about what really matters. And life matters. And we get the promise that when this life ends—
we get more.
We get more. The last breath here is the first breath there. And oh, oh, oh, baby, we will not look back. We won't look back. There just won't be any sorrow. He wipes away every tear. Don't you love that? That he wipes away every tear and there is nothing but joy. Nothing but joy on the other side. So, you know, there's a lot to be grateful for.
So good.
Okay, so I'm wondering, I'm thinking about you right now.
As she's talking, it made me cry.
It's okay, you can cry. I got tissue somewhere in here. So as you're listening to Liz, how does that resonate with you? Because I know we were talking about when you know those things, but in the moment of carrying those things, it can still be difficult.
Well, my mom has brain cancer.
Ah.
And she's 62.
I'm 63, so right, I'm right there.
And it's the— I think it's the most painful thing in the world to watch somebody live this way. And you get to this place where you don't know how to live when somebody else is not living. And I think, I think what God— like every— like it's almost one of these like seasons where every day you wake up and you're like, "Oh my God, please nothing else today." Like, right? Yes. And so walking through this though with her, it is a privilege.
I can bet.
It is such a privilege to walk through somebody with this. And for so long I have been a runner of all the hard things. I mean, I wrote a book about it.
Like, "Five Habits of a Woman Who Doesn't Quit," from the lady who likes to quit. I don't like hard.
Yeah. I don't like hard.
Absolutely.
Hardest thing I have ever walked through in my entire life. And it's not gonna get any easier anytime soon. I mean, it could go on for a couple more months. And God has taught me so much about just staying in the process with somebody because— and I've been pulled in so many different directions. And, you know, I kind of like— I feel like every day a ball is dropping, you know, somewhere in my life right now. But I try to not let the same ball drop every single day. So, you know, it's your turn, Paul. Yeah, it's your turn. It's your turn, Chris, sorry. It's your turn, girls, sorry. But in doing that, like, I've experienced a strength that only God can give me.
Only God.
And you don't know it until you go through something like this.
No, that's right. And I just want to affirm to you that the choice you're making to walk through this with your mother is the most important choice. All those balls can be picked up again later.
Yeah, absolutely.
Every one of them. But this one, it matters. I lost my mom when I was 23. And so I have a little sense of how hard it is when you're young and you're certainly not ready to say goodbye to your mother and the prognosis I suspect is not good. Right. So, Jesus. Peace, Lord. Just your peace. This is what we need. Peace that what she's chosen to do is the right thing to do, and it certainly seems so to me. I can be her mom here for just a minute. Same age. And think, first of all, how proud I would be to have this daughter. And how grateful I would be to have her walk through this with me. Give our Nikki strength, Lord. She feels it, and she knows it's from you. There's nothing easy about this. There's no platitude that's going to make it better. But your love does make it possible.
Thank you.
Bless your heart.
Mm-hmm.
Boy, Liz. Well, I just— oof. Yeah.
But see, this is the stuff like when we're on the other side, it's really easy to stand back and say, God was faithful. —But when you're there, and you can still say, "God is faithful." —This is it. —Despite what I'm seeing right now. It really— I mean, I just want anyone who's going through something like that to hear that.
—Yes. Yeah. Because He doesn't change. If He's faithful when you get to the other side, He's faithful through as well.
—And if He was faithful for you, He'll be faithful for me.
—That's right. He will. Because He doesn't change. Same God. Loves you that much. But, oh, the hardness of it. Is inescapable and it's a have to go through. It's not— you can't run. You can't run. There's nowhere to go except through. There's some comfort in knowing that your relationship with him will be deeper, but nobody signs up for that. You know, truly, I mean, we all— "Eke, suffering God, no!" I mean, we all want to have a deeper walk with God, but we somehow like it to happen through a Bible study. We wouldn't actually— not actually happen. Yeah, through the actual, through the valley kind of walking. But when I think about any growth point in my life, it has never come in the mountaintop. It has never come in the easy time. It's always in the hard stuff. I hate that. It's just true. So I hope, and I believe, you have— are surrounded by people who are linking arms with you and walking through through it. That's when we need our sisters desperately. Yeah.
Well, what I love so much about you and I, I mean, we live in two different states, and I don't know about you, but there are the people in my everyday life who know what's going on, and we have one kind of encouragement and circling the wagons. And then there are people who I may talk to them every blue moon, and it's, it's a different kind of download, and it's a different level and insertion of encouragement. And, you know, it's kind of like a pyramid. You've got people that, you know, may hit you this much, but when they do hit you, it's right, you know. And you got people that hit you this much, and then you got people who are in your everyday. And so, you know, I'm expecting that the people that are circling you in these different spheres, that they're encouraging to you. It doesn't change the fact that you've got to walk through through it, but I know that you've got lots of people who love you and who are praying for your family.
It does help just to know you're not alone.
That's the biggest thing. It is big. Like people, you know, people say crazy stuff when you're going through stuff like this and— Yes, they do.
You're just looking at him like, did you just?
Yeah, I wrote a blog post. Can we do something about that word?
I'm not a blog.
I'm a writer, I'm a speaker, I'm a columnist, I'm a blogger. Oh, it's just awful. But anyway, so, but I wrote a blog after my brother's funeral of things not to say at a funeral.
I'm gonna go retweet that. Yes. Even though it might have been a while.
Absolutely, you're welcome to it. Okay. Because people do try.
Mean well. They mean well.
But just saying, I don't know what to say, but I'm here. Yes.
Is so powerful. Or just being there. You don't have to say anything.
And both of you guys have so, even though like we're so far apart, both Winter has done has done that for me too. It comes at just the right time. Never underestimate the power of what one text message, one tweet, one anything. Yeah, I've learned that.
I've learned that when someone's on your mind, just let them know. You don't have to ask a question. You don't have to have an answer. You don't have to pray a holy prayer. I was thinking about you today. That's it. When people do that for me, it's like, I've cried. There was a lady at our church, She's a prayer warrior. That's what I know about her. I've never been to her home. She has been in our church for, gosh, at least 30 years. I know who she is, I know her family, I know where they serve. And I see her every week at our women's Bible study. But we don't interact all the time. I just, she's a part of the fabric of my long life, long-term life. And one day I was in the parking lot of Target, and I kid you not, I was sitting a little longer in the car having a conversation with Jesus about how no one— I just felt unseen. And I had been going through some things and I was like, no one's really— I just, I'm just, I feel very alone and I feel like no one's really seeing or realizing that what I'm going through is really hurting. It's really hurting. And as I was sitting in the car, and I rarely answer the phone when I don't know the number. You know, these days now, the telemarketers have your cell phone. I don't know how they do it. So my phone rang, I answered it, and it was her. And she said, "How are you doing?" And I was like, "Who is this?" Wow. And she said, I said, "I'm doing okay." I said, "How are you?" She said, "Well, you know, I was just sitting in my quiet time and couldn't shake your mind." Wow. "I couldn't shake your name out of my mind." Wow, wow, wow. And I said, "Lord, I've never talked to her. Well, I'll pray for her." And he wouldn't let it go until I called you. Wow. And I just, she didn't want anything. She didn't want to pray with me. She just said, "I just wanted you to know that you're on my mind."— that you are prayed for and that you are loved. Have a good day! Wow.
Wow. What that also lets you know is you are on God's mind. Exactly. And that is a beautiful and sweet truth. Wow. See, those kind of things— you asked me where the joy comes from— I'll be smiling about that story tomorrow. You know what I'm saying? It's just to see God at work in the teeny tiny ways that He works, the very specific, personal, meet your need right then, Only God can do that. The word coincidence, for the record, is not in the Bible. Mm-hmm.
