Staying Awake When Life Hurts

Starting. Okay, I think we're live now, um, you guys. Hi, it's Chrystal Hurst, and welcome back to another YouTube Live. Um, this is the Sister Circle Show Live, where I am joined by friends or people I want to be my friends to talk about things that matter. Um, I think the conversations that we have as girls, sometimes if we can take some of those conversations public and have them in a public forum, it's helpful to other people. And that's kind of what I wanted to do today. As many of you know, I am one of a— one person in a, in a great family that lost a great member of our family last week. Many of you know this already because you follow me on social media. And so if you follow me or Priscilla or Anthony or Jonathan, or Alina, or my parents, or my cousin, I mean anybody, then you know that, um, Winter died last week. I actually still want to throw up every time I say that. Um, but, um, one of the things that has been helpful for me has been, um, processing a lot with friends. And I'm talking about how I feel, crying when I need to cry. Shoot, I don't think I brought Kleenex in here.

Here you go.

Thank you. Um, and one of the friends who's been really great, um, in this season is my friend Heather, for a variety of reasons. And I wanted to not do today's YouTube for a variety of reasons. I thought, well, first of all, what, what am I going to talk about? Um, I just said on Instagram, um, on an Insta story that, um, today I was supposed to be talking to Wynter. I actually did not remember that until I just said it, like right before I said it last Monday or Tuesday. I've been trying to get her to do one of these with me for, um, the month, but the month of July, she and her family have been in the process of moving. So she was like, girl, I'm just not anywhere where I can do it. And she's like, I can't believe it, because she just launched a book. And she's like, I can't believe I have no time to actually market the book. She just had put out a new book called God's Girl Says Yes. She has a ministry to girls. And, you know, this is what we do. We're family. So we promote stuff and we talk about stuff. And I was like, great, you're easy. Can I just get you on YouTube? One Tuesday went by, another one went by, and we just couldn't make it work with her travel. So today was supposed to be her. She was like, yeah, I think, I think I can do it. Like, we'll be moving. And, um, so who else do you talk to when you're supposed to be talking to? So I wanted to talk to Heather because, um, I don't want to talk about whatever else I could have come up with. Yeah, life goes on, but not that fast. And, um, I wanted to kind of talk about, um, what are healthy ways to process hurt, because grief and sadness and mourning is basically a form of hurt. And I wanted to talk about what that means for you when you're hurting, but also what it means for you when people that you love are hurting, people that you care about. How, how do you help? Um, so that's what we're going to talk about today. And one of the other reasons why I was a little afraid to talk about it or even do it was because I thought, you know, you always worry about what people think. Okay, so she's just gonna jump back on, just keep going. But last Wednesday night at my church, if you haven't seen it, you can go to my church's YouTube page, just search for OCBF on YouTube. We were doing a question and answer series, um, at church, and it was the same thing. How are we just going to keep going? I mean, like, she had just died the day before, so it was like, how are we going to do this? Well, that particular night, the question was, you know, theology about God. What, what do you have trouble understanding about God? Well, I have a hard time understanding why in the world God would allow, um, at this time, at this time when, when my cousin and our family were moving and they were excited about new things in their life, like, why would he allow this tragedy right now? Like, now? Um, so we talked about it, and so many of you have told me that, um, you've watched it and it's been helpful. So many of you have shared it to say it was helpful to watch you guys process through this. Um, so I thought, okay, who cares about the one or two people that'll be like, that is so tacky. Um, I'm interested in having as much good come out of this as possible. And I think that me being slightly raw, very raw as a matter of fact, and talking to a friend where this topic is a topic we've already been having, so it's safe, and to invite you into that would be helpful. So for the sake of being helpful and for the sake of honoring Winter by talking about how much I love her, which is why it's so hard, that we would do it anyway. So, um, anyway, so I want to introduce you to my friend Heather. Many of you may already know her. She is the God-Centered Mom. We are blogging slash podcast slash real life friends. And, um, because we've talked about everything under the sun, um, I think there's something, Heather, that happens when you're in a Voxer group or when you're talking to people and you're not doing it face to face that gives you, um, freedom to be a tad bit more vulnerable. And then when you see them in person, you're like, they know stuff. But, uh, we've been friends for a long time, and the reason why I asked Heather to join me in this conversation is because she's not, um, a stranger to grief. I'll let her tell you a little bit about that, but I've walked with her, um, through a season of her own grief. And just recently she's had some epiphanies about what it meant, or maybe should have meant, to walk through that season well. And she has taken it upon herself, and I'm very grateful for that, to remind me of some things that I might not be aware of so that I do the same. So that I can do it well. So welcome, Heather.

Thank you for having me. I love you.

I love you too. So if I cry, what I do have on my desk are some Starbucks napkins. That's appropriate because, you know, there's that. I made it, I made a run this morning, and if I take a bite, there's that. So my oatmeal. So can you tell everybody kind of who you are, where they can find you if they don't know who you are, and then just share what your season of hurting— well, one of them anyway, right? What it looked like, your season of grieving, and why grieving well, hurting well, honoring a season of sadness, why that's so important to you.

So I'm Heather McFadden. I write and now I podcast over at godcentermom.com. I have 4 boys and a husband, Bruce. 2 years ago almost exactly, grief started being a thing for me. You know, you go through seasons and you haven't been to a funeral. I mean, you can't even remember when. And then it was just like an uncle who— a distant uncle. My parents flew in for that funeral. And then it was a longtime childhood friend took his life. And then it was my aunt. And my dad spoke at that funeral, and I got a flat tire on the way and was bawling. That I couldn't get there in time. 'Cause I just felt this pressure that I wanted to be there, not knowing that months after my dad would actually pass away, my mom would get breast cancer, they would move in with us, and he would get sick and was sick for about 3 to 4 weeks before passing. So it was really quick. Not as quick as Winter. I think there's something to that, losing someone quickly. Unexpectedly is really— I think we can't compare grief, but there is something that you have to recognize with that. And then taking care of my mom for a year and just then walking through— as of 2 weeks ago, a friend was in my wedding, a high school friend. Her 14-year-old was in a car accident and passed away. And then winter. I just— I have been to more funerals and been a part of more grief in the last 2 years than I think all the years before that. What's going on? The theories. But like you said, we don't know. We don't know. God, what are you up to? We don't know. Um, but I, I do know that I've learned grief is individual. We've talked like that. We say let everyone grieve in their own way. So even that beautiful thing, I mean, part of me was like, why'd y'all have to get up on stage like less than 24 hours after winter's dead. Like, my protection of you did not want you up there. But it was interesting to see. I mean, I have a family of 4 kids, and I could see in the 4 kids up there the different types of grief and the processing. And I think that that's a gift because there's everyone out there that could say, I'm more like Anthony, I'm more like Priscilla, I'm more like sweet Jonathan. And then there's Chrystal Hurst being the oldest child, just like your dad. I saw y'all both there and I thought they're the They just, they just, it helps them to keep going. It makes it okay to keep going. And so to not judge, like you said, whoever's going to be out there judging, okay, that's on them. That's their hoop. Uh, until you walk through something, you can't judge that person's processing. For me, I had to keep going. I had 4 kids. My mom was like still super sick with breast cancer. We didn't know if she'd survive. I had to take her to chemo and make sure she ate food and drank. So you just, you keep going in some places. And with young kids, it is hard because there's not space for grief. And I'm just now realizing that my grieving is starting after my mom has moved to Florida and now that I have space. And even in the fall, the boys will all be off to school, making space for that. But that's some of the things I've learned.

What do you think grieving well, honoring a season of sadness, what does it look like to do that well? And before you share that, tell the thing about that you were telling me the other day. So y'all, Heather, I don't want to tell too much because I want to save this for the part where we talk about how to help people, but you were in my kitchen. Um, a few days ago, and, uh, you were telling me about the way people used to grieve, like how one of the things that we used to do— can you talk about that and how what we do now is so different?

I mean, one thing that struck me right when I saw you was you were coming out from out of your car, and we have to be out in public, like going through the drive-through, and nobody knows. Nobody knows as you're getting your Starbucks all that you're carrying. But when you— my dad's favorite movie was It's a Wonderful Life, and, um, when his dad passes away, the guy in the movie wears a black band around his arm. There was physical signs that people knew around you, or, or the widow or widow would wear black for a season of time. There was an allowance that you could be sad, or give that person more grace visually that we don't get, right? But then when I went off—

I went off yesterday.

You did good.

When I ordered some fries and a Coke and they didn't have hot fries.

Okay.

They asked me to pull up and, um, this is dumb, but they asked me to pull up and I pulled into the numbered spot. And, uh, I just wanted some fries. I was hungry and it— and I just was wrestling even with the run through McDonald's going, that's not what you need right now. But it was like I'd already like done the whole wrestle. So when they made me pull up and then 15 minutes later it's McDonald's, I'm still sitting in the car. Let me tell you something, that, that poor little boy who came out to bring me my fries That poor little boy. I just like, Lord, just help him to know your love some other kind of way today. I screwed that up.

I know, and it would have been good if he would have known that you walked up and he would have known if I had a black band. Sad.

I like, she's on another planet today, you know? Yeah.

Yes, yes. And I think so many people are grieving in different ways. It's It's not even a loss of a person. It's a marriage. It's a job. It's—

yes.

And we, we go on Instagram, or we, we might say something because we're wanting to tell people, but the average stranger doesn't know. And there's— we've lost that bit of a community. But I think it was sharing with you is God gave me a gift before of a trip to Israel, um, where I was by myself with strangers, so I didn't have to be anything, and I could just grieve, and there was space. And it was my dad's favorite place. He talked about all the time, so of course God would send me there. Of course. Um, and I'm on the plane, I'm bawling, of course. But while I was on the plane, I had said, God, if you could just let me hang out with a rabbi for a little bit, that'd be really cool. Just learn a little bit more about the Jewish faith. And I sat next to one, and it was my 40th birthday, and so I just asked him tons of questions. And one thing I— he brought up was they had this word for the anniversary of the loss of someone, their own Hebrew word.

Mm-hmm.

And I said, oh, that's amazing. I love that y'all have that, because one way I'll tell you to honor the person who's lost someone is to put in your calendar on your phone that date. Unfortunately, I have calendars full of, this is when my friend's mom died, this is when my friend's dad died, this is when she lost her son, so that I remember and I think ahead and Um, so that's one way, but that was a thing. You, you honor them every year. And then he told me how they honored the person after, and I thought, oh my gosh, that would have been a dream. And that's what I told you about, that for 7 days the person grieving would stay in their house and they were required not to keep the law. For as much as men were required to find a group of men and pray this many times a day It was like, no, you cannot keep the law because God's acknowledging your pain. And then the 7 days after that, people come to you to help you keep the law. You still are sitting in your house. And at the end of that, I think he said they would walk around the neighborhood or whatever the place was 7 times to say that's done, that period's done. But then a month later, and for that next month, you are focusing on some topic something that meant a lot to the person who passed. You're learning about a topic and then you present it to friends and family at the end of the month as a way to honor them. And it just felt like space was given. And, um, there's a part in you that wants to wrap it up or finish in some way, and we're just moving to the next thing. We're just moving.

Well, that's the problem. Life doesn't stop. You talked about small kids. People have to go back to work. I mean, this is a gift this week. My kids are at camp, so I literally am doing whatever I want to do. Yeah, but here's what's funny. Even if there's no external requirement for me to— I've got emails, you know, I work from home, obviously. But, um, it's not that there's not stuff for me to do, um, but even in this week where I don't have to cook anybody dinner and my kids are not here, and, um, you know, we buried Winter Sunday morning, which was beautiful, by the way. Sunday morning, there's something about that. But anyway, um, me being still is the issue. Sometimes it's not that there's an external requirement. It's the internal permission to just sit. And I think for me, what I've learned about hurt in my own life is that if you can visual— I have this big, wooden bin. I've got it for my boys when they were smaller. It's in the garage now. And once I'm assured that Ellie won't throw a wooden block at anybody and hurt anybody, I might bring it back out. But she's at that age, right? It's a big, like, old school wooden bin, and it's on wheels. So, um, if I were to run— or you can think of a wagon or something that you would have to pull— if I were to run with that full of heavy bricks It's going to keep going at the pace that I keep going, but the moment I slow down, it's not going to stop. It's going to keep going and run into the back of my, you know, Achilles heel or my calves. And the way I described pain is that if you, if you, if you take off running with it, um, at a pace that's too fast, when you do feel the need to slow down, and you will because you can't move that fast for that long with that wait, it will run into you. And when it hits, that's the kind of grief and pain that doubles you over, that stops you in your track where you can't— and not that you can't experience that otherwise, but I'm saying to me, you double up on that, um, if you don't give yourself the room to carry it at a pace where you can see it and look at it and examine it. And take your time with it. And so, so I think what I'm having to do is to tell people, and which is harder. I would rather have a band that everybody knew meant this is a Black band, she lost somebody close, I didn't have to tell them. But, and I don't want to be that sappy weird person either, but I also think that Um, I went to therapy this morning and she asked me, she said, didn't you— because I had to skip last week, I was supposed to be on a plane on Wednesday morning. And she said, so weren't you going out of town last week? You know, where'd you go? And I was thinking, what was I supposed to— first of all, it feels so long ago. It just— me and another— yeah, I mean, another friend of hers, she just said by now she would have called me. And, and, and the last time we got together Even Priscilla said it. She was in a panic yesterday. We were sitting at the table. Where was she sitting? Like, I can't visualize where she was sitting. Or there's something that she shared with me a week, a week we were together in San Antonio. This, the Saturday before she passed, we were together. We were both speaking at an event, and we were recently at another conference. And last weekend, weekend passed, she told me what the one thing was that God told her. I know, I know it. I can't remember it. I can't remember it. So there's this, there's this, this, this vortex that we're kind of in. So when she asked me that, first of all, I couldn't remember what she was talking about. Then I finally remembered, and I also remembered this, that on Tuesday night when I was at the hospital, I remember thinking, I'm not supposed to be here tonight. I'm supposed to be here tomorrow. Like, for therapy. I'm not supposed to be here tonight in the emergency room, you know. So then I was like, okay, do I get into all that with her? Like, you know what I mean? Like, do I tell her I was supposed to get on a plane? So I just said, you know what, um, my cousin died the night before, and yeah, I was supposed to be on a plane, but I didn't make that. And it changed the whole tone of our time. She still did her job.

And we still ask me, just so people know, you're not talking about— I was thinking counseling here. I was like, perfect, you're in counseling. You're talking— no, tell your counselor that this—

no, it was for my toe. It was physical, physical therapy for my foot.

Clarification. I was like, praise Jesus, Chrystal Hurst therapy.

No, you're my therapy.

Oh darn it. Okay, I was so excited there.

Okay.

Physical therapy, we're back.

Yeah, so sorry.

Yeah, so a little change of tone.

So change of tone. Yeah, she was more careful. Yes, she was more ginger, and she didn't do anything different really. It's just her approach was different. But I had to tell her, and I, and I said, you know, I, I feel like cousin does not do it justice. She's more like a sister. So, um, she said, I'm so sorry. She just said, I'm so sorry, and her tone changed. Uh, you know, so somebody in the I'm taking a minute every now and then to look down at the comments. And Melanie said, you know, hot fries are legitimate. You know what, that poor boy, you know, I mean, it was not about— it wasn't about the fries, but at that moment, like, do I tell you I'm losing it right now? Because, you know, somebody dear to me died, and the one thing I wanted today was hot fries, and you couldn't deliver that? You know what I mean? Like, so I think we have to tell people, and I think a part of the A part of hurting will because we're not in a society that encourages transparency and vulnerability. Um, but if you don't do it in the wrong ways, we're super— again, oh yeah, oh, I'm gonna show you my behind, I'll show you my behind, but I'm gonna have body positivity and I'm gonna show you everything you never wanted to see.

But yeah, but real Yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah.

So I think you have to say— you don't have to tell them the whole sob story, but if you just tell them, I'm, I'm actually grieving, I'm, I'm sorry, uh, fry boy, um, I'm sorry, I'm, I'm actually— I lost someone dear to me just recently and I'm not, I'm not in a good place.

And you can have a moment there.

And you can have a moment.

Seeing humanity. Yeah.

Yep. I, I— so I think communicating is one thing. What, what else do you think is helpful for people who need to give themselves the space and the permission to grieve well?

Well, I think you have to recognize, like I was saying with the 4 different personalities that were up on stage, you know, with the whole Enneagram, I go towards feelings. I'm gonna feel all the things. I'm a 4 on the Enneagram. I'm gonna feel my feelings. And the, the deal for me is to move on, like to not get sucked back into them and turn everything off.

Challenge for you is to actually keep going.

Yes, is to not let— like, okay, I got myself the space. Okay, you gotta move on out of that space. That's where the whole circling 7 times and saying it's done. Like, let yourself be sad, meet with your people, and then it's time to get going. What Winter's Passing did for me is it lit a flame in my— there's work to be done, and what in the world am I doing with the time? One, she, she modeled family, she modeled obedience. Um, I think I I also think you have to recognize that grief is going to show up in the least expected.

Yes.

I took my third son to see Lion King the musical, and I'm in the musical and I'm like, oh, this is so great, look at all the cool puppet things. It's a really cool musical. And then we get to the scene, the dad dies. Never thought about the fact that Simba's dad dies. And what does Simba do? He leaves, he leaves, he goes, he hakuna matata, he's gonna— life, no worries, we're gonna party. He went away from the pain. So that to me, I think of a 7 on Enneagram, went away from the pain. We're going to ignore the pain, just move on with life. And then he gets reminded, no, it's by you being who you are supposed to be, the king, that you actually allow your dad to live through you. And I'm having this moment. My dad was an author, like, bawling in Lion King. My son keeps looking over like, what is wrong with you? I was like, he lives in me. When I pursue the things that I still have a body to do, I'm actually giving life to my dad here on Earth. My dad was a great dad. He loved me a ton. By me loving my kids well, I am honoring his life. So whereas your challenge might be to stop the work and give the space, my challenge is to stop the space and do the work.

Wow.

So we have to recognize God's doing an individual work. I also found two weeks ago there was a bitterness in me that I had not recognized until it was called out. Actually, at Pine Cove, um, the, the teacher said worry is when you think God's gonna get it he's not going to get it right. And bitterness is when you think he got it wrong. And that phrase, you think he got it wrong, resonated too much with what was really down here. Jesus girl knew truth. Heart said, yep, he got it wrong.

Yeah, I mean, I— it helped me. It helped me. My dad say that, uh, at Winter's funeral. He said, you know, there are times when you know, even with all the things I know about God, I, you know, I, I struggle. And he said, on this one, he said, that's how I feel. I feel like you got this one wrong. And I was like, et tu, Pastor Tony? Um, because yeah, you're just sitting there going— I mean, my cousin Andrea and I, when she walked up to me at the funeral, she just said, what are we doing here? Yeah, sorry.

Yeah, I think that's—

what are we doing here? So, you know, it helps to know that this idea of loving God, believing it, trying to have faith, hope in the hereafter, which You know, can we just be honest about that for a second?

Like, yeah, I told you, I woke up one morning, I was like, the whole thing's made up. There's no heaven. We made it up to make ourselves feel better.

I'm just like, you have to have faith even in that.

Yeah, yeah.

I mean, you know, I didn't just get to see her, you know, at the funeral. I saw her at the hospital.

Yeah, yeah, you know.

Yeah, she's still warm.

Yeah.

So yeah, uh, yeah. And at that moment I'm thinking there are some scientists somewhere that can explain the, the electrical impulses and the mechanical reasons the body ceases to exist and all that. And we're telling the babies um, you know, your mom isn't here, this is just her body. And you're saying all these things that you believe, and then, you know, somewhere back here or in here, you're going, man, I hope really she did close her eyes and like the Bible promises, she opened up her eyes in heaven. Like, absent from the body is immediately, twinkling of the eye, present with the Lord and that it just didn't all go dark. Because then really, yeah, how do you make any sense of that? So, you know, that's just the honesty. That's the— I love Jesus, I believe, but I am in the straight-up wrestle with all the things that we say and that we do. And, um, but yeah, that was the feeling. The feeling is, why are we here?

And I think the key on all that, like I told you, is to feel those things and to say those things and to acknowledge those things. And like I told— I went to God with that. I said, I confess, I believe you got it wrong. Yeah, I believe you got it wrong here, here, here, here. I know I'm limited. I know I don't— I'm not God, but I have to acknowledge that that is what I'm thinking. Just like, um, David in all of the Psalms— we always talk about David, I'm being so honest, and I wanted to tell you, share this with you. It's the She Reads Truth Morning and Dancing. Yeah, um, it walks you through how to write your own lament. It's Psalm 71, and it goes through where I think I go, you got it wrong, where I need help, and the complaining, and then the trust and the petition and the praise. Like, he, he walks you through because, like your dad said, if it is all fake, that doesn't make the hard things Any easier doesn't take them away. No, God doesn't make it easier. So going to God, um, with those things, in honesty, he can handle it.

What does it look like to go to God with those things? Like, do you talk out loud? Do you write it down? Like, for you?

Yeah, for me it's been a process. I'm definitely a journaler, and so I did. I journaled about it when I recognized it. I shared with my husband. I shared with some friends, and those friends fortunately are prayer warriors with me, and they said, let's pray for you right now. And so we just went before the presence of the Lord, and we— I said those things in tears and felt the Holy Spirit's true healing and almost removal of that root of bitterness, because I kind of had to like really dig on in there. And this is where I, I kind of agreed with the enemy. I needed forgiveness for that. And then it's like healing, and I can't explain it but it was almost like that bitterness was keeping me from letting me love my people. That pain means, why would I love someone else? They could be taken too. Um, that I couldn't have said out loud was happening, but it was. Now I look back, and so there's a freedom there to love people that wasn't when I was holding on to that, that lie of God got it wrong.

But how do you let it go? I think that's the practical part.

Like me letting it go, it was more like me taking it to God because he always says, if you confess, I'm faithful and just to forgive you. And he pours it over and he takes it. And it's a supernatural thing that I can't explain, but I've experienced. And so it's, it's one of these things that in the church I think we talk a lot around, we read the scriptures around, but I've come to find out in the last couple years there is power in the supernatural and the Holy Spirit that we're kind of not accessing. And you can't put words to it, and it's experiences that, that I can't— it's almost like Isaiah, like, I have unclean lips. Like, even just talking about the holiness of it makes it less holy. Describing it puts— take— make— takes it away from being the beautiful thing that it is. So I don't know, it's supernatural. But I know, and I know, and I know that when you bring these things to God, he is faithful to heal.

Yeah, I think bringing it to God for me is, uh, it is writing, um, but it is also talking. What I, what I, what I try to do now is to talk it out and then write it down. Or I even talk it out and record it because, you know, I think that, that like when I'm having a conversation with you or, you know, somebody goes and visits a counselor, sees a therapist, you are processing it, but somebody is catching what you're processing and giving it back to you so you hear what you say. You know, it doesn't just—

like an external processor. You like to talk it out loud.

Yeah. So for me, if I do that I can just say what I gotta say. But I have found, honestly, my little voice recorder, or just writing down the thoughts. Or I'm a, I'm a talker in the shower. I don't know what it is about the shower. I feel safe in the shower. So I just got these Aqua Note things, and you can literally write in the shower. So I'll just write like little keywords down so I don't forget. Um, but I think what's key for me is to remember that giving it to God is not a one and done. No, it's an on— it's an ongoing— yeah, Paula, Paula said it's a process.

Yeah, it's like—

yeah, it's a journey. It's not get over, get through, um, have all the explanations for. It is a— I mean, everybody understood that when I was in the hospital with my foot, that when I came home that I had to sit still, I had to be still, I had to put my foot up, and no one derailed me for taking the time to operate abnormally in my life because I needed to heal. In fact, everybody encouraged me not to go too fast, right? They were like, are you supposed to be on your foot?

Did you do it at Costco right now? That was me. Yes.

You know, but I mean, yeah, but everybody was like, you know, and I put my foot up at Costco, but everybody was like, okay, you know, like a nurse came through. Okay, can you— do you have anything else? You need to prop that up a little higher. Like, I mean, it was— but everybody was totally, um, fine with not only giving me the space to heal but encouraging me to heal.

Yes, yes.

And, and they knew what was required. That's the thing. They knew what was required. You need to be still. You need to eat well. You need to— and so they were like, put your foot up. So I think That's where we just have to say to ourselves that this ongoing process of letting the emotions be what they are, expressing them in self-safe places, even if that's in our own journal, seeing what they are, and— but then the most important thing is just giving yourself time. And then after, you know, 3 weeks, 4 weeks, 6 weeks, I mean You know, my grandmother passed, um, 5 years ago, my dad's mom. I, I was texting somebody just yesterday about that and how this is different or the same. And as I started thinking about her, started crying again. Like, it— there's— I don't cry about it every day, but there are certain times when I think about her or I think about, you know, something that I would love to talk to her about, you know, it makes me sad. So it— then I do it again. Um, so I think to understand that healing in grief and sadness, that it is an ongoing, somewhat never-ending but changing process, because I mean, do you, do you think it ends? I don't think it ends. I think what I hear people say is it just gets different.

Yeah, yeah. I think the intensity of the pain lessens. Think of your toe, how painful it was at first when it was healing. I broke my foot years ago, but if it rains a little bit or I tweak it a little bit, I feel like a slight pain, a twinge. I remember, it's like a reminder. Oh yeah, I broke that, that was broken, that was hurtful. Um, And I think that's what happens over the years. I think, uh, and, and then, and the more you love, the more you grieve. The person was important to you.

Wow.

The deeper the love, the deeper the grief. And I think that we have to say how, how blessed to have such beautiful people.

Wow. To love is to— yeah. I'll never forget when I was, um, trying to decide if my husband was the one, and I asked, uh, a relative, you know, what do you think, what do you think? And she just said— she told me everything that she thought, and then she said, but you know, no matter what, it's a risk. Um, she said, because loving is always a risk. And at the time she meant, you know, because I was kind of reserved and holding back and didn't really want to do the relationship thing because I had been in one that was very hurtful. And she said, loving is always a risk, but if you never risk hurt to love, you will never know how good love can be.

Yes.

And I think when you, when you love, you run the risk, you run the risk of loss because no one can stay with you forever. And whether you lose them through death or the, you know, the dissolve of a marriage, where you lose them because the friendship changes or you lose them because you change jobs. I mean, you know what I mean? Like, you really developed community on your job, and then it's an opportunity you just can't say no to, but you miss the people you worked with for 15 years. I mean, living with an open heart, that's what it means, because nothing that you have in terms of people can last forever. No.

Well, in terms of anything, I love what you said about, you know, how because of the timing of Winter, y'all got lots of time.

And we got lots of time. And that, yeah, if she'd come back one more time, you know, like, there's, there's never enough.

I got 10 more years with my dad. How much— I mean, then it would be even hard. I mean, how—

when is there When is enough enough? I mean, as, as humans, I think the concept is, you know, of contentment, of things, of money, of vacation. We never have enough. I mean, how many times have you gone on a vacation and thought, even though you're glad to be home, if I could have had just a couple more days, or maybe I got home and I needed like 3 more days to detox from the— I mean, if I, if, if I could have had Winter back for one more hug, like a warning, would it have been enough? No, no. If she had been able to live until all of her babies had grown up, till all of them had gotten married, be there for the birth of their first children, if all of that had happened, and the pictures that we take with the whole sister-cousin thing, if we could have taken those pictures every year for some event and have done that every year until we were 80 Whoever was the first one of us to go, would it have been enough? No.

Right.

No.

Right.

So I think for having to have enough— and this is what I did say, you're right, about Wynter— for having to have enough, we're very grateful that if there is such a thing as enough, you know, we got pretty close. Because they were leaving, we'd said goodbye. We said, why we love you. We'd given them the picture books. We've done that. Um, so that God was very gracious to us in that, in so many, so many other ways. Um, what I said— I didn't realize this until later— what I said about her at the funeral, about her learning to work from a place of rest, and me being Type A and her being Type B, and me trying to figure out how to be more Type B, and her trying to figure out how to do the Type A things that work for me, that she didn't have to figure out the hard way. She was just gonna like take the you know, shortcut, and Chrystal tell me what to do. Um, I'd said to her in a text before when she launched a book last year, I'd said to her, she was like, you're doing such a great job with the launch of your book, you know, I need to be more like you. And I said, girl, no, I need to be more like you. You have learned the art of working from a place of rest and letting God market your book for you. Like I'd said that to her. So even in that, it's not words that I hadn't already said. I said them to her.

Yeah.

Um, so, okay, so here's a very realistic question, um, because a lot of people don't feel like they had enough time and there are things that went unsaid. And, um, so the Tuesday that she died, uh, I remember telling her— it's where she was, a beautiful place— and, um, I was like, I'm gonna come over, we're just gonna hang out. And I was supposed to be leaving town to go and be at Proverbs 31, the She Speaks Conference, to teach on a few things. And of course I wasn't going to go after she passed, but I realized on that Tuesday, crossed my mind, I told Winter I would come and just sit and enjoy where she's at, just chill, you know. And I made the conscious decision not to go because I said I'm also leaving my family on Wednesday, and I was just with Winter this weekend. I was with her. We had lunch, you know, we joked around. We put—

like, I mean, you spent a lot of time with her.

Yeah, we spent a lot of time in general, like, because they lived in Dallas. But like, that weekend I had one-on-one time with her. So to go and sit would have been extra. It would have been good, you know, they're gonna leave for Nashville, uh, but I was also going to leave my family. And in that moment, the best decision seemed to me to do what I needed to do to be present with my family. You know, I was going to leave and come back in town on a Saturday night, and then the next day I got to send my kids to camp. So I wanted to make sure that, you know, they were ready to go. I didn't want to shortcut my husband or put him out. So I made that decision. And afterwards, I don't know that I regret it as much as I just go, why, God? Like, why didn't you make it hard on me. Like, just, just like in my spirit, make me feel like, no, you need to go. Like, this is important. She's leaving. You need to go. Stay it till 3 AM if you have to, but go. Be like, why didn't you do that for me? Um, so here's the, here's the question. Sometimes if we want to live like it's your last day, that's not a helpful thing to say, because your last day with what? Or your last day with whom? Yeah, you don't know that. And in any given moment, you're always having to look at the priorities in your life. Okay, your dad wants you to come and visit, but your husband has a, you know, a function at his job. Or, uh, your sister wants to talk on the phone for an hour longer than normal today, but you've got a project due at work, you know, and you need to do a good job on your job. So the reality is sometimes making those if it's my last time decisions isn't as simple because you don't know what you would— you don't know what there is to lose, right? So how do we live in the tension of that reality? Because, you know, in hindsight now, I'm like, again, I don't know if I feel a strong thing of regret because I'd had so much time with her, but I do think dog it, I made the wrong choice. I ended up being here all week. I, I had the whole week to pack for my kids. Yeah, I made the wrong choice.

Yeah.

So what do you tell people when they feel like they, they didn't get that last phone call or they didn't say that last thing? Um, you know, like, how do you reconcile that?

I think saying like, would it have been enough? I think, you know, like you said, yeah, you never know. You not going, she might have gotten more time with her girls. You don't know. That's true. I was supposed to have lunch and it got moved. So do I regret— why'd we move the lunch? I could have lunch with her, but by her having me, she would have been driving. What if something had happened on the drive?

That's true.

She would have— I would have then regretted taking time away on that last day. So I think the element of walking in the spirit, of trusting God, that there's so much outside of our little—

there's more than we can ever know.

We just live a surrendered life moment to moment, trusting him, that even if it seems like I made the wrong choice right now, we don't know in the whole scope. We don't know. We don't know what could have or didn't happen. Um, we just trust him in all things. Because even like you said, she worked from a place of rest. I think it even comes from that. We, we make our, we make our time priority choices from a place of rest.

I will tell you, that's the thing for sure Winter had down pat. She was just like, if it was overwhelming, if she felt like she messed it up You know, she— it's not that she wouldn't feel sad about it, but there was a level of, well, I guess it was the way it's supposed to be then. I mean, she just was like, I did the best I— I mean, she just didn't hold on to that. It wasn't her personality to do that. So I learned a lot from her about stressing out about stuff that is just way out of my control. Um, somebody's on the chat and said— her name is Mrs. Johnson, I like this— she said, it helps me to know that my mom got a better invitation. So just kind of what you were saying, not only that Winter got a better invitation to be with God, but if me not going to her house, the invitation to spend time with her kids, that's a better invitation than being with me, you know, chalking it up on the back when we already spent time together. I mean, so there's got to be something better that we don't know, that we can't see, because God promises in his word that all things work together to the good, for the good of those who love him and are called according to his purpose. So we can rest that there's got to be something better that we don't know of, we can't conceive. We don't— we live inside of time. There's things we will never know, and we just have to trust in that truth.

That Israelites leaving Egypt and being like, man, this stinks. Back in slavery in Egypt, at least we had fresh food. And they're like, dude, the promised land's pretty awesome, right? Yeah, in that direction, and it's gonna be good. But right now it doesn't look so hot, and you're gonna not make sense, and you're not met, and you're not comforted right this second in the way you think is comforting.

Well, I want to talk for a second about how people can help others when they're hurting, and I'm just gonna like just list off some things that come to mind. You do the same. The first thing that comes to mind, y'all, is toilet paper. Like, people are like, how can I help?

Amazon Prime that, right?

Yes, because if you have family coming in from out of town, the first thing you're gonna run out of is toilet paper.

Let's put your address right here and you can just get tons of toilet paper, right?

You know, and I didn't need it. People weren't saying— but, but my, you know my, my, uh, the people. Yeah, the host. So they're a mile away from me. So, you know, people always think food, and yes, food is a thing, but I also want to say think about the type of food because people a lot of times start bringing the same food. They're bringing casseroles, they're bringing chicken, green beans, and very, very grateful. Our family has been very, very grateful. But to think you might need a salad, you know what I mean? Or, um, they might need something, you know, different. So Well, probably change it up.

Yeah, I'll tell you one friend who's so gracious, um, I went to pick up my son from preschool and she loaded up the back of my car with every paper product, paper plates, paper towels, those coffee cups that have the lids on them that are— you could throw away, um, fun little drinks for my boys, uh, to keep them entertained. She just like really outside the box practical things. And then, uh, Kay Wyma left a cooler of just groceries from Costco. Tons of things that my boys could just pull out and eat, that they were thrilled about. Frozen pizzas and I don't know, different, different things that I'd never even bought, but it was food that was different and new and easy food. I didn't have to think about it. And basics too, you know, milk and all that stuff, bread.

You know, I think that, um, one of the things that I've learned, just not even from this as much as me being hurt, uh, my, my whole hospital thing was thinking about us as a family, but thinking about my kids specifically. Like, um, like people would send cards and they'd put $5 in there for the kids.

Yeah.

Like, the next time you get out, tell your dad to make a Sonic run. You know, here's money for a Sonic run. Or, um, or, or saying, you know what, when people stop bringing food, here's a gift card. To a place that delivers near your house so you don't have to go anywhere. And money can— and of course, you know, we started the GoFundMe for, um, Jonathan and the girls, which the response to that was overwhelming. And I did that because it was quick and easy and everybody knows what a GoFundMe is. But, you know, another way to do it, if you don't necessarily need to do something that's that public and that whatever, is just to say, hey, do you have a PayPal account? I'll just shoot you some money. Like, yeah, Venmo, Cash App, Zelle, you know. That's another thing, um, one of our mutual friends, Courtney, uh, DeFeo, knowing that all of our kids were going to camp and Jonathan and Winter's kids, he talked to the girls and he said, do you want to still go? And they were like, yeah, we, you know, like, we weren't going to be home anyway, like, we weren't going to be with y'all anyway, so we still want to go. And it's great. Pine Cove Camps is awesome. Um, and they have counselors that are there. It's built into how they do camp. So it's a perfect place for them to be this week, for them to have some joy, but also have people on hand if they're, you know, they're experiencing some deep pain and which they are, of course, but if they really are struggling, it comes to the surface.

Yeah.

Yeah. But, but Courtney was like, your kids are going to camp. And she just showed up and said, give me the lists. I'll do the run. Not only did she get the stuff the kids needed, but she got the stuff the kids didn't even know they wanted. We have never sprayed silly spring— silly string on our way into camp. We've never done that. But you know, now this is the year the kids are going to remember. We're going to do this every year. Or you came up, you called me the night of the funeral and you said, do you have everything you need for camp? And I was like, yeah, I think so. And you said, well, what about, did you mark up your car? Every stinking year I want to mark up my car and I never remember to do it. Like, we're driving into camp and then I'm looking at all the other cars thinking I'm out-mommed again, you know what I mean? Every other mom did it. You went by Walmart and got the glass paint, and not only did you come over and bring it to me, you stayed and helped me do it because, you know, I'm a little art challenged, so I didn't know how to draw a pine cone. But you did.

Okay.

And when I drove up to the burial ground on Sunday, all the kids were like, Mom, you didn't mark up our car! My cousin was like, thanks a lot. I was like, I have extra.

You're like, now you're super mom, you're helping.

I don't even think I've told you this. Everybody came, uh, we either— they came either by my house or we met up at my parents' house and made pancakes for everybody before we left, and— or there. And everybody went with their cars painted.

I love that, you know. Um, so it's such a simple procession of, of celebration.

Yeah, yeah. So I think when you're thinking about how can you help, think beyond like they're hurting. And food is good, like I'm not anti-food. I'm just saying, if you had a bunch of people come to town all at once, what would you need? Or if you had, um, if you were sick in the hospital and were incapacitated What would people need?

Yeah.

Or, um, and then the thing I think that is crucial is go as you're led, but, you know, show up right that minute or not, because I can guarantee you that 2, 3 weeks, 6 weeks, 2, 3 months after the loss, there's still room for you to be a voice of encouragement with a card, a meal, just to take the load. I mean, it's just Don't feel the pressure.

Yeah, yeah, it's so cool. Um, a book, or, uh, like I told you, someone gave me and my mom, um, really super soft blankets. Yeah, that— it's very comforting and reminds me of my dad. Um, yeah, helping people live their normal life you know, making that easier for them. Of an idea, a friend who was going through breast cancer said was say, hey, can I do your laundry? Just leave it out front in a basket, right?

I don't even need to come in your house.

Leave it out front of that, and then they bring it back.

I will take it and wash it and bring it back. Yep.

I think if that would—

let them wash your underwear. Don't even take the underwear out, just let them do it.

I would say don't text the thing, how can I help?

Come with a very specific idea.

I'm at Target, can I get you—

Yes, I'm running through Chick-fil-A, can I get you— Because you're right, because at the moment it's not that I don't want people to help, it's at that moment I can't even think.

I, I come up with the idea for you.

So yes, that is how I'm doing.

And then think of me and say, is this a blessing or a burden? And that's it.

That's a great— that's a great thing. Is this a blessing or a burden? I love that. I— we even had someone ask, they were like, we, we're sure you have food, we, we'd love to bring you food, but if you're okay on food, we'd love to just bring by everybody's favorite drink. Oh, like, it was like a— one was a Starbucks run, and then the other one was like, they literally went and just bought Sunkist Orange for this person and Sparkling Cranberry for this person. Because it wasn't about you needing a drink, it was about you just feeling good. Another way to say we love you. That's all it is, is another way to say we love you.

Yeah. Um, no, offering— if you're a real close friend, you could offer to do some of the harder stuff, you know. Yeah, the cleaning out a room. Um, there's that blessing that the Pitts didn't have a house full of stuff to go through. She had already packed herself up.

Yep.

Just unbelievable. Um, in my friend's case, they had sold everything and moved to Costa Rica, so it was pretty seamless on the—

yeah.

So I think, you know, but if there is something hard to do, picking out clothes or cleaning out a closet or thank you notes, I I didn't— I don't think I wrote a lot.

Yes, thank you notes.

I wrote a lot of them. I feel bad about that a little bit, but not— I just— there was no— I had nothing in me to write a thank you note.

Well, well, I know that the one thing that you can do is just say, here's the message, like write it once so it came from your heart. Um, and, and— but then let other people write it down. Like, it's okay, it's okay. It came from your heart. If you— if that's not what brings you joy and brings you energy, let other people Like, and we had a, um, and still have a, a list at my cousin's home. So every time somebody brings something by, like, we're keeping track of that. But it would be burdensome to say now, after all this, now go and do the whole thank you note thing.

Jonathan, go write all that in the midst of taking care of 4 girls.

Yeah. So, so let people help you. And that's something I would say to you if you're hurting. Let people help you. Let people help you, because the tendency sometimes is to just—

I'm fine.

Yeah, I'm fine.

And it's not helpful if you are having to come up with the idea of how to help. And, and there's— if you are helping, don't make it be an expectation that they then have to hold your grief too, you know what I mean?

Yeah.

To be cognizant of the fact that your role there is to lift, whatever it is. And yes, and be a space holder, not to then start saying all your junk to them.

Yeah, which is hard, which is hard because, you know, in, in my family, in my role in my family, you know, that's a part of what we do is if you are hurting, I'm supposed to be here for you. So, you know, I've had— yeah, I mean, I've had people that are stopping me really there's— they're— and they mean it.

They mean it.

I'm so sorry for you. But if they know her, they're, they're hurting too. Yeah. And so then it is that— it is that, you know, she was just this and we were just this and we were just— and I'm— I don't have a problem with it, but I do— in that moment, there is the setting aside of where I'm hurting so I can handle yours.

Yeah.

And so I think it's just good to be cognizant of that. Um, it doesn't mean you shouldn't I actually had a mutual friend of ours stop by because she just stopped by and she said, I just wanted to see you and know that you're okay. And it was fine for her to do it, you know what I mean? But there's some other people that they would just stop by, I'd have been like, for real? Like, I'm not dressed right now.

Um, no. And I— there's in this book, again, it says, you know, you can say to the person things to say. I find myself really missing Winter. Um, it's a comfort, I think, for you to know that I haven't forgotten. You know, it's okay to say, like you said, I'm really sad right now. I, I'm missing this about her. Is there a certain time of day that's hard for you? Or what is your grief like these days? Um, are you finding You know, that's good that you don't even have—

there are helps for what to say, because I think that's part of the challenge is you don't know what to say, you know.

And if there's that date coming up, is there something I can do to help you honor her? Or I know this hard thing's coming up, and I have to say, the one week, like today, the one month, the 3 months, the 6 months, sometimes your body knows before your brain does.

Isn't that the truth?

Or your soul. Your soul knows before your, your mind catches up to some things. I don't— I was at, uh, someone invited us to go on a beach vacation, which should be amazing, right? That should be amazing. And I'm on it and I'm feeling kind of funky. I don't know why I'm feeling funky the whole time. And then we're driving back home and I'm scrolling on Instagram and seeing everyone's posting their Father's Day pictures. I'm like, oh right, this is another holiday where I'm sad. This is— I, my— I knew, but I didn't know.

You knew, you knew soulfully, but not mentally.

Yes. And, and to be okay with just letting that happen, and, um, and to be the people around that person to again recognize the band might be on, they might be off, when you interact with them and you're like, what is up with so-and-so? Oh right, this is the 6th. Oh right, this is, you know, this is Mother's Day. This is a big day. Winter's Mother's Day will be hard. Christmas will be hard, you know.

Yep, yep. I, I think that the whole idea though of staying awake is because this— staying awake to this, to hurt is a part of staying awake to your life, because hurt is a part of living. Pain is a part of living. And if you want to close your eyes and skip that part, you're actually not living, because you can't live full and never experience pain. Um, the Bible talks about comforting others with the comfort that you've received.

Yeah.

And yes, there is a whole nother level because of what I've been through physically this year, um, and because of what I've been through emotionally this year, because of what I've been through from this hurt, um, this pain. It changes the way I know to help other people. It changes the way I know what to do. It changes me knowing what to say or what not to say because I've been there. But I think to do the opposite and to say you don't want to be awake to the pain, you don't want to feel it, you want to rush through it, get back to work, get back to life, not stop when the tears fall, is to rob yourself of actually being awake to your life. It's not fun necessarily. But I always give this illustration. And I said this in She's Still There. That if life is like a faucet, if your soul and the emotions are like a faucet— in my kitchen I have one lever and one side is cold and one side is hot. If I don't want the cold water, so I shut it, that means I never get the hot water either. So the only way to get what I want is to leave the faucet open, and that means that both are able to come through. And, you know, there's no greater pain— well, I'm sure there might be, but childbirth is very painful. But regardless of epidural or not, C-section or not, either before, during, or after, it is painful. But if you don't have that pain, you don't get the baby. Even if you didn't have a baby naturally, even adoption, the desire, the pain of knowing that there are kids that need a home, the pain of your own struggle with fertility, that pain is what makes way you know, for the joy. So, um, so yeah, I also want to share this. My, my uncle's wife— he, he passed away this past December— uh, she shared this book with me and I read a few excerpts from it. I don't even know if everybody can see it. Yeah, but it says Healing After Law— Healing After Loss. Yeah, and the author there is Martha Hickman. Daily Meditations for Working Through Grief. So that's another resource if you are looking for help with grieving. Heather, thank you, um, first of all for being my friend and calling me out on moving too fast. No, thank you for being my friend and knowing that I like chocolate chip cookies and bringing me cookies that I had a problem Stop me.

They're really good.

And introducing me to puppy chow and bringing us dinner. My husband was so very happy to find out that we had babes coming. Um, and that's a blessing for him. I mean, he's grieving in a way that I'm not. He loved Winter too, but I'm good with eating cereal. Him, not so much. So that was a blessing to our family. Thank you for being with me. Um, just a few things, you guys, for, um, those of you who are still on, and a lot of you are still on, thank you so much for being here. Um, I want to thank, um, the folks who support what I do on media, podcasting, and YouTubing, um, the Patreon subscribers who have committed to contribute for the cost of what it requires to do this stuff. And, um, if you are interested in helping to support what I do Um, you can find out more about that by just going to patreon.com/chrystalhurst. But for those who are currently co-producers of, um, what I do in the media atmosphere, thank you very much. Um, if you are not subscribed to my YouTube channel, please do that because that means when I do stuff like this, you get a notification. And if you forgot, you get that as a reminder. Um, Heather, can you please share where everybody can find you online?

Right now it's Everything God-Centered Mom.

Uh-oh, does that mean you're gonna change it?

Maybe so, give me 2 months. Yeah.

Okay, Heather has a burden for motherhood, really, um, for a lot of things in the spiritual realm actually. I still have yet to let you do some healing prayer over me.

I haven't forgotten about that, Mom.

We got space. Um, but a lot of things, but definitely motherhood for sure. So if you need encouragement and, um, practical tools to help you in your mothering journey, um, there is such a thing as not momming alone. You don't— alone, alone.

So we're headed— that might be where we're headed.

Yeah. Okay. All right, all right. Well, that's, that's great. So be sure and check her out online if you joined us late, the replay will be available if you didn't catch the full video. And if you want to revisit, take— I'm going to rewatch it and take some notes over some things. And then if you have suggestions for stuff that has been helpful to you in your grieving process, or, um, for you to heal, or that other people have done that have been healing to you, I actually— I want to put together like a resource, like I was telling my team earlier today. Watch what I'm doing, take notes, because I think it would be helpful to say, here's, here's how I can tangibly remember what to do when I'm, when I'm hurting. And whether, like you said, whether it's grief or any other kind of hurt, knowing how to walk through that well, knowing how to help people in those seasons for you. I want to do that and would love to include your suggestions. So if you have suggestions that we didn't cover, please, please share those with me. And then, um, most importantly, um, keep Jonathan and the girls in your prayers, um, as the girls are away at camp, as Jonathan is doing all the things. When someone passes away, there are things to do.

Yes.

I mean, it's just— yeah, it's just insane.

You don't even know. I didn't know what probate was. I mean, so many ridiculous It's just, yes, it's a whole situation.

So, um, so just know that, and there's a whole— yeah, so just keep them, um, in your prayer, prayers. And a couple of other things, um, there is right now on my website at chrystalevanshurst.com/free-download what we had put up there weeks, weeks ago. It's an assessment for whether or not you're actually staying awake in your life. And if you don't even know what I'm talking about, I encourage you to go get it. It's free, it's there, it's a little test you can take to see are you really awake to your life. And some of the questions have to do with pain, but other stuff too, because that will be helpful to you. So that's, that's there for you. For those of you who joined me on, I got to see a lot of your comments, and I know, I, I know that you are hurting. I know, I'm— I know that there are some of you, I know you by name, that you just lost your mom. I see one of you girls on here, you just lost your mom, and you were comforting me in my loss of Winter and our family's loss of Winter. So many of you have said that you are thankful for these honest conversations. I'm seeing it. I'm seeing you talk about how grief isolates you. I'm seeing you talk about, um, your agreement with coffee and paper cups. And yes, bring some chocolate, dark chocolate for me. I mean, I'm seeing it. And so if you are joining us and you didn't realize that there is gold in the chat for this, you know, mine the chat, leave the comments. People read the comments after this. Our conversation doesn't have to end here. But I'm very grateful to you, Heather, for your time and for letting me learn from you in so many, so many, so many ways. But in particular during this season in my life. Letting me learn from you of how to be okay with hurting. And though, even though it isn't my personality to keep going, to know when I'm not doing that in a healthy way, I appreciate you being my friend and calling me out on that. And, um, yeah, so thank you.

I am honored to be here with you. Love you, ton.

All right, y'all, I'm gonna end the broadcast, but again, conversation doesn't have to end, so feel free to encourage each other in the comments. And watch the replay if you missed any of it. I'll see you. I think I'm gonna do one more because I had already invited somebody, and this was supposed to be the last live Tuesday thing for a while, but you might see me here next Tuesday, so be sure and check your email because the fries were a thing in the conversation. The invitation was for taking care of your body, so maybe we're supposed to have that conversation.

That But I did get hot fries.

Good. And they were good, thank you very much. All right, y'all.

All right.