The Power of Perseverance - Maria Menounos | 1147 | Dave Asprey

It was the night before surgery, and I had a chat with my friend John Amaral, who's an energy worker. I was feeling shame for being scared, and he was like, maria, you have a pancreas tumor. You're having massive abdominal surgery tomorrow. You have every right to be scared, and that's okay. And he freed me of so much in that moment. So it's not that I'm fearless or anything. I've definitely had my moments. I just climb out of them fast because I know that whenever something bad happens or something good, that usually comes around the corner. Now, maybe that corner is a little longer in times, but there's always the pendulum swing.

You're listening to the human upgrade with Dave Asprey. You're listening to the human upgrade with Dave Asprey. You've probably heard that well known saying, when life gives you lemons, make lemonade. I'm not sure that I really ascribe to that, because I'm like, if life gives you lemons, you should probably plant the lemons, like the seeds, so they'll grow into more lemon trees, and that's one thing. But if you're having a really bad day, you could actually plant the lemon seeds in the bodies of your an. Okay, no, no, that's not what I was thinking. Okay, Dave, let's go. Wait, was that my outdoor voice? I'm just kidding, guys. What we're talking about, though, is you can have gratitude for a situation, even if it looks like it's a really, really terrible thing. And sometimes you do that around health. There's a time when I weighed 300 pounds. You've all probably heard me say that before. But the chronic fatigue syndrome was the real thing, where you just feel like everything. Everything you do is an enormous amount of work. Just driving, just making a decision. And if you've ever had that kind of what I'm gonna call crippling fatigue, it's not about willpower. It doesn't matter how much you want to do it. It's just everything is so big. And I. I was there, and I climbed out of it, and I'm in a really, really good place, better than I've ever been in my life. And maybe that's making lemonade, but at the time, it was actually kind of a traumatizing thing. Your body actually worries about not having enough energy, so you have, like, fear of being tired, which is almost as bad as being tired. And it takes an enormous spiritual act to turn what can be really, really scary and potentially sort of mess. You up mentally for life and turn into something that's good. So our guest today is someone who's done that. Someone well known who was diagnosed with a brain tumor and then later another kind of cancer. Her name is Maria Menounos and she's well known for courage and resilience. You might have seen her on TV as an actress, as an author, E. News, the Today Show, WWE and the Heel Squad. In fact, she's on the Heel Squad set as I'm interviewing her today. We're going to learn from her today about how, how you deal with it when you, or maybe someone you know is dealing with something that might actually kill you. And it's a hard conversation to have because facing mortality is one of those things that no one wants to do. And even when you're a hundred, if, when you were 30, you say, you know when, if I'm a hundred and I can't run a marathon, I don't want to be here. Everyone I know who's a hundred still wants to be here, even if life is pretty crappy and maybe they don't know what's coming next. But there's a part of us that wants, wants to live and wants to thrive. So Maria and I are going to talk about how do you take that life threatening situation and how do you not let it define your life? Maria, thanks for coming on the show today.

Thanks, Dave. Or maybe how you do make it define your life?

Good question.

I'd have to find my new life in a way you can use it.

To set a mission.

I think it was a redirect and a shift towards my true purpose and true mission here.

We share that. And that I probably wouldn't have been a biohacker if I hadn't have been that sick and been forced to do it. And my motivation was I just want five people to not go through what I went through. And maybe a few more than that were listening. But it makes it personal for you, right?

Absolutely.

Do you define yourself? You wake up in the morning and say, I'm, I'm a brain tumor survivor, I'm a cancer survivor. Or do you see yourself as something more than that?

No, I don't see myself at that. It's funny because I had to do a PSA for Pancreatic Cancer Awareness Month and just having to say that out loud. I don't want to own any of it, to be honest, where I don't even say I'm diabetic. I currently at the moment have diabetes because I'm going to Heal it. So I don't even want to say, oh, I'm type one diabetic.

Yeah.

So I definitely don't define myself with those things. It is an interesting laundry list to share with people. When, you know, you're talking about health, it's like, oh, well, yeah, definitely had a few things, but, yeah, it's one.

Of those things where I see people on Instagram and they say, you know, I'm a survivor of this and survivor of that and survivor of this other thing. And it kind of feels almost like it's time to move on. Where, like, I want to help you not have. What happened to me is a very different vibe than I survived. How do you. And you're one of the people very clearly is like, here's what to do. How did you make the shift from the I'm going to sound rude here, but kind of the poor me mindset that everyone has when they're really sick. How did you step out of that?

I don't think I ever was in poor me. I was a bit in poor me when I got diagnosed with the neuroendocrine tumor on my pancreas, where I was. Holy.

Can I swear?

Yeah. It's a podcast. I can swear.

You can swear. That's my new ringtone for you. It's good.

But, you know, I had a baby on the way, and I was like, how could this be happening? This is insane. Like, we just. That one really threw us for the loop. But. And also, there was so much we still didn't know when I was diagnosed. We didn't know how bad it was. We didn't know if I was gonna live, if I was gonna. Like, we didn't know anything. It's the thing that killed Steve Jobs. So that's all we knew.

Yeah.

And Steve Jobs had a lot more money than me and a lot more resources. So you're like, well, if it didn't work out for him, so your mind can run away with things. But when I was diagnosed with a brain tumor, it was a few months after my mom was diagnosed with a brain tumor. My mom's was stage four brain cancer. Mine was benign. We didn't know for sure when I was diagnosed because they have to take it out and biopsy it. But they were fairly certain at the time that that's what it looked like. Dr. Black at Cedars sign. I was like, well, I've been fooled before, so I reserve comment. But at that time, I. I just had done so much work, whether, you know, with Tony Robbins and such, where I knew life is happening for you, not to you. I know that tool can't be applied in every scenario because there are some very dark scenarios out there, but it was applicable here. I knew my mom had something deadly, and I knew I was spared to a degree. And any time through the journey with my mom and after my brain tumor situation, my dad would be. I remember in the kitchen, he would be cooking, and he's like. He'd cry, and he'd say, why, Mario? Why so many things, our family? And I'm like, dad, why not us? We're not special. It happens to everybody. Everybody has to go through something awful in life, unfortunately, whether it's death or illness or whatever, loss of some kind. And so I said, we have a lot of resources where we know how to navigate this, even though we don't. We're figuring it out.

Yeah.

And I was like, why not us? And so that was always my attitude. When I got diagnosed with the type 1 diabetes, that really rocked me, too, because I had watched my dad deal with it, and it was one of my most traumatizing events in life, was seeing him almost die on the regular because his blood sugars would drop so low. My mom and I had to become so in tune and psychic to know where he was and. And know he wasn't okay to save him. And if it wasn't us, it was the firefighters at the door who were called on the regular. So I was like, oh, gosh, that's going to be my life now. This is crazy. And then, yes, moving forward to the pancreas tumor. I had a baby on the way, and I was just. The one year anniversary just happened. So I was looking back at videos. I save everything. I record video diaries because I'm too lazy to write. So I said, I remember one of the videos. I. It was the night before surgery, and I had a chat with my friend John Amaral, who's an energy worker.

Oh, I love John. He's been on the show. Okay, cool.

He's wonderful. So he and I had a really important chat that night because I was feeling shame for being scared, because I'm pretty tough, and I've gone through a lot. And, you know, I was just. I don't know why, but I was feeling shame for it. And he was like, maria, you have a pancreas tumor. You're having massive abdominal surgery tomorrow. You have every right to be scared, and that's okay. And he freed me of so much in that moment. Then I said, okay, I'm going to go have dinner with my family and I'm going to celebrate today and we'll see what happens tomorrow. So it's not that I'm fearless or anything. I've definitely had my moments. I just climb out of them fast because I know that whenever something bad happens or something good, that usually comes around the corner. Now, maybe that corner is a little longer in times, but there's always the pendulum swing. And it's been a pattern I've watched for my 45 years on this planet. And so, and I, and I have such faith that I'm guided and protected, that at some point I can get back there. It's not my instant moment where I'm like, I've got into protected and everything's happening for me, not to me. And, but I do have these tools that I've acquired on my journey and especially through my show Heal Squad, where I have all these experts come in, I have all these gurus, and we have these important conversations where we go deeper. I've accrued these tools that help me in these moments. And I think that, as I said in the beginning, I know that I'm being hit over the head for a reason and I follow those breadcrumbs as much as I can and they lead to breakthroughs. And I know that this is my mission is to figure it out and help other people along the way.

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He's.

He doesn't often speak about the science of his work, but he's at the biohacking conference. Guys, if you are a Joe Dispenza fan, as Maria and I are, go to the biohacking conference, biohackingconference.com and you'll see him there in a rare talk about how it works. Instead of leading on breathwork, what happened when you came across Dr. Joe Dispenza's work, Maria?

So just like Tony, it happened at the right time. So I was really kind of just depleted and. And just not okay. And went to Tony Robbins. And, you know, I felt like the. The. My eyes had windshield wipers. It just cleaned all the fog off. And so Dr. Joe came to me through someone you may know, Marie Forleo, of course. So my. My other friend had told me about Dr. Joe. He had been on the show before I had him on my show.

Oh, wow.

But I never did the work. And so it was January 2021, 22. January 2022. Marie Forleo had just come back from a meditation event with Dr. Joe. And she called me and she's like, you have to do this. And I was like, listen, you know, I'm self help queen. I have been forever. The last thing I want to do is a meditation event. I'd rather gouge my eyeballs out with a spoon. Not me. It's just not for me. And she's like, Maria. I felt like a snake coming out of my skin. It was so transformative. And something about when she said that clicked, and I was like, okay, I'm gonna start today. So I went online, I bought the formula, his class, and I started. And I was so hooked. After three days of doing this crippling anxiety. I had just lost my mom. Crippling anxiety that I was finally gonna give into and get medicated for was gone three days.

Wow. And so reset inside your nervous system, right?

Yeah. So I kept with it. I did the progressive course. I went to an event. It was life changing. And you know when he.

Did you have the whole body orgasm, loud thing too? No, I did, man. I was like, I. Because it's kind of embarrassing, but all right.

Wow.

Like the seventh day advanced one or did you do a different one?

I did all of them now. Okay. But I. You know when he says, at some point you'll get happy for no reason?

Uh huh.

That hit me. I started in January, sometime around April. I remember being in my kitchen and it hit me like a ton of bricks. And I looked at my husband, I go, honey, it's happening. And he's like, what? I go, I'm happy for no good reason. I feel like lowering with my joy. And it was so powerful. And it just came at the right time. It. Because right after I was diagnosed with the type 1 and then right after that I was diagnosed with the pancreatic tumor. So he came into my life at the right time. And I'll tell you, when I do the meditations and he tells you to kind of. You're basically making a movie of what you want to happen in your life, what you would like to see. I would be doing the meditations and in the middle of it be like, oh, shit, the doctor just told me that. So I would visualize and meditate on what I wanted the doctors to say to me verbatim. And it would happen.

Wow.

Oh my gosh. You just called me last night and said that I can take that off the list. I take it off the list. And then soon enough I'd have to recreate a whole new movie because everything was manifesting.

Wow. Did you do any of the hands on healing where you healed other people when you were there?

I was the healey, not the healer. But I did do an offshoot. You know, sometimes they do those offshoots.

Yeah, they do some here in Austin. I've been to this.

Yeah, okay. So I went to someone's house. I had a crazy experience. So I go to the house, I'm late. And I didn't learn kind of the process, but I've. I've always had an ability. It's not, you know, honed or anything, but I've always been able to feel in and see things and whatever. So I was like, I have good energy, I'm just gonna get in. So they're like, go, go work on this guy. And I just put hands over this guy. And I kept having this pain and it was really, really strong. And at the end of the session, I was like, should I say something? No. Should I say something? He's gonna think I'm nuts. So finally I go up to him and I go, can I ask you a question? Are you. Is there something going on in this region? He's like, how do you know? I was like, I was getting pain there, and I know it's not me. And he's like, I literally flew from Mexico yesterday to have these doctors, you know, give me another opinion at Cedars. And I was like, yeah, I feel it there for you.

When you talk about that, are you nervous that people won't believe you?

No, because I'm past that now.

Good.

I used to. I still kind of get scared of, like, the judgment a little bit, where I'm like, oh, they're going to think I'm nuts, but I really don't care about that either. Part of the healing I asked for with Dr. Joe was full mind, body and soul healing. And it's so funny because even just recently, I had another breakthrough where I'm like, I finally don't give a.

There you go.

It happened. People are mommy shaming me for taking care of my health. I got shamed for officiating my two very good friends wedding because they're gay. I'm like, and I don't care. And I'm not gonna judge you for your opinions either. How about that? I just. I don't care.

It's so funny because saying I don't care will trigger some people. And, guys, if you were triggered, when someone says they don't care about you being a critic, that means when you were a small child, someone said they didn't care and it hurt your feelings. And you're still playing that, and you should probably go do some work with Dr. Joe or EMDR or something. But it's not Maria's problem. It's not mine. The reason I ask you is when I started the biohacking movement, I actually am a scientist. You know, computer science, all that stuff. And I grew up in a house where no alternative anything was. Was the thing. In fact, if you even thought about it, you were an idiot. And over time, none of the normal stuff worked for me, and I started learning this. And when I started the biohacking movement, I thought, well, okay, how many weird things can I put into this where people are just gonna think I'm an aluminum foil hat guy? Which I'm not. Like, I'm not into conspiracy theories and things like that.

Well, that's not the Definition of a scientist, right?

Yeah. And, but I am willing to say, like, there's weird stuff going on and the current story is wrong, but I'm just not the guy who goes. And it's because you don't know that either. But what happened over time is I'm like, all right, I'm going to mention, you know, that I did work with gurus in the Himalayas and Andes and from China and just all, all this stuff and breath work and some mystical things just kind of salted in there. And I've done shamanic training, but I'm not a shaman. And I, I, I'm open about it, but only 10% open. So people like, look, this is part of biohacking, but over the past couple years, maybe I've got some of that same. I just don't care if you don't like it, because biohacking is a 10 or a $63 billion market, depending what, which reports you. You do. But I, I started that. But I have a question for you here, and this is kind of philosophical, because you're at that same point, people come in and they try to shame you or make fun of you for whatever, and you're like, you don't care. Do you ever, like, play with them because it's funny?

No, I don't think I'm there yet, but show me an example.

Well, I'll get people who will make, like, the most ridiculous comments ever. And one guy's like, he looks old enough to be my dad. And I'm like, I've lost 100 pounds, and, yeah, I got some extra skin and I'm 6% body fat, and you'll see me soon on a major national TV show with my shirt off because they wanted to film it. And I don't care if you want to make fun of me or my stretch marks or whatever, I'm ripped. But I thought about this guy's comment saying I could be his dad. So I just wrote back and I said, don't ask your mom about this, please. Seriously. And that hundreds of likes on, on the comment. So now I play with the trolls.

I love it.

They're acting like kids. Like, let's go down to kids. Like, can we make mom jokes about each other? Like, this could be so fun. And it's just a sense of joy and laughter. It's not even, it's not even the apathy where it's like, oh, my gosh, look where, look where their mindset is. And I've had so much fun on Instagram. Just being like, oh my gosh, like, let's see, you can be dumber than the other one. And I usually went on dumbness. And it's fun, so you gotta try it.

I used to. And then somehow would become friends with some of the people that would attack me.

Yeah.

Now I play the scenario out with Kevin. Like any of the people who, you know, were shaming me for, you know, taking care of my health, so I, you know, don't have another life or death situation. I was like, oh, yes, motherhood about a ball else. Okay, so I should potentially die so I can be with my child 24 7, that I can live up to your standards of mommyhood as opposed to leaving to go heal myself and come back and be able to live another 40, 50 years with my kid.

Like, there you go.

And, you know, I. I play the scenario out because these people are so incited as it is. I don't need to add to their incitement, to their anger. And so I've kind of just given up. What I've done in these situations now is I'll heart a few of the wonderful people that go fight the fights for me.

Oh, yeah, I'll do that too.

Yeah. So I'll just. It's not about fighting, just so people know where I stand. I'm like, thank you, thank you. But I leave it alone because they're obviously troubled. They're obviously either jealous or, you know, or just are really in their opinion, and that's fine. I think one of the biggest problems we have today is we're not respecting the fact that we're not all the same. We don't all have the same opinions, we don't all have the same beliefs. And so I'm gonna try not to judge other people. Just like, I don't want to be judged myself. But like I said, at this point, I'm really getting to a place where all that matters to me is my family and our health and our well being. By the way, people matter to me. I'm not saying, like, I. I care about everyone in our heel squad.

Yeah, you. You care about people. You just don't care about the fact that some people are trying to troll you. It doesn't affect you anymore.

Exactly. That's the point. Yeah.

I'm still surprised that people do that because on social media today, whether it's a good or bad thing, we can actually know who you are. And the Internet never forgets.

Yeah.

And people who say really mean things five years later, like, oh, my gosh, I just got called out on that.

So sometimes I'll go to their profile because I'm like. Like, I need to know who this person is. They're really, really angry. And it's like, someone's like, christian, mom. And I'm like, wait, how are you Christian? Like, the basis of Christianity is, like, you know, love and whatever you.

It's forgiveness. Like, of the major world religions, that's the forgiveness one.

This makes no sense.

But anyway, I laugh at it, and I. I wanted to check in with you on that because for some reason, people get a little bit mean when it's a health thing, and you didn't. I think you're actually underplaying what happened. This was only about a year ago, but part of your pancreas, your spleen, 17 lymph nodes all taken out, and.

A fibroid the size of a baby.

Oh, my gosh.

I was moving my rectum and my tailbone into a whole other stratosphere.

That would hurt so bad to have your tailbone pushed out of place. Oh, I can't even imagine.

It was. It was rough.

Are you still in pain from all the procedures?

No.

See, that is a beautiful thing, and that's that internal healing where, like, the interface between the mind and body heals differently than the body heals. And so many people have a healed body, but their mind doesn't know it. What fixed your pain perception in. In the course of your healing?

I mean, listen, I had so much to look forward to, too. I had a baby coming. So for me, it was. Like I said, I just kind of like moving forward. I don't like being stuck. And so I gave myself the time it needed to heal. It's not like I was rushing myself. And it was very painful, very painful. And then at some point, it wasn't. And then I moved on. And, you know, I just. We roll through things in this house, Dave, like, shit happens where we know how to roll through. And I'm so lucky and blessed and grateful to have support. I have my dad, who stayed with me and cooked for me and helped me, and my husband, who slept in the hospital with me every night. I was never alone. Wonderful nurses and doctors, like, I. I had a really good support system. I know that's not always the case. So, you know, that also helps in. In the healing process, for sure.

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It wouldn't be stereotypical. You know, I think where we've gone is, is really sad because, you know, you guys, guys, I mean, you go to work, you don't really bring it home. You get on Sports Center. This is me being stereotypical. You get to Sports center and you just, you go to bed and it's good. Like, we have to go to work now, by the way, when women entered the workforce, no responsibilities were taken off of our plate. We still have to maintain the house, take care of the kids, book the vacations, handle all the health care for everybody. We have to do everything.

Come on, you got TV dinners. I mean.

Since before Barbie. Okay. And then as women, we have to make sure aesthetically we stay pleasing in, in whatever way we feel. So we're getting our hair colored, we got to get our nails done, we got to go to the gym, we got to do this, we got to do that. There's so many things as a woman we have to get our makeup done, our hair, so many things that we have to do just to get out the door that you guys don't have to do. So, yes, our stress levels are very, very different. And we're supposed to be superheroes and do it all with a smile and look hot and whatever. So it's an exhausting process. Process. So, yeah, stress, I think, has been a really, really hard thing for women. If we're being stereotypical and we're just painting with one swatch, it seems like.

There'S a difference often, but not always in the way that women and men will take on stress from others as well. And I've heard you talk about that before. Do you think it's because maybe women on average are more empathetic than men? So if you have more empathy and you know, it's the kids, it's your job to take care of the K that your body feels it differently. Not everyone's the same. But just on, on average, like there's, there's tendencies it traits.

How often are men gaslit?

It happens.

Women are really gaslit.

Okay.

We're gaslit left and right. We're told we're crazy left and right. So. And we are empathetic and we are, you know, yeah, we are.

We're.

We're all of those things you guys, guys have. You guys have this kind of unwritten thing where you guys all have each other's backs. And that was not always the case for women. What?

This is the funniest thing ever.

It's true.

You think guys all of each other's backs. I mean, you should check out the comments section here.

Never heard of boys club.

There are bullied men out there.

I'm. I said we're stereotyping and we're painting.

There's a lot of those guys.

I'm not saying everybody. I'm saying if we're, if we're just being stereotypical.

Okay.

Because we're not, we're not speaking about all genders. We're not speaking about like all experiences. But just generally speaking, there's a boys club wherever you go to work as a woman and they're all help each other and you're alone trying to. Having to become so masculine to survive in there. That was where everything just kind of went amok.

You, you have a, a very good point there. And I, I talked to younger friends, men and women, and it seems like that is shifting in the workforce now compared to when you were building your career. Especially in the news. Right. That was the tech world where I built my career. Same thing. You know, if you were a wim. A woman software developer back then, like you had to like it. It was not a good thing. It was a good thing you were doing it, but it was not a good thing that, that the standards were very different for you. In fact, it was stupid that they did that. Today I know lots of software development women who just like I just do it. So I'm, I'm hopeful it's changing. Are you seeing a change in, in younger women? When you talk with them about this.

Yeah, I think it is. And I think women are getting stronger because every generation's gotta get better than the other. I mean, hopefully.

Do you really think men are getting stronger with 50% less testosterone than the last generation?

I was talking about women.

Oh, I thought you said men were getting stronger also. Okay, I missed the whoa. Part. But women also have 50% less testosterone than before because we're disrupting statistics that.

I'm not aware of.

Oh, yeah. So they talk a lot about the men's statistics, but it turns out sex hormone levels all over are dropping like crazy because of all the endocrine disruptors.

Yeah.

And women have more testosterone than estrogen. Yeah. So I'm, I'm hopeful that our next generation is stronger. And the facts are a little bit scary from, from a health perspective. So I'm, I'm doing a lot of work now. What do you do in your 20s to be highly resilient? Because you shouldn't be looking around with all of your friends being sick. You're supposed to look around with all of your friends being so healthy they can drink stupidly until they figure out it's bad for them like that. That's how it's been in your 20s for the last thousands of years until now. So I'm a little, I'm a little concerned about our environment. How much of your environment do you think? You know, toxins and lighting and EMFs or all the, all the environmental things. How much of that do you think Contributed? Your health vs stress and career stuff?

I think it's. There's like a lot of things that contributed. I just had a massive breakthrough recently too, but basically it's like, it's traumas, it's stress, and then, and then you add in. You're in studios with artificial light all day, all night.

Oh, yeah.

And you're on your phone constantly. And I traveled millions of miles. You're in a microwave oven on that plane, non stop dehydrating and, you know, getting French fried. And so. And I, I dealt with a lot of toxicity in the workplace too. That was really, really hard because. Just kept feeling like I, I just would just step on a rake and be like, wait, I thought you were nice. I was so excited to work with you. Bomb. Okay. Thanks, Tyson, for that round. And I think that we'll probably find out at some point in the future that IVF and pumping ourselves with synthetic hormones is not maybe the greatest thing in the world.

Yeah.

Because the brain tumor was identified shortly after that. For me, it was just growing and growing, and I was in so much pain. So I think that that was a contributor as well. I think, you know, there's been a lot of statistics around Covid and type 1 diabetes and diabetes in general that are really interesting. And I just think the blue light has been a killer and the sunscreen and all of that and being away from nature and. And out of the sun. And so I've recently just been on my little experiment, you know, kind of tracking what that all would be if you did the opposite. So I'm in the middle of it. Hence my super tan. Love it.

I love it. Is it real?

It's so real. I was at the coffee shop yesterday, my baby so white, and I'm like, bright orange now. And this woman goes, that's your baby? And I just looked at her and go, yeah, we look a little different, don't we?

It's kind of funny. It. It happens. And I used to take the kids out when they were little, and we'd, you know, take off their clothes and put them in the backyard for a half hour in the sun. And baby skin is soft, and you don't want to have a dark tan. But they were tanner than other babies, I think. Vitamin D and strong bones and immune systems, and they're crawling in the grass and earthing, and the grass didn't have glyphosate on it.

Yeah.

And seems like it works. But now what I do is I inject something called melanotan or msh, which is a peptide that increases your body's ability to grow a natural tan really rapidly. You ever try that?

I don't want to do anything that exogenously that can be done endogenously, and the sun can give me that without it. So I don't like to take anything that I don't have to like. I know that magnesium can be an issue for me, so I'll supplement with magnesium. I'm very, very low on the supplements. I think we've gone a little crazy on it.

I only do 150 pills a day. That's not that crazy, right?

No, you don't.

I totally do.

You do 150 pills a day?

Yeah, but I'm gonna live to at least 180. And so some of these are advanced longevity strategies. Like. Well, they make mice live 30% longer. They're probably not bad. For me, I'm willing to do that. I wrote a whole big book about it. I went really deep on the research.

I love it. Well, I. Listen, everyone can do whatever they want with their own body.

Right.

So I love people who are willing to experiment. I mean, I feel like I guinea pig on myself with certain things, too. Like. Like I'm guinea pigging with the sun and stuff like that. But, you know, even with my mom, when she was sick, I would have to use my kind of internal guidance and my instincts, like, okay, does this feel right? Does that feel right? Like we were using a supplement for the brain? Oh, gosh. What? Benign.

Oh, yeah. Geez. I was the first podcaster years ago to bring that stuff out. And then I partnered and when I was running Bulletproof, and I have nothing to do with Bulletproof now.

You might have told me about it back then, actually.

Yeah, I think I did. It was before we even launched that.

If I go back to that podcast, I bet you anything you're the one who told me about it.

Yeah.

And I think it was helpful in her journey.

In Europe, it's an orphan drug for glioblastoma, brain cancer, and in the US it's something that primes the mitochondrial pump to make mitochondria work better. So. Fascinating. Wow. I. That goes way back in time, doesn't it?

Yeah, that's what she had. She had glioblastoma. So that's why I say this show has been so helpful. And that's why I steered into this, because I had a SiriusXM show interviewing celebrities. And when my mom got diagnosed, I needed help, so I needed people like you to come in, and there would be some nugget that would come through that would feel right and resonate, and I would say, okay, this feels good. Let's try it. And my mom got five years with glioblastoma.

I think that played a role, to be honest. I've.

I do, too. But also, we did a lot of work in Mexico where they optimized her immune system so she could handle the barrage of drugs. I always say, like, if your immune system's being murdered by a disease and now you're going to crush it with more chemo and all this other stuff, like, we got to see how can we keep the balance. So optimize the immune system to handle it. I mean, this is just my common sense kind of shit. I'm not. I'm not even a scientist, but I have good gut instincts, and I would. I would hear things, like you said, with the benign, and I would implement them. And then what I realized at some point is she was on this cocktail that this woman I interviewed, this woman comes into the show. I think her name was Jane McClelland and she had a concoction she created to beat all these different cancers. And it was like doxycycline, Avastin medicine. There was like five things. And I go, oh my God, my mom's on four of the five things. I didn't even realize. And. And then they created this whole protocol based on that that people were using after. And I was like, this is kind of cool.

It's amazing what can happen. I had a friend, actually an employee, years ago, really bad brain injury. I said, look, here's the protocol. And. And I said, on top of that, why don't you go see my dear friend Dr. Daniel Amen @ Amen Clinics.

He's been here too. We love Dr. Amen.

He's such a genuine human being. And, and I'm on his board of directors now. Even though his work changed my life 20 years ago. Like, I get to, I get to say thanks.

Wow.

And she goes to see Dr. Amen. She goes back goes. He says, you the same thing. Like, I'm not Dr. Amen by a million years. But the basics, there's a lot of us who know it, but you have to, as someone listening to the show, you just heard Maria who healed say I don't do supplements. And you heard me say that I don't need to eat anymore because I just eat fistfuls of supplements. Okay, not quite. But which one of us is right? It turns out neither one of us. Like, we're both following whatever makes us feel better and even measurably perform and be better. So you know, if I know, if I do no supplements, I get pretty sick. Cuz my. I have really unhealthy background. So I, I place myself in this state with my intake of stuff and I'm happy about it. But if I didn't need to do that to feel the way I do now, or maybe if I knew how to do it, I, I would take less. But when I take less, I. My rate of aging accelerates or I just don't feel good.

Like, have you checked your telomere lengths and stuff? And you see a difference?

I have. In fact, I've been doing this. I wrote one of the major longevity books called A Superhuman A few years ago you might have come across your desk. And today my rate of aging twice. I've measured it beyond telomeres. It's called a DNA methylation test. My rate of aging on One test was 69%, the other was 72%. That would put me in the top five on the longevity Olympics.

Wow.

Brian Johnson's at 72%. And here's the funny thing. Brian eats 20 grams of animal protein per day and kind of talks about almost being vegan. I do 200 grams of animal protein a day, and I got the same longevity numbers.

Isn't that wild?

So I'm pretty sure there's individual variations.

Yeah.

But the fact that I'm aging less, you know, three. Less than three quarters as fast as the general population, I feel good about that. But you may be aging less quickly, too, with, you know, taking some magnesium, who knows?

Yeah. I haven't done mine in a while. I did it two years ago when I was first diagnosed with type 1 diabetes, and I think it was, like, either a year ahead or a year behind, whatever my age was at that time. Telomere lengthwise. So I'd be curious to see after the blessing of the type 1 diabetes, because now, because I wanted to beat it, I ate in such a way where I would use the littlest amount of insulin. So that just meant protein and veggies, by the way. I got off all insulin for months until they severed my pancreas.

And.

And so anyhow, I'd be curious to see what it's at now, after all of the lifestyle changes that I've been able to implement.

When we're done with the show, I know a guy who's growing genetically engineered stem cells to replace your pancreas.

No way.

And so normal stem cells, the ones that I've used for longevity, kind of go everywhere. They stick to stuff, they make stuff heal, and then they kind of go away. But these are edited to be like baby stem cells, the ones you had when you were a baby that. That become new tissue.

So it regenerates the pancreas.

Yeah.

Wow.

Would that be kind of cool? Your liver can regenerate. Why shouldn't your pancreas? Well, I think this guy's cracked the code.

Wow.

I'll. I'll make a connection afterwards, because, yes, you might be a good. A good candidate for his trial.

Yeah.

Isn't that kind of cool? Like, in the next five years, the. Our ability to control our biology feels like it's going through the roof. And you do that, and then you do some of the meditation and awareness work that you clearly know how to do, because you've always been intuitive, it sounds like, then who knows what you might do? It could be really interesting.

Yeah.

I want to know about some of the biohacks that you've done. Do you do red light therapy?

I did it this morning for 26 minutes.

Do you do it over your abdomen or over your face or both?

So I have a full body one.

Cool.

And I lay on a massage table and my red lights suspended from the ceiling so it's inches off my body.

Very cool. And you're getting a massage on the massage table? No, it's not an automatic massage table. You just lay on the table.

I just lay on the table so that it's comfortable.

Okay.

And I have an infrared sauna as well.

My next question.

I have a cold plunge.

You sound like a biohacker.

And then I have my trampoline for my fascia.

Nice.

What else? I do the methylene blue. Oh, ice face baths.

Oh, yeah, those are cool. I read about those in my. In the bulletproof diet. This is in 2014, like 10 years ago. And then got more into it in the last book. Just saying, if you just stick your face in ice, it's almost as good as a whole cold plunge. But it also makes your face look younger, right?

Yeah. It wasn't for the. The esthetic. My doctor told me, like, a list of things that would be helpful for health wise. So. So I do that and then sunrises and if I can, sunsets. Now sunsets are becoming mandatory. But before, for the last two years, I never miss a sunrise. And I get as much light on my body without sunscreen.

You are doing all the healthy stuff. And these are all biohacking things.

Oh, I didn't know I was a biohacker till now.

Like, you know, if you go back, actually 12 years now, none of these any sane person would do. And so these are sort of like the high performance behaviors that I inserted into it. And you know, our big conference where Joe is speaking, Judge Spend is speaking, we have hundreds of vendors now who make these kinds of things. And. And now they're kind of what the cool kids do, because the cool kids want to feel good and they want to look good and they want to be smarter and faster and all that. But I've met a few really successful cancer survivors who just get a. Get a diagnosis. They're like, this is wrong. And then they just go all in on fixing their mitochondria on the theory that cancer is usually mitochondrially caused or at least involved. So they do it, and all of a sudden they break all the rules. And the doctors say, you know, you should have lived for a week, and you lived for many, many years. I think it's all about Grounding and sunshine and quality fats. Yeah, you do that. Okay, cool. I was guessing when you're. You're getting the sun, you're probably barefoot because that's how you do it. What about ozone therapy?

I haven't done ozone therapy.

Interesting.

There's a few things that I've not felt safe about and I just follow my instincts. And hyperbaric chambers are another one.

Oh, wow. Those are common for cancer, but you didn't need to do either one.

Just never felt good about it. I recently did this new thing called the stratosphere. Have you heard of it?

What's that?

So the stratosphere is mimicking what the Sherpas did.

Oh, yeah.

With elevation changes. Kind of the opposite of hyperbaric.

It's called hypobaric.

Yeah.

Instead of hyperbaric. Yeah, we do that at Upgrade Labs. So when you come into. We have 27 locations being open. So people and do that as part of their membership.

No way. Yeah, it's 27 places now.

27 signed up. There's a couple open and the other ones are all in the stages. Austin should be opening up in the next month here and more franchisees are signing up. By the way, guys, own and upgrade labs.com. if you only open one in your town and it. It's because I feel like if you'd have had access to that stuff and we told you exactly what to do to feel and get your energy back before you had anything going on, it would have been a higher quality of life just in general, and you wouldn't have got anything going on. Like you get your energy now and then, you just have less risk of all sorts of stuff. If I'd have had that stuff when I was 20, oh my God, the millions of dollars and all the suffering and stuff. So I. I feel obligated to bring it out. Even though, you know, running a physical facility is harder than running an e commerce company. I just do both because I feel like we've got to have access to these things. And if you hear that, well, Maria and Dave have these crazy technologies that they get to do, but there's no way I could do it. Well, yeah, there's a way. It's five miles from your house and you can be a member. That. That's the vision. You know, it's going to take a little while, but I'm. I'm in for it.

I love it. That was actually my dream for the last few years. I'm like, we need a place we can actually go to. Yeah, when we have things like this. Because like, for example, I bought a red light unit and sent it to my best friend who just dealt with breast cancer because I heard her talking about how she was going to finally listen to me and try it. And it was like a 25 minute ride and there were always booked. And so finally I was like, you know what? I'm just going to send her one. Because when you're sick, the, the exhaustion that people have to go through to piecemeal some of this stuff. Right. Then they give up. Yeah, you can't. Okay, I gotta go to acupuncture here, gotta go do this over there. We really do need one place that we can go that's trusted, that has stuff. And then what I always say is, just like we talked about earlier, you have to be the CEO of your health. You have to decide what's right for you. We can all say, this worked for me. That worked for me. I read this, I read that. Just like, just like in politics, everyone says their side and who knows who's right? Everyone's so vehement, they're right. Jobs are up. No, jobs are down. Well, which one fucking is it? And everyone's got facts to say both. So it's the Scarecrow and the wizard of Oz, they're pointing in both directions. So you have to make the decision for yourself, what feels right for you.

Okay, I want to go a little bit deeper on something you said earlier and what you just said now. You said you have to go deeper on what feels right for you. You also mentioned earlier that you've always been intuitive and seen things and you just, you have. Some people can, some people don't. And seeing things are just feeling things. And you say, well, it just didn't feel right to go do that thing. So I didn't do it. People say, dave, how do you know what supplements to take for the first couple years? I said, well, I'm just going to do the same thing every day. I'll be very rigorous and scientific. And then I also became, I know what all of them do and I know how all of them feel. And if I reach for a supplement in the morning and my body says, I don't want that, I just don't take that one.

Yeah.

And what inspired me was a rancher I interviewed many years ago on the Human Upgrade. And he was a soil biologist and had a head of 300 cattle who are almost wild. And he said, the reason that they're so healthy and they taste different is they're walking on wild rangeland that we, we wouldn't want to turn into farmland. And they smell some grass. I don't want that. And they go over and they, they eat that other one. And they eat one bite of this plant and that they're actually, with every bite, selecting the appropriate stuff for their microbiome and for their biology and everything. And if cows can do it, we ought to be able to do it too. And started paying attention. And some of this goes into Joe's work, Joe Dispenza's work. He's going to go through some of the science behind this. But what I've observed at my neuroscience clinic, when you go really deep into these meditative states, is there's three things that come up for you. And I want you to say if, if this makes sense to you and you experience the same thing, or if you have a different version of this. When you decide whether you want to do something, whether it's take a supplement or do a treatment or just whether you want to hang out with somebody, very quickly, your body will give you knowledge like a yes or a no. And. And you may be from a lineage says, well, you know, that's God talking, or that's the collective consciousness, or okay, whatever. You get a almost instantaneous knowing. And then right after that, you get an emotional response, right? Which usually if it's not a positive emotional response, it's a trauma programming response. And then right after that, your brain has a chance to kick in. And then you get an ego response, which is brain going, ignore the emotion. Because my emotions always get me in trouble. They're probably stupid. But when we ignore the emotion, we also ignore the intuition. Is that accurate in your view of things? And how do you know it's your intuition, not your emotions and not your ego?

Well, sometimes it's confusing. Sometimes, I don't know. I think for me, first of all, I also, I do lean on my naturopath, Dr. Allison, a lot in the journey because I trust her. She's well read and well studied. So sometimes I will run things by her. Not sometimes I run things by her all the time. I run my theories by her. Like, I was taking L thiamine, this supplement, althiamine. And at some point, point I was taking it, and it was like there was a real visceral reaction. It would smell like skunk for a second. I'm like, this can't be good. Something's going wrong. It was before the pancreas tumor. So something was reacting in there with it. And I was like, I'm stopping this because it doesn't feel right. And she was like, yep, 100. Stop it. So sometimes I, I, I'm relying on outside help, but when I'm, when I'm listening to myself. So with the hyperbaric chamber, for example, there was conflicting information. There were people that said the oxygen proliferates cells, and then there was opposite saying, this was so good for cancer, blah, blah, blah. And so when it's so conflicting, I take that, I feel, and I'm like, no, not till there's more information. Not right for me yet. I'm not willing to make that gamble.

The truth on Hyperbaric is, is exactly what you said. If you do the genetic analysis of your tumor, you can figure out whether it's one that likes hyperbaric or hates hyperbaric. And if you don't know, the odds are it hates hyperbaric. But there is a chance it could make it worse. And if your intuition's like, don't go in there. You might want to listen to your intuition unless you've had a genetic analysis. Because, yeah, I have the same time. Sometimes there's, yeah, I just know that. And other times going, is that an invisible program that's running that I haven't figured out that I have yet? And it, it's just a constant, a constant process to just say what happened first, what happened second? And was it, you know, positive or negative emotion? And then what I think about it, and I've just learned to trust that first one.

The other thing I do is I'll meditate and I'll ask for a sign. And by the way, it's like, so insane. I was meditating in the Dominican Republic the other day, and I was like, okay. Because he says, ask for a sign. And so I asked for the sign. I said, send me a single feather. And it has to come in a way I would least expect it. And so I leave my meditation in the house. I go outside to the golf cart. I go to sit on the chair, and there's a single feather on the seat.

Oh, my gosh.

But my signs come just like that. They're always so mind blowing, like, holy, holy. It's in a garage and there's a single feather in there. Anyway, I will, when I'm confused or conflicted, I'll ask for signs. I'll pray, I'll wait. And usually there's something that comes together to tell me yay or nay if I'm confused. Other times it's very like, no, not Right. For me. Nope. I'm too afraid of that. Or. And if I'm afraid, I'm listening because there's something emotional, like you said, that's telling me there's a reason for it. And I've learned when I don't listen to myself, I get into trouble. So I really try to listen.

Yeah, the learning to listen is. Is something I was truly terrible at when I was at my unhealthiest. In fact, I would do something a little different than you. You talked about how when you were. You were feeling anxious, you felt ashamed that you felt anxious when you just, you know, like, hey, I'm going in for a procedure where I might die, and you were released from the shame. I was in a situation where I can't be feeling fear or anxiety because there's no reason to feel fear and anxiety, therefore, I'm not feeling it. So when you think you're not feeling something and your body is actually feeling that, that creates a different set of problems. There's some similarities there, but those are really common mistakes that, like, well, I shouldn't be feeling this way or I'm not feeling this way. It doesn't matter. Feelings aren't rational. They just do what they're going to do.

Yeah, well, there's a disconnect in the brain and the body at that point.

What do you do for that?

Meditate? Pray. You know, I think there's. There's definitely, like, a lot of different scenarios I could probably play out right now like that in my head, where you don't feel like. Like, are you. Some of them, it sounded like you didn't feel like you deserved to feel that way. Right.

It wasn't about deserving. It was just that why would I feel afraid unless there's a threat in the room? Therefore, whatever feelings I have, they can't be fear. Therefore, I. I don't, you know, I. I don't have any fear in me.

Yeah, I mean, I talked to my husband. I guess when that kind of stuff happens where I have someone trusted, where I'm like, this doesn't make sense.

I'm.

I'm being, you know, crazy right now. And he's like, no, you're not crazy. You have a trauma that's triggered you to feel like this or whatever.

It's usually something that's a trauma. In, in my experience, it's something you either learn as, as a kid, and it's just a belief about reality. And that can be just societal programming. And if it's got real big teeth it's usually societal programming plus a trauma about it. You were ashamed as a kid or something, and it just feels like it's happened over and over to you. Even though it might not be as big of a deal, you feel like it's a bigger deal than it is. We'll put it that way.

Yeah. Yeah.

I recently did a whole podcast on Yoga Nidra with this really amazing Buddhist woman who lives in northern New Mexico. Now, after a lifetime of teaching this. And I first started writing about it and sharing it in 2018 on. On social media and on my blog. And recently, Andrew Huberman's come out and said to you, yoga Nidra, big deal. It really is effective. You used Yoga Nidra as a part of your. As a part of your path as well. When did you start doing it and how has it affected you?

It might have been around that time. Like, it was years ago, because it was before Dr. Joe.

Oh, wow. Okay. So going back, yeah.

Because I had started with tm, and that was just not really working for me. And then I had some friends on Yogi Cameron and his wife who talked about Yoga Nidra on the show. And prior to them coming on, I had started using one I found on YouTube. Basically, I YouTubed Yoga Nidra. It was the first one that popped up. And this woman, I loved it because you can lay down, and she just takes your awareness to different places. So she would say your pinky finger, your fourth finger, your middle finger. Focus on your index finger and your whole body. And by the time the 20 or so minutes was done, Dave, I felt like I had napped for three hours. I would feel so great. And it was more. It was way more helpful to me than TM had been at the time. And, you know, quieting the mind is really hard. That's why Dr. Joe was the next step, because he really teaches you how to change your personality, to change your reality, how to really become cognizant of what thoughts are going on in between your ears and how to kind of tame that beast. And so. And I really liked his meditations because it wasn't just listen, you know, to music and say a mantra in your head and. And pretend you're not thinking thoughts. I'm swatting thoughts all the time.

And.

And that's why I feel like his program is the program to do. I don't think there's anything really better at the moment that I've come across. One of the things when I'm trying to get people into this is I say start with Yoga Nidra.

Yeah.

There's no place where your brain can really start to think about things. That's why it's brilliant. You can really just. If you're going to follow along and not miss a beat, you've got to focus. And then you, you fall into a lull that's so beautiful. And so from there you want to change your reality and really work on your life. Dr. Joe takes you to the next level.

I am such a fan of, of the meditation practices with Dr. Joe and when he talks about the science where he says, okay, we looked at the genetic expression, microbiome, blood work, saliva and tears of 2,500 people. Meditating, doing my work. And here were the effects in each of those areas and here they are compared to statins, antidepressants and all sorts of things. He's kicking the pharmaceutical industry's ass just full on.

Yeah.

And I, I've spent some time with Dr. Patel, the lead researcher behind his work down at UC San Diego. And he's going to be coming to the biohacking conference as well. And I'm working where I'm going to get him on stage to talk about mitochondria. And what you realize here is that yoga, Nidra, the types of breath work and meditation that Joe does and what I layer on top of that is, is this reset process, which is a 40 years as in practice. And it's based. I discovered it with neuroscience and neurofeedback and you can do it without it. But it's this really profound, open hearted, compassion, forgiveness process of yourself or of others. Because it's one of those ways to deprogram that self. So that second voice where the first one is knowingness or intuition, the second one is trauma or programming. This is what I've used to go in and edit out the trauma, at least to the extent that I'm aware of it. And then there's that other. Well, I thought about it. How often do you have an option or a choice to make and your brain is a hell yes and your intuition is a no and you do it anyway.

Ooh, good question. I don't know. I can't think of anything. The moment.

If you go back 20 years, what would you answer with that?

Brain says hell yes, body says hell no.

Yeah, like you're going like this. This doesn't feel right. But it's a big deal. I want to do it. It's.

Yeah, yeah. Probably having a lot.

I did it a ton.

Yeah. I think I still might get sucked in once or Twice now, too, where you're like, oh, all right, I should do this. And then. But I'm really getting good at, like. I know it's, like, so counterproductive for my health at this point to do anything that does not resonate and feel good, because I'm trying to heal from so many things, and I'm just like, I just won't do it. You know? Like, I used to be so responsive, and if I look at my phone right now, I probably have 500 unanswered texts. I just can only do so much, and I'm not going to apologize anymore. I'm doing the best that I can with what I'm dealing with. So, yeah, I definitely think, will you give me a good example like that a billion times throughout my life? And then even here or there, they might still get me, but I'm pretty good at it now.

Maria, this is the first chance we've had in this episode for me to shame you.

Ah.

And you only have 500 unanswered text messages. I'm at about 1478 the last time I checked.

Okay, wait, let me check. Hold on. Maybe I'll be better. Okay, no, unread. Where does it say. Oh. Oh, I only have 49 right now.

Oh, my gosh. Shame.

One day in December, I felt so bad, and I was in. In my bathtub doing an Epsom salt bath, and I just started responding to people and being like. And by the way, like, really important people in my life, too.

Oh, yeah? Yeah. Dear friends. I don't see them sometimes. Yeah.

And, like, you know, important contacts and stuff. And I'm like, oh, my God, I'm so embarrassed. I'm so sorry. There's. There's just only so much time in the day. I have a baby, and I'm giving her everything I have.

There you go.

I have, I have my show. I have to do, obviously, to keep the lights on and, and do what my mission is and all of that, but I also have a baby and my family, and I can only do so much, and I'm so sorry. I love you. The thing is, is people know that I was always responsive. So I think people get it now, and they're kind and accommodating, I guess. But, yeah, I, I, I have to just do what's best for my health because I have to be around for this child.

You have the right priority, and if everyone listening to the show put your health as the number one priority, ahead of your relationships, ahead of your spouse, ahead of your job and Your career and head of your parents, all of that. That's. That's the big lesson. I always put career success. Had my health in my. In my 20s and early 30s. And it costs you greatly.

Yeah.

And you sort of feel like, oh, I'll just do it later. And when I work with my assistant and with my team now, I'm like, no, this is my priority. Right. It's first my health and second, my kids. Right. And third comes close relationships, and fourth comes my work. And I've built a very large company and I have six other companies now, so my work seems to be doing okay. Maybe it could be better at the cost of my health, which would make my work ruinous because my brain wouldn't work. So I'm hoping that people listening, especially if you're in that under 30 crowd or I'm spending so much time. Your health does come first. Right. And you can have all these other goals, but you're just a prime example of someone who got it. And you say, I need to be here for my family, which means I need to be here. And I just love it that you're so public about that on Heal Squad on your show, and you're doing a lot of people service just by being vulnerable. I take a screenshot now of the number of unread messages and I'll send a text to the people I haven't talked to. And again, sometimes there's billionaires and people. I'm like, hey, man, yeah, I didn't see your message. This is my inbox right now. I love you, I care about you, I'm interested. Sometimes I don't respond. If I don't respond, you have my permission to text me again and be like, you know, wtf? And maybe I'll see that one.

I love that. That's great.

So if that's helpful for you or anyone listening, there you go. That's what I got.

For the under 30s who are listening, this is what I share with them. Because, like, I had this real go getter working for me. I loved her and she'll still come in and out. And I said, listen, I know you're going to really, like, give everything you have to your career. You have a dream. That's amazing. Just if you can do one or two things better than, let's say I did, you will be in a better position. Because I don't want the message to be that, you know, because right now there's so many health messages. So even all the things I listed, people are like, oh, my God, how do you have time to do that in a day and still like put food on the table and all of that, right? Like it's just not feasible for everyone to do all of it. But I said to her, as long as you get your sleep at night, go to bed at 9, please, if you can go to bed at 9. And if you can just control what goes in your mouth, eat well. Don't abuse your body because you're in your 20s and you can, because in your 30s, it's going to be a thyroid issue and then it's going to be the gateway to everything else. And if you can get the morning sun, you can get that morning sunlight. And throughout the day, make sure your eyes, the retinas that, that take in that UV light can get that light. So your body knows what time it is when you're in production. Then your body knows at 3 o' clock or whatever, oh, it's 3 o', clock, let's start producing melatonin. So I can actually sleep tonight and stop using your blue light devices. After that it becomes dark. Or wear your blue light glasses if you have to. Whatever it is you can do, if you can make some small, you know, commitments to those things, you're going to be ahead of everybody else. I was eating fast food, Dave, every meal just to make day's meet, because I was doing 18 hour days.

Wow.

I was not sleeping because when I was sleeping, I was, when everyone was sleeping, I was working. That's when I would write my books and do things like that. So I wasn't sleeping, I wasn't eating right. I was totally taking advantage of my body because I thought being a workaholic was cool. I thought, well, if everyone else can work like that, so can I. All right, let's do this. I can do this. And it's not, you know, it's not good because ultimately it's going to get you. And the, the road backwards is so much harder to take. To get your health back is so much harder than to preserve it along the way, in my opinion. And now you don't get rerouted from your dream. You can continue to follow your dream and have them continue to come true. You're not going to be sidelined for a year with surgeries and, and health issues. So, you know, the under 30s, it's like there's just some little things you can really commit to that will make a huge difference in your life. And then you can have almost everything right. You, you always can't have it all. But you can almost have it all.

And you can probably have more energy than a lot of people in your.

Life without energy drinks and the 50, 000 coffees with 40 grams of sugar in each.

I remember back I, I was much, much younger, I think around 2008. I've been wearing blue blocking glasses since before they were cool, since before I started the biohacking movement.

Is that what Bono wears?

No, but one time at a celebrity poker tournament where I was not a celebrity, I was with real celebrities. Someone thought I was Bono. And it was one of the funniest things ever. It was at Ben Affleck's charity thing with Matt Damon. And I was laughing. I'm like, I think I'm a foot taller and he's a much better singer dead. Like there, there's no, there's no similarities between us.

Always wondered if that's what he was wearing. I forgot mine and I was racing in here. I normally mine, but.

Yeah, I think he's light sensitive. He almost has to be. And there's a number of people with Erlin syndrome, but I, I wore mine on stage for the first time at a computer security conference. And I was really self conscious. Like, I'm just. I know these led. These bright lights, they, they just make me dumb. I, I could feel them melting my mitochondria, probably not really melting, but I just, I, they, I still don't like them. And so I just said I was going to wear them and no one said anything. I was like, I don't know what's going on now they're, you know, kind of only halfway fat. Computer hacker hair. And afterwards, 20 times more people came up to me because they could recognize me, because everyone else looks like a guy in a sport coat and a guy in a sport coat with weird glasses. And it didn't harm my reputation the way I thought it would. And it was, it was why I started TrueDark, which is the first company to make, in fact, we had a patent pending for a while to make the glasses that control the color of the light. So it's not just blue light, it's a bunch of other colors and the angle and the brightness of it. So they actually mimic sunset. And it's a, it's a unique thing. It's not just blue loggers, it's not just red lenses. Cool. But TrueDark has been one of my favorite little companies that I've started. I don't talk about it as much as I should, but you just reminded me of that because the path to get there was, oh, wait, all these Studies are showing UVB and angle of incidence. And those are like early 2000 kind of studies. And that was why we had the patents filed and why we did all that work. But circadian biology is so hard to explain to people. Even with Sachin Panda from UC San Diego wrote a big book about it. It was like one month and then people forget. So the fact you just told everyone under, under 30, like, hey, go to bed a little earlier and see the sunrise, it's actually way more important than people think it is. Ultraviolet light in your eyes makes you need glasses less. And you could go outside. This is going to be sacrilege. Take off the sunglasses and you can look at your phone while the sun's outside. It'll still work. It's just not a good idea. But you could do it and it's still better.

Yeah. If I'm going to use my blue light devices, I'm outside.

Yeah. Very cool.

Because we live in a modern world. It's not like I'm never going to use my iPhone again, but I will use it outside so that I have full spectrum light to help. But circadian biology is so important.