Episode 465: Her 80-year-old Mother Beat Cancer Twice

Welcome to Cannabis Health Radio, where we share powerful real life stories from people around the world who are using cannabis as medicine. The goal of this podcast is to raise awareness of the healing potential of cannabis and is not intended as medical advice. And now, here's your host, Ian Jessup.

Foreign welcome to the Cannabis Health Radio podcast. I'm Ian Jessup. And joining us today from Utah is Roxanne Elmer, who last year shared the incredible story of her 78 year old mother overcoming stage four ovarian cancer. Now, recently, a new scan revealed a spot on her mother's liver and lymph nodes and doctors wanted her to begin chemotherapy again. Instead, Roxane turned to cannabis oil suppositories, something she first learned about on this podcast from Corey Ellen. And after just three months, her mother's latest scan showed no evidence of disease. Roxanne, it's good to see you again. Give us an update on this incredible journey of your mother. First of all, I want in case listeners didn't hear the first podcast, we did tell us about your mother's stage four ovarian cancer and how that was dealt with.

Yeah, good to see you too, Ian. Thanks for having me back. So she was diagnosed with stage four ovarian cancer the end of 2023. No, it was, yeah, end of 2023, she had a 14 centimeter tumor on her ovaries. And I, so the doctors obviously, they wanted, they wanted to start her on chemo and she, so she started doing weekly doses of chemo, but along with that, she agreed to try some of the my products. So I own a CBD and wellness shop in Utah. And she was, I, so I was like, hey, do you want to try cannabis? It will help you not only feel better, but maybe we can help with the disease as well. And so she started out at low doses of thc, high doses of CBD, and a product called methylene blue. And if you guys don't know what methylene blue does, repairs your mitochondria and it also helps oxygenate all of your cells. Well, cancer is diseased cells, so that makes sense, right? So she, she kept doing the chemo, but as she was doing the chemo, she had a much better outcome or than a lot of the patients. Her numbers dropped at a much higher rate than they expected. So her numbers started, her cannabis tumor markers started at 593. And so for a month before they got all of the stuff set up for the chemo, we had started this regimen of THC and CBD and the methylene blue. And she was taking four times a day. She was doing that regimen, except for the methylene blue was twice, but it was 80 to 100 milligrams of CBD and actually very low THC in the beginning because she did not want the high. And so we did more micro dosing with the THC in the beginning. But before she even started her chemo, I had them draw another test because for myself, I wanted to know was what we were doing helping. And lo and behold, her numbers dropped 120 points in that month before she even did any conventional medications. And she wasn't on any other medications. It was all what I was giving her.

That's it. You know, Roxanne, that's incredible. From 593 to about 470.

Yes.

Yeah. That's remarkable.

Right. Just off of natural medicine, you know, because I, I was like, you know, the whole, oh, there's no studies. I mean, we talked about this last time. There are there. You're just not looking for them. And also for myself, I wanted to know, was this gonna help her? I knew it would, but I. And I also wanted her to know too. It was like a confirmation that she was, you know, that it was gonna work. So continue on. Her numbers dropped higher or faster than they expected. They just kept dropping, even though she was doing the weekly chemo. But along with that, she just didn't look as sick as the other chemo patients. So having that natural medicine in her, she. I think she got sick like three times. She was a little bit nauseated, but she mostly kept her appetite. And except for the first day or two after her chemo, she was living life like normal. She was not laying in bed. She just. You could tell that she felt a lot better than most of those patients that were receiving chemo.

Well, you know, that's something that we hear all the time on how people who take cannabis oil while they're taking chemotherapy, and as a result of that, they don't have the severe reactions that other people do. And it's almost like they living life normally. And to, to a person, I think they all say, boy, if I knew what it had, what it was going to do to me, I wouldn't have done the chemo.

Oh, absolutely. You hear that a lot.

Yeah. So you might use.

It doesn't just target cancer cells, it kills everything, the good, the bad, all of it. And then you're left with, you know, the, the after effects, the brain fog. And that was another thing. She had a little bit of it. And I, I just told her the other day, I'm like, I don't really want to know. But what would have been the difference if you didn't take it during that time? Like I'm sure it, she would have been a lot sicker and not had as good of an outcome. So they, we got down to her numbers like every time would drop, drop, drop. And the doctors, even the doctor, the oncologist even said wow. He would never say, oh, you know, of course a hundred percent, like keep, you know, he wasn't against it, but he wasn't like, you know, gonna, gonna admit that it was, it was that. But he did say keep doing what you're doing. So it's like they almost like they can't say that.

Yeah.

But they, but they somewhat believe in it because they've been trained one way and that is through pharmaceuticals, conventional medicine, not looking at the core problem and trying to fix that. And so she ended up having a total hysterectomy and her numbers ended up being at 17 by the time she was done. But once again that like her numbers were dropping a lot faster than that than they expected. And so she had the total hysterectomy and then they wanted her to take Avastin, which is a, it's supposed to keep the cancer away. Right. But with that comes again side effects. And so she was like, she did one treatment and she decided no, it, it made her depressed, it changed her mood. She's never been depressed. And so she just did that one treatment. And then we continued. I mean this whole time she was using cannabis and the methylene blue. And so she didn't do that. And her first scan was clean. And then she had another scan that came up with the spot on her liver. And then her, all, all of her nodes, well, a few of her nodes were hyper metabolic, so. And that means cancer. So you have hyper metabolic nodes and that's what the, the dye reacts and, and lights up as they say. And well, so the first scan was a CT scan. I'll reverse. So the first was a CT scan. That's where they saw a spot on her liver. And then he wanted to do a biopsy and I said no, we're not doing a biopsy. Why don't we do a PET scan? A PET scan is a more definitive, I believe in Europe that is like the, the what they go to, like if they think you have cancer, you get a PET scan to confirm. It's the most entailed test that will show them like confirmed cancer. Well, he says, well, the health and the insurance doesn't pay for the PET scan like they will the other scans as much because it costs more. Right. So we were. We were still following up with her gynecology, gynecological oncologist, who had taken out her ovaries and was part of her. Or her total hysterectomy and was part of her. Her treatment plan. Like, they would, you know, get together and, like, this is her treatment plan. And so when we went to her, I asked her, I said, well, why. Why are we doing a PET scan? And she ordered the PET scan. So in the meantime, of course, the first oncologist started her. She actually did end up doing a couple doses of chemo. So she started back on the chemo, two doses, and we got the PET scan. In the meantime. Well, we couldn't get an answer back from the doctor. The gynecological oncologist said, I don't. There's nothing. There's nothing on here as far as on the liver. The part of the liver was gone or the part that they thought was on her liver didn't show anymore. So. But back up. In the meantime, when she had started the chemo, the second round of chemo, she started the suppositories. So I was like, mom, we can. This is. This is like the standard for, you know, systemic getting it through your system without getting the high. She never wanted the high. And so we got feco, or RSO as some people call it, fecal oil. And I made her suppositories, and she was doing those 20 twice a day. And they. I mean, I know that the protocol for cancer is a lot higher, like a gram a day, I believe. She wasn't doing that that much. She was doing 80 milligrams, suppositories twice a day before she started at the same time, she started chemo. And so then we went back and finally got an answer from the doctor, her oncologist, to confirm. And we were like, well, why are we doing chemo? This is like. It doesn't show anything on the liver anymore. So it was either that the scan was off or that.

In the meantime the suppositories worked.

Exactly. Yeah. And we actually. I wouldn't call it a confrontation, but he walked in the room, and he. You could tell that his demeanor was different, and he was very much on the defensive. And he even said, I feel there's some animosity in this room. And I never. I never felt animosity. But I was definitely gonna call him out on it. Like, well, so he. She was set to have another chemo treatment that same day that we met with the doctor. And so he's looking at the scans, and he's like, well, yeah, I don't see it on there on the liver anymore. It still showed hypermetabolic activity, though, in her nose.

Okay.

And so he was like, well, I said, well, what do you suggest? And he's like, well, I suggest. Suggest that she continue chemo. And I said, why? Chemo is not a preventative medication. It is not supposed to, you know. And I looked at my mom, and I said, it's up to you. This is your body, your choice. I said, oh, and in the meantime, what was. What is. What's weird, too, is that her numbers were. Were low on her tumor marker. Okay. The whole time, because they redraw, redrew her tumor marker. It was the scan that was. And. And he said, it. It can happen like that. Like, sometimes the marker will show and the scan won't, or vice versa. But I do know. I. And my thought was like. Like, I don't know. I. I don't know what. What it was exactly. But anyway, so she says, no, I don't want to continue chemo. So we walked out. So during this time in his office, he was like, well, this is great news. But then he was like, you could tell that he. Okay, so I'm gonna back up. I'm sorry. I got lost my train of thought. So he. During that visit before she stopped chemo, and we're continuing on where it still showed the hypermetabolic activity activity in her nodes. That was when he was like, well, I feel like kind of like we went behind his back, but I'm like, if you're not gonna order it, I'm gonna find somebody that can, because we need to know. This is not like we're just gonna give her chemo just because, you know, whatever.

Because you said so, right?

Because you said so. Yeah. And I'm like, there's no animosity here. I just want to know why. Why you didn't order the PET scan. Well, I offered you a biopsy, and I said we didn't want a biopsy. I said that that can help spread the disease. Well, that. That's not true. That's not true. They say that, but that's not. Like, people will say that, but that's been debunked, basically. And I'm like, whatever. You put something in there, you know, it's gonna Spread is my thought. So he, so we, he set up for three months to, to do the, the next scan and we walked out of there. No chemo. And she went back for a three month scan. And he's like, well, well, from here on out I'll just order a PET scan. So why can't you do that in the first place? Right, but now you're like, because I called him out on it. Like, you know, I think people have to like be aware and make sure that they're, they're looking into, you know, just because the doctor says so. With all due respect. No, like, you have to do your own looking.

Yeah. I think one of the issues too is that people who are diagnosed with cancer, it's very, it's a frightening diagnosis.

Absolutely.

And they, they're paralyzed. I don't want to say emotionally and mentally, but they're so scared that they will do what the doctor says in order to preserve their life. I mean, that's completely understandable. I understand it.

Absolutely.

But if people just have just a little bit of knowledge on the medical benefits of cannabis. Not necessarily. I think most people today have an idea that cannabis all. You just smoke it and get high. Well, no, that's not it. I mean, one of the reasons Cory and I started this podcast is because we want to help educate people on the medical benefits of cannabis. And doctors who say there are no studies. There are thousands and thousands of studies around the world about the medical benefits of cannabis and why were people taking it for centuries prior to the 1930s.

Because it worked.

That's right. Yeah. So how is, how is your mom today?

She's, she's absolutely wonderful. So the, so the very end scan that after taking the three months of suppositories and the still high amounts of CBD and the methylene blue, no evidence of disease that, I mean, he, we went back to, of course, they always have you back in the office to read the scan. And with my medical background, I, I could, I knew because I had access to it and I knew and I, I told her, I said, mom, there's nothing like. But yeah, no evidence of disease. And, and before we left that visit, it was quite humorous because he said, and I'm not, I'm not trying to down doctors get, don't get me wrong, I, I respect them. I think they have a lot of knowledge, but I don't think they have a lot of, in the way that they were taught, which is pharmaceuticals and chemo and you know, that sort of, sort of thing. But he says, well, well, I don't know if it was, who's to say if it was your medicine or my medicine. I'm just ecstatic that it's, it's gone. And I, and you know, I thought in my head, well, two rounds of chemo three months ago and she still had the hyper metabolic, you know, it, it's my medicine, you know, there's no doubt in my mind. But yeah, she's, I mean, I think her attitude and, and it, it has a lot to do with it. That's definitely something that she's always had a really good positive attitude. She's had family that are supported her and been around her and she said that has been one of the biggest things for her as well. But now that she's been off, hasn't had chemo for over six months and then before that she said that she's starting to feel like herself again, like fully like herself again. Like the poison has gotten out of her. Is that was what she said.

She's, she's what, still 78 or 79?

She will be 80 on Saturday.

Oh, 80, yeah.

So she was, she was 78 there when she got diagnosed the very end of that year and then, yeah, she'll be 80 on Saturday.

Does she take the cannabis on a maintenance dose now?

She takes, still takes one suppository a night and then she takes the three dose, four doses of CBD still every day with a smaller amount of thc. She's, her tolerance has gotten a little more, you know, over, you know, building it up over the years. But I'd say she's only taking about 15 milligrams of TH, 10 to 15 milligrams of THC through orally with, with the CBD, 100 milligrams. But then also the one she does the one suppository at night and she. One thing, she always says, I sleep so good. Oh yeah, yeah, she sleeps really good. But yeah, so she is. They bumped her up to doing it only every six months now. And I think I'm just gonna keep her on that maintenance dose of the high amounts of cbd, the methylene blue and the suppositories. I drop down to about 50 milligrams and that's once a day at night.

Tell her I'm a little disappointed. She doesn't like to get high, right?

Well, she did a couple of times in the beginning when I was giving it to her and she was quite funny actually, but she just, she doesn't. Yeah, she doesn't like that feeling.

I actually think it's, you know, if you don't overdo it, that's it. It can be a lot of fun.

It can.

Yeah. It's not like drinking alcohol and getting drunk. You just. You laugh and things are funny. You listen to music and you go into yourself a bit and discover who you are. Creative. Exactly. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's really good. So your mom will be. When we post this podcast next week, she'll be 80.

Yeah.

And that's very interesting. She sleeps well. She feels more like herself. And how. How is she emotionally through all this?

She's been pretty strong. Like I said, she's a strong woman. She. I think having family around and having that support is very, very important for somebody in this, you know, cancer journey. And I think your attitude, like I said, her attitude is positive. She's. She's. I. She was gonna start last time, she was gonna start back into crossing guard and bowling, and then she didn't end up doing it. But now she's gonna be a crossing guard and she's gonna be a sub for her bowling group, and she's living her life.

Oh, that's fantastic.

Yeah.

Roxanne, I want to kind of switch here a bit because before we started this podcast, you were telling me about your grandson's autism and cbd. I want you to tell that story because I think it's really, really important for parents to hear that.

Oh, absolutely. Yeah. So my grandson was. He was diagnosed actually pretty early at about age 2 with autism. And my daughter kept saying, I know something's wrong. And we're like, no, he's just a little delayed. Anyway, she knew, and so we got. She got him diagnosed. So he was non verbal, and it was about two and a half, closer to three when we started using CBD for him. So I used to be in the medical field and I. I just knew there was something better out there for all of these ailments, which I've used cannabis my whole life. I'm not going to say any. Like, I know. Even when I didn't know it was medicinal, it was medicinal when I wasn't using it for that intent. But. So we actually went to a CBD complex conference in San Diego and found out more. And there was a gentleman there that made his own CBD product for his son with autism. And so we were talking to him and come to find out that it can be really helpful with their sleep. A lot of autistic kids don't sleep through the night. He was. He Was about almost three and he was waking up every two hours, hours like an infant. He would have like meltdowns. Like I said, he was non verbal. And so after talking to this gentleman that was giving it to his son and actually made a company because of his son, a CBD company that was out of California, we just, my daughter was like, I was like, we are, you know, willing to try this. And she was like, yeah, let's try it. And so we got a water soluble CBD product. The other thing to note is like depending on your body obviously, but like what's going on in your body. So with autism there's a lot going on. And so what we learned was higher doses because it, you know, cannabis's job obviously is to put our bodies back into a state of balance. And so if there's more going on, it's going to take more to put that back into a state of balance. And so we were giving him probably 50 milligrams of full spectrum CBD, water soluble that we would put in his chocolate milk. And we were doing it three times a day so morning, afternoon and night. And lo and behold he started sleeping through the night. And then he seemed to have less medicine meltdowns. And a lot of kids that have autism also have adhd and so that, that constant, you know, just go, go, go. It wasn't like he was, you know, a lot. They'll put him on the medications and they become zombies. He, you didn't see that with him with the cbd. You know, it had that little bit of thc, but not enough to give him, you know, any kind of high as you will. And, and then he even started becoming, saying a few words. And I have heard stories ever since that about parents that have had similar effects and it's actually a qualifying condition in Utah for a medical card is autism. And so that right there is like, well, that tells you that it's, it does something for it, right. And so he wouldn't take it for a while because one thing with autism is they're very particular about tastes and foods. And so at one point he could taste it and so he would refuse it. And then, then we found a gummy that he would take that tasted okay to him, I guess. And now he did. He takes a smaller dose now just because it's not as available as when I had the water soluble. We've got to find a product that has a little bit more THC in it. But such a, I mean, in fact, in my CBD store I offer A discount for people with autism, because I know how much it helps. I've seen it firsthand and I want people to be able to, you know, because it can get expensive.

Oh, yeah, yeah.

And of course, insurances won't pay for anything like that. And so if I can reach enough people and just change their mind about, like, hey, just look at this. Just, there's something to it. I, I have two personal stories. I mean, in my own personal story, really, like I said, I used it for probably depression my whole life, and I didn't even realize it, you know, but.

So how is your grandson today? You said he started around two, two and a half, and now he's nine?

Yes, he's nine.

Have you seen a lot of progress with him?

Yes. So he, he has, he actually started public school last year, was the, for his first year in public school and he got an achievement for, he's trying to read. He, he still has his meltdowns. He has his, his, his time, but he sleeps through the night still to this day. And yeah, he has progressed. So she had him in a special autism school until last year and then started him in public school just going like half a day. But he, he'll, you know, he's trying to read. He's, he, he knows ABCs. He, he's a lot more, he's definitely verbal now, but, you know, if people realize that's that's what cannabis does, you know, we have all these ailments and, and all these things wrong with our bodies, and its job is to put it back into where it was meant to be. Our bodies are actually made for cannabis.

Roxanne, in conclusion, what do you think is the biggest challenge that we face, specifically with politicians around the world in making cannabis legal, both recreationally and medically? I mean, if we can allow alcohol to be legal, which has a really devastating effect on society in some regards, not saying that having a glass of wine now and then is bad, but with cannabis, my perception is that people think it's just a, about getting high. And you know, what, what if people want to get high? Who cares?

Why is that any different than getting drunk?

Exactly. Yeah.

And you don't see the, you know, like the domestic violence that you see. In fact, I have a couple of cops, police officers that come in to visit my shop quite often, and I've talked to them about it and they're like, I would much rather come across somebody that's high than drunk. Yeah, like, but I think the biggest thing is education. If, if they would really Stop and look at the science of it all. There is no doubt, you cannot deny that this is a medicine and that our bodies are made for it. Sadly, I don't know. I think if we could get rid of, you know, all the big money that's going into it, because that's what it comes down to. Like, how can you look at all of these stories and not know that this works and deny people the right to choose whether they want to put a poison in their body or whether they want to put a plant in their body? That should be their right. And so I think it's controlled by big pharma. Big money. People have the money to pay big alcohol. You know, they don't. They don't necessarily want cannabis to be legal because they've already seen numbers drop on, on their cells. But, but if they, if people would stop and be. Actually be educated about it and, and open their minds. Like, like, my mom grew up in the era of, like, this is a. This is a terrible drug. This is gonna fry your brain. This is, you know. Yeah, but, but having said, in my shop for four years before she got cancer, she. She would listen to people tell their stories of how they had gotten off opioids and how they had been, you know, couldn't get out of bed, and all of a sudden they start. They discussed cannabis and they're living their lives. I mean, how can you deny that?

Yeah. Roxanne, it was good to talk to you again. I'm glad your mother is healthy and say hi to her for me and tell her to get high once in a while.

Okay, I will.

I appreciate it. Thank you.

I appreciate you. You have a beautiful day.

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