Dennis & Julie: Bibles and Pianos

Your dog and a stranger are drowning. You can only save one. Who do you choose? Dennis Prager says your answer reveals everything about how you define right and wrong. In his new book, If There Is No God, Prager exposes the danger of emotion-based morality and why without objective truth, society descends into chaos. This isn't a religious book. It's a rational case for moral clarity in a confused age. If There Is No God from Dennis Prager. Order now at PragerStore.com. Hi everybody, I'm Dennis Prager. With me is Julie Hartman, and that is why it's called Dennis and Julie. Julie, I'm going to tell you something from my heart, man. I really look forward to doing this.

Oh, it's the highlight of my week. It's so much fun. And as I said last time, we do it all the time. We, we have conversations all the time where we do exactly this.

It's still a highlight. I—

it's so, it's so much fun.

Uh, and I— look, you know what is interesting? And I know this after so many years of broadcasting, people pick up on a lot. You'll find this of interest. I, you know me and my theories, so here's Prager Theory 8022736. I realized very early in my broadcast career the vast majority of people are intelligent, and so I came up with a rule for me: never underestimate their intelligence and never overestimate their knowledge.

You've told me that many times. It was, you actually told me that.

Do you see that corroborated?

Oh, of course. Even when I guest host for you, I see that the people who call in are very, very intelligent. I talked to you about when I did an hour on, uh, on Iran, the history of Iran and all of these Iranian Americans called in and even non-Iranian Americans called in. They were all so, you know, so intelligent. But here's where the knowledge part comes in. I will also have people call in and say, talk about some committee or some study. And, and I don't always know if that's true or they have their facts exactly right on that. So it's very hard when you're guest hosting. You can't—

it's impossible. No, no. When they come up with something that I never heard of, it's really hard to know how to respond. But I rarely have been lied to, and I've said that on the air. So I say, I don't believe— I don't know what you're saying to be fully accurate. It might well be. It often is. But I will check it into it. Then that's it. And everybody understands. Nobody gets angry. But The point I just wanted to make was people pick up. So what was I think— what led me to that idea about people's intelligence and they pick up things? They know there's chemistry between us. And I'll tell you, obviously I'm not going to mention the show, but I'm thinking of a show on radio for years and I don't think the hosts have any chemistry.

Yeah, you can tell. You can really tell.

Yes, it doesn't— it could be male, male, female, female, male, female, old, young. It doesn't matter. But either there is or there isn't.

And something else that our listeners have pointed out, both to you and to me, is that they don't notice an age difference, which I think is very astute and true. And we say that of each other all the time. We're like best friends.

I, I never think about it.

We forget.

Well, in it, let me deal with that because it's— I had another, and I'll get to what I had in mind. But so I have always tried to see myself outside of myself. I think I'm fairly good at it because I, I'm aware of how people perceive me generally. So I would say everybody knows you're young and everybody knows I'm old. Okay, that, or whatever I am, whatever word, not young, okay, post-middle age, but nobody thinks about it. That's my point. In a sense, you're ageless, and in a sense, I'm ageless, meaning not have an age.

I have to tell you, I think a lot about what I'm going to be like in 10, 20, or 30 years because I've really been the same person for my entire life. Certainly when I discovered PragerU, I I say that I was brought to my conservative instincts. I used to call it a transformation, but now I call it that, what I just mentioned, bringing myself to my instincts, because I realized that that was always in me. I just didn't have the vocabulary to express it. Anyway, that's just to say, I think and know that I've been the same person for my whole life. And so it will just be interesting to see if I change at all in the next few decades. I'm sure in some ways I will as my life changes.

I haven't changed much.

I don't think I'm going to change dramatically.

Yeah, so there's a very interesting question that you just raised, which is gonna— kills me because it's so interesting. It may take up time, but I, I'm not—

let it take up time.

Well, it might, but I'm not intending it. But okay, it is— it's just that I don't have a full answer to this question though. But what you said raised— has reminded me of something I've been asking. At what age are we who we be— who we become? 6?

It's a very good question.

15? It is a very good— see, I don't think I am who I was at 8, right?

Of course.

But, but wait a minute. So do you know my story when I flew alone?

Yes, I do.

Oh, you do?

And so does that questioner who we have to give a shout out to. Oh my gosh. Now I'm turning into Dennis. I can't remember his name. The guy who came up with the 50 questions about you.

Oh, right.

That was one of the questions about when you flew alone when you were 8.

Right, exactly. 7, actually.

So any— just, just to tell the audience, there's this listener and I am so sorry, I can't remember his name.

Well, we have—

we'll find it.

Well, and we'll mention it.

Well, yes. He sent me this list of 50 questions 'How well do you know Dennis?' questions. They are really detailed and really spot-on.

I'm very flattered that the guy knows all of that, including my favorite aunt.

Yeah, there was one about his favorite aunt. Oh, sorry. Well, listeners of Dennis and Julie would know. Anyway, go on.

I love them very, very much. So answering I just said to you, I, I, I'm not who I was at 8, but my parents put me on a plane to Florida to visit my Aunt Chippy when I was 7. Actually, I flew alone in those days. Nobody escorted you. You boarded the plane just as if you were 57. I'm 7. I board the plane, I fly. My aunt picks me up. Anyway, flying back after I don't know how many weeks, I flew back, fittingly, and I don't say this at all, at all negatively, my parents came late to pick up their 7-year-old son.

Look, I'm sorry, I know that you're not saying it negatively, and I'm certainly not trying to insult your parents. Really?

Oh, I mean, I love it.

That's pretty bad.

I don't think it's bad at all. I think it shows you, seriously, it shows you the time in which I lived. There was not— it never occurred to them I was in danger, and they were right.

True.

They were right.

That's true.

This is not today. Well, so anyway, I just want to note, when I— maybe I am who I was at 7, because when they came late and, and they saw this happened, this is not just my recollection, I had already asked the porter to get my luggage, and when they arrived, I was giving him a tip.

I know, I love it. Right, so 7 years old.

So in it, so it is, so back to our question, at what age are we who we end up as?

Well, I'm going to segue a little bit, but, but it relates to this. You know, I've been also thinking a lot about how am I supposed to use my 20s? This is a very formative decade that I'm in. Formative, I don't even know if it's intellectually or emotionally formative, though I am trying to use it as such, but it's formative in the sense that it sort of puts you on the path for the rest of your life, career-wise, personally. So I'm trying to think because there's this idea among people my age that we are supposed to use certainly the first half of our 20s to party, to go out every Friday and Saturday, get drunk, have the fun experiences that you can't have when you're married with children, travel. There's this sort of hedonist, recreational-centered idea for how you're supposed to handle your early 20s. I view it differently, as I just hinted at a few moments ago. Though sometimes, as you know, I think, am I doing it? Am I having enough fun? Taking advantage of my youth. But I view this as the time where, again, as I say, as I say often on the show, my brain still isn't fully molded. And I can, I can shape it and I can shape my habits still while I'm malleable. And so anyway, I'm using this time to continue to shape myself. So it does raise the question, am I, am I shaped now? Do I still have, have I become my full self? I think, for speaking as Julie Hartman, I think I have. I think I'm, I am fully myself now, but I'm just sort of fine-tuning the details. But I think a lot of people my age don't think that they have fully become themselves.

Oh, that makes sense. Yeah.

Well, they think that happens when, you know, when you're 30 or 40.

Ah, so this is a really, it is a rich subject.

It's so funny about Dennis and Julie. We did not plan that. This is just us again. Like, we, I want people to understand. No, so spontaneous, so spur of the moment.

They heard it spontaneously develop. So I— when I hear this question, or when a parent will say to me about their 21-year-old, let's say, oh, he's, uh, he's finding himself. And, and I'm not in any way judging or mocking, certainly not mocking, but I will admit I don't, I don't fully— A, I certainly don't relate because I, I knew myself by 21 really well, you, as you do. But secondly, I don't even fully understand the question. I don't even think it's a good question. Let me just say, I wonder if you've heard me say this. You probably did, but I'm curious. The question is not who are you, it's who do you want to be. That I knew. I knew that at a really young age. What, what man do I want to become? Notice the word man, by the way. I knew I wasn't going to stay a boy. What man do I want to become? Not who am I.

It's so important.

Oh, you want to hear important? All right, I'm going to blow your mind with this one. I can't tell you who told this to me, but someone I love said this to me, and we was a very, very, um, open conversation. And he's successful, he's adored, he's got everything going for him. And he, he sees a therapist, which is perfectly, perfectly fine, obviously. And one of the things he thinks— and I'm curious how you would react to this, I'm going to talk about this on some hour of radio, but I don't know yet what— he said, Dennis, I deep down I feel like I'm an imposter. And I, I have been meditating on that line since he said this to me, and I didn't come back with a response other than I felt bad for him. And now I have a response. You are This, and I don't know if everybody would agree, you are what you do. That is who you are. In a sense, unless you follow your nature, in which case you, you're an a-hole, we're all imposters in that sense. If imposter means I'm not really what my nature is, You're not really what your nature is if you don't cheat people, if you're always kind. I mean, it, you know, look, I'm sorry, but I have to say because it's— people need to know it. Men, if men follow their nature, they, they would be screwing around all the time. Are you an imposter if you're faithful to your wife?

So, so if you don't mind sharing, what— in what way did he mean that he was an imposter?

That I don't— I, I sometimes, and this is maybe a flaw in me, I'm known for having quick responses and, and correctly. But there are also many times, maybe not on radio but in private life, where I hear something brand new and I don't have an immediate response. That's why I say I've been mulling this thing over. He's a terrific person. So what does it mean? Do you— you, you don't relate to it, right? You don't— you know, among the battles you have with Julie is not that you think you're an imposter.

I had a little bit of imposter syndrome when I got to Harvard, which by the way, actually during our convocation, which is the opening ceremony at Harvard, one of the deans got up and said, if there's one thing I've heard from freshmen, it's that they have imposter syndrome. And I'm sure all of you are feeling it, that you don't, you're looking.

He said that?

He said that. Yes. I, it was, it was really nice. He said, you know, I'm sure all of you are looking around at each other and looking at yourselves and thinking, I don't belong. You know, how did I get so lucky to be here? I don't belong here. And he said, said, let me tell all 1,600 of you, you are meant to be here. We picked you to be here. We want you here. Anyway, it was easily the biggest point he made in the speech was please do not be wracked with imposter syndrome. Almost every freshman has it. I did a bit because I mean, I'm self-conscious because I feel like it sounds sort of—

No, no, no, go ahead. I understand why you're self-conscious.

But look, going to Harvard is a big deal. Being— getting into Harvard is a big deal. And I recognize how lucky and fortunate I was. I also recognize how hard I worked to get there. But still, even though I know I worked so hard, just being there and knowing, you know, seeing all the other very talented people, you do sort of get a sense of how did, you know, how did I get picked? Or how did I end up here? So I have had that a little bit. But I can't say— it sounds like with this individual that you're talking about, he felt like his whole Yeah, his whole existence was— thank God I've never felt that way. I've always felt very comfortable in myself.

I wonder how many people think that. And I'll bet you that only good people are wracked by that.

Yeah, I think only good people are wracked by most things.

That's a great point.

One of the signs of a good person— this of course isn't always true— is if they don't think that they're very good, or if they don't think that they're exceptional. We're thinking of—

now wait, think of what?

Of, uh, I, I want to, I want to say him by name, but I don't know if I should. But our friend at Shabbat dinner who both you and Alan agreed is a truly good person, his response was, oh, that's very sweet. In other words, he didn't go, yeah, I am, I am a really good person. You know, have it—

doubting yourself is a sign of a good person. That is very interesting too. That I have generally had a different thought. I think most good people know that— well, I used to— okay, I think I'll finish the sentence. I think most good people think they're good people. On the other hand, I think we're both right. I think good people constantly challenge their own moral status. But deep, deep down, see, for example, when people talk about other people as being good, it's because it matters to them. Other people will talk about their being rich, their being famous, their being good-looking, a whole host of things. Brilliant, that, that's a big one. But if someone who narrows in, zeros in on person's goodness It's because they care about goodness, and the odds are that they're good. Anyway, we said he was great.

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Yes, he, he thought great was a compliment. I don't think he would've thought good was a compliment 'cause I think he thinks he's good.

Right. Well, with this person we're talking about, great is not a compliment. He truly is great. But back to what you were saying, forgive me, I forgot. What were you saying after imposter syndrome? Do you—

Oh no, I thought that was the last point that I had made. Well, maybe it wasn't there. We've already moved on to people know they're good.

Well, back for a minute to when do you know That, well, who you are, who you are.

Well, that preceded Impossible.

I know, I know. It's so fun and characteristic.

So have you thought of that?

Yes, I have. Again, I hesitate to bring this back to myself, but it's the only way I can speak about it because I—

yeah, obviously.

But I feel that I've, again, always been the same person. But I've just refined myself. I think I really became me when I was 20 or 21, the full me, because even if I went back to me in high school, I was maybe 90% of the way there, but honestly, this is so much of who I am, and I really only discovered that when I was 20, i.e., me being conservative, me realizing that I believe in God, me sort of going in this direction where I want to fulfill my potential intellectually, not just professionally, sort of all of these things that are so much of who I am now. I don't know if that was fully me when I was 19 or 18. I think I was more back then, I was sort of more accomplishment-driven. I thought I wanted to go to law school, thought I wanted to be this big bad entertainment lawyer or Hollywood executive. I look back—

you'd have been really happy.

I know. I look back on that and I'm like, was I the same? You know, it's— so anyway, I— but what I think, I, I got so, so, so unbelievably lucky because I met the right people and I had the right people in my life who helped me become— pull out the real me. And I credit you and PragerU so much for that. And it's sad because I think that people can become their full selves, reach their full potential, refine themselves morally. But a lot of them don't have good people around them or good influences to help them do that.

So you now have hit one of the only sad things in my life. And you couldn't put two and two together here. It's too It's really more 100,000 and 462,872, but it is— see what it pains me, that just speaking for me, the stuff that I do, as, as well known as it is, is not better known. And it has nothing to do with fame or money.

I know. It really is life-changing.

Yes. Not everybody, even if it's a third, but that's a lot of people. It pains me when, when, uh, I mean, I'll even say something that has no monetary value in my life. The books theoretically do, but nobody writes Bible commentaries for wealth. I, I've just done a series of 6 videos for The Daily Wire. They sent in a whole camera crew. I mean, it was really professional, and they asked me to speak 45 minutes to an hour just looking into the cameras on 10 different subjects. And it is the best work I ever did in each of those arenas.

I can't wait to see it.

Oh, they're, they're, they're, they're literally life-changing. And Daily Wire has a gigantic— I mean, they have a million subscribers. That's a lot of people. But, you know, when I think of, of the lost kids of the college generation, and they could watch just the 10 if they could watch 10 videos, they could see those. Some of them— what happened to you, I love your— it, it pulled out what was inside of you.

Yes, it did.

We can't— I can't— nobody effective can manufacture if it isn't there. I admit it, okay? There are people we'll never reach, right? But a lot of people have these seeds.

It's so true. Again, I'm so glad we're talking about this because I see a lot of people— even I saw this them in college who identify quote unquote as liberal. And I would look at them and I would go, you're not liberal.

That's right.

I know you. I know your nature. Frankly, I have friends like this and I'm like, you are not liberal. You are liberal by default. That's what I called myself. You know, back in the day I called myself liberal. I wasn't liberal. I just didn't know what I was. And so there are so many people with fertile ground to let this stuff grow. And it really is a shame that, that not more is exposed to them. I also want to say, I mean, parenting is, is so important, but it's also only important to an extent. I credit even more than I do you and PragerU, I credit my parents for shaping me into, into who I am. And I, you know, I have incredible parents that, that really created such a healthy foundation for me. But also, once you get to a certain, certain point, you're— it's not that you— it's hard to talk about because, A, I don't want it to come off as insulting to my parents or any parents, but it's just a truth of life. Once you hit a certain point, your parents' work is done. and do you have to sort of take the baton and figure out who you are?

It's like a relay race, right?

It does sound— but it sort of is a relay race. And so I think I, you know, when my parents— not that they're ever done being my parents, but you know, when I reached 18, 19, 20, they had done their part extremely well, and I felt like I was 90% of who I am now. But that 10%, I think, really was finding PragerU, finding you, refining my values that helped sort of kick that over the edge. And similarly, there are a lot of people who go to college and maybe their parents like mine have done the best job bringing them up to that point. And then they get to college and a lot of that is unraveled and they sort of revert or they, you know, go down a dark path. So that's why it is, it is so important it doesn't negate the, the role of parents, but it is so important to find things outside of your parents— good influences, good adults— that can help shape you, because that's— that is just as important as parents. So do I— did I make any sense when I said that?

You made 100%.

Okay.

One of my, I guess, 10 favorite verses in the Bible that repository of genius. Therefore a man shall leave his mother and father and cling unto his wife, and they shall be as one flesh. You can't cling unto your wife, you can't grow up until you leave your mother and father, right? That, that's, that's the Bible speaking in Genesis, the foundational book of everything. It, it's so— by the way, such a radical departure from the rest of the world where you, you make— you were really your parents' child forever. And, and the, the Torah, which is where all the laws are and so on, it wants you to grow up. And, and part of it is, and therefore you leave your father and mother. And I think it's easier for fathers, and I think it's easier for fathers and sons I only have sons, right? And that's exactly what I want them to do. I want them to grow up. I want them to live wonderful and fruitful and productive lives, cling to their wives, and make a family. It doesn't diminish my love in the least. It's just that I know that my, my role— I'm— look, I will always have a role and should as their father. That's a given. But, but I know what you said is true, and I want to come back to it in a moment. But there is one thing I do believe I still owe to my children, and that is to, to lead a life of dignity. Do you know, this is a really super serious subject. I have another One of my theories, as bad as it is to have a bad child, and it is crushing— I mean bad, not, not, not successful or this or that, bad— it is worse to have a bad father. And my proof is parents of bad children do not kill themselves. Sons of bad fathers kill themselves.

It's true.

Like one of Bernie Madoffs. And, uh, who was the guy, um, the guy who sent the people to murder Sharon Tate? And, uh, you know, the, um— oh God, everybody listening is going to come yelling their words. Anyway, uh, he— his son committed suicide.

You're right.

So It— Charlie Manson. Thank you. Of course, Charles Manson. So I do feel, and they, they probably don't think about it, but the sort of role that I now have is model, which a father and a mother, but especially a father, always has. Till he dies, is a model. That's a big, big, big deal. And my, my other lighter sounding, but not all that less significant, being no trouble in their kids' lives.

That's something I always thought growing up. Always I said, you know, mostly because of my sister with severe autism. I said, even in times if I can't be a total joy to my parents, which was always my goal, to be a joy and a distraction to them, I am never ever going to cause them problems. At the very least, I'm just going to be neutral.

That's interesting.

I remember, like, literally from 6 years old, just thinking that neutral—

that is atypical of a child to think that, that, that they're lucky that you thought that way. I always think of it in the other direction. Parents should be easy in the lives of their children, but you're entirely right. Look, easy— everybody should have the goal of being easy. You should be easy to work with at your workplace. Nobody talks about it. What is important in life? If you give me 100 adjectives of what's important to be in life, I don't think almost anybody would write the word easy, but it's in the top 5.

It's so true, actually. I didn't even think of that.

Oh yeah, it's— I said to my— I now have 2 daughters-in-law, literally as of 1 year ago. But I have— I had another daughter-in-law much longer than that. And I said to her on the phone once, Miriam, I just want you to know There is— I have a real goal in life vis-à-vis you. I want to be easy.

Well, my dear, you are easy to everyone in your life. You are one of the easiest people.

Okay, that's a conscious goal, just for the record.

Oh, I know it is. Oh, I know, knowing you, that it is. I know that you've— I tell you, you are a remarkably healthy person in every way. And I know that that's been conscious and it has taken a lot of work.

By the way, the, you know, thank you. It's all true. Okay. I have worked.

You don't, you don't have a temper. You're not jealous. You're not, you know, you don't have, you don't have expectation. You know, there are a lot of ways that you—

Well, I really worked on me.

Even going back to what you said about that Buddhist, you know, not having any desires or expectations.

Well, yeah, but I have desires.

Of course. You're saying it applies to the second, but that shows that you, it wasn't innate in you. That you learned it and you refined yourself and you became that healthy person that doesn't have expectations.

Do you know my story about my high school basketball coach?

Oh yes. Yeah, it's in the 50 questions.

It is.

Yes, the scraping the bottom of the barrel to get you on the team. God, who's— I've got to pull up that guy's name, right?

So just, just that I was, I was 16. When the guy insulted me in front of the entire basketball team of my high school, you know, oh, we scraped the bottom, we're not going to do well this year, we scraped the bottom of the barrel, Prager made the team. And he was— so here's the point. I remember my reaction, and that means I was already formed. My reaction was This guy is an a-hole, except I used the word in my brain, but he's right. That I could say that and not, not mope at 16, being insulted like that in front of the whole team, that, that was a good sign.

Definitely. Definitely. You know, what people don't realize is that, you know, you and I, I believe as recently as last time, talked about how it's— you choose whether or not to be offended. I've always viewed getting offended by things as just enslaving yourself. You're just harming yourself by doing that. When even when someone, you know, it happened unfortunately to be true what that guy said about you, you know, the basketball player.

I wasn't— but that's the point, though. I wasn't offended.

No, I'm saying—

I know you are. I'm backing you up.

So in that case, it was true what the guy said to you, and you, you went, okay, it's true, I'm not going to get offended by it. But even when people say things to you that aren't true, of course it's natural to get offended or upset. But whenever that happens to me, I just kind of look at the person and I'm like, that's your problem. And if I'm gonna— if I'm going to let this ruin my day, I'm enslaved. I'm only harming myself, right? I'm only harming myself. Or even when someone has done you wrong and you hold a grudge and don't forgive them, of course there are exceptions. If someone has really done you wrong, you should hold a grudge and not forgive them. But I think, like, again, I'm just— I'm making life harder for myself by carrying this around. It's oddly a selfish thing to do to forgive the person, or a selfish thing to do to not be offended. I don't want to walk around a bitter, angry, upset person.

That's right.

So just rid yourself of it. Don't enslave yourself anyway. But back to this point, which I suppose has become the theme of our episode. When do you know if you are fully formed, or when do you really become who you are? And of course, there are nuances we're talking about with that. It's more important to become who you want to be.

By the way, there are different questions. Not when do you know you're fully formed. We're never fully formed. The second way you put it would be the right one. At what age are you what you are now?

So what's your theory?

On what age?

Yes.

Different people's answer. It's a very tough question. That's why I posed it. I said I didn't have an answer. Look, the only— okay, so I know my boys and I know me. They're the only humans on Earth I know from early on to adulthood, right? Who else do I know? Know my wife from, from her childhood. I, I, I know I knew me and my two children. I, I would say now that I've never really thought of it. That's a good— it's a good test case. So it's clearer in, in my older son. He, he really I think he, he was who he is at a very young age, now that I know, but I think of it. And, and the younger one, it's very tough to know because he, he was into drugs and alcohol from a very early age. He was born to a meth addict, and there were other issues involved, so it's hard to know. I think, I think the real person— I'll tell you this, I'll give you an answer on that. A tentative answer, which is why drugs and alcohol are so terrible. The addict isn't who they are till they're sober. That's a, that's a killer.

So I have a, another follow-up question. Do you think that people can be who they are if they are crippled by circumstance? You know, again, I, to make it personal, I think about my parents and what they've had to go through with my, my sister with autism, and they have truly gone through hell with her in her, in her care, just decades of hell. I'm sure in some ways she has, I know, I know in, in ways she's prevented them from, from doing things and, you know, has certainly been an impediment to their happiness and even prevented them from doing things like traveling, you know, because they have to stay in Los Angeles to be near her. But what I will say about my parents, and is a huge credit to them, is that they— I don't think that they let that really, really hold them back from living their lives to— or being the real people that they are. It never really diminished them in the way that some other people who have children with disabilities. It lets them diminish them. And by the way, I say that with no judgment. It's remarkable the way my parents have tried to steer clear of letting it completely ruin their lives. As I said, there have been times where they have— it's impeded their ability to be happy, but it's never fully diminished them. So in other words, I guess again, the question is, can you be your full self despite certain curveballs and, and tragedies that you have.

Well, that's Viktor Frankl's theory. The only freedom we have is how we react to what happens to us. And he said that having gone through a Nazi concentration camp. That had— I read it in high school, and it— that was one— it was a life-changing book.

You mean Man's Search for Meaning? Yeah. I've got to read it.

Oh my God.

Have I?

You know, I sort of envy you. It's like the first time people go to Israel.

Oh my gosh, that is such an apt analogy. That is the best analogy. It's the one— the first time people go to Israel, that is a life-changing experience. Oh my gosh, I'm so— I'm excited to read it. I'm reading this Islam book right now. I don't know why it's on the table. And of course, your Rational Bible, but Maybe I'll put his book before those. Just when you thought it couldn't get any better, Mike Lindell with MyPillow is launching the MyPillow 2.0. When Mike invented MyPillow, it did everything you could want in a pillow. Now, nearly 20 years later, he discovered a new technology that makes it even better. The MyPillow 2.0 has the patented adjustable fill of the original MyPillow, and now with a brand new fabric that is made with a temperature-regulating thread. The MyPillow 2.0 is the softest, the smoothest, and the coolest pillow you'll ever own. For our exclusive listeners, the MyPillow 2.0 is buy one get one free with the promo code Hartman. MyPillow 2.0 temperature regulating technology is 100% made in the USA and comes with a 10-year warranty and a 60-day money-back guarantee. Just go to mypillow.com and click on the radio listener square to get the buy one get one free offer. Enter the promo code Hartman or call 1-800-566-6745. 5 to get your MyPillow 2.0s now.

A woman called my show, the Happiness Hour, the last Happiness Hour I did. I, I, I don't remember calls. It's not possible. Uh, thank God there were so many. I, I, so if I remember a call, it really made an impact on me. This happened in the last edition of the Happiness Hour, my Friday second hour. My subject was envy and how it, it's such a powerful force in so many people's lives. I thank God not in my own, but I know that it is very powerful in many, many most, in most people's lives. Then I want to give you a biblical thing because it gives you the genius of the Bible. But woman calls up and was the first call I took because, uh, I knew it sort of challenged my thesis of not being envy, and I love challenges. The woman has lost both her daughters. They both died, one of suicide and one literally overnight of a brain aneurysm, out of nowhere. That's how aneurysms— they're— it's a frightening thing when you think about it. They just happen and you die. And she said, so Dennis, you'll understand. And she said this with, with no bitterness, not, not even any self-pity. She says, you'll understand why I envy parents who still have their children.

Oh, of course.

And she, and she, she spoke about the— in the case of the woman with the aneurysm, she left two, two children, 8 and 10. So I said, of course, I totally understand. I said, but I'd like you to, to answer this question. There are a lot of people who have children who don't have children. The children don't, they don't have grandchildren, and you do. Are they right to envy you?

This was your response to her?

Yes.

Oh, wow. And what did she say?

Yes. She was honest, and I was honest. But I'm sure she never thought of it. She only thought that she envied people who had children. But what about the people who want grandchildren and envy her?

That's true, but I think, I think losing two children—

no, no, no—

leaves a far gaping hole than— yeah, no, no, well, well, but I take your point.

Oh, but you— well, you're right, of course that's true. Death is death. You can't lament not having like you lament dying. I get it. However, I will tell you that it is an ongoing pain in many people's lives if their children don't have children. I mean, big time.

That's fair. That's not something I, I would know.

You wouldn't, and I wouldn't know until I became of grandparent age. And, and, and people open up to me about it. And, well, you know, Dennis, you got it good, you got two grandchildren. And I don't walk around thinking, I got it good, I have two grandchildren. I love them, that— but I don't think, oh, how lucky I am to have grandchildren, right? But they do.

It's a good point.

Any more than people walk around, I'm lucky my kids didn't die. I mean, if you ask me, of course I know I'm lucky my kids didn't die, but I, I can't walk— it's not even healthy. You can't walk around every day, 'Oh, my kids didn't die today.' It's a little sick, right? So it— I was very, if I may say, I was very proud of my response, that I came up with that immediately and made her realize she is the object of envy. The woman who lost her two daughters.

Yes. It's a very important point that people who envy are also the objects of envy. And also, when you said that you were talking about envy during your happiness hour, my first thing was the typical— I thought of the typical ways that we think about envy. You envy someone for being smarter, for being richer, for having, you know, a seemingly more glamorous or fulfilled life. But you're— there is this other category of envy in the sad realm, in the realm of—

well, there's an answer to that.

Sorry, the realm of grief and loss. Envy goes into those realms of life too. I don't— I just— I think of envy as only existing in the sort of materialist Are you referring to what I said to the woman?

Or—

No, I'm just saying when you brought up that you were talking about envy on your Happiness Hour, I was— what was going through my mind is, oh, you were talking to people, don't covet your neighbor's bigger house or their more money. But this is a very serious part of envy, right?

So this is the genius again of the Ten Commandments. Which I've written so much about, as you know.

I do.

The 10th Commandment is do not covet your neighbor's house, your neighbor's spouse, your neighbor's animals. We would say instead of animals today, you know, property or whatever, right? Covet is not envy. Covet comes from envy, but it is not the same as envy. There's no law against envy in the 613 laws of the Torah.

So what is the difference? You've explained this to me before. I can't remember.

Covet is not I envy my neighbor's house. Fine. Envy your neighbor's house. It's not healthy, but nobody's hurt. Coveting your neighbor's house means I want to take it away from my neighbor. By the way, all of leftism is built on coveting. We resent— see, if you— there are two ways to react to your neighbor's bigger house. One is, wow, that's a great house, I would like one like that. That was the classic American way. I'm going to work so hard, I'm going to have a house like that, or similar to it, or half as big, or whatever. The evil way to react is to resent that your neighbor has a bigger house or a better house. That's all of leftism is based on that. All, by the way, all the gigantic hatreds, anti-Americanism, we resent that America has this wealth and this freedom and this prosperity and anti-Semitism. We resent that the Jews live the quality of life. What is it in the Middle East? The Jews literally did make an incredible country out of a desert. It was nothing. Tel Aviv was a malaria swamp. It is today one of the biggest high-tech cities on earth. That's what they did with it. Their neighbors had the same land and did nothing with it. By the way, it's very similar to the United States. South America could be an incredibly prosperous and free place. But they didn't have the same values. So you— what do you say? You say, wait, you know what? You obviously have a good value system, Americans. We'll adopt it. Or screw you, we're going to destroy you, right? We're going to bring you down.

That's your— that's your essay in the first— in Chapter 4, I think it is, with Cain and Abel. Do you seek to envy?

That's right.

Or emulate the people who do better than you?

I love— you don't know that. You know my Bible. Commentary.

Oh, I, I know it cold. Uh, well, that's— I mean, that's—

yeah, well, that was Cain's— yeah, Cain knew that Abel brought a better sacrifice.

This is what has really, I think, made me the person I am, is, is this Bible commentary and, and all that I've learned through you and PragerU. I mean, I just And again, I feel so lucky because I feel like I just, I am such a happier, healthier person for having this wisdom in my life. Because when I catch myself going down a road, whether it's, you know, I talk to you a lot about that light near my house, or I talk on the show a lot about the light near my house and that you have to wait a long time to turn left. And sometimes there are no cars coming and you just want to go against the light and turn left. And I think back, to things that I've learned, you know, through PragerU and through you about, you know, the slippery slope. If you behave poorly once, you're more likely to do it again and other people are more likely to see you. I think about that when I start envying someone. I think of the Cain and Abel chapter. Do you wanna envy? I mean, I think about all of it so much. And anyway, it's just to say I feel really, really blessed. And I thank you.

I am blessed that someone of your caliber has so taken in my ideas. Look, I, I say, when you're not around, I, I see you as carrying on my mission. Uh, I, I didn't think I would meet somebody so young and, and feel that way. It almost makes me tear up.

Well, that's what I hope to do, you know, with my show. I just, again, I talk about those people who I look at and I go, you you're this, but you just, you haven't had the right exposure to, to the best ideas. And I, I so badly want to bring that to people because I got really lucky early on. But, but I want to go back, I want to go back to this because I want to go back to that point that I said earlier about you have to sort of take the baton and find good influences, good adults that help shape you and bring you to fruition. But before we go back to that, the— I want to go back to the question that I asked you a few minutes ago about can a person be their full selves despite their circumstances? And you brought up that caller that you had of the—

well, the— sure, okay, go on, go on. I brought up the caller. You mean me? Which caller?

The caller who has the— who, who lost the two daughters. That was, that was how you responded, by the way.

So the— they're, they're not separable because circumstances help form us. So you get married and, and you're not the same as when you were single. You become a parent and you're not the same as when you didn't have children. So that's why my question isn't who I am, it's What do I want to be? I knew I wanted to be married. I knew I wanted to have children. It was inconceivable to me I wouldn't marry. It is not inconceivable to most members of your generation. Maybe they will, maybe they won't. Is that not fair?

Oh no, I'm shaking my head because it's sadly true.

So that is a sea change.

I know it is. It's, it's really sad.

I, I would have sooner imagined myself, uh, an accountant than a Bachelor. And I have— the only reason I mentioned accountants is I have, I, I have no ability with numbers. But, but I, I could, I could have made it, but it was inconceivable. Dennis the Bachelor.

Well, you just said about how your circumstances form you, that, that is so— that is really, really important because even the way that I phrase the question and the way a lot of people think about circumstances is that they work against you, but actually they can, they can facilitate your reaching your, your fullest potential. I know, I know the hardest parts of my life, I've, I've thought about them is how is this an opportunity for me to transform myself? This was put into my life for a reason. I could view it as holding me back, or I could view it as a way that's going to, to push me forward and teach me something or open me up to something that I wouldn't have been exposed to before. That's very, very important.

That's right. Well, that's the— our freedom is how we react to what happens, right? Or you will— what you incorporate it in a positive way into your life.

Yes.

Yeah, no, I agree with that.

I mean, look, easier said than done.

I mean, you know, you keep mentioning— because of course, as I always do, the Torah in particular, the Bible generally, the greatest sources of wisdom ever written And that's why I'm working so hard. Last night I sent in the 23rd chapter of the 4th book, Numbers. So I'm 2/3 of the way through the 4th of the 5 books.

It's amazing that you—

well, I can't believe it either. Don't start me on that. But I'm just saying it's so important for me to get— I'll give you one example you will love. This is, this is the first time I'm doing this, sort of like a trailer. Nobody cares about the Book of Numbers. Nobody even knows it's one of the 5 books of Moses. It's the 4th book of the Bible. There's a phenomenal story about a pagan prophet named Balaam, and he's riding his donkey, and the donkey— to do something negative that a king who wanted to destroy Israel called him. It's fascinating. It's an incredibly unique story in the Torah. 3 chapters, and it's got a talking donkey in it. So the donkey sees, sees an angel with a sword and stops walking, and Balaam beats the donkey to move. Does it 3 times. Stops, beats, stops, beats, stops, beats. Finally, the donkey opens his mouth and says, "Haven't I been a good donkey for you all these years? Why did you hit me?" And almost no commentator, Jewish or Christian or just general biblical scholar, No, notes what I believe is so huge in that lesson: if every animal could speak, what would it say to its owner? I have the chills as I relate that to you. I've never seen any other commentator on the Bible make that point, which I'm making in the 22nd chapter of Numbers. But isn't that powerful? The first thing it says is not, hey, there's an angel standing there, that's why I stopped. The first thing the donkey says is, I didn't deserve to be beaten. How many animals could have said that to owners in the history of the world? The Torah's preoccupation with animals is one of the unsung glories of the Torah.

I know. And the irony is that the, you know, the vegans and—

Yeah, right, right. Exactly.

People, it's like, where do you think we get our respect for animals from? As you observe at the beginning of the commentary, the Torah has more, or at least maybe not, at least it's Genesis. I don't know if you said it was Torah, the whole Torah, or just Genesis, has more laws pertaining to the humane treatment of animals than it does about keeping the Sabbath.

Yeah, that's right.

Case in point.

Yeah, I love that you know it. So listen to this, so good. I've been, I've been patiently awaiting telling you a point I made on my show that I think you will love, given your, your, your love, as I have, of the wisdom of the Bible. So I, I noted in passing, I don't know what raised the issue, but if you read American history, you will note that virtually every American home, unless truly, truly abjectly poor— you know what I'm going to say—

had a Bible.

Ah, no, but I, I— yes, they all had that. But there was a second thing they had. Guess what it was? A piano.

Oh wow, really? Yes, it's very telling.

So I said, if your house has a Bible and a piano, your kids are going to be richer and better and deeper and maturer and finer than almost any other kid?

I have to tell you, I have these dreams of raising my children in a technology-free house. Like, I just want my house to be filled with books. I want it to have a piano. I want it to have, you know, filled with instruments, a trampoline, like nothing. I don't— no TV, no computer, no phone. I think about like like having a house that would be indistinguishable from one in 1940. I mean, because I, I think that stuff is so rotten, and you are so right that it leads to a richer life if you, if you have all of those boring things. Yes, piano and Bible. Gosh, I have to tell you, when you said it, it gave me a pang in my heart because I used to know how to play the piano and now I don't. I should take it up again.

Yeah, but you know what, Look, I, I taught— I didn't teach. I mean, my— I gave my son trumpet lessons. He wanted trumpet. I didn't give a damn what he played.

How did you know how to give trumpet lessons?

I didn't. No, no, I had him a trumpet teacher. Are you kidding? I don't have a clue what to do with the trumpet. I would use it as a baton.

Hey, it's a credit to you. I thought you were the ones giving it.

That is a true credit to me.

Because you learned, so you're like, oh, I learned Russian.

I can play Age 10, play trumpet. Do you know his trumpet teacher showed up at a speech of mine about 5 years ago in South Carolina?

Oh really?

I embraced that guy. He was about as sweet a human being. And by the way, there's a good example. A healthy parent so aches for their kid to have healthy adults in their lives other than themselves.

My parents with you, that's exactly how my parents feel with you.

I, I hope that's true.

I'm sure if you People ask me— I think it's worth talking about here, you know— people ask me, how do your parents feel about your relationship with Dennis? Because, you know, you're a very significant adult figure and mentor in my life. And I have to say, my parents love Dennis. They love my relationship with Dennis. They know that you and I— he's— you're not a replacement, you know, of them in any way. There's no such thing. And they just— they they say to me, because I bring it up with them sometimes, I go, I want you, you know.

So do you know how strongly I identify with what you're saying? And I'm so happy, of course, that your parents, to their credit, feel that way. I very early on, before I had kids, people would thank me or they would say, oh, well, my, my son, my daughter had Dennis Prager in his or her life. Because I was teaching kids from a very young age. And I remember saying periodically, I hope my kids have a Dennis Prager in their life.

Really?

I swear to God, before I ever had kids, I knew how important another adult is.

Oh, again, it's what I was saying earlier. You have to— when you get to a certain age—

I'm not Dennis Prager in my kids' lives.

Yes, you're— I want them to have your dad. That's right. My parents say to me, we're thrilled that you have another— you have another adult in your life who loves you, who cares about you, who wants to help you succeed.

Yes.

I mean, they say, why would we hate? Why would we be threatened?

Well, some would, but they're not healthy. Okay. But right. Exactly. But you, you, the more the merrier.

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Oh, exactly.

Exactly. I mean, I'm just being honest.

There have been parents who have said to me, Dennis, do me a favor, I'd like you to introduce my son to this, this young woman. Oh, but if I introduce them, he'll never meet him, he'll never meet her.

Totally.

But if you do, they'll take you seriously.

As much as I have an incredible relationship with my parents and I adore them, there are some things that only— no, no, other adults could tell me, or, you know, and that's That's what you want. It wouldn't annoy me, right?

No, it's— that's what— when Hillary Clinton wrote her book—

Yes, I knew you were going to bring this up. It's so true.

Go ahead.

No, you please. I'm sorry. I interrupt. I interrupt because I know— anyway, I'm sorry.

No, I love that. Anyway, she wrote the book, It Takes a Village, right, to raise a child. And when she published it, I said on the radio, I agree with her. I just don't like her village.

Right.

I prefer my village. But of course it takes a village to raise a child.

Yes.

There's no such thing as only parents. It's not possible.

You know, I was also thinking recently, I mean, again, not, not to beat a dead horse, but you know how often I think about how lucky I am that, that you're in my life and I have this incredible personal and professional situation. I mean, it's just my cup runneth over, but I think about, really, like, you don't see a lot of instances of mentors anymore. I mean, you really— I mean, again, it is such a credit to you that you took me under your wing the way that you continue to do so. And you really have taken it as, as a responsibility to mentor me. And I, again, I just— I'm, I'm, I'm really overwhelmed. But you don't see that, right?

You know, you know why? Because People want to stay children.

That's the reason adults doing that to kids. You're saying that adults want to stay children?

Yes.

You don't— I can't think of anyone else in my life, and again, it makes me feel all the more lucky, who has a similar situation where there's an adult in their life where they really feel has mentored them and helped them like you have with me.

Well, that's a— it's a very important point. Uh, I have gotten the line— remember, I'm on radio now for 40 years, so I've gotten this line Almost from the beginning, and I was 34 when I began, or yeah, 34, yeah, no, no, yeah, 40 years, right, yes. And the, I would say starting at 40, guys would call up, this because it's a guy thing, guys would call up, you know, Dennis, you're like a father figure to me. Guy would be 10 years younger than me. By the way, to this day I will get that from guys 10 years younger than me. Can't be a father at 10 to the best of my knowledge. And I remember thinking, I'm too young. I would think, am I too young to be a father figure? And then why am I too young? That's absurd. And then I thought, you know what, that's great. And then I thought more, every man should aspire to be a father figure to young men, younger men. Yes, that, but they don't. I remember, and this is no knock against him at all, there was a very, very famous basketball player. He's still with us, I believe. Larry Bird of the Boston Celtics. He's a legend. And there was an article on him, and he said, oh, you know, I'm getting older, and I got to say, when a kid comes over to me and goes, "Mr. What, you got the time?" This was before kids walked around having the time on their wrist.

Yes, I've never heard that sentence uttered.

Yes, oh, it was very, very common because the adult would have the watch and the kid didn't have a watch. So, "Mister, you got the time?" And he goes something to the effect, I'm not all that comfortable being called mister. By a little kid. People— and it's no knock on Larry Bird at all.

He didn't want to be called mister.

Huh?

He didn't want to be called mister.

That's right. Yeah, because that meant— well, it meant he was an adult. You don't— you don't call a 15-year-old mister.

I don't know. I view that as a little odd. I think it's— I think it's nice and respectful for a kid to call you mister.

Of course it is. But it meant that he— it was a certification he's an adult. He's not a kid. You don't call kids mister. Simple as that. But you have to raise children to aspire to be adults. That's not done now, any more than the piano and Bible combo. But isn't that— wouldn't that be a great— I have the word in my mind—

experiment?

Crusade. Oh. I'll use the word crusade, but probably a better word than crusade because that sounds like you're almost at war. Wouldn't it be a great mission, task, job to start that every home should have a piano and a Bible? See, if it just says Bible, they think you're just some religious advocate. But if you say piano— but you see, and by the way, it's symbolic in another way. I'm loving this. I'm thinking it through with you because they represent totally separate realms in a sense, the religious and the aesthetic. And the kids get neither today. There is no aesthetic beauty.

Yes, it's true.

Your generation has not experienced aesthetic beauty. Be. Not in art, not in architecture, not in music. I mean, it's unbelievable when I think about it. That, by the way, for the record, is what conservatism is about— conserving the most beautiful, the most profound, the most wise. What is wrong with that?

And by the way, you know, earlier in this episode when I was saying that there are people around me who are liberal and I look at them and I go, no, you're not, I was thinking as I was saying it, this really goes beyond the political realm. When I look at people and I see that they have, what did I say, fertile soil to allow certain ideas to grow, I don't just mean political ideas. I mean being opened up to the world in the way that we're talking about now. And again, I know I keep repeating myself, but that's something that I really found and discovered you know, kind of coming into this world with people like Robert Florczak, who's this great artist who opened my eyes to the beauty of classical art and that you don't need to be an expert to appreciate a painting, you know. Even, I mean, PragerU does these videos. Robert Florczak, doesn't he do videos?

Yes, that's where you found him.

And, you know, they do a book club, which has been so interesting. And I feel like Part of being, you know, what you just said about how conservatism conserves the best. One of the things I love about conservatism and what it's done for my life is that it, it, the political part is actually such a small part of conservatism.

That's right.

And that's what people don't understand. It's a huge, and that's not true of liberalism.

No.

And that's not true of leftism, liberalism and leftism. The political is the entirety of it. For conservatism, the political is a manifestation of the greater values and themes that we hold respect for the past.

Before the left took over things, that's what existed. A music conservatory was just there to teach you music. Right now it's there to teach you social justice.

I feel like I am like my whole world has been opened up because of being conservative, because I have an appreciation for—

Oh, isn't it a great— It's amazing.

Look, I And again, I know this is odd, but I have this book here that I stole from Dennis Prager's library. I love going to your house and looking through your books. It's like an archaeological dig going through all the different books, and I steal some, but I always return them. This is Bernard Lewis's book on Islam. I don't know if the me 5 years ago would be reading a book on Islam, but I'm addicted. I know it sounds weird. I'm addicted to the world. I'm addicted to learning about everything.

So, all right, I'll be personal. Look, I adore you, and, and we're so, we're so fundamentally similar. And, uh, that's not the reason, but it is true. Your love of life— I mean, tell everybody how much time you spent when you last visited the house looking at inks Oh, so much fun.

Yes, I pulled up a chair next to Dennis's computer as he was looking at fountain pen inks. And I have to say, which sounds as boring as possible, I thought it— I was just interested. I just wanted to know what you were doing because you said that you were relaxing, and I'm like, I'm going to see how he relaxes. He was going through fountain pen ink, and it was, it was riveting. It was so much fun, the different— and what's so cool about it is they have this one color, purple, But then there were like 10 different shades of this beautiful royal purple. Oh, it was so fun. It was so fun.

So I talk about that even in my happiness book, not just on the radio, that the more that brings you delight, the more you're passionate about, the happier you will be. But it is— your response to that was really indicative of your— you, you love life. You now, you love classical art. But let's admit, I mean, how many people your age— gee, I really tell you, reading this book on Islam and, and looking at Pieter Bruegel the Elder, and again, that wasn't me.

I don't know if that really was me 5 years ago.

But sadly, it does. Sadly is, is it the operative word here? Unfortunately, it, it's all within you. It's been extracted. But I don't know that it's within everybody. I think everybody could love more about life than they do now.

Yes.

But I— so I, I don't know. But I'll tell you though what makes me think I may be wrong, and If you do it early enough, you can cultivate love of life in almost any kid unless there are major psychopathological impediments. So I have, I had a Prager Force young girl on my radio show today because we're doing appeals for PragerU. By the way, PragerU pays good money to, to the radio stations to allow this. This is not— I don't use my radio to do this for free anyway. Uh, so I had this 17-year-old girl on. I don't remember what state was she in. I don't remember, not— nor is it important. She was in Texas. Oh yeah, San Antonio. That's right, she was in San Antonio, Texas. Correct. Within 1 minute, I said to her— I think it was my first question, or after she started speaking, so my second question— said, I'm just curious, why are you so mature? And she didn't go, oh, thank you. Oh, that's so sweet. She goes, because I was homeschooled. Oh yeah, by the way, and I knew it, and I said if I had to bet my house, I would have bet she was homeschooled from the moment she opened her mouth.

These are— you see, so against that.

Why?

Oh, because I thought it was ridiculous. I thought, oh, you're going to take people, kids away from school where they, they meet other kids, and then you're going to confine them to the home where their parents teach? I just didn't understand it. I didn't get what it really was. And also, that was back during the time when schools were vaguely okay. Educational. Yes.

Vaguely educational.

Vaguely.

Yeah, exactly.

Now they're just hubs of leftist indoctrination camps.

And worse, and somewhat sick. You'll decide if you're a boy or a girl.

Well, that's what I mean. I mean, the leftist indoctrination camps.

No, no, I know you meant that, but I'm just saying.

They're sick.

It's not just political, it's every aspect of life, right? This, this girl— oh, there's another thing. This girl radiated happiness. These kids, they're— I have a term for homeschooled kids. Nothing applies to everyone, okay? I know that there are non-homeschooled kids for whom this is true, and there are homeschooled kids for whom it's not true. But, but the generalization is what matters. They are not jaded. Most people your age and much younger, already in high school, are jaded.

They're jaded because they make themselves jaded. They're jaded not because they actually were in life jaded. They, they contrive these narratives and myths that they have been oppressed and that they have a reason to be jaded. It's a, it's like a, it's a personality trait for people at this point, a learned personality trait.

And their innocence has been shattered. That, that also makes them jaded.

Yes, that's true. Well, we— yeah, again, I was so lucky. I, I really had a very lovely, innocent childhood, and I think a lot of people my age had pretty innocent childhoods, but I, I cannot I can't bear to think about what the 4, 5, 6-year-olds right now who are getting drag queen, you know, twerkers in front of them— I can't bear to think what they're going to be like in 20 years. Talk about jaded. Talk about having their innocence robbed. I didn't have drag queens twerking in front of me.

That's exactly my point. Yeah, twerking is the term I should use now. No, no, that— because that's what often—

that's what they do. And Sue, your wife, so, um, at last Shabbat dinner there Sue, who's the researcher extraordinaire— there's nothing that woman doesn't know— she had this, uh, video that she found on Twitter of these sick people. I mean, I don't know if it was at a bar or somewhere, but there were all these adults and they had this little 4-year-old girl in a chair in the center of the room, and this big thug drag queen was twerking and dancing around the 4-year-old. And Sue passed it around for all of us to watch. And she said, what do you see about this video? And the thing that was so clear, and my heart aches as I say it, because I can picture that girl's face. Everyone in the room, all of the adults in the room are laughing and smiling. They have this sicko evil face. And the girl, she looks uncomfortable. And she has this deep, again, it's actually getting me a little emotional thinking about it because I, it's, it's just evil what that— what they're doing. She has this look on her face of, I know that this is bad. I know that there is something really sick about this.

That's right.

And, and again, she's all of maybe 4 or 5 years old, but she has that instinct that it is wrong.

If adults don't present admirable models. It's very bad for a child. They yearn for admirable models. It's a, it's a point, at least for me, I'll conclude on. And anything you want to add, obviously. I— this is new, this is a newer insight in my life. Relatively recent. I think it's more important— and I didn't used to think this— I think it's more important for a parent to be an admirable model than, than to be a particularly loving parent. I think children will do better with admirable parents who are not all that loving I don't mean abusive, just not all that loving. They don't tell the kid all the time they love them. They're not effusive. They don't— they're not big huggers. And I am a big hugger. I'm still saying this. Then that, that's— that is what a child needs the most, is admirable parents and admirable other adults. If adults are twerking The— their world collapses, though they don't know it. That girl's face seemed to say, I know there's something wrong. Yes, but most, most kids, either they'll have that face or nothing. They— but to have— you could say whatever you like, but a drag queen dancing, uh, in front of you is not an admirable model. Men wearing women's clothing and taking some of it off during the course of their dance or routine or read— this is not admirable. It is what it is, and if adults wish to enjoy it, look, I am libertarian on sexual matters. I don't think strip joints should be closed. People want to go, they should go, but I don't want to take a 5-year-old there.

Keyword adults.

Yes, the key, keyword adults.

The, the final thing I will add, and it's a bit on a more optimistic note, is, you know, I agree with what you said a few minutes ago that there are, you know, this was really brought out in me, this, this curiosity about the world. As I said, I'm addicted to learning about the world. And you said it's not always, you know, the case in others, or maybe not to the same extent. I totally agree. But I really think, and I know that you'll agree with me here too, that there is so much more that people could be learning about the world that would interest them than they are now. And it really does start young. You know, when people say that they're bad at school or they're not, I don't buy that. I don't think that there are, certainly there are people, you know, for whom learning comes easier than others, but There are so many lost souls out there who wander around and they have no idea what they're missing. If you just look up and pay attention, the world is so cool. I just did a 30 minutes on my show Timeless about owls. Owls, they are the coolest animals.

The coolest.

Oh my God, aren't they amazing? Like, and I'm not even—

their hooting.

And by the way, like, you don't— what I'm saying is, yes, maybe I'm a nerd and I read the book about Islam, but there are so many cool things. Not just even, you know, I talk about classical art.

I know, birds, it's like insects, it's like a candy store life.

It is, it's— that's exactly what it is. And if you just look up and pay attention and really see the beauty—

that's what I mean by jaded. Yeah, none of this, Matt. Owls? You tell that to an average high school kid. What, you're into owls?

That's what I would have thought. That's exactly what I would have thought.

Well, that's interesting. So there is hope.

I mean, I think I'm being a little too hard on myself. I think I— there would have been a part of me that would have thought, okay, maybe I should explore this. But yeah, I think most of me would think, that's someone who's a little kooky. Anyway, you should— you should all watch a show on owls. They are the cool— they are the coolest animals, and I think the most beautiful animals of all.

A barn owl, by the way. Here's— this is to crack you up. Sue is crazy about owls.

Really? I never knew this about her.

Raise this with her.

Oh my gosh, she bought dinner. That's what I'm doing.

That's correct.

Okay, Dennis, for the sake of Prager Memes, which is the, the meme account that someone has created, what is our Instagram handle? By the way, do you know what a meme is?

I know what a meme is. The handle was a little trickier. But, but I have a handle on it. It is Dennis and Julie podcast. Dennis Julie podcast. Dennis and Julie need it, need a cast on their arm. The Dennis and Julie cast this week features— what did I miss? What is it?

Dennis Julie pod.

Oh, I got the casting and not the pod.

And what's my email?

Julie at Julie-Hartman.com.

That's amazing. Bam!

Thank you.

Wow, I am stunned. That— well done. Just to repeat, @DennisPragerPod, Julie at Julie-Hartman.com. And we're gonna find that guy that did the 50 questions.

Yes, that's impressive.

Read him— read his name aloud. Bye everyone.

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