Dennis & Julie: Science and Religion

Your dog and a stranger are drowning. You can only save one. Who do you choose? Dennis Prager says your answer reveals everything about how you define right and wrong. In his new book, If There Is No God, Prager exposes the danger of emotion-based morality and why without objective truth, society descends into chaos. This isn't a religious book. It's a rational case for moral clarity in a confused age. If There Is No God from Dennis Prager. Order now at PragerStore.com.

Hi everybody, Dennis Prager and Julie Hartmann. It's Dennis and Julie. Do you know that two guys in their 40s stopped me? I told you this, stopped me a few days ago on the street in Southern California. And it happens a lot. It's a beautiful thing. People say kind things, pose for a selfie. And the one thing they mentioned was, I really love your Dennis and Julie podcast. And I'm getting that more and more from people that, you know, most of the time people will mention my fireside chat. Uh, but now Dennis and Julie is, is, uh, is, is frequently mentioned.

I love that. I mean, that makes my day. And, and what a day to bring that up from the outside because it's our one year anniversary of Dennis and Julie. Episode 52.

I want, yes, I want to reflect on that for a second. Because time is a very odd thing. We say time flies, and that's completely true. At the same time, it seems like we're doing this way more than a year.

I know.

Well, also, it does to me anyway. Does it to you?

It, it does.

I mean, I mean, a year— that means a year ago you were still in your dorm room.

I was still in my dorm.

Well, doesn't that seem long ago?

It does. It seems— I will say it does. I know I'm the same person, but my life has changed so much in the past year that I don't know. It does seem like a while ago. I, what I thought you were going to say is that in addition to thinking that we've been doing it longer than a year, I sometimes think that we do it more than once a week. A, because the week flies by so fast. And so it seems like almost just every few days as opposed to every week. And also honestly, we do Dennis and Julie in our separate time. Like, this is just—

this is just a continuation.

We just go on. Like, last night we had an hour-long conversation that totally could have been recorded and posted as an episode. We have Shabbat dinners.

So that's entirely true.

It happens a lot.

But I tell you, I— it blows my mind that it's only a year. I know. Normally you would say, blows my mind, a year has passed already. I actually have the opposite reaction. And I don't know what determines It's only a year. So if you're in prison for a year, I know this is an odd way, but you know, this is where my brain is going. If you're in prison for a year and it's the year anniversary, do you think, wow, it certainly seems like less than a year, or God, it feels like 10 years?

Probably the latter.

Yeah, you would think.

May we never know the answer.

Right, right, I agree with you. But, uh, that's why this is odd, because we've had a good time. The way is you don't have a good time in prison. So nevertheless, it is a year. Wow. You know, one more thing on the Dennis and Julie, uh, subject. Somebody raised it with me, and I don't remember whom, but very recently, and they, they asked how many viewers we have. And it's, you know, it's always hard to know because there's so many ways of watching or listening to this, but, and it's growing and so on. But I said, I, I, look, I wish the entire planet, uh, watched this, and it has nothing to do with ego. I would be happy if they didn't even know Dennis who. I, I just think that the content can so benefit people, and that's why I do anything, to be honest. But I, I did— I also have to be very, very open and personal I believe that I'm doing something for posterity with you.

I agree. And I feel weird saying it because I don't know why. I know it's— you didn't say it in this way, and I certainly don't say it in this way. I feel like it sounds self-congratulatory, but I agree. They really are, for lack of a better term, timeless episodes.

Yes. And You're so young and you'll look back. It's, this is what is so odd. You will look back and go, God, was I young?

I know. And I wrote, gosh, it was so crazy because I was thinking a year ago right now, I had just written the Wall Street Journal op-ed.

Oh, that's right. February.

Which by the way, it's so funny because I was rereading the comments of that, uh, journal op-ed, which, which back a year ago I didn't do because back then I was, I don't know, I just, I didn't read comments. Now I'm like you, I love reading comments. I learned so much.

Oh, exactly.

And it's so funny because one of the people who was disagreeing with me, well, there was one guy that was like, you know, this girl is talking about, you know, is conservative and of course she is because she works for that billionaire Dennis Prager. This guy kept commenting that you were a billionaire. And I remember last year I sent a screenshot to Dennis and Sue.

That is precious.

And Sue wrote back, well, we will like give him a finder's fee if he can.

Oh yes, we'll give him 90%.

Yeah. So that's number one. And number two, one of the things that people wrote was, oh, she only did this, uh, op-ed to promote Dennis and Julie, because at the end of the op-ed it said, you know, Miss Hartman.

Yeah, but that's your ID. That's what everybody does, right? But like saying, oh, This guy wrote it only because of— to promote his book.

Well, yes, that's true. But also what people don't realize, and I swear to God, this is the truth. You were the one that told me to put it. I don't even know if you remember that.

I do entirely remember.

I didn't even put it like I said. I know that I sent it to him before I sent it to the Wall Street Journal and he was like, so anyway.

But it makes perfect sense. Obviously. Of course.

Of course it makes sense.

But that— see, when When people differ, they have two choices. They can dismiss your arguments with their arguments, or they can dismiss you. The left overwhelmingly dismisses the person, not the argument.

Yep.

That's why I coined the acronym 20 years ago, SIXHERB: Sexist, Intolerant, Xenophobic, Homophobic, Islamophobic, Racist, Bigoted. You never heard me say that? Oh, that's great. Oh yeah, absolutely. 15, 20 years ago, that's all they do. That you, you said, you know, maybe the vaccines are not good, especially for young people, and you're an anti-vaxxer. So they don't have to deal with all the scientists who said, you know, there's myocarditis developing in kids that otherwise wouldn't have it. And it seems to be correlated with the COVID vaccine.

Anti-vaxxer.

It doesn't matter what subject you raise. Gee, I really don't think that United should hire pilots based on race. Racist.

You know, I was thinking about this recently because shout out to Anne. I know that she watches Dennis and Julian. You know Anne. Anne is this wonderful—

We adore Anne.

We adore her. She goes to Dennis's minion.

Synagogue.

Synagogue.

You know it.

I know it. And I didn't— I used to not know it, but I do now. Of course you wouldn't have known it, right? And we had dinner recently. It was so much fun. And she's so smart and great. And we were talking about the war in Ukraine because I want to do a segment on my show about why Putin invaded Ukraine, because I've done so much research on it. And I think it's really important for people to understand because a lot of Americans understand that Putin is the enemy and that we're on the side of Ukraine, but they don't really understand why Putin invaded and what what led up to it, and I think that's, that's a mistake. So anyway, I was talking with Anne about it because I wanted to get her opinions on my, uh, my analysis before I presented it to the public. And she has a family member who's from Ukraine. I think she has actually many family members who are from there. So she has a deep personal tie to it in addition to just being well-researched. And we were disagreeing for a lot of the dinner. I was more or less, to put it in crude terms, taking the argument that we, the United States, were unwise to push Georgia and Ukraine and other former Soviet states or former Soviet satellite states into NATO. I think over time that was— although I understand why we did and I'm sort of of two brains about it, I think that it was strategically unwise for us to do it, especially because Putin for many years had said that he thought that it was a provocative move. He did not want— he said at the 2007 Munich conference that he did not want states around his border joining NATO. She was of a different opinion, which I totally understand. She was saying the whole purpose of NATO is to protect states like Georgia and Ukraine from possibly being invaded. The point is not that, though we can talk about the specifics of my argument if you'd like. The point was I just sort of zoomed out and I went, oh my gosh, if I were having this conversation with a leftist, well, first of all, I never would be having it because no offense to them, they wouldn't know enough to participate in the conversation. But they would get so angry and emotional. Here I'm sitting across from someone who has family who is in Ukraine or from Ukraine, and we're disagreeing about Putin. It's a very emotional subject. And we're just debating as two rational, open-minded people. It was really lovely. She did not let emotion get in the way of her. I didn't let it get in the way of me. And I thought, how nice.

How rare.

How rare. But we just both care about getting to the right place, you know?

And she even said, you know, to tell, tell the listeners the story you just told me right before we came on. Your dear, dear friend Gabby, in high school reading my book on happiness and how your classmates regarded that.

So we were on a senior class trip, this is in high school, and—

No, go, no, no, yeah, yeah, this is just the volume.

Oh, okay. I thought he was coughing.

Right.

And one of my best friends from high school is named Gabby, and Dennis has met her several times. She's a doll. She's one of my—

She's terrific.

Oh my gosh, she's— She is the definition of just a purely good human being. Anyway, we were on the senior class trip in high school, and I remember she was reading this happiness book on the beach. And there were some girls that were giving her a hard time for reading this book because of the apparently bigoted views of the author.

On happiness.

On happiness. And it was— it turned out to be Dennis's happiness book. And then later on, when I, you know, first went on your radio show and we became friends, of course I told Gabby and she was like, Julie, that was the guy. That was the book that I was reading, you know, in Hawaii. I know that was our senior class trip.

That's a great story. But the reason I raised it was—

and people were getting upset with her.

Yes. That they got upset that she would read a book by Dennis Prager. On happiness, no less. It wasn't like, why the left is destroying Western civilization. I could see why that would animate them, but it's a book on happiness. It doesn't matter. That's what I mean, though. You dismiss the person, not the ideas.

Yes, I know. I mean, look, obviously you're not a bigot, but even if you were a bigot, if you had something good to say about happiness—

that's right—

why wouldn't I read it?

That's exactly right.

People are multifaceted. Like, why would you just cancel the entirety of a person for one part of them?

The dismissal of people because you differ on a— listen, it's happening on Ukraine where there are conservatives who are against aiding Ukraine and dismiss conservatives who are for it, which only means that the left will conquer America and it will— there will be no hope for the future. I would then grieve for you. I had a great America, but I would grieve for you and your generation if Republicans cannot live with other Republicans who differ on an issue, and it isn't even a domestic issue. It's not like we differ on whether girls' breasts should be cut off if they say they're boys. That, I have to admit, could cause a real rift. But on Ukraine, that we would differ, this is suicide for us and therefore for the United States. Anyway, we don't have to get into that one at length, but I just want to say on behalf of your friend Gabby, you are absolutely right. I have met her a few times. It almost disturbs me, the issue, when I meet the Gabby's of the world who are so obviously good souls. Because I've really come to realize— and you'd think, why didn't I know this when I was 18? And yet I, I've always, I've always rejected the idea that we're born with a predilection to good. Some are born with a predilection to good more than others. I, I wanted it to be an even field. For a level field for everybody, that you have as good a chance of being a good person as the next person. But some people, just as they're born with musical talent, they're born with moral talent, right? And it is disturbing, but it is true. And I, you know, truth has to be the number one, absolutely number one concern of a person. So, you know, I'm not taking any credit from Gabby, but it would— if her parents said to me, well, she really has turned out good, but oh man, did she start out mean, I'd think, whoa, that's hard to believe.

Right. You know, I'll say this of Gabby, and it's true of our listeners. And I was telling Dennis this last night on the phone because we were talking about how today is our 52nd episode. And I said, I know that our show is good because, A, I'm in it and I, I feel it and I hear it. But B, because of the quality of people who write into me. Case in point, Elizabeth, the 12-year-old. I mean, almost 13, almost 13, you know, and I could, I could name so many people of, of truly a wide variety of age ranges who have written into me. And really, our listeners are— they're so good. You can just tell. And I've had the opportunity to really like engage in email exchanges with them. Very wise. I mean, all the time they send me articles or corrections or books that they think I should read. And honestly, that shows me that we're doing something right. Because if we're attracting those kinds of people—

That's everything.

It is. But that's the same with Gabby. I know I must be a good person because I've attracted a friend like her.

That's exactly right. You know, that's my mirror theory. The mirror of your body and face is a physical mirror. The The mirror of your mind is writing, and the mirror of your character is the people you attract into your life. If you keep attracting bad people, mean people, destructive people, then the point is not to insult you, you the individual, but you need to, quote unquote, look into the mirror. Why do such people come into your life? What is it about you that is a magnet for crappy people?

Right. Yes, it's a very, very good point.

It really is. That's why people who say, oh, I'm always mistreated— and there are many people who walk around thinking that way— well, you must look into yourself if, if that's true. And I'm, I'm ambivalent But maybe it's true. If that's true, why do they come into your life and not in my life? I'm not cheated and hurt by the people in my life.

If only people thought that way.

Well, that's the reason it bugs me that 6 billion people are not listening to Dennis and Julie. I know this sounds hilarious.

No, I agree with you. I understand.

That's the only— If we did not make one more dollar, that, that's all I would be concerned with.

It's true. So I have an issue to raise, which I like doing because usually you're the one who's, who's raising the issues and which is, which is great. But, um, it, it's on this subject of good people and did it arose this week, uh, on my show Timeless. I was interviewing this FBI whistleblower, Kyle Serafin, who served in the Bureau, I think from 2016 to 2022. And he observed a lot of political corruption, abuse of FISA warrants, the FBI spying on Americans in a way that he thought was unjust. I mean, he just, he talked, and he talked about the Twitter Files, and he just finally decided that he had to leave the FBI, and he was indefinitely suspended, and now he goes and he's brave enough to talk about it. And so what's really interesting is after the show, I was chatting with him, And I said, you know, it seems that there are more of you out there now, more whistleblowers, whether it be in the FBI or the CIA, that are coming out and saying, you know, kind of waving the red flag. And he said something that was so interesting to me, and it got me thinking about the subject that I want to raise, where he said, there are a lot of whistleblowers, but a lot of them won't go as far as I'll go. Like they'll come out and they'll talk about certain corrupt parts of the FBI. But this individual, Mr. Serafin, who I interviewed, he talked about sexual misconduct of FBI senior management. He talked about very, I mean, he really like did not pull any punches with coming out and exposing the corruption. And when he said that, I realized there are a lot of good people in this world Well, I should amend that. There aren't a lot of good people in this world, but there is a certain segment of good people in this world, but only a few will really go all the way in their goodness, if that makes any sense. Like even, I'll say this one thing and then I'm eager to hear your response. Even when I started out doing this job, conservative political commentating, there were times when I would think, are there certain subjects that I should avoid? For instance, I'm not going to say the election in 2020 was stolen because we don't know. But there were some egregious and vast improprieties that occurred in 2020. And I remember thinking, if I acknowledge that, then that's going to turn a lot of listeners off to me. Or if I acknowledge that, then I may not get opportunities in the future. And then I thought, Julie, you can't cherry-pick the truth that you talk about. If that is true, And you need to talk about it. You can't just, you can't just tell yourself that you don't wanna go there because it may not personally or professionally advantage you. That is shirking your responsibility as a commentator and as an American. Similarly with COVID vaccines, that's a very contentious subject. I could talk about other things, but I would feel again, like I'm morally shirking if I didn't discuss that there are some major problems with the COVID vaccine. But it's interesting because I think I see a lot of people who will sort of like, go 80% with acknowledging that there are things wrong in this country, but they won't kick it up the other 20%. And I think that's true of fighters and truth tellers in general.

I could spend the rest of the hour or whatever time we have just on that. I won't. I, I, I guess this is a perfect segue to— I just told me, right? Before we went on, what you wanted to raise as an issue on your part. That defines what I would call a great person.

By the way, that's what you wanted to raise last week, just to be precise.

Yes, that's correct. And I gave my talk at my synagogue on this. I did an hour on radio on this. This is really taken me over for the last few weeks. What constitutes a great person? Courage. Courage. I have courage, truth, not yearning to be loved, and being an outlier. Those are my 4 characteristics. You had not heard this, correct?

No.

Good.

Wait, can you repeat?

Yes, of course. Courage. Placing truth as the number 1 pursuit in life. The— God, what was the third one? Oh, yes. Not yearning to be loved. Being prepared to be hated, in fact. And therefore, the sum total is every great person has been an outlier.

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So those are my 4 characteristics. I actually have— I came up with a 5th. Yeah, so I told you to come up and you didn't, without hearing me. You're just hearing this now, just now. So, and I don't know what you're— what you listed. I, I did add a 5th, uh, at synagogue and that is having wisdom. You can't be a fool and great. Wisdom must be part of it because you can, although it's hard to pursue truth and not pursue wisdom at the same time. So I'm debating whether to add that fifth or not.

That is so, yes, you have to add that fifth.

Oh, really?

Totally, totally.

So you think you could have courage, pursue truth, not yearn to be loved, be an outlier and be a fool nevertheless.

Yes.

Okay, that's fair.

By the way, I think that there are people on the left who are that way.

Perhaps they don't pursue truth.

Well, okay, that's fair.

That's it. If you pursue the truth, you could be a liberal, you could be a conservative. You can't be a leftist.

Well, I may challenge—

You can't say sex is not binary and be a pursuer of truth. You can't say America is systemically racist and be a pursuer of truth. It is a fact. The whole foundation is lies. You can't say vaccines are good for children. It is good to keep children out of school for 2 years. It is good to mask 2-year-olds and be a pursuer of truth.

I agree with you. What I will say is, and this is— trust me, I, I couldn't agree with you more. And it's not a pass for these people. But I think that there are people who are like in high school who are on the left and have truly been brainwashed. And they think that they are telling the truth when they talk about—

Oh, yes. And so they're not pursuing truth, right? They think they're telling it. And here's a very good way of knowing if you pursue truth or not. Have you read both sides?

Yes. By the way, you know, it's so funny. And then I want to read and I have proof right here. I wrote it down.

I'm very curious.

And it's actually eerie because there's so much overlap. I would imagine again, this is the proof that I'm not just saying it because it's written down right here.

Right.

What you just said, oh, reading both sides. So I'll just tell you this one quick story. When I discovered you and discovered my conservative instincts, I of course talked with many of my friends about it and I lost some friends, as you know, and the audience knows. And I remember one of these friends who I lost said to me, just do me a favor. You know, if you're gonna be conservative, just make sure that you also read you read a liberal article or magazine for every conservative article or magazine that you read. And I responded to this person, do you do that? This person's on the left. And he just looked like, oh no, I don't do that. Like it didn't even occur to him.

Right.

I mean, it was just so pompous. It was like, oh, but you have to read if you're going to, you have to read the other side, but I don't.

Well, I told the anecdote. I asked a someone in my life who was liberal, not left, liberal. It was a major, major— I'm hesitating because I don't want to give it away at all who this might be. And I asked him, have you ever heard of Jordan Peterson? No. And have you ever heard of— and I just went through the list of the finest conservative minds that I know of. They had— did not— have never heard of one of them.

I never heard of you prior to PragerU. I just Googled, what do conservatives think about police? And thank God PragerU has a very robust advertising push. But I had never heard of you prior to that.

That's right. Well, I—

Jordan— no one.

Yeah. Well, are any of us exactly correct? It's— but we heard of all of theirs.

I know. Well, because it's—

all right, so what are your three?

Okay, so, so the first one was principled, but I, but I wrote under it what I mean by that, and I said you need to have a higher set of values, parentheses, truth, that you subordinate yourself to. I think this is so important. This is what religion used to provide for people. There were certain things that you placed above yourself and you followed regardless if it personally or professionally advantaged you. And that, that was your framework. So someone has to be principled. And I wrote under here an example that I'd like to tell you. I remember in college, and this is a very common view among people my age, there was a guy who said to me, or I asked him, what's your view of life? And he responded by saying, life's a game and you Basically what you have to do, the winners are the ones who play it well and the losers are the ones who don't play it well.

And I said, well, you know, that's about as dark a response as I could imagine.

And I said, you know, well, what about guardrails or what about morals or what about, you know, values? And he said, you have to do what you have to do. Like everyone is, everyone is playing a dirty game. Life is a dirty game.

Dog eat dog.

Yeah, if you want to triumph, that's what you do. And I think a lot of people, even people my age who aren't necessarily bad people, have that view. So I think in order to truly be a great person, you need to have principles higher than you, which is primarily truth. And I also wrote under that as a note, you need to know what it is you're fighting for, what it is—

your—

the kind of essence of your greatness. You can't just pursue greatness for the sake of being famous or well-known or of great. Truly great people are only aspiring to be great insofar as they're pushing their values, if that makes sense. Like, you don't— I know you so well, and I'm telling the audience this even though I'm sure they can see it for themselves— you don't care about being famous. You don't care about having— making a name for yourself as the Tower of Babel builders. Put it. You truly just care about bringing your worldview and your values to as many people as possible. And I think that's what a truly great person does.

So wait, what? How do you characterize the second characteristic?

Well, sorry, this wasn't—

this was sort of all under— this is under principle.

The principle needs to motivate your greatness, not the pursuit of greatness. You need to also have a principle. So that's number one. Number two, I put courageous, which is obvious. And I put that you can't just go 80%. Idea that I just talked to you about. The third thing I put was self-doubting but self-assured. And I would like to quote G.K. Chesterton on this one. He wrote, I think, in the early 1900s that a credo of the modern man is that he believes in himself. That's what every modern man thinks of himself. And Chesterton wrote, It used to be the case that you believed in the truth but doubted yourself. Now people believe in themselves and doubt the truth.

That's what he wrote.

That's what he wrote.

The guy was a genius.

Oh, my God. He was a genius. And you know what else? Not unlike Eric Metaxas. He was a hoot. He was a total—

Oh, I totally believe just from the quotes that I know of his. I mean, that, that is so great. They used to doubt themselves and believe the truth.

'Now people doubt the truth and believe in themselves.' By the way, I have that just locked into my memory. I didn't look that quote up before I came here. It is that—

that's beautiful.

It is that memorable that I can spit out exact Chesterton quotes because he's that good.

He's so good that people attribute to him quotes that he never even said that are great. Like my favorite: 'When people stop believing in God, they don't believe in nothing.

They believe in anything.' I thought that was a Pragerism. That's a Chestertonism.

No, no. And I always say it's not me. I'm adamant about not taking credit for great quotes that are not mine.

Right.

I want to shoot myself that I didn't come up with it. That, that is how I feel about it. The truth of that. So there's an old joke. He is a self-made man and he believes in his creator. It's another good line.

It is a good one.

Yeah. Not mine again, but it is. It is a great line.

But I think, you know, I—

forgive me, I just want to say this, this, this is probably something that occurs to me almost every day of my life and has almost all of my life. Those, those who accept God, and I mean this in an even intellectual sense, even not just emotional or theological just accept the God— and I'm speaking, it's got to be, I'm talking about the God of the Bible— the moment you do that, most people change. You, you, you walk around life knowing you're not the greatest thing since sliced bread. It, it, it does when properly believed in, and many people have improper faith or silly faith even, or even bad faith, but when properly believed in, there's an insurance of a certain degree of humility that there is so much stuff that is more important than I am. And I saw this dying in America in my generation, and it was. That's why the next two generations are so screwed up and so narcissistic. They're— a religious kid is not as likely to be as arrogant, as utterly self-assured, because you just grow up knowing there is— God is higher than me, my parents are higher than me, the Ten Commandments are higher than me, the Bible is higher than me, my religion is higher than me. It is such a difference. There's nothing higher than you in the secular universe.

That's literally what I wrote, a higher set of values, because a truly great person needs to have that framework.

You do. That's exactly right. You know, Micah 6:8, it's one of the few things I know to cite the chapter and verse. So Micah was one of the prophets and said, what does God want from you, O man? It begins with O man, not O no Israelite. Oh, oh man, this is universal. What does God want from you but that you pursue justice, love righteousness, and walk humbly with your God? Isn't that interesting? Have you ever heard that quote?

I have.

Walk humbly with your God. It's such a big deal because when you— if you really take it seriously, there's nothing to get all that arrogant about.

That's one of the amazing things about religion, and I know I've argued this on the show, but religion reconciles— or that's actually not true. Religion allows two seemingly contradictory things to exist. And I actually think religion does have sort of a nice way of reconciling them. The examples that I've given on the show is that certainly in Christianity, God is both incorporeal, but also has a son. God is righteous, but yet he allows bad things to happen. There are all these sort of things that seem to be working against each other in religion. And one of them is what you're just talking about right now. It's that on the one hand, people who really follow religion properly understand that they are small in the universe, that there are things that are higher than themselves that are more important than they. But also what religion teaches you in just as important terms is that you are significant, that your contribution matters. Isn't that amazing?

Yes.

Because both are really important.

And in the secular world, for many, it's all the opposite.

Yes.

There's nothing higher than me, but I'm nothing. I'm just a coincidental piece of physical matter. Do you know that there is a Hebrew saying I don't know where the source is, but it's ancient. So you'll love this. You will love this. So I learned this. I was single-digit old because my yeshiva education taught me so much, you know, religious Jewish education from the sources and in Hebrew. So a person is supposed to believe two things. Bishvilini v'rahah olam. The world was created for me. Is one, and the other is, I, I am just, uh, dirt from the earth. You, you have to carry both, uh, with you to have a realistic view of who you are. Yes, the whole universe was created just for you. On the other hand, you know, you're, you're just, uh, dust, dust of the earth.

You're made in the image and likeness of God. Yes, you are dust, right?

That's that. You're— yes.

And that is— again, that's totally the way that you should view yourself.

Yes.

In some ways you need to realize that you are in the image and likeness of God.

In another way, I wrote an article, one of my columns in the last 6 months, that the average kid in a truly religious Christian or truly religious— because most Christian and Jewish schools today are neither Jewish nor Christian, they're just a name. They're the same woke values as in a regular secular school. But a true Jewish or true Christian school will in fact teach you these things. This, in other words, what I wrote was not just that they teach you these things. We, I believe that I had more wisdom when I was 13, and so did my peers. It wasn't Dennis. My fellow students at yeshiva had more wisdom than the faculty of almost any university in America today. Than the whole faculty. At the age of 11. Because I learned this: the world was created for me and I am just dust of the earth. I learned that in 5th grade. I learned in 4th grade that I can't be— I can't follow my mood. By that great story I told you. So what? I'm not in the mood for the afternoon prayer. Really? So what? Oh, maybe my mood doesn't matter. You know how that's life-changing? A kid, what you want to do doesn't matter. It's whether it's right or not. What do you, what do you want to do is one of the least important questions a child needs to involve himself in. He needs to involve himself in the question, what should I do? And you know what was taught in my generation, which is the mother generation of all idiocies, the baby boomers, '60s? Let's get rid of the word should. There are no shoulds. I remember it. I heard there are no shoulds in life as often as I heard water is wet. Well, like much more often than water is wet.

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Isn't that something?

We talked—

there were no shoulds.

Okay, this is very interesting because I don't know if you remember— no offense, you probably don't, said with love— but we talked about on this show a few episodes ago our favorite words. And I love yours. You said earn and you also said should. And I on that episode said that I don't like the word should. And I think the origin of our disagreement comes from the fact that in your generation it meant something different than what it means in my generation.

I don't remember your commenting on this.

Did you then? Yes, I did. I said that I didn't, I don't like that word because, because you take it to mean what it really, moral obligation, should mean, for lack of a better term. Yeah, moral obligation, your duty. I told you that even though I recognize that that's what should, should mean, when I hear the word should, I think of people who are shirking their responsibilities and they want other people to do what they—

Oh, they're not doing the shoulds that they're advocating?

No. And one of the things that I said on that show is—

I remember you saying this.

We should— my lead— and also, I'm sorry to say this, one of my least favorite words is we, for the same reason, because so many people in college, my friends who I love, but they would say this, they would go, we should go to Boston this weekend. And you know what I would say to them? Okay, are we gonna make a reservation? And they'd say, yes, we should make a reservation. And I said, we means me. You— oh, sorry, I cursed. Oh my God, you have to bleep me out. You, dear friends, are not going to do it. I'm gonna be doing it. We means me. And the same thing with should. People would talk about—

oh, that was new to me.

When you should, you know, we should do this, or, or America 'By the way, I got this.' So I said 'should,' and what was the other one?

You remember? Earn.

I love that. That's a great one.

Did I give my third favorite?

Yes, you did, and I can't remember. Oh God, and I'm the human recording machine.

That's true. It's okay.

Yeah, what is it?

Nobody would like—

Yes, that's right.

Like beats love.

Why? Again, I don't recall.

Everybody loves their kids. Very, not very few, many of the people who love their kids don't like them.

That's another, that's another great Pragerism and good distinction. I'll tell you one I was thinking of today. Now when I say that I love someone, I say that I love them like a friend.

Uh-huh.

As opposed to like a best friend.

How about this? Just add, I love them and I even, even like them.

Yes.

That really, that's a good one. That brings the point home.

So you wrote this, or was it a column?

Yeah, no, it wasn't a column. It was a speech for my synagogue, and it was at one hour on the radio. When I get possessed by an idea—

oh, I know—

and it works, because then, thanks to the radio show, I have so many people to bounce it off. And then again, publicly speaking on it, then I will write it up, and that will force me to get it even clearer, because writing forces you to think much more clearly. And then, by golly, I have an important idea for, for people to— and then it's in your mind, it's filed away in your mind, and it's truly filed away. So here is an even— not more interesting, but as interesting question. This you didn't know I would ask. So you gave your characteristics of who is a great person. And I gave mine. So here is the interesting— and this is not an— the question seems simple, but it's not. Well, it's two-pronged. Should everyone aspire to be a great person is one. Two, can everyone be one?

You asked this last week, and I think I misunderstood. I did? Yeah, you did.

Bummer.

He's so funny. He— and by the way, Dennis, sometimes I feel like I shade you a lot with regard to your memory. You have an excellent memory when it comes to ideas, and that's right, but not— and that's what's important.

Okay, I'm not complaining. God gave me, or nature gave me, the gifts and some not gifts.

Anyway, by the way, one of the bingos that, that, um, some of our producers made is Dennis repeats an idea that he said last week, right, as if it's brand new. Yeah, it's okay. They also say I bang the table.

And by the way, since I came up with this phrase that repetition is the mother of pedagogy— pedagogy is teaching— it's not a bad thing that I don't remember.

No, no, it's not.

Who remembers it? We're bombarded with messages. Anyway, go on.

Well, I was just going to say it's worth bringing up again because it is an important point. I think last week I misunderstood your definition of great. You, you meant like you meant, excuse me, in the macro world, great. Like someone who's—

So no, this is okay. You have now raised—

No, this happened last week. This happened last week. Wait. Okay. I'm trying to remember. I thought, well, there was, I think we had this exact disagreement or like misunderstanding last week. Do you mean in terms of the macro or the micro?

So this, this, I don't know.

And I know people can be great in both.

That— well, that's the point. There are, there are two of us. Morally, there are two of us: macro and micro. Micro is how you treat other people on a daily basis. Macro is the positions you hold about things that are larger than you. So for example, when this— I said, and it completely eluded the left, which attacked me for it. It's all over the left. Prager says slave owners— there were some nice— some slave owners were nice people. It's so, it's so much deeper than the left-wing mind can, can tolerate. It's because they don't see subtlety in life, as if I'm saying it's nice to be a slave owner. What I was saying was the human being is divided into two, into two parts. There are people just like on the left. There are people whose, whose beliefs will destroy America and the West, but on a personal basis are wonderful to be with. They make a great neighbor. I fully acknowledge that fact.

And by the way, that's— we have to acknowledge that because that's part of—

that was Trump. That's what I kept saying. I don't care about Trump, micro. I only care about Trump macro. Macro is a problem, if there is one, between him and the people in his life. Macro is me and 300 million Americans and 7 billion human beings. That's more important to me. The macro of a president is much more important to me than the micro. Jimmy Carter was reputed to be a nice guy. He was an idiot. He was a moral idiot. He's the guy who wrote Israel was an apartheid state before the term even became the lie it is.

And he was the first— I mean, this is arguably a lesser offense. He was the first president to acknowledge the Communist— the Chinese Communist Party is the legitimate government of China.

I didn't know that.

Yeah, in the '70s. I was—

Wait, Nixon didn't do that?

No, Nixon visited. Nixon visited.

Yeah, right.

But Carter was the first to formally recognize.

Oh, is that right?

Yes. Just another great thing he did. That's an achievement. Yes, and there are so many others, and he has now survived. We are, that's right.

So by the way, maybe we should both add to our list great macro and great micro.

Right. By the way, just before we move on, I wanna say something that I have come up with as a rule for myself, and really since I became conservative. If it's true, I can't get offended by it.

That's right. That's a good one.

I mean, look, if someone's yelling at you and saying something true, but they're being abusive to you and they're not treating you kindly, you can be offended by that. You know, like, I'm not saying like people have the right to treat you poorly if something is true, but I'm saying like with what you just said, that some slave owners were personally agreeable or nice people. I can't get offended by that because that's true. That doesn't mean I endorse their slavery.

Of course not. That's right, no, exactly.

And the same thing, you know, like so many women get offended when you or others say that women have problems controlling their emotions. I can't get offended by that because it's true. Now if you—

They don't ask on the left, is it true? They ask, is it offensive?

How can you get offended, again, obviously within appropriate limits, or—

Right, as you—

How can you get offended by something that is true?

Not only that, it's not meant to be offensive to begin with.

Yes.

When men have to control their desire to, be sexual predators and to be violent.

You can be discouraged by something that is true. I'm discouraged by what you just said. I wish men were different. I'm discouraged by the fact that women are overly emotional. But this concept of being offended— we— if I were offended by reality, if I were a teacher, I would just like say to a student who says that they're offended by something like, it's impossible for you to be offended by this. You can't be offended by this.

Well, as I say to people all the time, you choose to be offended or not to be. It is a choice. People act as if 'I'm offended' is an objective reality. No, it's a subjective reality. You have chosen to be offended. Okay, I choose not to be offended. I'm not offended. The only question people should ask in any event as you point out, is, is it true? When I say United Airlines is going to have less qualified pilots because it has announced half of its flight school will be women and minorities, in other words, we at United are not going to choose pilots based on ability, but in, in at least in half the cases based more on their sex and their race. Why will I expect equally good pilots? It is not an offense against women or against minorities. It's a fact. If you don't choose based on excellence, you won't get excellence. Why is that offensive?

And you know, I'm sorry to say it, on the subject of planes, we're going to be seeing a lot more plane crashes coming up in the next few years because of that. And Even, you know, in the medical realm, because the MCAT— did you know this? The MCAT is removing a quarter— actually, I shouldn't say is as if they're going to do it. They already have. Removing a quarter of their questions that pertain to, oh, I don't know, medicine and anatomy, and they're replacing them with social justice questions. And also the MCAT has a policy. And by the way, look up the corruption of medicine.

Tell people what MCATs are.

MCATs are the, the, the test that you take to get into medical school. Have this all according to Heather MacDonald, by the way, who is, who is a Sue Prager in her own right, in that she is a, she is astoundingly well-researched and rational.

She's phenomenal.

She is phenomenal. So the MCAT has gotten rid of a quarter of the questions and replaced them with social justice.

I did not know that.

And oh, this one you're really going to love. They have a policy where if there's a certain like percentage point disparity with the amount of people who get a question right, like if 15% more white people get a certain question right than Black people, they think that that racial disparity is evidence of racism due to the question. They get rid of the question. Yeah, we're in great shape.

What do mitochondria do? We'll get rid of that. That's clearly— you ever hear mitochondria? I do, but it's a It's the part of the cell, I think it's the part that produces protein, but I'm not certain. But I know very little of this stuff, but I just happened to remember that. And isn't that an amazing thing to think that there's a racial quality to, gee, what do the mitochondria do? Which part of the heart pumps blood and which part of the heart receives blood? Well, if more Asians get that right, It's clearly racist.

So I have a little bit of a seemingly curveball question for you, but I'll tell you why I'm asking. Are you interested in biology?

Mitochondria. What? I was right. I said— I can't hear him. He says it takes the food we eat and turns it into energy so the cell can use it. So is that protein or not? Maybe I wasn't right. Okay, go ahead.

Are you interested in biology or anatomy at all? Like, do you try to learn more about it, or—

Well, in school, that was the science that most intrigued me, but I can't say that I read about it now. If there's an article, you know, it, it's found that X does this as opposed to what people used to believe, I'll read it, but I, I can't honestly say that it, it has grabbed me. I'm not proud of that fact. It just, it is what it is. Why? Why do you ask?

I ask because, well, A, let me first just say I feel the same way. It doesn't particularly grab me either. But the more that I learn about it, the more that I come to believe in God, which seems paradoxical because you would think that the more I would come to understand science, then I would believe in science. But the more that I come to understand science, I believe in the magnificence of science, which makes me believe in God, if that makes any sense. Because it's just— of course it is. So unbelievable.

My brother, who was at Harvard Medical School many years ago, he said that's where I came to believe in God, when I looked in the microscope.

Even if you— like, I remember learning in, in college, in my psychology courses of all things, the way that our eyes work with, uh, taking in vision, right? That we take these two photo, or photos is the wrong word, these two images, we bring them together in our mind, and by the way, apparently we see upside down.

I know, I heard that, I learned that, I remember that, without realizing it, and it's done immediately.

It's done immediately. You don't even understand all of the gymnastics that your eyes are doing so that you can see.

The eye alone. If somebody said, why do you believe in God the Creator? The eyeball.

Seriously. And it's so funny because I think a lot of people would, the more they'd learn about that, the more they'd—

When people say that logic Logic dictates that this was all natural selection. It is so obviously a function of a desire to believe that the eye made itself, or over, over a million years it developed all these abilities.

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When entropy is the far more logical thing in life, where things devolve, not become superior?

Also, as you point out in your Rational Bible Commentary, and I will admit the thought didn't even occur to me prior to reading what you wrote, how does life emerge from non-life? It's not rationally tenable.

Right, so you know what, they admit that they have never been able to replicate that. And yet they, they know by fact that there is life and there is non-life. So the— you know what their answer is? Are you—

do you—

you don't know?

Big Bang Theory? But that's—

no, no, no, that has nothing to do with it.

Okay, what?

So their answer is, we don't know, but science will tell us one day. So that, that's— but, but we're the ones who have faith. Like, right, that's, that's not a fair— oh really? How do you, how do you know one day science will tell you How life came from non-life.

So let's go back for a moment to what you just said, because I think it's really true and important. You said it clearly comes from a— comes from a desire within them to not believe in God or to believe in science. Why do you think they don't want to believe in God? Isn't it comforting and lovely to believe in God? Don't you want to think there's an afterlife that rewards good and punishes evil?

Well, so you have hit one of my favorite things that I developed in the last 10 years. Whenever I have a dialogue with an atheist privately or publicly, my first question is— and this way I know, am I talking to a rational person or a true believer, or a true— well, true believer, true fanatic. In other words, is the person intellectually honest? I don't care if he's an atheist, I care if he's intellectually honest. So I asked them, do you hope you're right or wrong? That's my question. If they, if they say, I hope I'm right, you hope there is no God? You hope you will never see any of the, of the people who you have loved in this life? You hope that? I did this with a very, very famous atheist. I won't say his name.

And was it a fireside chat?

No, no, it was on his— I think it was, it It was either on his show or a moderator's show, and we were both guests. And he's an editor of a science magazine. He's well known. And he's a good guy. In other words, he's not aggressive and so on. But he's a militant atheist. But I asked him that. I'm just curious. Do you hope you're right or wrong? And at first he was ambivalent. You know, well, I don't think about that, Dennis, or something like that. I said, really? Wait a minute. There's a part of you that hopes that you're right, that you will never see your wife or children for eternity, that you will have no other joy ever, that it's oblivion after this tiny infinitesimally small period of life. You don't hope that that's not the case?

It's weird.

So wait, so he goes, well, I never thought of it that way, so yeah, I'd like to see my loved ones. So you hope you're wrong. That— so, but it goes back to your question. So why, in my view, because they don't, they don't come to atheism intellectually, they come to atheism psychologically and emotionally, which is what they say about us and God, but They can say all they like. By the way, some people do come to God emotionally and psychologically. I come intellectually, but I admit that. But they don't admit that they come psychologically and emotionally. So your question is why? What's in it for them? So this is a very hard question given the fact that if they think about it, they hope they're wrong. So why would their emotions and psychology work against their fervent hope. So as we saw during the lockdowns and COVID generally, people follow the herd. The intellectual herd is atheist. To stand out in the realm of the intellectual today as a believer in God is to stand out and not be taken seriously. People want to be taken seriously by their peers, so there is huge social pressure to be secular at least and atheist at most. That's a big factor. Another is they have been brainwashed into believing that if they are serious about science, by definition it precludes belief in God.

I think that science demonstrates belief in God.

Yes, yes.

I don't see science— I don't see science as irreconciled palatable.

You got it.

I got it. With, with God. In fact, one of the things that I feel like I'm just a walking, living, breathing advertisement for the Rational Bible. By the way, the listeners agree. You know, I have listeners write into me, Dennis and Julie listeners, and ask me which one I should buy.

And what do you recommend?

I say Genesis. I say, I say Genesis.

Just start at the beginning.

Yeah, start at the beginning.

Yeah, I'll answer. It doesn't matter.

So, you know, while, while I'm here, while I'm bringing this up, maybe I could get like a 1% cut for, you know, my—

No, because then I will have been paying for these plugs. That's dishonest.

I am kidding.

No, I mean, I know you are.

I know it sounds corny to say, but the book is in and of itself the reward, the joy. I mean, it really is life-changing. Anyway, you write in the first chapter how the Torah's description of the beginning of the world actually fits the Big Bang Theory. It's amazing. So it just proves the point that science and religion cannot— are not irreconcilable.

Well, this is a new idea that science conflicts. The greatest scientists— who was the— Newton, the father of modern physics as far as I understand, was fervently religious. The idea that science conflicts with religion is post-Darwin, not pre-Darwin.

So what's interesting about that too is, um, when I first guest hosted for you, I did an hour called How Did We Get Here? Which, by the way, if I ever had my own radio show, like, and I had to segment my hours just in the same way you once a week do Happiness, I would probably do one hour on How Did We Get Here? Because there are so many—

I think if you ever name if you have a radio show every day, I think it should be named How Did We Get Here?

The show itself? Yes, I think that's not just an hour.

I think that's fantastic title.

Hmm.

How Did We Get Here? It is so provocative.

Okay, I'm almost tempted to ask Sean to edit this out because I feel like that's such a good idea, actually.

So why would you want—

because I don't want anybody stealing it.

Oh, that's hilarious.

Don't you dare. I'm gonna get it. I'm going to get it trademarked.

Yes, get a trademark.

I'm actually gonna get it trademarked like after the show. Anyway, thank you.

By the way, I said to— when I spoke to years ago in Baltimore or somewhere in Maryland, I think outside of Baltimore, to all, virtually all the Republicans in the House of Representatives. So I said, that's when I came up with my line, the bigger the government, the smaller the citizen. And Hugh Hewitt, who was also on the dais, said, you tomorrow you must get that trademarked.

Yes. No, you know, when you have a good thought like that, especially us who, you know, speak about publicly, you have to jump to get a trademark. I am not kidding, by the way. I'm getting trademarked.

Good, good. Yes, it's fantastic.

But I anyway, the first time I ever guest hosted for you, one of the greatest honors of my life, one of the most fun days of my life. I did an hour on how did we get here. And one of the things that I talked about was Einstein's theory of relativity. At the turn of the century, that is from the 19th to 20th century, Einstein discovered that the way that we understood the universe according to Newtonian laws was wrong. It doesn't really— the science of it doesn't exactly matter, but what matters is that he discovered that time and space are relative to one another as opposed to fixed, which is what Newton thought. Anyway, What happened, and Paul Johnson explains this marvelously in his book Modern Times, which Alan recommended to me, and anyway, it's a great book. You guys who haven't read it should read it. And one of the things Paul Johnson says is that Einstein's theory of relativity sort of opened the door for moral relativity.

That's how he begins the book.

Yes, because people, you know, think about it, it would literally— Einstein's discovery was so revolutionary at the time, it would be as if we discovered life on another planet today. It shook up people's understanding of the universe so strongly that people started to think, huh, well, if what I understood about the way time and space works was wrong, what else? What other assumptions do I have about the way that the universe works that are wrong? And then that's when religion started to be doubted, etc. But what's interesting, and this reminded me of when you said, did you say Newton, was he himself religious? Einstein wrote about how he— lamenting how his scientific discovery has led to this moral relativism. He, Albert Einstein, Mr. Science—

Wrote what? I'm curious.

He wrote he was also religious, and he wrote and he said— obviously I can't quote it verbatim, but it's in Paul Johnson's book— he wrote that he feared that his discoveries about relativity has wreaked moral and cultural havoc.

Yeah, I wouldn't characterize him as religious.

Well, he— and then he said, and he said, uh, sometimes I wonder if I should have just been a watchmaker instead of a scientist, because he was so, so concerned about what his discovery did morally and intellectually.

That is interesting. That I believe. But I, uh, just for the record, I— he wasn't religious. I don't know what he was. And by the way, I'm not— I'm not— just for the record, and this may surprise you. I don't care. See, the notion that we should care about what great experts think about anything outside of their area of expertise, that's a flawed notion. And you know when— I'll tell you, I know the day I came to this realization. Decades ago, there was a full-page ad in the New York Times. X number— I don't remember the number— X number of Nobel laureates oppose capital punishment and signed this petition.

Exactly.

And I remember, what do I care? You got— wait a minute, you, you got a, a Nobel Prize in chemistry and I should care what you think about capital punishment?

Why?

This is the, this is the one of the many false gods of our time— expertise. All I, all I admire is your expertise. That's why we got screwed up with the lockdowns. The experts said lock down children for 2 years in schools. They were dead wrong. They were 100% wrong. But it wasn't their area of expertise.

Right.

And if it was, then we're really doomed.

I know this is a— this is a not exactly related point, but tangential. But again, welcome to Dennis and Julie, because we are nothing if not tangential.

Tangential hour and a half.

That's right. I'm going to get that one trademarked as well. Of course, now I'm forgetting, and that's a bingo thing. So congrats to anyone who's playing at home. One of them is Julie forgets. Oh, yes, yes, yes. People coming out about statements. We live— you were making the point that people speak on things, and they're not— even if they're not experts on them, why are the Nobel laureates talking about capital punishment? What I have noticed is that So after George Floyd's death, it was so creepy to me to see how many businesses, how many sports teams, how many like weird niche organizations had to come out and say that they are anti-racist. Like, I remember the Harvard women's softball team posting a statement on their Instagram saying, we, the Harvard women's softball team, like condemn what happened to George Floyd, and we vigorously support the defund the police movement and systemic racism. And it was— I'm not just picking on the Harvard women's softball team, by the way. Some of the greatest girls I ever met at Harvard were on the women's softball team. Really awesome conservatives.

Conservatives I met when I spoke at Stanford years ago, when I interviewed students, were guys on the sports teams.

Oh yeah, no, I mean, the sports teams people loved me. Because they like you a lot. But so I'm not trying to pick on them, but one team after the other, the baseball team, the soccer team that I remember sitting there thinking, why the bleep does it matter if the Harvard men's soccer team opposes systemic racism? They're here to play soccer. Like, why are they commenting on this?

I mean, well, that's what woke— that's what woke is about. Look, leftism infiltrates everything. There cannot be a nonpolitical arena of life. This is one of the reasons I hate the left. They ruin joy.

Well, I told you that one of the ways that that was really hammered home to me was during my graduation speech. What? Or sorry, during my graduation ceremony, one speaker after the other, after the next would talk about politics. No life wisdom.

That's right.

None of that. And I, and I was sitting there thinking, and this was, by the way, this was the same at my high school graduation. So So it shows that it's been there for a while, even though I'm only 5 years out. But I remember when you're a graduate up on that stage, you don't want to hear about climate change. You don't want to hear about guns. You don't want to hear about abortion. You're scared. You don't know what your life's going to look like, and you want some wisdom. The last thing you want to hear is politics.

Well, left and wisdom are antithetical. And I don't mean that as a putdown. I just mean it is true. I'd like somebody to tell me a leftist with wisdom. Not liberal, not conservative, a leftist.

No.

If they were wise, they wouldn't be leftist. I mean, it's just, it's very, very sad, but very true. You're right to think about what should be said at a graduation. That's why PragerU has a graduation speech every year.

I love it. You delivered it.

Well, I delivered one, but they're—

Oh, they're every year.

Oh, every year different people deliver it. Do it. Absolutely. And they're terrific. They are really terrific. I, I, is it Tim Pool who gives, uh, will give this year's coming? I just saw, you know, I see the videos in advance cuz we review them.

So I'm planning a little spoil, spoiler alert. I plan very far ahead on my show, Timeless. For instance, not that this is related, but the 20th anniversary of the United States invasion of Iraq is coming up on March 20th. Of this month, so I'm going to do a whole show on that. Anyway, I try to think far in advance to prep some really cool episodes, and one of the things I'm planning on doing this May is looking back at the best and the worst graduation speeches and analyzing what makes a good one.

Oh, I think that's great.

And what makes a bad one. Unfortunately, I can find far more bad ones than good ones, but I was thinking maybe I'd write my own.

Of course you should. We have to conclude in a moment, but to give you an idea of that, of how radically schools have changed, you will be shocked to know that years ago I gave the graduation speech at the University of California Irvine Medical School graduation.

No way!

That's right. Is that amazing?

I never knew that about you.

UC Irvine. Today, if I showed up at UC Irvine, they would send police to escort me.

They would— I was going to say they would throw tomatoes at you, but that would be nice.

Well, if they were good, ripe, nice, I would just catch them.

That's amazing. So is it on YouTube?

No, I'm just letting you know though. Isn't that fascinating?

And you also— this isn't really the same thing, but you debated Kamala Harris of all people on CNN.

Larry King on CNN. Yeah, people could say that. See that? It's—

I've met Kamala Harris.

Wasn't a full debate, it was just a few moments.

But yeah, I met her.

Lucky you.

Lucky me.

Her husband just spoke about toxic masculinity. We should do that.

And her husband kisses Jill Biden.

Yeah, well, I have no comment.

Okay, how can we be reached?

Yes, how can we, just as your roommates, how can we be reached? No, no, no, we, you. Me, you, we does mean you, just as it did in your dorm.

Oh, trust me, we always means me. You can reach me at julie@julie-hartman.com. And oh my god, I feel like I say this every time, but you know how much I love reading the emails I send.

I do too.

Thank you, thank you all for listening and for your wisdom and for your love.

And let others know about—

let others know—

really touch, especially young people, could touch their lives.

Yes, and follow us at Dennis and Julie— no, at Dennis Julie Pod on Instagram and Twitter. To another year!

That's right, indeed.

Take care.

Bring champagne.

My God, I forgot.

I know.

Your beloved dog and a stranger are both drowning. You can only save one. Who do you save? Every time Dennis Prager asks that question, his audience splits three ways. One-third chooses the dog, one-third chooses the stranger, and one-third aren't sure.

Why?

Because we live in an age where increasingly feelings define right and wrong. But if morality is based on emotion, then murder, rape, and theft are just opinions. And if people feel justified, why is rioting or destruction wrong at all? In his new book, If There Is No God, Dennis Prager explains why civilizations cannot survive without objective morality and why Judeo-Christian Christian values shape the moral foundations of the free world.

If you claim that certain things are good, certain things are evil, independent of how you feel about it, you are in effect affirming God.

If There Is No God by Dennis Prager, available now at pragerstore.com. That's pragerstore.com.