Dennis & Julie: The Middle East Problem

Your dog and a stranger are drowning. You can only save one. Who do you choose? Dennis Prager says your answer reveals everything about how you define right and wrong. In his new book, If There Is No God, Prager exposes the danger of emotion-based morality and why without objective truth, society descends into chaos. This isn't a religious book. It's a rational case for moral clarity in a confused age. If There Is No God from Dennis Prager. Order now at PragerStore.com. Hi everybody, welcome to Dennis and Julie, Dennis Prager and Julie Hartman. So I, I never make reference to the exact moment we're recording Dennis and Julie, but it is very relevant in this case. This recording is taking place just 2 days after the massacre of Israelis by Hamas, and only God knows what will transpire.

Oh, I know.

Between now and the time this airs, so please be aware of that. No, I don't think anything will change. I think many things will change, but I don't think anything would change in what we would say, right? What we would say, I think, is applicable 20 years from now. In fact, I could prove it because my video for PragerU explaining the Middle East, I think it's the most widely viewed video on the Middle East and in the world. And you know, I don't say this to brag, I say it's for people to understand It has earned credibility over, I don't know, 15 years. Every word. Ironically, the theme of my 5-minute video was proven to anyone who didn't believe my video. One side wants the other side dead. That was the constant refrain. I said it's the easiest conflict in the world to understand. And the toughest to solve. That was my theme. It's very simple. One side wants the other side dead. A lot of Israelis were in denial about this, which is part of their complacency with what allowed this to happen. Totally understandably, decent people have a very hard time understanding evil. This has been the theme of my life, whether it was communism or whether it is Islamism as opposed to just Islam, the Islamic radical.

It's a good distinction, Islamism versus Islam.

Oh, well, I always use that. That's right. And even in the book that touched you, I call it Islamism. Yeah. So anyway, I will tell you, you know, it takes a lot to get me down. The, the scene of, of Jews being slaughtered family by family. So let me just say a couple of things, and then obviously I want to hear from you. But I, I do want to say, first of all, as Israelis are noting, more Jews were killed on Saturday of that, of these events, than at any, in any one day since the Holocaust.

Oh wow, really?

Yeah.

I didn't know that.

Of course, there would be no reason you would. I didn't think of it actually till I, I read it in Israeli newspapers. Israelis are very, very aware of that. And you don't have to be a religious person. You could be an atheist and understand that. That's a fact. Second, that's all they want to do is murder Jews. And anyone who supports Hamas in the Hamas-Israeli dilemma, like the morons I debated at Oxford, true morons, academics, needless to say, with PhDs, but in many cases PhD means fool. And the debate, people should watch it. It's on YouTube. My debate at Oxford. Do you know what the debate— the debate was? Who is the greater threat to peace in the Middle East, Hamas or Israel? And I debated a professor at Oxford who was an Israeli, ironically, maybe not ironically, who was an idiotic Israeli who said Israel is the greater threat. Is there— is there an Israeli who wants to go to every Muslim home and slaughter the parents and the children? I— it— people don't have an easy time recognizing evil because they're weak. People are weak.

I'm just astounded at the moral confusion. That's the thing. The existence of evil itself is hard enough. But then to see all of these people who are saying, oh, well, Israel is fully responsible. I'll read you one. I'm sure you're aware of it. I'm sure you discussed it on your show.

Read it. No, Harvard. Oh yeah. Yeah.

You want to know what is it?

27 groups?

I think 31 groups. Ready? We, the undersigned student organizations, hold the Israeli regime entirely responsible. How sick do you have to be to think that?

Well, well, you should read the names of the groups because it gives you an idea of the state of the Muslim Arab world. Today, morally speaking, not all by any means.

Of course.

I mean, I want to make that clear. I mean, there are many wonderful Arabs, many wonderful Muslims, but there were many wonderful Germans. But so read the names of all the Harvard groups that said Israel is entirely responsible for the fact that people went into their homes and slaughtered the families.

I'm going to read them to you because you're right, it's revelatory. But let me first just read 3 more sentences from this. So they're saying they hold the Israeli regime entirely responsible Today's events did not occur in a vacuum. For the last two decades, millions of Palestinians in Gaza have been forced to live in an open-air prison. Oh, because of whom? Israel has forced them to live in an open-air prison?

Exactly.

Or Hamas, who uses women and children as shields, who melt the food that Israelis give to them to use as rocket fuel, who put their military infrastructure embedded in hospitals and schools so that Israelis can't bomb them unless they harm civilians. These people are deranged. Changed and deny basic human rights to every individual, not just women and children. Oh, right. But Israelis are keeping them in the open-air prison. Sick. The apartheid regime is the only one to blame. Israeli violence has structured every aspect of Palestinian existence for 75 years, etc. You get it. Everyone has read stuff like this. Okay, so ready?

Yeah.

By the way, just the existence of all of these groups alone proves my point. I either talked about it on D&J or on Timeless. These affinity groups at these universities. There are so many of them. What do they accomplish? What are they really doing to unite the said group? It's bizarre. And no one calls it out because everyone's so afraid to call out. You can't criticize affinity groups. Listen to these. Harvard College Pakistan Student Association, Harvard Divinity School Muslim Association, Harvard Middle Eastern and North African Law Student Association, Harvard Graduate Students for Palestine, Harvard Law School Justice for Palestine, Harvard Divinity School for Justice in Palestine, Harvard Jews for Liberation, Harvard Kennedy School Bangladesh Caucus, Harvard Kennedy School Muslim Caucus, Kennedy School Muslim Women's Caucus. That one's a trip. Harvard Kennedy School Palestine Caucus, Harvard Kennedy School South Asia Caucus. I'm sorry, I shouldn't be laughing, but it's so absurd. Harvard Muslim Law School Association, Harvard Prison Divest Coalition. I'm just, I'm skipping some.

That is an interesting one. The Harvard South Asian, what was it?

The Harvard, oh no, I can't find it. Yeah, it was the South Asia Caucus.

Yeah, the South Asia Caucus.

And the South Asian Law Students Association.

Yeah, South Asian. So what does South Asia mean? Does it mean India? What does it mean?

Yeah, I think it means like India, Pakistan, Bangladesh, Indonesia.

Okay, well, so other than India, they're all Muslim.

Okay, right. Um, I'll— I believe it or not, I'm, uh, skipping some. Harvard Undergraduates Arab Women's Collective, Harvard Undergraduate Muslim Women's Medical Alliance, Harvard Undergraduates Nepali Students Association, Harvard Undergraduate Palestine Association. There's a— there's a— I had toe fungus as a child association.

This is the left's undoing of one of the three mottos of America, e pluribus unum, from many one.

Absolutely.

Everyone is divided into a primitive notion. Your ethnicity or race matters more than anything.

Oh my God, I have so much to say about this. First, it's amazing to me that these schools continue to tout their commitment to diversity, and yet they encourage and allow these students to segregate into God knows how many affinity groups. Again, they're like, I had toe fungus as a child affinity group. You think I'm kidding? There's stuff like that. There's at my old high school, there's a learning divergent affinity group.

What does that mean?

Like if you have ADHD or something, or if you have learning divergent affinity group. And so it's amazing that these schools are like diversity, diversity, diversity, and then people segregate into groups where people are exactly like them. And it's insulting contrived Richard Hanania, who you interviewed on your show and then I interviewed on Timeless, published this book called The Origins of Woke. So good. It's a slog, honestly, because he goes through all the civil rights law and how it's been misinterpreted and skewed to kind of lead to the DEI regime that we have today. But one of the things he highlights is that the government came up with like AAPI and these acronyms that are supposed to encompass—

what's AAPI?

Asian American Pacific Islander.

Oh yeah.

How the hell are Asian Americans and Pacific Islanders this? I mean, it's, It's ridiculous.

They have nothing in common.

And there are AAPI affinity groups at Harvard, at these— I'm not going to name them, but my friends work at these corporations.

What they all mean is not white Anglo-Saxon Protestant. Exactly. That's all it means.

Yes.

By the way, you read— wait, wait, wait, remember what you want to say. But I want to comment. So you read a Jewish group?

Harvard Jews for Liberation.

Yeah, Jews for Liberation. So you— one must understand, under the heading of pathology are the Jews. I don't know how many there are. There might be 5, there might be 50 who are a member of that organization. They just saw Jews massacred— men, women, children, grandparents— solely for being Jews. Grandparents, toddlers, babies slaughtered, whole families of Jews slaughtered because they were Jews, and then they sign a letter of solidarity with those who slaughter Jews. I don't know— I say this as a Jew, and as a very committed Jew, as is well known— I don't know what group produces the same number of sick people as my group does percentage-wise. There are, there are.

I'm sure there are many.

No, no, I don't, I don't, I don't know. I mean, are there? Listen, I am quite unhappy with the number of left-wing Blacks, but there are no Blacks who are for the Ku Klux Klan. There is no, there's no analogy in any other group to support those who wish to murder your group. Only Jews produce such sick people. I know why. Because they, they, they think that if they side with those who persecute them, they won't get hurt. You don't know this because you're not Jewish. And most Jews don't know this. But that is the reason. Why would a Jew— why would no Black support of the Ku Klux Klan ever? Why would Jews support the Hamas? Hamas has, has in its charter, it is to Kill Jews. Jews, not Israelis. Jews. It is. It is in its charter. We saw what they did this past weekend. And yet Jews would sign that. These are the sickest of the sick. They are in league with the most befuddled human beings that exist in our society.

You know what also bothers me, Dennis, in addition to The Jews who are siding with the, essentially the terrorists who are coming.

They would've been murdered.

I know.

I know. That's the irony.

You know it all. And of course this is not all, I mean, dear God, it's not all Jews. I'm just sitting in front of one.

Right.

Yeah. So, so that's, but you know, you know, whenever we talk about stuff like this, you have to put in a million disclaimers, a million qualifications before you say anything because I'm, I'm about to be called an antisemite. You know what also bothers me? I see a lot of left-wing American Jews, secular Jews, who are very sensible when it comes to Israel. When something like this happens, I see them posting, I see them reacting appropriately. They seem to have a lot of clarity about Israel's right to defend itself, Israel's— how Israel is not a racist apartheid state, how these terrorists are the aggressors. They seem to have a lot of clarity when it comes to Israel, and God bless him. But suddenly all of that clarity is suspended when it comes to the United States of America.

I couldn't agree with you more.

Pisses me off to no end. I'm sorry.

Right.

Makes me crazy. It's like, right, these are the same people who are like, transphobia and Trump is so evil, right? Well, it's xenophobic to close the border, right? They're so—

the flag is imperialist.

The flag is imperialist. And then they have all— and then all of a sudden they get this rationality when it comes to Israel, right?

So here's the deal. Most of their kids are no longer even pro-Israel.

Yeah, well, that's, that's the ultimate coming around for them.

That's correct. That Jew— there was a fascinating piece in Tablet, a great, great website, of, of actual very bright Jews. And the article was essentially the The left-wing Jew is in his or her last generations in America. And they gave data to support it. For one thing, the vast majority of their children are marrying outside of— marrying non-Jews, which, by the way, is not in and of itself a guarantee that you will assimilate, but it usually means that. It's not a guarantee, but it usually means that. And they're not having children. So the, the left-wing American Jew is disappearing. Their, their kids no longer identify as Jews in any meaningful way. And, and if they even are, they may well not have Jews. Orthodox Jews are having 4 children per couple in America, and left-wing Jews are having well under 2. Probably one or less. So it's a certain sad fact of American Jewish life. But I just want to say, when you read the Harvard group, to be a Jew who is pro-Hamas is literally sociopathologic. There is something wrong with you. It is not a matter of we have divergent opinions. You are supporting people who wish to slaughter every Jew in Israel. And as I pointed out, and needless to say, you picked up on, they don't confine it to Israel. How many, how many Jews in America, let alone non-Jews, remember the blowing up of the Jewish community center in Buenos Aires, a Jewish school and Jewish community center? It was done by Iran. And the—

What year was that, roughly?

Oh, I don't know.

A decade.

Oh, a decade. It was, I would say, I would say the '80s. Yeah, that's my rough, my rough estimate. And, uh, it's, it's happened all over the world. I read on the air today the Australian— Australia, you can't get further from the Middle East on planet Earth— Australian Jewish community said the police have asked us to announce Jews should not go to the Sydney Opera House. Because Muslims are demonstrating on behalf of Hamas and it is a dangerous place for a Jew to be. Why would an Australian Jew be in danger if the only, only issue is Israeli Jews?

Totally. As I'm going to repeat what you said on your radio show, Iran and Hamas and Hezbollah and insert any other radical Islamic regime or group, their hatred for Jews is not confined to Israeli Jews. It is. It is for every Jew, to your point. And the analogy that you drew, which I thought was amazing and really hammered it home, was it would be as if to say that the Nazis only hated European Jews. No, they hated entire Jewry.

Right. But they were right. They were dedicated to exterminating European Jews, like Iran and Hezbollah and Hamas are dedicated to exterminating Israel's Jews.

But if they could exterminate every Jew, they would.

That's correct.

And also, we saw, you know, in Egypt, that on Saturday those two Israeli tourists in Egypt were shot by an Egyptian police officer. Did you know that?

No.

Yeah, and another Egyptian was killed, but this police officer just opened fire on these two Israelis, these tourists.

So it's very interesting. My thesis about antisemitism, and I wrote a book on it, Why the Jews, it's a really important book. It's I think the book I've written I least refer to until there's a new eruption of antisemitism. But people don't understand, and that's why I wrote the book 40 years ago. It's in its 3rd edition, so it's been updated over the course of the decades. People don't understand that the Jews are the miner's canary. In other words, a lot of people don't know what miner's canary means. Apparently miners did take or do take canaries canaries down to the mine because they die as soon as there are noxious fumes. So they see the canary died, they know they better fight those fumes or they'll die.

Right.

The Jews are the world's miners' canary. Evil focuses on Jews. And the non-Jew is the miner. And they have two choices when the Jew is slaughtered by the noxious fumes of Jew hatred. They could say, "Ah, look at that, how sad the canary died," or "Uh-oh, we're in trouble." And they didn't say, "Uh-oh, we're in trouble with Hitler." They said, "Oh, too bad the canary died." "Oh, too bad Hitler is a Jewish problem." Like the fumes are just the canary's problem. And that is the terrible lesson of Jew hatred.

One of the things that I hear often is people say it's that super trite quote that the march of history has been towards justice or the arc of history has been towards justice.

Right.

That to me is the most idiotic statement that you could say.

You need a PhD to say that.

You do need a PhD to say that or an undergraduate degree from an American university unless you're me. Look at the 20th century. Talk about recent. I mean, that was the most bloody century perhaps in world history. We don't, we don't know, obviously going way back.

It probably was.

But certainly in modern history, my gosh. And that was yesterday. That wasn't even 80. The Auschwitz was not liberated even 80 years ago.

That's right.

Which is amazing to me.

The gas chambers were functioning 80 years ago.

80 years ago right now. And it's amazing to sit across from you, as you often say, and you were born only 3 years, right, after the gates of Auschwitz were opened and it was liberated. So people— it's just like, I don't understand when people say that. And then when something like this happens, I just want to say to them, no, we have this idea, and it's all of Francis Fukuyama's book— what was it called? The End of History— that Basically, when the Soviet Union collapsed in '91, the Western liberal democratic norm has triumphed. And in many ways, it's dwindling now. In many ways, it has triumphed. But to say that basically it's the end of history, everything is going to be fine, that is an irresponsible and reckless thing to think. But, you know, The arc of history should be towards justice, especially in the United States, because we— this hit me the other day, like, we should be the most enlightened people to ever live. We live in the 21st century. We've seen thousands of years of human history. We have the capability to know about that history thanks to a lot of technological, archaeological advancements. You know, a lot of people living centuries before didn't know so much about history as we do now. We have access to so much writing, so many profound thinkers who can enlighten us about human nature and about the way things go in life. And we don't— we just ignore it. And we are the least enlightened American generation, despite all of our privilege and despite all of our knowledge and resources we have at our fingertips. Do you ever think about that? It's scary that we should— we should be the ones that see something like what happened this weekend really clearly. And yet compared to previous generations, which had a lot less, fewer resources than we do, we, we see it.

Well, clarity, clarity and knowledge are not related, right?

Well, actually, I think wisdom and knowledge and clarity and privilege and peace are not, are not related. I actually think as, I think part of our issue is we have been in such a prosperous, affluent, leisurely society. You know, we don't know really.

My equation, secularism plus affluence equals boredom.

Yes.

And boredom leads to very sick doctrines.

You know what I also can't help but think of right now? And you tell me if you think I'm exaggerating, but okay. So this attack on Israel occurred 2 days ago. Francis— or no, not Francis Fukuyama. I'm getting my historians confused. Neil Ferguson has this hypothesis, which some may think is a little out there, But he said that World War II didn't start in 1938 or '39 when Hitler invaded Poland. He says it started in 1931 when Japan invaded Manchuria, and then a few years later when it invaded the rest of China, and when Hitler started to go into the Sudetenland and part of Czechoslovakia. In other words, he said there were these like little threads that were happening And they seem to have nothing to do with one another. I mean, who would have thought in the '30s that whatever Japan was doing in Asia would have anything to do with whatever Hitler was doing in Europe? People view that— would have viewed that as totally separate entities. But then in the fullness of time, they kind of came together. And I sort of feel like that's our situation right now in the world. There are these things happening that seem totally unrelated to one another. Biden's disastrous withdrawal from Afghanistan and the Taliban taking over. Iran getting pretty damn close to fashioning a nuclear weapon. Putin invading Ukraine. Russia or China probably is going to invade Taiwan in the near future. And then this in Israel. And I think we kind of look at all of these things as just separate bad things happening in the world. But I fear that soon there will be some kind of way that this will come together that will make sense. And it certainly won't be good because I see the hand of China and Russia in a lot of this. I mean, Russia, if Iran— and we know Iran was behind Hamas and what Hamas did this past weekend. If Iran was behind it, then Russia was behind Iran. And Russia, in all likelihood, knew about it. And so, again, I just think we ought to really pay attention to what Neil Ferguson warned us about. These, these threads can come together and the—

well, and they're all predicated on one overriding thread: American weakness.

Yes, that's well said. Yep.

If America is strong— I spoke to Michael Oren, Michael Oren, just before the show, who's on my show. He is the former Israeli ambassador to the United States. He is one of the greatest living historians. That's his field as a historian, but he was named Dennis Prager, Israeli ambassador. He's a remarkable man. He's an Israeli, he's an American, either his family or he moved to Israel when he was young. He's a remarkable man, a terrific historian. And he was speaking about the issue of America and in passing And this guy is a centrist. I don't know if he's left or right.

I saw him on CNN this past weekend.

Yeah, well, CNN wouldn't have a rightist on, so that's a perfect example. Okay. And he said something to the effect that, oh yes, Iran fears Trump being elected. In passing. And I was thinking when I Neil Ferguson, back to him again, the great historian. I asked him a year ago, would Putin have invaded Ukraine if Trump were president? And I would say one second took place between the question and the answer. He said no. And I, again, because I have wisdom, and that, that's why I'm not on the left, you cannot be both. You can be a liberal, you can be a conservative, you can't be a leftist and be wise. And I understand this: I don't give a damn if the American president is loved. It is of absolute no interest to me. I care if the American president is feared. That's it.

And Machiavelli would agree with you.

Well, your man Machiavelli. Because it's true. Because if the, if the bad guys don't fear anyone, they'll, they'll be bad.

Oh, they laugh at Joe Biden. They— I mean, and that's, you know, so I tweeted this past weekend something that basically outlined the past, what, 2 years, 2.5 years of American foreign policy. Starting in 2021, August, Biden's disastrous, disastrous withdrawal of Afghanistan, by the way, leaving many hundreds of Americans and Afghan allies behind. Mike Lindell has a passion to help you get the best sleep of your life. He didn't stop at the pillow. He also created the Giza Dream bedsheets. These sheets look and feel great, which means an even better night's sleep. Which is crucial for our overall health. Mike found the world's best cotton called Giza. It's ultra soft and breathable, but extremely durable. Mike's latest deal is the sale of the year. For a limited time, you'll receive 50% off of the Giza Dream Sheets, marking prices down as low as $29.98 depending on the size. Go to mypillow.com and click on the radio podcast square and use the promo code Hartman. There you'll find not only this great offer, but also deep discounts on all MyPillow products, including the MyPillow 2.0 mattress topper, MyPillow kitchen towel sets, and many more. Call 1-800-566-6745 or go to mypillow.com and use the promo code Hartmann. 20 years of, of service and sacrifice is wiped away. The Taliban retakes over, including taking over over $40 million of American equipment. Okay, that happens. Whoops. Oh, what a shame. Then President Biden says in January of 2022 that a minor incursion by Russia in Ukraine might be acceptable.

Yes. People forget.

36 days later, Putin invades Ukraine. Whoops. Oh my gosh. How did that happen? How's that? And then we see Biden giving $6 billion to Iran. 19 days later, Hamas launches the deadliest attack in Israeli history.

Right.

Hello. It's, it's American weakness, American blunders. Our enemies see us as incompetent. They see us as not fulfilling our promises. They see us as unprincipled and just totally disoriented, disoriented. And it is going to end up catastrophically for us. If I were one of our adversaries, I would do whatever I wanted to do now while Biden was president.

That's correct.

Because even, you know, he gives these, these, these statements that seem so good. We stand with Israel. We unequivocally condemn Hamas. But what is he really doing about it?

Right. Well, what did he do that made that more likely?

Yes. Well, he also gave aid to Gaza. And the leaked documents said that they knew that a lot of it was probably going to end up in the hands of Hamas and not in civilian hands.

Well, well, of course it would.

I know. But the point, the point is they even knew that and did it anyway. I really hope people— I mean, this is just the foreign policy stuff. This is not even— this is not even touching the domestic issues that we have, which are enough to say adios to Biden. But I hope that the one silver lining of this terrible thing in Israel is that people might start to really see the consequences of having someone like Biden in office?

I don't know.

I don't know if they will.

I don't think they will. Well, see, in the column that I've written on this issue, I note that Hamas and Hezbollah, among others, are the successor to the Nazis, the successors that they're from. In terms of Jews, they're indistinguishable. They both are for exterminating Jews. I just, I have to repeat this point. When you realize how many academics think this is, what is their term? The violent spiral? What is their term? They have this term to cycle of violence. Cycle of violence. Yeah. Cycle of violence. That's— it's indistinguishable from saying, you know, the cycle of violence between Britain and Germany or between the U.S. and Japan. We cycle of violence. Somebody started this, right? The inability to determine who is responsible, to see the evil for what it is, is— that's frightening.

It is. That's what I was saying earlier, that the existence of the evil is hard enough, but the moral confusion that we're seeing in the wake of it is what scares me more than the presence of evil, because evil is always going to exist.

Right. If the good don't know what's evil, it's over.

Yes.

That's exactly right.

Do we see that in the United States? I mean, I can't believe that it is even up for debate that children should be allowed to get puberty blockers and get their breasts amputated. I literally—

Well, here's a great question then. If we could do a poll, among all Americans who believe that girls should be allowed to decide to get a double mastectomy if they say they're boys. And let's say even at 18, forget, forget 15. I'll make it easier for the other side. Right. Just on the basis I'm a boy. Okay, we'll cut your breasts off. What percentage of them support Hamas and what percentage support Israel?

Fascinating.

So is it, huh?

It's a fascinating question.

Isn't it?

Yes.

I am convinced that among the community of people who support the— what's the word? Not ruining, but the—

Obliteration, annihilation.

Yeah, well, the terrible act the physical acts done to boys.

Mutilation.

Yeah, mutilation is one word, right? I would say that moral— my lifetime, I have noticed a broken moral compass is pretty consistent.

Yes.

So that if you think that's good, then if you think men menstruate and people should say that, the odds are you think Hamas is the good guy and Israel's the bad guy. I am convinced that that is— that they are related.

Well, well, what I said about the left-wing Jews, the secular left-wing Jews who I know, may complicate that because I know a lot of them believe that men menstruate.

And well, no, you— yeah, because, okay. So I— you were right and I answered that their children will not vote accordingly. They have this emotional attachment to Israel from their childhood. And it is—

it is from their parents, you mean?

Yeah, from their parents. But I'm talking about the adults that you're describing. They have—

I'm talking about people my age.

No, I don't believe that most Jews your age who are on the left on American things are big supporters of Israel.

Most aren't. But I know— I know a lot who are.

Of your age?

Yes.

That's fascinating.

I do.

So they are—

they're super rational with Israel and then suspend that in America.

Okay. You— I believe you. But as I said earlier, the data are that they're disappearing. Yeah, but it's, it's distressing.

So— oh, sorry.

No, no, no. It's just— it's distressing. You've kept your sanity on Israel and lost your sanity on America.

Yep, it is. It really angers me too, because they're lucky to live in America. We all are lucky to live in America. I'm not just, you know, wagging my finger. All of us are. And it's—

Well, can I join the South Asian Pacific Islander Legal Association?

Oh, I have something to say on that, which I don't want to forget. So help me not forget it. But about this. Affinity groups. But before I do, I want to ask you a question. Affinity groups, that, that's the way of helping me. I'm trying to just every, every 30 seconds. Yeah, affinity groups, affinity groups. Sean, we'll put you in charge of that. So question for you, and obviously this is the eternal question, this is the question that you have been trying to answer for your entire career, and this is the question that we will try to answer for the rest of our lives. Why I think, I think the Hamas and Hezbollah and those kinds of people are truly so brainwashed and extremely evil. What I'm asking about are not those individuals, but about the signers of the Harvard letter that we just talked about. What is wrong with them? Are they brainwashed? Are they evil? Are they thinking that they are genuinely doing something good and they are just totally misdirected? Did they have a really horrible? And I'm not even being tongue-in-cheek here. Did they have something really awful happen to them that, that has made them have this visceral, blind anger towards Jews? No matter what anybody does to them, it's always the Jews' fault. Like, what do you think animates? And obviously it's different depending on the individual. What do you think animates? And this can be extended to not just the signers of the Harvard letter, but the people who think that it's— say that it's okay to have drag queens twerk in front of 4-year-olds and have 10-year-olds get their breasts cut off. What is— what is impelling them to do that?

Well, it's, I think, different things in different cases. However, it is apparently— it, it isn't— it is very difficult to withstand the mob. I would say that that more than anything else—

cowardice. Yeah, it's a good point.

If you are a Muslim student at Harvard and don't sign that petition, you're ostracized. People don't want to be ostracized. So I would say that it's the mob mentality.

So true, Dennis.

Yeah. You know that there is a biblical law. It's in the Torah, one of the many great, great, great, great, great, great, great, great, great laws. Do not follow the majority to do evil. It's an actual biblical law.

Cowardice is evil, sidekick. It's not the same as evil, but without evil could not exist.

Could not exist. It's. It is sine qua non, without which nothing. Without cowardice, the desire to be a sheep. You'll love this. I can't— look, I have no apologies for citing the Torah because that's the greatest book.

Especially not in front of me.

Especially not in front of you. So you have not read this yet because I didn't come out with the fourth volume yet. It's coming out next year, the Book of Numbers. And in it, there is something to the effect of that the Israelites wanted a shepherd, a leader to be their shepherd. And it sounds perfectly fine. And I write an extended essay there. You know my essays and my commentary. And it is human beings should not want a shepherd, because if I have a shepherd, I'm a sheep. My only shepherd should be God. And that, by the way, is the biblical ideal. Your one shepherd is God. Your terrestrial leader, your earthbound leader, is not your shepherd. God is your shepherd. God is my shepherd, I shall not want. I mean, the most famous of all the Psalms, Psalm 23. I don't want to be a sheep. I even, by the way, ironically, even vis-à-vis God, the Torah doesn't want you to be sheep. You're supposed to argue with God. The name of Israel means argue with God, fight with God. You should never be a sheep, even a religious sheep. But that is the answer to your question. They go along because they go along. Yeah, that very few people are prepared to fight on their own. It's— you're— you are, folks. I just, I just want to say this on your behalf. You know, see, too many things are forgotten. You wrote a piece for the Wall Street Journal saying during, during the lockdowns that your fellow Harvard student was sheepish. You wrote that, and the Wall Street Journal, to its credit, published you. By the way, I was stunned that you weren't more eviscerated, maybe because they were all locked up in their dorm rooms.

You know, in a weird way, I have a theory about why I wasn't more eviscerated. The first thing is I actually think a lot more people agreed with me than were willing to say, but it supports your sheep mentality point, right? And I also think the people who were just like crazy lefties and didn't agree with me, I think they were afraid to confront me. And I'm not saying this is like, I'm so, I'm so inspired fear. I think I have this theory about being canceled. When someone does something and they get canceled, They're still like, okay, let me backtrack. Let me phrase it differently. At that point, when I wrote that article, I had worked for you for a whole summer. I was on your show once a week, then I guest hosted for you. Okay. So there were videos online of me on your show. People knew I'm not, you know, it's not like I was famous or anything in the world or on Harvard's campus, but people knew what I did and people knew where I stood politically. And I think that kind of made me a little bit untouchable. Not that I didn't get some crap. I did. But I think it was almost like, this person is so strong in what she believes that it's not even worth my energy to try and—

And has an audience.

Yes.

This is not an— what is the English for nebbish? This is not a nerd. This is not some one student voice. You have a bigger voice.

Right.

And they knew it.

Right. It's because they can't cancel me. Because when you cancel someone, you're assuming that that person ascribes to your same worldview, that, that they deserve to be canceled. I am so not in their worldview that I'm almost uncancelable, because if they try to cancel me, then I'm just like, well, I don't know.

Cancel from—

Yeah, there's— this is just— I'm in a different reality than you, or you're in a different reality than I. And so I want people to realize that, that actually the more that you stand strong.

That's right.

It's weird. Like, in some ways it actually immunizes you against the people because you see these individuals who get canceled and then they issue an apology. They are targeted because I think the woke mob knew that they would capitulate and give an apology. Yeah, they don't target me because they know I'm not going to capitulate and give an apology.

My— the biggest national controversy when truly I was the target of the national media.

Quran.

The Quran issue.

Which is so stupid.

When I said, yeah, I wrote a column and I said Keith Ellison should take his oath on the Bible, not the Quran. And I wrote in the article, I would be against any group. I wrote in the article, right? I said, I love Mormons and every Mormon knows that. I am a big fan of LDS. And I said I would be opposed to a Mormon taking his oath on the Book of Mormon rather than the Bible.

Yeah.

And I added over and over, if you want to add your own book, go right ahead, but the Bible is America's holy book. And I said, as a Jew, the New Testament is not my Bible. I wrote in there Yet I, if I took an oath of office, I would take it with a Bible that contained the Old and New Testaments in honor of America and the people who founded it who believed in that book. I want to honor my country. So I was excoriated. I was on the, at the time, I was on the board of directors of the Holocaust Museum.

Museum.

One of the most prestigious things you could have in Jewish life is to be a board member of the U.S. Holocaust Museum. And there were Jews at the Holocaust Museum who said Dennis Prager should resign for what he wrote there. Of course, I didn't resign. But I remember on Wolf Blitzer's show with CNN, there were Muslim representatives who said, you are Islamophobic. So I wonder if we could dig this up. And I looked at them and I said, tell me exactly what I said that is Islamophobic, since I applied the exact same thing to Jews and Mormons. Give me one example in the entire article. And they couldn't.

They hurl at me.

What they expected was that I would be like what you just said. Oh, I'm so sorry. Oh, if I offended you. Oh, if I offended you. That would have been the end of anyone taking me seriously.

And by the way, I know you and I know me. If we're wrong or if we did say something, we will acknowledge that. I've done that before. There have been times like, yeah, I could have said that better. I could have softened that. That was a little, you know, and you do that too. But so it's not just blindly don't capitulate.

No, no.

Right.

Yes. But there was nothing to apologize. I wrote one line that I did regret. I said he shouldn't be allowed to. That was a silly line. And, you know, in 1,000 columns to write one silly line is not a bad, bad—

Well, that's another thing. They so approach you in bad faith. They— Yes, they know what you meant. And I believe words matter.

Right.

But you know what? Human beings— and we don't always say things exactly the way that we mean them. Okay. Like sometimes on this show, I'll say, you know, all— everyone on the left. Of course, I don't mean everyone on the left. You have to take it with a grain of, you know, But there's no grace extended to you, which shows that they're really not trying to get to the truth. They're not trying to get to what's good. They're not trying to resolve a difference. They are trying to smear you and vilify you and cower you into submission. And God bless you, Dennis. You never do it. You never get cowered into submission.

Well, I certainly won't now, but I will tell you, back to the original issue, You know, I, I am in as consistently a good mood as a human can be this side of sanity.

Sometimes it's like, oh my, how are you in this kind of a mood on a Tuesday morning?

But this, what happened in Israel, I know, has really affected me and it should affect everyone. I mean, we are— this was Holocaustian. You know, I wrote in my column Because these are the, these are the successors to the Nazis in every single way. But you know why that won't resonate with most people? Because the left have cheapened the word Nazi.

Yes.

And fascist and, and racist and existential threat and threat to democracy and domestic terrorist and insurrection. They have cheapened every word So it doesn't mean sexual assault if a man rubs a woman's shoulder and he shouldn't have. But it's not a kiss. Not—

it's not second.

Oh, yeah, that's right. Oh, oh, international hysteria.

He's under investigation in Spain for sexual assault with an A. Assault for a kiss.

She— the Spanish women's soccer team won for the first time the World Cup. So they were ecstatic. He was the president of the team. He greeted all the women players to hug them. One of them lifted him up in tremendous glee. She's strong enough to lift him. He's not a big guy.

Was that assault?

Well, that's right. And that's one question. And if you watch it, it is literally 1 second. He hit a pec, not open mouth. Not— it wasn't sexual. He kissed her on, on the lip. That was it.

I know, trust me.

And the— and he is now out of a job. He is disgraced. And it is called sexual assault. So what I always wonder, a woman who has really been sexually assaulted, what does she think about that?

Oh, how about, how about the women in Iran who I often talk about because I'm so fascinated by all that's going on there. The women in Iran, what do you think they think when they hear, you know, people in the United States talking about persecution of women? Yes, persecution of women, patriarchy, malesplaining. What's the one they have, like, male empathy? Like male empathy only? Like you only give empathy to males? Something. What do they think of all these slogans and these things that we like whine about?

Yeah, a girl, 16-year-old. Have you read about the 16-year-old girl who's in a coma in Iran?

No.

Yeah. Happened last week. The again, the, the religious police.

And then we have these—

she wasn't wearing the proper headgear like Mahsa Amini. So she's now comatose. They took her into a car and she left comatose.

What I look when I was seeing what was going on in Israel and something what happened in Israel to some extent actually to a large extent happens a lot around the world. People get massacred. And I'm not saying that's okay, but I'm saying this is a given of human existence. And we know that. But a lot of people don't think about that and don't care. So I think to see a Western country, have it happen to a Western country like Israel, an ally of the United States, I thought, okay, maybe this will wake people up to the fact that real evil, real barbarism, real assault, real terrorism exist. And maybe they'll think twice before, you know, saying that the United States and Donald Trump and border control and whoever the hell are so bad. I really wonder. I don't know if they will. When I, when I watch something like that, I know I do a kind of evaluation of my own life and the things that I—

You are asking a very interesting question. I'll tell you why. Do you know how many people have called my show or have written on the internet that they are a 9/11 conservative?

What? What does that mean?

Oh, you should look.

What is a 9/11 conservative?

I'll tell you. They were on the left till 9/11, and 9/11 shook them up and they became conservative. This is not a small number of Americans. It's part of the reason Donald Trump won.

Yep.

9/11. There may be— what is the date of the attack, of the massacre in Israel? October 7th.

Yeah.

There may be 10/7 conservatives from this, or 10/7 Zionists. Zionist, by the way, is a noble term. It just comes from the biblical word Zion, which is one of the terms for the Jewish state or Jerusalem. It's used interchangeably. Zionists— there were more Christian Zionists than Jewish Zionists who believed that there was something beautiful about the true indigenous people of that area returning to their homeland. They saw God's working in history here. If you were an atheist, as Herzl was, the father of modern Zionism, he was not a religious man, but he thought, what, this is amazing, after 2,000 years we're returning to our homeland. By the way, there were Arabs who welcomed the Jews back, and they knew, hey, this is awesome. The Jews are coming back. We'll all benefit. It's like I always tell my non-Jewish friends, you want to know where to buy real estate? Wherever Orthodox Jews buy houses, you should buy a house. I guarantee you that houses will go up faster in that neighborhood than any other single neighborhood in your city.

Well, also a lot of the early, you know, in the 18th, the latter half of the 19th century, and then of course in the beginning of the 20th century, a lot of the land that was taken by Jews was purchased.

Yeah. And remember, there was no country there. I know that people don't know this. 3 countries have existed there. Jew 1, Jew 2, Jew 3.

And the relations, from what I have read, were pretty very conciliatory and actually collaborative in the 1880s, 1890s, '10s, and '20s between the Jews and the Arabs in the region because the Jews bought the land because there were people funding them to be able to come. And also I was reading in this book that Jews taught some irrigation techniques to the Arabs that were living there.

Arabs taught Jews some farming techniques. It was a malarial swamp when the Jews came.

Right.

Why wouldn't you sell land in the malarial swamp?

Right. Yes. And, and also I just wanna, you know, tell everyone for, and, and look, I love Israel. I'm not saying Israel's been perfect. I'm not saying it hasn't done some things that have been terrible, but we need to assess the situation. Now, 20% of Israel is Arab. There are Arab Supreme Court justices. There are two, I believe, Arab parties that are in the Israeli Congress. Arabs in Israel have equal rights to ethnic Jews or other individuals. Yes, Israel is a Jewish state, but it's a Jewish and a democratic state. This whole idea that Israel is forcing these people in Gaza to live in an open-air prison. If all of those people move to Israel or if the the borders of Gaza were knocked down and it all became a part of Israel, they would be given— women would have— would be able to take off their hijabs. They'd be given equal rights. They'd be given proper food and nutrition. They'd be given adequate schooling. I mean, it's like—

I can't— but Hamas is as interested in adequate schooling.

I know.

As you are. And I don't know what.

Beekeeping.

Right. But beekeeping. Yeah. Okay. Fair enough.

I don't give a damn about B'Tselem.

That's fair.

Yeah.

They don't care.

And they're saying Israelis are denying them equal rights. I mean, my God.

Well, this open air prison. The only reason Israel occupies that land is because if they don't occupy it, they will be slaughtered like this past weekend. Is this not the proof that Israel has to be Hakuba. I was for a two-state solution my whole life. Now I'm not.

I know.

Because the other state, the other state will be governed by people who are Nazis. Let's give one state to the Nazis and one state to the Jews. That's brilliant.

Oh, gosh. What do you— I mean, I know you don't ever get into the realm of predictions, and I respect that because more chances than I actually have some predictions. Yeah. What are your predictions?

Very rare.

Okay.

I would be surprised if there's no a war between Israel and Iran in the coming year. And I— yeah, that's a big one. I'm torn over a prediction about Hezbollah, which would be they have 10 times as many rockets as Hamas, 10 times as many. So I forgot to ask Michael Oren this question. Why aren't they using them now? And I'm sure they're under tremendous pressure from radical Islamic elements to send 100,000 rockets to massacre more Israelis. However, this is what I think, and I have no idea if I'm right. Right, but this is what I think. The Lebanese government has— is probably begging Hezbollah not to do this because this is the end of Lebanon as Lebanon knows it for the foreseeable future, because Israel would retaliate. Obviously, Hezbollah holds Lebanon in its hands. And half of Lebanon hates Hezbollah. I mean, hates them, hates them more than I do because of the wreckage that they have created in Lebanon. By the way, Hamas is hated by a lot of people in Gaza. The Iranian regime is hated by probably half of the Iranian people. That's why whenever Americans tell me You know, the majority of Americans don't agree with the left. I go, it's irrelevant what the majority thinks. It's who's in power. Majority, majority, man. The majority of Russians were not communists. The majority of Germans were not Nazi. So when I'm told, oh, the majority of Muslims are not radical. Yeah, but who's in charge?

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It will. I really don't know if the world changed.

The world changed. Yes.

Yes, correct.

Because of the hostages in Gaza. I mean, that is really going to amp things up. I think this may be another Yom Kippur War-like event in that other states may join in against Israel. I don't discount your supposition that there may be an Israeli-Iranian war soon. There's a lot that's really going to change. And not to mention the death count, I anticipate by the time this will air, will just go way, way, way, way, way up. You know, it's hard because I do believe that Israel has a right and an obligation to retaliate. I mean, my gosh, How could you not retaliate after what happened? And Hamas needs to be eliminated. The thing that I fear is that this is exactly what Iran wants Israel to do. I think they're trying to goad Israel into a war. That's why you take hostages, you know, primarily not just massacring people, but really the taking of the hostages amps up a war. I think, I think they want Israel to, to try to eliminate Gaza. And I think they want Israel to go to war with them. And I would just be very cautious if I were Israel and consider if they should behave in the exact way that the enemy wants them to behave. But it's also tricky because if they don't retaliate, then what? They, they, they capitulate to the murderers.

Israel has basically said it's all or nothing. We're not going in like in the past. We're going in to get rid of Hamas. Now, I don't know what that means, getting rid of Hamas. I don't— without Israel taking over. By the way, how many of our viewers— and these are knowledgeable people, I'm not patronizing them, right? How many of our viewers/listeners know that Israel did give up Gaza in '05? They, they, they did give Gazans independence and then look at what they got.

in 2007. Yeah.

Yeah.

But do you hear what I mean? That I do. They're saying—

I hear it. I hear it very clearly.

Exactly what they want. What they want Israel to do is retaliate. And it's sort of, you know, I was, I was 1 year old when 9/11 happened. But from what I read and understand about, about the aftermath is that, you know, in the days and weeks after 9/11, we, the United States, had the moral high ground.

By the way, just for the record, Julie was reading Dostoevsky at one.

I just thought maybe, honestly, maybe I was, right? It wouldn't shock me. Um, by the way, I'm reading him now. I'm reading Crime and Punishment now, which is kind of depressing.

Depressing?

Yeah, it's—

don't have a knife near you when you read that.

I know, it's really— it is really depressing.

Yes. The only thing I was just mentioning recently, the only thing that I— I don't know if I said it to you or just said it somewhere else, The two most depressing books I have read in the last 10 years are Crime and Punishment and Betty Friedan's The Feminine Mystique. The Feminine Mystique is as dark as Crime and Punishment.

Yes, it is.

It is relentlessly bleak.

Yes. And as I was saying on a recent show when I was talking with this great author who wrote The End of Woman, the book, Betty Friedan's book, which is, you know, based— I remember thinking this in high school as a lib. The whole thing is like lamenting and criticizing women for being in the home and being wives and mothers. It's so insulting. Like, she's excoriating the stereotype of women as just wives and mothers, but then she's fulfilling the stereotype by like writing about it so much and reducing women to just wives. And like, she in the book is fulfilling the stereotype that she laments. I read parts of it in high school, and I even thought, this is a woman that has a very cynical view of women.

Do you know how many women on earth, if you said to them, listen, what do you think of the idea that you would live in a nice home in a free country and married to a man who wants to support you and your children and you love? And you love—

into the marriage.

That's right. And but that means that your full-time job is taking care of the home. You could do anything else you want, by the way. It's not like that is the only thing, right, you can do. Uh, and, uh, that most of the women of the world will go, you kidding? I know you're making me that offer. I know I much rather work in the field.

We are spoiled brats. It's disgusting. We are spoiled brats in the United States in every way possible. Every way. What was I saying about— oh, 9/11. Yes. After 9/11, we had the moral high ground. We were attacked. The images were amazing in the sense of inspiring amazement. They were just unbelievable. And then I think our enemies were counting on an overreaction and a harsh response. And we gave it to them. We did exactly what they wanted. Now, I'm not saying we should have just rolled over and done nothing after 9/11. Instead, going into Iraq was stupid. Going into Afghanistan, I understand more. I wouldn't have done either. I would have figured out who exactly was behind it and targeted them with airstrikes or drone strikes and gotten rid of them. But because we did that huge reaction, now for perpetuity, the Islamic world is going to blame Americans for every single ailment that they have, especially in Iraq. And frankly, honestly, if they blame us for a lot of what's going on in Iraq, I wouldn't actually blame them for doing so because we—

Iraq was an error.

Iraq was a moral atrocity.

Right, and Iraq has become the best, the greatest, or closest ally of Iran in the Middle East.

I know, now it's a client state of Iran.

Yes.

And when they were at war with one another in the '80s, it's a—

By the way, since you know, I'm very curious. I've never tested you on a knowledge question. What, by the way, it's quite all right if you don't know this.

Okay.

But I am curious.

Now I'm so determined to know.

I know. What was Saddam Hussein's religion?

He was Sunni in charge of a majority. Wait, no, wait, no, wait, hold on. That's Iran. Hold on. Iran is majority Shia. Hold on.

I'm having fun.

No, no, no, no, no. I'm gonna get this. I'm gonna get this. Okay, Iraq. Iraq is not—

You're right.

He was Sunni. No, he was Shia. Sorry.

No, no.

Oh God. Sorry. I'm sorry.

So no, no, no. Your thinking was excellent. I asked it because this—

No, he was Sunni. No, he was a Ba'athist.

Yes, he was a Ba'athist.

He was secular.

No, no, no. Ba'athist was a secular party.

He was secular.

But he was a member of a secular party.

He was.

But he was Alawite.

He was Alawite? Really? Like Bashar al-Assad?

Well, that you know that. Okay, it is really impressive that you know that.

No, but I missed it. I didn't get it right. I'm so upset. Damn, I thought he was Sunni.

No, you were right that a non-Shia was the head of a Shia state. Yes, you were right about that. Yes, but to the best of my knowledge, he was an Alawite. It's worth looking up.

I'm sorry for cursing on air.

There are no words. I mean, this is going to go viral. What did you want to say about affinity groups?

I will say that, but just quickly, we were— our enemies after 9/11 were counting on a response. They were trying to lure us in. And I fear that Israel is falling into exactly what they want them to do. They're luring Israel into war. And I get the— I get it.

Why would they— why do they benefit if Israel is at war? Why does Iran benefit?

For two reasons. First, I think Iran has advanced capabilities now than it did in the past. And perhaps they think that they are better equipped to take on Israel than at any other time with their nuclear power. Also with the fact that Joe Biden is literally asleep in his basement and will not respond like Trump.

Well, and just gave them $6 billion and just gave them $6 billion.

So I think Iran feels like they can take Israel and—

Well, again, they're not— they're taking through Hamas.

Right. Well, they may directly take Israel, but yes, they're taking it through Hamas. And also they desperately want Israelis to kill civilians.

Yeah, they don't give a damn about Palestinians. No, no, that is correct.

They want the images. And so I just, just exercise caution when you're doing exactly what the enemy wants you to do. Anyway, affinity groups. Yeah, boy, do we pivot on this show.

It's okay.

So I had a really interesting question that I actually thought about bringing up when I guest hosted for you recently about should there be— should a white affinity group be allowed to exist at a college, at a corporation, anywhere, if other affinity groups exist. I was talking about this with a friend who was defending the existence of Black, Hispanic, AAPI affinity groups, and I was really pushing him on this subject.

What's AAPI?

Asian American Pacific Islander. Which again, if you read Richard Hanania's book, you'll know a lot of these are contrived. Like even the Black affinity group, being Black, I mean, it's— they make it out like it's this homogenous thing.

Well, it's racist.

It is racist.

It's pure racist.

It's pure racist. There are 54 countries in Africa.

Right. And a white group would be racist too.

I totally agree. However, I'm—

Right. But once you have all these others, why doesn't the white kid at the school have a chance to have his group? And— Well, you asked aloud. It should be allowed. Correct. Should one join it?

Of course not. I would never join.

Right.

Okay.

So that's the issue.

Right.

But it should be allowed.

I wanna say at the outset, I would never join such a group. Frankly, I think all of these groups have gone away from their initial mission of being something good and have turned into, well, anti-diversity disasters.

But yeah, go on.

But this person was, it was so interesting cuz everyone who I ask, they're like, no, there shouldn't be a white affinity group. Mm-hmm. What's the principle though?

Right. What is the principle?

If the principle is, You know, like, identify with your race, identify. And also white encompasses many countries, many ethnicities, many people, as Black does or as Hispanic does. I mean, Hispanic, there are dozens and dozens of Hispanic majority countries. You know, some, some are Spanish, some are Argentinian, some are Brazilians. I mean, Portuguese. Like, so again, I always try to get back to the principle. If the principle is to be around people who are like you, who share a common background and upbringing and culture, and who are in the same like ethnic geographic region, then why not have a white group alongside other groups? Saying someone who would never ever join.

They don't have an answer. Well, I know what their answer would be. They don't need one because of white privilege.

That's right.

All the others need one. Right. But that's absurd. You're a Black kid at Harvard and you need a Black affinity group. You're one of the luckiest human beings on earth in terms of what your future portends. And you need an affinity group because you feel left out. I wonder what percentage of Harvard students—

A lot.

No, no, no, are white.

Oh, I was gonna, I thought you asked are in affinity groups. I don't know. I don't know.

When— it's funny because you being a white middle-class Los Angeles— well, upper, definitely upper middle class, even more so. Fine, right? White upper middle class, uh, you know, Christian, at least culturally. You were the only group, the only group, right? A non-legacy. You are the The only group harder is would be you and a male to get in now to Harvard.

Asians, I think, too.

Oh, well, so Asians. Yeah, you're probably right. You know, I was just reading in this article, do you know Harvard in the 1920s, '30s, 25% of the Harvard students were Jews, and now it's like 6%. Oh, why?

Why do you think?

Because they know— same thing with Asians— because they no longer accept— they don't measure achievement. They measure race. And Jews are wildly disproportionately, like Asians, doing well in high school. So it's funny, the Jews and Asians who are on the left, I wonder, do they ever think think, gee, what, we backed a way of discriminating against us. Uh, but who knows, who knows what happens there.

I'm not on principle opposed to these affinity groups. I am on principle opposed to how mainstream they've become and how they have transformed from, hey, if you want to, you know, meet once a month with people who are like you and learn about some part of your culture, you know, it's transformed from that into at all times be with that group, be like this kind of super politicized apropos of this Harvard letter group. Don't interact with people who are different from that group. Don't invite other people who are different into that group. That's what I don't like. Yeah, it's not its existence on principle.

So I'll end this. Almost 38% what? Are white at Harvard? 38% of Harvard students this year, this class, this incoming class. What percentage of the country is white? I assume 50.

Oh, I would think like 70.

No, I don't think so. I don't know. Anyway, so in other words, it is probably— in other words, in terms of your grades and achievement, a high achiever who is white or Asian or Jew has the hardest time to get into Harvard.

Yeah, that's true.

Yeah, that would be true. So I want to end with this question. Oh, 70%. You were right, of America's white. I'm getting the signals through from God. Yes. So I am curious. This is purely emotional. And as I said when we began, it's tough to get me upset. And I, I'm really upset about what happened and what's happening and happened in Israel. Really, really upset. So I'm curious how you reacted. On A, you're not Jewish. B, you've been there.

Oh yeah.

So that's an interesting combination. And you're a sensitive soul, forgetting the other two parts. So I'm curious how this has affected you emotionally. I know how morally and and how intellectually?

Well, I actually think it'll be a moment I'll never forget. I journaled about it recently, but I came downstairs, woke up on Saturday morning, came downstairs. My mom and sister were in the kitchen and the news was on. And I remember the headline, 70 Israelis dead after a Hamas attack. And now at the time of recording, it's 700, probably now it's 800. And God knows what it will be in a week. Week when this airs. And I went, oh my God, oh my God, what happened? What happened? I was glued to the TV for the rest of the day. My family was like, can we go out? No, I was watching it for the whole rest of the day. There was something that was so fascinating to me about it. I think it was just, first of all, how could this happen? Who, how Israel, which is so superior in its intelligence capabilities. I mean, how did they let this, how did they not know about this? It was captivating in a terrible way, but nevertheless captivating to see this evil, these people coming and slaughtering children, children, grandmothers, kidnapping these, these women and raping them and parading that German tourist's dead body all around the way. I think I was, again, just, just evil to me is fascinating. Doesn't mean I love it. I'm celebrating it. I'm fetishizing it. It is fascinating for me to see evil. Because I want to understand it. But oh, I was, I've just been so sad because look, is Israel a perfect country? No. But I know from being there and from reading how out of their way they go to try to create a workable situation. I know that equal rights are granted to non-Israelis and Jews in Israel. I know that they have certain types of bonds bombs, which are supposed to shake buildings in Gaza or in the West Bank so that civilians are not killed. They warn civilians to get out of certain buildings. They aid, they send food and supplies to Gaza. And I just felt so sad that despite all of these efforts, these people still hate the Jews. It was horrible. It made me scared for Jews in Israel and frankly around the world. It made me realize that that antisemitism and Jew hatred is way more mainstream and way more common than I thought. I think it's very easy to think the Holocaust was this horrible event and there are remnants of antisemitism, but to see it really made me go, oh no, this is alive and well. And frankly, I know this is a shallow thing to say, I thought of the holy sites. I thought, if there's a war, will Jerusalem be destroyed? Will the Western Wall be destroyed? Thank God I went there. Will I ever be able to go back? That was, that's, I know that's a long-winded way of saying my train of thoughts, my train of thought. I will say as sad as I felt for the Israelis, I also felt really sad for many of the people living in Gaza, the civilians. I bet so many of them desperately would love to live in Israel. They're probably thinking, I am on your side as you're bombing us.

You know, there's a whole video of Gazans incognito, in other words, blurred out, speaking about how awful it is to live under Hamas.

I feel so bad for those people.

And they're trapped.

They are trapped. And they're not trapped by Israel. They're trapped by—

Right, exactly.

Can I say one final thing really quick? Really, really quick.

Eeny meeny miny moe. Okay, go ahead.

Um, I told the story on Dennis and Julie when I was on a plane, of all things, and I was reading a book on Islam that you gave to me, or I stole from you actually, from your library. And there was a Muslim guy next to me from Egypt, and he said, are you in university? Why are you reading this book on Islam? And I said, no, I'm just— I'm not in university, I'm just really interested. So we had this chat and And he, as I said, is from Egypt. He's a Sunni Muslim. And I was on a plane to New York. He was flying LA to New York and then New York to Cairo. And he said to me, you know, not all Muslims are terrorists. You know that, right? And I said, of course I know that. Literally my best friend in the world from college is Muslim and devoutly Muslim. Anyway, this conversation kind of went into the direction of 9/11. That's why I said I was on a plane of all things having this discussion. And he said totally seriously that Jews got the day off on 9/11, that 9/11 was a Western plant to justify invading the Middle East, that bombs went off in the Twin Towers and then the West, the big bad West, had planes fly behind the Twin Towers to get the photo of making it look like it went into the towers as the bomb went off. And no Jews were killed. Again, they had the day off and they were fine. And it was— that was actually, I think, one of the more formative moments of my life as far as my understanding of the world, because this guy, despite all that he was saying, he was so nice. He was lovely. I mean, he said to me, right, he helped me with my luggage.

He—

when I got up to go to the bathroom, he stood up to be polite. He said to me, if you're ever in Egypt, here's my number. And he was like— you could tell he was a lovely guy, and he was so brainwashed. And I thought about him because there are a lot of Muslims around the world in countries who are very nice, gentle, good people, and they are brainwashed by their governments that the Israelis are doing this and the Americans are doing that and the West are doing that. And it's easy for them to scapegoat the West because then the citizenry can get mad at the West for the issues that their own government are inflicting.

Morally speaking, we are all two people, micro and macro, personal and societal.

Fascinating. You're so right.

That's— that is why it is very hard to assess people morally. That's why I said— and the left, of course, as always, because truth is not a left-wing value, completely distorted what I said— I said, in light of this, there were undoubtedly some nice slaveholders.

Oh yeah, you got killed for that one.

Yes, just as I believe there were some nice Nazis and some nice communists. Nice is nice, and ideology is ideology. You, you can have pure evil ideology and be a nice person. You could be a not nice person and have a great ideology. That's why I never cared whether Donald Trump was a nice person. It didn't mean anything because you're electing him for his ideology. Yes, that's right.

But you would care if your wife is a nice person because you're marrying her.

That's right.

Yeah.

And ideology. Yes, that's right.

Well, you got both with her.

That's correct.

And a lot more too. Well, this was intense.

It was.

And I pray that when it airs, things will be better.

Well, it's not likely, but let's hope.

At least not worse.

Well, give your, uh, valedictory address of each show, how to contact you.

You can reach me at julie@julie-hartman.com, and you can follow me on Instagram and Twitter at Julie R. Hartman, and you can follow Dennis, smile and nod, at The Dennis Prager. He's smiling and nodding on Instagram. And Dennis and Julie premieres every Monday, 1 o'clock Pacific, 4 o'clock Eastern, on this channel. And of course, you can listen to it on any podcast platform after, but it's nice to see us in person to get our facial reactions.

Unlike my radio show, which people are totally free to watch, this is worth watching because of the interaction of two human beings.

You can see my outfit. You can see all of the stuff.

Dennis Prager's outfit.

Yeah, we— they can see your outfit.

Yeah. Oh God, was that sexist? All right, everybody, thank you.

Bye. Shalom.

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