Oh What a Night: Donald Trump Re-Elected

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Hi everybody, Dennis and Julie, Dennis Prager and Julie Harbin. I just want to say at the outset, it is impossible to overstate how committed Julie and I are to the DNJ broadcast. This was not an easy one to arrange. I came in from Nashville, and this is actually thanks to Sean and Rick and Zach. God bless you guys.

We love you.

No, it's very— it's— I mean, they're staying very late at night to make this possible because, uh, Well, we'll talk about a little later being— I was with Daily Wire all week in Nashville, Tennessee, and we had to arrange it. And you, you have— I can't believe it. Is tomorrow your exam?

Yes. Yes.

So give it—

broadcasting this to everybody. So if I don't do well.

Oh, no, no, no. This is— this— that's really a statement. That's even more of a statement than my being on. That the night before the law school exams, which I don't exactly know why you're taking, but we'll leave that subject completely. But that you're doing this. I mean, I do want everybody to know, it should be obvious, but I still thought it was worth noting. We love this and we're committed to it. And we're committed to everybody who gets a lot out of it. And I just want to—

I don't view it as a burden. Do I? I know that, you know, we have people here who are working overtime.

Who do view it as a burden.

Totally.

Yeah, I know.

I don't view it as a burden. It's actually, it's actually a great distraction the night before. It's, it's just fun to do. And by the way, everybody, speaking of fun, I would put this on, but I don't want to mess up my hair. And I would ask you to put it on, but I wouldn't want you to mess up your luxurious locks unless you want to.

I'm with you. So we can put it on the mic. Yeah, but so look, it would be bizarre for us to not comment on the election. Now, there would be— we are not political animals.

No, we're not. Not at all.

We almost never talk politics. I would say I can't even remember in the 130-whatever podcasts if we ever did. But this is monumental. Whether you like the result or not, it is monumental. That is probably the only thing that we can agree on. That— what, not we, but Americans. Yes. So I'll share a thought and then obviously I want you to give your equivalent, how you reacted. Sure. I am a keen observer of me. I look at me from outside of me, and I remember distinctly how I reacted in 2016 when Trump beat Hillary Clinton. Now, I want to make something clear. I am not preoccupied with Donald Trump. I am preoccupied with America. I am preoccupied with defeating the left because anything the left touches, it destroys. From young people to universities to medicine to science to freedom, there is nothing. It's amazing. There is nothing the left touches that is left intact. It is a shark. It just destroys. But there's a— nature has a bigger role for sharks than humanity does for the left. I'm not talking about liberals. Liberals are naive, but they're not nearly as destructive. So I just want to make that clear. My joy at his winning in 2016 was that the left was defeated.

Yes.

I didn't know how he would be as a president. I knew nothing. So anyway, I was so happy, and now I'll tell my famous story because I get such a kick out of it. So I have told people, you know this well, but so I feel, I wish I could tell it to you for the first time.

No, I love hearing it. It's a great story.

It's, it's, it, and the, the latest chapter in it is awesome. So anyway, I I would say in speeches and on radio, folks, I was so happy on election night in 2016. It was the happiest night of my happiest day of my life, including the days my two sons were born. So I— it's on the internet, people saying, what kind of a-hole is Dennis Prager? Does his— do his sons know what he is saying? So of course the answer is not only did they know, they think it's hilarious. So what happened? So I got a text from my older son David. Sent it to his brother, my younger son Aaron, and to Sue and to me. And he goes, now our birthdays, Aaron's and my days, the day we were born, Now, the third happiest day in Dad's life, which I remember I was reading it in my hotel room in Nashville. When you start laughing when you're alone, it really means it's funny.

Didn't David write something back to—

No, no. Then Aaron wrote.

Oh, that's right. Aaron wrote.

Yes. So, so everybody loved David's hilarious thing. Now, now we're relegated to the third happiest day of his life when we were born. So Aaron writes back. Something to the effect, in fact, I'm happier than I was when I was born. So it gives you an idea of my sons and the healthy, truly, I thank God every day, relationship that I have with them.

And they're both fighters, I might add. I mean, David, obviously, PragerU, but Aaron was registering the Amish in Pennsylvania.

That's right.

Which is really, really great.

Yeah, and does his own wonderful podcast, AP Unfiltered. AP for Aaron Prager, one word. Just letting people know. You'll get a kick out of it if you watch it. So anyway, I just want to say this. I don't want to spend a lot of time on my own reaction, but it is an interesting concept. So 2016, I was just overjoyed. I rarely get depressed and I rarely get ecstatic. I'm in an essentially happy, stable mood all the time, as you can testify to. But I was sort of ecstatic that night. I admit it. This time, I was relieved. And then somebody said to me when I told them that, he said, "What's the difference between relieved and happy?" It's a very fair question. So I said, if you're being tortured and they stop, your primary emotion is relief.

Factor.

Not, oh, am I a— I'm leaving.

I'm sorry, I was waiting for it.

Your primary emotion is not, oh, what a great day.

Right.

It's, thank God this is over. Thank God. I don't know when America would have rebounded from another 4 years of the left suppressing liberty, for example, which is my biggest single fear. And, you know, passing legislation that—

Overhauling Title IX, for example.

Yes, well, people— which passed, by the way, in New York State, Proposition 1. I know you cannot. And it is now part of the Constitution of the state of New York that you can't discriminate based on gender identity. That means if you say you're a boy, you're a girl, you must compete in New York State according to the Constitution. That's what I mean by the left destroys everything. It's destroying women's sports anyway. So I just want to say it was relief that it was immense. Okay. What was your reaction?

Oh, I was elated. I mean, the whole night just kept getting better and better. If you had come to me a day or two before the election and said, Julie, what would be your fantasy of how that night would go? I would never have imagined that it would have gone the way that it did. I wouldn't even have thought that it was possible for him not only to win, win resoundingly, win the popular vote, resoundingly, 5.5 million, completely win all of the swing states. Michigan, Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, Arizona, and Nevada all went for Biden in 2020. They flipped. They went for Trump. For us to win the House, the Senate—

I don't know. Is the House definite? Well, the Senate is definite.

I think the House—

I don't know. I don't know yet.

Well, perhaps hopefully by the time this airs, it will be definite. But it's just— it's so— I'm so used to feeling pessimistic, right, that that this was surprising. And I'll tell you, you know, if there's one thing I've learned over the past few months, it's that as badly as you think things can go— and you know this, and to your credit, you talk about this, and your, your son Aaron talks about this, you know this with his addiction— as badly as you think that things could go, there's also a possibility that they, that they could go spectacularly well.

I mean, it's important, really.

I mean, a few months ago, I was feeling very down about the state of this country and the state of the election. And then the fact that God spared Trump's life on July 13th, and then the fact that he won. I mean, it's just— I wouldn't have imagined this. And it feels— and also, he won in one night, which was such a relief. I was thinking, oh God, this is going to drag on and then you'll have riots and they're going to be riots. And thankfully, none of that happened. And it's just I tend to be very pessimistic and it's good to remind yourself, no, it actually can go very well. And you know that with Aaron. I mean, could you have imagined 10 years ago that Aaron would be where he is now doing the podcast? Married, baby on the way, baby on the way. Uh, hold Shabbat dinner every Friday night. I mean, you couldn't have imagined it.

No.

But you know, I, I just feel, ah, God, I feel this responsibility to wake other women up because there is this monomania that women my age have with abortion. And I have to tell you, I find it to be incredibly creepy as someone who, for the record, is conflicted about abortion. I mean, it's a very difficult issue. I would say that I lean more pro-life than pro-choice, but I'm not a pro-life absolutist. And the obsession that women my age and not just my, but women have with aborting a baby is really odd. Do you agree?

Oh, it's, it's inexplicable.

It's creepy. It's like, why are you so obsessed with this?

Of course, if you see the thing The thing that most bothers me about it is there is no recognition that there might be a moral problem.

And a huge one at that.

How do you reconcile that you're a pregnant woman and a mugger comes, holds, you know, a holdup on the street shoots you, kills your baby, goes to prison for homicide, right? For murder. I think it's called murder. Maybe it's called third-degree murder. Maybe it's called just homicide or manslaughter. But if you get rid of the baby, then it's a non-issue. How is the same creature invaluable if you want it and worthless if you don't want it. How does, how does one morally reconcile that idea?

I completely agree with you. And, you know, another thing to say about this election is I, like you, was very disappointed when Trump lost in 2020. And weirdly, I know some people like Charlie Kirk have been saying this, and I think it's really worth mentioning. In a way, dare I say, it almost worked out better that he lost in 2020, because if you look at the coalition that he has assembled in 2024 between RFK Jr. and Tulsi Gabbard and Elon Musk and Vivek Ramaswamy, I mean, this is truly, to use the left's buzzword, this is one of the most diverse coalitions in American history. The amount of Latinos, Black people, women that Trump garnered. In addition, look at the people I just mentioned, just mentioned. R.F.K., Jr., a member of the Kennedy family who are like the, you know, monarchs of the Democratic Party. Tulsi Gabbard, who was the darling. I mean, I remember in 2008, Tulsi Gabbard was right next to Obama. I thought she would be the first female Democratic president. Elon Musk. I mean, this is an amazing thing. And it sort of teaches you in life, sometimes if things don't work out the way you thought they would, it actually could turn out in the long run, strangely, to be setting you up for something that's way better.

So you cited Charlie and—

God bless him, by the way. He was a— I mean, he— you know what I like— forgive me. You know what I like about Charlie? He doesn't just sit behind the microphone and talk. He goes out to these campuses. He's registering people.

Oh, and not only that, podcast after podcast, if you disagree with me, Yes. And they line up and throw everything they can at him.

Yes.

And he calmly answers them. Oh, no, Charlie's— Charlie's wonderful. Oh, and I have to tell him that we told the world.

I think he's listening. He listens. He tells me he listens, which is a great honor.

Charlie, God bless you, Charlie.

You were saying, speaking of Charlie.

So, yes, because you mentioned that Charlie had said maybe in retrospect it's a good thing he didn't win in 2020. I'll give you another argument, which I heard from someone. It's not original to me. I just don't remember who it is. But I, I never take credit for an idea that's not mine. In 2020, you just would have been saddled with COVID He couldn't, you know, what was he going to do? And so now it's sort of the deck is cleared and he has the Senate. He may have— I think he'll have, but I have— I don't know. The House. But thank God the Senate, because then they can't get rid of the filibuster. And by the way, how ironic, because now ask Democrats now, would you like to get rid of the filibuster? Because then, then Republicans will pass anything they want.

So true. Yes. Well, you know, an example of what I just said about how sometimes if things don't work out, they strangely may be setting you up to have it work out even better. Remember when Robert Bork was borked?

Yep.

It's because Robert Bork— and I don't, I don't like the practice of borking, for the record. Record. But it's because Robert Bork was borked that Merrick Garland was borked.

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And then Trump took office and then nominated— what was it, 3 or 2?

I think, yeah, that's right.

Supreme Court justices. And so it's kind of a karma thing.

Don't start me on Merrick Garland because—

oh, don't start me on Merrick Garland.

Well, I do want to start you, but he is awful. He was portrayed by the left-wing media, by the way. One of my changes as a result of 2 nights ago, I no longer call the New York Times, Washington Post, ABC, NBC, CBS, PBS, etc., mainstream media. They're not. They're left-wing media and they're a minority media. The— there's a transformation that, that is proven took place. The more influential media is this. Whoa. Yes. No, no, no, no. It's not.

I know.

It's not self-referential. I never said this before. Talk radio and Daily Wire and PragerU and podcasts like this and, and Megyn Kelly and Dave Rubin. I mean, it's free press. Free press. It's— these are the influential media. The New York Times is not influential. It only speaks to the people who buy its line. I know it's a left-wing propaganda sheet. It is nothing more than that. And this is a guy who, when I moved to California 40 years ago from New York City, I was so enamored of the New York Times, I subscribed to it. You have to understand, this is pre-internet. This is pre-there being a national edition of the New York Times. I got the New York New York Times in brown paper packaging, 4 days late. That's how committed I was to The New York Times. It's now a piece of crap. It's a left-wing lying newspaper.

They called October 7th a riot or, sorry, a raid. A raid. They said the October 7th raid.

Well, they are. Wait, are they calling Hamas still militants or have they allowed themselves to change?

I actually unsubscribed to The New York Times. I used to read it and I actually unsubscribed. I said, this is not even worth my time to read.

Yeah.

Oh gosh, I was going to bring something up about— Oh yes. This is the most— well, actually, let me back up. I want to say two things. First of all, thank God Elon Musk bought Twitter. We cannot underestimate the role that that played in this election. Seriously.

I called him on my Daily Wire broadcast where I was with Daily Wire all week, and I said he's a giant.

He is.

I don't remember the last living person I call the Giant.

He is. He— okay, 4 years ago, and this was when I started Timeless, this was the— what did he say?

What about me?

You're the gentle Gentile Giant. Triple G. Correct. Uh, you know how often I do that, by the way? Because you do it. Correct, correct. It's a Pragerism.

I love it.

It's one of my favorite. And Alyssa and Zach do too. Okay, so thank God Elon Musk—

They do?

Oh yeah, Zach does it. They're our Shabbat dinner crew friends. Correct. And we texted to each other. Anyway, I remember when I started Timeless, one of the first things that I reported on was the Twitter Files. Barry Weiss, Matt Taibbi, and Michael Shellenberger unearthed that the FBI was colluding with Twitter during the 2020 election to suppress conservative content and primarily anti-vaccine content. On top of that, that the FBI wired Twitter $3.4 million under the previous ownership. And it was this messy situation where it looked like the government was pulling the strings and violating the First Amendment. And that had a huge effect on the election. The Hunter Biden laptop story was released on my birthday, October 14th, 3 weeks before the 2020 election. Twitter removed it and censored all of the accounts that talked about it or reposted it. And the fact that, and then there was a poll afterwards, which Larry Elder often cites, which found that enough people would have been dissuaded from voting for Biden had they actually known that the Hunter Biden dissuaded. Thank you. I knew I said that incorrectly. From, from voting for, for Biden if they had known that the contents were actually verified and not Russian disinformation. Thank God Elon bought Twitter because it would be a repeat. They would literally do the same thing. And so many people are actually seeing the truth on Twitter. That's the first thing. The second thing I'm so, so curious to hear your theory about this, given your knowledge of the left and how many years you've been at this. Do you think after their resounding defeat the other night that they are capable of having a hard look in the mirror and course correcting? No, I agree. Why?

For the same reason that when Jews were persecuted, they didn't give up Judaism. When Christians were persecuted by the Romans, they didn't give up belief in Christ. The left believes in leftism as much as a Christian believes in Christ. That's what people have to understand. They— the only self-searching they will engage in is tactics. What did we do wrong to lose? Not do we have any despicable, destructive, nihilistic ideas. We still believe girls should have their breasts removed if they say they're boys. They will not stop that. So it's asking— there will be a handful of people, and we see it, Tulsi Gabbard and so on, and there are people who go, whoa, wait a minute. R.F.K., who will say, you know what, liberalism may be beautiful, but leftism is ugly. Which is fine with me if people say that. I have no problem with that. But there will be no, you think AOC is gonna wake up and go, hmm, gee, Maybe siding with Hamas for the destruction of Israel is not a moral idea. Inconceivable.

You just hit the nail on the head when you said that they will think that they were tactically incorrect, not with regard to principle. So, you know, so we, we are seeing, obviously, although it is diminished since 2016, thankfully, that people are beside themselves. I've been seeing on social media people are going, what am I going to tell my daughter? And oh my God, are we going to be able to vote again? All these outrageous things about the Trump.

I know when he turns out not to be Hitler.

I know.

Will they, will they say, geez, that really was despicable of us to say that?

Despicable?

No. And it is despicable. Completely. What they did, they cheapened the Holocaust. My contempt for Jewish groups for not calling them out as having trivialized the Holocaust. Groups like the ADL are worthless. I say as a committed Jew, the ADL is worthless. If it closed up tomorrow, nothing bad would happen to the Jews.

It's true. We see that there's this response. Can you remember another time in your life where there was a similar response? When Ronald Reagan was elected, for instance, was there that kind of backlash?

No.

What liberals, not just leftists, what liberals had was a disdain for Reagan as they have had for all Republicans and all conservatives. And they dismissed him as a buffoon. Although his wit, Joseph Telushkin pointed out when we were in high school, there was a brilliant insight, maybe college, but I want to attribute it to him because it was such a great insight. He said, not every very bright person is witty, but every witty person is very bright. Ronald Reagan was very bright, far brighter than his Harvard-educated critics. And so, I mean, his aphorisms, his insights, his read of the world were so accurate as a general rule. But the hatred, there was an analogous hatred of Nixon. They hated Nixon.

Was that deserved?

No. And I was not a Nixon fan, but it was not deserved. That is correct.

Why do you think—

You know that Nixon knew that he was cheated out of the election by Kennedy in Illinois? I mean, he knew it and he said it is— I don't want to put the country through anything. So I'm not— I'm not challenging the election.

You mentioned that even in the time of Reagan, liberals had disdain for conservatives. Why do you think that is? We do not have a— I mean, nowadays we might because liberals support the left. Because, yes, but we don't have a— generally we do not have a comparable state.

It's not—

why, why do you think they have such a—

by the way, I want to prove it to anybody listening who thinks it is comparable. I'll give you a proof. There are hundreds of thousands of adult children who will not speak to one or both parents because they voted for Donald Trump.

Good proof.

There aren't 5 Adult children who won't speak to a parent because they voted for Biden or Harris. Is that correct? And by the way, if we as conservatives met one, we'd say you're an a-hole. Of course, you're not talking to your parents because they voted for Kamala. What are you, nuts?

Totally. I mean, I'll give you other examples. First of all, just anecdotally, if you were to go into a liberal workplace and say, I'm pro-life? All right, let me back up. Which one would you rather do? Would you rather go into a liberal workplace and say you're pro-life or go into a conservative workplace and say you're pro-choice? Right. Which one would you— which day would you rather have?

Right. Where would you be treated with more warmth and less hatred?

And by the way, I am the proof. I have said on this show and guest hosting for you and for our other colleagues here at Salem dozens of times that I'm pro-gay marriage. I used to say I was pro-choice. Now I say I'm very conflicted. I lean more pro-life. I have never gotten any kind of backlash from this.

Larry Elder. Larry Elder is one of the heroes, and correctly, of the conservatives. And he's pro-gay marriage.

Never have gotten backlash from you. And you know what's even more of a testament to the conservatives? Never gotten any backlash from our listeners. Never. I will get emails from people expressing their disagreement with me. I've never had something approximating vitriol. Can you imagine if I were on a liberal radio show and I said I'm pro-life?

Or if I went on and said, you know, I really do believe marriage is—

Oh my God, it would be the end. Yes.

No, no. Oh, you're a hater. You're a bigot. You're every possible word, probably fascist.

So I want to understand, why do you think it is that liberals have a particular disdain for conservatives?

That's a great question. There's, in their thinking, in their thinking, there's no room for dissent. Every leftist, whether it's conscious or not, is a totalitarian. Not liberals. Liberals are not totalitarian. That's what all totalitarianism outside— the only The only totalitarian regime outside of the left that I can think of was Hitler's Germany. Okay, that's the only one. The closest we get to that is perhaps Iran as a theocratic totalitarian regime, but I'll put that aside. Between left and right, 99% of totalitarianism in the 20th century was left-wing. In their heart, all leftists would like to be totalitarian. They would, and the proof is they shut down all dissent. Your existence as an anti-leftist must be gotten rid of. I'm not saying they want to kill you. They probably do want to, but I'm not saying they would. We don't have that. We're perfectly fine if you dissent against conservatism. It's a non-issue. I remember, I was a kid when Nazis, real Nazis, okay, when people understood what Nazi meant and the left hadn't screwed up the term, marched or wanted to march in Skokie, Illinois which these sadists picked because there were Holocaust survivors living there, is a Jewish suburb, so to speak, of Chicago. And liberals, including liberal Jews, said, look, that's what freedom of speech is about. The most evil people around are allowed to say what they want to say. They can march in a Jewish neighborhood of Holocaust survivors. But that's a liberal view. The left-wing view is we suppress all dissent and we will destroy you in any way we can. And they try in every way they can. Fascist, Hitler, Nazi, racist. I mean, all these terms are used against anyone who dissents against them. When, remember, I say this all the time because people need to remember this. Lenin, who created left-wing totalitarianism, not Stalin— Stalin just increased it— Lenin, this vile, vile figure, he named the Soviet communist newspaper Pravda, which means truth. That's really important. Truth does not have an independent reality to the left. Truth is what the left says it is.

Great point.

If— oh, oh, it's, it's critical. That's why I always played Jacinda Ardern, who properly is now at Harvard, perfectly fittingly, when she was Prime Minister of New Zealand. And we, we play this on, on my show all the time. If you do not hear it from the government, it is not true.

Well, how about the term my truth, your truth?

Yes, right. That's more silly than it is dangerous. But well, of course, taken seriously, it's dangerous. You're right. But this is my truth writ large. This is not even my truth. This is what I say is true is your truth. That's why my truth is not the same as left-wing totalitarianism. My truth—

And when you see those messages, remember that unless you hear it from us, It is not the truth.

There it is. You hear that?

Yes, of course. No, I'm familiar with it.

So when Oprah Winfrey would say, my— this is what's your truth? What's my truth? That's problematic, but it is not totalitarian. The left doesn't say my truth. They say my truth is your truth.

Well, that's what people— I mean, I've been in enough conversations with people my age to know that when they're saying my truth, they're actually not doing it as a recognition that they're speaking subjectively. They're saying it to, to trump yours. If you're in a debate, for instance, about abortion, they're like, well, my, my truth is that this is abhorrent and I can't stand people who are, you know, like it's almost like this is the line and you, you have to go there.

All right, well then, then fine. So when they use my truth, they mean the truth, not just my truth.

So on this question of why is there a particular disdain that many leftists and liberals have for conservatives that is not in equal measure reciprocated by conservatives towards them, I agree with your stipulation. I would say that even more than the totalitarian aspect, I think it's that they don't have an appropriate understanding of good versus evil. And that really comes with a biblical worldview. Which people on the right tend to just have more of. When you don't see, when you don't divide the world between good and evil, or as Viktor Frankl says, and I know that's one of your favorite quotes as it is mine, that dividing the world between the decent and the indecent. In order to function as a human being, you have to be able to process evil.

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And what they do, absent of that biblical Judeo-Christian worldview, is that conservatives are the evil ones, right?

So, so it's a rare time where I'm amending your statement. They, they do believe in good and evil, but it's twisted.

Right.

You— if you said to a leftist, you don't believe in good and evil, they wouldn't know what the hell you're talking about. Conservatives are evil and we're good. So they do divide the world between good and evil. But it— but it's a corrupted good and evil, right?

That's— yes, it's their— it's their division of good and evil. Like when I think it's not a biblical division. Yes, exactly. It's not a biblical division. It's their own. I remember I was at a bar with some conservative friends. Who you know, and one of them you introduced to me. Thank you for my friend Anne. And, uh, we are—

a moment to celebrate Anne.

Oh, she's gonna love this. She really deserves— we should bring her on. She's so impressive.

It's a gem, a gem of a human being, and that's an understatement.

She's— yeah, thank you. Among many other things, thank you for Anne. I was with Anne and some of our other friends at a bar, and It's so funny, actually. Maybe it's because we didn't have a ton of piercings and we didn't have blue hair, but there were these guys at the bar who turned to us and said, are you ladies conservative? And we said yes. We weren't— they didn't overhear us talking about anything. They just guessed. And we were so happy, you know, in Los Angeles to find conservatives. And we're talking with these guys and I kind of sensed that they were arrogant. I'm like you, I have that read. I can kind of pick it up in 5 seconds. And we just start talking and one of them says, oh yeah, well, you know, something about how great Putin is. And I said, what? You think Putin is great? And he's like, oh yeah, I love Putin. And this is, by the way, for— I don't want liberals or leftists to listen to this and think that this is the norm. I mean, you and I have met so many conservatives. I've never heard another conservative say this. This guy was just arrogant. I don't know if he was trying to get a rise out of us. I don't know. But he goes, yeah, you know, and I said, I can't understand this. He's evil. He's a horrible dictator. He imprisons the people who—

And kills them.

And kills them and who dissent. And he goes, like who? And I said, like Alexei Navalny. He goes, Alexei Navalny, at the time he was still alive. He goes, Alexei Navalny's a lib. And I said, you know, I don't know. I said, I don't know if you're trying to be cool. I don't know if you're trying to get a rise out of us, but this is so gross. And that is what I wish people understood. I, as a conservative, I probably vote the same way he does. I probably agree with him on 90% of things. If he truly believes that, I think he's a scumbag because I don't divide the world between my political allies and my political—

Right. And they're right. So their division should be if you have anything positive to say about Hamas, that they're a liberation movement, for example.

Yes, it's a great example.

They—

it's like there's— I would, I would not want to have anything to do with that guy. I would sooner have dinner with a Kamala Harris supporter than I would with him.

Right.

Because that's how I— and, and also I think I don't endorse it, but I understand why people vote for Kamala Harris because people's life experiences inform their beliefs. And I don't think that, that people on the other side have that same understanding with us.

Well, that's an interesting— no, they— that they don't— they don't have a charitable view of conservatives, let alone Trump supporters. Which is actually now the majority of their fellow Americans, amazingly.

How amazing is that?

Truly. But I'm not as sympathetic as you seem to be, which I salute you for. It's not— I'm not saying you're wrong. There is no excuse for a thinking, rational person to vote Democrat at this time in American history. I'm sorry. I wish that were not true. But it is. I mean, this is the party that, you know, there are exceptions, obviously. Of course there are exceptions. But the dominant strand of that party thinks Israel is loathsome. That's pretty invalidating morally. They think that America was founded in 1619. And if you vote Democrat and you say, oh, that's ridiculous, then you shouldn't vote Democrat. The New York Times invented the lie that America was founded in 1619, and that is what Democrats have in their public schools all over the country. That is what kids are learning all over America, not in every school, but in vast numbers of schools. America was founded when the first slave came to America, not in 1776.

What was it like at The Daily Wire?

So look, I adore these guys. I mean, you know, I, I'm— I was very touched they invited me to be part of their election night coverage, and then they asked me to stay an extra day and be part of their last 2 hours covering it. And boy, what I had to do in order to say yes, I had to— this is the reason we're recording our thing at such a late hour. This is— I gave up my wonderful nonstop flight from Nashville. I— it doesn't matter. I did a lot of things in order to— that's how much I cherish them. These— they're wonderful. You know, everyone knows obviously about Ben Shapiro and— and Jeremy Boreing. No, I don't know. Yeah, no, Michael Knowles and Matt Walsh. Matt Walsh. But I always forget Matt's first name. I always remember that. Yes. And of course, Andrew Klavan. Jeremy. A lot of people know about Jeremy. I just want to say Jeremy is Well, I, I guess I'll use it again, the word giant. Jeremy is such an exceptional human being.

What makes you say that?

Oh, because he is so— he's so gifted, he's so— he's courageous, he thinks so clearly. He's a committed Christian. We have the, the discussion on, on On what to do if you're pro-life, and he's radically pro-life, and he's a committed Christian, but he knows you can't get good done except incrementally. That's the only way good is achieved. It's not— that's why, you know, when people say, well, why didn't the Bible outlaw slavery? Just because you can't get good done non-incrementally.

No, but no, but Gomorrah, we— you have to— I guess it's a little bit of a different point, but you have to compromise sometimes.

Yes. And that's right. He knows that religious people have to get their hands dirty if you want to remain pure. You won't make the world better. You'll just feel good about yourself, but you won't make the world better. You have to enter the world. The world is flawed. And you cannot be pure in a flawed world to make anything better. So he understands this. And of course, he's this genius behind the financial success of Daily Wire.

You know, I know that you know this because you know these people far, far better than I know them. But I've had the privilege of meeting most of the prolific figures in the conservative media movement? They are all so real. They are so down to earth.

Yes.

They don't have one iota of arrogance. And they're totally the same on the air as they are off the air. That's, by the way, when people ask me, what's it— what is Dennis really like? Or what is it like to work for Dennis? I say, you know, like, you know what it's like because he, you know, it's actually amazing. I was listening to you the other day on the radio and I thought, He doesn't change his voice at all. I hear you all the time off the air. The majority of the time I spend with you is not in the studio. And you don't even— I mean, I probably change my voice a little bit, not consciously. It's hard not to. You don't change it at all. And I've met many of them. They're— oh my God, I did the book club with Michael Knowles. He is such a doll. Spencer Klaven is one of my dear friends. He's a doll.

All of them. Are so bright, so gifted, and yet so down to earth. Oh, do you know when they spoke? So I was on, you know, I was on with them for hours. So I'm thinking when they— when each of them would speak, like, you know, when Matt Walsh would speak, he's— Matt Walsh, I so enjoy. He spoke probably less time-wise than anybody. But every time he said something, it was— but it's true for all of them.

Yeah.

That. And so I'm sitting there. This is— I'm really being self-revealing here. I'm sitting there. And the only other time I had this is with when I would go around the country with Adam Carolla. So I'll tell it first with Adam Carolla. So Adam Carolla, who I think is the most gifted comedian in the country. He's— his insights are— he borders on the genius with his insights. And he's so not full of himself. I love Adam Carolla. So we would go around the country, we would, you know, to these evening events in theaters, and I would say to myself, because I often address myself. I would say to myself, Dennis, you are not only here to listen to Adam Carolla, you have to speak. They are paying you. They are paying you to say something.

And you felt that way at The Daily Wire?

That's right. I am perfectly happy to listen to all of these guys the whole night. I— half the time I offered an insight and I hope they were worthwhile because I never— I try never to speak if it isn't an important thing to say. I'll tell you, by the way, I'll tell you how I learned that. I want to tell you this. You'll get it. This will be— this will interest you. But I just remember thinking, you know, they did invite you. You did come from California to Tennessee. You should speak because I don't have any yearning.

You know how many people that is so not the case for? I mean, they would want to overpower others.

Oh, well, people could watch it. And it is available. You could still watch it at The Daily Wire. And you'll see I don't speak that often. And I learned though, this is a really good thing for anyone who goes into public life, in podcasting, in politics, in anything. You have to be governed by this ambition, if that's the goal. If you open your mouth, it has to be something important. And I'll tell you how I learned it. I instinctively have it, I think, I hope. That's why I think people read me, because I only write what I think is important. But I learned it by going on television a lot. You're given—

Totally.

You're given 60 minutes, 60 seconds, excuse me, maybe 3 minutes if you're really, really lucky. And so after the first or second time on television, I said, Dennis, if you're given 40 seconds, make a really important point in 40 seconds.

That medium really does force you to do that. And another thing, I remember being in school and, God, if I did one of these, I did 100 of them, I would have to write 12-page papers. 15-page papers, 30-page papers, 35-page papers. I've written a lot of long papers. And I always wondered, and I swear that you know me, this was not because I wasn't willing to do the work. I'll be willing to do 5 times the amount of work that's obligated of me. But I thought, why does more equal better?

Mm-hmm.

If I can make this argument—

Yes.

—in 6 pages, why do I have to Kamala Harris it and make it in 12? By the way, she is the queen of that. Boy, that woman, if she could say something in 5 words, she, she doesn't care.

She'll say it in 50 words. Well, but she says nothing in all of her words. It's smoke and mirrors.

It's smoke and mirrors. But I wanna tell you 3, I don't, you definitely, you know, one of these, you don't know 2 of these. I think you'll be touched. I wanna give you 3 quick stories to illustrate how real people are on this in our world. And as I was kind of coming up in it, it made such an impression on me. The first one was, when Candace Owens left PragerU to go to The Daily Wire. And this was very early on in my relationship with you. And I remember I asked you, how do you and Marissa and Allen feel about that? And you just looked at me and you said, we're so happy for her. This is great. Yeah, it's more, it's more power to our side. It elevates our side. And I thought, wow, that is because I had just never encountered people like that. You know, I would— I honestly was expecting you to call her a traitor or call her a, you know, climber or something like—

or just some way just be like, oh gosh. Yeah, she's not like—

and it wasn't facetious. You were genuinely happy. That was the first thing. The second thing pertains to me. When I first became conservative, when I first went on your show, you know, I got a lot of backlash and it really affected me. I very soon after I went on your show, went to PragerU and filmed Stories of Us, which is their brief series where people give their story of, of Turning Conservative. And afterwards, I was so depressed. I was getting so much heat. It was COVID. I was in lockdown. I wasn't seeing anybody. People were coming at me online. Some of my friends were turning on me. It was really hard. And I really didn't want it to air. And I was like, oh God, like, I don't want to— I don't want another wave of backlash. I wasn't ready yet. And I remember I called Dana at PragerU. And I said, Dana, I hate to— because they spent— I mean, you film for like 2 or 3 hours. Somebody does your makeup, they do your hair. They have like 15 people in the room. It's a production, you know, it's time is money. And I called her and I just said, I'm just not ready yet. Is there any way that you could not release it or you could delay it? And she wasn't— she said, no problem. We want you to be totally comfortable. And I thought, wow, that is a classy organization. I mean, if she had, if she had said to me on the phone, are you kidding me? You, you know, we paid the makeup artist, we paid the hair person, we paid— I actually would have understood. And she said, no, we want you to be completely comfortable. And they didn't air it. And the one that I have now on PragerU is a, is a, is a second one that I did. It's not the original. They never aired it. They never Aired it. They honored you. No, you should be. They honored my, my decision so much. They didn't give me any pushback. And the one that's on PragerU, I did like 2 years later. I'll give you a third example. You will love this. It's quick. You won't love it because it's quick.

I'm just saying it's quick. I love that you clarified.

Yes, that was awesome. No, you— this is really— this really moved me. So on election night after Trump won, I was seeing all these things on Instagram and Twitter about how influential Charlie Kirk was in turning Gen Z to vote for Trump. And I was just watching these videos of him. And so I texted him and people online were praising him. And I texted him and I said, you're an American hero. Want to know what he responded? What? Immediately he responded. He said, very kind, just a vessel. Praise God. I mean, this is like, this is a private course, but he could have said, you know, thank you. It's so decent.

Yes. So let me say a word about that. I have a lot to say about that, believe it or not. First of all, so when I mentioned earlier, you know, the various now mainstream, because we conservatives are no longer the alternate media, we are the mainstream. So I should absolutely have included Charlie. Well, we ended up praising Charlie anyway, so that's fine. Um, the other thing I want to say is that I believe his answer is authentic. Totally. And that's how I feel. That is why it'll sound funny to some people, but I don't— I'll live with it. I really don't have an arrogant bone in my body, and I think you know that. Everybody who— everybody who works with me knows it. It's I just don't. I have flaws like every human being. That's not one of them. But the biggest reason— well, there are many reasons, but perhaps the biggest is that's how I view me, as a vessel. I have been given the ability. It's a gift, whether from God or luck or nature or genes or I don't know what, because I'm always hesitant to say from God because how do I know? But the ability to transmit the really important ideas and touch people's lives. You know, Guy, did I tell you this? I probably did. Oh yeah, I did, just on the way here, in fact. This, every, there is no day of my life that I'm out of my house that I'm not approached by at least one stranger, okay? I'm not Tom Cruise. I don't have, I don't want to be Tom Cruise, but there is no day that happens. And it's usually a few people, especially if I'm at an airport. Airports is the most people come over. And a guy, I'd say about 35, just comes over to me in Austin, Texas. I was in Austin on the way back to LA. He's from Austin, which is a big liberal city. I just want you to know your Ten Commandments videos changed my life. And that, that's the greatest thing I could hear. And it is zero— I, I mean, I have an ego, but I have a— but I have a healthy ego. I don't— it doesn't need to be fed. I'm thrilled because that's why I think I was born. To bring the Ten Commandments to humanity. So if somebody it really happened to, and he was a good-looking, you know, solid guy. Yes, I suspect he's married. But I— and you'll have to tell me the age range because I think he was a little outside your range.

I don't think people saw my look at it.

Yeah, yeah. No, no, no. Nobody thinks about that more than I do. Okay, just for the record, Larry Elder does.

I know, we all do.

We all do. Exactly. It's Project Julie. Uh, anyway, I understand the term vessel. That's all the point. That's all I wanted to say.

You know, I really feel this way too, which is not surprising to you, I know. But I, I told you the story of when I was in Rome and the priest said it so beautifully and so hilariously. He said when the donkey is carrying Jesus into Jerusalem on Palm Sunday and everybody's waving the palms, the donkey probably thinks that they're waving the palms at him, and he doesn't realize that he's just a donkey. And this priest looks at me and he goes, that's you, you're an ass, amen. And I'm like, I love it. There's nothing— and you have a really funny priest friend. There's nothing better than having a really funny priest friend, I'm telling you. By the way, this is another D&J subject. If you could have told me in high school that I would be on a texting basis with like 3 priests and they're hilarious I, I, I—

Now how about this? Let's add to the, the, the rabbis.

I spend every Friday night with these rabbis, right? No, no.

Well, let's just add you're all, you're texting 3 priests and going to Shabbat dinner every Friday night.

No. And I, oh my gosh, don't—

So that's beautiful.

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That you're texting priests?

Yeah. Like, they're just like, what?

Because you're a single woman and— No, no, no, no, no.

Not that there's anything untoward. Just like, why are you texting a priest? Like, priests text? Or like, aren't they like weird? Or aren't they, you know, really?

That's what people think. Totally. Totally. There is no profession that is different from any other profession. Okay. The gamut of jerks to terrific is the same among priests as among chiropractors, as among lawyers, as among Uber drivers. That is the human condition.

And let me tell you something. When I was in Rome this summer, I spent a lot of time with a lot of Catholics, and I didn't understand how funny that world is. I mean, the jokes that they were making were so funny. I was, I mean, with all kinds of Catholics, and people don't realize that. They think, and there are some, apropos of your point about the purity death spiral à la Jeremy Boreing, of course there are some religious people who like, you can't curse, or you can't this. Oh my God, people, I wouldn't have predicted when I was in high school that priests can be so funny. To your point, they run the gamut. Like, they actually do have a sense of humor. But anyway, back to this vessel point that were asses. Amen.

I love that line, by the way, about the donkey thinks they're waving. Perfect visual.

Who came up with that? Father Francesco Giordano, who is a French-Spanish priest. He is hilarious. You will. So that's not—

that is not like an ancient Catholic teaching. I don't know.

I thought it might be. Sean, you grew up Catholic. Did you ever hear this? Oh, would he? It is. Oh, really? Oh, okay.

But no, it isn't. Okay.

This priest is a laugh a minute, I'm telling you.

Well, that is a ritual to him. He is so funny. I actually have to remember that it is appropriate to anyone of any faith or no faith. I just want to remember. So what the crowd was doing, what exactly?

They were waving the palms at Jesus riding the donkey into Jerusalem.

And the donkey. By the way, you know, you know, that's built on, in a certain sense, the great story of Balaam's ass. Yeah. In the Book of Numbers. I love that.

I know that. Yeah. You are the reason I know that.

Right.

The only reason.

So it's in 2 weeks, it's coming out, the Book of Numbers, which sounds boring. It's an incredibly fascinating— the 4th book of the Torah, the 4th book of the Bible. There's a talking donkey and there's a talking donkey. Donkey. And the moral of that story is so appropriate to your priest's funny line. In the story, the donkey sees the angel of God and the prophet Balaam doesn't.

Yes. Yes. So, okay, I have a question for you. I am not saying this in an arrogant way, but I also truly every single day live my life. I try to, at the very least, as a vessel of God. And what I'm about to say next actually proves that I'm not arrogant. I must get some kind of like, I don't know if that's purely out of nobility. I think and hope it is, but is it really just purely out of nobility? Like there's something that is so cool and elevating about living your life as a vessel of God. I really am not saying this as like I'm a pious monk or I'm just so holier than thou.

You're not arrogant. And you really have passed the test because you're the only person I know, because we're so similar, our lives and our beings, that you've had so much success at such a young age, could have easily, you know, bedazzled you. I mean, look at what fame does to so many people in Hollywood, for example. So if it hasn't already screwed you up, it's not going to do so.

Well, I don't think I have a particularly high level of fame, but—

No, no, no. But no, no, you have to compare. I mean, it's a funny thing that we're discussing this, but why not? We're both real. You have— you can't compare yourself to people who have been doing this like me half a century longer than you. You have to compare yourself to other 25-year-olds. I mean, you can't name many 25-year-olds who have achieved what you have in terms of being an influence in people's lives. I mean, that's just a fact. You, you sit in for me on a national radio show. There are millions of people listening to you. How many people 25 could say that? I couldn't say that at 25. I had a lot of people listening, but I didn't have a radio show. So no, you have passed that test. But, well, thank you. Britney Spears didn't pass that test. Poor thing. But yes, she is a poor thing. No, she really— The worst thing that ever happened to that woman is that she became famous.

Oh gosh, let me tell, we could do another whole episode on this. When I was young, I used to really wanna be famous. I did. Now that I am potentially in a position to be famous, I hope to God, as weird as it sounds, that I can continue doing this work and have a huge influence on people and not be famous. Because I think it's mostly a curse. But, but back to this vessel thing. Seriously, when I say that I love being a vessel of God, it shows that I'm not saying this in an arrogant way because I don't feel like a pious monk doing so. So what is— like, you know, I mean, I can't, I can't really figure out what it is. I think and hope it's motivated primarily by nobility, but I feel very I feel jazzed. I feel elevated. I feel—

Yeah, it's an interesting question. Is it motivated? It is noble, but I don't know if it's motivated by nobility. I'm motivated. I'll tell you what motivates me. I hate evil. And there's only one solution to evil, and that is biblical values. That's it. My, my preoccupation is destroying evil. That's why my favorite verse in the Bible is, those of you who love God must hate evil. If you don't hate evil, you don't love God.

Why do you think that is? Why do you think you're so preoccupied with it?

I don't have an answer to your question. I've asked that. All I could tell you is I— well, actually, I think I have an answer. It's built in. I hated it when I was a kid. You know, I've— you know, I'm about to tell you a story. I have never said this publicly. Ever. I'm not even sure I've said this to my wife. Not that I've hidden it, it's just never— it's, it's one of the only shameful stories of my life that I'm aware of. When I was a kid in, in, uh, in summer camp, where we— in those days we went for 8 weeks, and I would say I was about 12. I think I was about maybe 11, but not younger than that. And there were kids in the bunk. Kids are mean. I mean, you don't get as— it's very few adults are as mean as children, as kids are. And in my bunk, there was, it was a kid who would, uh, every so often he'd urinate in bed at night. And they, they mocked him for it. And one night, 3 kids went over to his bed and scared him awake to induce his urinating. And I hated them for it, but I didn't stop them. To this day, I mean, I was 11 or 12. To this day, I am embarrassed. So I can only tell you that it took a while for me to be a fighter, but I always hated evil, and that was evil. It's built— it's built into me. I— the idea that you get joy out of humiliating a human being is so bizarre to me.

It has to be built in because I always had that too. Yes, it was just so anathema.

By the way, it doesn't bring me any joy to say built in, because this, this does trouble me. You— we can't rely on goodness being built in because then there's no chance for goodness to prevail. The people for whom it's built in, we have to be fighters and then bring along people for whom it's not built in built in. And we can— there are people who will respond positively to the call to fight evil for whom it is not built in.

You know, I think of kids who I was in elementary school with, and I remember some of their mean acts. And actually, I know— I mean, I don't know any of them really well, but I've watched some of them grow up to actually be fine people.

That's weird thing. Well, I don't know if it's weird. It's It is interesting. Well, all that does, by the way, I believe you, and all that does is reinforce what I just said earlier, that kids are meaner than adults. They got better as they got, they get old. Why do you think they're meaner? Most people do get better. There's a great scene because, you know, Alan and I wrote And based on my thinking, we wrote For Goodness' Sake, which anybody could watch on the internet. That's how Alan and I met. It was in the 1990s and we made this film. If you want to see what I looked like 30 years ago, there's a whole film. Big glasses. Is that right? Huge. So there is a scene with elderly citizens. You know, holding up a bank or something like that, or no, no, spraying graffiti on public buildings. And, you know, then I step in and say, folks, this is not realistic, right? People tend to get better when they get older. If you think of a group of people leaving a car and spraying graffiti on a public building, you think of 18-year-olds, not 80-year-olds. So that you knew kids who were mean and then got nicer proves your point.

Yes. You know, my analogy— or that's actually the wrong word— my, my counterpart to your story is when I was 11, I got a frog for my birthday. A pet frog. Tiny, tiny little thing. And in a— in a— what do you call it? Not a cage, don't, no, don't, don't tell me.

A bowl. Yeah, yeah, I know what you mean. They were special. Yeah, they were just tiny fish bowls. I know, I had a turtle in one of those, yeah.

And I named it Herbert and I put it in my bathroom and I just got lazy and didn't clean the fish bowl and I didn't feed it for like 6 weeks. And I— Out of laziness. Out of total laziness. And I had to go to the pet store and I wanted to ask my parents to drive and I just remember like, I was like, I'm gonna do it next week, I'm gonna do it next week. Week. And I watched this thing die. Like, I watched this thing every single week get really skinny. I actually— it, it did die. And it died. And I truly can't even tell you right now how awful I feel. And it was so weird because I didn't take any pleasure in seeing this thing die. And I saw it get skinny and skinnier and skinnier, and I just was like— I just didn't— I don't know if I was afraid to ask my parents to drive me. I don't know what was my problem, but I didn't it, get the food for it. And when it died, I cried so much. I wrote, I buried it in the backyard and I wrote a note, like a 5-page note, an apology, and had a burial. And I'm telling you to this day, once a week I think about this frog, sometimes twice a week. And I feel, look at you, see, look at the glasses.

They're enormous. That's from For Goodness' Sake. There you go. God, I really had dark hair.

Well, look at the glasses. The glasses are huge, but that was in. Yeah, but I think about that damn frog like twice a week because it was, it was so evil what I did. It was horrible. That's a powerful story. Yes. And I, and also I, I had such a sense of how precious this little being was. Well, clearly I didn't enough because I didn't take care of it properly, but when it died Like, I just got this— like, that I had a living being entrusted in my care and I didn't, I didn't take care of it. And you know what, this, this really shows you something. I confess this in the Vatican just, just last year, literally like 3 months ago. Like, I confess this. They probably thought I was a little weird. You know another thing I confess? Half half in jest, half not in jest. I said, forgive me, Father, for I have greatly sinned.

Wait, did you confess it to a priest? Or— yes, yeah, really? Of course. How did he react?

Oh God, I could tell so many stories about that day. It was actually crazy. He gave me a Miraculous Medal and I lost it. It flung out of my hand as I was leaving the Vatican. I had sweaty hands. That was weird. But so many stories. But I— it was my first confession and I looked through the thing in there. I wanted to see like if he was like playing a game or— it was very touching. I looked through, which you're not supposed to do, and he was just there with his eyes closed, really taking in what I was saying. It was very touching. But I said to him, I said, forgive me, Father, for I have sinned. I joined the Harvard College Democrats. You added that? Yes. And I said it—

Did he crack up?

No, I said it half in jest and half totally serious.

Well, he might have been a Democrat for all you know.

I know. And I'm looking through the And he's just like nothing.

And I'm like, Democrat. He was European.

Yeah. Yeah. Isn't that interesting? Yeah. With those things make an impression on us that the frog thing.

Oh, too bad. Why? It went fast. It's over. Yeah, I know. It's fine.

They're like, get us out of here.

You know, I just want to say, I— it's, it's a very interesting subject. I should do this on the radio. I'll tell my story of not stopping the kids from humiliating that kid in the bunk. I'll tell your story. And said, and I wonder how many people have shame over something from their childhood, or you—

I will never forget what I did. No, and I will never— the pain is so—

I don't remember anything from that summer. It's all I remember is that I didn't stop them that night. That's literally all I—

Sean, do you have something like that?

No, no, Sean has it from yesterday. It's just ridiculous.

Sean. But you know what? I think I am really made better by that act because I feel this extra motivation.

Yes. Well, I know me. I remember saying to myself, I will never do this again. Yes. You will never. Observe bullying again. And by the way, it turned out true because I— my father was called into school very often. Dennis got into a fight again, but I only got into fights with bullies. Nobody bullied me. I was always bigger than everybody. So, so it wasn't me. It was on behalf of—

I love standing up to bullies. I did it in kindergarten. And did through 6th grade. It was so— it was fun. Like, I hunted the bullies to fight down because they're so weak.

That's a great term for you. It was really fun. Julie the bully hunter. So that's it. It's wrap-up time. A—

how do they reach us? And don't say by listening to me. Give it a shot. Huh? That was a little quick.

You see, she, she speaks of the shame she has over the treatment of this fraud. Herbert. And then she treats me this way. No. And there's no shame. No shame whatsoever.

I'm pushing you to expand your mental capacity. Can you tell my email? Certainly.

julie@juliehartman.com. So close. Julie-Hartman.com.

Oh, Goddamn. Your Instagram. I—

it's not worth knowing. You should follow me at DennisPrager.com.

I kind of agree with that. I hate to say it, you know, I kind of agree. It's not the thing that we should be saying.

But why Instagram?

I mean, dear God, just like get off of it. Who cares what you're gonna live your life on this thing? Yeah, but sure, follow us, Julie R. Hartman and The Dennis Prager and PragerU and all that good stuff.

You could follow Sean at IamWonderful.com. And on that note, time for bed.

Bye, everybody.

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