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Your dog and a stranger are drowning. You can only save one. Who do you choose? Dennis Prager says your answer reveals everything about how you define right and wrong. In his new book, If There Is No God, Prager exposes the danger of emotion-based morality and why without objective truth, society descends into chaos. This isn't a religious book. It's a rational case for moral clarity in a confused age. If There Is No God from Dennis Prager. Order now at PragerStore.com.

Dennis Prager with Julie Hartman. Dennis and Julie, or if you prefer, Julie Hartman with Dennis Prager. It's an interesting thing. Does it matter to you?

Not in the slightest. Literally, I couldn't.

No, I don't. I would imagine.

But more people ask me than I would think, like, why isn't it called Julian Dennis Prager?

Oh, is that right?

And I don't know if they're joking or not. Some of them are joking, but it actually comes up more than you might expect. I don't care. It makes sense alphabetically. Also, you're—

No, no, I'm better known than you.

You're the big deal. You're the better known. Of course, you're first.

I mean, it's such a—

What do I care?

But you know what? This is unbelievable. We both had talked about a whole bunch of things, but this is an important subject.

Well, this always happens to us. It's in the first 10 seconds.

What matters to people? Do you know? I'll give you a great example. A perfect example. Adam Carolla and I made a film, a great film, a movie, a movie, not just a film, a movie. A full-length movie, No Safe Spaces, and all of you should be watching.

Great movie.

It is, no, literally a great movie. And I always say I am in a great movie. It is not a great movie because I'm in it. I just want to make that clear. Generally speaking, his name precedes mine on billboards and so on. I give you, well, you know me, but I give all of you my word, I couldn't care less. That people are— think that that matters. If the, if the people who produced the movie thought Adam's name first will have more people come to it, what do I care?

I know. Well, people tend to— I just want to pause and say I love this. It's so funny. I've studied this with us in the first 10 seconds of the show. Occasionally before the show, we'll say, do you have something? Do you have something? We don't really— we actually don't really discuss what it is, right? But This always happens in the first 10 seconds. Something innocuous.

I know, but there are big lessons to be drawn from these things.

I know. And then we turn, we go, well, what is the meaning of having a pen on a desk? Or what do people— it's just funny how quickly it mushrooms. But no, it's true. I mean, people tend to care about very stupid things and get offended and ruffled by very stupid things. And I've actually noticed this in myself in the past. I mean, I think and hope that generally I'm the type of person who doesn't get ruffled or offended by very much. I just, I've never been that way. But I can look back at times in my life. I remember one time I had a friend who spent a lot of time with her boyfriend and that kind of bothered me because, yeah, cuz you were neglected. I felt neglected.

Right.

I look back on that, that was so stupid.

Why did I care so much about that? That, to be honest, I can understand. Not that you would be offended, that you would be sad. I mean, you lost time with your friend because she's spending it with somebody else. It makes sense. That's— offended is wrong, sad is right.

Well, maybe I think I was definitely sad, and I think I was a little offended.

Uh-huh. Yeah.

If I'm being fully transparent, I was a little like But, but yeah, you're just ditching me to go hang out with your boyfriend. But, but I actually look back on that and I think that was really stupid. I mean, it wasn't a huge deal.

The offended part is wrong. The, the sad part is right. Obviously you like someone, you want to spend more time with them.

I'll give you, I'll give you another example because I've been thinking about this lately. Uh, the, what we all choose to spend our mental energy on. I feel like on recent episodes of Dennis and Julie, in recent episodes on Timeless, this has been a through line. It's been, been a big priority in my life to reshape my mental energy. And this subject is one of the big things, like don't waste your time getting upset about small things. Yesterday I was driving and I was in the left lane and there was some guy in front of me who was turning left into a Whole Foods parking lot, but it was the same left lane to up at the light, turn left. And so I went behind him.

Yeah.

And he was— he wasn't turning or he was taking a really long time. And as this is happening, all these other cars were coming and going in front of us and turning, like probably 25 cars. So I'm sitting there and I'm going, damn it, this red Honda, he's not turning. I have to get to my apartment.

Right. I need— but that was a matter of bad luck rather than a jerk.

Right.

Well, because I'm honestly, I think he was a little bit of a jerk because he could have turned in. Okay, fair enough. But, but normally that was just bad luck. You were behind the guy who wasn't turning.

And it was so frustrating because I want to go around him, but all these cars are coming and I'm literally up ahead watching 25 cars turn left as I'm behind this red Honda. And I'll tell you what I did. I paused. I was getting angry. And I literally aloud, alone in my car, said, Julie Hartman, let this be your worst problem in life.

That's good.

I said that.

I said that aloud.

Yeah. And then, and then I shut up and I didn't get angry about it. I said, okay, guess what? The guy's gonna turn in 2 minutes. I'm gonna get home 3 minutes later than I would've. Big whoop. But we do. Why do we like allow ourselves to do that? Who cares?

The, The power of instant rage is staggering, and people pay a lifelong price for it. Because if they didn't do anything— now, sometimes you should do something, clearly, right? But if they didn't do anything, in most cases they would have forgotten about it by the evening. It, it looks like it didn't happen. It's, it's— I have a great example of what I think about this. So I'm coming into the parking lot where we work here, and if a pedestrian is crossing, I obviously stop my car.

Good.

I don't run people over.

Glad to hear it.

And I, I'm thinking, wow, God, this is taking a long time. And ever since I thought that, I decided to actually measure the amount of time. Oh no, that I wait. It's 5 seconds. Good. At max. Sometimes it's less than 5 seconds. And yet we're annoyed over 5 seconds.

I know. Like, so why do you think this is? Do you think that we— it's like sublimated anger?

No, it's the power of the immediate. That's why you have to—

but it's not rational.

No. Oh well, hello, why did I write the Rational Bible? I'm a big lover of reason.

I mean, even in my position where you're with the pedestrian was 5 seconds. Mine was like 2 minutes straight.

Yes, 2 minutes. But when you think about it, what the hell is 2 minutes?

Exactly.

Yes.

So why, why do we get so angry?

Because of the emotion of the moment. That's the point.

But again, there's no emotion to be had in the moment. It's so dumb. It's not like someone ran into your car.

It's not like someone, you know, It's that if it weren't for this guy, I would have made a turn and 25 people passed me who got to make the turn and I didn't.

Okay, I'm not, I'm not trying to be annoying with this, but like, but so what?

Again, no, we both agree with so what, but I understand why one is annoyed at the moment. I would get annoyed at the moment and then say to myself, hello, this is, this should be your greatest problem.

Human nature is an interesting thing. I mean, that's the most colossally obvious.

I want to get back though to the believe it or not, that it's very important that people say to you, do you care that it's Dennis and Julie? It's a— that's a very important thing that people think that those things matter.

No offense to them, I never even think about it. It never crossed my mind, right?

And let's say, look, it crossed my mind that Adam's name was first, but it didn't cross my mind negatively. I just found it of interest. They decided to publicize his name. So if you see anything, No Safe Spaces, it's Adam Carolla on the left, Dennis Prager on the right. So theoretically, his name is first, theoretically, because we read left to right in English. I would happily take a lie detector test. I couldn't care less. In what possible way did it detract from me? I was so, first of all, to be honest, honored to be in a film with him. He's terrific. He is, he's terrific.

He's so funny.

He's funny, he's bright, he's deep, and he chooses people he's with very carefully. I was honored, the whole thing was an honor for me. I trust he was honored too. He thinks well of me, and I'm very flattered by that because he's got very strong standards. But all I'm saying is People, you know what one of the lessons is? You have to know what to get upset about.

Yes. Well, I'll give you another example. Something far greater than 25 cars making the left turn when I'm stuck behind the Honda or you're turning and the pedestrian delays your entry. I have thought about this with regard to my lost COVID years of college. I'm coming up on 2 years Just crazy. So weird. It just went by in a flash. 2 years of graduating from college, since graduating from college. And lately I've been feeling sad about that lost time. I was sent home.

Well, you have a right to. I know I do.

I really do.

On your behalf, I feel angry.

I will admit I feel angry too. And anger is not an emotion that I tend to be afflicted with often.

No, but it's righteous anger. Righteous anger is appropriate.

That's absolutely right. And that to— I just got back from Rome, so I feel very immersed in Christianity. Jesus had righteous anger. Yes, he did. So, so that's, that's indicative that that's a noble emotion for us.

God has righteous anger.

Yes. And God has sadness.

Yes, that's right.

And so it's, it's good and noble for us to feel these emotions.

Our task is to control, however, Right. Morally and rationally control our responses. Well, there's a difference between anger with the 25-car example and then my righteous anger with the COVID You were robbed by Harvard, which is a scummy place run by awful people, which has some wonderful professors. I have no doubt about it.

And wonderful students.

And some, some wonderful students.

Some.

It's important to add some.

It is.

But Harvard was the first college in the country to shut down with COVID That is so indicative of who runs Harvard.

And, you know, I look back on that and I have been through worse things in life than the COVID clearly sent home. I just want to make that clear because there— I don't know.

You were robbed.

There are far—

You were irrationally robbed by people who revel in the belief that they're scientists and experts. They were all wrong. They were just wrong.

And that was a real— I mean, that was again, I am—

and they charged you the same fee, 2% increase for what?

Tuition, 2% increase.

Oh, I thought for Zoom calling. Oh, the Zoom, the Zoom. Fine.

But, you know, I look back on that and I was sent home halfway through, a little over halfway through my sophomore year of college and lost the whole rest of that year. And then I lost the entirety May I repeat, the entirety of my junior year, all on Zoom. So the only two full years that I ever had at Harvard University were first and last. Okay. Again, I am not a woman living in Iran. I am not a Chinese national, you know, living, living under Xi Jinping and getting my organs harvested. I am not. Trust me, I am staggeringly aware of my privilege. Right.

Right. Your luck, your good fortune.

My luck, my privilege, my opportunity. I'm aware I'm not crying, you know, crying woe is me. But I will say I do. I look back on that and I feel sad. I feel like a portion of my life which was robbed, which can never be replaced, never be replaced.

Exactly.

I think it's hitting— and I've talked to some friends about it— I think it's hitting us now because we're 2 years out of college and there was this weird kind of feeling when we were in it that we knew, and I would talk about people with this at the time, we knew that it was wrong, but nevertheless we had this feeling like, oh, they're gonna make it up to us someday. Oh, I, we're gonna get it.

We're gonna get, I'm not sure. I wonder if most of your classmates thought it was wrong. I would bet that most thought it was right.

Absolutely. You're, you're 100% right. As time goes on, more and more people are awakening to the idea.

Right.

By the way, there was a recent New York Times Siena poll which found— New York Times, which found that people look back on the Trump administration far more favorably than they did in years past. And they, they look like saying that people prefer health to sickness. Yes.

I mean, but on every single issue, if you don't acknowledge that in every metric America was better when he was president, you can hate his guts. Yes. But if you are intellectually honest, America was better in every metric. The world was better in every metric. I don't believe Putin would have invaded Ukraine. I don't believe that Hamas would have done what it did on October 7th. The world is chaos because of this. Just this week, Joe Biden did two things. I mean, two horribly destructive things. Apply Title IX to trans. So that all you have to do is say you're a woman and you have every right that a woman or a man has not to be discriminated against, and which presumably would include sports, even though he didn't mention sports. How could it not include sports?

Of course, I say I'm a woman, I have a right to be in Title IX. It was based on applied to sports.

That's right.

Most of the time.

Plus, he has now announced that millions of acres in Alaska that no one ever sees. No one. It is as remote a land as exists on Earth, will not be allowed to be mined in any way so that America will become more and more dependent on China and Russia and Saudi Arabia for its energy.

Venezuela.

Yes, this is—

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All he does is make it worse. And then people yell how bad Trump is. Trump may be as awful a human to it as ever occupied the White House, and it doesn't matter. It doesn't matter.

By the way, I don't believe that's true.

I don't believe— I don't believe it is true either. I couldn't agree with you.

I take your point, though.

Yes.

Well, I want to get back to this Trump thing. I mean, Dennis and Julie, we tend— we tend to not that we don't discuss, you know, politics, but I like it when we do life stuff. But I think this is worthy of discussion. But I do want to go back for a moment, if we can, to this COVID thing, because this is a really important point. I look back on those lost years and feel very sad and angry. For what? Why did we have to be sent home? I mean, I think about that time And I'm not trying to cry woe is me, but it was, I was in my childhood bedroom on a computer. I didn't see anyone for weeks besides my parents. And when I would see my one friend in Los Angeles, we would be in our N95s, 20 feet away from each other in the trunks of our car. We literally would go into this parking lot, open the trunks of our car and sit 20 feet away from each other. That was back when I was brainwashed. That was before I woke up and COVID and Black Lives Matter was the big wake up. For months and months of my life, I'm sorry if this sounds dramatic, I was living in prison. Like—

[Speaker:DENNIS PRAGER] That's correct.

[Speaker:KATIE HARBISON] Basically living in prison. And then, you know, junior year was a little better, but we were all on Zoom and it was just a profoundly diminished experience. And I look back and I go, why the hell did that have to happen? But let me tell you the thing that gives me consolation. It's sort of like what I said with the driving thing yesterday when I audibly in my car said, Julie Hartman, let this be your worst problem in life. You know what? With COVID Sean, I'm sorry, you're gonna have to bleep it. I got fucked. I totally absolutely got fucked with the COVID lockdown situation. Okay, sometimes in life you get fucked. Sometimes you're treated unfairly. People do things to you, make, make your life worse. And it can be very real and very hard. But everyone in life has that happen to them. And it won't be the last time it happens to me. It'll just be in a different flavor. And that's a weird— that's, that's a strangely kind of comforting thing. Okay, Julie. Yep. You're right to have that anger. You're right to feel that loss. You can't do anything about it.

Well, and of course the sum total of your life has been so positive.

Of course. Absolutely.

But no, you're, you're right. All of it is true. By the way, there was one silver lining. You and I got to spend time together. Oh, well, because you weren't at college.

It's so funny that you call that the one silver lining. That is a catastrophic understatement to call it the one silver lining. I hesitate to acknowledge that because so many people had just awful COVID experiences. And I feel like COVID gave me the greatest gift of my life. So I don't. Want to be like braggadocious or boastful about that, but you're right. I mean, strangely, COVID, the lockdowns were kind of— ended up being a blessing for me because it led me to this.

You never know, do you? We never know the bad stuff that might turn out good, and we never know the good stuff that might turn out bad. That's why people say be careful what you wish for, you might get it. That is one great statement because there is so much truth to that.

Wow, say that again. Be careful.

Oh, you never heard about— oh, oh, I'm paraphrasing it. Yeah, I want to understand it. Be careful or beware of what you wish for, you might actually get it. We, we don't— not we, most humans do not know what is good for them. They know what they want. But what you want and what's good for you— you want ice cream, ice cream's not good for you. Obviously in moderation it's a non-issue, but the point is clear. What we want and what is good for us are tangentially related. That, that's why so many of your generation, you know, have no plans to get married and certainly no plans to have kids.

You—

so you, you don't want kids. Okay, I understand what you want or don't want. Will it be good for you and good for the world if you have kids? That's a more important question than what do you want. The earlier you teach your child that what he or she wants is not significant— I know this sounds to many people almost like molesting a child But I— okay, so Madison, I hear what you want. The question you should be asking is what's good for you? How many parents tell that to a kid?

You know, it's so, it's so interesting because what you just said is such a culturally defiant statement. As you, as you, you said it sounds like molesting, you know, like it's— I took your point. Like it's so shocking to the system to consider that you would say to someone what you want doesn't matter. What's good for you matters. So when that child says to you, why, what's your answer?

Oh, well, I would give the ice cream example. I mean, it's even a kid understands that you want candy, but it's candy good for you. Every kid knows candy is not good for them. I mean, maybe not at 5, but by 8, they all know that. I mean, you could give example after example, right? It's, you know, you, you want to cross the street, but if you don't wait for the green light, you might get run over.

But here's the thing too. Part of the reason why people indulge in this, what I want is what I will do worldview is A, because it's been taught to us extensively, but B, because in the modern world, life doesn't have stakes to it. Like we're just a materialist bundle of cells here on planet Earth for a blip on the radar screen, excuse me, in terms of the, the vast longevity of the universe. Like, we don't— we really kind of view ourselves as incredibly, incredibly insignificant. And one of the things that I admire and appreciate about religion is— and this is what makes it so good for you and so good for society— is that there are built-in stakes, because the way you live in this life will determine what happens to you in the next life. So whether you like it or not, when you're in a culture which adopts a religious worldview, your life has built-in stakes that you can't run away from.

You will love this. Have I— I don't think I've told you this.

Does that make sense?

Yeah, well, you'll know if it makes sense based on what I'm about to say. So, uh, it's virtually directly related, might be a bit tangentially related. A couple of professors did a study which I'm shocked because it's so not like professors to do an important study, and that goes against the academic mind. They found that societies in which people believe in hell produced less crime, of course, than where people only believed in heaven.

Of course.

All right, so there is— is that what you're saying?

Yes, absolutely.

Of course. Yes. Well, it's the no-consequences worldview that has taken place. Well, they raised— so they raised the— in California, a completely destructive government did another destructive thing. They raised the minimum wage of employees at fast food places from $16 to $20. As a result, Thousands have already been let off work. Many of these places are cutting their hours. And in one case of a Burger King with a vast number of franchisees, they will be substituting kiosks for people. And that really depresses me. I don't like relating to a kiosk. I want to talk to a human being. One of my favorite parts of eating out, and you know I eat out all the time, all the time, is relating to a waiter or waitress.

That's a good point. I'm writing down something.

Yes, I don't forget. It's anti-human. This stuff is anti-human.

Well, the other day on Timeless, which by the way, people should watch Mondays, Tuesdays, and Wednesdays.

I pushed Timeless, by the way. Where was— yes. Oh no, I talk about you frequently. Where was I just— where I am? Oh, on Dave Rubin, I believe. I think it was on Dave Rubin.

Thank you. That's very kind of you.

Right. It's not kind. I did not do it to be kind. Well, I did it because you have a magnificent voice.

Well, thank you.

Okay.

So Timeless is Mondays, Tuesdays, Wednesdays, 1:00 Pacific, 4:00 Eastern, live. So you can call in, you can write in the chat, and I interact with Sean on the air. Which I would say 95% of the time is a good choice.

That high?

5% of the time he makes— you make good jokes, actually. I appreciate your jokes. I'm totally kidding. He's an amazing addition.

I think that's funny, to make a joke. It's a funny use of the word.

Oh yeah, you're right. Well, I should just say he jokes.

No, no, I don't know what one would say. He makes—

well, joke is a verb.

He said he makes good jokes. It's so funny to me. I don't know why.

You'll like this one that he said.

He made a joke. Is that what people say in English? He made a joke. Isn't that what—

is that what people say in our language?

No, no, no. It sounds like foreigners would say that. Like it would come from some European. Like, he make— he made a joke. He make joke. Okay, go on.

He— I'm always trying to be more concise. So thanks for identifying that. He joked, or he jokes.

Okay, fair enough.

Well, on the show, one of the jokes, we were talking about studying abroad, and he cuts in and he goes, ah, I love studying abroad.

Okay, I just want— I want—

that was good.

Okay, as God is my witness, yes, I knew that was coming.

Of course you did. I didn't know. I didn't get it.

Of course you didn't.

I didn't get it because you were like 15 seconds—

and I'm another male like Sean, As soon as you said that, it's funny because when I— my sophomore year in college, I won the Brooklyn College study abroad scholarship.

See, now I hear it and I think of the Sean Way.

And I thought, am I lucky or what? Oh, I get to study abroad.

Well, you study that England thing. You studied abroad and you studied abroad.

Oh, that, that That made my life, all of my life emanates from winning that award. It's a very touching thing.

We are talking about— All of my life emanates from the COVID lockdowns and what happened as a result there to bring the conversation back. But what was I saying? Oh yes. So the other day on Timeless, we were talking about some new technological innovation and Sean cut in. Sean, do you remember what it was? Oh, self-driving cars. And he said, Sean asked me on the air, do you support or like self-driving cars? And it reminded me when you were talking about the kiosks at the fast food stores. I said, we are now at a point where just because we can innovate doesn't mean that we should. For much of human history, innovating was not only a great thing, but a necessary thing. I mean, the advent of antibiotics is one of the, Prime examples: airplane, automobile. So many of those things have been miraculous. But now we're at a point where our lives are pretty much healthy and safe and efficient enough where we're now getting into territory of just creating for the sake of creating. And you will love this because you are the person who alerted me to this. And this is what I was reading during the COVID lockdowns when I couldn't interact with anybody. I was reading your Rational Bible Commentary, and that's the Tower of Babel story. When we just build sort of, um, for the sake of— for the build— for the sake of building, to make a name for ourselves superfluously, to just build these towers because we can, it's not good for us. And but I don't hear this being talked about in the national discourse. Like, we never— we, we just sort of charge forward blindly with innovation. We're going to get to a point, and I think we're already here, but we're really going to get to a point where we're— it's going to be like the COVID lockdowns all the time because we're— when are we going to interact with human beings?

Well, well, the minimum wage is one example of where that's being—

we're going to go to stores and just— I mean, we may not even go. I mean, look at Uber Eats and Postmates.

People don't even go to stores anymore in line. To deal with a human rather than speedily check out with a kiosk. I want to interrelate with a human being. Talking about that on a really serious note, I read this week that the AI, artificial intelligence, of, of creating, uh, female sexy models, uh, AI girlfriends, will reach a billion dollars.

I know, I know.

And that's just the beginning.

I know.

There— oh, did you see the movie? I think it's called Her.

And, uh, oh, I've heard of it.

It's a very, very good movie about a guy who has an artificial intelligence girlfriend. It is really done well. Sue and I watched it and we were very impressed.

I can't watch. I will be like too discouraged. I know myself. I don't want to watch that film.

Okay, then don't. Seriously, we don't have to add to your misery. No, no, I'm not kidding. It's not critical, but it is a very well done film. I didn't think they would do it that well. They made it believable, which made it all the more frightening. And the, the estrangement of male and female caused by the left is so deep already, it will only get deeper. With tech, men are opting out of women and women are opting out of men. You know, I— a lot of people worry about their weight, and for good reason, and I am one of them. And I have embarked on PhD weight loss and nutrition. At the urging of my colleagues and friends, Seb Gorka and Mike Gallagher. It's called PhD Weight Loss and Nutrition because they're as emphatic on the nutrition part as they are on the weight loss part. What I suggest you do is have a half-hour conference call with them. Just conference call may not be the right term. You are having a conference with them. It's just you and someone at PhD Weight Loss. Go to myphdweightloss.com or call 864-644-1900. 864-644-1900. myphdweightloss.com. I was with the parents of a teenage girl recently, and I said, so is she boy crazy? And they, they looked at me like, why would you ask such a terrible question? That's the last thing we want. And I would think, really? I would think it's one of the first things you would want. And I would want your son to be girl crazy. That, that they think that that's not healthy. Most natural thing in the world is to be somewhat preoccupied with the opposite sex. When you're young? What do you want your daughter to be preoccupied with? Women's studies? Gender studies? Anthropology? What do you want her to be preoccupied with? Making a lot of money? You think that will do better than having a good man in her life?

We are a very morally confused—

Because there's no wisdom. Secularism produces morons. That's— it's a rule of life. There was no example of a secular institution that has wisdom. Not one.

That's the thesis statement of your career.

Yes.

Secularism produces morons. For 40 years.

That's it.

Every day, every story, you basically have been saying.

That's right. Yes. That's my life has been devoted to the dangers of secularism.

So I want to pause for a moment and acknowledge something, which is that on this show and and on Timeless. So I'm really trying to work on it on Timeless. We tend to diagnose problems very well, but I want to caution both of us against continuing to just talk about how bad this is and not offer solutions, because I can tell you, speaking on a personal note, recently I've gotten very discouraged about the state of the United States and the world. And I'm a pretty happy-go-lucky person most of the time. My default position is to be optimistic and happy. But I've lately been kind of having a holy moly moment about life. And again, it sounds so stupid to say because even though things are getting worse, I still live in the United States of America, you know, the freest, most tolerant country on Earth. You know, again, I'm not a woman in Iran. I'm well aware of that. I have a lot of opportunities, a lot of advantages. But lately, and I've been talking with a lot of my friends about this, I notice my 20-something-year-old girlfriends, that is, we're all kind of right now not, not depressed, but we're kind of having a holy moly moment about, about life. And I think that's normal in your 20s to feel.

It's not normal in your 20s.

Really?

You are having a holy moly moment in your life because it is merited.

Yes, it is merited.

It is merited. But wait, wait, wait. I just want to plead innocent or not guilty to a charge. My whole life I've been offering solutions. Of course, I just— I know you weren't saying it about me, but I just want to say I do offer solutions regularly. Get married, have children, have God, have a religion, get deep, and you will solve— get a community and you will solve most of your issues.

Yes. The only point I was trying to make was, was to say that sometimes we really diagnose the problem, but we need to be very clear in these conversations with the solution. Sometimes I think that we tend to think it's, it's obvious, but I want to like—

I'm happy to repeat it as often as you want.

Yes, because we need to, we need to repeat it often. But back to what I was saying, I actually do think it's normal in your 20s. I mean, this is my first time being in my 20s, so I, Funny for me to say it's normal.

I think the angst is normal in your teens. I think every teenager goes through that. I don't know why you think—

See, I disagree.

Why do you think 20s?

I think 20s because you're no longer a kid. You're not, I mean, we are adults, but you're not in full-fledged adulthood. And we are now in the very, very important period where we are building the infrastructure for our lives. We, we're building the infrastructure in our careers, in our dating lives, in where we live, in our communities, in our friends. And that's a liberating and fun thing. Being in your 20s, like, the opportunities are endless. By the way, there was a very wise person, I'm not going to mention him by name, who I was talking with. He's much older, and I asked him, when do you get old? And he had an amazing answer for me. He said, it's not like a specific age, like when you're 32, you get older, when you're 42, you get old. He said, imagine a fulcrum, like, you know, on a seesaw, that middle fulcrum thing. And he said, there's a point in life, or for a lot of your life, you're looking, you're thinking primarily about the future. And he said, there comes a point where the seesaw, the fulcrum goes in the other direction and you're no longer thinking about the future primarily, but you're thinking about the past. And he said, that's when you get old.

That's a great answer. So I lucked out.

I know.

And I know how—

I don't know if that applies to you.

It doesn't apply to me.

And I think with most people it does.

Absolutely.

But back to the 20s thing, I do think it's normal in your 20s to feel this, even though, to use his— you're looking forward, you're looking forward. And that's great. You know, that's fun. And I don't lose sight of how fun that is.

You have the you have the other problem. You don't know what the forward will bring.

Exactly.

And many in your age don't even know what the forward should be.

Exactly.

That's the bigger problem.

Well, that's a really, really good point because one of the things I talk with my friends about is they go, okay, we don't know what the future's going to hold, but we do know what we want it to hold. And that's a huge advantage.

No, I, I, you, you might, I don't think most people your age do.

Well, my friends, my friends who I talk to about this are very wise and You, you ask females your age, what should my future hold?

And undoubtedly will overwhelmingly involve career.

Yep. Yep.

Which is a big boo-boo, by the way. Careers end. Now you'll say, well, there are marriages that end too. That's true. But you can remarry, by the way, which I have. So it hasn't— marriage has not ended. A marriage has ended, but marriage has not ended for me and for anyone who remarries. And you know how happy I am. So I'm totally blessed in that arena. And unless your children are alienated from you, which is a real issue in this country thanks to the left, which tells you that if your parents are— have certain views, you shouldn't— you probably shouldn't be associating with them. They're toxic. I mean, this is all new where, you know, your parents and you differ politically, so you don't show up for Thanksgiving dinner. I mean, give me a break. But the, the— I— it's an interesting question to ask. I know the problem with the girls, but so ask a boy when they are boys. You're 25 years old. What do you look forward to? See, for my generation, everybody said marriage, for boys and girls.

Wow.

Getting married, having kids, having a family, and And certainly for men, a good job. So the women said, oh, oh, well, why don't we have a good job? Which is fair, except now a good job for the vast majority of women does not substitute for a marriage and family. A new study, in case you need studies, okay, you know what I think of studies. They either confirm the obvious or they're wrong. Okay, but new study, the happiest women alive are those who are married and have a family?

Of course. Oh, I mean, and this is your classic question. If you could have one guarantee in life, marriage or career, the answer for is there is no, there's no hesitation. If someone said to me, Julie, you tomorrow will never film another episode of any— and I love, I love this job. You know, this gives me immense meaning and purpose and I love it. If someone said to me, tomorrow morning, starting tomorrow morning, you will never film anything a day in your life, you will never be able to do this job, but you will have an amazing marriage and kids, or you can film, do this job, and you'll have like—

or won't get married, or won't get— but that's important. I never heard you say this. This is an important—

of course, there's no, there's no question. So my biggest priority in life is marriage.

And by the way, so people might say, but given, and I would 100% assent, given Julie's mind and heart, it would be a loss not to have her in the public arena. And it would be. I just want to say, and I say that about almost nobody, that's how much I value your, your mind and heart. However, I live with an example of a great mind and heart, my wife. And she, there's no question that What she knows would make her happy? Me.

And also—

No, no, no, this is— I just want to develop this point. If people don't know my wife, you do really well.

Really well.

No, no, and you're crazy about her. And I just have to add that fact. It's—

I'm very impressed. She is as— people don't know, they've never seen her. She is as special as Dennis is.

That's correct.

She's not close to as special.

I said this to her when we were dating.

I know.

She didn't believe me. It doesn't matter. She is a remarkable human being.

Right.

Brilliant and deep and very— and everything. But there's no doubt to her that, Sue, you can have a national— millions watching you versus a husband like Dennis. I won't even say only Dennis— like Dennis and kids. She'd think you're an idiot. The question is a non-question to her.

And it's not just about what would make her happy, but you know, apropos of your earlier point, it's what makes society good too when people prioritize marriage and kids.

It's a big, big factor.

Look how much you are better because of Sue Prager. Look at Brandon and look at all of us because of her.

Okay, no, I am better for a marriage that didn't work.

Yeah.

Okay, as it happens. The silliness of, oh well, there's so much divorce, I won't get married. There were so many car accidents, you won't drive? It's the— I think the analogy is perfect.

So I want to go back. Well, first I want to say, God willing, I'll be able to do both. God willing, I'll continue this career. But I only raise that, that binary question to say if it became binary. No question. Literally no question. I would choose marriage and kids.

By the way, I don't know if you'd have said this 4 years ago.

I actually think I would.

Really?

I think I would have. Yes. In fact, the first time we ever met, you asked me that question, the guarantee.

Oh yeah.

And I answered marriage.

Oh, okay, fair enough.

So I actually think I would, but, but as time has gone on, I'm redoubled in my motivation because I realized that, to put it really simply, and it really is this simple, if you have a marriage and kids, you're, you're rich.

That's right, you're rich.

You know, I mean, you can, you can have a mediocre career, you cannot like your job, you can, but if you have that It doesn't mean all of life is good, but you're not rich, you're good, a great career.

And as I said, careers—

and I have seen, I've really seen this go on, careers end. Yes, I, I, I've been very kind of aware of this over the past few years, the, the, the importance of a family. And I've grown up in a great family, thank God, but, but just as I've gotten older, it's gotten clearer. Okay, so back to the 20s thing, because I think this is really important and We have a lot of 20-something-year-old listeners. We should sometime do an episode where I read some emails.

I'd love that.

Amazing. I mean, really, really amazing emails. Um, so I think this will, this will be, um, a good discussion and relatable for a lot of our 20-something-year-old listeners. But my friends and I, we've been kind of having this holy moment, holy moly moment about life, which I am which we're talking about, I think is normal for your 20s and being a woman and kind of waking up to, okay, I have a biological clock, I've gotta get married, I've gotta have kids. It doesn't need to happen tomorrow, but I've gotta, this is something I have to prioritize while also balancing career. You know, it can cause stress. But generally, I know a lot of us are having these moments of what's gonna happen to our country? And what's going to happen to our world. And growing up, I don't know about you, but I imagine you'll, you will have had the same experience. I never worried about America growing up. And what a privilege that is. What a privilege it was that I didn't even know that I had, that growing up I never worried about my country. And now I really worry about my country.

You have every right.

And I'll tell you another thing. I have a very, very, very close friend. I have many very close friends who are Jewish, That's what I'm thinking of. She's Jewish. And we talk a lot about what's going on in Israel. And we talk a lot about just, oh my gosh, the Chicago O'Hare Airport was blocked today by another Palestine person. The UC Berkeley law incident, you know, all these crazy— the self-immolation. We talk about all the craziness that's going on. And she said to me the other day, and she's a really, really stoic girl. She's like Sue Prager. Like, she doesn't get ruffled. She started crying to me the other day.

Yeah.

And she said, I am so afraid as a Jew.

Yeah.

She said, do I have to like live in a Jewish community one day because people are going to hate me because I'm Jewish and they're going to, you know, chant Intifada, you know. And it was a really hard moment, Dennis, because I didn't know what to say to her besides your anxiety is real. Your fear is real. But given what I said about solutions, I also want to say, and I know this may come off as like putting a Band-Aid on it or trying to spin things to be optimistic. But I actually do think there's a lot of reason for optimism. Because as many scumbags as there are in this country, I do think more and more people are waking up. As some of you may know, I use a lot of MyPillow products. I sleep on a MyPillow. I sleep on the Giza Dream bedsheets. I use my towels and I wear my slippers. And you can get a lot of these products at a discount too if you use the promo code PRAGER. Right now, MyPillow is having a $25 extravaganza. When MyPillow started, it was just a one-product company. But now MyPillow has hundreds of products, some of which you may not even know about. This is why they want you to know about their $25 extravaganza. 2-pack multi-use MyPillows for just $25. MyPillow sandals for $25. Their 6-pack towel sets for $25. Brand new 4-pack dish towels. You guessed it. For just $25. For the first time ever, the premium MyPillows with all new giza fabric, also just $25. Orders over $75 will receive free shipping too. This offer won't last long. Just go to mypillow.com and use the promo code PRAGER or call 1-800-761-6302 today and use the promo code PRAGER. And even if you look at the Republican Party, look at someone like Vivek Ramaswamy. How old is he? Like 38 years old. He's a great, great leader. Look at someone like Ron DeSantis. You know, you just mentioned Dave. Look at The Daily Wire. Look at PragerU. There, there we don't, we don't always focus on those reasons for optimism. And I think that's what I was trying to say. And I want you to know, and I want the audience to know that you are a solutions person. When I said that thing, I wasn't, I know, I know. I'm glad you cut in.

Yes, yes.

But you are, and I wanna give you credit, and I hope I am, but—

Why did I devote 10 years to the Rational Bible? That's all solutions.

It is, you're right.

5 volumes of solutions.

You're right. I just think, I don't wanna say that there's a case for optimism when there's not. I think the point I was trying to make is that I would like to suffuse more optimism in our shows, because I know I'm feeling down about the direction that our country's going in. I know a lot of my friends are, and I know a lot of listeners are. And if we, like, succumb to the fret, that's going to debilitate us. So we have a moral obligation to be optimistic.

So I'm ambivalent on optimism and pessimism. I'm not optimistic and I'm not pessimistic. And I don't, by the way, I don't believe that I'm right and I don't believe that I'm wrong. I mean, if I thought I was wrong, I would obviously adopt what I thought was right. We each deal with these issues in our own way. My thing is realism and fight. Look, if I were completely pessimistic, I would say fighting is useless and I would just withdraw, you know, listen to Bach all day.

But I think a lot of people— I'm glad you brought that up— I think a lot of people don't want to fight.

No kidding.

Well, even when they know that it's— I mean, there are people who don't want to fight because they're, you know, off the reservation brainwashed. But I'm saying even among those who understand the malaise, they don't want to fight. They want to walk follow. And so this is, again, I know I'm like a broken record, but I think this is the point I'm trying to make. Like, I want to motivate people to fight. I just don't, I don't just want to diagnose what's wrong and say, and as helpful as it is to say, oh, we need God and religion and community, those things sound great, but really like getting there is hard. You know, going from A all the way to B is a difficult task with a lot of trial and error, a lot of setbacks, a lot of disappointments. Life's a hard—

well, I am proud to say that for 40 years I have said on the radio, 40 years, you should date for friends like you dated for a spouse.

Yeah, that's a, that's a very good solution.

It's— for me, it is the incomparable.

Well, your friends are incredible.

Yeah, I agree.

And guess what? I should say my friends are incredible because your friends are my friends.

That's right, they are.

Lucky me. Thank you for those gifts of those, those incredible people.

Well, they feel the same about you, so it's a mutual thing.

But we have to— like, how do we get people to understand that they have to fight? And I get why sometimes people don't want to fight.

By the way, if they don't want to fight, I have a solution: help the fighters.

That's another good solution.

Helping fighters is as important as fighting. If the troops don't have supplies, The troops can't fight. Well, donate, donate to good causes. It's simple as that. Not everybody is cut out to be a fighter or knows even how to fight. By the way, there are many ways that— that would be a good guideline. How could the average person fight? Okay, they don't have access to a microphone or a video camera, and I understand, although they do have access to a video camera now that I think of it.

But that's not all.

I mean, but, but no, it isn't. But forgive me, I just want to say they can help. Also, they can forward— you come across a great article, forward it to everybody in your life. I get millions of those, and I read a lot of them that people I trust forward to me. That's a way of fighting.

Be a fighter. I mean, we have this platform, and I'm so grateful for it. But we live in an exhibitionist culture where we think that we have to go big and do something huge in order to fight. I love what you just said. Fight in your own life.

Yeah, no, that's exactly right.

Fight in your own family, fight in your own friends, fight in your own workplace. But this is—

How did we get from those who object to Dennis Prager?

Yeah, exactly. Oh, well, I ask myself that a lot on this show. It is fun.

But it is organic. Well, one doesn't sound like we've reached for the stars here.

You know what I'm going to do? I'm going to go home one day and get out a piece of paper and literally draw an outline with arrows. That would just be— that would be so interesting, like how conversations work. But you, you said to me the other day on the phone, a great line: Life is not a dress rehearsal. Do you remember?

Yeah. Which is not my line.

But no, I know it's not your line.

I've never heard it. It's fantastic. I think about it all the time.

Life is not a dress rehearsal.

That's right.

This is it, you know?

Yeah. And you're thrust on opening night with no dress rehearsal.

Yes. And, you know, with regard to this conversation, I think that's what kind of motivates me to go forward, even with my worries about the future. It's sort of like, well, you don't have a choice.

That's right.

You're here. Like, and I say this on Dennis and Julie a lot, buy in. Buy into life.

By the way, that is— you don't have a choice is my motto about happiness. What is my choice if I'm not happy? To be unhappy? That is a non-choice for me.

Yeah.

Yeah, it is off limits. I, I hate being unhappy.

Well, congratulations, Dennis, you're not.

Well, it is congratulations because I've worked on it a lot.

You are not.

You are not unhappy. But also, I mean, I grant I also believe that my nature is— see, it's— I'm a very odd combination. And you know who pointed this out? Jordan Peterson. Did I tell you this? He came over to me. Yeah, he came over to me after an evening we did together, and he said, you know, I was watching you, Dennis. And he's very observant, and aside from being a professor of psychology, because you're, you're very, uh, I don't know, rare, uncommon, whatever. In what way? You're really intense and very light and happy.

You have an amazing ability to, to oscillate between those two.

Well, they keep the, the latter keeps me sane to do the intense part. I couldn't be intense 24/7. I would drive me crazy. I would drive, drive everybody in my life crazy. So what was it? The wonderful woman who is— oh, you'll love this. This is apropos. So the wonderful woman who has been the producer of the fireside chat, Megan, Megan, who has done it for years. We have 330 whatever fireside chats.

Amazing.

It is. And it's for those who don't know, you should watch it. It's once a week at the PragerU. Watch any one you want. Go to 157. And you'll, you'll benefit. It's really wonderful stuff. And you— so she's no longer— she left. She did her last one last week. You know why?

She's moving to Georgia, right?

Because her husband got a better job and she wants to be full-time mommy and, and, and wife.

Her baby's so cute.

And she wants more babies. Your baby is cute. And we— I actually had her on a fireside chat. I almost never have guests. Maybe 3 times a year. And I wanted people to hear her thinking because she had a— she's a wonderful job at PragerU, very wonderful job, wonderful people. But she goes, I have this one opportunity to be, be the mother of my, of my children.

Yes, life is not a dress for—

sorry, no, you, it was a proper cutoff. That's exactly—

life is not your kid.

Yes.

You don't get to go back and go, oh, I missed my kids' first 2 years of life and now they're older and I wasn't— that's gone.

That's gone. But I love that you remember that line because it's so perfect.

Well, it really is.

We were warned not to compliment each other, so don't you dare compliment me. But I will.

We were warned by whom?

Oh, in the very beginning. Remember who said, oh, you guys, you know, you say—

oh, you mean of this show?

Yes.

I thought you meant today. I'm like, who did that?

No, no, no, no, this show. But, uh, look, folks, hello out there. I'm looking at you, my, my listener. She's very, very deep, this woman. We ought to do one on depth. It's never mentioned. You know what's— this is, this is perfect for your chart about how we go to other subjects.

Oh, I'm excited for that.

This one is— this is— we have to work on this together. This, uh, although I might be better at it because I'm so much older than you. What are terms that are incredibly important that no one even mentions? Depth.

Maturity.

And maturity. That's right. How did you know I'd say maturity? Because I've said it, or you, you know, I just, I thought of it. Yes, exactly. If you tell a kid today, you know, that's not mature I truly believe that most kids would go, what?

Because it's— because what does that mean? Maturity doesn't matter.

Your truth matters.

Your truth matters.

Well, yes, although I don't know if the—

because maturity is an objective standard.

No, maturity—

objective standards are not like depth and maturity are. Nothing is fully objective. Of course, beautiful we think of as an objective standard, but there are subjective gradations, whatever. But maturity is an objective standard, and we don't have those anymore. So that's why, that's why it's not said.

They are two of the most important things you could be in life, and they are never mentioned.

I know, it's true.

Imagine, you know, I'm now entering— I stare out and I'm entering a truly make-believe world that there was a TikTok or an Instagram that simply developed your depth and maturity?

There is @JulieR. Hartman.

Okay, that's fair.

No, but that's really what I endeavor to be as a talk show host.

Yes.

And making, like, making myself that person and trying to spread good values in society.

You'll be sitting in for me sometimes in Africa, correct?

Yeah, I'm excited about that.

I'm excited about it too.

But I don't know how much time we have, but I really do want to go back to this point of life is not a dress rehearsal just for a little bit. Because I actually think that this is the solution, which is my favorite word of the day, to a lot of the malaise. Because you have to understand, I get emails from people and I get it. I really, really get it. College students who write, I'm so lonely. My whole college is woke. You know, I have to say my pronouns every class. I'm terrified of speaking up in class. I don't have a lot of friends and I can't tell them that I'm conservative. You know, I got an email from some girl the other day who said, I work from home and I'm very lonely working from home. I get a lot of people writing to me, I'm so honored that people write to me and I get it, that it's a weird, lonely, culturally radical time and being young is hard. But I think the solution is like realizing that even if it's hard, you're still here and this is your life and life is not a dress rehearsal and don't wallow in it. And even if you have reasons to wallow in it, sort of what I was saying about COVID like even if I'm totally right and I know I'm totally right, that being sent home for that year and for that year and a half was irrational and despicable and I got screwed over. Even though I am right, I have to move on. Even though you're lonely, even though things are stacked against you, don't you dare bow down on your life. Don't you dare. This is your life. Push through it. And, and I sometimes I wake up and I feel very discouraged myself. And you know what? Every morning I tell myself, Okay, Julie, you can't control what's going to happen in the future, but what you can do is every single day wake up and try. Just try. And I have a feeling that if you try, 5 years from now, you'll look back and things will pan out well.

This is your wonderful way of stating something that I I say a lot. You are what you want to be. And I developed it because people would write into me frequently and say, you speak about courage is the most important characteristic of— without it, good is not possible, which is true. So I got so many people would say to me, including people that I'm friendly with, the people in my life, Dennis, how do you become courageous? And I thought about it, I would say for a year, and I finally gave a talk. I think it's at the pragerstore.com. I'm not trying to sell up the lecture there. I don't make any serious money from this, but Salem owns the store, and it's good that people take a look at what's available there. But I, I think that how to become courageous is, is one of the talks you could download. But the gist of it was you become courageous if you decide to be. Yes, you are what you decide to become. A lot of people worry about their weight, and for good reason, and I am one of them. And I have embarked on PhD weight loss and nutrition at the urging of my colleagues and friends Seb Gorka Dennis Prager and Mike Gallagher. It's called PhD Weight Loss and Nutrition because they're as emphatic on the nutrition part as they are on the weight loss part. What I suggest you do is have a half-hour conference call with them. Just— conference call may not be the right term. You are having a conference with them. It's just you and someone at, at PhD Weight Loss. Go to myphdweightloss.com. Or call 864-644-1900. 864-644-1900. myphdweightloss.com. It's really interesting. I'm pausing and letting it sink in because I mean, I first developed it with Happy that—

and fake it till you make it.

Fake it till you make it. Behave courageously, you'll become courageous. Behave religiously, you'll become religious. People go, oh well, I can't, I can't believe in God. Oh yeah? Well, how about finding an impressive religious community and affiliating with them? Okay, is it— why is that not a better life?

Gosh, it's, it's— as you're saying this, I'm thinking about how many struggle from paralysis. Like, they, they know that what you're saying is true, but they won't take the first step.

That's right.

And again, as I am saying this, please know I'm not like speaking as a holier-than-thou individual. I'm, I'm trying to do my best with all— like, when I was saying, don't you dare bow down on your life, when I'm advising that, I'm advising that to myself.

We all—

I'm a seeker. I'm on a journey.

We're all speaking to ourselves when we speak.

Yes, yes, that's right. So, but I find this with myself, it's easy sometimes to have paralysis where you, you know, you want certain— like, sometimes in Los Angeles, it's hard to have a robust social life.

And yeah, I'm not sure it's easy in Milwaukee. I mean, the— it's right.

No, I know.

No, no, I— you know what it reminds me of?

But you have to— you have to just— yeah, I just want to finish it. You have to take the first step. And sometimes I sit and I'm like, I know I have to take a step, but I don't know what step. Well, you know what, Julie? Shut up. Get out of your apartment and literally go to a coffee store. And turn to the person next to you and introduce yourself.

Yeah.

Or go to like, there's a running club in Venice. Go to the run. Just, just do something. Or a book club. Do something. Sorry, go ahead, Dennis.

No, no, I did have a point.

Oh God, I'm sorry.

No, no, no, it's not a catastrophe. But it was, what were we saying? But it was a fun point. Oh well, it doesn't happen to me much.

I can't tell you how bad I feel. No, I feel, I feel really bad. I'm sorry.

That is so sad that you feel bad. What was the topic, though? Because it was— it's a worthy topic.

We've been Zooming, trying, taking—

yeah.

Oh, be—

oh no, I know, I remember, I remember. So I— so you said it's hard in Los Angeles, and I said I think it's hard in Milwaukee too.

Yeah.

So this is a— this truly has nothing to do with that. But it has something to do with Los Angeles. So there aren't many people in this country who travel as much as I do. This is not a brag. I'm just— it's—

of course it is what it is.

It's just a fact. Correct. Okay. So, and I've been to all 50 states and I'm gone virtually every week of the year somewhere. So where was I most recently? Washington, D.C. And I rent a car everywhere I go, as you know. Because that's freedom to me, renting a car. And I was completely tied up in traffic. I mean, just non-moving traffic. And I was talking to Sue, and she's probably tired of this because, to her credit though, she tolerates it because I've said it so often. Where did this idiocy of LA traffic ever develop, where is traffic not a problem? What major city— what major city has less traffic than LA? And the answer is it doesn't exist. You don't move anywhere. Did you go— have you been to Atlanta? Have you been to Chicago? Have you been to Miami? Try the I-95 in South Florida during rush hour. You, you could pull out a book and read it. It still cracks me up that places get a rep— some reputations are deserved. And yes, LA traffic is awful, but every city's traffic is awful. It just cracks me up. And I think that that's part of the issue with the social life.

Oh, you convince yourself.

Yes, yes. I look, with all the lamenting that people like singles and young people like you have about LA social scene, You have a lot of wonderful people here.

Oh, I'm not compl—

Oh, I know you're not. No, I'm— I know I'm not addressing this to a complaint. You're not complaining. I'm saying this to all those who go, oh, LA, what do I— you know, LA, where, where am I going to find anybody? There are a lot of wonderful people in LA.

Yes, there are. And the reason I said it is because in my situation, 99% of my friends are in New York. But I was just using that as an example of sometimes you can wallow in these scenarios.

Well, but ask your 99% friends, how are they doing socially?

I think a lot of them would say they're having fun.

Fun, I believe. But you're not preoccupied with fun.

Who says I'm not preoccupied with fun?

No, no, I'm totally pro-fun. You would rather meet a guy, I presume, than just have fun. Is that fair to say?

I don't think that's a binary.

It's not a binary, but neither was it with regard— you placed the binary earlier of career and— and if it were a binary, you said, right? Right. By the way, you can have fun if you're married. Just for the record.

Of course, yeah.

Okay, so I— when I think, all right, this may be truly a factor of my temperament and/or my age or both. I fully acknowledge that. When I think of having fun socially at your age, it usually involves, you know, hanging out at usually a bar.

Yeah.

Okay. So I don't think it's an age factor because when I was your age, I didn't hang out at bars and I had a lot of fun. I just want, just for the record, I'm a fun fan, but I don't know. I don't know. That would be an interesting experiment for you to be there for, you know, 6 months and see how much fun you had.

But I think the point here is really important that it's weird. So many Dennis and Julie conversations are weirdly full circle. And we started off the show by discussing the things that we get angry about or the things that we spend our energy on. And I do think a lot of us in all areas of life tend to convince ourselves of these narratives. And we can use the social, like, oh, LA has bad traffic compared to— or LA has bad social life compared to others. And we literally just like feed ourselves these lies and we wallow in them and we're not seeing what's right in front of us. And it debilitates us.

That's right. And we need to take the first step. They become self-fulfilling prophecies.

That's right. We need to take the first step out of those narratives. And, and so speaking, you know, the people who write to me that they're lonely in college, yes, those things are real. I am not denying that, that these people, because I was in it too, you know, the professors are super woke, the students are super woke, it's radical, it's a tense college environment. Those things are true. But if you swallow the whole lie that your whole college experience is bad, and you're going to be lonely because of this moment that we're living in, then it's going to become a self-fulfilling prophecy. And so acknowledge that that's there, put it in a box and put the box to the side and take the first few steps out of it.

Couldn't agree more.

Well, wow, that was a lot. I mean, it's always a lot.

You know what is funny? Not a single thing we mentioned before the show.

I know, what did we even mention?

Oh, we— well, oh, Israel. I had this big debate which is all over the internet on Israel. People can watch, and I wanted to reflect on that. You wanted to reflect on Rome.

I know, I need to do—

I know, it's really funny.

I mean, anything we mentioned, you know, we usually don't even mention anything, but I know Well, I guess we'll just have to— yes, do more Dennis and Julies.

I couldn't agree more.

Two show notes that may matter.

Two show notes. Yes, be careful what you wish for. The actual quote is, be careful what you wish for, your wish may be granted. The actual quote is, be careful what you wish for, your wish may be granted.

From Aesop's Fables. So wise.

The Herdsman and the Lost Bull.

Yeah, and there is a reason we call the show Dennis and Julie.

What is the reason we call the show Dennis and Julie? Because we put age before beauty. But see, now I just want to say that that was a beautiful thought. Thank you for sharing it.

God, I, I, we really need to do an email thing. I, I'll tell you one really fast if we have time. I got an email from a transgender individual in their 20s, and I'm saying they not from a pronouns perspective. I can't remember if it's male to female or female. I just don't remember.

You don't? That's interesting.

I don't.

Okay.

I think it was male to female.

That doesn't matter.

Okay, whatever. No, I actually think it doesn't matter. And this person wrote to me, I am transgender, and I got, you know, the full transition but I know I have a mental illness and my even acknowledging that I have a mental illness makes me a pariah in my community.

That's right.

And this person wrote, I wish these people, these ideologues understood that it is one of the worst things in the world to have this mental illness and to have the solution be to change your body.

My heart goes out to this person.

And I, I mean, That's right.

What the left has done is normalized the abnormal.

What an amazing person that is.

And it's not an insult, yes.

Because that person is in pursuit of truth.

That's right.

And the truth—

That makes you amazing.

And as we talk about, the truth is decent. You know, the truth isn't bigoted. It's not like eugenicist or, the truth is decent, but the truth is uncomfortable. And that person, it was the most truthful, email I may have ever received.

You should, uh, you should read it on the air. I, I would like this.

I'm very protective of people's anonymity when they're— well, don't say kind enough. Well, I didn't, right? But this— wow, this email was, was crazy. Talk about feeling lonely, you know?

That's right. Well, it's a double whammy. It's lonely because, yes, trans people in general will be lonely. And it's lonely because they know that it's not a— it's not— it's an issue. It's a mental issue. By the way, to say that someone has a mental issue is not an insult. It's so bizarre that, that this is considered to be bigoted.

They are succumbing to the things that they claim to hate. They would claim to hate disparaging someone who's mentally ill, but But when a trans person says that they're mentally ill, they are disparaging a person who's mentally ill by making them feel bad for saying that. Do you understand what I mean? That they are doing what they claim to not do, to not want to do.

Yes, because they're claiming mental ill is bad.

Right. I'll say one final thing, and I promise you it will be the final thing. How many people, how many leftists would imagine that a trans person listens to our show? They don't understand conservatism or conservatives.

I've had trans people call my show.

Of course. How many, how many people would expect you to be the godfather of a gay couple's son? How many people would expect you, expect you, excuse me, to adopt a child? How many people would expect that I'm born of a surrogate mother? They don't, they don't understand. They think conservatives are these, like, purified caricatures.

They have to think that.

That's right. Well, you can email me at julie@julie-hartman.com. If there's one thing you've gotten from this episode, it's that I read the emails, even if I can't always respond. I so take them to heart and appreciate them. So please email me. You can follow me at Julie R. Hartman on Instagram and Twitter, and you can follow Dennis at @TheDennisPrager on Instagram and @DennisPrager on Twitter. And DennisPrager.com. Is that right?

That's the place, DennisPrager.com.

Thanks everyone, we love being with you.

Bye.

Shalom.

Your beloved dog and a stranger are both drowning. You can only save one. Who do you save? Every time Dennis Prager asks that question, his audience splits three ways. One-third chooses the dog, one-third chooses the stranger, and one-third aren't sure. Why? Because we live in an age where increasingly feelings define right and wrong. But if my If morality is based on emotion, then murder, rape, and theft are just opinions. And if people feel justified, why is rioting or destruction wrong at all? In his new book, If There Is No God, Dennis Prager explains why civilizations cannot survive without objective morality and why Judeo-Christian values shape the moral foundations of the free world.

If you claim that certain things are good, certain things are evil, evil, independent of how you feel about it, you are in effect affirming God.

If There Is No God by Dennis Prager, available now at pragerstore.com. That's pragerstore.com.