EP 169 WTH?!?: The Healing Power of Divine Presence with Maetreyii Ma

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Welcome back everybody. I'm Dr. Greg Eckel and this is what the health and we have a fascinating discussion of into the Heart of the Infinite. I'm really looking forward to this conversation. I have Maitrey Ma and she is an award winning author, psychologist and spiritual teacher who has developed a worldwide following bringing forth deep wisdom that manifests to her both through her inner guru Baba and in her teacher, the renowned Indian mystic, Shri Sri Anandamurti Baba. It's fun and you can say that five times really quickly, but here's what this gets really when where this gets really interesting. The Baba that has loved and guided her throughout her long life is the all knowing spiritual consciousness that embodies divine love and speaks to and in recent years through her. And while she met and lived in the ashram of the living guru in India for eight months before he passed from the earth, the immortal spiritual consciousness he embodied has been side by side with her since her college years, long before she met him and long after. Her story, beautifully told in her new book into the Heart of the Infinite a spiritual memoir of an extraordinary mystical Journey, is a story of profound transformation that reveals how she came to experience the spiritual ecstasy and beauty that her guide Baba brought to her while integrating it into her real world life of wife, mother, psychologist and spiritual teacher. To live a life in an awakened joyful consciousness. With roles as the past founder and president of the Ananda Seva Mission, a founding board member of the Kundalini Research Network and a previous director of the Spiritual Emergency Network, she has long been a guiding light in the spiritual community. Wow. And welcome aboard.

Thank you. It's wonderful to be here with you.

I am really, really excited to share your story and, and your book and the message. I love the topic. And into the Heart of the Infinite is the title of your book. It's the title of our show today. And if I just lobbed that over to you with our community on the edge of their seat, where would you start with that?

Oh my. Well, the book is really about my own spiritual journey to the heart of the Infinite. You know, we all have. I feel the capacity to have a personal relationship, a personal connectedness to the God self, to the divinity which is everywhere and omniscient to the one eternal essence I call the infinite. And I feel that we each have a very special ability to have that connection. And sometimes it comes when we're in nature, you know. Have you ever had those moments in nature?

Yeah, yeah.

You're just there and you go, ah, right. And it's the ah and the ah. Right. And. And you just. You kind of leave your isolated sense of self and you're connected, right?

Yeah.

And it comes with loved ones who you love and you feel connected to when you look in the eyes of somebody you really love and care about. And there's that moment where time and space disappear and melody goes away and there you are in the one and. Yeah, it happens, huh?

Yes, it does. It may happen more and more frequently, that's for sure.

Yeah. And. And in deep meditation, right, when you. When you really let go of all the jabber in the mind and you settle into the depths and then. Then you experience that unitary wholeness. And then sometimes, especially if you've been meditating, sometimes just in ordinary life, something will just trigger it and your mind will just go out into the wholeness. We have these God moments, if you will, where we have this connectedness. And through meditative practice, we cultivate that. We cultivate that unitary wholeness. And that is. You know, I know that your show is a lot about healing and that unitary wholeness is a really deep source of healing and nurturance.

How, if someone has never experienced that, how. How did you first come across it, feel it, experience it? Like, what was your first.

Aha.

Like, whoa, there's something else here.

Yeah. I was a kid, I had a tremendous connection to nature. I grew up on this five and a half acre little farm we had. And I. I had my cats and my dog and the chickens and, you know, the natural world. And I ran around as a little, little one in this natural world. And I felt. I felt a connection to nature. And then I felt the same connection to nature as. As I grew. And I think that connection to nature, for me, as I think it is for a lot of people, that was my first inroad. And then, Then when I was in my. About 11 or 12, I started to feel this divine presence. You know, there was some. This being with me who was divine, like a Christ, like, you know, like. Like Christ. I really. There was no name, there was no guidance. It was just a presence that would kind of descend. And it was kind of. I knew it was a holy presence, like a Christ. And I could feel this divine presence with me. And I would feel it near me and that became that. And the. And the trees that I was close to and would go to and hug and they would just. If I had struggles, you know, from school and all kinds of things that stress kids out, it would just. I felt like the clouds would just Float away and I would be left with this calm energy from the trees and, and from this divine presence which I felt held by and connected to. And, and when I felt this presence, I really fell in love. I think, I think it's a love that really comes to people the more you feel this presence, this, it's hard to be in the in to experience this divine presence without feeling love. And I think that happens for a lot of people who do have an experience of divine presence, however it may manifest for them and for sure I.

Think, you know, it's an interesting component because it never really gets talked about in medicine. And I, I have a definition of disease as separation from source and have had experience in my life where really experiencing that unity consciousness and, and really coming from the one of this returning home and, and practicing what we bring into our centers is more of deep presence and listening and embracing and you know, really reverence for life, the preciousness of life and the in, in awe of the, of this. I mean we're, it's miraculous that we're even here right? And, and, and coming from that state, you know, before it was like oh this is physiology, this is anatomy. Then life experiences happen and you realize, you know, we don't know how long we are here together and to no one gets to get between you and that connection. And I love that you're. You're writing about it and you know, speaking about spiritual transformation and, and really bringing the, the heart of the infinite. You know, we, we say in Chinese medicine there's no word for mind body medicine, it's just heart based medicine. So it is the Emperor and the Empress. And so with that I maybe let's see what bubbles up for you with that.

Well, I love what you're saying about that divine unitary consciousness being the source of healing and disposal ease being when you cease to be in harmony, you cease to be at ease. You cease to be in the flow of that wave of harmony that comes from divine source from the unitary consciousness into all creation and moves creation in a certain flow. And when you're out of, out of sync with that, you're in a state of dis ease. I believe that's what you're saying. Yeah. And, and that be true healing. There's levels of healing which I'm sure you've gone into, you know. Yeah, you can get over your cold, you can cure your cancer, but can you cure the source of your cancer? Can you hear the source of your cold? Can you cure the source of your dis. Ease? So that, that dis ease doesn't just find another symptom, another way to be out there. You know, is there, is there a way to work? You know, I come from a yogic background with a whole, with a classical tantra, subtle body theory. So there's a whole theory which is very similar to Chinese medicine of how, you know, the subtle body interfaces with the physical form. But through all of that there's a, there's a harmony of flow that you can get into that comes from that unitary deep source of all being. And is that when you touch it, that deep source? I think that's when you feel awe, that's when you feel incredible heart opening and love, because that's the nature of that consciousness which is at our source, at our home. And the more we flow from that into our minds, into our bodies, into our whole subtle body to physical body flow, then dis ease tends to dissipate and it does bring healing on a very, very deep level of those core issues. Because deep inside I think we all suffer with the pain of separation. The, the, the, the. Our individuality is a source. Ultimately. We have, we have a lot of things that go on in our lives and ways that it manifests and all sorts of psychological issues that come up. But under those issues, the, the sort of fall from grace, the separation of self and other, the, the pain of duality, the pain of feeling that you're alone, that you're separate, is, is a deep source of dis. Ease. And, and that when you heal, that when you come into alignment and flow from the, from the one and you feel that infinite love, then there's tremendous healing in that, tremendous healing for body, mind and spirit. Because that's the, that dissolves the dis. Ease of separateness, of duality.

Yeah. And so how, how do you help folks? Or what do you recommend to, to get in touch or number one, discovering that, that you are, you're suffering, you have loneliness, you've got isolation, you know, you may not have others in your vicinity. Like I talk to a lot of patients, they're, they're at home, they have chronic debilitating disease and they don't have relatives or family near. They're not in any community. And so on one level, they, it really is them in their house. But when you tune in to that oneness and the connection and the kind of the, the bigger self. Yes, just the meat suit that we find ourselves in at the moment. But you know, you talk a lot about spiritual transformation in inner guidance and meditation and I know that you write about that in your book.

What.

What would you give as suggestions for folks watching and viewing that might be saying, well, that's really nice to say. And xyz, I have, you know, chronic pain and my brain is degenerating. And, you know, all of these things that are maybe evidence over here to support the. I don't even know how. What language you would use. I would say smaller self or individual self rather than higher self. Um, you know, how do you talk about that with folks?

I think that meditation is. Is key, but we can do meditation and we can do body scanning, we can do mantra, we can do different techniques, but as long as it's just a technique, it is practice for calming the mind, relaxing your anxiety about things happening. But if you're caught up in all that stuff, it. It. It's depressing, you know, if that's all there is. And, and depression. And when you do have chronic illness, a lot of times depression goes along with it because there's a lot to cope with, and anxiety a lot of times.

Yeah. Yeah.

And so feeling that there is something larger than yourself, something that's. That holds your being beyond the physical body, beyond the. The pain and the suffering of the physical body, beyond the dis. Ease that you're dealing with, that there's a larger context for you, and that there is a spiritual home. And knowing that reading books that support that and bring you closer to it, and reading different kinds of writings, listening to podcasts, listening to. Listening to things that inspire you to feel that there is something greater, something there. And then taking your silent time to connect, to feel presence, to feel that infinite love is all around you, that you and the plant. I have this beautiful plant in front of me that I'm pointing to that you can't see. But the plant, the leaves in the plant, blades of grass, the trees, animals, people, they're all part of one infinite whole. And as you begin to feel that you are surrounded by this great love that embodies in all of creation, in life, that there's beauty in every moment, even when there's pain, even when there's unhappiness, there's beauty in the present moment. And when you begin to open up to that possibility, when you begin to open up to the love inside your own heart, then it brings you into connectedness. And then maybe you have that moment where you just look at a tree or even a plate of grass, or you pet your cat and you just think, I'm with God. I'm with the whole I'm with love divine. And, and you feel that connectedness. So it's, it's always there with you. It's. You're not alone. It's, it's clo. That infinite consciousness is, is your closest companion. It's, it's, it's like there's layers to each of our minds. And, and when we're out here dealing with objects and things and dealing with the body, mind is absorbed, attention is absorbed in those things. Right? But that same attention can go deep and you, and you can drop down to deeper layers of the mind. And in the deepest layer, where a lot of times delta waves that we have in deep sleep are produced, your conscious mind, through meditative practice and through, through love of the divine, can move down into this deep realm where you experience that unitary consciousness awake, conscious. So your, your conscious attention can shift, shift gears, shift levels and pain and suffering exist on one stratum of your being. That's not all of who you are. And there's a level, a level of wholeness beneath that that is more than the body, more than the mind. It's a connectedness to all of life and to the wholeness that sustains and runs through everything. And so I think it's, it's, it's a matter of intent, having the intention, taking the time to breathe to do some sort of practice to help you bring in taking the time in nature to just the connectedness and, and let your heart move out, let your heart open.

Beautifully put. Thank you. The, the component of that opening of the heart, I, I really feel there is a movement. I mean, you know, it's kind of the ancient wisdom of the heart. We are heart centered beings. We, we want to be seen and heard and acknowledged and feel love. Yeah, the, the aspect of that with kind of ancestral traumas and the longer period of humanity on the planet with accumulation of traumas and maybe not the best modeling on how to handle wounds and wounds in general and suffering and you know, wars, etc. Injustices, all of those seem to be building up and coming to this crescendo and, and maybe this has been all of time. Right? Because there is only now and it is the human experience, but there's more of us now. And having you having this experience with a guru or teacher is not, it's not common practice these days. And so I'm wondering if you want to kind of speak about that because you, you have this really, really extraordinary relationship with your teacher and an ability to have that conversation where you are out of Space and time, you know, so you've, you've developed this and I don't know if you've cultivated that or did that just come naturally to you.

Maybe it's a combination. I feel that it's grace. But grace comes. You know, the yogis say that the ego, the separate sense of self, is like an umbrella that we hold over ourselves. And there is always this gentle fall of grace, of divine love which is there. And when we take down the umbrella of ego, then we feel that divine grace. So I don't think I'm special in any way. I think it's something that if you just learn to take down that umbrella, it's there and it, grace that brings it. So, so I've, I started out, as I said, I felt this presence as a child and then it went away. I became, you know, I got involved with all the typical growing things and social things that teenagers and, yeah, young adults do. And then in my early 20s, I began to, I wanted to learn meditation. I went through some psychedelic experiences that definitely opened me up to unitary consciousness. And then I crashed and burned with that. And I, I, I wanted to learn meditation in this Eastern I lived in. But I, I got this book on how to meditate from the Theosophical Society. And I was reading it, you know, can learn how to meditate. And then it said, well, you shouldn't meditate without a guru. I lived at, I went to Carbondale, to Southern Illinois University, and I said, you know, I live in the middle of a cornfield. Where am I going to find a guru? You know? But, but just that next week, two meditation teachers, one a TM and one this orange robe swami, came to, came to Carbondale in Southern Illinois. And I got initiated into this one meditative practice. This was a long time ago. And I began doing regular twice a day meditation. And I didn't do it for very long before I, I felt this divine presence coming. And it's, it's a whole story in itself. I don't want to go into the details, but, but this, again, this divine presence came to me and this time gave a name and talked to me and said its name was Baba. And, and by the time I connected deeply and was aware of this Presence, I was so much in love. And I experienced like these divine qualities manifesting through this presence. Like one word would be a single drop of perfect love or perfect, perfect, perfect justice, perfect beauty, like, like the facets of a jewel, you know, and, and I don't think anybody can be in the Presence of that without falling completely in love. It's. It's a. A love that is. Makes this human life in a way black and white compared to color. It's so profound. But then my teach, my transformation process was learning to see that in everything and everyone, that it's all around us, as well as in the silence. But for me, meditation practice opened me up to inner guidance. And inner guidance came from my guru Baba. And I met him internally, and I had a variety of deep mystical experiences. And then he said, now you should come to India and be with me physically as. And so I and my husband at the time sold everything we had, get found homes for our dog and our cats and. And bought oneway tickets to India.

Wow.

Yeah. And. And we went to be with Baba and as a physical guru, and a lot of different experiences happened. But after a while, I felt deep love for that physical guru who was very magical. You know, things happen, were unusual and mystical and miraculous and. And when I would meditate, I did a lot of meditation at that time, and. And I would feel this divine bliss, this rapture, this divine bliss very much in my meditation. And I would feel that in the presence of my guru. And. But I also felt it then to come back into my room and feel the. The presence of the inner guru. But. And they sort of blended into one. It seems like, you know, like gurus are like sort of like flavors of ice cream. There's the one that looks like this and talks like this, and the one that looks like this and talks like this, but they're all ice cream. You know, they're just come in different. Just come in different flavors. And so basically, the Anandamurti Baba and my inner guide seem to be of the same flavor, you know, but I really see. And this is one thing you pointed out when you were talking earlier in the intro, is that Baba is not, for me, a physical person. And my guidance isn't channeling that physical person. For me, Baba is a doorway, you know, and if you open that door, the infinite is on the other side. There's just being pure absolute love, pure absolute peace. There is that which cannot be named, which really can't be described in words. And so Baba is a doorway that brings. Brings that into form for me and brings it into. In 1990, I. I received guidance as my physical guru left this body to start bringing through this teachings from that, from that level. And so from Baba, I experienced, I can just sort of melt back into it. And it's kind of like channeling and But I don't feel it's channeling another entity. I feel it's this divine flow and it just sort of drops down into my mind, which is very different. I mean I'm very capable of giving a lecture, you know, and, but that comes from the rational mind which is a very different process than that which comes from the, from the source, from that cosmic source and just seems to drop in. And I think so much of the knowledge and what we have in our world has really come from that cosmic source. So much of science is focusing, focusing, focusing until you get that aha moment. You know the guy who would, what's his name, Mandal, who did the periodic table, it came to him in a dream and he wrote it down.

Right, Right.

A lot of scientific discoveries are like that. They, they come an intuitive moment, right?

Yes.

And in medicine also it comes, you concentrate, you concentrate and you come to that intuitive moment where something kind of drops from a different level. Yeah.

And it is so true. And I think, you know, we, the pendulum is swinging more into that intuitive component with frequency, light and sound, this heart as the multi dimensional portal for, for our true greatness and who we, who we can truly be. I love that being. Peace, being, love. It's being. There's no doing in that. You just be and radiating. So you know, opening your field, opening your heart. I think that is. You've put it so beautifully and I'm really, I'm really glad we had you on the show and I'm excited to share, share your book and your teachings and we're going to put all of your, your contact info in our show notes and wondering if there's anything that you would like to. A message you'd like to part.

Well, one thing I wanted to say is that I've changed my website to something a little simpler than mytrainmod.org because no one can spell it. So it's yogamma.org so that my website, if people wanna want to know more, want to find out, want to connect with me, just go to yogama.org right. And as a parting message I think I would like to say to people, trust yourself, trust the love that's in you and go deep. There is a deeper level. Even if you're in pain, even if you're suffering, there, there's, there's the ability to, to let that suffering drive you deep and let your difficulties in life help you focus and, and come to the deeper stratum of your being where there really is love and support for you. That's simple message.

I love it. Thank you so much. My Trey coming on.

Yeah, it's great to be here. So I wish you well.

Thank you. And folks, this is into the Heart of the Infinite is the name of today's topic and of the book. So go out to Amazon if you're interested. Check her out on the website on the links in the show notes. If you enjoyed today's show, please give us a five star review and put down what you're taking home. What are you getting into action with? What? How does this land for you? You know, this is where the message is coming. It's not coming from top down. It's coming from the what the health and from other podcasters coming directly into your homes. We wouldn't be here without you. So bless you all and we will talk to you soon. Thank you.