From the Couch: A Listener’s Struggle with Her Sister-in-Law

We've spent so much time talking about the mother in law, but what happens when the conflict isn't with her, it's with the sister in law. When her toxic patterns keep showing up at the family table, it can leave everyone walking on eggshells. And that's what this from the couch episode is all about. I am answering Michelle's question. Michelle sent me a DM over on Instagram and here's what she said in a nutshell. I've been with my husband 20 years, married 10 together since we were kids, really. He has a sister two years older than him and his brother. Their mom died seven years ago. His dad has been with his stepmother forever. The relationship he has had with his stepmother wasn't good as a kid and now it's fine, but she's just not maternal or loving per se. But it isn't something he desires to change. The sister and the stepmom are close and love to gossip. My husband and I had life milestones before his sister, like marriage, house, kids. When things are really good for us, I feel like her negative energy. She tries to compete with me and I have no desire to do that. There have been many years of passive aggression and it feels like a lot of important moments in my life kind of have this dark cloud around it because of her. Oh, I am so sorry for this. Because really, when we are in a family system, we hope that people can celebrate us and be there to lift us up and recognize that we all enter different life stages at different times. And it's not a competition really is about saying this is what works for you. And I can separate that from maybe my own struggle. Initially, when I went through this, Michelle, I started to wonder about some of those hard feelings that show up for other people. So this is not your responsibility. This is just more of an insight piece. And I was thinking about the two emotions that we do tend to mix up, envy and jealousy. Envy is when someone has something that you don't have and you want it. So I don't know, maybe there's some envy for her. But then jealousy is also the threat to a third. So this idea maybe that she's lost the specialness that she felt with her brother. So she's older and I would imagine then you've married the middle child. Middle child and her probably had a special bond growing up. Middle kid looked up to oldest. And so maybe there's this flavor in here of jealousy that she who has lost her sibling and all that to say, though I will say this, that's not your yours to own. You do not need to take that on. And again, it really is that separation and the both end that you can be upset about these things, but you can also be an adult and communicate your needs and talk to your brother about what you would like moving forward without having to make it really muddy and dark for your good moments. Okay, here's what else you said. So then you said, at first I ignored it. That's what my husband wanted. At times it got so bad that I kept my distance. Time went by and I let her get close again with the kids as well. And now I feel like she is taking the hate in her heart towards me out on my son. From a family system perspective, I think something that I want to highlight here is that so often, even amongst siblings, we don't call things out. And I think that this is really tricky actually, because it is almost this part that we don't fully understand of what's happening in the history of the Simship. And I often think that when it comes to siblings, we don't know how to update our scripts of each other. And in some ways then it's not to. To give permission to your husband, but I, I do often see this happening. Is that a sibling, you know, your partner will say, just let it go. It's not a big deal because that is part of the dynamic that they've always had. So in some way your husband learned that if I ignore her, it's actually much better to get out of it. And I think as we go forward, I think I can understand why, because you're going to give us a story here where she ups the ant. Just want to sink into first this validation, Michelle, because I see you and I can only imagine how painful this is that you enter into this family and of course you hope to have another sister, another bond with someone, and instead you've been met with anger and contempt and passive aggressiveness, which doesn't feel good, especially as you've been navigating what it means to become a parent and to enter parenthood and navigate your son's life. One of the things I want to say right away is how important it is to not create triangles. And so sometimes what I see happen is that then it's kind of a you and your husband, and instead of going to sister, then what we do to try to alleviate that stress is we bring in a parent. So then, for example, you or your husband would then bring in stepmom or bring in dad or bring in another sibling and Then the conflict starts to spread through the entire family. And. And that's the triangle piece. This is step three in my vault method where you learn all about what triangles you're getting stuck in. And this is truly why my vault method applies to all families. Because when we are struggling with someone, it is tempting. And I'm not Michelle, I'm not saying that that's what you're going to do or that you have done that, but for anybody listening, if you are going to mom or dad or someone else about a sibling, I'm going to encourage you to stop doing that because that weakens and impacts everybody's relationship and it is a sure way to stop being able to work through things. Okay, so at this point, Michelle, you're saying that it would be very difficult to cut her off, but I am considering it. At least I'm taking a step back. And we may not attend Thanksgiving. So of course that makes sense because you're saying, well, this is so hurtful and painful. So here's a recent example. She thought everything was fine. And then when I see her with his parents around, she's very cold. She says, clearly, I should have set strong boundaries in the beginning, but I wanted to be the good girl daughter in law. Oh, Michelle, of course, I'm just going to validate that again. You know, there is this and also too, she's the older sister, mom has passed away. So there is this power differential in the sense of you want to be invited into the in circle, you want to be part of this family. So of course you're going to step into that good girl daughter in law position. Of course you're going to bend on your boundaries. And you know, I think so much of what shows up here for people is this is the first time you, you're all navigating this role together. Not only that role of when you first meet, but then the other role that you evolve into is now what it means to become a mother. And then you've also shared later that she also has a child. So your question essentially here is how to handle someone with a hate in their heart towards you who will likely never admit it. Okay, so here's the example that you gave. When it comes to your kiddo, she barks at him constantly. Your guy is 7, she has a 4 year old. You give this recent example around when he was born, she sent money to his college account. Then she said it went back by itself, but she never gave it back. Okay, so some lying perhaps. Most recently, we had a serious issue With a bully around my kids. She knew about that. I know this sounds nuts, but I feel like she's trying to copy my experience and make it seem like he is. He is bullying her son. Okay, so now your son is being accused of bullying your sister in law's son. Okay, so then you describe this barbecue where the kids, of course, kids being kids, her son who's four, through a truck, a metal Hot Wheels car. It hit your son in the head completely by accident. So of course your son cries for a minute. And then the other, his cousin says sorry. So the younger boy says sorry. And your son was not holding a grudge at all, but just needed a minute and he tossed the car in frustration. She immediately acted outraged that she had to leave, that her son apologized and yelled loudly. She was leaving because my son can't handle it. By the time she was leaving, they were already playing again together. When my husband texted her that night. Oh, okay. He said she went a bit too far. Okay, so heat is still there. So the text can't. He's. He sent the text that night. She's still in her anger and righteousness. That. That shows up there. So then by text, she said that the kids need a break and basically projected everything that she did onto us. Said we treated my nephew like he didn't matter and that hurts because we spoil our nephew. And she said that we coddled my son. Meanwhile, she never asked if my son was okay. She couldn't wait to say that he was being mean by not jumping up right away and playing. And she told her son, oh, you did nothing wrong, baby. It's not your fault. We have to leave. When my husband T.R. talk to her, she basically deflected. And the most we got was, I won't say your son can't handle it. No apology. Oh, okay. Michelle, this is this kind of escalation here. It's like one thing happens and then another thing happens and you are then completely made out to be the bad one. And so it's not even if it's about you. Now she's going to place it on your child. And that feels so, so sticky because children should not be put in the middle of this. So one of the first things you want to do is find ways to protect your son, to protect his well being. And he can then say how he feels playing with his cousin, making sure that if she says anything that's hurtful to him, you. You stand up for him. You be that sturdy leader and you can say in front of everybody, that's not a kind thing to say or that's not okay. And just to leave it very much like that because the more you give her, the more she's going to come back to you. And instead what's going to be even more powerful is helping your child process this at home after those family events or maybe even beforehand, and saying, you know, how are you feeling about seeing your cousin and your aunt? What kinds of things don't feel good? How might you want to respond so he's 7 and he can start to prepare himself for those things. Not for you to sit there and say, your aunt is so nasty, how are we going to deal with it? But instead to say, you know, how are you feeling about seeing your cousin after what happened last time? And then if things are said at the event again, maybe the next day or the day after, when you're out for a car ride with your little one, talk about how did you feel when your aunt said? And then talk about how that aligns with your values and how that maybe hurt for you and maybe something that he could say next time and to also really make space for his feelings so that he can process that. Okay, but here's what you will want to do moving forward and that's really going to be about your own boundaries. And I hear you saying, I would love to be able to cut her off. And of course this is the tricky thing, is that if it weren't family, if it's a friend, it's someone that arguably can be easier to leave because you don't have the family ties. I'm not saying that leaving friends is easy because, gosh, friendship breakups are so painful, but it's that tie that continues to hold you together. And so then how are we going to be together at these family events? Some people will choose. And so here's the piece. Boundaries are going to be all about what you do and it's not about asking them to be different. And I would even argue that you trying to go in and explaining these things to her. So now you have the this list of things that hurts and rightfully so, something about the money, how she's showed up very negative and passive aggressive on all your special events, it can feel really tempting to then want the apology, to want her to see the impact she has had on you. And yet based on what you're saying to me, based on repeated experiences and how she flips things back on you, that's not something she can do. And this is where you bring in the acceptance for who she is. And acceptance doesn't mean you like it. It also doesn't mean that you have to tolerate all of this. And that's where step five in my vault method is so good, because I do help you and your partner identify what's the tolerable and intolerable behaviors. And then you get to decide, how am I going to respond in this moment? And given what I know about this person, how, like, what does that look like? So I was thinking about this, and I was thinking even too about the gray rock method. The gray rock method being that you become like a gray rock, so uninteresting that you are not responsive. You're not giving them any of that emotional feedback. You're not lighting it up for them because she's looking for that emotional arousal or reaction from you because then she jumps on that. But when you gray rock, the gray rock method, that's you saying to yourself, I'm not entering into this. And this is how I actually get to protect myself. Because the text after the party, all of the things. And let's even play this out for a minute. Imagine your husband hadn't text her. I wonder how that would have gone instead. Because then she would have had no space to give that back to you. And if she had have come then to text you guys, then you get to take lots of time to respond to that. And the response might actually be a thanks for letting me know. And that's it, right? If she's saying, I'm so upset, you guys haven't even checked in on us. And after just what happened with you and your kid throwing cars and all the things, right? So she plays her. Her long story to you of how she's been so injured, and you just respond by saying, thanks for letting me know. That's not interesting. There's nothing to bite onto that. And if someone then escalates and ups the ante, then again, you choose how you respond. So thinking of the upcoming holidays, then how do you limit your time? Is that something that you consider doing? So I know we often go from this. We're doing all of these things and having this conflict that I know sometimes we then immediately go to, okay, we're not going this year. And I think one of the reasons, and this is why so many people have come to me through the years. And Michelle, you sent your message because family is important to you. And I imagine also too, which I know so many parents feel this is that you then see the kids and you think, I want the kids to have that relationship. So then how do we do it together and how do we protect ourselves? So you might limit the conversation, you might keep it high level to things like what's going on in sports and how the kids are doing, but don't bring up the hard stuff. And when she baits you into that, when she makes a digging comment, you respond with something very neutral. Hmm. And then change the topic or say, oh, I'm thirsty, I'm going to grab some water and walk away. You do not want to give her more. And I think that's where your boundaries come into place. The boundary of what am I willing to share with her? What conversations am I willing to have? And the most important piece then is what are you willing to let into your space? Your emotional mental well being. And this is where the gate analogy is so powerful when we come to thinking about boundaries. And this is where you think of the fence. You have a fence around you and your property and you have a gate. And you don't get to control who walks by your property. You don't get to control the comments they make about your property, but you're going to choose how open or closed that gate is. I remember one client telling me that she would share things with her brother and they would always end up getting into these big debates about who was right or wrong or what the right approach was to whatever it is that they're talking about. And so we really talked about this concept of pruning, so pulling back how much they're willing to share and what conversations they're willing to enter into. And once you go into there, that's a space where you have a lot of agency. All right, Michelle, I want to leave you with this. Remember, you don't get to control her. You will control how you show up to her. And I think there's a really huge empowerment piece here where you can say, we're going because family is important to us, but when we leave, we shake out her energy. We do not take that treatment with us. We do not need to tolerate that. We can walk away and be in a different room or sit beside someone else and not engage in that conversation. And that's really where you have your power and choice in navigating your sister in law. I want to finish off with the couple piece because I know for so many people this can be tricky, is when our partners say, don't say anything, or they say, it's not that big of a deal. It sounds like your partner does understand that this doesn't feel good. And at the same time, when he messages her, he's giving her more attention for the negativity. And maybe that's not something that's going to keep working for both of you, but that he needs to find his own way to maintain that relationship with her. And perhaps then you pull back in other ways. But the most important thing always is for you and your partner, you and your husband, to be in the same team and that he understands that these are really hard experiences for you and that you can go to him and say, that was a really hard one. And he says, yes, absolutely, I see you. And when couples are on the same team, that's everything. All right, Michelle, thanks for sending your question in. I'm so glad that we had a chance to connect over in DMS and for others. Don't forget to grab your copy of you, your husband and his, his mother. And if you have a question for me here on the podcast about relationships, about something that's happening in your family, about how to move forward with a friend or whatever it might be, head over to my website, drtracyd.com or click the form link in the show notes and I can't wait to see you next time.