Interview with Kristin Oelke

You're listening to One Sharp Sword Cutting through to what Matters Most with outfluencer Dr. Wayne Purnell. Welcome to One Sharp Sword Cutting through to what matters most. I'm your host, Dr. P. Dr. Wayne Purnell, the Exponential Success Coach, the CEO and founder of Dynamic Leader Incorporated and your host on this podcast with me today, I have the chief marketing officer and so much more for a. Well, she calls herself the full stack transformational marketing leader. I want to dive in deeper. This is Kristen Elki. Welcome to One Sharp Sword.

Wayne, it's great to be with you.

Yeah, it's great to have you. When we first met, it was, I reached out, we had a conversation. It was so much fun. Our conversation was so great. Talk to me a little bit about like you didn't talk to me a little bit about your origin, like how you got here because you didn't wake up one day and go, I'm gonna be the CMO of this international organization. Right. You're with. Right. Rose, as is noted in your. In, in your profile. Talk to me about that. Like, how did you get to where you are? And if you need to back up all the way to high school where it's like, well, I've always been in. Interested in. Let's do that. Let's go. We'll go where you want to go.

Okay, well, let's see. Let me start with, well, bright roses, Bright Rose Ventures. We are an advisory and Investment Company for B2B Technology Company, software technology services companies. We go in and we partner with investors and management teams to what we say, transform to perform. So it can be either later stage technology companies that are needing to pivot to. To stay relevant, or it can be the early stage businesses who have really just started to find their place in the market and they need to really scale. And so we go in when things are a little messy and where we can just jump in and take what is my, you know, more than 20 years experience and our other founder, Davin Cushman, his experience and we've been through most of these situations before, so we can jump in and help them.

But where define messy. Like when things get messy, you come in and, and help to clean them up and get them back on track.

Messy can be. Can look at a few different ways messy. For older companies, it can be they have. They're operating in a tech platform. So when you look at organizations, as you well know. Right. It's people process technology.

Yeah.

And so when you think about the technology component of it, you know, they can have very dated systems or they can have systems that are far too costly or overbuilt. They haven't been modernized. When you think about the people part, the people haven't been trained or don't have the skills to perform the way they need to in the business. As, as the vision now dictates. Right. The processes. The processes because of the way that automation has really embedded itself within every size of organization. Sometimes the automation streams, the digitization isn't there. And so we go in and we look at all of that. And so when I say messy, it's when those things aren't optimized for what's currently available in the market to make you the top performing business that you want to be.

That was great. That was so well said. And I think it's important for any business owner, no matter what size, to be looking at what's current, right? What is current for you? Where are you headed? What is your vision? If you haven't revised your vision in the last five years, it is time. It's past time. People process technology. Are your people trained? Are they ready? Are they engaging with each other? Processes, what systems do you have? What automation do you have? What repeatable processes to make things flow and technology, is it outdated? Probably. The answer is probably, yeah, because if you haven't updated recently in the last couple of years, it's outdated. So that's, that's amazing. That's awesome.

And I think on those three, the other thing to keep in mind is that every company is behind somewhere. So don't feel bad. Like, like it just. And the reason is, is because everything is moving so fast, right? And when you get up and you, you go in to do your job, you're like, I've got my list of 10 things to do and I've got time for three, you know, like, and so it's very easy for that to happen. And so sometimes having someone come in from the outside one, it gives you, you know, that, that additional manpower and you know, know smarts into looking at it. But sometimes you, you just need to partner with somebody who can help you through that. And I think that's probably, you know, where you spend your time too is like, you know, encouraging people, showing them the path, making sure they know they've got a partner there to help them through that transformation.

Well, the, you know, the saying is you can't, you can't see the frame if you're in the picture.

Oh, that's a great thing.

Yeah, right. Another one is you can't read the label from inside the bottle. The whole thing about having somebody outside come in is that we offer perspective. Right. I don't know if you've ever coached sports. I was a martial arts instructor for 20 plus years. And you know, changing somebody's movement by even a quarter of an inch makes all the difference. And so sometimes, you know, the highest performers have up to six coaches. Sometimes that, that perspective on your performance, whether it is the people, the process, the tech, that perspective makes all the difference. And so when you come in and you, you see a thing that's out of place, it's amazing. Right, because you could do something really, that looks really small to you and makes a major impact on the organization.

Yeah, yeah. And we, we love doing it, you know, because like I said, we've been there, we've, we've been in the sticky wicket and so getting to go in and kind of pay it forward a little bit, you know, that feels good too.

Yeah. We've, all those of us that have run some miles, you know, we know what to look for. Right. So we've, we've been down the path and we're ready to say, come with us. This is, you know, the, this way, the path is safe and, and certainly there's territory that we don't know about yet. But with the skills we have, we're able to lead even further. And that's, I think both you and I approach leadership development that way where you lift as you lead. It's like, oh, I've come this way. Come, come with me. That's great. Where did you start? You didn't, I mean, are you a problem solver? Have you always liked puzzles? Where, where does that come from? And how do you get your passion every day to do this?

Yeah, yeah. And I think it'll, I'll also contribute a little bit in there on, you know, how, how I got started from a, from a skills perspective. So I think it was a combination of. I've always loved writing, I've always loved communication, but I've always loved it in a non fiction way. I've been in, you know, a crazy fanatic around news and you know, documentaries and you know, like I, that, that is where I would spend my time. But I've also combined that with like, I'm a doer, I played a lot of sports, I'm competitive, I'd like to win. I also believe that, you know, if you work hard enough, you can get anything. I know a lot of people say that, but it's, it's easier said than done that I'll just keep trying to wiggle my way to, like, okay, let me try this. And I'm always confident enough that I can keep experimenting and keep trying things and ask for help and, you know, be open to, hey, how did you do that? You know? And so I think when I was right, when I was graduating high school, I knew some of my attributes, but the one that got me hung up a little bit for a while was my curiosity because I was so interested in so many different things that it took me a little bit longer to get through college because I still, you know, I started in, you know, like, history, and then I went to. I thought maybe I'd do this journalism thing. And then, you know, I was, like, trying all these. And I wasn't for sure. And so I didn't get all those credits in the right boxes in four years. So it took me a little bit longer to get there. And then when I finally figured it out, I went right away, got my graduate degree because I had, like, figured out my path.

So this is, this, this is really important, Kristen, because a lot of people wait, and they just wait for purpose to fall on them. What is my purpose? Where am I at my best? And you said some really important things that I do want to highlight, and, and one of them is try new things. The other thing you said was, ask for help. Both of those serve you. Both of them, like, try new things. How will you know if you. If you're in your purpose? Well, you could sit there and go, I wonder what it is. Or you could go, well, I'm interested in history. I'm interested in journalism. I'm interested in, you know, all these different areas. And then it's like, oh, I'm. I am interested in all these things. This one lights me up. The other thing is, it's almost like you're apologizing for taking more time than normal in a. In doing your undergrad. And you know what? You got experience that other people don't have. Like, you picked up things that other people don't tend to spend time on. And I think that serves you. And so, you know, I. I will talk about. Listen to the whispers, that thing that you put aside for someday. You were able to go, is it this? I don't know. I kind of like it. Is it this? I don't know. I kind of like it. So I'm. I'm applauding you for having that as your background. That, you know, it's not. Oh, I didn't do it in four years. So what, look at what you look at the foundation you gave yourself. What a gift. What a true gift.

Yeah, I was very lucky. My parents were very supportive. I think that they were, they could see me though struggling is to like trying to figure out what that was. And I think that that was the part of like. But find that because then, because you know you're going to do it for a long time, so make sure it's something that you like, you get great satisfaction out of. And it was interesting. You know, my mom still tells me this day, she goes, once you figured it out, you figured it out, like when you were dabbling around. And I did a lot of like those informational interviews, you know, I was talking to everybody's parents, you know, like what they were doing, like, what does that really mean every day? And I, I didn't know. I grew up in a small rural area where I wasn't as exposed to as many different professions as in some, maybe metropolitan areas. You would see some other professions. And so that, that's how I found out about it. But anyway, so, you know, I, I got into that and then I thought, you know, in graduate school I realized it was more around like public relations and media because it would combine that real world communications, not, not the literature side of it. And then, then I realized I got in it and I loved it. But I was like, okay, now I did all this, I want to make a little bit more money, like, you know, so how can I navigate into the roles where I've got higher probability of greater earnings? Right. And those were more in the marketing side, the product side. As soon as you got closer to the revenue, you know, those roles were compensated at greater levels. And so that's when I went, okay, let me go see what that looks like. So I parlayed it into, you know, customer marketing and being very close to where pipelines driven sales are closed and supporting that. And that's then how I finally started to get into this combination of problem solving, combining my, you know, communications background. And that's how I got eventually into more leadership positions. And you asked me earlier about sports. I played a ton of sports and I think, you know, when women ask me, I always encourage them to find those opportunities for team sports because just like in, you know, your team environment, you know, I played a lot of volleyball. That was my, that was my sport. You know, some people have a good day, someone will have a good, girls will have a good day, and some will have a bad day. And that's work every day. And you have to have that give and take and support each other and it, and it comes far more naturally. But then you also still have that focus on what is that goal within a time frame. And I think that's the other thing that when I talked like I'm talking to the local high school here on Friday. But the, you know, it's getting it done. But in the business world there is a end of game clock. You know, you are, you know, you have to deliver in a certain time frame. And I think as you know, professionals that have been out there for a while, I think we need to talk about that a bit more.

That's great. That's the, the almost the urgency, right? You start with a goal and the goal is to win. And then you define the goal. Along the way it gets re refined and defined. You know what skill sets you have, right. And sometimes you bump, sometimes you hit, sometimes right, you, you set. And how's that for volleyball?

I was like, you know my sport,

I used to love volleyball actually. I was, I was quite the server. So

my high school record and it stuck for a while in serving. So we have.

Oh, very good, very good. Awesome. I, yeah, just so the whole idea like you could be a two person team, it's hard to be a one person team. You could be a six person team. Right. And, and each person has their function and, or their zone and as a team you have to work together. I love the idea of the, of the clock also just to impose like there's urgency sometimes we need to finish and wherever we are when the clock runs out, that's, that's where we are. So I love that, I love that

there's another game after that. But you've got to realize there's an evaluation point at that, at that, you know, end of clock when the clock goes off of how, how well did you do in that time frame?

That's great. That's great. And, and there is another game. And so you learn from the previous game but you don't hold on to it.

Yeah, right, exactly. Exactly.

So how does that play out for you now? How does that, you know, you work with, you go from business to business. You're, you're doing that. And are you working with a team? Are you managing a team?

I am, I am. So it's a, it's a hybrid, right. So I have folks that work directly for me within our business and what we call it is an integrated fractional model. So most of the organizations we work with in a very simplistic way. I'll say they have budget for a marketing director, but they need marketing ops, they need rev ops, they need design, they need content, they need a strategist, they need a campaign execute, they need the digital. They get all these things across you. You were saying that when you introduced me full funnel marketing. Right. Marketing is a very, very broad discipline. And so what we do is I generally go in and do an assessment at the beginning and determine where the opportunities and the blockers are and then apply unique, a unique or distinct set of hours of each of those disciplines for people on my team to go in and fix it. So you get experts as opposed to having to pay for a dedicated team of all these people who end up being. And this is another big thing I've been talking about is like hiring a generalist to do all these things when they're not an expert in it isn't fair to that individual, right? And it's not going to get you to what you need. And so these companies see the benefit of that. Because if we need a little bit more content, right, that's a different skill set. You've got the writers, the messaging folks, the designers, some digital involved. But sometimes it's this, the engine of the operations, right? The connection of sales and marketing working together. That's a very different skill set and a very different tooling. And both of those can add incredible value to a business, right? It can unlock pipeline, it can accelerate deals, right. It can give confidence to your investors, right? You can, you can drive down cost if you do those things really well. And so that's what I do. I go in and I look at, look at these businesses. I have a lot of conversations across the business and then I meet with whoever my main, you know, folks are that are trying to drive a transformation or a change and share my, my views and where, how I think this thing could evolve. So sometimes I'm in there for a longer state and sometimes I'm in there for a shorter state and then some of my folks could stay on, depending upon what the best solution is, the right fit solution at the right budget

for what they need, then that's, that's great. I have two thoughts. One is just to underscore something you said. It's. It's like bringing a Shetland pony to a thoroughbred horse race and it's not fair to the pony and it does not get you the outcome you want. So you have to have the right, the right person with the right skill set at the Right moment. How, how would a person in an organization identify that they need you?

Generally it's through poor revenue performance. That's usually how it's initially uncovered. But the why that's happening is more to what I was just sharing. Right. Sometimes it can be that. Like one example is I had a client that we had a lot of what we call top of funnel, a lot of interest from the folks that we think really had a, a good fit for, for the solution that we were, that we were selling. But everything got stuck in the middle of the funnel right after you looked at it. So it wasn't that we weren't getting the message out there and the value prop of it. We couldn't figure out how to differentiate that product versus the other solutions they were deciding among. Right. Or the price was too high for the market that we were going after. Right. So we're looking at it. Fundamentally it came down to they didn't trust that this early stage business could perform the way that it could. Right. So we had to build out that trust profile, which is how this, my whole book thing got started last year. But then another business, that one has incredible retention once they get the customers in. So we know it was a great product. But what happened is that they also had a lot of referral business coming in. They had a great partner ecosystem that, you know, they would refer all these businesses in, but they, it was not organized internally so that it was an efficient process from a lead coming in. And I know we're talking about leadership on this call, so I don't, don't want to go too much into the weeds of the marketing mechanics, but I, I don't mind.

It's, you know, this is, it's an interesting path and there is enough overlap that you can draw analogy and you can, you know, when, for me, when I listen to somebody talk about their path, whether that's, oh, I do this very, very, very, very specific thing in business or if it's, oh, this is the general kind of flow, I will find myself in that story. Where does that fit for me? And so as you're describing it, I think it's perfect. I think, keep going.

Okay, so, so, you know, the, the lead would come in and we knew after they closed the customer was happy. But how do we efficiently get it from yes, tell me more about your product to yes, I am your customer. Right. And so what we work on are all the systems and the communications in between that and the roles and the responsibilities. Who does what when with what to make sure. That it's, you know, trustworthy, relevant. You know, it's simple things like easy to find. It's documented, like all of that stuff. Right. And when I talked earlier about messy, that's like the process messy example. But what ended up, you know, within 90 days, there was a 70% improvement of pipeline that could be reported to the board of directors. So that, that's a really quick focus way of being like, okay, where's the problem? Let's focus in on that. And now we've got other things that we're working on together. But that, that's generally where I come into the business and the examples of the different types of things that can be done to help these, these businesses perform better.

Do you ever find CEOs are so tied to their pet project that they can't hear what you're saying?

Yes, but it, but it's not often. But I have. I mean, and the reason I can say that confidently because when I think about the pool. So over my career, and I want to say this is even just in the last 10, 15 years, I've been doing this much longer than that, but that I've had opportunities to work in roles where I would work with 20 different companies at a time. So out of those 50, let's say over this last decade. Yeah, there, there is going to be a couple. And that might be the crutch, right. As to how they got into this. Like, they didn't evolve fast enough. Their people processor technology didn't evolve fast enough. And sometimes it's been, you know, they're, they've had someone working with them for a really long time and they've gotten really close to them and they trust them, but they're not the right person for that job today. Right. And we talked about the systems before. Right. Or they didn't update their product and the definition and the differentiation of their product in today's market. Right. So it can be a variety of things.

That's interesting too, to think about. I think that's important for, for each of us actually to be thinking about it for ourselves. You know, to be in a position where, wow, it made so much sense. And now you either have somebody that's in a position or it could be you yourself in a position where it's not exactly the position that that person needs to be in. It's not the position that that person is at their best in, giving their best. And I think that's, that's a huge thing where, you know, well, you know, I've Got my best friend and we started out together and, and now what? Right. That's the nature of relationship, is that it evolves and being able to, to keep your eyes on that and your fingers on that, I think that's really important. So, so what's next for you? Like what are you working on? And like I like to ask what's your next big next. I think that that's a, you know, personally, professionally, whatever, like what are you working on and how are you expanding yourself?

Yeah, so I think, I think for. I love that question. I don't think. And I've been on a lot of podcasts in this, this year and I don't think I've ever been asked that. I, I want to say it's probably getting more into the investment side of it, not the operational side. You know, I do a lot of the value creation from a go to market standpoint and I, I love that. I think I personally would want to see myself over the next five years evolve more into being more on the investment side and advisor, you know. Yeah, that's probably, probably where I would like to see my skill set evolve, my time commitment evolve into.

That's great. That was, that was a great answer because it was so reflective. It was like, that's where I like to go, you know, I like to hit that, that personal place where you're like, huh, this could be like what I want, you know, and that's tapping into your desire. And that is, if you think about it, it's a very different desire than 20 years ago. And that's absolutely right. That is absolutely. I think that is something that we humans need to allow ourselves. You know, you found your passion. Yay. And you're in your purpose. Yay. And as you develop, your vision expands. Right. You see more, there's, there are other paths to go down. That's amazing. Also, what do you think it will take for you? What, Let me ask that in a coherent sentence. What will it take for you, do you think, for, for you to expand into the investment side? What do you, do you have skill sets you need to develop? Do you have networks to be pushing on, finding yourself into? Like, what does that look like for you, coming from cmo, right. Chief Marketing Officer, into the financial world a little bit more? What does that look like for you?

Yeah, I think the way that I thought about it when you asked me was, you know, that I would be a bridge in that. Right. So my investment commitment would still be focused on advising and being active in businesses where I Could support people doing like what I'm doing now. Right. Being more of the hands on strategist, overseeing execution in a go to market or marketing capacity. And I think for me to get there, I think it's, you know, some stuff. I'm super fortunate now with the head of Bright Rose, you know, I worked with, for him, with him in a large private equity firm before. And so, you know, he's great at, you know, bringing me into additional conversations and part of the services that I provide, bridge some of that. So it's kind of, you know, continuing to find more of those opportunities, get more of an understanding, you know, and connect with more people who are in those seats. Right. So I think there's a few steps I'm taking now to get there and hopefully I can continue to expand that and then really decide if that's where I want to go. Because like your question, like I said, I hadn't been taught that. I hadn't thought about that. But it's definitely something of interest for sure.

Isn't that great? So it goes back to your curiosity where what's, you know, what's this and what's that? And you won't know.

Right.

That's the whole thing. Like, I really want to encourage every single one of my audience members here to follow that example. You won't know until you try it whether it's a door that you want to open further to the next door. And it's like, I tried it. It's not for me. That's great. It's like a, an international food flavor. Right? I tried it. I want more of that. I've never had anything like that. I want more of it. Is it my only diet nop. But is that something I want more of? Absolutely. I've tried this. It's not my taste. Thanks. I'm glad I tried it. Next. I love that.

You know what I'd add into that? You were. Something you said a minute or so ago triggered a thought that what I have learned when I was in very large organizations early in my career, which I'm super grateful for, because they have incredible training programs, training on your discipline, but also business training. And you have these sessions where you get to think about where do you want to be in five years? Where do you think you want to be in 20 years? But then as you evolve in your career, at least for, for my case, you know, I, I moved into smaller businesses, you know, now I'm doing my own thing and it's so easy to not take that time for reflection that forced stop things going. Is this where you want to be? Where do I want to be, you know, in the future? And I think, you know, for your audience, I would say, you know, and the majority of people are not in those big organizations, even though they employ a lot of people. When you look at the full population, that's not where people are employed. And so I would say, you know, make sure to take that time along your, you know, career journey, because we're working, you know, 40 years. I mean, you know, that's a long time. And I, I know I've done my pivots and I'm glad I did. And I've tried different things. But what I've learned now, I have to be super disciplined about, you know, where I'm at, you know, will what I'm doing today get me to where I'm at, where I want to be? And the thing is, I hadn't thought about the where exactly I want to be for many years. While I'm hustling, you know, getting this

stuff done, I'm going to give myself a plug here and say, that is my sweet spot. Right. I just, I, I help people move from where they've been and where they are to help them define what, where they want to be. And Dynamic Transitions, which was one of my international best selling books, helps people do that. Dynamic transitions, moving boldly and gracefully into the next phase of, of your life. It's, it's important. It starts with values and we can talk about that a little bit. You're. I believe that everybody has core values and what are called peripheral values. You know, our core values, love, family, whatever it is, right? Integrity, those stay with us. It would take a lot to shake those, the values of people in their 20s. Like in our 20s, look at me, I'm strong, I'm powerful, I'm pretty, I'm whatever it is, right? In our 30s, let's get the value of stability. I want to hone my, hone my skills enough to get a really good job. And in our 40s, it's more about, you start to build legacy, you know, and in our 50s, it's like, oh, let's look back and see if we can combine all that, create legacy, but also health and also adventure. And so each season has its own values. And when you can tie what you do with what you value, you are super powerful. And so, you know, I think for you, as you move forward and you go, you know what? I want to see what the investment side looks like. It's like, that's another puzzle to be. To be pondering, you know? And I love that about you. I love that that you're in this space of curiosity. I think that that's, you know, that's pretty fabulous. Right.

I hope I never lose it.

Right. I don't think. Yeah. I think if you've got that as kind of an operational style, at no point. Right. I was telling you before we started recording that that I. One of my spirit animals is Curious George and. Right. He just reminds me, stay curious, because if you're in curiosity, you can't be in judgment. And I don't think at any point you're going to flip from, I'm done being curious. And now everything. I judge everything in the world as, you know, good or bad. It's like, I think you're gonna keep that curiosity, which is kind of cool.

I hope so.

Yeah. What. What haven't we talked about? What. What were you hoping I would ask you that we haven't touched on?

Oh, gosh. I would have thought there would have been something maybe around biggest lesson learned, life lesson, AKA where you. Where you really stubbed your toe, you know, Great.

Let's go there. Let's go there. Ask. Ask yourself that question. So, yeah, no, I'll ask you. For you, Kristen, you know, along the way, you've held multiple leadership roles, and there. There are. This really is important because as you climb and as you make your way through various organizations, you're dealing with. You're dealing with different stake stakeholders, either a board or a president or. Or the end user, the consumer. And there are times when you know you are giving your absolute best, and this is so good. And there are times when you've had a hiccup. So that is the question then. Where have you had the biggest hiccup? And what was the biggest. Where did you stub your toe, as you say, and what was the big lesson that you learned? Because I am not a fan of calling anything a failure. Really, You. It's a failure if you don't learn. Right. So where did you stub your toe and what did you learn from doing so? How did you grow?

Yeah, Yeah, I, you know, everything's easier in hindsight, for sure, but I. I think it's what I've really learned in spades. You know, everyone says it's about the people. Like your work. It's. Oh, it's about the people. And when. When I was younger, I thought it was like the culture, you know, the colleagues I'd be working with. And, you know, are we going to have time to get to know each other? And I think that, you know, I have younger nieces and nephews who are earlier in their careers and that is important. Like, they, they want to build that out. And I get that. But I think what I've learned the most and where I've made some poor decisions have been around choosing my boss and the leadership. Right. I, I've had, you know, uncomfortable situations where I didn't align with the values, let's say the professional values of, of my boss. I've also picked bosses who were not. You used a phrase earlier that I love, like a leader who brings people along. Right. You had a phrase for that.

Lift as you lead, Lift as you lead.

And you know, in finding those people, when I, when I now talk to groups, I tell them what I have found is, yes, it's important to know who you're working with, but also who you're working for. And that will set the stage for the expectations put upon you. And so, you know, make sure that your values align with theirs, that they give you an opportunity to continue to learn. What I'm finding with the marketing community right now is if you're in an environment where you weren't introduced to AI, you weren't given the tools and the like, you're struggling with your, your work prospects right now. And so, you know, you need to make sure that you're interviewing and joining people that will, yeah, you'll enjoy and they got good ethics, but will also help you stay relevant and current and know that that's important.

That's great. That's great. The piece you, you said that I will highlight is make sure your values are aligned. Yeah, right. Make sure your values are aligned. And that means you need to know what your values are. And as you're working with leadership or interviewing even, is to double check. What does the other person believe in? Where do they see themselves? And you can even share your values and find out, is there alignment? Is that something that you would value? Dear leader? And, and don't be afraid to say no to a job. You know, if you're not aligned, it's. That's, yeah, that is like horrible to work under.

We've all been there to find. Now, you know, with LinkedIn, right, you can find more connections. People who know are connected close enough and you don't necessarily have to say, hey, you know, what are their values? But you can ask a lot of questions and find out, you know, how they manage, you know, what, what they Prioritize in and out of work. That is a signal to me to their values.

That's great. That's exactly right. That's great. And. And what aligns for you may not be what aligns for someone else.

Exactly.

Yeah. And it's, you know, that's why. Yeah. When you find the right person to work with, that's where culture comes from. Like, leaders establish culture by letting their values be known. And that's a huge. I believe that's a huge leadership lesson there is that if you are in a position to lead an organization, a division, a team, a family, if you're in a position of leadership, let your values be known. And even if you're not in a position of leadership as a team member, let your values be known. People will either align with you or they won't. And you need to know. And if you're in a place where you can have people align with you because you're the one that's telling others what you believe in now you've become a leader, an even stronger leader, and one that's trustworthy. Right. Because you say it and you live into it. Huge. That's really good. I'm glad. I'm glad I asked that last. What did I miss? Question, because that was really. Your response was really, really good. Anything else before we close out our. Our episode together?

No, this has been an absolute pleasure. Yeah. And I always try to get the A. So I'm glad that that last response was. Was a good one.

You competitive thing, you. That's awesome. Yeah, it was.

Talk about marketing and so talking about this. I love talking about this.

Yeah, it's. I mean, we could talk about what you do and all that stuff, but I think it's really important to talk about, you know, what you do in the context of who you are. And to me, that is what cutting through to what matters most really is. So. So, Kristin Alke, thank you for joining me on One Sharp Sword.

Thank you for having me.

Excellent. All right. My guest today, Kristen Okey. And this is one sharp sword cutting through to what matters most. I'm your host, Dr. P. Dr. Wayne Purnell. And we'll see you here next time. Thanks for joining me. Thanks for listening to one sharp sword cutting through to what matters most without Fluncirp, Dr. Wayne Purnell. For more information, please go to OneSharpsWord.

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