Escaping Corporate Sales To Go All-In on High-Ticket Sales - Ryan

What's up, y'all? We got Mr. Ryan here back for Sales Bro Pod episode 5 or 6, not so sure. I'd have to double check. But yeah, we got the mysterious, mysterious Ryan from Twitter, Mr. RyDirkX. I appreciate you for coming on, man.

Good to be here, man. How you doing?

So far so good. A little, little chat before. We both had a, a light day sales calls-wise. Um, it's Friday today that we're recording, so it's a good day for a podcast.

Great day for a podcast.

So I told you this a little bit already, but I know that so many people are gonna be tuning into this cuz they're like, who the hell is this dude? Because the stuff that you post is like, It's, it creates so much intrigue and there's value in it and, you know, behind the intrigue. And, um, I think a lot of people are gonna be looking forward to learning a little bit more about what, you know, what you actually do, like what, what you do off of Twitter, um, and how you kind of carry yourself and all that. So, dude, let's start, let's start, let's take it back. I wanna talk about sales stuff, but I also do wanna talk about kind of you as like the, The online money getter as well. So we take it back, man. How did you how did you stumble into all of this online money stuff?

The online money stuff. Um, that's a good question. More or less like general to probably what I'm talking about on Twitter a bit. But I don't know. Like I was always I was actually on more of like a traditional path. Like I went to a four-year university. I graduated with degree and had a corporate sales job. But I was always doing the random side hustles and shit for a while. I was flipping stuff on Facebook. In college, I was dropshipping before I had any idea what I was doing. And I don't know, I was just always kind of doing it. I knew I was never going to stay on a more traditional path, but didn't really know what it was going to look like until I got into more the shit you see on Twitter and ended up going pretty much full-time in online sales.

Yeah. So you never, okay, so you, you graduated. What did, what kind of degree do you have?

Like business, it was an economics degree.

Cool. And then you went the corporate route and did that for a couple years, or how long did you do that for?

It was actually exactly one year. I quit the same week that I had initially started.

Nice. And you, you went straight into like from school to sales job, like was that the plan that you originally had?

More or less. You know, I never really knew like specifically what I wanted to do. It's always like, oh yeah, I'm just gonna make a bunch of money, but you don't like specifically know how. You don't have like the tools, you don't have the avenues, you don't know the systems behind it.

Yep.

So like even when I graduated, it was like 2020 pandemic and my first job outta college was like a union job. I was unloading cargo planes overnight and that was like fresh out of a degree. That's what I was doing. And that was still a time I was like dropshipping, making random sales. But, you know, obviously, you're not any sort of e-com guru, to say the least.

Yeah.

But I did that for a while. And it's kind of a funny story. Like, I actually had like an internship with a private equity company, like in college. And initially, it's like investment banking. You want to do that, you want to make a bunch of money. But like, once you do that, you realize it's terrible. And I didn't want to do it at all. And it was kind of like a running joke with everyone that we were just going to do sales. Because like, that's why everyone wanted to do investment banking, make a bunch of money.

Yeah.

But like this one guy, like he was like a caddy on a golf course and he was talking about these guys who were like just day drinking all the time, doing like Xanax, like weird shit at 2 PM on a Wednesday and then always going on vacations and stuff. He was like, what do they do? And they sold like medical devices, just made tons of money. And so, it was always like a running joke of like, yeah, not doing this, we're gonna get into sales instead. And so, it was like always kind of in the back of my mind. And then when I graduated, I had just sort of like, I knew someone who worked at a company and ended up helping me out, got me an interview at this job for sales and ended up got it. I was like, cool. Ended up working out pretty well. But ultimately I knew it wasn't like a long-term thing, you know?

Dude, like my story is almost exactly the same. Graduated, pandemic, got the corporate job, had online money, Before, like I was doing, I tried, I started with copywriting. Uh, or actually, no, I like started with dropshipping, but I never got in because I didn't have the capital. So I went to copywriting.

Yeah.

And then eventually built out like a couple of stores, never really got any momentum there. And then kind of like, I kind of fucked off for a while, did the big boy job for actually 2 years for me. And then, um, Found this high-ticket sales shit and then, you know, here we are. So, yeah. When did you realize like, oh dude, dropshipping, maybe not for me right now. Like, let me do sales instead.

I don't think it was ever meant to be like the ticket to success, right? I think it was more or less like, here's something to do. Here's something to like learn and understand of like, this is a vehicle where if you get good at it, you can actually make a bunch of money doing so. But it was weird. I was like making stores more or less to like, oh, Run ads, see how it goes. Oh, like this made a couple sales, try to do it and just more or less like learn skills before you really know what's out there. You know what I mean?

How did you stumble across like money Twitter to begin with?

That's actually kind of funny. So I was obviously having my personal Twitter, but it was around like 2020 where anytime you go on Twitter, it's about like election. It's like all this crazy stuff happening, you know, in the US. And I just, I couldn't, I was off social media for like months. I was like, there's no point in doing this. But I was still on that kind of like self-improvement journey, to say the least, still trying to make money. I was still dropshipping, learning e-com, a couple other things, and just like familiarizing myself with the space.

Yeah.

And then you ended up— I just made like a separate Twitter account and then just sort of like algorithmically found my way to like some of those people. And then you just like find, oh, it's like kind of a weird community. Everyone's talking about the same thing. And I was like in a sales job. And then people are just making money online sales. I was like, well, this is the perfect vehicle. If I wanna make money online, I wanna go that more entrepreneurship route, but you kind of just need a way to get into it, need to learn the industry and start making some money. So it was like that perfect, you know, first step to say the least. And I was like, cool, burn the bridges, just did it. Yeah.

How long did you like lurk before you started actually creating content?

Well, I wasn't— I was lurking for a while because I wasn't doing anything. Like, I was at a corporate job. I was like on Twitter, I was following people, familiarizing myself with it, but I wasn't like tweeting about sales because I just had like a corporate job. It really wasn't the same.

Yeah.

And so, it wasn't until I was like, you know what, screw it, I'm just gonna quit my job, do it full-time. Then I started just kind of putting some stuff out there.

Yeah.

But it really wasn't to like grow a brand, right? Because like, what's your brand at that point? You're making a couple thousand dollars. You don't know what you're doing. You're just trying to figure it out. And then it wasn't until I was like, oh, I kind of got the hang of it. People are asking me for advice now. You know, I was helping people on the offer and stuff like that. It's like, all right, maybe I have a thing or two to actually talk about, post on social media about.

I remember when I started, like, I started, I posted my first tweet in like February 2021 off, or I'm sorry, 2022 off that account. So like literally About a year ago to probably like to the day, really freaking close. And like one of the first, the first person that I connected with was you.

Yeah.

Like not, not like the first follower following, but like the first person that I got on a call with. And we were like, we were like, bro, we just both quit our jobs. Like, this is what I'm doing. This is what I'm doing. Like, and we were just like, I remember we were talking. And we were like, dude, like, yeah, this is gonna work. Like, we're just gonna stick to it. And I don't know, I thought that was super cool. And then to be able to see, obviously both of us, like 12 months later, just completely different situation.

Yeah.

It's fucking, it's nuts. And the power of Twitter, I don't know, like for me personally, I've met so many people that have like kind of like propelled me to to the opportunities that I'm in today through Twitter, um, or opportunities and the connections and, you know, everything else that's going on. So I'm curious, like, how has Twitter— I guess since you've been active, more active, and like posting your thoughts and all that stuff, like what kind of crazy connections or like opportunities have come from it, if any?

Yeah, I think a lot of them are in Honestly, like smaller ways, it's like hard to pinpoint. For example, I've bought a bunch of different courses. I bought a bunch of different programs. Like from that, maybe you learn one or two things that closes a deal here and there. Or like I've met people like just through groups that I was in type of thing. And I think just from being on Twitter as well, one of the big ones and, you know, I was very advantageous to me, kind of got me like the offer I'm on now was like Closeify, for example. And Like I was on it, it worked out very well and made a huge impact on me. And so it's just like little stuff like that. You just like figure out, oh, I'm gonna give this a shot. And that sort of like propels you into a lot of cooler stuff. And like some connections, I don't do a ton of like networking on Twitter, to be honest. But like, I've definitely met a lot of people through it. And it is more, I guess, like like-minded people than I know in real life.

Yeah, I'm not a huge like, reach out to people for the sake of reaching out, but I have a lot of people message me and from there, I don't know, you're just like, I'm not an asshole. Like I'll talk to people, you know? So yeah, I, you mentioned something earlier that I wanna dive into cuz I also have the same similarity where it was like burnt, burnt the ships, went like just from comfy, cozy sales job to Yeah. Trying to make this work. And I did the same thing. What was that experience like for you? Like, how was it nerve-wracking? Like, did you have like a nice little financial cushion when you did it? Like, can you talk about that a bit?

Yeah, it, it definitely was, but it was one of those things. It was like the way I thought about it was just like a mental framework that I had was like, worst case scenario, I quit this job and then I, I try to do my own thing. Right. But like, if that doesn't work, I just get another corporate sales job. So I was already in my worst case scenario, you know what I mean? So it's like, you might as well do it. I was like 24 at the time. Like, there's just no better time to do it, you know what I mean? So I ended up kind of like getting an offer, like had some contacts, and I was like, now seems like as good a time as any. I had a year of corporate experience on the dot, and I was like, dude, worst case scenario, I could just get another job. But like, with that all said, and like, as much as you can Logically look at a scenario and say, oh, that's exactly what I should do. Like, of course I was stressed about it. Like, you still feel it, you know what I mean? Yeah. And it, it is tough. And like, I had kind of like weird doubts about it, but it was never a doubt of like, oh, I, I'm not gonna do it. I can't do it. It was more or less like, oh, I'm surprised I actually feel the stress about it. Doesn't matter. I'm still gonna do it anyways, you know?

Yeah. Yeah. I was same boat, bro. I was like, I'm doing good here. I could stay here forever. And like, Live a comfy life. It's like, but there, there has to be more, bro. And I was like, unless I make the jump, like it's not just gonna happen. Like I'm not gonna free up the time. It's not like gonna be a part-time thing. Like I know this works and the only way I can make it work is if I just fucking go for it, you know? Um, yeah.

So I'd say that's an important part too, is like I always try to do it part-time. I'd be on like interviews and stuff like, oh, I have a corporate sales job now, but like I'll try to take calls after. And they're like, no, because Yeah. Like you think you're being slick with it of like, oh, I'm, I have some availability on the weekends, but they probably heard that a bunch of times. In their eyes, you're not committed. You know what I mean? Yeah. So it's like either go all in or don't do it at all.

Yeah, that's a really good point. 'Cause like, I, my main thing that I really help people with is like literally making that transition or like finding opportunities. Yeah. Positioning themselves. And like so many people come in where it's like, hey, I got this job or I'm in school or like I've got these other priorities. And it, it is possible, but like the caliber of opportunity that's gonna take you part-time, it's usually not the one you want. Like they, they are out there.

Exactly.

100%. But like, just, you gotta manage the expectations correctly. So how did you find, like, I, you mentioned how you found the one now that's like working well for you. How did you find your first one?

That's a good question. I think it was like a random, again, that's one of those things that you see it on Twitter and you kind of have to like trace back of like where it initially started. I think someone tweeted something about like high ticket sales. I looked into it, found like Facebook groups, met a recruiter through there.

Hmm.

And then they like reached out a couple times about a couple different offers. And it's funny, the first one, like the reason why I took it is I saw that dude on YouTube all the time, like on all of the ads. And like every time I'd watch a video, of course I was like in that space doing e-com.

Yeah.

Learning about like agencies and stuff like that. So I was targeted with his ads. And then she sent me a message one day and like the link popped up in his face. I was like, that dude, that's crazy. And so I ended up just like, seems like, I don't know, destined maybe. But it was kind of funny. So I ended up just thinking, you know what, seems like as good an offer as any, I suppose.

Yeah. How long did you end up staying on the First one.

Yeah, that one was funny because I started off, there was like 3, there's 3 closers and I think a setter maybe. And a couple months in, he fired all of them except me. And so I was like the only one on it. And it was tough because I didn't have a ton of experience, but you're already kind of like, you are the guy, you're the only one doing anything. And he had, it was like a biz op, right? And so he had like his agency, And he was like helping do that on the side. But it really wasn't like optimized to scale. Like there were like 2 testimonials. It was all like paid advertising and stuff like that. There wasn't much out there about him. And so I thought it was like very tough. It just wasn't one of those offers where you can go in and start slinging deals.

Yeah.

And even if I closed a bunch of deals, like it wasn't optimized to the point where we're getting qualified leads. Like everyone was pretty much broke. I remember breaking down payment plans up to like 7 payments because it was like all the people could do, you know what I mean? Stuff like that. It's just, it's not a vehicle where you're just slinging deals left and right and making a bunch of money. And so, I kind of got that experience from that and just leveraged that into something better. And that's honestly what I tell people. People DM me all the time and ask about how to get those offers. Like, I want to do this, but like, I can't get it. And like, you can't get it because you don't have any experience.

Right.

Right? You still kind of have to You know, eat shit to a certain extent and get an offer so you can take it, get some deals. And then when you outreach and look for other opportunities, yeah, I closed a quarter million last couple months, right? It looks very good. And then you can kind of get in that better vehicle.

Yeah, dude. People come all the time with like tech sales experience or like real estate or insurance. And it's like, yes, that's valuable. But like on paper, these people want you to have specifically high-ticket sales experience.

Right.

I came in with like millions under my belt and like, even then, bro, like this, I got my first gig by like a stroke of luck because I had a strong referral. I had like the small personal brand at the time. I had sales experience and I followed up twice on the interview and that last one was like what really got me in. But yeah, dude, so that's what, that's what I tell people all the time and like I'll admit, like, I came into high ticket sales with a bit of an ego because I was like, dude, I'm killing it here. Like, there's no reason why I can't close deals here. But then I started applying and all this shit and I was like, damn, they like really do want me to have high ticket sales experience. So do you think, and I think I know the answer, but do you think you could have got the job that you have now without the experience of like that shitty offer before?

I mean, it's tough. I think no, because if I was in a corporate sales job, maybe even if I would've got it, you know, I probably wouldn't have lasted very long. 'Cause you just don't have like the experience. You just don't have the reps. It's not about like, oh, I closed X amount. I closed, I think like $2 million in corporate sales. But it's just such a different, it's such a different sales call. It's such a different process. Yep. And you know, like, I think Richard was on this podcast and he mentioned like we probably had 15 to 20 closers maybe, and every single one of them was fired except me and Richard. And it's because like you need to be a certain type of person. Like you need to have a lot of experience, know how to handle certain situations to survive when you get those really good offers. Yeah.

Yeah, I definitely want to like dive into like your experience in that role so far. So now when you kind of going through things chronologically, like you're going in this first offer, you realize like, dude, this is probably not where I want to be long-term. Like what things started happening to where you were like, all right, I'm gonna start like looking out, planting seeds other places. I mean, if it was, there any like big things that really like forced you to leave that or was it just like a, a accumulation or? How did that wrap up?

Yeah, I think there was a few things where number one, I felt like nothing ever really changed. It was like, hey, these leads aren't good. And then that's just kind of where it ends, right? Like there's no, like we were working together on like the VSL and like how to qualify people and questions and stuff like that. It just sort of never changed. Like problems just continue to persist. And it was like fairly early when I realized, yeah, maybe I'm not gonna be, You know, making tons of money on this offer. But I think people, and it's tough because everyone has a different situation, but it's like, do you just want to close there for 3 weeks and then dip and then try something else and then do that for a few weeks and do it? So it was almost like, I'm gonna actually try to get good at this and then grow out of it. Like to the point of like, you know, people have money, I can close them. But the problem is, is like they don't have money and like there's a bunch of no-shows. The offer is just like not that good.

Yeah.

You know what I mean? It's tough because you, it can't be like a cope at the same time of like, I'm not closing people this offer sucks. I have to leave.

Yeah.

And so you just kind of have to have that like emotional intelligence to be like, you know, I feel like I've reached a point that I'm happy with my progress, but I need a better vehicle for it.

Yeah. That's, dude, that is so hard. Like when you, I don't know if you were the only sales rep when you left, but like when you're the only person on a team, bro, it's like, it's so hard to like, Figure out like, is it me or is it the offer? Like nobody wants to be that sales guy that's just like, bro, the leads suck. Like the qualifications before garbage. But yeah, dude, you have to have like that level of emotional intelligence to just like decipher what the real issue is, you know?

Yeah. And it's funny too, 'cause after I left that it shut down. God, it's like the, the offer just stopped. Yeah.

Do you think that was because you left or like it was gonna happen anyways?

I don't know. Like I said, I think it just wasn't a priority for the guy running it. It seemed like it was just kind of maybe like a side thing for him. He did it for a while, but I don't know. It's tough. Like I said, it's tough to know. We had a couple closers. He got rid of all of them and it was just me. And then I was like, hey bro, I can't do this anymore. I'm out. And I think he was just like, all right, chalk it up. But I don't know, honestly.

Cool. So going into like, all right, I step away from this, like I have the skill down, I'm ready to like play a bigger game. When you found the next opportunity, like how did you know that that was the one? Because I'd imagine you maybe took a few interviews, maybe correct me if I'm wrong, but Like, how did you know like this was the opportunity that you needed to pursue?

Well, the biggest things were just like, at that point I had good experience. I could sort of tell like a good offer from a bad offer. And the thing that was different from like the first one was like, hey, you could make $15,000 a month. And I'm like, oh, like sick. Like the math makes sense. They have all these leads. This is what a commission is. But you know, it just didn't really make sense. And then the second one, he was like, this is what our current closers are making. I was like, that's awesome. And then he goes, there's also like plenty of testimonials, plenty of case studies. And on the first offer, they didn't have that. So it just seemed like I had more like weapons on a call. You know what I mean? Where if they're like, hey, like, who have you done this before? There's like nothing to back it up. And so once you're in that vehicle, like, oh, they've actually been there and done that before. It's just a bit easier to make that sale. It's a bit easier to make that transaction, right? When there's like something to back it up.

Yeah. Yeah, dude. That's some One thing, well, ideally that's better to know like, hey, we have 4 sales reps and last month they all made over 10 grand. Like that is like, yeah, you can look at all the other stuff, but like that is the real actionable stuff. I also say like, if they don't have sales reps, like just get an idea of where the revenue is and then like reverse engineer your percentage and should you be able to hit KPIs.

Yeah.

But like, dude, yeah, so many people are out there like Oh, $15K OTE, but that's based on numbers that the company has never even come close to hitting before.

Yeah.

So yeah, that's—

That's what you see in the Facebook groups a lot for sure. $20K, $20K, $20K.

Yeah. Where do you get that from? It's like an outbound cold calling position with no base. It's like, bro, your company has not even done $20K in the past like 6 months. What do you mean?

So that's just the unfortunate part of like the commission-only space. Like you can just kind of say these numbers, you get those really ambitious people. And they're like, yo, let's do it.

Yeah, dude. It's kind of, it's kind of fucked up, dude. Like a lot of these people go in blind with no guidance and like a lot of people in, you know, not as fortunate positions as like you or I were when we came in. And like when you're commission only, like praying, like, dude, I need, I need to close a deal or I need my appointments to close so I can fucking pay my bills. Like, yeah, dude, it's so easy to get burnt. So easy. So you've only had 2 offers ever?

3, technically 4. When I was on, like I had a corporate job, I did a little bit one part-time, but they were like, yeah, it doesn't work like time-wise. Yeah. So not including that, I did, after I left my first one, I had a second one, which is like the one we were talking about, like plenty of case studies, testimonials, closers were doing well. But the caveat to that that I never thought of was that it was in the real estate industry. And the real estate market was terrible.

Yeah, I remember.

And specifically it was like mortgage loan originators. And like there's this graph kind of going around, it was very funny. It was like the demand for mortgages was at all-time low from like before 20— like 2008. And so it was just a very bad time to be commission only in the real estate niche. And like even I'd be talking to people on the phone, like loan originators, like I've been doing this for 20 years. This is the worst the market has ever been. Like, I like what you guys are doing, but I'm actually gonna take the next 6 months off and just go on vacation and stuff like that. And it was just, the timing was very unfortunate to say the least.

Yeah. I do remember you on that one. Like we had chatted like a while back and you're like, bro, this is fucking tough.

It was miserable.

Yeah. Yeah. So that's a good, I mean, a good example of like being able to tell when it's, You or if it's like outside factors. Clearly, that was outside factors. All right, dude. I want to talk a little bit more about like how you guys on your team are so good at what you do. How you've like been able to not be one of like the fifteen reps that have churned. I'm trying to think of a good place to start it out, but I guess when you came on. to the team that you're on. How much, I mean, how much ramp up did you need? Were you ever in a position of like, oh shoot, dude, I might not, I might not fucking make it. Like talk about like that first like month or 2 on this like kind of big team.

Yeah. So it's probably the opposite of what you think where the ramp up was. So whenever they started like hiring out the sales team, It was like the founders were doing it themselves. It was by a couple brothers. Like they were doing the sales and they wanted to scale and like we're building out a sales team. And so whenever I got in, the onboarding process was a link to the Hormozi YouTube video talking about the closer framework. That was the script. And so it was basically nonexistent. And then what he was saying was like, yeah, you know, I think I tweeted about this before. They're like very, very high ticket deals, like some, you know, 6 figures plus, right? And he was like, yeah, we'll give you 4 calls. If you close one of them, you can stay on. And I was like, are you serious? And so it was definitely very, very stressful. And this was, I actually had like some personal stuff going on at the time too. So I was just not in a good place with it. And I was like just ready to be done with the real estate one. So I was like trying to burn the bridges there, but it was the vehicle of like, hey, we actually just fired 5 closers last week, but if you want 4 calls, see if you can close one. And I was like, sure. And so I just did it. And I think I ended up closing like 2 of them maybe. And he was like, yeah, we'll keep you on. But even at that point, like the next couple months, they still just kept hiring people and they just kept firing people like left and right. And it wasn't, you know, like unnecessary random firing. Like they just, you just need to be like a certain type of person, I guess. I don't know.

Yeah.

And it just wasn't working for some people.

Yeah. So I think I wanna say that Richard, in, in, I think Richard's episode 3, he mentioned like that you are on the same team as him. So I'm gonna make that connection on this one.

Yeah.

So like Richard's sales manager, there's you, and then there's a bunch of people who didn't make it, quite frankly. Like, what are you doing? Or like, what, what is it about you and, and how you You know, handle yourself, your sales process to where you like have not been cut and all these other people have?

That's a good question, man. And I honestly, I wish I knew, 'cause the thing is, is like ever since I started with it, it's been very, like, as I said, we're literally kind of building out the sales team, so to speak. And things are just constantly changing. Like every few weeks, new script, new framework, new this, new that. And so there hasn't been like a ton of compound growth, I guess you can say. And so like, honestly, I honestly couldn't tell you, you know what I mean? People kind of come on. I think the biggest thing is like, so Richard is the sales manager now. When I first started, it was someone else who they also fired. And so like, we'll review calls and like, I mean, that dude closes at like 50% regardless of what change goes on. Like he's just on it. And so we do call reviews. We, you know, review like specific ways we need to handle ourselves because when we're closing 6-figure deals with Absolute sharks. Like you just need to present yourself a certain way, and I just think like the recurring thing is like people don't do that. And I don't know; it's really tough for me to say honestly. Like I just think there's a certain way you need to be on those calls, and I do my best to do it. Things constantly change. You also have to adapt to it. But I think you at a certain point either kind of like have it or you don't. I feel like yeah, they would listen to a couple calls and just say no.

Yeah.

So you just have to, which is probably a terrible answer cuz I, I honestly couldn't give you a good one.

No, no, that I like, I know exactly what you're talking about. So like you either like just naturally have Chad frame or you don't.

Like, that's a good way to say it, I guess.

So like, I'm curious, I do wanna talk about a little bit more of like how you kind of go about things, but like You working alongside Richard, I think he was there a little bit before you, right?

Like, like a month or so. Yeah, bro.

So some of the stuff he says, especially to like a newer audience, is like, this is like complete opposite, like literally the complete opposite of what everybody else is telling me to do. So like you looking like from the outside in at him, like what is it that he does that like He can close these high-level deals at 50%.

I mean, I think it's the word that gets thrown around a lot is like the frame of the call. And it's just not accepting bullshit, right? Like he likes to tweet about like the doctor framework. And I agree with that to a certain extent where it works maybe like a, you know, like a B2C offer. You're like, oh, what are you doing? Like, what is this? Maybe like a lead gen offer. Like, oh, how do you get your leads and stuff like that? You talk to people making millions of dollars, right? You just you can't ask questions like that. It doesn't make any sense.

Yeah.

And so I think it's just a matter of like having that frame, but being very specific with the way you handle yourself and the way you control the conversation. And whole sweet stuff like like fuck rapport, right? And it's very true. It's like you get that rapport through your competency and through your expertise, right? Because man, I'm 25 years old and I talk to people making millions of dollars a month. And I have to have the frame still. And you have to like find ways to do that. And so when they say something stupid, you have to call them out on it. And then they're like, oh, I respect this kid. When normally they probably wouldn't if I sat there asking Dr. Frame questions like, where do your leads come from?

Yeah. Yeah, that's good. That's a good point. I was going to ask you, you are usually, I'd assume, talking to just high-level people, right? Like they're making money, they're established, they're up, you know, they're probably older than you in a lot of cases.

Yeah.

Besides you just like calling them out on dumb shit that they say and then competency, like, is there anything that you do in particular to kind of like show them like, dude, I know what I'm doing, I'm the expert? Stuff along those lines.

I mean, I think part of it is that frame still where it's like pushing them away in like a humorous way. Like, for example, I had this guy, it was yesterday, he said something about like specific service we do is like, I know someone that'll do that for a couple hundred dollars. I'm like, why don't you just pay them a couple hundred dollars then? With like a smile on your face in a way. And they're like, oh, okay, like this guy, right? And if you just like say something stupid like, oh no, well, like the value of our service does this and does that, like you just sound like a salesperson, you know what I mean?

Yeah.

And they don't like respect you for it. Like they just know if they say something, you're gonna like handle the objection. And it's very hard to like take what I'm saying and like Richard's tweets and like use that to your own offer. To a certain degree, because if people do it wrong, like you'll look like an idiot. And I've tried like playing that frame game and played around with like different personalities on calls. And if you do it wrong, you just look like a dick.

Yeah. Yeah. And so this is something I wanted to talk about with you because like, to somebody who's been in sales for just a little bit longer, like the stuff that you tweet and the stuff that Richard tweets, like I can see that there's like, sometimes they're like, sometimes it's super serious. Sometimes there's a little sarcasm. Sometimes it's like a joke. But like a lot of these new guys, dude, they come in and they like, basically, they basically like, um, I'm trying to think of the right words. For example, let me, let me just give you an example. I work with like a lot of younger kids, like trying to get their first appointment setting job and, and, you know, eventually close and all that. And like, dude, they are, they are like so consumed by the idea of dequeuing. Because like, not, it's not just you, but there's other people on Twitter who like, who just make it seem like, oh dude, I'm just the fucking best. I'm gonna DQ 10 people today. Um, and so like, yes, DQing is good, but like, you can't go too far off the deep end. Like, don't take everything that these people say literally. Like, don't, because you're gonna get, you're gonna get fucked over. So, um, yeah. Yeah, that, that was one thing I wanted to talk about, cuz I know like, dude, specifically there's a few people that I work with, it's like, oh, I'm gonna DQ someone today. Like, I can't wait. It's like, bro, come on. Like, I don't know.

So like, yeah.

Can you, can you tell the people that like sometimes the stuff that you say shouldn't be taken 100% as it's read? Or, or I don't know, dude. Maybe just tell them like, hey, like, just take it with a grain of salt. I don't know. Like, can you talk a little bit about your tweeting style and like how you, I don't know how you like get your message out? 'Cause I feel like some people might be confused.

Yeah, it's a good question. And honestly, probably don't follow me on Twitter if you want really good sales advice. There is a lot of nuance to it, a lot of sarcasm and a lot of satire. I think that's different, like, about people on Twitter. I think it's funny when I get tagged on like, oh, who's like the top sales Gs? And I'll get tagged in it. And I'm like, don't, don't follow me because a lot of it is kind of like that sarcastic way of doing things. And yeah, I almost think like once you get into it, like you learn the high ticket sales, it's like, oh, Dr. Framework and stuff like that. But after you kind of maybe sell some not so great offers, you've had thousands of sales calls, you're double booked on your calendar. you know, 6 hours to 10 hours a day for over a year, like you just kind of pick up on like a lot of those nuances and it's not wasting your time. It's not bullshitting. It's very cutthroat to a certain extent on calls.

Yeah.

And so like, for example, I'll get on there. I tweeted once of like, I DQ'd someone in 3 minutes. Great start to the day. And everyone's like, why didn't you do that? Why didn't you do that? Why'd you do that? Why didn't the setters do that? I always have people asking me to like, oh, can I set appointments for you? Like they're not qualified. And that's not the case. And obviously I'm not gonna have a thread every time I tweet something like that explaining the nuance behind it. But I think that there are things that you probably don't realize when you're first starting sales, like when to DQ people and when I'm joking and when it actually makes sense to do so.

Yeah.

So like for example, we'll have people on there and we have like a setting process. I have, do like research before the calls and you can very quickly identify, is this person a good fit for your service or not? And if they're probably not, you challenge them on that. And then if a couple minutes in the call you realize it's not, maybe they'll realize it's not and you just kind of end things there. And obviously it doesn't happen every single day on every single call, but it's like unique situations.

Yeah. Yeah, I think, and that's the hardest thing to teach, dude. Like, yeah, like, and you can't, you can't really teach it. Like sales and being good at sales is like so much just about being aware, bro. Like, If your head is stuck in your fucking Cole Gordon script, like, right, good luck. You know, you'll, you'll close like low-level B2C just, you know, fine. But like, especially once you get playing with like bigger players, companies, stuff like that, like you just have to, you have to be EQ maxing, you know?

So you just have to figure out who's worth having a conversation with, right? Who's pitching? Yeah.

Yes.

And there's stuff with that, honestly, like we made a huge change in like our sales process and our script and our framework. Like the last couple of weeks have been kind of rough and I'm still trying to figure it out and understand like those nuances to it. And so that stuff definitely comes with time. And so like you said, yeah, if someone's on their first B2C offer and reading Minor Richard's tweets, it's not gonna make any sense to them. They're gonna try that stuff and it's not gonna work. So there is a lot of nuance to it. Maybe we should put a disclaimer out there, but.

Yeah. You've seen those like little information circle. It's like this tweet may contain false information. Yeah. Yeah, no, it's funny though. And I like, I just like, this has blown up in my face because I am working with like a lot of guys who are like literally first sales job and they're trying to like literally learn sales. So it's like, uh, it's, it's funny sometimes, but I know that, um, I want to get your thoughts on this. I can't remember if it was on the podcast or afterwards, but Richard tweeted something about like, like Why would I have a hot, like, why would I have a cold streak? Like, why would I not close deals? Like, again, just going back to one of those things where it's like, there's very few people that can like say that, mean it, believe it. Like, do you find yourself as things change, like, do you find yourself getting into like dry spells? And like, if so, how do you pull yourself out?

Yeah, I do. And Richard might be pissed about that. But the thing is, is like he doesn't, and it's hard, right? It's annoying to see it in like a positive way, but it doesn't matter what he's doing. Doesn't matter what changes happen, scripts, frameworks, stuff like that, closes probably over 50%. And to be honest, I'm not at that point yet. And when you make a lot of changes, you're constantly adapting, tweaking offers, tweaking sales processes, and making things like more efficient. There's gonna be like lags of information. Right? So like I tweeted something the other day of like I was working on like a specific script to an offer that we had, and then the next day we had a sales meeting and pretty much redid the whole thing, right? And so for me, I'm very oriented on like the sales process itself, and like once it makes sense and once it clicks, I feel very confident with it. And when things make changes, yeah, like sometimes that lags behind and you have drier spells or maybe calls you could have closed but you didn't. Yeah. And so whenever he tweets those things, like He's the top percentage of people closing. And so to your point, again, when you're working with someone on their very first offer, maybe it's not a good offer if they see something like that and like, oh my God, I had a dry spell. What does that mean? Like, it's, it happens.

Yeah, no, it's, it's part of the game. Like there's, there's probably like 2, 3 people on Twitter who would probably make that take of like, oh no, I don't have, I don't have those. But like the 99% of closers or just salespeople, like, dude, it, You're not in sales if you've never experienced that, you know, just same as like the hot streak, right? Like you get 2, 3 back-to-back paid in fulls. Like, bro, you're fucking untouchable. Untouchable. Like, give me more. Give me more calls. That's what you're on. But then you'll go like, dude, you'll have like sometimes 5, 10, 15 calls without a close. 15 is kind of crazy, but like, yeah. Yeah, dude, that, that shit gets like in your head really bad and that's normal. You just have to remember like, this is normal, you know?

Yeah. I mean, it does happen and I get the point to it. It's like assuming everything is stagnant. Like realistically, if you get good leads, like you should understand how to close them. Like you shouldn't deal with the same problems multiple times, you know? But at a certain extent, like again, if you make a lot of changes, you kind of adapt the offer. Like there's sometimes it's like, oh, you're figuring out what works best. Same thing with paid ads. Like, oh, this is working, this is working, this isn't not. It does take some time to figure that stuff out, right? And if you're like, oh my God, I didn't close, you know, at 50% this week, it's like, okay, well, why didn't you? What didn't work? What did work? And then just kind of optimize that moving forward.

Yeah. So how do you like everyone follows for the most part? Like when you, when you start a new sales gig, like it would be irresponsible for these business owners not to give you like the full script, you know, you gotta go here, then here, then here. It's usually like an intro discovery, you know, the, you know, the progression, right? Like, yeah. Can you break down, and I know it's gonna look different for different calls, but like break down like how you like to structure your calls for your specific customer. And I know again, it, it's gonna look different, but like if you could tie like a percentage, like, hey man, I spend like X percent Doing like a discovery? Like, can you just talk a little bit about your specific process, like what works for your type of customer?

Yeah. And so as I said, we're still playing around with it a little bit, but I think it is the same general framework where we do have setting calls and they go over a pretty solid explanation of who we are. It's like a pretty big brand, so most people are relatively familiar with it in the space, especially at the point that they're on the call with me. So really we started off And say, basically like, hey, look, I know you had a call with Setter, but just in your own words, I always like to ask, what are you looking to get out of this conversation? And then some people make like, oh, why are you on the call today? I've never found anyone answers that in an effective manner. And so like once you establish what they're looking for on the call, of course you can kind of tailor things toward that. After that, a matter of like setting the frame. Saying, hey, we're looking for a yes or no. And then once you get alignment on that, really like the discovery for me, I mean, it's probably like four or five questions I like to ask, and the calls maybe twenty-five minutes as a whole. So I think it's different for everyone. Like you kind of you have to understand your framework, but also have that you know degree of flexibility to take the conversation where it needs to go. Because if you just You're like, oh, I asked this question, then this question. Like, you're gonna miss stuff and you're not gonna listen to what they're saying.

Yeah.

So I don't have like a super specific process after I say like 4 or 5 questions I like to do. Maybe you show an example of that and then you just kind of present. I don't know. It's not, yeah, I wouldn't say it's like a super strict process.

What you guys do is like super custom fit though, right?

Yeah.

So it looks different for everybody. Um, but I would like to talk a little bit about the, I'm looking for the yes or no, because I know that's something where like, dude, it's so easy to get caught on the wrong end of that question, you know? So like, I know it's happened before. It's like, hey, I'm looking for a yes or no. Uh, but I'm not gonna make a decision on the call. Like, how do you navigate like people kind of bucking up to you on that question?

People really don't push back in a way like that. Maybe you'll have someone like, yeah, I'm not gonna give you a yes or no today. And then you can say, if it's a no today, that's fine then. And just kind of get that frame back of, I'm still looking for a yes or no.

Yeah.

But most people, you could just tell their response of, sometimes they respect it. They're like, yeah, for sure. I totally understand. It sounds good. But more times than not, if you don't say it exactly right, maybe you rush it and it comes across as unconfident. They'll just kind of be like, okay.

Yeah.

And then you have to sort of make up from lost ground there. So it's one of those things you need to do right if you're gonna do it.

Richard was saying that too. Like some of the stuff that he gets away with, it's because of how he says it. Like when you're, when you're reading tweets, you can't pick that up. But when, when people watch that episode and when they watch this one, they're gonna be able to tell like, okay, like that's how you actually do it.

Just have a—

I'm curious, like, the yes, the yes/no frame thing in the beginning, like, is never something that I have personally implemented. So when— and I've seen Richard tweet about this too— like, when people say, hey, I'm, you know, I've got to go talk to this person after, I'm not going to make a decision on the call, and you're like, okay, it's a no, like, cool, we'll go for that, or we'll go with that for today, like, do you then proceed to like Walk through, you know, what could potentially work for them? Or is that something where you decide like, okay, let's rebook at a later date once you are ready? Like, how do you navigate that?

Well, it depends why it's a no, right? Like sometimes it just doesn't make business sense, like logistical sense for them to move forward today. Maybe it would in Q2, Q3, whatever, right? And so yeah, sometimes you could just say, yeah, it's no today. I'll have my assistant reach out or something along those lines. And sometimes it's like, oh, I need to talk to my wife, I need to talk to my business partner, I need to talk to my board of directors or something along those lines. And there's like specific ways you can kind of tweak it. And I'm not sure if like he talked about it, but the way our offer is, is like we don't really send anything out or give demos or whatever until we have a deposit down. And so it's like, hey, if you need to talk to your business partner, that's totally fine. So what I suggest we do then— Start with a refundable deposit and then like XYZ, like you can kind of move forward with whether it be a contract, whether it be more custom package and stuff like that. Our offer is a little bit different because there's like several steps to the fulfillment. And so you can kind of like push them along there, but at the same time they get more information like why they're talking to the partner, see if it makes sense. Great. Do this. We can build out a custom package for you. We get you a contract, then you can talk to your partners.

Yeah.

They're like, oh, that makes sense. You get a deposit down, then you move the deal forward.

Yeah. It's a very unique offer. Like it's most people listening to this, like your offer is not going to be similar to theirs. So not at all. Yeah. And then like this kind of stuff, man, like some of it will work on B2C, some will work on low-level B2B. Like it really depends on where the, where the leads come from, who you're talking to. Like there's so many factors, bro. There's so many. So don't just take this shit and then go tell people like, hey, I'm looking for a yes or no. And it's like gonna backfire in your face cuz like you don't know what the fuck you're doing. But if it, if any of this so far does apply to you guys, like, yeah, like take some time, think about it, put, put that shit on paper, make sure it makes sense and then try it. So yeah, dude, so far, like this has been super good. I think a lot of people are gonna realize like, hey, this guy does more than just Shitposts on Twitter.

Hardly. Mostly shitposting on Twitter.

Yeah. So I guess let's, I still wanna talk about some sales stuff, but since like we're talking on the topic of that, like you've obviously just kind of by like tweeting your thoughts throughout the day, I guess like you've kind of amassed an audience. Like what is, what is your vision for like that side of things? Like do you plan on leaning into it? Do you plan on? Like going full guru mode? Like what is your plan with that?

I don't know. That's a good question. I think I've wanted to delete my Twitter probably once a week, but I haven't yet. So, but I don't know. I have really no desire to be the guy on Twitter saying this is how you handle XYZ objection and then going through it. It just doesn't appeal to me. It's not something I'd have to like fake it. You know what I mean? Put on that face and say, kind of go like sales guru mode. But I honestly don't know. I don't have an answer. And you could probably see that scrolling through my tweets where there's no direction to this. It's just kind of whatever, you know what I mean?

Yeah.

Which is probably not the right answer. It's probably not a good thing. Like, look at the way the world works, like building a personal brand and, you know, amassing an audience, monetizing it and stuff like that. I honestly don't know what I wanna do. As of right now, I'm just kind of focusing on what I'm doing that actually moves the needle forward, making money this way. And then as like, I'm gonna definitely continue to grow with that and see where it takes it. But as of right now, I don't have very specific things that I'm gonna do with it.

Yeah. Yeah. And I think I found this a similar like style and in the sense that like, dude, the best performing stuff that I do, like it's usually the shitposts, it's the memes. Like I don't, I've, I've written the thread on how to handle the objections. Like, I've done it. Like, you can only do it so many times.

Yeah.

And so, yeah, like, I think the best stuff that really resonates with the audience, and even if you're just building it up for like a rainy day or not even a rainy day, but just like future efforts, like just posting, posting the shit that you are going through, like as you go through your day, as you go through like Your time as a sales rep, like, so piggybacking off of that, your time as a sales rep, you've been selling for like, like 3, 4 years now.

Yeah.

Like altogether it's been, it's been a little bit.

Yeah, I guess it was like 2020 when I, my first sales job.

So, so what's like your vision career-wise? Like, do you plan on just cashing out as a sales rep, leaning into it for the longest time? Do you plan on building your own thing? Like any particular vision there?

Yeah, I kind of hate sales, to be honest with you. So I'd be lying if I said that I wanted to keep doing this. I like the position that I'm in right now, like the offer that I sell, the team that I'm with, that's great. But if I wasn't on this, there's no way I'd still be just a sales rep. And it kind of goes back to like why I even got into this sales to begin with. I'm sure like you as well, most people who start, like you have those dreams of like, just you want to do things for yourself, like have your own business.

Yeah.

And just kind of like work on your own time. But like as a sales rep, like you're still kind of an employee, if that makes sense. But you're in that vehicle where you're learning the skills, like you're learning the industry and you're learning all those different things. So it's like at a certain point it's like, yeah, you could just snap your fingers and pop up an offer that would probably do pretty well. Because you just know too much to fail.

Yeah.

You know, and I'm in a really good position now. I'm very grateful for it. So, I don't really have any, you know, plans on leaving or doing anything different anytime soon, at least in substitution of. I'll probably like add some stuff on and maybe work on some side stuff. But, yeah, as of right now, just continuing to kind of do what I'm doing. I'm enjoying the position that I'm in and I definitely am very soon kind of like working on some other stuff. That'll maybe come to fruition soon. Not sure if it'll be on a Twitter timeline or what, but we'll see.

For sure. I think a lot of people get into like high ticket sales because they want the fucking laptop on the beach lifestyle.

Yeah.

It's not that, bro.

No, it's not.

It's like, it's like 3 coffee cups on your desk. Like haven't eaten since yesterday. Like back to back to back Zoom calls all day long. It's like, I genuinely think sales is like, or online or high ticket sales is like the lowest barrier to entry. But if you're on a legitimate sales team, like, bro, this is a fucking job and it's not like a lot of times it's more than 40 hours a week. Mm-hmm.

You know?

So the only like upside is like, bro, you are technically, you're doing it on your own and you can do it from wherever the fuck you want to, but Yeah, I mean, realize that it isn't, it isn't like, oh, I'm gonna take 2 Zoom calls on the beach today. It's gonna be fucking awesome. Like, it's not that.

Yeah, I mean, you definitely can do that. Like, I've done that before. I, I remember, um, I was in, I was in Florida. I forget why, but like, I took a sales call by the pool. It was great. Closed it. It was paid in full. It was like, ah, you can take a picture, made $1,000 sitting here by the pool before 10 AM. But that's not like the reality of it. You know what I mean?

Yeah.

I think it is a perfect hybrid between like more of a corporate setting and like that entrepreneurial route. It's kind of like the in-between where you get sides of both, right? And so it ultimately just matters what you want to do with it. Like there's plenty of people who start off selling for an agency. You realize what makes a good agency, like the position now, like we're sales reps, like an 8-figure organization, been there since like the ground up. And you understand what makes a good team, what makes a good sales process, what makes a good offer. And then as I said, at a certain point, you know too much to fail and you can just kind of pop something up on your own and take what you've learned and, you know, monetize your knowledge, monetize your experience as opposed to just your time from a corporate setting.

Knowing what you know now about kind of just like sales, online business, do you ever see yourself going back to like dropshipping?

No, I don't even know why I did that. It was just more or less like something to do. Like I was just in college and I thought it'd be funny. Like you're just at the bar like, oh, let's check and see how my ads are doing. You know?

Oh bro, like my Shopify notifications, like check it out.

Um, yeah, I think that was, that was like everybody, bro.

Like I, I came across dropshipping in 2018. That dude Nate Schmidt was like the guy on Twitter.

Yeah.

Um, and yeah dude, it just like completely shifted how I thought about money, what's possible, all that stuff. Even though I didn't ever have like success In it, like, yeah, dude, it just opened the floodgates. Like, I, I went on to do copywriting, got a client, realized like, oh shit, like this actually works and just broke down the fucking—

Yeah.

The wall or like the floodgates of like what is possible. So yeah, dude, I think, um, all this stuff, like so many people are gonna have the same journey as, as we did where it's like, We had, we had something going. We could have stayed there. It would've been, it would've been, you know, better than most. But then there's just some people that are wired a little bit differently. They're like, bro, I just, I want to get it on my own, on my own terms.

Yeah.

Um, technically have the freedom, but you're working like more than you would on, on your normal job. Do you ever see yourself like, I guess, There's gonna be a progression of your, your online money journey. Like, we look, we look down a year, 2 years, it's probably not gonna look the same as it does today. What do you wanna do, like, with that? Like, do you, are you like a real estate guy? Are you like brick and mortar coffee shop with the family? Like, what do you wanna do with it?

That's a, that's an interesting question. I think after being miserable in that real estate offer, I have no desire to do anything in real estate. it ever. But I don't know. I think like there's some other stuff. Like I said, I was in a— I actually worked for like a private equity firm for a little bit. And it was always hilarious to me. Like, we'd be inquiring about this company that makes $50 million a year that sells like paper towels. Like, that was always fascinating to me. So, I almost think like to a certain extent, like the online money is cool, but having like legitimate boots on the ground recession-proof businesses like that is definitely exciting to me. But— Honestly, I don't know. We'll see how it goes. Like, there's some stuff, uh, I'm gonna get into shortly. I kind of already started, of course, like the sales stuff's great, but I have no idea, you know, years from now what it's gonna look like. It's almost like a day-by-day, month-by-month type of thing.

Yeah. Yeah. Is a, is a fucking Lambo in the cards for you? Or like a, like a flexed whip? Like Anything crazy?

I don't know. I think Lambo's way too like flashy. I like to be a little bit more, I don't know, low-key. That's also just like a fucking cope. Like, of course I'd get a Lambo, you know what I mean? So I don't know. It's, it's a little too far to say.

For sure. Yeah, dude. I'm trying to think. 'Cause I think, like a lot of us, I'm sure we know a lot of the same people. Like we all have that connection of like, oh, we're in, we're in remote sales or high ticket sales. Like, So we kind of get each other to some extent. But I do feel like, like you and I do, we're literally like, I don't think there's another person who had like this as similar of a fucking story. And like, I think we're the same age. Like I'm 24, about to be 25. And, um, yeah, dude, I'm just curious, like, because we haven't talked in a long time. It's been like at least 6 months. And so, yeah, dude, just curious to see what you're doing. I, I do plan on trying to get into some like commercial real estate. And, um, probably like hopefully this year and, and go from there. But I don't really have a Lambo in my cards either, not yet at least.

But yeah, we'll see. I think it might be a little bit too soon. Realistically, I'm still in like the, uh, cash stacking phase of sales. We're like, okay, it's going well, I get it. A couple tweaks here and there, very, very good, you know, relatively efficient vehicle of Of making money, right? And I think like after you kind of stack so over those months, maybe everyone has a different number, then you can say, oh, I'm gonna focus more so on this, kind of have like the sales thing on lock. Because I honestly think like at a certain point, it kind of become like after the same offer for a while, it can become, I could take, you know, 5, 6 calls a day, do whatever, close at 50%, like you're doing pretty well for yourself. And so I think like once you get in, in that position, It'll kind of gradually just become way more efficient to make that type of money. And then you're like stacking cash. You can kind of have those different vehicles like real estate and other businesses and stuff like that. But I think that's a bit more down the road for me still.

But yeah, I don't know.

We'll see. For sure.

Yeah. I think a lot of people do like inflate their lifestyle a little bit too quick too. So you gotta make sure like you're not the dude who like goes and cops the the M4 and then you have to sell it for the Ford Taurus like a year later.

Yeah, it's like, oh, I hit a couple $10K months, let me just buy a new car and then buy a new house and stuff like that. But I don't know, the way I look at it is more of like a war chest type of thing. It's like you kind of stack some cash. I don't live in a very— you can see the city, it's not a very nice one. So, you know, I'm not spending tons of money on stupid stuff as of right now. So I've just been enjoying stacking cash and enjoying myself.

Yeah, I wanna ask you too, like there's so many people that come from, who are in like Ohio that dip out once they like make it, whatever, or like just start to get like self-sufficient online. Like, do you have any plans to go somewhere a little sunnier?

100%. Yeah. I mean, it, it's, it's fine. I've like, I'm from up here, like I'm from Pennsylvania, not Ohio, but It's just like the cold. Like, I played hockey growing up. You're always just the winters playing sports and stuff like that. It doesn't really bother me. I'm kind of used to it and I kind of like it in a certain way. But I mean, yeah, 100%, very realistically going somewhere sunny, probably either when this lease is up or maybe the next like year or so. Like, that's definitely gonna happen. But in terms of like super flashy lifestyle, I'm not sure. We'll see when the time comes, I suppose.

So no like Dubai for you?

Dubai would be sick, but I don't know, that's a bit out of the cards. I've hardly ever been out of the country, just play hockey in Canada a few times. I don't know what life would look like in Dubai.

Yeah, I think, yeah, the Ohio to Florida pipeline is fucking serious.

Pretty solid one.

Yeah, I'm, uh, I mean, I'm in Texas. It's like usually pretty sunny and cool here, but I'm, I think this year heading over to Florida too. I might jump on the bandwagon, so we'll We'll see.

Oh yeah? It's funny 'cause I did it backwards. Like I said, I'm from Pennsylvania. Once I started making money online, I moved to Ohio, which I think I've fucked that one up a little bit, but—

That's kind of crazy.

It is what it is. Yeah, I don't know why I did that, but yeah, like I said, I don't know. I'm not very like, I wanna be in Dubai, supercar, stuff like that.

Yeah.

As of right now, I just kind of, I don't really look too far ahead, which maybe is a good thing, maybe not, but Just kind of take it as it is.

So you're not one of those white dudes who wants to go start like a massive family in Brazil? Like you don't have any desire for that?

In Brazil? I don't know. Like, that'd be cool. I think I almost— it's almost like day by day. It's like one day I wake up, I tweeted about this before, of like something about it was snowing here in Ohio. And I just scroll on the timeline and someone's driving supercars in Dubai. I'm like, I want to do that. Then the next day it's like, oh, some random minimalistic lifestyle in Bali. And then the next day it's Something else. So you kind of played around, I think, with those different entrepreneurial personalities a bit. And ultimately, you'll find something that sticks. Like, even a few years ago, like, it would have been sick that I'm making money online, like, nice apartment in the city, doing my thing, enjoying life, which would have been crazy to me a few years ago. So like, as of right now, I'm still kind of thinking what's most appealing. But, you know, I'm not stressing over it. It'll happen as it happens.

There's so many options, bro, especially when you have that freedom. Like, money isn't Yeah. Not strapped for cash. Um, yeah, dude, exciting stuff. I'm, I'm excited to see like where each of us are in the next year. We'll have to run it back, uh, a second time, but I think it's a good place to wrap it up. We dove like a lot into sales, which I think is gonna be really good. Talked a little bit of like online money banter. Um, so yeah, I guess where, where do you wanna direct people? Like where can people find you? And that kind of stuff. Let's go there.

Don't even follow me on Twitter. I don't know. You can if you want, maybe plug it. I don't know. But, um, I don't know. You can find me if you like. If you wanna look for me, you can find me.

Yeah. You're gonna have to start like typing in random names, but no, I'll, I'll plug it. I'll plug it below. Just use caution when you press that follow button. Um, shoot, man. Besides that, appreciate you coming on. Know you're a busy guy. And we'll, uh, we'll catch you around.

Awesome, bro. I appreciate you having me.